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(Uproxx)   Plot hole gripers get to griping: Dark Knight Rises originally had way more Bane backstory   (uproxx.com) divider line 164
    More: Followup, TDKR, bane, goatse  
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5465 clicks; posted to Geek » on 09 Aug 2012 at 4:08 PM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2012-08-09 01:11:43 PM
I can't imagine why it was cut. They could have used some more flashbacks to pad the run time.
 
2012-08-09 01:19:41 PM
Bane should be Brazilian and a luchaidor with venom that makes him strong. This movie's Bane was shiat.
 
2012-08-09 01:20:18 PM
The more I think about the movie, the more I love it. The problems with it have nothing to do with plot holes, though.
 
2012-08-09 01:24:23 PM

doglover: Bane should be Brazilian and a luchaidor with venom that makes him strong. This movie's Bane was shiat.


They colossally farked up Two-Face and most people didn't mind. Actually, none of the Rogue's Gallery in any of the Nolan films were true to their comic book counterparts (except maybe Catwoman). The difference being that The Joker and Ra's al Ghul were still cool without being faithful to the source material.
 
2012-08-09 01:42:55 PM
The extended cut of this movie is going to be farking 3 days long
 
2012-08-09 01:47:47 PM

SnakeLee: The extended cut of this movie is going to be farking 3 days long


Chris Nolan doesnt do that kind of stuff, I dont think.
 
2012-08-09 01:58:55 PM
And since Nolan doesn't include deleted scenes in his Blu-Ray/DVDs, we'll never see that stuff.

At least, until the 20th anniversary holcube version comes out.

doglover: Bane should be Brazilian and a luchaidor with venom that makes him strong. This movie's Bane was shiat.


Presumably they changed that because they didn't want the film to look like a WCW match from 1998.
 
2012-08-09 02:30:25 PM
I read people like that dumb fark Harry Knowles complaining that Nolan completely screwed up what Batman or Bruce Wayne would have done. Yeah, well, tough shiat. These weren't laughable glitzy crap like the Schumacher films, and bizarre and fun yet completely stupid ones like Burton's. Nolan made his movies have much more of a tether to reality than most superhero stories.

I loved all three of the Nolan Batman films. The only problem I had with this one was Bane sounding like John Rhys-Davies doing a book-on-tape.
 
2012-08-09 02:32:22 PM
Gripers, no griping.

Gripers, no griping!

/oh man
 
2012-08-09 02:37:13 PM
I could gripe but I'd rather snark and say that for this movie, all of Batman's problems could have been solved by Iron Man in 5 minutes. (That's including travel time.)
 
2012-08-09 02:49:19 PM
Hmmm, I'm not sure how you'd give more of his back story without spoiling the plot twist.
 
2012-08-09 03:28:21 PM

Makh: I could gripe but I'd rather snark and say that for this movie, all of Batman's problems could have been solved by Iron Man in 5 minutes. (That's including travel time.)


Yeah, but Bruce Wayne doesn't have any superpowers the way Iron Man does.
 
2012-08-09 03:29:28 PM

Karac: Makh: I could gripe but I'd rather snark and say that for this movie, all of Batman's problems could have been solved by Iron Man in 5 minutes. (That's including travel time.)

Yeah, but Bruce Wayne doesn't have any superpowers the way Iron Man does.


i dunno, he's got that magic rope that fixes backs. that's something.
 
2012-08-09 03:32:44 PM

Mugato: doglover: Bane should be Brazilian and a luchaidor with venom that makes him strong. This movie's Bane was shiat.

They colossally farked up Two-Face and most people didn't mind. Actually, none of the Rogue's Gallery in any of the Nolan films were true to their comic book counterparts (except maybe Catwoman). The difference being that The Joker and Ra's al Ghul were still cool without being faithful to the source material.


Nolan got the spirit of the characters right. His Scarecrow brought out the scientific side of the character. The Joker was literally a force of nature...both funny and scary at the same time. Two Face was really tragic figure pushed beyond the edge.

I thought Bane, Talia and Ras were done BETTER in the Nolan movies than the comics. Ras being a "James Bond" type villain never suited me for a hero that was more about crime. The twist of Ras being a head of an organization that fought crime in the worse way possible. I always thought Talia was lame. A writers conceit that their female character is the "love" of a continuing characters life. The fact that she was a vengeful daughter made her a much better character.

Bane literally was the man who took up Ras offer that Bruce rejected. It's an aspect of the character that the comic had overlooked for a while. His creator wanted Bane to be a villain who learned from his mistakes.

Catwoman was actually pitch perfect

But in the end-these characters were adapted to the story Nolan was telling..and it was done beautifully. A hell of a lot better than the more "comic-book" accurate Burton movies. Joker was just Jack being Jack. The penguin was an atrocity. Catwoman totally stupid.
 
2012-08-09 03:34:32 PM

thomps: Karac: Makh: I could gripe but I'd rather snark and say that for this movie, all of Batman's problems could have been solved by Iron Man in 5 minutes. (That's including travel time.)

Yeah, but Bruce Wayne doesn't have any superpowers the way Iron Man does.

i dunno, he's got that magic rope that fixes backs. that's something.


OK, so Batman has a magical chiropractor. Iron Man has the superpower of a comic book sized bank account. He could have just paid the prisoners to lift him out of that hole like a cheerleader at the top of a pyramid.
 
2012-08-09 03:35:57 PM

Rev. Skarekroe: And since Nolan doesn't include deleted scenes in his Blu-Ray/DVDs, we'll never see that stuff.

At least, until the 20th anniversary holcube version comes out.

doglover: Bane should be Brazilian and a luchaidor with venom that makes him strong. This movie's Bane was shiat.

Presumably they changed that because they didn't want the film to look like a WCW match from 1998.


Actually, I think it's because Nolan really didn't have a lot of deleted scenes. He shoots a tight script...I think this time, he might have realized that he went a bit too far and had to edit.
 
2012-08-09 03:37:37 PM

DamnYankees: The more I think about the movie, the more I love it. The problems with it have nothing to do with plot holes, though.


I went and did a second viewing a few days ago on IMAX and it was a lot better the second time. Wasn't perfect but the good far outweighed the bad.

I'm kinda glad they limited Bane's backstory. One thing I loved about TDK was no Joker origin. He just shows up and causes chaos. But I thought Bane was a great villian so ehh. I'll watch this footage on the deleted scenes.
 
2012-08-09 03:39:24 PM

Karac: thomps: Karac: Makh: I could gripe but I'd rather snark and say that for this movie, all of Batman's problems could have been solved by Iron Man in 5 minutes. (That's including travel time.)

Yeah, but Bruce Wayne doesn't have any superpowers the way Iron Man does.

i dunno, he's got that magic rope that fixes backs. that's something.

OK, so Batman has a magical chiropractor. Iron Man has the superpower of a comic book sized bank account. He could have just paid the prisoners to lift him out of that hole like a cheerleader at the top of a pyramid.


so that stock exchange break-in that bankrupted bruce wayne thing was the most annoying part of that movie to me. why would they not back out every transaction that happened while they were hacked into the exchange network? didn't they do that a few years ago after that "fat finger" flash crash?
 
2012-08-09 03:44:57 PM

Karac: Yeah, but Bruce Wayne doesn't have any superpowers the way Iron Man does.


Just like Tony Stark doesn't have any superpowers (or magical flying devices) the way Batman does. :P
 
2012-08-09 03:45:18 PM

Mugato: Actually, none of the Rogue's Gallery in any of the Nolan films were true to their comic book counterparts (except maybe Catwoman).


Scarecrow was close enough.
 
2012-08-09 03:48:11 PM
Would it have explained why he sounded like Deckard Cain? Because that would have been helpful to know.
 
2012-08-09 03:54:27 PM
Lucius Fox: "Autopilot. I said, BRUCE, THE AUTOPILOT. Let's talk more about the autopilot and how that doesn't work even though it's completely irrelevant at the moment. BRUCE! Are you listening? I'm FORESHADOWING here! Not even the most oblivious audience member could possibly miss this, for when we do the fake death later..." [turns to camera] "Or could they?"
 
2012-08-09 04:17:44 PM

tallguywithglasseson: Lucius Fox: "Autopilot. I said, BRUCE, THE AUTOPILOT. Let's talk more about the autopilot and how that doesn't work even though it's completely irrelevant at the moment. BRUCE! Are you listening? I'm FORESHADOWING here! Not even the most oblivious audience member could possibly miss this, for when we do the fake death later..." [turns to camera] "Or could they?"


Ha!
 
2012-08-09 04:18:20 PM
I was surprised it had more plot holes and suspension of disbelief moments than Prometheus.
 
2012-08-09 04:19:33 PM

DamnYankees: SnakeLee: The extended cut of this movie is going to be farking 3 days long

Chris Nolan doesnt do that kind of stuff, I dont think.


Yeah, he's not Peter Jackson.
 
2012-08-09 04:20:39 PM

Kome: Would it have explained why he sounded like Deckard Cain Goldmember? Because that would have been helpful to know.


FTFY

Darth_Lukecash: Catwoman was actually pitch perfect.


Like The Brown Note.

Catwoman added nothing to this story other than being Anne Hathaway in a tight bodysuit.

<SPOILER>
And to be Batman's redemption, but she was so totally half-assing the "criminal" part of being Catwoman (you know, what with the laserlike focus on wiping out her history) that she seems more like one of the cops trapped under the city than an integral part of the story. Her purpose was to validate Bruce's desire to not be Batman any more.
</SPOILER>
 
2012-08-09 04:23:00 PM

tallguywithglasseson: Lucius Fox: "Autopilot. I said, BRUCE, THE AUTOPILOT. Let's talk more about the autopilot and how that doesn't work even though it's completely irrelevant at the moment. BRUCE! Are you listening? I'm FORESHADOWING here! Not even the most oblivious audience member could possibly miss this, for when we do the fake death later..." [turns to camera] "Or could they?"


Haha, it wasn't that bad, was it? The second mention was a bit unnecessary though. (did it get mentioned more than twice before the thing at the end with the technician?) Actually now that you mention it, the whole "less busy mind" thing or whatever Fox says was probably a bit much too.

That part and the first mention of the cafe thing both stood out to me as forestadowy, but more just like a "hmmmmm, meta" than it bothering me.

Anyway, I enjoyed that movie a lot. I think my expectations were pretty low from hearing people semi-rag on it a bit before seeing it. So, thanks Fark!
 
2012-08-09 04:24:44 PM

alwaysjaded: One thing I loved about TDK was no Joker origin. He just shows up and causes chaos.


I remember being really annoyed when the Joker was explaining his backstory and how it was the same old hackneyed "my daddy beat me" justification. It was such a shallow copout for a badguy to just blame it all on bad parenting. Then, a bit later, when he was explaining his backstory and it was totally different, I was grinning like an idiot because it was just the right touch.
 
2012-08-09 04:24:59 PM
Here's the thing I don't get about Bane:

If he's a denizen of that decrepid hole-in-the-ground prison, which is apparently in some mysterious Asian location, why does he sound like he's doing a bad Sean Connery impersonation?
 
