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(Science Daily)   Adolescent pot use shown to leave lasting, like, stuff and all   (sciencedaily.com) divider line 248
    More: Scary, photos, Institute of Psychiatry, development studies, shortages, teenagers, marijuana  
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9229 clicks; posted to Main » on 27 Aug 2012 at 8:27 PM (2 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2012-08-27 09:23:25 PM  

Mithiwithi: mekki: FloydA: What's ironic is that these data will probably be used to try to support a "tough on drugs" stance, when in fact, the most effective way to reduce teenagers' access to pot would be to legalize it and treat it like alcohol or tobacco- no ID, no sale. The street corner pot dealers don't ask for ID, but shop clerks do. Legalize it for sale to adults and the profit will drop out of the bottom, so the criminal gangs won't sell it anymore. Immediately, teenagers' access to pot would be dramatically diminished.

Yeah, because underaged kids never drink or smoke or find ways to get alcohol and cigarettes. This will decrease drug use for sure.

Good thing that's not the case. Because if it were, it'd totally prove that it was easier for teens to get booze and cigs than it is for them to get weed.

/I'm not entirely sure which way the sarcasm is even going anymore
//to be more clear, my actual point is "it's easier for teens to get pot than booze" != "it's hard for teens to get booze".


If you think it's hard for teens to get booze then you've been around some really dumb, lazy teens. No one I knew had any problem getting booze. That's what older siblings, older relatives, older friends and "cool" parents were for.
 
2012-08-27 09:23:49 PM  
Umfufu:Ummm...does anyone think the corner dealers are going to go away if pot is legalized? Really?

Really?


They'll just be selling less weed. There will still be plenty of crack and meth to sell!
 
2012-08-27 09:23:51 PM  

Umfufu: Ummm...does anyone think the corner dealers are going to go away if pot is legalized? Really?

Really?


Yes I do. Do you see people selling booze and cigarettes on the street?

forum.stratovarius.com
 
2012-08-27 09:24:23 PM  

RandomRandom: Weed isn't as harmful as alcohol, but it's not nearly as harmless as a stone sober existence.



and who the fark would want this? i take it you don't enjoy any coffee or other kinds of stimulants to get you going in the morning? humans have an innate desire to change their perceptions of the world. this occurs whether you have access to drugs or not. why do you think choking/oxygen deprivation games are so popular amongst kids?
 
2012-08-27 09:26:39 PM  

divgradcurl: RandomRandom: Weed isn't as harmful as alcohol, but it's not nearly as harmless as a stone sober existence.


and who the fark would want this? i take it you don't enjoy any coffee or other kinds of stimulants to get you going in the morning? humans have an innate desire to change their perceptions of the world. this occurs whether you have access to drugs or not. why do you think choking/oxygen deprivation games are so popular amongst kids?


In the fitness/gym world, we have something called "bro science." This seems like "stoner science."
 
2012-08-27 09:28:37 PM  

nmemkha: Umfufu: Ummm...does anyone think the corner dealers are going to go away if pot is legalized? Really?

Really?

Yes I do. Do you see people selling booze and cigarettes on the street?

[forum.stratovarius.com image 491x379]


I DO NOT EVER WANT TO SEE THAT AGAIN. Phillip Morris would totally fark over weed spraying it with the nastiest shiat they can find. Glass pipe, nice juicy bud, that's the way it should be. Fark P.M.!
 
2012-08-27 09:30:26 PM  

GentlemanJ: See? I could have been a genius, but instead, I'm just a...SubGenius.


Nobody was looking. Do it again.
 
2012-08-27 09:31:03 PM  
IQ tests are lame anyway. You spend your time smoking and weed and watching cartoons instead of doing sudoku, and your brain gets lazy instead of forming the kinds of habits you need to do well on an IQ test. Somebody who did nothing but watch porn all day over the same period would probably see the same drop in "performance." Doesn't mean anything.
 
