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(Huffington Post)   "Apple lawyers plan to formally demand Samsung pull its most popular cellphones and computer tablets from the U.S. market"   (huffingtonpost.com) divider line 104
    More: Followup, Apple-Samsung, U.S., social costs, patent infringements, Christopher Marlett, group analyst  
•       •       •

2588 clicks; posted to Business » on 25 Aug 2012 at 9:50 AM (2 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



104 Comments   (+0 »)
   
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2012-08-25 02:27:05 AM  
And the stockpiling/Ebay speculation begins.
 
2012-08-25 04:08:16 AM  
Fark you, Apple. Android is here to stay.
 
2012-08-25 08:42:29 AM  
It's not like I'm ever going to buy a God damned thing from Apple, so what's the point?
 
2012-08-25 09:07:51 AM  
This is WWF versus WWF rehashed with different players
 
2012-08-25 09:25:38 AM  
I could really go for a "Steve jobs still dead; still an arsehole" follow-up link right about now.
 
2012-08-25 09:58:24 AM  
"It is unfortunate that patent law can be manipulated to grant one company a monopoly over rectangles with rounded corners."

*snert*
 
2012-08-25 10:00:16 AM  
I love Apple products, but I hate this shiat.
 
2012-08-25 10:05:18 AM  
I'd buy a Windows phone before I'd buy an iPhone, just because of this bullshiat.

/and I hate Windows Phone.
 
2012-08-25 10:05:56 AM  
Samsung will appeal, presumably having learned some lessons so they'll be able to present some of the evidence that was denied in this trail. That will be the interesting decision. This was really just the first round sparring (admittedly won convincingly by Apple).
 
2012-08-25 10:15:58 AM  

John Nash: Samsung will appeal, presumably having learned some lessons so they'll be able to present some of the evidence that was denied in this trail. That will be the interesting decision. This was really just the first round sparring (admittedly won convincingly by Apple).


By convincing 12 people who were too dumb to get out of jury duty.
 
2012-08-25 10:26:52 AM  

Some Bass Playing Guy: I love Apple products, but I hate this shiat.


I understand that, patent wars are out of control, but Samsung went out of their way to copy Apple's product in features but more importantly in appearance almost exactly. That was really sleazy and they deserved to be sued for it.
 
2012-08-25 10:28:31 AM  
Meanwhile I assume that in the background Google is busy organizing their Motorola Patent Library into a nice little file so they can go bend Apple over in court (or make it clear to Apple that they can). Meanwhile HTC will just see a bump in its Android sales.

This whole thing, and the whole industry really, is a joke. In the auto industry if you took all the companies and asked us for how we sized things (steering wheel size, trunk deck height, button size and location, etc) we'd all be within centimeters of each other if not showing the exactly same size. We also tend to use the same colors for the same things on interior lighting. We all did ergonomics studies for placement and since humans are humans we all got the same results. Yet we manage to differentiate our products (not always in a good way, but still) despite the fact we all have four wheels, doors, a combustion engine, etc.

Of course a phone is going to have rounded corners, you don't put sharp edges on a hand held device. Of course screen sizes are tend to going to be similar. Most users will also hold it at a specific distance from their face, so certain icon and text sizes are ideal assuming 20/20 vision. Everyone uses their fingers to work the phone, so certain icon and button sizes are also ideal.

Ergonomics should never be covered by patent. They're not determined by some super genius, they're determined by an economic study. Letting one company patent something like the ideal shape/size for a palm held device or a IU widget like best icon size is just bad for society. All that means is one company gets a monopoly on "Size that is actually pleasant to use". That's bullshiat. Some company didn't determine the best size to use, genetics did that and the company is merely responding to it.