2012-08-09 04:27:32 PM

cgraves67: Here's the thing I don't get about Bane:

If he's a denizen of that decrepid hole-in-the-ground prison, which is apparently in some mysterious Asian location, why does he sound like he's doing a bad Sean Connery impersonation?


Maybe he was actually trying for an Egyptian accent?

/too obscure?
 
2012-08-09 04:27:37 PM

cgraves67: Here's the thing I don't get about Bane:

If he's a denizen of that decrepid hole-in-the-ground prison, which is apparently in some mysterious Asian location, why does he sound like he's doing a bad Sean Connery impersonation?


The same reason maybe that Bruce Wayne had an American accent? Not from there?
 
2012-08-09 04:29:41 PM

doglover: Bane should be Brazilian and a luchaidor with venom that makes him strong. This movie's Bane was shiat.


I didn't know Schumacher was on FARK. Hi, Joel!
 
2012-08-09 04:29:42 PM

Abner Doon: That part and the first mention of the cafe thing both stood out to me as forestadowy, but more just like a "hmmmmm, meta" than it bothering me.


Alfred's "fantasy" would have been better expressed as a more general idea of encountering Bruce in some unspecified location within Italy (or even Europe in general) than encountering Bruce in a specific cafe.
 
2012-08-09 04:31:10 PM

Karac: cgraves67: Here's the thing I don't get about Bane:

If he's a denizen of that decrepid hole-in-the-ground prison, which is apparently in some mysterious Asian location, why does he sound like he's doing a bad Sean Connery impersonation?

Maybe he was actually trying for an Egyptian accent?

/too obscure?


Input from a Spanish peacock is not needed here.
 
2012-08-09 04:32:53 PM

Darth_Lukecash: Nolan got the spirit of the characters right. His Scarecrow brought out the scientific side of the character. The Joker was literally a force of nature...both funny and scary at the same time. Two Face was really tragic figure pushed beyond the edge.


Two Face was supposed to be a guy with two separate personalities, a crime lord and a righteous DA, which personality he adopted depended on the flip of a coin. In both Batman Forever and The Dark Knight, he was just a psycho who asked the coin whether or not he had permission to kill people. Batman Forever was irredeemable but in TDK they missed and opportunity for a genuinely interesting character study-thingie and could have been better.

tallguywithglasseson: Lucius Fox: "Autopilot. I said, BRUCE, THE AUTOPILOT. Let's talk more about the autopilot and how that doesn't work even though it's completely irrelevant at the moment. BRUCE! Are you listening? I'm FORESHADOWING here! Not even the most oblivious audience member could possibly miss this, for when we do the fake death later..." [turns to camera] "Or could they?"



That was admittedly a bit lame. The Bruce Wayne in the Nolanverse is frankly a moron. He's not a scientist. He's not the world's greatest detective. He turns to Lucious to implement the complex "motorcycle helmet " technology so that he can turn his head in the batsuit. But he can figure out the autopilot in the Bat that stumped Lucious.

Yeah, there are a lot of contrivances in the film and I'm probably giving people who get paid ridiculous amounts of money to write this shiat an undue pass but the overall film worked for me, despite the glitches in the script that shouldn't be there.
 
2012-08-09 04:36:45 PM

sprawl15: alwaysjaded: One thing I loved about TDK was no Joker origin. He just shows up and causes chaos.

I remember being really annoyed when the Joker was explaining his backstory and how it was the same old hackneyed "my daddy beat me" justification. It was such a shallow copout for a badguy to just blame it all on bad parenting. Then, a bit later, when he was explaining his backstory and it was totally different, I was grinning like an idiot because it was just the right touch.


That's when I knew he was truly insane, and in a dangerously functional way. I was like:

"Wait that isn't the same sto... oh god."
 
2012-08-09 04:39:12 PM

Mugato: Two Face was supposed to be a guy with two separate personalities, a crime lord and a righteous DA, which personality he adopted depended on the flip of a coin. In both Batman Forever and The Dark Knight, he was just a psycho who asked the coin whether or not he had permission to kill people. Batman Forever was irredeemable but in TDK they missed and opportunity for a genuinely interesting character study-thingie and could have been better.


Two-Face in The Dark Knight was portrayed as a character with fundamentally opposed personality traits, rather than two fundamentally opposed personalities. It was a variation upon the comic-book character.

Two-Face in Batman Forever was a goofy variant of the Joker with a coin-flipping gimmick who upon at least one occasion had to be reminded of his reliance upon that gimmick. It was only superficially similar to the comic-book character.
 
2012-08-09 04:40:17 PM

tallguywithglasseson: Lucius Fox: "Autopilot. I said, BRUCE, THE AUTOPILOT. Let's talk more about the autopilot and how that doesn't work even though it's completely irrelevant at the moment. BRUCE! Are you listening? I'm FORESHADOWING here! Not even the most oblivious audience member could possibly miss this, for when we do the fake death later..." [turns to camera] "Or could they?"


Yea, they were very heavy on the foreshadowing. But then again everyone expected batman to buy the farm in this one. A slight change to the Cafe scene and his fate would have only been implied.
Maybe they wanted to end it on a mystery and then backed out at the last moment.

Its the Catch 22 of trying to appease the new audience and the fans at the same time. I think Nolan took alot of old characters and added just enough of a fresh twist to keep it exciting and watchable.
For a summer blockbuster I thought they did a pretty good job.

I mean, the old Bane was strong but not strong enough to bring ruination to Gotham.
This new Bane, he kind of grows on you.
 
2012-08-09 04:42:19 PM
I love how righteous and pretentious people are about Nolan's trilogy.

Is it the best ever? No.

Is it entertaining? Yes.

/Can't wait to see what he does with Superman.
 
2012-08-09 04:44:43 PM

BafflerMeal: cgraves67: Here's the thing I don't get about Bane:

If he's a denizen of that decrepid hole-in-the-ground prison, which is apparently in some mysterious Asian location, why does he sound like he's doing a bad Sean Connery impersonation?

The same reason maybe that Bruce Wayne had an American accent? Not from there?


That's true, but BW was thrown in after it became the dumping ground for Ra's Al-ghul (and later Bane), while Bane had been thrown in there when it was the prison of that nameless warlord. It makes sense that there would be westerners in a prison run by an international terror group, but less likely for a local warlord.
 
2012-08-09 04:46:51 PM

Mugato: But he can figure out the autopilot in the Bat that stumped Lucious.


He spent his time as a recluse becoming an l33t h4x0r. They cut the montage where he sneaks off to MIT and learns under the cruel tutelage of RMS.
 
2012-08-09 04:46:55 PM

Dimensio: Two-Face in The Dark Knight was portrayed as a character with fundamentally opposed personality traits, rather than two fundamentally opposed personalities. It was a variation upon the comic-book character.


But then shouldn't he have tried to bring the people who survived his coin toss to justice if he wasn't allowed to kill them? And isn't flipping again for the guy's driver cheating? I dunno, I thought TDK was a great film but the Two Face thing felt tacked on and nonsensical.

Bane though, I thought was a pretty good villain even if he wasn't close to the books.

Although I still don't understand the mechanics of the pit and why there had to be a jump involved in climbing out.
 
2012-08-09 04:52:49 PM

cgraves67: Here's the thing I don't get about Bane:

If he's a denizen of that decrepid hole-in-the-ground prison, which is apparently in some mysterious Asian location, why does he sound like he's doing a bad Sean Connery impersonation?


[possible spoilers]

I dug the voice. Creepy old man voice on a younger big bad guy. Up until they made him into the trivial henchman with the reveal. The joker was a mostly indomitable intellect, the consumate arch enemy for Batman, and so was Bane in a more brute force way with his militia(but still fugging smart) and physical stature, until M Night Shamalan styled twist that robbed him of all coolness. The creepy, wise but humored, old man voice lost all the points it had garnered, and then he...got shot. Not just anti-climactic, but a huge kick in the balls.
 
2012-08-09 04:53:58 PM

Mugato: Dimensio: Two-Face in The Dark Knight was portrayed as a character with fundamentally opposed personality traits, rather than two fundamentally opposed personalities. It was a variation upon the comic-book character.

But then shouldn't he have tried to bring the people who survived his coin toss to justice if he wasn't allowed to kill them? And isn't flipping again for the guy's driver cheating? I dunno, I thought TDK was a great film but the Two Face thing felt tacked on and nonsensical.

Bane though, I thought was a pretty good villain even if he wasn't close to the books.

Although I still don't understand the mechanics of the pit and why there had to be a jump involved in climbing out.


seems like you could have climbed around it or above it...
 
2012-08-09 04:54:44 PM

omeganuepsilon: I dug the voice. Creepy old man voice on a younger big bad guy. Up until they made him into the trivial henchman with the reveal.


Revealing Bane's accomplice did not demonstrate Bane himself to be a "trivial henchman". He was, at the very least, the second-in-command and he may have been a more-or-less equal collaborator.
 
2012-08-09 04:54:52 PM
SPOILERS

I gotta admit, I couldn't feel anything for Bane. I couldn't get what his motivation was. Okay, if he was in the League of Shadows and wanted to destroy Gotham, why didn't he just, you know, destroy Gotham? They could've set that bomb off at any time and their mission would've been accomplished. Why wait the extra months where they just let Gotham go to hell? And I feel like the reasoning behind Bane's mask was pretty silly (and also that when it was disconnected he just kinda laid there - I would've expected screaming or something).

To be honest, I always thought the League of Shadows storyline was silly to begin with. The Dark Knight was so good in part because the Joker was a believable villain.
 
2012-08-09 04:55:46 PM

tallguywithglasseson: Mugato: But he can figure out the autopilot in the Bat that stumped Lucious.

He spent his time as a recluse becoming an l33t h4x0r. They cut the montage where he sneaks off to MIT and learns under the cruel tutelage of RMS.


Or he could have subbed it out to a firm that had no clue what they were looking at other than faulty code.
 
2012-08-09 04:57:39 PM

omeganuepsilon: cgraves67: Here's the thing I don't get about Bane:

If he's a denizen of that decrepid hole-in-the-ground prison, which is apparently in some mysterious Asian location, why does he sound like he's doing a bad Sean Connery impersonation?

[possible spoilers]

I dug the voice. Creepy old man voice on a younger big bad guy. Up until they made him into the trivial henchman with the reveal. The joker was a mostly indomitable intellect, the consumate arch enemy for Batman, and so was Bane in a more brute force way with his militia(but still fugging smart) and physical stature, until M Night Shamalan styled twist that robbed him of all coolness. The creepy, wise but humored, old man voice lost all the points it had garnered, and then he...got shot. Not just anti-climactic, but a huge kick in the balls.


Yep. Pretty much this. If Bane had actually practiced what he preached - if he had been an anarchist trying to return Gotham to its people, but really just in it for the power trip or to totally bring down the system, that would have been awesome. They even played up that angle, when Bane was told he had been paid a small fortune, he says "and why would that give you any power over me?"

But instead it meant nothing. In the end, he was just a big guy who happened to wear a mask. His actions were meaningless.

