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(CBC)   Lingerie Football League player tells women not to dress like whores (with Lingerie Football pic)   (cbc.ca) divider line 179
    More: Ironic, Toronto, Lingerie Football League, York University, nieces, Toronto Police  
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17259 clicks; posted to Main » on 30 Aug 2012 at 12:38 PM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2012-08-30 02:25:43 PM

PlatinumDragon: Mr. Right: The intelligent ones realize that following the law is always the best course. Those with personality disorders or other mental deficiencies do not believe that rules apply to them. So they do believe if a woman is dressed in a manner that they find provocative, they are entitled to "have their way" with her because "She was asking for it." No matter how wrong it is, those whose mental defects are severe enough to permit them to believe they are entitled to have sex with a woman on the basis of how she's dressed are not susceptible to suggestions to the contrary.

The very existence of victim-blaming "advice", and entire communities who treat assault victims poorly based on assumptions that they were "asking for it" based upon how they dressed, should demonstrate that the problem is at least partly societal, not just limited to sociopaths and people with low intelligence or mental disorders. Rape culture exists, it is communicated socially. Where do you think men (and, distressingly, a lot of women) get the idea that an attractively-dressed woman is "asking for it" and is at least partly responsible for an assault? Because that's exactly what Krista Ford's "don't dress like a whore" statement communicates.


I've never considered the origins of the excuse, just how to deal with it. In dealing with everyone from rapists to mild-mannered employees, we seem, societally, to have an inordinately high number of people who are, to varying degrees, pathologically incapable of being wrong. No excuse is too flimsy, too irrational, to be tried. The worst among them seem to believe that nothing they do is wrong so long as they can come up with an excuse. For "date rapists" the SHE WAS ASKING FOR IT works.

I've likened people like that to folks who drive the wrong way down a one way street. Normal people do that on occasion, but usually by accident. If you tell a sociopath that he's going the wrong way down a one way street, he'll find an excuse (I didn't see the arrow) which not only absolves him from all blame but it, in his warped mind, permits him to continue driving the wrong way. If he gets a ticket, the cop is a jerk because he doesn't understand that the fact that our driver didn't see the sign means he should be allowed to drive the wrong way whenever he wants!!!!

Our driver will also, by the way, be the most intolerant, road-raging SOB ever to get behind a wheel if he witnesses someone else driving the wrong way down the one-way street.

That's why I say that you can reach normal people with the message that no means no. Nothing gets through to the sociopath. I would also argue that people who are not rapists but believe the "she was asking for it" excuse have their own form of mental defect.
 
2012-08-30 02:26:33 PM
The Accused 1988
Case closed
 
2012-08-30 02:30:12 PM

PlatinumDragon: darkmayo: Your last statement reads to me like you are saying that there is nothing a woman can do to prevent or reduce risk of sexual assault.

You mean aside from packing heat and drawing on any guy who even jokes about doing something she doesn't want to do? Go look at the statistics and tell me what those women could have done to reduce their chances of being attacked by a friend, relative, co-worker, or acquaintance. You eventually end up at a Schroedinger's Rapist-type situation, which the Fark Independents repeatedly assure me is misandrist and man-hating stuff. Maybe the problem isn't that women don't do enough to prevent people from assaulting them -- maybe the problem is that people (overwhelmingly men) force sexual contact upon others, regardless of circumstances. Barring telepathic control of potential perpretrators, you tell me, based on actual research and evidence, what someone can do to "reduce the risk" of encouraging someone to attack them.

You know would reduce a woman's risk of being sexually assaulted? Teaching men that being around an intoxicated woman, her mode of dress, or being alone in the same friggin' room does not mean "yes, let's have sex". Dropkicking frat boys who chant things like "No means yes! Yes means anal!" out of school and making them explain to their families why might also have an effect.


So if there is no way to decrease it from happening, is there ways to increase your risk (not just from people you know, but from strangers as well)

/being a bit of a DA here.
 