2012-08-27 09:31:17 PM  
in america adults cannot smoke a cigarette in most bars, restaurants or places of employment. i don't expect maryjane laws to get lax coast to coast anytime soon.

worried about the children? i'd worry too except there are so many alcoholics, drug abusers, wife/husband/child beaters, mentally ill, undereducated, ignorant, redneck, unemployed, republican, democrat, and religion mind-farked people having and raising these children that it really doesn't matter a crap. we have a country full of trash, amen.
 
2012-08-27 09:32:25 PM  
What?
 
2012-08-27 09:32:45 PM  
because, man, squirrels the indubitable pocket ninja

It's a watchword round here
 
2012-08-27 09:33:28 PM  

FloydA: What's ironic is that these data will probably be used to try to support a "tough on drugs" stance, when in fact, the most effective way to reduce teenagers' access to pot would be to legalize it and treat it like alcohol or tobacco- no ID, no sale. The street corner pot dealers don't ask for ID, but shop clerks do. Legalize it for sale to adults and the profit will drop out of the bottom, so the criminal gangs won't sell it anymore. Immediately, teenagers' access to pot would be dramatically diminished.


It's pretty easy to get alcohol when you're a kid. A lot easier than weed, actually, for most people. You walk to the fridge and grab a beer, or walk to the liquor cabinet and grab a bottle of jack, or walk to the wine rack and grab a bottle of wine. Don't even need to leave the house.

And, no, access to black market pot all of the sudden won't disappear if drugs are legalized. The difference between drinkable alcohol, today's smokeable tobacco, and smokeable marijuana is pretty vast as far as cultivation and preparation goes. You need orders of magnitude less labor and investment to grow marijuana than to make drinkable alcohol or tobacco
 
2012-08-27 09:35:34 PM  
Well, I'm not sure one could argue they smoke pot and are intelligent when they're choosing to partake in something that is illegal and could screw their life up if caught. At the very least you're lacking common sense which is almost par with being stupid.
 
2012-08-27 09:36:15 PM  
I hate this idea of IQ being a static number that will remain the same for the rest of your life barring external factors (like marijuana use). Your IQ is like your weight. It fluctuates as you develop and age.
 
2012-08-27 09:39:07 PM  

Dow Jones and the Temple of Doom: divgradcurl: RandomRandom: Weed isn't as harmful as alcohol, but it's not nearly as harmless as a stone sober existence.


and who the fark would want this? i take it you don't enjoy any coffee or other kinds of stimulants to get you going in the morning? humans have an innate desire to change their perceptions of the world. this occurs whether you have access to drugs or not. why do you think choking/oxygen deprivation games are so popular amongst kids?

In the fitness/gym world, we have something called "bro science." This seems like "stoner science."


heh. i would never take anything anybody says about science in places like /fit/ or misc seriously, however, you would be partially correct that this is sort of "stoner reasoning" i read this argument in either "from chocolate to morphine" or the "the natural mind." both books by a alternative medicine doctor named andrew weil. the argument seemed convincing and has stayed with when thinking about how we handle different substances and how they affect our minds/perceptions.
 
2012-08-27 09:39:13 PM  
Thinking in my own regard, honestly, I'd have to agree. Somewhere in my youth I simply lost the ability to understand math. Algebra-Trig it started and then pre-calc was it. Done. Couldn't get it. And at one time math seemed so easy but I remember I just hit a wall mentally. Exactly around the time I started finding weed more enjoyable and available. However, I also around that time discovered I had a fair knack for writing, playing and creating music, and even a spark of artistic talents. Not exactly intelligent stuff, at least measurable. So to math's loss was music's gain.

/ such as it was
 
Oak
2012-08-27 09:39:24 PM  
I agree: you probably shouldn't smoke pot until you're 18. I smoked it twice before I was 18, but I don't consider myself any kind of role model. I didn't start smoking more enthusiastically until I was older than 18; I advocate waiting.

But it still oughta be treated by the law more like alcohol than heroin.
 
2012-08-27 09:41:16 PM  

trappedspirit: GentlemanJ: See? I could have been a genius, but instead, I'm just a...SubGenius.

Nobody was looking. Do it again.