Tying the movie back to the first one was a mistake, in my opinion.
 
2012-08-09 04:59:24 PM
Everyone keeps saying they nailed catwoman(I know I'd like to HEY-OOOOOO) but wtf with the end? She found her dream man and just gave up her life of crime and questionably dumped girls?
 
2012-08-09 05:01:24 PM

Lord Dimwit: "and why would that give you any power over me?"


I think the line was "do you really feel like you're in control"

Yeah his motivations were weak sauce but I still really liked him and thought he inspired fear.
 
2012-08-09 05:04:40 PM

Lord Dimwit: I gotta admit, I couldn't feel anything for Bane. I couldn't get what his motivation was. Okay, if he was in the League of Shadows and wanted to destroy Gotham, why didn't he just, you know, destroy Gotham? They could've set that bomb off at any time and their mission would've been accomplished. Why wait the extra months where they just let Gotham go to hell?


It was the same reasoning as putting Wayne in a prison with a possible escape route that wasn't really possible. To really fark someone up, they have to have a little hope that's always crushed. So his and Talia's plan was to string the city along and make them think that they were going to be okay and even get back at the corrupt people and then tell them that they're going to die anyway. It's called sadism.

thecpt: Or he could have subbed it out to a firm that had no clue what they were looking at other than faulty code.


Nothing that Lucious couldn't have done. It was a goofy plot device is all, I liked the movie overall. It just could have used one more pass in the screenwriting dept.
 
2012-08-09 05:06:17 PM

AdolfOliverPanties: I read people like that dumb fark Harry Knowles complaining that Nolan completely screwed up what Batman or Bruce Wayne would have done. Yeah, well, tough shiat. These weren't laughable glitzy crap like the Schumacher films, and bizarre and fun yet completely stupid ones like Burton's. Nolan made his movies have much more of a tether to reality than most superhero stories.

I loved all three of the Nolan Batman films. The only problem I had with this one was Bane sounding like John Rhys-Davies doing a book-on-tape.


You didn't have a problem with Batman's voice? Him shouting at Bane "WHERE'S THE TRIGGER?" was as silly as Nicholas Cage shouting "HOW'D IT GET BURNT?" in the Wicker Man.
 
2012-08-09 05:09:33 PM

almandot: Everyone keeps saying they nailed catwoman(I know I'd like to HEY-OOOOOO) but wtf with the end? She found her dream man and just gave up her life of crime and questionably dumped girls?


I think the scene in Batman Returns with Keaton and Pfieffer at the ball was a lot cooler than the characters' interactions in TDKR. It was a masquerade ball and they were the only ones not wearing masks but they were the only ones who were wearing masks and then they discovered each other's true identity. Sure the cats bringing her back to life was farking stupid but that one scene was badass.
 
2012-08-09 05:11:27 PM

Tyrone Slothrop: AdolfOliverPanties: I read people like that dumb fark Harry Knowles complaining that Nolan completely screwed up what Batman or Bruce Wayne would have done. Yeah, well, tough shiat. These weren't laughable glitzy crap like the Schumacher films, and bizarre and fun yet completely stupid ones like Burton's. Nolan made his movies have much more of a tether to reality than most superhero stories.

I loved all three of the Nolan Batman films. The only problem I had with this one was Bane sounding like John Rhys-Davies doing a book-on-tape.

You didn't have a problem with Batman's voice? Him shouting at Bane "WHERE'S THE TRIGGER?" was as silly as Nicholas Cage shouting "HOW'D IT GET BURNT?" in the Wicker Man.


Considering how much they toned down Bale's screaming compared to how much he did in "The Dark Knight," when he finally screamed "where's the trigger" I turned to my son and said "oh yeah. That's what he sounded like the whole last movie."

So no, it didn't bother me. It bothered me in "The Dark Knight" though.
 
2012-08-09 05:11:46 PM
I say this in every thread about Batman movies but, I should say it again anyway. Batman: Mask of the Phantasm was the best batman movie.
 
2012-08-09 05:13:35 PM

thecpt: Lord Dimwit: "and why would that give you any power over me?"

I think the line was "do you really feel like you're in control"

Yeah his motivations were weak sauce but I still really liked him and thought he inspired fear.


I saw it again yesterday. The exact lines were:

Dagget: I've paid you a very large amount of money!
Bane: ...and this gives you power over me?
 
2012-08-09 05:14:17 PM

AdolfOliverPanties: Considering how much they toned down Bale's screaming compared to how much he did in "The Dark Knight," when he finally screamed "where's the trigger" I turned to my son and said "oh yeah. That's what he sounded like the whole last movie."

So no, it didn't bother me. It bothered me in "The Dark Knight" though.


I don't get it. Him screaming "WHERE ARE THEY" is one of my absolute favorite scenes in that movie.
 
2012-08-09 05:17:26 PM

AdolfOliverPanties: Considering how much they toned down Bale's screaming compared to how much he did in "The Dark Knight," when he finally screamed "where's the trigger" I turned to my son and said "oh yeah. That's what he sounded like the whole last movie."

So no, it didn't bother me. It bothered me in "The Dark Knight" though.


Really? I thought it was worse in TDKR because in this one he actually had some dramatic lines to read, which were undercut by the gravelly voice. In Batman Begins he had a Bat-voice but it wasn't nearly as pronounced.

And then there's the issue of him using the voice even when he's talking to people who knows who he is or even when he's talking to himself. So that might indicate a split personality or something.
 
2012-08-09 05:17:27 PM

Lord Dimwit: Yep. Pretty much this. If Bane had actually practiced what he preached - if he had been an anarchist trying to return Gotham to its people, but really just in it for the power trip or to totally bring down the system, that would have been awesome. They even played up that angle, when Bane was told he had been paid a small fortune, he says "and why would that give you any power over me?"

But instead it meant nothing. In the end, he was just a big guy who happened to wear a mask. His actions were meaningless.

Tying the movie back to the first one was a mistake, in my opinion.


Try watching it again but every time he talks about returning Gotham to the people, pretend Heath Ledger is alive and it is the Joker saying it. The movie makes more sense that way, in my opinion.

The Joker gives the city back, the Joker causes chaos... and Talia suddenly shanghai's his plot to serve her revenge purpose at the end, killing the Joker in cold blood.
 
2012-08-09 05:18:27 PM

DamnYankees: I don't get it. Him screaming "WHERE ARE THEY" is one of my absolute favorite scenes in that movie.


Yeah, he was LOSING IT in that scene. Gordon even noted that he wasn't in control. That scene was so mesmerizing I didn't even think of it comically.
 
2012-08-09 05:18:27 PM

Lord Dimwit: Yep. Pretty much this. If Bane had actually practiced what he preached - if he had been an anarchist trying to return Gotham to its people, but really just in it for the power trip or to totally bring down the system, that would have been awesome. They even played up that angle, when Bane was told he had been paid a small fortune, he says "and why would that give you any power over me?"

But instead it meant nothing. In the end, he was just a big guy who happened to wear a mask. His actions were meaningless.

Tying the movie back to the first one was a mistake, in my opinion.


I would have been much happier had there been an internal conflict between Talia and Bane, because Talia was motivated by revenge while Bane was motivated by idealism. Then again, that would have added an hour to the movie.
 
2012-08-09 05:20:02 PM
I don't really need any more Bane back story. What I need is more of a ramp up to the populist uprising in Gotham and more Batman/Catwoman interaction to make that relationship seem like it matters.
 
2012-08-09 05:20:20 PM
Catwoman also could've used a little bit of backstory. The clean slate thing just seemed to MacGuffin-ey to me. But I don't know how they could do her and Bane properly without the movie getting ridiculously long.
 
2012-08-09 05:20:53 PM

Mugato: And then there's the issue of him using the voice even when he's talking to people who knows who he is or even when he's talking to himself. So that might indicate a split personality or something.


I think his cowl makes him speak like that automatically. Like, it has a voice modulator in it. That's my explanation - he put that in so he didn't have to really think about it, but it means he has to talk that way even if people know who he is.
 
2012-08-09 05:21:06 PM

Mugato: doglover: Bane should be Brazilian and a luchaidor with venom that makes him strong. This movie's Bane was shiat.

They colossally farked up Two-Face and most people didn't mind. Actually, none of the Rogue's Gallery in any of the Nolan films were true to their comic book counterparts (except maybe Catwoman). The difference being that The Joker and Ra's al Ghul were still cool without being faithful to the source material.


I don't see this as a bug. Nolan was clearly not trying to do a canonical DC batman, so complaining that characters don't match their canon depictions is kind of missing the point.

One of the great things about the Batman character is that the story is flexible enough to be told in innumerable ways and from innumerable angles, and non-canonical stories enhance that. It's like complaining that Red Son got Superman wrong because it he didn't land in Smallville.
 
2012-08-09 05:21:37 PM

Mugato: AdolfOliverPanties: Considering how much they toned down Bale's screaming compared to how much he did in "The Dark Knight," when he finally screamed "where's the trigger" I turned to my son and said "oh yeah. That's what he sounded like the whole last movie."

So no, it didn't bother me. It bothered me in "The Dark Knight" though.

Really? I thought it was worse in TDKR because in this one he actually had some dramatic lines to read, which were undercut by the gravelly voice. In Batman Begins he had a Bat-voice but it wasn't nearly as pronounced.

And then there's the issue of him using the voice even when he's talking to people who knows who he is or even when he's talking to himself. So that might indicate a split personality or something.


Most people wisely put it up to a voice scrambler he wears. Or he stays in character at all times, mainly because he's never know who's listening.
 
2012-08-09 05:21:49 PM

sprawl15: Lord Dimwit: Yep. Pretty much this. If Bane had actually practiced what he preached - if he had been an anarchist trying to return Gotham to its people, but really just in it for the power trip or to totally bring down the system, that would have been awesome. They even played up that angle, when Bane was told he had been paid a small fortune, he says "and why would that give you any power over me?"

But instead it meant nothing. In the end, he was just a big guy who happened to wear a mask. His actions were meaningless.

Tying the movie back to the first one was a mistake, in my opinion.

I would have been much happier had there been an internal conflict between Talia and Bane, because Talia was motivated by revenge while Bane was motivated by idealism. Then again, that would have added an hour to the movie.


See, I didn't even get that from Bane. I don't think he was motivated by idealism - I think he was just Talia's willing toy the whole time. I don't think she promised him anything.
 
2012-08-09 05:22:18 PM

Mugato: And then there's the issue of him using the voice even when he's talking to people who knows who he is or even when he's talking to himself. So that might indicate a split personality or something.


Haven't you seen The Prestige? You never, ever break character!
 
2012-08-09 05:22:52 PM

Some 'Splainin' To Do: Mugato: And then there's the issue of him using the voice even when he's talking to people who knows who he is or even when he's talking to himself. So that might indicate a split personality or something.

Haven't you seen The Prestige? You never, ever break character!


Catwoman wants to be...fooled.
 
2012-08-09 05:24:47 PM

Lord Dimwit: See, I didn't even get that from Bane. I don't think he was motivated by idealism - I think he was just Talia's willing toy the whole time. I don't think she promised him anything.


