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(Reuters)   Headline: "Organic food no healthier than non-organic." Second sentence: "But organic options may live up to their billing of lowering exposure to pesticide residue and antibiotic-resistant bacteria"   (reuters.com) divider line 69
    More: Stupid, bacteria, pesticide residues, parliamentary immunity, Annals of Internal Medicine, photos, nutritional value, omega-3 fatty acids, phosphorus  
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4242 clicks; posted to Geek » on 03 Sep 2012 at 6:52 PM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2012-09-03 06:23:57 PM
That is a pretty strange headline.
 
2012-09-03 06:25:30 PM
But you smooth skipped over the relevant part of the first sentence, subby.
 
2012-09-03 06:32:03 PM
Hopefully they meant to say nutritious instead of healthy.
 
2012-09-03 06:55:40 PM
Organic foods are not marketed as more nutritious. They are marketed as having fewer pesticides and farming methods that are more friendly to the environment than traditional methods. The organic food did live up to the claim of having less exposure to pesticides.
 
2012-09-03 06:57:57 PM
I buy Organic bananas because they taste better and don't make me sick. You could call them "Taste Better" bananas and I'd still buy them. I don't actually believe they are healthier/cleaner/better for the environment
 
2012-09-03 06:58:37 PM

greentea1985: Organic foods are not marketed as more nutritious. They are marketed as having fewer pesticides and farming methods that are more friendly to the environment than traditional methods. The organic food did live up to the claim of having less exposure to pesticides.


Which continues to show the lack of evidence supporting either claim that something will kill you earlier or not. My bet is that neither will and you will most likely die of texting while walking into oncoming traffic.
 
2012-09-03 07:03:59 PM

qwave54: I buy Organic bananas because they taste better and don't make me sick. You could call them "Taste Better" bananas and I'd still buy them. I don't actually believe they are healthier/cleaner/better for the environment


Link
 
2012-09-03 07:04:53 PM
I have what I guess you could call an organic garden, and I'll match my produce against the supermarket's any day.

I don't use pesticides because just don't have a bug problem, and the only "fertilizer" I use, are the leaves from my lawn tilled under because I'm too lazy to do anything else with them.

I just have a fence to keep the rabbits, and the neighbor's dog out, who seems to think it's his own personal salad bar.
 
2012-09-03 07:05:29 PM

gingerjet: greentea1985: Organic foods are not marketed as more nutritious. They are marketed as having fewer pesticides and farming methods that are more friendly to the environment than traditional methods. The organic food did live up to the claim of having less exposure to pesticides.

Which continues to show the lack of evidence supporting either claim that something will kill you earlier or not. My bet is that neither will and you will most likely die of texting while walking into oncoming traffic.


I support organics more because they do not bulk up animals with antibiotics, which is a major source of antibiotic-resistant bacteria. Still, they do live up to their marketing of reduced pesticides, no hormones, and no antibiotics.
 
2012-09-03 07:05:59 PM

greentea1985: Organic foods are not marketed as more nutritious. They are marketed as having fewer pesticides and farming methods that are more friendly to the environment than traditional methods. The organic food did live up to the claim of having less exposure to pesticides.


Very true. The question about organic food isn't about nutrition it's about low cost and high quantity of food vs. environmental impact. The problem with organic farming is that humans have organically farmed for all of history and we've seen that it's unstable, unpredictable, and low yield. The green revolution really was a revolution that fed the world. Thanks to pesticides and fertilizer there are no more famines (that aren't caused by war or politics) and as much damage as they do to nature, organic farming will never be more than a fad that those who have money to will indulge in. Nobody is willing to see pesticides go away if it means that their children will go hungry. Of course, that doesn't mean they couldn't be better used.
 
2012-09-03 07:08:59 PM

greentea1985: Organic foods are not marketed as more nutritious. They are marketed as having fewer pesticides and farming methods that are more friendly to the environment than traditional methods. The organic food did live up to the claim of having less exposure to pesticides.


I know that they're not, that's more of an assumption some people make. I was just trying to find a way to find an possible explanation/excuse for this tragic headline, for fun.
 
2012-09-03 07:09:35 PM
I believe it. Last time I ate silicon-based food I was bleeding for days.
 
2012-09-03 07:11:27 PM

Martian_Astronomer: I believe it. Last time I ate silicon-based food I was bleeding for days.


Nice.
 
2012-09-03 07:11:44 PM
I buy rBST-free milk. It comes in an opaque bottle with a screw-top which makes it last longer than the translucent stuff.