Sorry, meant to post the great and holy Dobbshead of Glory, but got distracted. This would not have happened were I on weed.

i1094.photobucket.com

dv-ous: IQ tests are lame anyway. You spend your time smoking and weed and watching cartoons instead of doing sudoku, and your brain gets lazy instead of forming the kinds of habits you need to do well on an IQ test. Somebody who did nothing but watch porn all day over the same period would probably see the same drop in "performance." Doesn't mean anything.


I freaking LOVE Sudoku when stoned. Also any kind of brain-training or memory enhancement programs. My best Ars Memorativa work happens while baked. Heheh- arse.
 
2012-08-27 09:41:21 PM  
Its science man. Like global warming.
 
2012-08-27 09:42:31 PM  

GentlemanJ: See? I could have been a genius, but instead, I'm just a...SubGenius.


Slack for you!
Slack for me!
You should join us,
or don't, and Fark off
 
2012-08-27 09:43:13 PM  

bhcompy: FloydA: What's ironic is that these data will probably be used to try to support a "tough on drugs" stance, when in fact, the most effective way to reduce teenagers' access to pot would be to legalize it and treat it like alcohol or tobacco- no ID, no sale. The street corner pot dealers don't ask for ID, but shop clerks do. Legalize it for sale to adults and the profit will drop out of the bottom, so the criminal gangs won't sell it anymore. Immediately, teenagers' access to pot would be dramatically diminished.

It's pretty easy to get alcohol when you're a kid. A lot easier than weed, actually, for most people. You walk to the fridge and grab a beer, or walk to the liquor cabinet and grab a bottle of jack, or walk to the wine rack and grab a bottle of wine. Don't even need to leave the house.

And, no, access to black market pot all of the sudden won't disappear if drugs are legalized. The difference between drinkable alcohol, today's smokeable tobacco, and smokeable marijuana is pretty vast as far as cultivation and preparation goes. You need orders of magnitude less labor and investment to grow marijuana than to make drinkable alcohol or tobacco


Why do people believe this tripe? Weed is just as labor intensive as tobacco and booze. Actually, making moonshine is way easier and faster.

Also, if alcohol was that easy to get then your parents were to blame, not an inanimate object.

/the kids are alright
 
2012-08-27 09:44:10 PM  

LamOtter: Indubitably: Indubitably: Indubitably: MBooda: Among a long-range study cohort of more than 1,000 New Zealanders,


A good man can use his penis to make women stalk him.

This has happened to me more than once.

Twice, in fact.

It isn't pleasant, actually.

Penis.

;)

No more drugs for that man.


Seriously?

Your penis decrys.
 
2012-08-27 09:47:53 PM  

lewismarktwo: Why do people believe this tripe? Weed is just as labor intensive as tobacco and booze. Actually, making moonshine is way easier and faster.


Because uneducated folks think you just plant a seed and out pops a plant and you put the plant in a pipe and smoke it.

Few people other than growers realize what a fickle plant it is to grow properly, or how sensitive it is to pests, or how labor intensive trimming is, or how long it takes to dry and cure buds to have an actual smokeable product that's worth a damn.
 
2012-08-27 09:51:43 PM  
Yeahhhhhh....here comes this old argument.

I'm 43 and smoked pot in my teens like my life depended on it. Now, I'm the software development architect for a major company. I've forgotten more about programming than most people know.

My brain work fine. It work. Yes. Fine it work...
 
2012-08-27 09:52:07 PM  
I think this is pretty common sense, kids should be kept away from all street drugs, and alcohol too. Also, this study was funded by the government. It's not like the government has a vested interest in demonizing the effects of cannabis.

"The study was published online Monday in the Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences. It was funded with governmental grants from the United States and Britain, and a foundation in Zurich."
 
2012-08-27 09:52:43 PM  
Growin' lotsa bloomers is hard; cannabis is easy. Do you think the plant would go ahead and make its imbibers dumb if doing so would effect its survival?
 
2012-08-27 09:53:17 PM  

drayno76: nmemkha: Umfufu: Ummm...does anyone think the corner dealers are going to go away if pot is legalized? Really?

