If that article is written by someone we can consider representative of the literacy of the Hardin Valley area, it may already be too late to get students interested in core subjects.

Is "editor" no longer a job title people have?

stonicus: Scorpio Rex: Unobtanium: When I was 14 or 15, we had to read The Catcher in the Rye, The Scarlet Letter, and a couple of Hemingway works. By that age I already knew (and had heard several times) George Carlin's take on "dirty" words, plus thanks to Monty Python's Flying Circus, I could curse in British.

But those are all quality works of literature and genius. Swear words in that context is acceptable. Robopocalypse? Yeah, not so much.

(And I am a HUGE fan of SF, don't read anything else.)

I had to read a lot of "quality" works in school that frankly I thought sucked big huge monkey balls. Even after I got older, the stories didn't take on any new meaning, just the same crappy boring stories I read as a kid. Some of the stuff I had to read was great... I loved Catcher in the Rye... I thought Great Gatsby was utter putrid garbage. I intensely dislike the notion that something that is by its very nature subjective is "ranked" objectively.

Their Eyes Were Watching God. The plot was ok, and it was a narrative that showed how life/race relations in Florida were at that time, but reading written ebonics was almost physically painful.

/and Alice in Wonderland would have made soooo much more sense if I'd had the slightest idea what acid was

Best part of the article for me:

The district also has a complaint process to address issues like this. It requires Lee filling out a form and then a formal review of the curriculum in question.

Lee said told district officials he is not interested in doing that because the process sounds like it could be lengthy.

Ugh, following established procedures is just so hard. Why can't I just whine to the newspaper and make the school change things without any real effort on my part?

/Also--cant: : the expression or repetition of conventional or trite opinions or sentiments; especially : the insincere use of pious words plus at least six other definitions. Your philology sucks.

Its not like the kids read the books anyways

I truly hope none of you Farkers have or will ever reproduce.

Chameleon: Best part of the article for me:

The district also has a complaint process to address issues like this. It requires Lee filling out a form and then a formal review of the curriculum in question.

Lee said told district officials he is not interested in doing that because the process sounds like it could be lengthy.

Ugh, following established procedures is just so hard. Why can't I just whine to the newspaper and make the school change things without any real effort on my part?

/Also--cant: : the expression or repetition of conventional or trite opinions or sentiments; especially : the insincere use of pious words plus at least six other definitions. Your philology sucks.

CrappityCrap: I truly hope none of you Farkers have or will ever reproduce.

Well, if I do, I'm teaching my kid to cuss like a sailor straight from the get-go. That alright with you?

jaylectricity: I plan on teaching my kid/s the swear word controversy. I'll tell them that I don't care if they say them around me, but if they say them around other people these other people might freak out for ABSOLUTELY no reason.

And either they'll grow up respectful of other people's insecurities, or they'll troll the hell out of the neighborhood parents. Who am I to decide what other people do with their lives?

Wow, you sound like a real peach.

Good thing these folks never read the Bible.

Mangoose: Also, the reason I know what pugnacious means has to do with breasts.
The first thing through the door of my seedy office were her pugnacious breasts. I could see right away that the dame was a knockout.

david_gaithersburg: Mangoose: I went to one of the most highly regarded private day schools and we were taught proper usage of expletives in english class.



We must have attended the same school. Was Mr. Grogan your English teacher by any chance?

fark = Fornication of Unlawful Carnal Knowledge, a.k.a., to sow the seed out of wedlock. So the use of fark in its slang context, would be "I'm heading out to fark the fields. The phrase "fark you" used properly could be considered a sexual proposition rather than an expletive.

fark is what would be written on the sign hanging from your neck while you were doing time in the pillory for committing the crime of fark.

Now please consider what you are saying and how silly you sound to everyone the next time you improperly use the word "fark".

Please consider that:
1. The etymology of words is really irrelevant when contemporary use has a different and accepted meaning.
2. Your understanding of the etymology of the word in question is incorrect.

Please consider how silly you sound when trying to be condescending with incorrect facts.

The more you know.

Scorpio Rex: RKade: Showering your kids in ignorance ...

I wish I could blame lack of coffee for reading that has "Showering with your kids is ignorant...." I was totally interested in finding out where you were going with that line of thought, you know, preparing to be outraged and all.

Sorry to disappoint you :)

MycroftHolmes:
Please consider that:
1. The etymology of words is really irrelevant when contemporary use has a different and accepted meaning.

For most people, in most parts of life, I agree. It only becomes an issue when dealing with historical documents, or if you're doing a spelling bee.

The point is to get kids interested in reading by letting them read things they'd actually enjoy.