I meant that part as what I would have liked to have seen.
 
2012-08-09 05:28:29 PM

Mugato: doglover: Bane should be Brazilian and a luchaidor with venom that makes him strong. This movie's Bane was shiat.

They colossally farked up Two-Face and most people didn't mind. Actually, none of the Rogue's Gallery in any of the Nolan films were true to their comic book counterparts (except maybe Catwoman). The difference being that The Joker and Ra's al Ghul were still cool without being faithful to the source material.


My niece was giving me the run down on this last night.

I kept on saying, "But Cesar Romero's Joker did have makeup!"
 
2012-08-09 05:29:34 PM

DamnYankees: thecpt: Lord Dimwit: "and why would that give you any power over me?"

I think the line was "do you really feel like you're in control"

Yeah his motivations were weak sauce but I still really liked him and thought he inspired fear.

I saw it again yesterday. The exact lines were:

Dagget: I've paid you a very large amount of money!
Bane: ...and this gives you power over me?


Hmmmm. I heard :TSSSHH DSHH YOU Pahwuh ovah me?
 
2012-08-09 05:32:17 PM

Darth_Lukecash: Mugato: AdolfOliverPanties: Considering how much they toned down Bale's screaming compared to how much he did in "The Dark Knight," when he finally screamed "where's the trigger" I turned to my son and said "oh yeah. That's what he sounded like the whole last movie."

So no, it didn't bother me. It bothered me in "The Dark Knight" though.

Really? I thought it was worse in TDKR because in this one he actually had some dramatic lines to read, which were undercut by the gravelly voice. In Batman Begins he had a Bat-voice but it wasn't nearly as pronounced.

And then there's the issue of him using the voice even when he's talking to people who knows who he is or even when he's talking to himself. So that might indicate a split personality or something.

Most people wisely put it up to a voice scrambler he wears. Or he stays in character at all times, mainly because he's never know who's listening.


Also, he's a mouth breather in the mask with his nose covered. Which always gives him the 'I'm on a respirator' language pauses...
 
2012-08-09 05:32:45 PM

Some 'Splainin' To Do: Mugato: And then there's the issue of him using the voice even when he's talking to people who knows who he is or even when he's talking to himself. So that might indicate a split personality or something.

Haven't you seen The Prestige? You never, ever break character!


Yeah, fair enough. It's not even a complaint I thought of until so many people brought it up. It is a bit distracting but the Bat-voice in the Keaton films is is a happy medium.


Some 'Splainin' To Do: I don't see this as a bug. Nolan was clearly not trying to do a canonical DC batman, so complaining that characters don't match their canon depictions is kind of missing the point.


Yeah and Ra's Al Ghul is pretty far from the book version because in the semi-realistic Nolan-verse, there aren't any immortal villains who dip in a Lazarus Pit. But Two-Face isn't that supernatural a character and they could have got him right without going all Man-Bat supernatural. But whatever.
 
2012-08-09 05:34:27 PM

thomps: Karac: thomps: Karac: Makh: I could gripe but I'd rather snark and say that for this movie, all of Batman's problems could have been solved by Iron Man in 5 minutes. (That's including travel time.)

Yeah, but Bruce Wayne doesn't have any superpowers the way Iron Man does.

i dunno, he's got that magic rope that fixes backs. that's something.

OK, so Batman has a magical chiropractor. Iron Man has the superpower of a comic book sized bank account. He could have just paid the prisoners to lift him out of that hole like a cheerleader at the top of a pyramid.

so that stock exchange break-in that bankrupted bruce wayne thing was the most annoying part of that movie to me. why would they not back out every transaction that happened while they were hacked into the exchange network? didn't they do that a few years ago after that "fat finger" flash crash?


They mentioned it in passing - the transactions would get reversed within a few days, but Wayne would be in the poor in the meantime.
 
2012-08-09 05:35:07 PM

Darth_Lukecash: Mugato: AdolfOliverPanties: Considering how much they toned down Bale's screaming compared to how much he did in "The Dark Knight," when he finally screamed "where's the trigger" I turned to my son and said "oh yeah. That's what he sounded like the whole last movie."

So no, it didn't bother me. It bothered me in "The Dark Knight" though.

Really? I thought it was worse in TDKR because in this one he actually had some dramatic lines to read, which were undercut by the gravelly voice. In Batman Begins he had a Bat-voice but it wasn't nearly as pronounced.

And then there's the issue of him using the voice even when he's talking to people who knows who he is or even when he's talking to himself. So that might indicate a split personality or something.

Most people wisely put it up to a voice scrambler he wears. Or he stays in character at all times, mainly because he's never know who's listening.


[again possible spoilers, can't we just tag recent movies with this in the title somewhere?]

I vote for off his rocker. He is a fairly unhinged character mentioned bluntly in all 3 movies. I don't know about dual personalities, but different persona's where he has to act a certain way(he does go on at length about what batman is as if it's somewhat separate from him, and it's covered in the new film by the rookie cop, anger hidden by a smile, etc) [Recently saw the South Park where Butters gets diagnosed for playing games and assuming a persona....maybe Batman just takes it seriously?]. Can't be the God Damned Batman and sound exactly like Bruce Wayne either, they went to great lengths to keep his identity unknown for obvious reasons.

Either way it's explainable and I'm not sure why everyone takes issue with it or just think it's silly(If that's the case, why are they watching comic book movies where most of the franchise was much much more silly?). There are a plethora of logical reasons for a different voice. Who should be amazed that it's a growl? I mean, if he lisped it wouldn't be very fitting, or squeeky, or sounded like a leatherfaced 3 pack a day breathy truckstop waitress...
 
2012-08-09 05:35:45 PM

Mugato: doglover: Bane should be Brazilian and a luchaidor with venom that makes him strong. This movie's Bane was shiat.

They colossally farked up Two-Face and most people didn't mind. Actually, none of the Rogue's Gallery in any of the Nolan films were true to their comic book counterparts (except maybe Catwoman). The difference being that The Joker and Ra's al Ghul were still cool without being faithful to the source material.


The Joker and Two-Face in The Dark Knight were believable and realistic. I'm not saying I read comics for the realism, but it certainly helps sometimes.

(Honestly, though, that's why I've always had Batman as my favorite hero - he's completely believable. He's just zis guy, you know? That's why I liked The Dark Knight and Batman: The Animated Series, because they had both believable villains and, unlike the comics, didn't have the whole DC Universe behind them. In a world with Superman and The Flash, why do you need Batman?)

(The answer being, of course, that Batman is awesome. Also, I loved Superman: Red Son's take on Batman, which was very believable in the context of the story.)

(For anyone out there who likes comics but hasn't read Superman: Red Son and you're over the age of about...25...it is the best Superman story ever written.)
 
2012-08-09 05:37:09 PM

Mugato: And then there's the issue of him using the voice even when he's talking to people who knows who he is


That literally had me laughing out loud at the movie.
 
2012-08-09 05:38:31 PM

Shazam999: thomps: Karac: thomps: Karac: Makh: I could gripe but I'd rather snark and say that for this movie, all of Batman's problems could have been solved by Iron Man in 5 minutes. (That's including travel time.)

Yeah, but Bruce Wayne doesn't have any superpowers the way Iron Man does.

i dunno, he's got that magic rope that fixes backs. that's something.

OK, so Batman has a magical chiropractor. Iron Man has the superpower of a comic book sized bank account. He could have just paid the prisoners to lift him out of that hole like a cheerleader at the top of a pyramid.

so that stock exchange break-in that bankrupted bruce wayne thing was the most annoying part of that movie to me. why would they not back out every transaction that happened while they were hacked into the exchange network? didn't they do that a few years ago after that "fat finger" flash crash?

They mentioned it in passing - the transactions would get reversed within a few days, but Wayne would be in the poor in the meantime.


i think they actually said a few months, and wayne was still poor at the end of the movie, no? i have a hard time believing that a sympathetic board would move that quickly to wrest control from him especially given the circumstances.
 
2012-08-09 05:42:00 PM

thomps: Shazam999: thomps: Karac: thomps: Karac: Makh: I could gripe but I'd rather snark and say that for this movie, all of Batman's problems could have been solved by Iron Man in 5 minutes. (That's including travel time.)

Yeah, but Bruce Wayne doesn't have any superpowers the way Iron Man does.

i dunno, he's got that magic rope that fixes backs. that's something.

OK, so Batman has a magical chiropractor. Iron Man has the superpower of a comic book sized bank account. He could have just paid the prisoners to lift him out of that hole like a cheerleader at the top of a pyramid.

so that stock exchange break-in that bankrupted bruce wayne thing was the most annoying part of that movie to me. why would they not back out every transaction that happened while they were hacked into the exchange network? didn't they do that a few years ago after that "fat finger" flash crash?

They mentioned it in passing - the transactions would get reversed within a few days, but Wayne would be in the poor in the meantime.

i think they actually said a few months, and wayne was still poor at the end of the movie, no? i have a hard time believing that a sympathetic board would move that quickly to wrest control from him especially given the circumstances.


Months, days, whatever. He was supposed to get his money back eventually.
 
2012-08-09 05:46:34 PM

thomps: i think they actually said a few months, and wayne was still poor at the end of the movie, no? i have a hard time believing that a sympathetic board would move that quickly to wrest control from him especially given the circumstances.


They weren't sympathetic. There was a guy who was already trying to wrest control of the company away from Wayne. Him and his followers were looking for any excuse and they got one.

I'm not sure if Wayne is poor at the end. He faked his own death so I doubt it really matters.
 
2012-08-09 05:47:33 PM

odinsposse: thomps: i think they actually said a few months, and wayne was still poor at the end of the movie, no? i have a hard time believing that a sympathetic board would move that quickly to wrest control from him especially given the circumstances.

They weren't sympathetic. There was a guy who was already trying to wrest control of the company away from Wayne. Him and his followers were looking for any excuse and they got one.

I'm not sure if Wayne is poor at the end. He faked his own death so I doubt it really matters.


Actually...did Wayne fake his own death? Batman fakes his own death, but when did Bruce Wayne die?
 
2012-08-09 05:49:00 PM

odinsposse: thomps: i think they actually said a few months, and wayne was still poor at the end of the movie, no? i have a hard time believing that a sympathetic board would move that quickly to wrest control from him especially given the circumstances.

They weren't sympathetic. There was a guy who was already trying to wrest control of the company away from Wayne. Him and his followers were looking for any excuse and they got one.

I'm not sure if Wayne is poor at the end. He faked his own death so I doubt it really matters.


oh yeah, i forgot about that.
 
2012-08-09 05:49:50 PM

Lord Dimwit: odinsposse: thomps: i think they actually said a few months, and wayne was still poor at the end of the movie, no? i have a hard time believing that a sympathetic board would move that quickly to wrest control from him especially given the circumstances.

They weren't sympathetic. There was a guy who was already trying to wrest control of the company away from Wayne. Him and his followers were looking for any excuse and they got one.

I'm not sure if Wayne is poor at the end. He faked his own death so I doubt it really matters.

Actually...did Wayne fake his own death? Batman fakes his own death, but when did Bruce Wayne die?