At the end of the day Apple was taking commodity hardware (they used to buy their screens from Samsung and had Foxconn assembling the phones) and trying to abuse the patent system to protect it. Apple for example bought a hardware company that does processors and if they come up with some new processor that uses 30% less battery, by all means let them patent it and sue other people. UI and ergonomics patents serve only to hurt the consumer. All Apple did was spend 6 months figuring out the sizes ideal to humans and that's something every company should be doing. The first company to market with it should not get a monopoly over it.
 
2012-08-25 10:31:23 AM  

Yakk: Some Bass Playing Guy: I love Apple products, but I hate this shiat.

I understand that, patent wars are out of control, but Samsung went out of their way to copy Apple's product in features but more importantly in appearance almost exactly. That was really sleazy and they deserved to be sued for it.


I agree that they've done some of that, especially with the hardware design of a couple GS1 variants and some TouchWiz UI decisions. But there are other OEMs that have been more blatent about it. Apple doesn't really care. They think all touch devices infringe, and they're going after their biggest competitor.
 
2012-08-25 10:35:13 AM  

Yakk: Some Bass Playing Guy: I love Apple products, but I hate this shiat.

I understand that, patent wars are out of control, but Samsung went out of their way to copy Apple's product in features but more importantly in appearance almost exactly. That was really sleazy and they deserved to be sued for it.


So what? Both Toyota and GM use the tear drop shape for their hybrids since it is the best at reducing drag. Rather than sue each other over it (well Toyota suing us since they did it first) we're busy competing over MPG, MSRP, and warranty to make our hybrid better than their hybrid. That's good for the consumer.

If Apple wants to put the Galaxy SIII in the ground they should do it by offering a better experience with the phone. Better App Store, better cloud syncing, better media experience, better hardware (speed, battery life, etc). Number of buttons, icon size, etc, should not be protected.
 
2012-08-25 10:36:14 AM  

there their theyre: By convincing 12 people who were too dumb to get out of jury duty.


Sure. Other than the ones that have worked in the tech industry or are engineers in some fashion.

But, sure, maybe it was just a bunch of nitwit apple fanboys that got stuck on jury duty.
 
2012-08-25 10:36:59 AM  
yeah.... the tablets were found to be non-infringing, and the phones that do infringe are all old and outdated anyway. seriously, nobody is buying a droid charge or a first-gen galaxy s anymore. the s III wasn't part of this trial.
 
2012-08-25 10:40:37 AM  

there their theyre: John Nash: Samsung will appeal, presumably having learned some lessons so they'll be able to present some of the evidence that was denied in this trail. That will be the interesting decision. This was really just the first round sparring (admittedly won convincingly by Apple).

By convincing 12 people who were too dumb to get out of jury duty.


Or 12 people who realize jury duty is one of the few times a normal citizen can help set precedent and influence the legal system.
 
2012-08-25 10:40:40 AM  
i46.tinypic.com
 
2012-08-25 10:45:29 AM  

ha-ha-guy: Yakk:

So what?

Rather than sue each other over it... (well Toyota suing us since they did it first).



O.o
 
2012-08-25 10:49:15 AM  

Chafed Willi: I could really go for a "Steve jobs still dead; still an arsehole" follow-up link right about now.


I'm no Steve Jobs biographer, but for some reason I don't see him approving of all these lawsuits. I guess they started before he died, but for some reason I can't see him as the direct driving force. He was a ruthless competitor, but I feel like he'd want to win in a more substantial way, not on a technicality.
 
2012-08-25 10:49:49 AM  

ocirats: "It is unfortunate that patent law can be manipulated to grant one company a monopoly over rectangles with rounded corners."


What ... wut? The jury stated that Samsung didn't infringe on this patent.

/all rational reporting on this has been thrown out the window
 
2012-08-25 10:51:19 AM  
I'll get rid of my Samsung Galaxy when you pry it from my cold, dead hands. I would continue to buy them, too. No way in hell will I buy an iPhone. Fark you Apple.
 