2012-08-30 02:34:41 PM
PlatinumDragon:

BTW, while no means no and how a woman is dressed in no way permits a man to take any liberties with her whatsoever, let's also make clear that when an attractive woman is provocatively dressed, men will look. I understand that drooling is classless but when an attractive woman is wandering the beach in 3 postage stamps and a small piece of yarn, men are going to stare, unless accompanied by a sharp-elbowed spouse. And even then, we're going to get the most out of our peripheral vision. Still no permission to touch or otherwise harass, but we will gaze longingly. And she was asking for that.
 
2012-08-30 02:35:33 PM
Fark, i find the lack of pictures disturbing
 
2012-08-30 02:36:45 PM
So whats wrong with dressing like a whore?
 
2012-08-30 02:38:30 PM

darkmayo: Your last statement reads to me like you are saying that there is nothing a woman can do to prevent or reduce risk of sexual assault.


There are lots of things that a woman can do that will make it more likely that a rapist will target someone else instead of her.

Rapists will always go for the best target, no matter what that is. If all women wear more conservative clothing, it won't reduce rape at all. All women are doing by taking these precautions is making sure that somebody else gets raped instead of her.

Rape is NOT a crime of opportunity. Normal people don't head for the store for a gallon of milk and decide to rape somebody instead because she's dressed like a slut. If you have an uncontrollable urge to rape somebody because she's dressed sluttily or because you think you'd get away with it, seek professional help.
 
2012-08-30 02:41:16 PM
darkmayo: So if there is no way to decrease it from happening, is there ways to increase your risk (not just from people you know, but from strangers as well)

Again, Schroedinger's Rapist. Practically the only truly common factor in 85% of assaults is that the victim is female and the attacker male, with another 10%-odd being male-on-male. Woman on man does happen; some of those get posted to Fark all the time. Statutory assault and authority figure-taking-advantage-of-teenage male is still assault. However, the overwhelming majority of assaults are male-on-female, and as noted by actual facts 3/4 of those are committed by people known to the victim, so unless risk mitigation involves treating every male as a potential rapist, then there is nothing a person can do to influence the chances of a given individual trying to assault her or him. This has to be a society-wide effort to make it damned clear that there is no excuse or mitigating factor that makes it OK to sexually assault another person, under any circumstances, because any such mitigation requires placing responsibility upon a person who in no way invited or encouraged an assault, not by wearing a skirt, not by smiling, not by having a drink. This has to be a big, bright, do-not-cross line, because as noted above rapists will use any available excuse to introduce doubt and uncertainty where there is none, and a distressing number of people will choose to side with known assaulters in order to avoid "ruining their lives", or to "stop ruining the scene", or because "I've heard she likes to sleep around anyway".

No means no. End of story.
 
2012-08-30 02:41:29 PM

The Jami Turman Fan Club: .

Rape is NOT a crime of opportunity. Normal people don't head for the store for a gallon of milk and decide to rape somebody instead because she's dressed like a slut. If you have an uncontrollable urge to rape somebody because she's dressed sluttily or because you think you'd get away with it, seek professional help.


FTFY.
 
2012-08-30 02:43:35 PM

Theaetetus: WhippingBoy: Theaetetus: WhippingBoy:
Theaetetus, you outed yourself as a feminist witch-hunting, bigoted feminist in the recent "Oklahoma Hate Crimes" threads. Your opinion has no relevance anymore.

Oh, noes...

/now with context!

It was the only part that I agreed with, plus the only part relevant to your opinion, so I figured I'd save time of the reader.


It's too bad you can't see what you've become.
 
2012-08-30 02:47:00 PM

MoronLessOff: Apos: This thread,while intellectually stimulating,suffers from a scarcity of lingerie-clad footballer pics....Let's try and change that,shall we?



[m.nypost.com image 500x379]
[i.usatoday.net image 490x854]
[photos.lasvegassun.com image 653x420]
[photos.lasvegassun.com image 653x416]

Much appreciated!


*tips bowler hat* Think nothing of it,good sir.
 
2012-08-30 02:47:03 PM

Mr. Right: I've never considered the origins of the excuse, just how to deal with it.


You cannot properly counteract the effects of the excuse until you understand the genesis and context of the excuse.

And if someone you're staring at gives you a dirty look, or tries to hurry away after noticing your leer, or tells you to stop... you stop. You don't keep doing it. That's basic respect.
 