There was a funeral for him. I don't remember the specifics but if everyone presumes Batman died then everyone who knew his identity must have made up a story about Bruce dying as well.
 
2012-08-09 05:51:00 PM

odinsposse: Lord Dimwit: odinsposse: thomps: i think they actually said a few months, and wayne was still poor at the end of the movie, no? i have a hard time believing that a sympathetic board would move that quickly to wrest control from him especially given the circumstances.

They weren't sympathetic. There was a guy who was already trying to wrest control of the company away from Wayne. Him and his followers were looking for any excuse and they got one.

I'm not sure if Wayne is poor at the end. He faked his own death so I doubt it really matters.

Actually...did Wayne fake his own death? Batman fakes his own death, but when did Bruce Wayne die?

There was a funeral for him. I don't remember the specifics but if everyone presumes Batman died then everyone who knew his identity must have made up a story about Bruce dying as well.


a lot of people died during the city lock-down, particularly rich people. wouldn't be hard to just count him among them
 
2012-08-09 05:55:16 PM

omeganuepsilon: I vote for off his rocker. He is a fairly unhinged character mentioned bluntly in all 3 movies.


Actually, he's not. Which, despite all the nitpicking stuff is the only real problem I have with Bruce Wayne's character in the Nolan films. He's not unhinged at all. Michael Keaton's Bruce Wayne was unhinged. You could see it in his performance. He wasn't totally there. His Bruce Wayne was arguably as crazy as The Joker. Nolan's Bruce Wayne was pragmatic and normal. He was basically a cop who just happened to dress like a bat to scare people. There was no psychosis there.
 
2012-08-09 06:00:59 PM

Mugato: omeganuepsilon: I vote for off his rocker. He is a fairly unhinged character mentioned bluntly in all 3 movies.

Actually, he's not. Which, despite all the nitpicking stuff is the only real problem I have with Bruce Wayne's character in the Nolan films. He's not unhinged at all. Michael Keaton's Bruce Wayne was unhinged. You could see it in his performance. He wasn't totally there. His Bruce Wayne was arguably as crazy as The Joker. Nolan's Bruce Wayne was pragmatic and normal. He was basically a cop who just happened to dress like a bat to scare people. There was no psychosis there.


To be honest, I don't think Keaton's Bruce Wayne fully captured it either. Honestly, very few portrayals have really captured that side of the character. Certain episodes of The Animated Series hinted at it. The comics have had a couple of arcs but it's really a woefully underexplored aspect of the character.
 
2012-08-09 06:10:32 PM

Lord Dimwit: To be honest, I don't think Keaton's Bruce Wayne fully captured it either


I think there were scenes in Burton's two films that portrayed Wayne's not being totally there pretty well. People seem to also forget that when the 1989 Batman came out all most people knew about Batman was the 1960s TV show. So it was hardcore. And the crazy quotient as far as the movies were concerned definitely went downhill since then.
 
2012-08-09 06:16:15 PM
Did someone say gripes? I love gripes!

Plot holes don't bother me most of the time.
What bothered me in this movie was the giant superhelicopter and batman dodging homing missiles.

Also, anything involving Miranda in the last 25 minutes was superfluous. Ultimately, it didn't matter who was the child of Ras Al-Ghul, and devoting so much time to the distinction didn't add any tension or further the plot for me.
 
2012-08-09 06:32:34 PM
For me the thing I hated most was all the Bane overdubs they used. Like in the plane at the beginning, he sounds like he's in a studio, using his "inside voice." But he's talking in a ripped-in-half plane, instead of shouting over all the wind noise. And pretty much everywhere he talked, it sounded like that. Really took me out of the movie in a way I've never been taken out before...

I also lol'ed at "WHERE'S THE TRIGGER!!" But mostly cuz of the face Bale makes.
 
2012-08-09 06:34:47 PM
Why don't studios release more "director cuts"? Word is that the first screening show to studio folk was almost 4 hours long. Just imagine the DVD sales if that was ever made available.

Is it the director or the studio who has final say over what gets released? I've heard that Nolan doesn't include deleted scenes on DVD releases of his film, but it seems strange to me that the studio wouldn't have the final say.
 
2012-08-09 06:37:56 PM

Mugato: Darth_Lukecash: Nolan got the spirit of the characters right. His Scarecrow brought out the scientific side of the character. The Joker was literally a force of nature...both funny and scary at the same time. Two Face was really tragic figure pushed beyond the edge.

Two Face was supposed to be a guy with two separate personalities, a crime lord and a righteous DA, which personality he adopted depended on the flip of a coin. In both Batman Forever and The Dark Knight, he was just a psycho who asked the coin whether or not he had permission to kill people. Batman Forever was irredeemable but in TDK they missed and opportunity for a genuinely interesting character study-thingie and could have been better.

tallguywithglasseson: Lucius Fox: "Autopilot. I said, BRUCE, THE AUTOPILOT. Let's talk more about the autopilot and how that doesn't work even though it's completely irrelevant at the moment. BRUCE! Are you listening? I'm FORESHADOWING here! Not even the most oblivious audience member could possibly miss this, for when we do the fake death later..." [turns to camera] "Or could they?"


That was admittedly a bit lame. The Bruce Wayne in the Nolanverse is frankly a moron. He's not a scientist. He's not the world's greatest detective. He turns to Lucious to implement the complex "motorcycle helmet " technology so that he can turn his head in the batsuit. But he can figure out the autopilot in the Bat that stumped Lucious.

Yeah, there are a lot of contrivances in the film and I'm probably giving people who get paid ridiculous amounts of money to write this shiat an undue pass but the overall film worked for me, despite the glitches in the script that shouldn't be there.


Bruce made that radar cell phone shiat too. And he analyzed that bullet that exploded in the wall. He figured out catwomans identity. There's more, but if he was the batman from the comics the movie would last 5minutes. 6 if he had to kill darkseid AGAIN.
 
2012-08-09 06:41:06 PM

consider this: Why don't studios release more "director cuts"? Word is that the first screening show to studio folk was almost 4 hours long. Just imagine the DVD sales if that was ever made available.

Is it the director or the studio who has final say over what gets released? I've heard that Nolan doesn't include deleted scenes on DVD releases of his film, but it seems strange to me that the studio wouldn't have the final say.


The studio, unless you're talking about guys like Lucas or Spielberg. The obsession with putting everything in "the cloud" or on Netflix streaming is cutting into the special features that they used to put effort into putting on DVD releases.
 
2012-08-09 06:47:15 PM

hervatski: Bruce made that radar cell phone shiat too. And he analyzed that bullet that exploded in the wall. He figured out catwomans identity. There's more, but if he was the batman from the comics the movie would last 5minutes


He outsourced the cell phone thing and the CSI bullet thing made no sense whatsoever. He gathered fragments from the part of the bullet that you don't touch while loading the gun and got a fingerprint from it? And even if you buy that, he still sent it to Lucious to analyze.

Nolan's Batman was a ninja, nothing more. The only time any of the 7 films came close to making him a scientist or detective was in the 1989 film where he figured out the combination of the chemicals The Joker poisoned and that was like 3 minutes of screen time. A cerebral Batman film with The Riddler would have been cool.
 
2012-08-09 06:59:12 PM

TexanBoy: For me the thing I hated most was all the Bane overdubs they used. Like in the plane at the beginning, he sounds like he's in a studio, using his "inside voice." But he's talking in a ripped-in-half plane, instead of shouting over all the wind noise. And pretty much everywhere he talked, it sounded like that. Really took me out of the movie in a way I've never been taken out before...


Yeah, they really farked up his voice after people complained about having a hard time understanding him when the prologue was shown last year. I'll admit, it was difficult to pick everything up, but the voice was so much better. I'd rather they had added subtitles than messing with it.

Here's a comparison for people who never saw the original prologue.

Link
 
2012-08-09 07:03:10 PM

Mugato: hervatski: Bruce made that radar cell phone shiat too. And he analyzed that bullet that exploded in the wall. He figured out catwomans identity. There's more, but if he was the batman from the comics the movie would last 5minutes

He outsourced the cell phone thing and the CSI bullet thing made no sense whatsoever. He gathered fragments from the part of the bullet that you don't touch while loading the gun and got a fingerprint from it? And even if you buy that, he still sent it to Lucious to analyze.


The fingerprint was purposely placed. A joke from the Joker. If someone figured it out (Gotham CSI/Batman) hey, more chaotic fun at the police funeral.
 
2012-08-09 07:25:09 PM

omeganuepsilon: Darth_Lukecash: Mugato: AdolfOliverPanties: Considering how much they toned down Bale's screaming compared to how much he did in "The Dark Knight," when he finally screamed "where's the trigger" I turned to my son and said "oh yeah. That's what he sounded like the whole last movie."

So no, it didn't bother me. It bothered me in "The Dark Knight" though.

Really? I thought it was worse in TDKR because in this one he actually had some dramatic lines to read, which were undercut by the gravelly voice. In Batman Begins he had a Bat-voice but it wasn't nearly as pronounced.

And then there's the issue of him using the voice even when he's talking to people who knows who he is or even when he's talking to himself. So that might indicate a split personality or something.

Most people wisely put it up to a voice scrambler he wears. Or he stays in character at all times, mainly because he's never know who's listening.

[again possible spoilers, can't we just tag recent movies with this in the title somewhere?]

I vote for off his rocker. He is a fairly unhinged character mentioned bluntly in all 3 movies. I don't know about dual personalities, but different persona's where he has to act a certain way(he does go on at length about what batman is as if it's somewhat separate from him, and it's covered in the new film by the rookie cop, anger hidden by a smile, etc) [Recently saw the South Park where Butters gets diagnosed for playing games and assuming a persona....maybe Batman just takes it seriously?]. Can't be the God Damned Batman and sound exactly like Bruce Wayne either, they went to great lengths to keep his identity unknown for obvious reasons.

Either way it's explainable and I'm not sure why everyone takes issue with it or just think it's silly(If that's the case, why are they watching comic book movies where most of the franchise was much much more silly?). There are a plethora of logical reasons for a different voice. Who should be amazed that it's a growl? ...


Way back when, I read the novelization for Knightfall (I didn't read the comic, so I don't know how it compares), but there was a part in it that really seemed to resonate for this particular topic and a myriad of others. To sum it up, here's an excerpt from an a cached tvtropes section:

"Summarized in the novelization of Knightfall, Alfred explains to Tim Drake that Batman uses the cowl to become a different personality, hearkening back to primitive beliefs that wearing the mask of a god is to literally become that god.
(Batman puts his mask on)
Bane: Stop hiding.
Batman: I'm not hiding. I'm becoming."

He doesn't break character because he IS Batman while he's wearing it.
 
2012-08-09 07:26:25 PM
Plot hole gripers get to griping: Dark Knight Rises originally had way more Bane backstory

Who gives a fark?


You can't judge the movie on ...try to follow this stub-tard... content that wasn't in the movie
 
2012-08-09 07:30:27 PM

Mugato: omeganuepsilon: I vote for off his rocker. He is a fairly unhinged character mentioned bluntly in all 3 movies.