Don't care about the science of rBST. I like milk that hasn't expired.
 
2012-09-03 07:14:26 PM
Why is this bullshiat in the news and not Monsanto and their genetically modified foods and the insane amounts of cash being spent by them and manufactures not to label them as such?
 
2012-09-03 07:19:40 PM

styckx: Why is this bullshiat in the news and not Monsanto and their genetically modified foods and the insane amounts of cash being spent by them and manufactures not to label them as such?


fun fact: everything you eat has been genetically modified by humans!
 
2012-09-03 07:23:12 PM

tlchwi02: styckx: Why is this bullshiat in the news and not Monsanto and their genetically modified foods and the insane amounts of cash being spent by them and manufactures not to label them as such?

fun fact: everything you eat has been genetically modified by humans!


They should keep genetically modifying things until we get that animal from the Hitchhiker's Guide.
 
2012-09-03 07:24:23 PM
Organics tend to be fresher and therefore more nutritious (and taste better) because they don't have as long of a shelf life due to the absence of anti-fungal agents etc.
 
2012-09-03 07:25:03 PM

tlchwi02: styckx: Why is this bullshiat in the news and not Monsanto and their genetically modified foods and the insane amounts of cash being spent by them and manufactures not to label them as such?

fun fact: everything you eat has been genetically modified by humans!


I don't have a problem with not labeling GM foods because if people don't know then they can't have knee-jerk "oh noes it's GM and therefore unsafe" reactions.
 
2012-09-03 07:27:20 PM

tlchwi02: styckx: Why is this bullshiat in the news and not Monsanto and their genetically modified foods and the insane amounts of cash being spent by them and manufactures not to label them as such?

fun fact: everything you eat has been genetically modified by humans!


Fun fact: sometimes with horrible consequences, sometimes to our benefit.

Horrible Evidence:
New Coke
 
2012-09-03 07:31:20 PM

To The Escape Zeppelin!: greentea1985: Organic foods are not marketed as more nutritious. They are marketed as having fewer pesticides and farming methods that are more friendly to the environment than traditional methods. The organic food did live up to the claim of having less exposure to pesticides.

Very true. The question about organic food isn't about nutrition it's about low cost and high quantity of food vs. environmental impact. The problem with organic farming is that humans have organically farmed for all of history and we've seen that it's unstable, unpredictable, and low yield. The green revolution really was a revolution that fed the world. Thanks to pesticides and fertilizer there are no more famines (that aren't caused by war or politics) and as much damage as they do to nature, organic farming will never be more than a fad that those who have money to will indulge in. Nobody is willing to see pesticides go away if it means that their children will go hungry. Of course, that doesn't mean they couldn't be better used.


I would like it if the world banned using antibiotics to bulk up animals. It is a major risk to human health because it promotes the rise of antibiotic-resistant bacteria.
 
2012-09-03 07:32:18 PM
Lesseee, they also produce half as much per acre as non-organics, meaning it takes twice the land, twice the gasoline, twice the waste, twice the people, twice the greenhouse gases, twice the pollution, and twice the global warming as non-organics. If we went 100% organic today, we couldn't feed all the people on the plant.

Organic food is evil. But as long as you enjoy the smell of you own farts, thhhannkkkks!
 
2012-09-03 07:45:39 PM

Relatively Obscure: tlchwi02: styckx: Why is this bullshiat in the news and not Monsanto and their genetically modified foods and the insane amounts of cash being spent by them and manufactures not to label them as such?

fun fact: everything you eat has been genetically modified by humans!

They should keep genetically modifying things until we get that animal from the Hitchhiker's Guide.


I really want a glazed rack of ribs, some crackling and a few steaks off that thing.
 
2012-09-03 07:47:39 PM

Relatively Obscure: They should keep genetically modifying things until we get that animal from the Hitchhiker's Guide.


fun fact: i've already said too much....
 
2012-09-03 07:54:40 PM
They totally taste better.

Got some Bell peppers from my friends garden. By the time I got home my car was filled with the smell.
 
2012-09-03 07:56:12 PM
Headline: "Organic food no healthier than non-organic." Second sentence: "But organic options may live up to their billing of lowering exposure to pesticide residue and antibiotic-resistant bacteria"

And therefore???