In tenth grade, in addition to the state mandated reading, we had to read and do book reports on just about anything you wanted that was at the required reading level, however our teacher had a ton of pulp novels in the back to choose from. Patterson, Koontz, and the like. I read Along Came a Spider. There was plenty of cursing, as well as murder, and sexual deviance in these books. Let kids transition to become adults, goddamnitsomuch.

downpaymentblues: I thought the term "snowflakes" was reserved for those dirty liberal parents.

I guess it's just used as a pejorative whenever it suits the narrative?

It's applicable across-the-board whenever over-parenting presents itself. But you knew that already, didn't you?

Tickle Mittens: Clear the fainting couch! Young adults are learning to read the words they learned to speak from their peers on the first day of kindergarden.

Came here to say this. I learned every possible profanity from the older kids ON THE BUS RIDE TO KINDERGARTEN.

"Upcoming"? Reading naughty words will prevent your child from ever becoming a member of the community?

I think "upstanding" is the word this person was grasping for.

Anyone else notice that when the camera cuts to the book at the 11 second mark you actually see the offending word?

FirstNationalBastard: Airportmatt: david_gaithersburg: Mangoose: I went to one of the most highly regarded private day schools and we were taught proper usage of expletives in english class.



We must have attended the same school. Was Mr. Grogan your English teacher by any chance?

fark = Fornication of Unlawful Carnal Knowledge, a.k.a., to sow the seed out of wedlock. So the use of fark in its slang context, would be "I'm heading out to fark the fields. The phrase "fark you" used properly could be considered a sexual proposition rather than an expletive.

fark is what would be written on the sign hanging from your neck while you were doing time in the pillory for committing the crime of fark.

Now please consider what you are saying and how silly you sound to everyone the next time you improperly use the word "fark".

Haven't read the whole thread yet, so I don't know if anybody responded yet...

But that's not true

He's been told, but insists that internet citations aren't enough, and that you must go back in time and find the first person to use the word fark and make them tell you how it originated before he will believe it wasn't really an acronym.

Between the etymology discussion and the definition of the word "cant", he's having a rough thread (haven't we all),

downpaymentblues: I didn't see any mention of religion in the story, so I guess it is an all-encompassing pejorative.

I think that is a reference to one of the very Weenerss:

"It opens the door to the debasement of the human spirit, and it in no way glorifies God."

david_gaithersburg: Hmm. Still not sure about this one. the definition of fark has been around for hundreds of years, then a few years ago an internet dictionary declares it to be different. Did you know that according to the Bill Gates Dictionary "cant" is a word, along with hundreds of other words he invented. I would be curious to see and official source such as Webster's on the topic.

Lemme get this straight. Are you seriously claiming that Bill Gates invented the word 'cant', and that it really isn't a word?

The mind boggles. You might benefit from some sort of remedial education.

Doesn't Fark auto-change offensive words? Kind of hipocritical to be mocking people for being offended by words on a website that goes out of its' way to avoid offensive words

This is why we can't have nice things.

CheekyMonkey: downpaymentblues: I thought the term "snowflakes" was reserved for those dirty liberal parents.

I guess it's just used as a pejorative whenever it suits the narrative?

It's applicable across-the-board whenever over-parenting presents itself. But you knew that already, didn't you?

Are you a member of the thought police as well? Deciding there is already enough violence and foul language in the world, and you don't feel it is appropriate for YOUR child to be assigned more of the same makes you over-parenting?

I guess in your world, the school is the final arbiter of how you raise your child? You have no say in the matter?

"If a parent doesn't do things the way I SAY they should be done, I will ridicule them for how they raise their child, no matter how minor the offense".

Quite the philosophy you have there.

Worldwalker: downpaymentblues: I didn't see any mention of religion in the story, so I guess it is an all-encompassing pejorative.

I think that is a reference to one of the very Weenerss:

"It opens the door to the debasement of the human spirit, and it in no way glorifies God."

I did miss that part. But isn't it their choice as parents to limit their children's exposure to violence and foul language when they can?

It seems as if "let the school do whatever they want to your kids" is the theme of this thread. I've seen the same people in this thread argue "how dare the school try to force kids too..." when the subject ISN'T violence and swearing.

david_gaithersburg: fark = Fornication of Unlawful Carnal Knowledge, a.k.a., to sow the seed out of wedlock. So the use of fark in its slang context, would be "I'm heading out to fark the fields. The phrase "fark you" used properly could be considered a sexual proposition rather than an expletive.

fark is what would be written on the sign hanging from your neck while you were doing time in the pillory for committing the crime of fark.

Now please consider what you are saying and how silly you sound to everyone the next time you improperly use the word "fark".

MYTH.

As are all the "Fornication Under Consent of the King" versions, etc.