Actually, he's not.


Because sane people regularly put themselves through that kind of physical beatings all of the time, destroying their bodies, for free and in secret.

As for Keaton, sure, if by unhinged you mean slightly aloof.

Mugato: He outsourced the cell phone thing


No, he re-purposed a run of the mill spy program and turned it into a kind of night vision.

Mugato: He gathered fragments from the part of the bullet that you don't touch while loading the gun and got a fingerprint from it? And even if you buy that, he still sent it to Lucious to analyze.


1. It's not like it's a rule that you don't touch the projectile end, people do it all the time, even when loading. Know how I know you like to pretend to know what you're talking about? (it's glaringly obvious you didn't even do a GIS)(Info for ignorant fools.)
2. That's what secretaries and assistants are for. You do the tricky stuff, they do the legwork.

Mugato: Nolan's Batman was a ninja, nothing more.


And a bit of a lunatic vigilante who's body is all but completely used up because he beats the shiat out of it on a regular basis. Again, sane people do not do this, for free(indeed, paying to do it), as a themed alter ego, all in the name of saving a city. Sure, it's standard super hero fare, but not sane for people without superpowers. They didn't dwell on the tortured soul bit a lot, but it was an underlying current throughout all 3 movies, a few drops of flavorings in a drink that end up altering the whole movie. Tretending that didn't happen at all is a denialist fantasy.

You can stop being intentionally obtuse and grasping with intent at the slippery straws. We get it, you don't like the most recent movies and want to have Keaton Batman's baby. That's perfectly fine. To each his own. But could you do it without making shiat up and denigrating some scenes, and denying other's even exist? Try listing an honest opinion instead of trying to fabricate facts to make yourself "right". Of all the places you could post and simply not get called on your BS, you came to Fark...

Welcome to Fark!
 
2012-08-09 07:34:56 PM
i.qkme.me
 
2012-08-09 07:39:06 PM

omeganuepsilon: 1. It's not like it's a rule that you don't touch the projectile end, people do it all the time, even when loading. Know how I know you like to pretend to know what you're talking about? (it's glaringly obvious you didn't even do a GIS)(Info for ignorant fools.)


There's really no reason to be a dick. And there's no reason to think that one could pull a fingerprint off of the portion of a bullet that one doesn't even touch while loading.

And Jesus, you really are a dick. Damn.
 
2012-08-09 07:41:13 PM

Lord Dimwit: I say this in every thread about Batman movies but, I should say it again anyway. Batman: Mask of the Phantasm was the best batman movie.


If we're bringing cartoons into the equation, I would make an argument for Under the Red Hood being the best self contained story.

There are going to be problems with comic book movies. No matter what. The scene with all the bats attacking in the first one. The entire boat drama of the second. I actually found almost no fault with the third and I liked Two Face in the second. He felt a bit more like Dent from the Long Halloween. As for Canon? Batman is barely canonical in the comics too. Dare I bring up Red Rain?

But what amazes me is thinking about this film in comparison with Spiderman 3, or Xmen 3. The release of this movie proves to me that A. Nolan was at least trying to make a good movie and a good trilogy. but B. The other writers were clearly trying to make terrible films on purpose. There's no other explanation. Nothing else makes sense.

We didn't have Bane doing a tap dance routine to try and impress Talia. Bane blew up bridges for actual reasons instead of...You know. I've never understood the bridge scene in Xmen 3. The movie was so bad on all levels that it gets lost in the shuffle.

Now if the only gripe we had about Spiderman 3 was that his voice was gravely while wearing the symbiote, we'd be much better for it.

Oh but I'm cereal. Under the Red Hood is great.
 
2012-08-09 07:55:37 PM
I thought it was kinda lame that Talia showed up only at the very end. She shows up and two seconds later the major bad guy from the whole movie is done in by a single batpod shot and that's it. I would've liked a grander final battle between Batman and Bane.

Also, they should've gone full Inception on the ending and just had Alfred look up and smile. No need to show Bruce and Selina sitting at the table. Just make people assume.
 
2012-08-09 07:59:58 PM

Lord Dimwit: odinsposse: thomps: i think they actually said a few months, and wayne was still poor at the end of the movie, no? i have a hard time believing that a sympathetic board would move that quickly to wrest control from him especially given the circumstances.

They weren't sympathetic. There was a guy who was already trying to wrest control of the company away from Wayne. Him and his followers were looking for any excuse and they got one.

I'm not sure if Wayne is poor at the end. He faked his own death so I doubt it really matters.

Actually...did Wayne fake his own death? Batman fakes his own death, but when did Bruce Wayne die?


We do see a tombstone for Wayne in the denouement.
 
2012-08-09 08:13:13 PM

Sail The Wide Accountancy: Batman is barely canonical in the comics too. Dare I bring up Red Rain?


Just to nit-pick, that is part of the Elseworlds non-canon stuff.
 
2012-08-09 08:28:25 PM

bulldg4life: Also, they should've gone full Inception on the ending and just had Alfred look up and smile. No need to show Bruce and Selina sitting at the table. Just make people assume.


Well they set up that scene at the beginning, they had to have a payoff. Otherwise, Bruce could have just sent some emails telling Alfred and Lucious that he was alive. The only reason he didn't was for that scene.
 
2012-08-09 08:36:32 PM
Yeah, but you get the hint with Bruce Wayne's ID for the autopilot software patch. And, from earlier in the movie, you have Alfred going to a cafe and looking up smile/nod. Leave it at that. From the point where you see Batman take a deep breath 5 seconds before the bomb explodes, there is no need to show Batman or Bruce for the rest of the movie.

Showing Bruce nod at Alfred is only for the same nitwits that won't admit that Tony Soprano is killed at the end of the TV show.
 
2012-08-09 08:42:14 PM

AdolfOliverPanties: I read people like that dumb fark Harry Knowles complaining that Nolan completely screwed up what Batman or Bruce Wayne would have done. Yeah, well, tough shiat. These weren't laughable glitzy crap like the Schumacher films, and bizarre and fun yet completely stupid ones like Burton's. Nolan made his movies have much more of a tether to reality than most superhero stories.

I loved all three of the Nolan Batman films. The only problem I had with this one was Bane sounding like John Rhys-Davies doing a book-on-tape.


So we can suspend our disbelief for bullshiat flying tanks, but Bane using drugs, now that's too out of this world.
 
2012-08-09 08:53:25 PM

bulldg4life: Yeah, but you get the hint with Bruce Wayne's ID for the autopilot software patch. And, from earlier in the movie, you have Alfred going to a cafe and looking up smile/nod. Leave it at that. From the point where you see Batman take a deep breath 5 seconds before the bomb explodes, there is no need to show Batman or Bruce for the rest of the movie.


I don't know, Alfred was such a blubbering crybaby through the whole film and him actually bumping into Bruce at the end was such a coincidence that I think it did have to be sort of spelled out or it would just be assumed that he was just having a senile hallucination.
 
2012-08-09 08:59:36 PM

Mugato: Alfred was such a blubbering crybaby


Yeah, I didn't like that. He seemed perfectly fine telling Bruce to burn down the forest in the previous movie...but now he's worried.

Of course, I really don't like how Batman went from a little injured at the end of TDK to a crippled has-been in 8 years...while he recovered from a broken back in 5 months.
 
2012-08-09 09:01:51 PM

bulldg4life: Mugato: Alfred was such a blubbering crybaby

Of course, I really don't like how Batman went from a little injured at the end of TDK to a crippled has-been in 8 years...while he recovered from a broken back in 5 months.


Bruce Wayne becomes crippled from his injuries.

The Goddamn Batman can survive a nuclear blast.

/You didn't really think that he ejected, did you?
//He SWAM to Italy and Selina met him there.
 
2012-08-09 09:03:44 PM

DamnYankees: The more I think about the movie, the more I love it. The problems with it have nothing to do with plot holes, though.


I'm having the opposite problem. The more I think about the movie, the less I like it. I saw Spider-man the same weekend and liked Spider-man way more. The only thing that Batman had on Spider-man was that Spider-man was yet another origin story that I think we're all tired of. But other than that Spider-man wins in every category from plot to dialog to soundtrack to comic relief. And this is from a guy that thinks TDK is the best movie of all time, pretty much perfect in every way.
 
2012-08-09 09:06:06 PM

jonny_q: And this is from a guy that thinks TDK is the best movie of all time, pretty much perfect in every way.


I'd say that is probably part of the issue. I mean, TDK was awesome. So, how does the sequel possibly live up to that? We know the story ends somehow and everybody knows it is some sort of death or Bruce passing "Batman" on.

If we go in to TDKR thinking that TDK was pretty much perfect in any way, I just don't see how we can expect the last movie to be something other than a bit of a let down
 
2012-08-09 09:08:29 PM
Dark Knight Rises was farking over rated, Prometheus was a better film.
 
2012-08-09 09:09:27 PM
I find it odd people say Nolan's Batman films should be like it is in the comics.

Why?

You never hear biatching of this magnitude with the Arkham games or when DC hires a team to do their own take on the character and his world.
 
2012-08-09 09:13:47 PM

jonny_q: DamnYankees: The more I think about the movie, the more I love it. The problems with it have nothing to do with plot holes, though.

I'm having the opposite problem. The more I think about the movie, the less I like it. I saw Spider-man the same weekend and liked Spider-man way more. The only thing that Batman had on Spider-man was that Spider-man was yet another origin story that I think we're all tired of. But other than that Spider-man wins in every category from plot to dialog to soundtrack to comic relief. And this is from a guy that thinks TDK is the best movie of all time, pretty much perfect in every way.


Ugh. I saw Spiderman this weekend. It has everyone I like. Andrew Garfield? Awesome. Martin Sheen? Love. Emma Stone? I don't have the words. But it was just. so. bland. Oy.
 
2012-08-09 09:13:55 PM

jonny_q: I saw Spider-man the same weekend and liked Spider-man way more


Really? With all the griping I did about the minutia of the film, TDKR at least tried to tell a story and had real character moments and some surprises. Spider-Man was just a cynical by-the-numbers run through made only so that Sony could avoid giving the rights of the property back to Marvel.
 
2012-08-09 09:16:20 PM

Kaybeck: I find it odd people say Nolan's Batman films should be like it is in the comics.

Why?

You never hear biatching of this magnitude with the Arkham games or when DC hires a team to do their own take on the character and his world.


I for one only had a problem with Two-Face. I thought all the other villains were fine despite not following the source material at all. Most were better than their comic book brethren.
 
2012-08-09 09:19:08 PM

bulldg4life: If we go in to TDKR thinking that TDK was pretty much perfect in any way, I just don't see how we can expect the last movie to be something other than a bit of a let down


I tried not to get my hopes up...

I couldn't understand Bane half the time. That's partly the fault of the theater I was in. The scene where Bane breaks Batman's back - and we knew this was coming from the comics and such - was so poorly framed you could barely tell what was going on. The lighting was poor too (that was part of the scene), but this was supposed to be a very gripping, emotional part of the movie. But how do they end this intense, emotional scene? With a close-up of Anne Hathaway mildly gasping with her hand over her mouth.