Lowering exposure to pesticide residue and antibiotic-resistant bacteria is no healthier than not lowering exposure to pesticide residue and antibiotic-resistant bacteria

QED 
 
2012-09-03 07:56:33 PM

cerejaninja: Hopefully they meant to say nutritious instead of healthy.


"Exposed to" is very nebulous. You can be exposed to a lot of things without negative health effects worth worrying about. I wouldn't worry about a tiny amount of pesticide on an apple when I'm eating the seeds that are chock-full of cyanide.

/i paid for a whole apple, I'm going to EAT the whole apple
 
2012-09-03 07:57:06 PM
i.qkme.me
 
2012-09-03 08:02:19 PM
As it has been mentioned already, organic farming is rather a feel good thing for those on the upper side of the global wealth scale who can afford to be picky about their food. If we switched to all organic farming we would have to be OK with letting a couple billion people starve to death. Hey, it's a free country. If you want to spend some more money to have a farmer produce less crops on that plot of land than they could otherwise for you to avoid modern farming methods, more power to you. It's not like I've never picked up some "organic" fruit in the supermarket.

But if you think you're saving the planet, tell that to the billions who either couldn't get or couldn't afford food if we switched entirely to the much less productive organic farming method.
 
2012-09-03 08:15:51 PM
Organic is the biggest food scam since the low-fat craze.
 
2012-09-03 08:24:12 PM

WorldCitizen: As it has been mentioned already, organic farming is rather a feel good thing for those on the upper side of the global wealth scale who can afford to be picky about their food. If we switched to all organic farming we would have to be OK with letting a couple billion people starve to death. Hey, it's a free country. If you want to spend some more money to have a farmer produce less crops on that plot of land than they could otherwise for you to avoid modern farming methods, more power to you. It's not like I've never picked up some "organic" fruit in the supermarket.

But if you think you're saving the planet, tell that to the billions who either couldn't get or couldn't afford food if we switched entirely to the much less productive organic farming method.


This only begs the questions organic is attempting to answer about sustainability and the next generation of limited resource users.
 
2012-09-03 08:25:14 PM

Bennie Crabtree: WorldCitizen: As it has been mentioned already, organic farming is rather a feel good thing for those on the upper side of the global wealth scale who can afford to be picky about their food. If we switched to all organic farming we would have to be OK with letting a couple billion people starve to death. Hey, it's a free country. If you want to spend some more money to have a farmer produce less crops on that plot of land than they could otherwise for you to avoid modern farming methods, more power to you. It's not like I've never picked up some "organic" fruit in the supermarket.

But if you think you're saving the planet, tell that to the billions who either couldn't get or couldn't afford food if we switched entirely to the much less productive organic farming method.

This only begs the questions organic is attempting to answer about sustainability and the next generation of limited resource users.


You don't know what "begs the question" means.
 
2012-09-03 08:27:13 PM

To The Escape Zeppelin!: organic farming will never be more than a fad that those who have money to will indulge in.


I'm sorry to have to tell you this, but your information is dated, and bears no resemblance to reality.

In fact, in much of the third world, organic farming is a far better tack to take than conventional farming, because it requires far fewer expensive inputs to produce well.

The notion that organic practices are less productive is largely a lie perpetrated by those who want to sell farmers a lot of expensive stuff, and who want the hidden costs of conventional farming to be paid by the public, rather than those who create those costs..
 
2012-09-03 08:28:10 PM

limboslam: qwave54: I buy Organic bananas because they taste better and don't make me sick. You could call them "Taste Better" bananas and I'd still buy them. I don't actually believe they are healthier/cleaner/better for the environment

Link


Lol. Taste tests are so great. They really just show how much people will trick themselves (or maybe even lie?) when their beliefs are at stake.

One of my favorites was a rice taste test my super anti-Japan Japanese politics teacher used conduct every year in Osaka with the help of his TAs. They claimed to be testing Japanese white rice, California-grown Japanese white rice, and Chinese white rice or something. They then did all kinds of sneaky stuff, like using the same type of rice under all three labels, switching the rices around, and generally just farking with the participants. Participants were then asked to rank the rices. Most people (if I recall correctly, like 80-something percent) picked Japanese, California-grown Japanese, and Chinese as their 1,2, and 3 respectively. He liked to talk about the results in class and watch the Japanese students squirm. It was pretty funny, though incredibly dickish.

/Super cool CSB, bro.
 