Really?

Yes I do. Do you see people selling booze and cigarettes on the street?

[forum.stratovarius.com image 491x379]

I DO NOT EVER WANT TO SEE THAT AGAIN. Phillip Morris would totally fark over weed spraying it with the nastiest shiat they can find. Glass pipe, nice juicy bud, that's the way it should be. Fark P.M.!


The point is, my smelly hippie friend, that legalization will bring in Big Business(tm) and that will lead to lobbying that will lead to the opening of legal channels and harsh crackdowns on illegal ones. Sure Big Tobacco will try and sell their processed poison, but I suspect mom-pot shops will open everywhere as entrepreneurs cater to a boutique market.
 
2012-08-27 09:53:37 PM  

vudukungfu: Pocket Ninja: I want an ice pop

I hate when the banana flavor is the same color as the pineapple. Usually, the greens are harsh and somewhat fruity, and the reds are some passion punch bullshiat, but the yellows, man. Those yellows in the tropical assorted fruit flavors can be either banana or pineapple, which I save for daiquiri, and by daiquiri, I mean add rum or tequila and let them mellow yellow in the glass. Don't add ice, because the ice is in the freezy pop, man. Anyway, don't you hate it when the kids get into your stash of freezy pops?


I've done my best to keep out of this but now the two of you have forced my hand.

First of all, there is a distinct difference in the shade of yellow when differentiating between the pineapple pop and it's lessor known cousin, the banana pop- the former having a washed out yellowish tint which can easily be confused for another common flavor: lemon-- and the latter which is a rich yellow tone that could only be attributed to the banana pop.

Secondly, you'd have cullinary manners of a freaking barbarian that would allow such a discussion such as this to come up. Do you really know of any company that would so foolishly include pops of similar color but completely different flavors to be distributed in the same carton to the general public? Of course not. Then why then would you be vexed by two different flavors similar in color encased in that yellow and brown stained, frost encrusteded hole you call a freezer? That's right, my friend, left-overs from times gone by- the dreaded second , third, forth generational remains of yellow popsicles gone by.

This is no way to treat a pop. Give them dignified depature they've truly earned. Peel off that soiled protective paper coat, drop them in the sink, shower them with luke warm water, and give them back to the Earth from whence they came.

PS. Ya don't know shiat from shinola, kiddies: the red pops are usually chemically enhanced cherry flavored and not an exotic mix of tropical fruit juices yo've been led by that ring in your collective noses to believe they are.
 
2012-08-27 09:56:26 PM  
I smoke pot daily (I have early stage Parkinson's) and I am able to work as a freelance software developer and juggle multiple projects while meeting my deadlines.

I hope the "Hippie Pot Smoking Loser" stereotype dies with the Boomers.
 
2012-08-27 09:57:16 PM  

scottydoesntknow: What kind of point are you trying to make? Of course some will get a hold of cigarettes (and booze), but I've never known a single dealer to turn away business based on age or lack of ID.


I think the point is that this claim that legalizing marijuana will make it harder for teens to get it is total, absolute, uncut bullshiat.

Virtually everyone in middle/high school can find at least one or two people over 18 to buy them cigarettes, and there's no shortage of stories about 13-20 year olds drinking on a regular basis.

Nearly everyone I knew in high school had zero issues getting cigarettes and only mild difficulty finding alcohol. EVERY SINGLE WEEKEND, someone threw a party or had a gathering and there was plenty of alcohol (usually beer) available.

To say that marijuana will be just as accessible is actually just fine by me as I see it as a healthier alternative to alcohol, and far, far less addicting then cigarettes.

But to pretend that alcohol and cigarettes are actually hard to get, that marijuana is easier to get, and that legalizing marijuana will actually make it harder to get is the kind of stuff people say when they're baked out of their mind.
 
2012-08-27 09:57:36 PM  

divgradcurl: and who the fark would want this? i take it you don't enjoy any coffee or other kinds of stimulants to get you going in the morning? humans have an innate desire to change their perceptions of the world. this occurs whether you have access to drugs or not. why do you think choking/oxygen deprivation games are so popular amongst kids?