I loved that Scarecrow was putting on mock trials, but it would have been made more me if his lines were amped up a bit with a little more crazy. He was just too tame during those scenes.

Spider-man on the other hand had awesome panoramic, colorful city shots, both in daytime and nighttime. The use of piano music during some of the more action-oriented scenes caught me off guard and I loved it. The first-person view of spiderman was awesome, and they didn't stick with it ad nauseum, panning smoothly out to a third-person view of Spider-man landing on the side of a building. And Stan Lee's cameo was priceless in this one.

I could rant forever.. and I don't want to be that guy... Batman is my favorite superhero for a bunch of reasons, but it's really sucks that it's the third best superhero movie so far this year.
 
2012-08-09 09:21:56 PM

jonny_q: I loved that Scarecrow was putting on mock trials, but it would have been made more me if his lines were amped up a bit with a little more crazy. He was just too tame during those scenes.


Well, had Heath still been around...I'd assume that would be A+ perfect job for the Joker
 
2012-08-09 09:22:56 PM

Mugato: Really? With all the griping I did about the minutia of the film, TDKR at least tried to tell a story and had real character moments and some surprises. Spider-Man was just a cynical by-the-numbers run through made only so that Sony could avoid giving the rights of the property back to Marvel.


You may have a point (or two, even) but Batman was more predictable.

DamnYankees: Ugh. I saw Spiderman this weekend. It has everyone I like. Andrew Garfield? Awesome. Martin Sheen? Love. Emma Stone? I don't have the words. But it was just. so. bland. Oy.


My only gripe in that respect is that Martin Sheen shat all over his most emotional, pivotal line in the movie. I'll concede to predictable, but I otherwise didn't think it was "bland"
 
2012-08-09 09:26:39 PM
So, without having yet seen it (I got a lot of stuff going on and don't get out to the movies much):

Does Fark love or not love this movie?

It's always interesting (to me) to find out the answer to that ...
 
2012-08-09 09:29:17 PM

jonny_q: You may have a point (or two, even) but Batman was more predictable.


Really? I didn't know that Wayne would lose his fortune, that Catwoman would turn out to be a sympathetic character, that that one chick was actually Talia al Ghul and that Batman didn't die at the end. Spider-Man however, was beat by beat predictable before I bought the ticket, not even counting that we saw at least half of it before 10 years ago.
 
2012-08-09 09:29:21 PM

Skwrl: So, without having yet seen it (I got a lot of stuff going on and don't get out to the movies much):

Does Fark love or not love this movie?

It's always interesting (to me) to find out the answer to that ...


While the consensus thus far trends toward a positive reception, the official Internet opinion has not yet been finalized.
 
2012-08-09 09:32:29 PM

Skwrl: Does Fark love or not love this movie?


Well I'd like to think that I'm not part of the Fark collective, that resistance is futile but I liked it a lot, despite its flaws. I think it was a more ambitious movie story-wise than The Avengers but probably not as entertaining. But it was miles ahead of Spider-Man.
 
2012-08-09 09:33:02 PM

Mugato: jonny_q: You may have a point (or two, even) but Batman was more predictable.

Really? I didn't know that Wayne would lose his fortune, that Catwoman would turn out to be a sympathetic character, that that one chick was actually Talia al Ghul and that Batman didn't die at the end. Spider-Man however, was beat by beat predictable before I bought the ticket, not even counting that we saw at least half of it before 10 years ago.


I hate accusation of 'predictability', because they are always so narrow. Take, for example, the scene where Batman fights Bane in the sewers. How to examine it from a perspective of 'predictability'?

Most people would think "will Bane break his back?" If yes, that makes the scene predictable. If no, not.

But that's not film! Film is so much more than that. You want to know why that scene was incredibly unpredictable?

I didn't predict Nolan would not use a music cue.
I didn't predict he would take this moment to really let Wayne, as a character, fight to the limit.
I didn't predict Bane would say the brilliant line "victory has defeated you".
I didn't predict this would be one of the most raw scenes of fear I'd have in the theaters all year, as we really begin to understand that Batman is going to lose.

TDKR was anything but 'predictable', if you understand that plot has very, very little to do with the meaning of that term.
 
2012-08-09 09:33:50 PM

Skwrl: Does Fark love or not love this movie?


I think we're basically nitpicking over whether it's a 3/5 star or 4/5 star movie. I don't know anyone that says it was flawless (except for a few less geeky, casual fans) or people that hate it (except non-geeks it's not intended for)
 
2012-08-09 09:38:02 PM

DamnYankees: I didn't predict Bane would say the brilliant line "victory has defeated you".


Hot fark I would I would have understood that line. It would have been better for me. I'm still not crazy about that scene, though.

Regarding predictability... There was nearly 30 minutes of the movie I spent thinking "Ok, here's part where they chant and he fails the climb two more times before he miraculously succeeds" I'll say that Liam Neeson was a pleasant surprise during that part of the movie.
 
2012-08-09 09:41:36 PM

DamnYankees: TDKR was anything but 'predictable', if you understand that plot has very, very little to do with the meaning of that term.


One of the parts that came out of the blue was when Batman 'returned' for the first time and just drove around like an asshole for a while then flew around on his Batcopter. I was thinking, "what a farking stupid, pointless series of events," when Alfred chewed him out for being a jackass.
 
2012-08-09 09:44:16 PM

jonny_q: Regarding predictability... There was nearly 30 minutes of the movie I spent thinking "Ok, here's part where they chant and he fails the climb two more times before he miraculously succeeds" I'll say that Liam Neeson was a pleasant surprise during that part of the movie.


Well yeah, of course he was going to make it on the third try without the rope and of course there was going to be a montage of him training and homo-erotically running on the beach with Ra's al Ghul's ghost (I may be mixing some of this up with Rocky 3) and he'd defeat Bane at the end but I mean the larger picture, the major story points weren't as predictable as The Avengers or Spider-Man.
 
2012-08-09 09:45:49 PM
Okay, if he was in the League of Shadows and wanted to destroy Gotham, why didn't he just, you know, destroy Gotham?

In Batman Begins, the League of Shadows is shown to be a vigilante organization that wants to destroy Gotham because it is corrupt and lawless.

In the Dark Knight Rises, the League of Shadows wants to destroy Gotham, because, well, fark Bruce Wayne. Fark that guy.
 
2012-08-09 09:57:24 PM

sendtodave: Okay, if he was in the League of Shadows and wanted to destroy Gotham, why didn't he just, you know, destroy Gotham?

In Batman Begins, the League of Shadows is shown to be a vigilante organization that wants to destroy Gotham because it is corrupt and lawless.

In the Dark Knight Rises, the League of Shadows wants to destroy Gotham, because, well, fark Bruce Wayne. Fark that guy.


Fulfilling the ambition of Ra's Al Ghul was an excuse. Vengeance against Bruce Wayne was the goal.
 
2012-08-09 10:01:52 PM

Dimensio: Fulfilling the ambition of Ra's Al Ghul was an excuse. Vengeance against Bruce Wayne was the goal.


So, really, Bane, Ra's great pupil, and Talia, his own daughter, destroyed the very meaning of his life's work, turning the League into just another mercenary group.

Good for them!
 
2012-08-09 10:09:27 PM

sendtodave: Dimensio: Fulfilling the ambition of Ra's Al Ghul was an excuse. Vengeance against Bruce Wayne was the goal.

So, really, Bane, Ra's great pupil, and Talia, his own daughter, destroyed the very meaning of his life's work, turning the League into just another mercenary group.

Good for them!


Ras was using the league like it had always been used. From the shadows.
His daughter was "too extreme", and set about wrecking the place openly with guns and bombs.

The leagues whole founding point was that Gotham (a civilization at the peak of decadence, like Rome and London) had to fall. That never changed.
They just disagreed on method.
 
2012-08-09 10:13:09 PM
I paid my money,
I was entertained,
I was promised nothing more
I expect nothing else.
 
2012-08-09 11:26:28 PM

jonny_q: I loved that Scarecrow was putting on mock trials, but it would have been made more me if his lines were amped up a bit with a little more crazy. He was just too tame during those scenes.


I loved that he was in all 3 movies but agree, he was tamed down far too much in the last 2.

He was more of an ankle biter miniature than the big dog that barks all night and growls when you walk by. An annoyance to be swatted aside, that is all. Could have been much more, but the persistence was appreciated.

jonny_q: I couldn't understand Bane half the time. That's partly the fault of the theater I was in. The scene where Bane breaks Batman's back - and we knew this was coming from the comics and such - was so poorly framed you could barely tell what was going on. The lighting was poor too (that was part of the scene), but this was supposed to be a very gripping, emotional part of the movie. But how do they end this intense, emotional scene? With a close-up of Anne Hathaway mildly gasping with her hand over her mouth.


Yes, poor quality did ruin some of the film for me as well. When it comes out on BR, it'll be like seeing it for the first time. I just wanted to see it to avoid the spoiler effect. Couldn't hardly get on fark without so many spoilers.

Some of the things with dark scenes, you never know if it's the theater set-up or not. Some places negligently leave filters on for other digital formats and whatnot. I'm reserving judgement until I see it in HD that I can control. Good point on the actual drama and characters though, was a bit of a sub-par moment all around.

Mugato: There's really no reason to be a dick.


You got caught blatantly making shiat up in an effort to belittle other people's opinions.

I'm the dick? Look in a mirror lately?

In fact, what you did was so dick-like, I'll re-cap, you know, so you stop being a denialist:

Mugato: He gathered fragments from the part of the bullet that you don't touch while loading the gun and got a fingerprint from it?


simplyaboutguns.com
img.photobucket.comimg.photobucket.com
 
2012-08-09 11:37:07 PM

omeganuepsilon: n fact, what you did was so dick-like, I'll re-cap, you know, so you stop being a denialist:Mugato: He gathered fragments from the part of the bullet that you don't touch while loading the gun and got a fingerprint from it?


Heh, I use my hard-on for that. Maybe you use your thumb
 
2012-08-09 11:59:33 PM
Spiderman is my favorite superhero and I really enjoyed the new spiderman, first time in a movie spiderman has actually fought like spiderman, they didn't try to force in every single spiderman character into one movie, the villian didn't look like a power ranger, etc etc. Having said that, I think I enjoyed TDKR more, although I did see it in a proper IMAX and had none of the issues with it being too dark that some people are complaining about. There were only two lines of Bane's that I couldn't understand the first time through and I was able to catch both of them the second time around. Best Bane line has to be when he sets his hand on Daggett "do you feel in control?"
 
2012-08-10 12:00:00 AM
i486.photobucket.com
They also left out the scenes where he was pumping himself full of steroids.
 
2012-08-10 12:09:08 AM

Dr Dreidel: <SPOILER>
And to be Batman's redemption, but she was so totally half-assing the "criminal" part of being Catwoman (you know, what with the laserlike focus on wiping out her history) that she seems more like one of the cops trapped under the city than an integral part of the story. Her purpose was to validate Bruce's desire to not be Batman any more.
</SPOILER>


I really liked that she was already over her past to some degree while leading Bruce, in whatever way, away from his. Her role basically seemed to be to remind him he was still alive, and not to let something he used to be control his entire life. She seemed to be in a similar situation, where she just wanted her past to be her past so she could start a new life.