2012-09-03 08:33:17 PM

WorldCitizen: As it has been mentioned already, organic farming is rather a feel good thing for those on the upper side of the global wealth scale who can afford to be picky about their food. If we switched to all organic farming we would have to be OK with letting a couple billion people starve to death. Hey, it's a free country. If you want to spend some more money to have a farmer produce less crops on that plot of land than they could otherwise for you to avoid modern farming methods, more power to you. It's not like I've never picked up some "organic" fruit in the supermarket.

But if you think you're saving the planet, tell that to the billions who either couldn't get or couldn't afford food if we switched entirely to the much less productive organic farming method.


the world produces more than enough food to feed itself. the problem with the world food system is that the excess does not end up with the hungry, and instead goes into the garbage dump. about 40% of food in the US goes in the trash. but god forbid an American consumes less.

Link
 
2012-09-03 08:46:24 PM

Likwit: limboslam: qwave54: I buy Organic bananas because they taste better and don't make me sick. You could call them "Taste Better" bananas and I'd still buy them. I don't actually believe they are healthier/cleaner/better for the environment

Link

Lol. Taste tests are so great. They really just show how much people will trick themselves (or maybe even lie?) when their beliefs are at stake.

One of my favorites was a rice taste test my super anti-Japan Japanese politics teacher used conduct every year in Osaka with the help of his TAs. They claimed to be testing Japanese white rice, California-grown Japanese white rice, and Chinese white rice or something. They then did all kinds of sneaky stuff, like using the same type of rice under all three labels, switching the rices around, and generally just farking with the participants. Participants were then asked to rank the rices. Most people (if I recall correctly, like 80-something percent) picked Japanese, California-grown Japanese, and Chinese as their 1,2, and 3 respectively. He liked to talk about the results in class and watch the Japanese students squirm. It was pretty funny, though incredibly dickish.

/Super cool CSB, bro.


Well, or Penn and Tellers Bullshiat episode where they do the bottled water taste tests. They give people all these different bottles of water labeled as from this place or that with this property or that and have people taste test them. The people go on and on about the difference and which one tastes better. Turns out, they were all filled up out back from the same garden hose. I so loved that episode.
 
2012-09-03 08:51:11 PM

TommyymmoT: I have what I guess you could call an organic garden, and I'll match my produce against the supermarket's any day.


My family used to grow tomatoes and peppers in their back yard. Ten times tastier than anything I got from a store. Especially the tomatoes. You've never had a BLT like one that came from your own stash.
 
2012-09-03 09:05:44 PM

greentea1985: Organic foods are not marketed as more nutritious. They are marketed as having fewer pesticides and farming methods that are more friendly to the environment than traditional methods. The organic food did live up to the claim of having less exposure to pesticides.


Say what?

Organic foods are indeed marketed as more nutritious.

And many consumers also make the mistake of organic == no spray, which is far from the truth.
 
2012-09-03 09:32:15 PM

To The Escape Zeppelin!: greentea1985: Organic foods are not marketed as more nutritious. They are marketed as having fewer pesticides and farming methods that are more friendly to the environment than traditional methods. The organic food did live up to the claim of having less exposure to pesticides.

Very true. The question about organic food isn't about nutrition it's about low cost and high quantity of food vs. environmental impact. The problem with organic farming is that humans have organically farmed for all of history and we've seen that it's unstable, unpredictable, and low yield. The green revolution really was a revolution that fed the world. Thanks to pesticides and fertilizer there are no more famines (that aren't caused by war or politics) and as much damage as they do to nature, organic farming will never be more than a fad that those who have money to will indulge in. Nobody is willing to see pesticides go away if it means that their children will go hungry. Of course, that doesn't mean they couldn't be better used.


homestead.org 

The Chinese built a civilization of over a billion people using the same farmland consistently for over 4,000 years using organic techniques. Even the best western farming techniques cannot match that. When they tried moving to "modern" intensive farming during the cultural revolution, tens of millions died in the ensuing famines.
 
2012-09-03 09:37:00 PM

ScreamingHangover: To The Escape Zeppelin!: greentea1985: Organic foods are not marketed as more nutritious. They are marketed as having fewer pesticides and farming methods that are more friendly to the environment than traditional methods. The organic food did live up to the claim of having less exposure to pesticides.

Very true. The question about organic food isn't about nutrition it's about low cost and high quantity of food vs. environmental impact. The problem with organic farming is that humans have organically farmed for all of history and we've seen that it's unstable, unpredictable, and low yield. The green revolution really was a revolution that fed the world. Thanks to pesticides and fertilizer there are no more famines (that aren't caused by war or politics) and as much damage as they do to nature, organic farming will never be more than a fad that those who have money to will indulge in. Nobody is willing to see pesticides go away if it means that their children will go hungry. Of course, that doesn't mean they couldn't be better used.