Caffeine doesn't drop average IQ by 8 points, or any points. If it did, I wouldn't use it, neither would a lot of people.

It's not exactly surprising that heavy weed use lowers IQ. Anyone spending time with heavy weed users has had abundant anecdotal evidence of their diminished mental ability. This study just confirms these long-time suspicions.

Weed users should be aware of the risks and not live in denial. There are provable disease risks from smoking weed, not as bad as cigarettes, but not nothing either. My doctor says that all of the young lung cancer patients he sees are heavy weed users, anecdotal, I know. These IQ risks are now provable and are not a small issue. Actions have consequences, wow, surprise.

/Don't smoke, but am absolutely in favor of totally legalized weed. Not de-criminalized, LEGALIZED, heavily taxed, and after this study, definitely age-restricted.
 
2012-08-27 10:01:06 PM  

lewismarktwo: Why do people believe this tripe? Weed is just as labor intensive as tobacco and booze. Actually, making moonshine is way easier and faster.



Ive personally made wine and grown plenty of weed, and never found either very labor intensive at all. Cannabis growth is more about paying attention than doing any actual labor, unless you're inexperienced, or running some kind of indoor state of the art hydro system and light rigs. Otherwise you put a plant in the ground and provide it with water and nutrients at the appropriate times, clone at the appropriate time, and pay your neighbors minimum wage to do all that trimming at the end.

I looked into it and beer brewing seems 10x as confusing, or at least has more potential for failure. You can do so many things wrong when trying to brew beer. Cannabis is a hardy ass weed that grows itself as long as you dont fakr it all up.
 
2012-08-27 10:01:28 PM  

Three-Fifty: In addition to making them, their clothes, their rooms, etc. smell like dog shiat?? Sucks for them.


I think you may have dog shiat on your upper lip...man.
 
2012-08-27 10:05:42 PM  
I'm sorry, I wasn't paying attention. Can you repeat that?
 
2012-08-27 10:09:03 PM  

nmemkha: Umfufu: Ummm...does anyone think the corner dealers are going to go away if pot is legalized? Really?

Really?

Yes I do. Do you see people selling booze and cigarettes on the street?



Look at it this way...how much do you think the government will sell pot for? (any medicinal guys want to enlighten us as to how much the prescription stuff runs?) Cheaper than a drug dealer can grow it in his basement? Cheaper than a kid can raise a pot plant in his room? How much actual processing is involved in taking pot from a plant to a sell-able product?

Cigarettes in NYC are $10.00+ a pack...how many folks actually buy their cigarettes in NYC?
 
2012-08-27 10:10:13 PM  

divgradcurl: Dow Jones and the Temple of Doom: divgradcurl: RandomRandom: Weed isn't as harmful as alcohol, but it's not nearly as harmless as a stone sober existence.


and who the fark would want this? i take it you don't enjoy any coffee or other kinds of stimulants to get you going in the morning? humans have an innate desire to change their perceptions of the world. this occurs whether you have access to drugs or not. why do you think choking/oxygen deprivation games are so popular amongst kids?

In the fitness/gym world, we have something called "bro science." This seems like "stoner science."

heh. i would never take anything anybody says about science in places like /fit/ or misc seriously, however, you would be partially correct that this is sort of "stoner reasoning" i read this argument in either "from chocolate to morphine" or the "the natural mind." both books by a alternative medicine doctor named andrew weil. the argument seemed convincing and has stayed with when thinking about how we handle different substances and how they affect our minds/perceptions.


Yeah, I get it. I definitely have done enough "perception altering." In fact, I've done so much that I actually am planning a long stretch of stone sobriety and I'm actually very excited about it.
 
2012-08-27 10:13:17 PM  

nmemkha: The point is, my smelly hippie friend, that legalization will bring in Big Business(tm) and that will lead to lobbying that will lead to the opening of legal channels and harsh crackdowns on illegal ones. Sure Big Tobacco will try and sell their processed poison, but I suspect mom-pot shops will open everywhere as entrepreneurs cater to a boutique market.