2012-08-30 02:47:16 PM
back to reality...

www2.pictures.zimbio.com
 
2012-08-30 02:49:04 PM

PlatinumDragon: darkmayo: So if there is no way to decrease it from happening, is there ways to increase your risk (not just from people you know, but from strangers as well)

Again, Schroedinger's Rapist. Practically the only truly common factor in 85% of assaults is that the victim is female and the attacker male, with another 10%-odd being male-on-male. Woman on man does happen; some of those get posted to Fark all the time. Statutory assault and authority figure-taking-advantage-of-teenage male is still assault. However, the overwhelming majority of assaults are male-on-female, and as noted by actual facts 3/4 of those are committed by people known to the victim, so unless risk mitigation involves treating every male as a potential rapist, then there is nothing a person can do to influence the chances of a given individual trying to assault her or him. This has to be a society-wide effort to make it damned clear that there is no excuse or mitigating factor that makes it OK to sexually assault another person, under any circumstances, because any such mitigation requires placing responsibility upon a person who in no way invited or encouraged an assault, not by wearing a skirt, not by smiling, not by having a drink. This has to be a big, bright, do-not-cross line, because as noted above rapists will use any available excuse to introduce doubt and uncertainty where there is none, and a distressing number of people will choose to side with known assaulters in order to avoid "ruining their lives", or to "stop ruining the scene", or because "I've heard she likes to sleep around anyway".

No means no. End of story.


There was a very interesting and sickening article that was posted (I think on fark) a few months ago that was a bunch of responses from rapists on why or what they thought when they raped or were about to rape someone, of course none of them thought it was rape and like you mentioned above had every excuse in the world to justify what they were doing.
 
2012-08-30 03:00:03 PM

darkmayo: There was a very interesting and sickening article that was posted (I think on fark) a few months ago that was a bunch of responses from rapists on why or what they thought when they raped or were about to rape someone, of course none of them thought it was rape and like you mentioned above had every excuse in the world to justify what they were doing.


And those were just the ones who got caught, IIRthe articleC. Grasping at any possible excuse they can conceive of to deflect attention away from the fact that they forced themselves upon women who didn't want to do anything. I'm also reminded of that bigshot RCC bishop (the story was linked here last night) who asserted that some abusive priests were the innocent victims of teen "seducers" - blame the victim, absolve the attacker of responsibility.

I remember the case of that 11-year-old girl who was gang-raped, and later blamed by the entire bloody town for the assault because she "dressed like a slut". People were more concerned with the lives of her attackers being ruined by the charges than the assault that led to those charges in the first place.

Don't get me started on Dominique Strauss-Kahn or Roman Polanski. The creepy euphemisms used to refer to the former's "advances" toward women, and the way otherwise-rational people act as if the latter was somehow the victim when he jumped bail to avoid being sentenced for raping a 13-year-old, send my rage meter off-scale.

There are a lot of things I can't discuss for various personal and confidentiality reasons, but suffice it to say every time someone offers so-called "common sense advice", I think "you're lucky you don't personally know the reality."
 
2012-08-30 03:01:41 PM
If she was wearing purple, she was just begging to get graped.
 
2012-08-30 03:05:35 PM
So the moral of the story is: if anyone asks for your advice on preventing sexual assault, say nothing, lest their delicate sensitivities are violated.
 
2012-08-30 03:15:47 PM

WhippingBoy: So the moral of the story is: if anyone asks for your advice on preventing sexual assault, say nothing, lest their delicate sensitivities are violated.


Pretty much. I think it's reasonable to say that if you are wearing clothing that draws additional attention to you that there is added risk to being assaulted. Even if it is only very slight. There is a very slight chance my airbag will go off in my truck if I get in an accident tonight, but I'm glad it's there.

You CAN wear a KKK costume in Harlem, but not a great idea. Looking in a mirror and asking yourself if your outfit is appropriate for the situation is just smart.

I appreciate myself a scantily clad woman, and don't want them to stop. All I'm saying is consider a jacket over top of that skirt if you are going to walk through the park at night alone. use common sense
 
2012-08-30 03:18:11 PM

WhippingBoy: So the moral of the story is: if anyone asks for your advice on preventing sexual assault, say nothing, lest their delicate sensitivities are violated.