There are a fair number of related words in Germanic and Scandinavian languages, none of which are acronyms for anything. Norwegian "fokka", Dutch "fokken", and German "ficken" are possible sources. The big problem is the taboo nature of the printed word has made tracing its origin harder than it needs to be. But it's definitely not an acronym.

david_gaithersburg: Hmm. Still not sure about this one. the definition of fark has been around for hundreds of years, then a few years ago an internet dictionary declares it to be different. Did you know that according to the Bill Gates Dictionary "cant" is a word, along with hundreds of other words he invented. I would be curious to see and official source such as Webster's on the topic.

Um, "cant" is a word.

Also, the indefinite article you're looking for there is "an" not "and."

Word geek humor: Heralds don't pun; they cant.

Crewmannumber6: xrayspx: If that article is written by someone we can consider representative of the literacy of the Hardin Valley area, it may already be too late to get students interested in core subjects.

Is "editor" no longer a job title people have?

A lot of stories like this are outsourced to copywriters in Malaysia and places like that. Just heard a story about it on This American Life on Saturday.

Wow really. That really does explain a lot.

CheekyMonkey: You might benefit from some sort of remedial education.

I suppose the thought that he already failed to benefit from such might not have occurred to you?


downpaymentblues: Are you a member of the thought police as well? Deciding there is already enough violence and foul language in the world, and you don't feel it is appropriate for YOUR child to be assigned more of the same makes you over-parenting?

CSB: I never swore till I was about twelve. Parents taught me not to, and, odd little rascal that I was, I never did.

What tipped me over that edge? Nervous breakdown. Started swearing- not quite like a soldier, but a fair amount. This probably accounted for my most puerile uses of colorful metaphor in my entire life (I had some doozies).

Some things I observed out of this experience:

1) It really was good at relieving stress. There's studies to go along with this, by the by- here comes the science...

2) Once I'd got 12 years of "abstinence" from cussing out of the way, I tapered off, learned how and where to use profanity, and in what circumstances it was appropriate. In short, I grew up. Good thing I got it out of the way at 12 instead of, say 10 or 20 years later.

3) You're going to encounter it in life sooner or later. Whether you choose to join 'em or not, you certainly won't beat them. It's handy to have some clue how to handle profanity when you run into it. Not exposing your kids to it is doing them a disservice, honestly.

downpaymentblues: CheekyMonkey: downpaymentblues: I thought the term "snowflakes" was reserved for those dirty liberal parents.

I guess it's just used as a pejorative whenever it suits the narrative?

It's applicable across-the-board whenever over-parenting presents itself. But you knew that already, didn't you?

Are you a member of the thought police as well? Deciding there is already enough violence and foul language in the world, and you don't feel it is appropriate for YOUR child to be assigned more of the same makes you over-parenting?

I guess in your world, the school is the final arbiter of how you raise your child? You have no say in the matter?

"If a parent doesn't do things the way I SAY they should be done, I will ridicule them for how they raise their child, no matter how minor the offense".

Quite the philosophy you have there.

The school is the final arbiter of so many other things. School is a social construct, and has a duty to teach social norms. That's the big question though, what is norm. A parent saying "no f word in my son's literature" seems valid to some, but what about going to the math teacher and saying "You can teach Jonny about fractions, but NOT about irrational numbers, we're Pythagorists." or "You can teach Mark trig and analysis, but none of the theories by Rudolf Lipschitz" or "You can teach Beth about astronomy, but not about the sun-centric model of the solar system, we're raising her to be Earth-centric." I doubt the last two would garner anything other than a STFU from everyone, as both views are outside of the norm.

Me personally, I'm in the "get over cuss words, they're just words" camp... If you really think it makes a bit of difference if someone yells SHOOT over shiat if they stub their toe, you're a moron.

God must have loved dumbasses, because he made so many of them.

Or,

God must have hated dumbasses because he made them so dumb.

Wickedness knows no decorum nor boundary

"Educators" today are what we used to call pimps and low lifes

stonicus: Me personally, I'm in the "get over cuss words, they're just words" camp... If you really think it makes a bit of difference if someone yells SHOOT over shiat if they stub their toe, you're a moron.

So, you are saying that words have no inherent meaning or value, and cannot be used in provoke or inflame emotion? So, no matter what anyone ever said to you, there is never any justification for getting angry at what they say? I don't know you personally, but I am more than willing to call bullshiat on that and bet everything I own that there have been times in your past where someone said something to you, and you reacted with anger.

downpaymentblues: CheekyMonkey: downpaymentblues: I thought the term "snowflakes" was reserved for those dirty liberal parents.

I guess it's just used as a pejorative whenever it suits the narrative?

It's applicable across-the-board whenever over-parenting presents itself. But you knew that already, didn't you?

Are you a member of the thought police as well? Deciding there is already enough violence and foul language in the world, and you don't feel it is appropriate for YOUR child to be assigned more of the same makes you over-parenting?