2012-08-25 10:54:21 AM  

ha-ha-guy: So what? Both Toyota and GM use the tear drop shape for their hybrids since it is the best at reducing drag. Rather than sue each other over it (well Toyota suing us since they did it first) we're busy competing over MPG, MSRP, and warranty to make our hybrid better than their hybrid. That's good for the consumer.


Small problem. Car companies sue each other all the time. And the early days of the industry - lawsuits were filed every other day over the littleness things. What we are seeing here is not new. You can argue if its good for the industry or not (I would argue that it isn't). But don't compare it to the car industry or any other industry that design is a major part of it.

/I used to work for the medical device industry - suing each other every other day was just the cost of doing business.
 
2012-08-25 10:54:48 AM  

Yakk: ha-ha-guy: Yakk:

So what?

Rather than sue each other over it... (well Toyota suing us since they did it first).


Ahh, read that wrong. Still unless the cars were almost identical in design (shape), size and color I don't think the analogy holds up.

cdn.arstechnica.net

cdn.arstechnica.net
 
2012-08-25 10:57:57 AM  
Yankees Team Gynecologist
I'm no Steve Jobs biographer, but for some reason I don't see him approving of all these lawsuits. I guess they started before he died, but for some reason I can't see him as the direct driving force. He was a ruthless competitor, but I feel like he'd want to win in a more substantial way, not on a technicality.


You haven't heard the "thermonuclear war" quote?
 
2012-08-25 11:01:38 AM  
Hey, look, it's a thread full of this:

zipmeme.com

You're all whiners. GFY and die.
 
2012-08-25 11:04:20 AM  

Yankees Team Gynecologist: Chafed Willi: I could really go for a "Steve jobs still dead; still an arsehole" follow-up link right about now.

I'm no Steve Jobs biographer, but for some reason I don't see him approving of all these lawsuits. I guess they started before he died, but for some reason I can't see him as the direct driving force. He was a ruthless competitor, but I feel like he'd want to win in a more substantial way, not on a technicality.


Steve Jobs was well known to want to crush Android and other smartphones out of existence by any means necessary. Apple became a juggernaut because of Jobs, not in spite of him.

In an interview for the biography conducted in January 2010, Jobs told its author Walter Isaacson, "I will spend my last dying breath if I need to, and I will spend every penny of Apple's $40 billion in the bank, to right this wrong. I'm going to destroy Android, because it's a stolen product. I'm willing to go thermonuclear war on this."

I somehow don't think Android's largest platform was exempt from this.

http://www.neowin.net/news/steve-jobs-wanted-to-destroy-android
 
2012-08-25 11:04:34 AM  

Dear Jerk: You haven't heard the "thermonuclear war" quote?


Even if he specifically meant lawsuits, I don't think he'd agree that they were at that point yet. That's a desperation move, and Apple has no reason to be desperate anytime soon.

Again, I didn't know the guy so I'm just talking out of my ass, but this really seems like something beneath him.
 
2012-08-25 11:05:08 AM  

ocirats: "It is unfortunate that patent law can be manipulated to grant one company a monopoly over rectangles with rounded corners."

*snert*


Yep, Samsung is still playing to the audience, instead of convincing the jury. Great strategy, guys.
 
2012-08-25 11:05:13 AM  

Your Average Witty Fark User: Hey, look, it's a thread full of this:

[zipmeme.com image 550x365]

You're all whiners. GFY and die.


Oh look, you posted a self-portrait.
 
2012-08-25 11:08:37 AM  

Yakk: Ahh, read that wrong. Still unless the cars were almost identical in design (shape), size and color I don't think the analogy holds up.


Didn't every single smartphone maker from Motorola to HTC end up with that design too? Oh no, they followed an industry standard!
 
2012-08-25 11:09:01 AM  

drewsclues: Apple became a juggernaut because of Jobs, not in spite of him.


Yeah, I know--and they got there with their products, not in the courtroom. Even if their products are more style/marketing than substance, that's still the products. There were tons of iPod knockoffs, but Apple steamed onward because they still sold what everyone wanted the most, at the highest profit margins.
 