You're wrong, but for the wrong reasons. They wouldn't need to crack down on small producers, they would just price them out of the market.

If weed were produced by Big Tobacco, their pricing would absolutely destroy the existing producers. Consider that tobacco cigarettes (pre-tax) cost only few cents to produce. A few years ago, it was under 3 cents per smoke.

Weed cigarettes would actually be cheaper to produce than finished cigarette tobacco. Sure, high-quality weed is cloned, but cigarette tobacco is packed with ingredients that are not tobacco, chocolate is a big one. These extra ingredients and processing required for most cigarette tobacco would not be necessary for weed cigarettes. This suggests that the production costs of industrially produced joints would be as low or lower than that of tobacco smokes.

At most, an industrially produced joint would probably cost a nickel to make. Add 2000% tax and it brings the price all the way up to $1. One dollar per joint for high quality, reliable, fresh, consistent, weed. Local weed vendors can compete against that? I don't think so.

Big Tobacco would DESTROY the illicit marketplace, overnight. The illicit market's problem is that secrecy costs, secrecy costs a lot. Illicit production of anything has massive overhead costs. Illicit farms, illicit farmers, illicit funding, illicit fertilizer, illicit workers, illicit payroll, illicit transportation, illicit sales force. People doing illicit work demand higher salaries. All that secrecy makes selling illicit products in a legal world completely unworkable.

When legalization happens, the current pot growers and sellers will be out of business overnight, forever.

/don't smoke, but am fully in favor of total legalization, not de-criminalization, legalization
 
2012-08-27 10:14:56 PM  

RandomRandom: IronJelly: My IQ might maybe be lower while I am under the influence, but it certainly doesn't stay that way.

And you'd know this how?

An 8 point drop in IQ is not something an individual would often notice, but it's definitely something that would show up in large-scale tests. Heavy adolescent weed consumption probably didn't move you from average to retard. More likely, it just moved you from average to slightly less-average.

I get it, you like weed and are loathe to admit it has detrimental, permanent effects on your mental ability. Sucks, but sometimes the truth hurts. Weed isn't as harmful as alcohol, but it's not nearly as harmless as a stone sober existence.


I disagree, and this may come as a major shock to you. But I dont smoke pot, I dont even drink. I have at least at least a few times in my past, most people do. Frankly the stone cold sober portions of our society scare the ever loving farking shiat out of me. People who frankly have never done ANYTHING, not a drink not a smoke not a single puff, hell some havent ever or promise to never have a blow-job, ever. These people are farking frightening and are not to be trusted. Are you like that? Have you ever, promise to never do....anything impure? People like that, theres something seriously unnatural about them.
vananne.com
Forget bath salt abusers, farking purist will eat your liver and say grace before they do. Not right in the head.
 
2012-08-27 10:25:00 PM  

orclover: People who frankly have never done ANYTHING, not a drink not a smoke not a single puff, Are you like that? Have you ever, promise to never do....anything impure? People like that, theres something seriously unnatural about them.


You are absolutely not describing me. I used to smoke, used to drink frequently.

I just don't feel I need it any longer, especially alcohol. I greatly prefer not feeling like a turd in the morning to any benefit alcohol provides the night before, though I still have a beer with friends from time to time.

Bottom line, I'm over it and don't miss it, not even a little.

/As I said above, I'm fully in favor of total legalization, though I'm completely against decriminalization. Decriminalization supports drug kingpins, legalization puts the kingpins out of business.
 
2012-08-27 10:28:16 PM  
StuffAnAll sounds like a new fark drug.
 
2012-08-27 10:30:02 PM  

D_Evans45: lewismarktwo: Why do people believe this tripe? Weed is just as labor intensive as tobacco and booze. Actually, making moonshine is way easier and faster.