I guess in your world, the school is the final arbiter of how you raise your child? You have no say in the matter?

"If a parent doesn't do things the way I SAY they should be done, I will ridicule them for how they raise their child, no matter how minor the offense".

Quite the philosophy you have there.

Hmm. TFA states that A) the parents were provided with alternate summer reading assignments to replace the book in question, and B) that the parents were directed to the formal process for curriculum review, but that "Lee said he told district officials he is not interested in doing that because the process sounds like it could be lengthy."

This strikes me as A) a reasonable response from the school, and B) the parents in question are lazy attention whores. If they actually cared about what their snowflake was being taught, they'd accept the alternate reading assignment, and involve themselves in the curriculum review process, not just biatch about how no one should have to read the book.

And, yes, I consider an attempt to protect your child from the real world to such an extent as to try to prohibit them from reading a few profanities, to be over-parenting. If you want your kid to grow up in a bubble, then home-school him. Like it or not, profanity is part of reality. I learned all the profanity I'll ever need on the bus to school when I was in kindergarten. I choose to teach my kids that those words are not part of polite discourse, and their use will not be tolerated at home, rather than trying to expunge all references of profanity from their reality.

Clemkadidlefark: "Educators" today are what we used to call pimps and low lifes

What's this "we" shiat?

SkunkWerks: CheekyMonkey: You might benefit from some sort of remedial education.I suppose the thought that he already failed to benefit from such might not have occurred to you?

Based on other posts of his which have read, this thought HAD occurred to me, thus the use of 'might'.

MycroftHolmes: but I am more than willing to call bullshiat on that and bet everything I own that there have been times in your past where someone said something to you, and you reacted with anger.

I'm more than willing to suggest that if you're reacting to what another person purely based on what words they're using, you're probably getting out of that precisely what you deserve.

oldsbone: Worldwalker: There are a fair number of related words in Germanic and Scandinavian languages, none of which are acronyms for anything. Norwegian "fokka", Dutch "fokken", and German "ficken" are possible sources. The big problem is the taboo nature of the printed word has made tracing its origin harder than it needs to be. But it's definitely not an acronym.

It seems that English gets a good amount of its big words from Latin and Greek (and their derivatives), so we get works like "Psychology" that way. It tends to get little everyday words from German, so we get words like "And (und), you (du), the (die)" and, of course, "F**k."

English is basically a creole.

Anglo-Saxon was a Germanic language, so a lot of our common, everyday words have Germanic roots. Some of them are very close to modern-day German, actually, if you account for the s/t differences (wasser/water for example). Most words for anything that would matter to a medieval peasant are fundamentally Anglo-Saxon in origin.

Then came the Norman Conquest, and the arrival of sort-of-French-speaking rulers. French of course is a Romance language, with Latin roots. So a lot of words, especially those used by the aristocracy, were added to English. If you've never read the part in Ivanhoe where Wamba talks about the pigs being turned into Normans, it's a hoot -- and true. Saxon swine become Norman pork when they're served to the nobility; cattle become beef, and so on.

H. Beam Piper said something to the effect that English is the product of Norman men-at-arms trying to get dates with Saxon barmaids, and no more legitimate than any of the other results. That's pretty much true. English as we know it arose from the pidgin that Normans and Saxons used to communicate, especially in the case of commerce. Merchants always come up with some sort of "trade tongue" that works, and English was the result.

Then add Latin as the language of science, and Greek to a lesser extent, and you can see where so many scientific words come from.

Also, not being a pure language, English has never had the equivalent of the French Academy deciding what is legitimately a part of the language and what isn't. It's a creole, so it has elements of its parent languages, and it has added anything else it could collect along the way. As they say, English doesn't just borrow words from other languages, it coshes them in back alleys and goes through their pockets for loose vocabulary.

MycroftHolmes: stonicus: Me personally, I'm in the "get over cuss words, they're just words" camp... If you really think it makes a bit of difference if someone yells SHOOT over shiat if they stub their toe, you're a moron.

So, you are saying that words have no inherent meaning or value, and cannot be used in provoke or inflame emotion? So, no matter what anyone ever said to you, there is never any justification for getting angry at what they say? I don't know you personally, but I am more than willing to call bullshiat on that and bet everything I own that there have been times in your past where someone said something to you, and you reacted with anger.

A single word, on its own, no. Taken in context, yes. That's why to me, shoot=shiat in the stubbing-your-toe scenario. fark you=Screw you in a heated argument. It's the intent that makes it bad.

"I swear to god and all his cronies, darling I'll farking kill you."
"I swear to god and all his cronies, darling I'll friggen kill you."
Do you think these are different in any way? One is ok for a kid to read, the other isn't?

/parents lack of complaining about the whole murder thing, I find that interesting...