2012-08-25 11:09:06 AM  
Hasn't apple lost this suit every where else on the planet?
 
2012-08-25 11:09:43 AM  
Steve Jobs is dead. Steve Jobs is a dead assh*le!
 
2012-08-25 11:11:56 AM  

SuperT: Hasn't apple lost this suit every where else on the planet?


Except South Korea.
 
2012-08-25 11:16:26 AM  
Apple Farked themselves over big time during the first years of the iPhone's life.

1) AT&T exclusive. Some people would not, could not move to AT&T but wanted a cool smart phone. The exclusive forced the customers to move to other phones with similar features. Building the Android share of the market.

2) Treating every user the same. Locking in to one model/color at a time. People want different size screens, wanted a physical keyboard, wanted different colors, maybe a lower end model.

Apple built the demand and then were shocked when people bought a phone that wasn't an Apple. Consumers were never confused between a Samsung phone and an iPhone. Put your hands on it and you're immediately going to know the difference. At which point the consumer has to decide do they insist on the iPhone feature set, or do they "settle" for the Android features.

Screaming to the courts to make up for your own business decisions, just seems wrong.

/Happy Android owner
//G1 / Mytouch 3G Slide / G2
///Insists on a physical keyboard on the phone
 
2012-08-25 11:22:44 AM  
BizarreMan
Apple Farked themselves over big time during the first years of the iPhone's life.


I'd like to subscribe to your investment newsletter.
 
2012-08-25 11:26:46 AM  
First smartphone, 2007:
theprime.co
First Epilady, 1986:
nakedthanks.com

Rectangle with rounded corners. You know, I think Epilady has a case against Apple.
 
2012-08-25 11:27:41 AM  

Yakk: Yakk: ha-ha-guy: Yakk:

So what?

Rather than sue each other over it... (well Toyota suing us since they did it first).

Ahh, read that wrong. Still unless the cars were almost identical in design (shape), size and color I don't think the analogy holds up.

[cdn.arstechnica.net image 640x405]

[cdn.arstechnica.net image 640x407]


Other than going to an internal antenna there is not really as much of a difference as you seem to think.
 
2012-08-25 11:44:38 AM  

Yakk: Yakk: ha-ha-guy: Yakk:

So what?

Rather than sue each other over it... (well Toyota suing us since they did it first).

Ahh, read that wrong. Still unless the cars were almost identical in design (shape), size and color I don't think the analogy holds up.

[cdn.arstechnica.net image 640x405]

[cdn.arstechnica.net image 640x407]


There are other devices that were around but not in production before that since they didnt think people would get rid of their keyboards and pointers.

Good luck getting the devices pulled, then apple will be sued for the bullshiat they are trying to pull, besides almost all their devices bear no resemblance to the iphone now.

So fark you apple, I hated you forcing me to use your interface when I had an iphone along with warning me about putting my own farking music on devices, this just seals it, you can eat a bag of dicks, if I have to go back to an old flip phone I will instead of using your pos proprietary devices.
 
2012-08-25 11:53:13 AM  

SharkTrager: Other than going to an internal antenna there is not really as much of a difference as you seem to think.


People also forget the palm treo had tap to zoom as well, it was just with their pointer not your finger although I discovered you could do it with your fingers as everyone else did, thats most likely where apple got an idea like that, along with all their other ideas. They see the way people are using devices then incorporated it into their devices, then get a patent on it to make sure nobody will ever be able to stomp them on innovation again like MS did in the 80s.
 
2012-08-25 12:00:28 PM  

steamingpile: SharkTrager: Other than going to an internal antenna there is not really as much of a difference as you seem to think.

People also forget the palm treo had tap to zoom as well, it was just with their pointer not your finger although I discovered you could do it with your fingers as everyone else did, thats most likely where apple got an idea like that, along with all their other ideas. They see the way people are using devices then incorporated it into their devices, then get a patent on it to make sure nobody will ever be able to stomp them on innovation again like MS did in the 80s.