Ive personally made wine and grown plenty of weed, and never found either very labor intensive at all. Cannabis growth is more about paying attention than doing any actual labor, unless you're inexperienced, or running some kind of indoor state of the art hydro system and light rigs. Otherwise you put a plant in the ground and provide it with water and nutrients at the appropriate times, clone at the appropriate time, and pay your neighbors minimum wage to do all that trimming at the end.

I looked into it and beer brewing seems 10x as confusing, or at least has more potential for failure. You can do so many things wrong when trying to brew beer. Cannabis is a hardy ass weed that grows itself as long as you dont fakr it all up.


I said 'just as' labor intensive. Beer is a pain in the dick to get right, but moonshine is as easy as boiling water.

As for paying your neighbors to trim it... why would you need to do that if it's so easy and fast?

/wished I liked moonshine..
 
2012-08-27 10:32:15 PM  

radarlove: IronJelly: Seriously?

I use pot for this exact effect, and I have been since I discovered it at 14 years old. Smoking is the ONLY way I have found to get my brain to shut up. It cures my migraines faster than Excedrin, and it relaxes my mind enough that I can actually fall asleep or watch non intellectual TV (for example, I can't stand Family Guy unless I'm baked). My IQ might maybe be lower while I am under the influence, but it certainly doesn't stay that way.

I can't possibly be the only one to use it for this purpose. I thought for like 6 years after I started that this was what it's for.

You're not.

I get terrible insomnia/headaches and frequently have trouble in verbal conversations because I have a very, VERY active brain. Thoughts are complex and race a mile a minute and are usually very loud, making it nearly impossible to do things that normal people take for granted, like relaxing or meditating or committing to moments and experiences. It's like having a thousand voices shouting about a thousand different things in unison, and trying to pick one out of the din.

About the only thing that slows my thought processes down to a normal, human rate is cannabis (especially strong indicas). Without it, I can't pick a single thought or idea out of the rushing torrent. But with it, I can pick an idea or topic and stick with it. With it, I can calm my mind enough that I can actually enjoy life around me instead of constantly analyzing it. With it, I can have blissful, undisturbed sleep.

I really need to get my NM MMJ card soon. I'm getting exhausted again and the headaches are getting worse.


Same here, although getting blitzed does help.

Of course, then there's the hangover...

/would like MMJ card as well
 
2012-08-27 10:32:26 PM  

RandomRandom: nmemkha: The point is, my smelly hippie friend, that legalization will bring in Big Business(tm) and that will lead to lobbying that will lead to the opening of legal channels and harsh crackdowns on illegal ones. Sure Big Tobacco will try and sell their processed poison, but I suspect mom-pot shops will open everywhere as entrepreneurs cater to a boutique market.

You're wrong, but for the wrong reasons. They wouldn't need to crack down on small producers, they would just price them out of the market.

If weed were produced by Big Tobacco, their pricing would absolutely destroy the existing producers. Consider that tobacco cigarettes (pre-tax) cost only few cents to produce. A few years ago, it was under 3 cents per smoke.

Weed cigarettes would actually be cheaper to produce than finished cigarette tobacco. Sure, high-quality weed is cloned, but cigarette tobacco is packed with ingredients that are not tobacco, chocolate is a big one. These extra ingredients and processing required for most cigarette tobacco would not be necessary for weed cigarettes. This suggests that the production costs of industrially produced joints would be as low or lower than that of tobacco smokes.

At most, an industrially produced joint would probably cost a nickel to make. Add 2000% tax and it brings the price all the way up to $1. One dollar per joint for high quality, reliable, fresh, consistent, weed. Local weed vendors can compete against that? I don't think so.

Big Tobacco would DESTROY the illicit marketplace, overnight. The illicit market's problem is that secrecy costs, secrecy costs a lot. Illicit production of anything has massive overhead costs. Illicit farms, illicit farmers, illicit funding, illicit fertilizer, illicit workers, illicit payroll, illicit transportation, illicit sales force. People doing illicit work demand higher salaries. All that secrecy makes selling illicit products in a legal world completely unworkable.

When legalization happens, the ...