In regards to the majority of sexual assaults that happen are by someone the victim knows, there really isn't a lot one can do other than some extreme measures.

Of course the stranger in a dark alley rape situations, which do happen but not anywhere near the frequency of other forms of rape yea you can not walk down dark alleys at night, be aware of your surroundings, being in shape and being able to smash a persons face in with your elbow likely also helps.
 
2012-08-30 03:25:28 PM

WhippingBoy: So the moral of the story is: if anyone asks for your advice on preventing sexual assault, say nothing, lest their delicate sensitivities are violated.


As opposed to simply offering it unasked, like a lot of people do, regardless of accuracy. After all, it's "common sense", even if it has no relation to or basis in what actually happens. It's factesque.
 
2012-08-30 03:26:42 PM

WhippingBoy: So the moral of the story is: if anyone asks for your advice on preventing sexual assault, say nothing, lest their delicate sensitivities are violated.


After the Aiken thing this last week, I think silence on the matter might be the right course.
 
2012-08-30 03:30:41 PM

Representative of the unwashed masses: You CAN wear a KKK costume in Harlem, but not a great idea. Looking in a mirror and asking yourself if your outfit is appropriate for the situation is just smart.


So what you're saying is that dressing attractively equals telling other people you want to have sex, amirite? Because that's the equivalence you're making here. A KKK costume has specific racist political meanings intended to trigger particular reactions in people. A short skirt or tank top, by the standard you've just established, must mean something. What ever could that intention you're mapping on to a wide range of clothing choices be?
 
2012-08-30 03:31:28 PM

WhippingBoy: Women should be able to dress how they want, just as I should be able to leave a wallet full of cash in plain sight in my unlocked car in the bad part of town.

Real World != Ideal World


True, but we should be strving for the ideal as much as possible.

Also, your correlation is flawed in multiple ways.

Try to be less stupid.
 
2012-08-30 03:32:09 PM

Agent Smiths Laugh: WhippingBoy: Women should be able to dress how they want, just as I should be able to leave a wallet full of cash in plain sight in my unlocked car in the bad part of town.

Real World != Ideal World

True, but we should be striving for the ideal as much as possible.

Also, your correlation is flawed in multiple ways.

Try to be less stupid.


Typo fixed.
 
2012-08-30 03:38:32 PM

PlatinumDragon: Representative of the unwashed masses: You CAN wear a KKK costume in Harlem, but not a great idea. Looking in a mirror and asking yourself if your outfit is appropriate for the situation is just smart.

So what you're saying is that dressing attractively equals telling other people you want to have sex, amirite? Because that's the equivalence you're making here. A KKK costume has specific racist political meanings intended to trigger particular reactions in people. A short skirt or tank top, by the standard you've just established, must mean something. What ever could that intention you're mapping on to a wide range of clothing choices be?


Way to take it out of context. I was picking an outlandish example, not saying anything at all bad about any outfit. Please don't try to put words into my mouth. Hell if you had read my entire post you'd realize I just want people to be careful and consider the situations that they may find themselves in, from there make a smart decision.

Perhaps a better analogy is sure you CAN wear a Boston Red Sox Jersey to a game at Yankee stadium but SHOULD you do that? That's everyone's choice, but even myself (white male) I'll consider wearing or not wearing an item of clothing that may offend someone.
 
2012-08-30 03:44:43 PM
Interesting thread.
 
2012-08-30 03:45:25 PM

MoronLessOff: CygnusDarius: MoronLessOff: fknra: [25.media.tumblr.com image 500x575]

... i'm... ok with this.

Looks like she's going deep.

She should tackle sack her.

I'd sack her too, IYKWIM.


Never stick your dick in crazy, and she has a documented family history of batshiat crazy.
 
2012-08-30 03:46:39 PM

lunkhed: If I leave my car keys in the ignition, there's no blame on me.
If I leave my house wide open, there's no blame on me.
If I write my credit card number and PIN at a supermarket cashpoint, there's no blame on me.
If I walk around dressed as a hooker, there's no blame on me.

Amirite?


Correct.
 