And that's what it comes down to. Apple has built an empire by standing on the shoulders of giants, but if anybody tries to stand on THEIR shoulders, they must be destroyed. It's disgusting, frankly.
 
2012-08-25 12:00:41 PM  

cameroncrazy1984: Your Average Witty Fark User: Hey, look, it's a thread full of this:

[zipmeme.com image 550x365]

You're all whiners. GFY and die.

Oh look, you posted a self-portrait.


Is that really the best you've got?

Then it applies to you too. Stuff it, crybaby.
 
2012-08-25 12:11:01 PM  
Maybe now Pizza Hut will be emboldened to sue Domino's over a product that looks suspiciously similar to their own. What copycats!
 
2012-08-25 12:15:32 PM  
So now the US and S Korea (the only two nations where this lawsuit has won) will become Apple's walled garden, and America will fall a little farther behind the rest of the developed world.
Apple - the Harley Davidson of gadget makers.
 
2012-08-25 12:20:40 PM  
Samsung got caught with their hand in the cookie jar. They deserved this beat-down.

I say that as someone who will never buy another iAnything again, and who hates Apple as a company. My first three iPhones (Original Recipe, 3G, and 3GStra Crispy) were enough to teach me exactly how shiatty Apple is.

Prior to owning their iDevices, I merely looked down on their computers as overpriced children's toys. Now I truly loathe them.

So it is with bile in my mouth that I applaud this decision. Right judgement.
 
2012-08-25 12:23:03 PM  

jso2897: So now the US and S Korea (the only two nations where this lawsuit has won) will become Apple's walled garden, and America will fall a little farther behind the rest of the developed world.
Apple - the Harley Davidson of gadget makers.


Patents must be enforced. Just like laws, without proper enforcement, bad patent decisions never come to light. With enough strong enforcement, we can see heavy hitters finally work to challenge our idiotic patent system out of their own self-interest.

I blame the USPTO, not Apple, the Judge or the Jury.
 
2012-08-25 12:24:02 PM  

EmmaLou: I'll get rid of my Samsung Galaxy when you pry it from my cold, dead hands. I would continue to buy them, too. No way in hell will I buy an iPhone. Fark you Apple.


Came here to say exactly this. And I'm posting from my Samsung galaxy!

/Apple needs to stop pretending that they invented the rounded-edged rectangle.
 
2012-08-25 12:25:11 PM  

Kuroshin: Samsung got caught with their hand in the cookie jar. They deserved this beat-down.

I say that as someone who will never buy another iAnything again, and who hates Apple as a company. My first three iPhones (Original Recipe, 3G, and 3GStra Crispy) were enough to teach me exactly how shiatty Apple is.

Prior to owning their iDevices, I merely looked down on their computers as overpriced children's toys. Now I truly loathe them.

So it is with bile in my mouth that I applaud this decision. Right judgement.


What "beat down"? The damages will be busted down to a small fraction of the current award. They won't be able to stop Samsung from marketing anything they are currently making. The few older models effected will still be available on Ebay. They have lost in almost every other country in the world.
They will probably fail to recover damages that cover their legal costs when all is said and done. With "victories" like this, one needs no defeats.
 
2012-08-25 12:26:17 PM  

Kuroshin: jso2897: So now the US and S Korea (the only two nations where this lawsuit has won) will become Apple's walled garden, and America will fall a little farther behind the rest of the developed world.
Apple - the Harley Davidson of gadget makers.

Patents must be enforced. Just like laws, without proper enforcement, bad patent decisions never come to light. With enough strong enforcement, we can see heavy hitters finally work to challenge our idiotic patent system out of their own self-interest.

I blame the USPTO, not Apple, the Judge or the Jury.


I generally tend to agree with blaming the enabler more than the addict - yes.
 
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