Ummm...couple of nice points...BUT...can you get arrested for driving under the influence of cigarettes? I imagine the taxes alone on pot cigarettes sets up a price that could be beaten illicitly. There would have to be whole infrastructure, or greatly enhanced the current infrastructure, just to enforce this aspect. Several states have agencies to enforce liquor and cigarettes, and adding pot just adds that much more. Driving Under the Influence takes a serious jump. Not only will drunk drivers be on the road, but stoned drivers as well, or even both.
 
2012-08-27 10:38:47 PM  

Umfufu: RandomRandom: nmemkha: ...

When legalization happens, the ...

Ummm...couple of nice points...BUT...can you get arrested for driving under the influence of cigarettes? I imagine the taxes alone on pot cigarettes sets up a price that could be beaten illicitly. There would have to be whole infrastructure, or greatly enhanced the current infrastructure, just to enforce this aspect. Several states have agencies to enforce liquor and cigarettes, and adding pot just adds that much more. Driving Under the Influence takes a serious jump. Not only will drunk drivers be on the road, but stoned drivers as well, or even both.


I hate to break it to you but...
 
2012-08-27 10:39:10 PM  

Umfufu: Look at it this way...how much do you think the government will sell pot for? (any medicinal guys want to enlighten us as to how much the prescription stuff runs?) Cheaper than a drug dealer can grow it in his basement? Cheaper than a kid can raise a pot plant in his room? How much actual processing is involved in taking pot from a plant to a sell-able product? Cigarettes in NYC are $10.00+ a pack...how many folks actually buy their cigarettes in NYC?



Weed prices in the shops are roughly the same prices on the street, though many places are more expensive. Apparently people are willing to pay more at a medical dispensary then on the corner for Paco Drugdealer's illicit wares. Id even say, fairly recently, dispensary pricing has forced street dealers to lower prices to compete. I can get an ounce of tasty weed on the street for $200, while I'll likely be paying $300+ at the shop.

However, weed shop culture has evolved so much that I go to the weed shop to socialize now, as much as fulfill my cannabis needs. I go on my lunch break with my buddies almost every day now, talk with the beautiful budtenders (weed shops make a point of hiring attractive young ladies), hit the blunt they're passing around in the shop, and choose an edible to blast off with later. Good music and atmosphere, attractive young people, it's a scene you'll find in a drug dealer's garage/basement. Ill pay a little more at my shop for this experience.
 
2012-08-27 10:40:54 PM  

lewismarktwo: As for paying your neighbors to trim it... why would you need to do that if it's so easy and fast?



You've never had a big outdoor harvest, have you? A few hours of that shiat is enough to give fit young men carpal tunnel symptoms.
 
2012-08-27 10:42:13 PM  
lh6.ggpht.com
 
2012-08-27 10:42:55 PM  

D_Evans45: lewismarktwo: As for paying your neighbors to trim it... why would you need to do that if it's so easy and fast?


You've never had a big outdoor harvest, have you? A few hours of that shiat is enough to give fit young men carpal tunnel symptoms.


Ok, now I'm confused. I haven't even smoked in a couple weeks. I thought my IQ was supposed to go back up! I have a feeling we're in agreement and just don't know it.
 
2012-08-27 10:46:48 PM  

Pocket Ninja: Studies like this just piss me off, mainly because I'm looking in the freezer for some ice pops and the box is in there with a tear in its side from that time ... /i>

Why is there not a "The Collected Wisdom of Pocket Ninja" book?

If there is ever an audio book, it would have to be read by Jeremy Irons.

 
2012-08-27 10:47:46 PM  

FloydA: What's ironic is that these data will probably be used to try to support a "tough on drugs" stance, when in fact, the most effective way to reduce teenagers' access to pot would be to legalize it and treat it like alcohol or tobacco- no ID, no sale. The street corner pot dealers don't ask for ID, but shop clerks do. Legalize it for sale to adults and the profit will drop out of the bottom, so the criminal gangs won't sell it anymore. Immediately, teenagers' access to pot would be dramatically diminished.


You and your common sense better be careful, that sorta thinking can get you in a lot of trouble.
 
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