2012-08-30 03:48:16 PM

Agent Smiths Laugh: Agent Smiths Laugh: WhippingBoy: Women should be able to dress how they want, just as I should be able to leave a wallet full of cash in plain sight in my unlocked car in the bad part of town.

Real World != Ideal World

True, but we should be striving for the ideal as much as possible.

Also, your correlation is flawed in multiple ways.

Try to be less stupid.

Typo fixed.


Try to be less stupid.
 
2012-08-30 04:03:58 PM
You'd think she would have learned from the cop who got burned at York University for saying EXACTLY THE SAME THING.

Stupid idiot.
 
2012-08-30 04:32:18 PM

Representative of the unwashed masses: PlatinumDragon: Representative of the unwashed masses: You CAN wear a KKK costume in Harlem, but not a great idea. Looking in a mirror and asking yourself if your outfit is appropriate for the situation is just smart.

So what you're saying is that dressing attractively equals telling other people you want to have sex, amirite? Because that's the equivalence you're making here. A KKK costume has specific racist political meanings intended to trigger particular reactions in people. A short skirt or tank top, by the standard you've just established, must mean something. What ever could that intention you're mapping on to a wide range of clothing choices be?

Way to take it out of context. I was picking an outlandish example, not saying anything at all bad about any outfit. Please don't try to put words into my mouth. Hell if you had read my entire post you'd realize I just want people to be careful and consider the situations that they may find themselves in, from there make a smart decision.

Perhaps a better analogy is sure you CAN wear a Boston Red Sox Jersey to a game at Yankee stadium but SHOULD you do that? That's everyone's choice, but even myself (white male) I'll consider wearing or not wearing an item of clothing that may offend someone.


You implied that wearing a jacket over a skirt can somehow magically make you invisible to rapists, and that it is common sense to hold such a belief.

/Common sense may be common, but that doesn't make it good sense.
 
2012-08-30 04:47:15 PM

Theaetetus: lunkhed: If I leave my car keys in the ignition, there's no blame on me.
If I leave my house wide open, there's no blame on me.
If I write my credit card number and PIN at a supermarket cashpoint, there's no blame on me.
If I walk around dressed as a hooker, there's no blame on me.

Amirite?

Yep. Of course:
If you leave your car keys in the ignition, your car may be more likely to be stolen.
If you leave your house wide open, you may be more likely to be burgled.
If you leave your credit card at the supermarket, you may be more likely to be defrauded.
If you walk around dressed like a hooker... You're less likely to be raped.


Proof? Evidence? Citation?
 
2012-08-30 04:50:49 PM
If you walk around dressed like a hooker... You're less likely to be raped.

Proof? Evidence? Citation?


What I meant to say.
 
2012-08-30 04:56:22 PM

Representative of the unwashed masses: PlatinumDragon: Representative of the unwashed masses: You CAN wear a KKK costume in Harlem, but not a great idea. Looking in a mirror and asking yourself if your outfit is appropriate for the situation is just smart.

So what you're saying is that dressing attractively equals telling other people you want to have sex, amirite? Because that's the equivalence you're making here. A KKK costume has specific racist political meanings intended to trigger particular reactions in people. A short skirt or tank top, by the standard you've just established, must mean something. What ever could that intention you're mapping on to a wide range of clothing choices be?

Way to take it out of context. I was picking an outlandish example, not saying anything at all bad about any outfit. Please don't try to put words into my mouth. Hell if you had read my entire post you'd realize I just want people to be careful and consider the situations that they may find themselves in, from there make a smart decision.

Perhaps a better analogy is sure you CAN wear a Boston Red Sox Jersey to a game at Yankee stadium but SHOULD you do that? That's everyone's choice, but even myself (white male) I'll consider wearing or not wearing an item of clothing that may offend someone.


And again; the implication you make is that wearing a particular piece or set of clothing communicates a message to others that may incite a negative reaction. It's not as if people in Harlem just loathe people wearing white robes and hoods, and Yankees fans supposedly loathe people wearing Red Sox journeys, for no reason, right? Your argument relies on the implication that clothing choices can communicate messages, even messages such as "I'm a member of a racist group and think dark-skinned people are inferior" or "Fark New York", and that those unspoken messages can trigger reactions. By making a comparison using that outlandish, as you described it, example, you also imply that people who choose to dress in an attractive manner are communicating a message and inviting a reaction. I'm curious to learn what you think that message is, because it goes to the root of the dispute here - does a person who dresses attractively necessarily communicate that s/he wants to have sex? I would strongly disagree with such an assertion. Wanting to look sexy does not mean wanting to have sex, and we should strictly expect people to avoid conflating the two ideas.