[homestead.org image 302x471] 

The Chinese built a civilization of over a billion people using the same farmland consistently for over 4,000 years using organic techniques. Even the best western farming techniques cannot match that. When they tried moving to "modern" intensive farming during the cultural revolution, tens of millions died in the ensuing famines.


China had less than 600 million in 1950. It's also a very large country with a very large amount of agricultural land.
 
2012-09-03 09:40:43 PM

vestona22: Lesseee, they also produce half as much per acre as non-organics, meaning it takes twice the land, twice the gasoline, twice the waste, twice the people, twice the greenhouse gases, twice the pollution, and twice the global warming as non-organics.


But you get to charge twice as much, so you''re OK.
 
2012-09-03 10:08:39 PM
Friend of mine is growing an organic garden and invited me to a lunch made with things from said garden. It all tasted great, but didn't noticed any difference with non-organic veggies. If I didn't knew that it was from her garden, I wouldn't have guessed it was organic.

I've eaten organic vegetables on other occasions, but never really could tell a difference.

I guess that if you can afford organics, go for it, but I don't see how it could be efficient on a large scale...
 
2012-09-03 10:18:57 PM

WorldCitizen: Well, or Penn and Tellers Bullshiat episode where they do the bottled water taste tests.


I'm with them on the water test...although I still don't see how someone couldn't detect 'garden hose' water. Unless they let water sit in the 'fridge awhile..they also had the waiters do 'pushing' authority thing to the people.

On their organic food stuff...They rigged the test...they're not dumb and wanted an edge, they served the 'organic' things on red-plates and the normal stuff on blue plates----every time.

A red plate skews the results...especially with tomatoes etc. "Blue Plates" tend to make people think the food is better--you never hear of a 'red plate special', which gave them a 'house edge' for stuff on blue plates.


Still for veggies, (except tomatoes) I can't tell much diffrence. Eggs on the other hand, you can tell.
 
2012-09-03 10:30:59 PM
I just like growing my own stuff. and I like farming techniques that will survive the fall of oil.
 
2012-09-03 10:33:35 PM

vestona22: Lesseee, they also produce half as much per acre as non-organics, meaning it takes twice the land, twice the gasoline, twice the waste, twice the people, twice the greenhouse gases, twice the pollution, and twice the global warming as non-organics.


Were you dropped on your head as a child?
 
2012-09-03 10:54:53 PM

optikeye:

On their organic food stuff...They rigged the test...they're not dumb and wanted an edge, they served the 'organic' things on red-plates and the normal stuff on blue plates----every time.

A red plate skews the results...especially with tomatoes etc. "Blue Plates" tend to make people think the food is better--you never hear of a 'red plate special', which gave them a 'house edge' for stuff on blue plates.

Huh? Where'd you hear that? The term blue plate special means a cheap meal.

 
2012-09-03 10:56:29 PM

WorldCitizen:
China had less than 600 million in 1950. It's also a very large country with a very large amount of agricultural land.


China has a billion more people than the U.S., with only about 7% more land.
 
2012-09-03 10:59:29 PM

The Bird: WorldCitizen:
China had less than 600 million in 1950. It's also a very large country with a very large amount of agricultural land.

China has a billion more people than the U.S., with only about 7% more land.


Yes, and the US could support the same number of people, especially with the eating habits of the Chinese.
 
2012-09-03 11:13:13 PM

cybernia: Huh? Where'd you hear that? The term blue plate special means a cheap meal.


Color has always been a part of studies for many things. In this link it mentions that people eat less on red plates vs blue plates. Link
The navy and has done many studies about paint colors etc...and holding cells for jails are painted certain colors to calm aggression. Along with schools with the 50's and 60's pale green paint scheme.

Mc Donalds and other fast places use garish colors in their interiors instead of warm tones. The bright yellows and reds..at first draw you in..and then you want to leave quickly making a fast turnover for guests that might linger...even the design of the seats are made purposely made to be uncomfortable after a few mins.
 
2012-09-03 11:21:14 PM

Dow Jones and the Temple of Doom: You don't know what "begs the question" means.


I do. I thought about what it means when I wrote that actually, and chose to use it in an acceptable but unusual way.
 
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