If all you were trying to say is that men just can't control themselves, that's offensive to all of us men that can control ourselves - and it still doesn't place any responsibility upon a woman (or man) for dressing in a fashion deemed attractive. That's the excuse peddled by fine, upstanding folks like the Taliban.
 
2012-08-30 05:03:47 PM
These threads are a great way to see which Farkers are misogynists, assholes, and idiots. Glad to know they enjoy getting off on women being attacked and brutalized by men who can't control themselves.

Also, what's your definition of "dressing like a whore"? Some people think anything less than an Eskimo outfit in the middle of summer is whorish, while others find complete nudity normal.

/it's truly amazing the lengths people will go to paint women as sinful beasts trying to seduce and spoil men
//also says a lot about how weak and worhtless the men are when they admit to being unable to resist
 
2012-08-30 05:11:22 PM

PlatinumDragon: Maybe the problem isn't that women don't do enough to prevent people from assaulting them -- maybe the problem is that people (overwhelmingly men) force sexual contact upon others, regardless of circumstances.


But it's not irregardless of circumstance. Rapists are predators. Predators look for their prey to show certain signs or weaknesses. They look for a victim that has their senses compromised or may show a lack of awareness. They will maneuver their prey into the situation that will allow them to rape their victim yet have plausible deniability that is was consensual.
 
2012-08-30 05:13:43 PM
Oh good grief, I try to say consider the places you are going and give a second thought to your choice of wardrobe so as to mitigate (even though it's only a fractional thing) potential risks and I'm a bad guy for saying it? Get farked! There are bad people in the world, sure it is a very small percentage but you have to be prepared and know that they are out there.

Would I wear a my favorite red bandana in a Crips run neighborhood late at night? NO! BECAUSE I'M NOT A MORON AND I LEFT IT AT HOME JUST IN CASE!

I wear my seatbelt in a car because there is a chance I'll get in a collision. More than likely I won't. But it's a PRECAUTION. I wear a hardhat on an industrial site just in case something falls on my head.

If you're walking in a secluded area with poor lighting late at night wouldn't you feel safer wearing something that is instantly forgettable or a tight little dress that draws the attention of NASA. These are decisions that everyone has to make for themselves. Most people are good and won't think of attacking a lone woman. Just I'm not saying that anyone should be required to wear anything that they don't want to. And I will feel just as bad for someone wearing a skimpy dress as old sweatpants who is assaulted. But don't just on me just because I'm suggesting that people take a variety of precautions when they go out. For example, keep your wallet tucked away, or your purse close to you so a mugger can't take your money easily.

Expect the best of people but be wary for the worst of them.
 
2012-08-30 05:15:00 PM

PlatinumDragon: Wanting to look sexy does not mean wanting to have sex, and we should strictly expect people to avoid conflating the two ideas.


How can you have any concept of looking sexy with out it being implicitly tied to wanting sex. I mean that's why looking sexy is one form of dress that anybody could identify and looking cute is totally different. Looking sexy and wanting sex, or at least wanting to advertise sexual availability cannot be separated as the concept of sexy cannot exist without the former.
 
2012-08-30 05:26:38 PM

Representative of the unwashed masses: Oh good grief, I try to say consider the places you are going and give a second thought to your choice of wardrobe so as to mitigate (even though it's only a fractional thing) potential risks and I'm a bad guy for saying it? Get farked! There are bad people in the world, sure it is a very small percentage but you have to be prepared and know that they are out there.

Would I wear a my favorite red bandana in a Crips run neighborhood late at night? NO! BECAUSE I'M NOT A MORON AND I LEFT IT AT HOME JUST IN CASE!

I wear my seatbelt in a car because there is a chance I'll get in a collision. More than likely I won't. But it's a PRECAUTION. I wear a hardhat on an industrial site just in case something falls on my head.

If you're walking in a secluded area with poor lighting late at night wouldn't you feel safer wearing something that is instantly forgettable or a tight little dress that draws the attention of NASA. These are decisions that everyone has to make for themselves. Most people are good and won't think of attacking a lone woman. Just I'm not saying that anyone should be required to wear anything that they don't want to. And I will feel just as bad for someone wearing a skimpy dress as old sweatpants who is assaulted. But don't just on me just because I'm suggesting that people take a variety of precautions when they go out. For example, keep your wallet tucked away, or your purse close to you so a mugger can't take your money easily.

Expect the best of people but be wary for the worst of them.


Somehow I doubt that a person lurking in a dark alley for someone to rob/rape would care what they were wearing as long as they could rape/rob them.
 
2012-08-30 05:28:48 PM

manimal2878: PlatinumDragon: Wanting to look sexy does not mean wanting to have sex, and we should strictly expect people to avoid conflating the two ideas.

How can you have any concept of looking sexy with out it being implicitly tied to wanting sex. I mean that's why looking sexy is one form of dress that anybody could identify and looking cute is totally different. Looking sexy and wanting sex, or at least wanting to advertise sexual availability cannot be separated as the concept of sexy cannot exist without the former.


By that logic, everyone at the beach is just begging for a farking.
 
2012-08-30 05:30:59 PM

Keizer_Ghidorah:

Somehow I doubt that a person lurking in a dark alley for someone to rob/rape would care what they were wearing as long as they could rape/rob them.



fc09.deviantart.net

Then I take it no one should ever take precautions because it's destined to happen? Hell you'd think I came in here and called all women sluts or something. One last time. Be careful. Consider taking precautions. It's what smart people do.
 
2012-08-30 05:38:20 PM
The Fords unfortunately still not found on road dead

Link

Worst mayor any city has ever had
 
2012-08-30 05:53:09 PM

Inflatable Rhetoric: If you walk around dressed like a hooker... You're less likely to be raped.

Proof? Evidence? Citation?

What I meant to say.


You should spend less time fixing typos and more time clicking on the cited links to read the evidence and proof therein.
 
2012-08-30 05:59:45 PM

BruinsHockey: And people wonder why Toronto is hated outside of Ontario


Not just outside of Ontario.

/905-er here
//hates T.O.
///commutes in to work there
 
2012-08-30 06:04:03 PM

Representative of the unwashed masses: Oh good grief, I try to say consider the places you are going and give a second thought to your choice of wardrobe so as to mitigate (even though it's only a fractional thing) potential risks and I'm a bad guy for saying it? Get farked! There are bad people in the world, sure it is a very small percentage but you have to be prepared and know that they are out there.

Would I wear a my favorite red bandana in a Crips run neighborhood late at night? NO! BECAUSE I'M NOT A MORON AND I LEFT IT AT HOME JUST IN CASE!

I wear my seatbelt in a car because there is a chance I'll get in a collision. More than likely I won't. But it's a PRECAUTION. I wear a hardhat on an industrial site just in case something falls on my head.

If you're walking in a secluded area with poor lighting late at night wouldn't you feel safer wearing something that is instantly forgettable or a tight little dress that draws the attention of NASA. These are decisions that everyone has to make for themselves. Most people are good and won't think of attacking a lone woman. Just I'm not saying that anyone should be required to wear anything that they don't want to. And I will feel just as bad for someone wearing a skimpy dress as old sweatpants who is assaulted. But don't just on me just because I'm suggesting that people take a variety of precautions when they go out. For example, keep your wallet tucked away, or your purse close to you so a mugger can't take your money easily.

Expect the best of people but be wary for the worst of them.


Maybe you could tell us where all of the "Rapist Neighbourhoods" are so we can make sure that we can take the proper precaution to not get caught there at night in our bar outfits.

If I'm walking alone in a dark, secluded area, I would feel safer simply not being there. The clothes I'm wearing wouldn't make me feel more or less safe, because the risk factor is that I'm walking alone in a dark, secluded area. A rapist is not looking to steal my dress and my high heels, they are looking to violate my body. I would have to wear a literal suit of armor if I wanted my clothing to reduce my risk factor of being raped, and even that would be no guarantee of safety.

I don't take issue with promoting safety precautions and awareness, I would just prefer if we could focus on safety precautions that might actually help to mitigate risk, rather than just making women feel ashamed for wanting to wear clothes that make them feel confident and attractive.
If you make the decision to walk home alone, inebriated, through a dark, secluded area where there happens to be a rapist hanging around, do you really think that you would be safer wearing a jacket?

/That's like thinking that home intruders won't find you if you just hide in bed under the blankets.
 
2012-08-30 06:09:16 PM

suziequzie: BruinsHockey: And people wonder why Toronto is hated outside of Ontario

Not just outside of Ontario.

/905-er here
//hates T.O.
///commutes in to work there


Not just outside Toronto, some days I hate this place, other days I love it. So far the love it is winning.
 
2012-08-30 06:17:07 PM

Representative of the unwashed masses: Keizer_Ghidorah:

Somehow I doubt that a person lurking in a dark alley for someone to rob/rape would care what they were wearing as long as they could rape/rob them.


[fc09.deviantart.net image 750x600]

Then I take it no one should ever take precautions because it's destined to happen? Hell you'd think I came in here and called all women sluts or something. One last time. Be careful. Consider taking precautions. It's what smart people do.



And the point being made is that wearing more concealing clothing doesn't really constitute a precaution (at least according to many studies linked ITT). Not walking home alone, drunk, in the dark, through a secluded/dangerous place? That's a precaution. Walking tall, as Ms. Ford suggested, as to not make oneself look weak and rape-able, while also carrying a weapon? That's a precaution, too. But if you're gonna be the victim of a 'wrong place, wrong time' rape, how sexily you're dressed doesn't really play into it.
 
2012-08-30 06:31:12 PM

Loomy: Representative of the unwashed masses: Keizer_Ghidorah:

Somehow I doubt that a person lurking in a dark alley for someone to rob/rape would care what they were wearing as long as they could rape/rob them.


[fc09.deviantart.net image 750x600]

Then I take it no one should ever take precautions because it's destined to happen? Hell you'd think I came in here and called all women sluts or something. One last time. Be careful. Consider taking precautions. It's what smart people do.


And the point being made is that wearing more concealing clothing doesn't really constitute a precaution (at least according to many studies linked ITT). Not walking home alone, drunk, in the dark, through a secluded/dangerous place? That's a precaution. Walking tall, as Ms. Ford suggested, as to not make oneself look weak and rape-able, while also carrying a weapon? That's a precaution, too. But if you're gonna be the victim of a 'wrong place, wrong time' rape, how sexily you're dressed doesn't really play into it.


sigh... ok pretend I am a dad talking to a daughter then. I don't care. I have no issue with people wearing whatever the fark they want. Of course there are people out there who mean to harm others. Nothing you do can prevent that. As a friendly statement I would say think about what you are doing, where you are going etc and try to be ready for it.

Look we're basically saying the same thing. I'm merely suggesting that in some cases it may not be wise to wear something that draws attention to you. How that's defined is different for everyone. I had my opinion on what I would want my daughter/girlfriend etc to wear in those kinds of cases. And just like assholes, everyone has an opinion.
 
2012-08-30 06:41:26 PM

manimal2878: PlatinumDragon: Wanting to look sexy does not mean wanting to have sex, and we should strictly expect people to avoid conflating the two ideas.

How can you have any concept of looking sexy with out it being implicitly tied to wanting sex. I mean that's why looking sexy is one form of dress that anybody could identify and looking cute is totally different. Looking sexy and wanting sex, or at least wanting to advertise sexual availability cannot be separated as the concept of sexy cannot exist without the former.


If you can't perceive a difference between wanting to look attractive and specifically wanting to have sex, then congratulations on demonstrating your lack of knowledge about consent.
 
2012-08-30 06:48:26 PM
Does expressing intense outrage and flying into histrionics every time someone gives potentially naive advice (e.g. "don't dress like a whore") really address the root of the problem? Does telling people to kill themselves or insinuating that they, themselves, are "probable rapists" because they advocate what they believe to be valid safety precautions make people want to listen to what you have to say?

Perhaps if we could drop the dramatics and act like adults, we might actually make some progress...
 
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