Plus, it gave her character the motivation to love Bruce Wayne for what he could do for her. He was able to make their pasts go away, and start over as whoever they wanted to be.

That's how I took it anyway. Maybe I missed something, but I just thought the whole movie was set up where they wanted the same thing even if their methods were completely different how they achieved them. He was born rich, she had to steal for what she had. He didn't kill, she was happy to use guns. Yin/Yang or something.

Overall, I thought it worked as a Batman/Catwoman movie. It felt like Bain was only there because they needed a bad guy to make it about.
 
2012-08-10 12:21:28 AM

RoyBatty: omeganuepsilon: n fact, what you did was so dick-like, I'll re-cap, you know, so you stop being a denialist:Mugato: He gathered fragments from the part of the bullet that you don't touch while loading the gun and got a fingerprint from it?

Heh, I use my hard-on for that. Maybe you use your thumb


So many options....

That's only because the thimble fits right on the tip of it.

or

I honestly never thought of that, but the doctor said to not over extend my arms or lift anything heavy.

or

So the tuna can reference your mom made wasn't only about the shape of it?

or

Of course I use my thumbs, I don't want to flatten the rounds.

/indecisive when it comes to penis jokes
 
2012-08-10 12:35:06 AM

limboslam: They also left out the scenes where he was pumping himself full of steroids.


I never really heard of Tom Hardy before TDKR, but I don't remember any Bane like person in Inception.

That could be because Hardy was wearing 3" heels in TDKR, but I was wondering where the stories were of how Hardy bulked up.
 
2012-08-10 12:57:51 AM

cgraves67: Here's the thing I don't get about Bane:

If he's a denizen of that decrepid hole-in-the-ground prison, which is apparently in some mysterious Asian location, why does he sound like he's doing a bad Sean Connery impersonation?


Considering that Sean Connery once played a Spaniard by way of Japan with a Scottish accent, I think you just answered your own question.

/mmmmummmm merrhen dummish permission to die.
 
2012-08-10 03:15:24 AM
There are certain franchises that I'm typically a purist fanboy for... And Batman is one of them.

Having said that, I don't see why people give the Nolan trilogy a hard time. He took creative liberties with the characters to make them more believable... big deal. Taken as separate properties, all three of the movies work. They just do. Taken as a single entity, the trilogy is a masterpiece.

SPOILERS

I've always thought of Bane as a stretch. I remember thinking that the Knightfall storyline didn't make sense. Bane came straight out of left field (well, Santa Prisca, but close enough) and picked Batman's world apart. With the venom, he always had the power to destroy Batman physically, but instead opted to wear him down, destroy him mentally, and force an ultimate confrontation, where honestly, Bane should have killed him. If anything, Nolan makes this work better in TDKR, and the vengeance plot adds better justification for leaving him alive and broken. Mixing the plot from TDKR and Knightfall, killing Wayne's Batman allows Jean-Paul Valley's more violent Batman freer reign to destroy everything Wayne built (further validating what would be the League of Shadows' overall goal), rather than allowing Bruce Wayne to recover and reclaim the cowl. If anything, comic book Bane was more of an empty plot device for DC to capitalize on the early 90's craze of killing off superheroes. Nolan's Bane has more character depth as an executive lieutenant to Talia al-Ghul in a two-hour movie than original comic Bane had over the entire run of Knightfall as a medical experiment -turned- criminal mastermind.

The often-mentioned gripe about why the League of Shadows didn't just destroy Gotham is probably the easiest one to counter. The League needed the world to see Gotham in chaos. It wasn't enough to destroy the city. They had to be an example. All three movies shared this thread of needing Gotham in an anarchical state. Scarecrow's toxin as weaponized fear and Joker's plot to have citizens or prisoners destroy one another work equally as a vehicle for the League of Shadows to put Gotham on trial. If Joker succeeds in getting "civilized" Gothamites to succumb to mass murder, it further validates the condemnation Ra's al-Ghul and the League had already decided in Batman Begins. In TDKR, Bane takes over the city, gives the citizens false hope of rescue or renewal, and lets the city devolve into that anarchy while the rest of the world watches helplessly. If anything, this plot better demonstrates what the League had in mind because it isn't chemically-induced, but driven solely by human nature.

As far as the prison imagery, why is it so far-fetched to think that a group of wretched, broken men would trust in a leap of faith for their salvation, rather than using technological means at their disposal for their escape? This is already a reality where a man dressed as a bat can easily hide his identity by using cough drop voice and a mask that doesn't even cover his whole face, and few people even blink to wonder where he gets those wonderful toys. Is it really that much of a stretch to think that a group of prisoners, put there by an organization as fanatical as the League of Shadows, and a man who inspires so much fear and respect as to command a comrade to plummet to his death in a broken aircraft, would do little more than simply go through the motions? There are already terror groups that inspire much more fear in people than that. If you really stop and think about it, most of civilized humanity does the exact same thing... plod along day-to-day, trusting in those little leaps of faith. It's an allegory to Bruce Wayne/Batman's entire existence, which is really the point people seem to miss when they're picking it apart. Batman was broken long before Bane put him in that pit. He needed to hit rock bottom, while his watching his entire world descended into chaos, simply so he could climb back out of the hole. It's clumsy imagery in a character property built on the back of clumsy imagery, yet people seem to still miss it.

I know I'm reading too much into this... Sue me. I thought the trilogy was an amazing interpretation.
 
2012-08-10 04:41:13 AM

bulldg4life: I thought it was kinda lame that Talia showed up only at the very end. She shows up and two seconds later the major bad guy from the whole movie is done in by a single batpod shot and that's it. I would've liked a grander final battle between Batman and Bane.


But she had to show up in some form or another. She was the only one who knew where the reactor was. As soon as bane('s henchmen) breached the wall and decided to bombify the thing, you should have known that she was evil.
 
2012-08-10 08:44:35 AM

DamnYankees: thecpt: Lord Dimwit: "and why would that give you any power over me?"

I think the line was "do you really feel like you're in control"

Yeah his motivations were weak sauce but I still really liked him and thought he inspired fear.

I saw it again yesterday. The exact lines were:

Dagget: I've paid you a very large amount of money!
Bane: ...and this gives you power over me?


I saw it a second time recently and there's also a bit of Talia foreshadowing... before this line is said, when Talia meets Dagget at Bruce's ball, when he tries to hit on her she says something about "all your money and the power you think it buys you." Very similar to the line you quoted, just rearranged.
 
2012-08-10 09:17:32 AM

Lord Dimwit: SPOILERS

I gotta admit, I couldn't feel anything for Bane. I couldn't get what his motivation was. Okay, if he was in the League of Shadows and wanted to destroy Gotham, why didn't he just, you know, destroy Gotham? They could've set that bomb off at any time and their mission would've been accomplished. Why wait the extra months where they just let Gotham go to hell? And I feel like the reasoning behind Bane's mask was pretty silly (and also that when it was disconnected he just kinda laid there - I would've expected screaming or something).

To be honest, I always thought the League of Shadows storyline was silly to begin with. The Dark Knight was so good in part because the Joker was a believable villain.


As he explains to Bruce in the prison, a sliver of hope is the ultimate hell. The hope of escaping the prison/the hope of revolution for the citizens in Gotham is torture because neither will come to pass. Bane wants the absolute worst for Bruce and Gotham.
 
2012-08-10 09:27:33 AM

RoyBatty: limboslam: They also left out the scenes where he was pumping himself full of steroids.

I never really heard of Tom Hardy before TDKR, but I don't remember any Bane like person in Inception.

That could be because Hardy was wearing 3" heels in TDKR, but I was wondering where the stories were of how Hardy bulked up.


He was already pumped up pretty big for Warrior, although he put on another 30 lbs. for Bane.

collider.com

Talk about a physical transformation, this was him 10 years ago.

img.photobucket.com

Pretty good article here.
 
2012-08-10 09:44:58 AM

Shazam999: thomps: Karac: thomps: Karac: Makh: I could gripe but I'd rather snark and say that for this movie, all of Batman's problems could have been solved by Iron Man in 5 minutes. (That's including travel time.)

Yeah, but Bruce Wayne doesn't have any superpowers the way Iron Man does.

i dunno, he's got that magic rope that fixes backs. that's something.

OK, so Batman has a magical chiropractor. Iron Man has the superpower of a comic book sized bank account. He could have just paid the prisoners to lift him out of that hole like a cheerleader at the top of a pyramid.

so that stock exchange break-in that bankrupted bruce wayne thing was the most annoying part of that movie to me. why would they not back out every transaction that happened while they were hacked into the exchange network? didn't they do that a few years ago after that "fat finger" flash crash?

They mentioned it in passing - the transactions would get reversed within a few days, but Wayne would be in the poor in the meantime.


Maybe they faked the timestamp on the Wayne transactions and did some other dummy transactions so that they would remove the dummy ones instead of the real ones.
 
2012-08-10 09:47:14 AM

tallguywithglasseson: Lucius Fox: "Autopilot. I said, BRUCE, THE AUTOPILOT. Let's talk more about the autopilot and how that doesn't work even though it's completely irrelevant at the moment. BRUCE! Are you listening? I'm FORESHADOWING here! Not even the most oblivious audience member could possibly miss this, for when we do the fake death later..." [turns to camera] "Or could they?"


Titty sprinkles.

/oblig
 
2012-08-10 09:48:55 AM

omeganuepsilon: I vote for off his rocker. He is a fairly unhinged character mentioned bluntly in all 3 movies. I don't know about dual personalities, but different persona's where he has to act a certain way(he does go on at length about what batman is as if it's somewhat separate from him


I think you just don't understand the movies at all. The Dark Knight goes to great lengths discussion how "batman" isn't a person it is a concept. How the idiot masses need heroes and villains to cope with reality. That is why Bruce talks about "the batman" as a person removed from himself. He is just the vessel for the concept. He doesn't act for himself, he acts for the common good.

It is kind of a messianic complex, but he is a reluctant messiah for the people of Gotham.
 
2012-08-10 09:51:47 AM

thomps: i think they actually said a few months, and wayne was still poor at the end of the movie, no? i have a hard time believing that a sympathetic board would move that quickly to wrest control from him especially given the circumstances.


Technically they don't say, but he is "dead" at the end of the movie so of course he doesn't have money. I believe in the conversation he has with Alfred about seeing him in that cafe someday there is mention of hidden European bank accounts.
 
2012-08-10 09:57:43 AM

TexanBoy: For me the thing I hated most was all the Bane overdubs they used. Like in the plane at the beginning, he sounds like he's in a studio, using his "inside voice." But he's talking in a ripped-in-half plane, instead of shouting over all the wind noise. And pretty much everywhere he talked, it sounded like that. Really took me out of the movie in a way I've never been taken out before...

I also lol'ed at "WHERE'S THE TRIGGER!!" But mostly cuz of the face Bale makes.


That is because they did use a studio voice dub. The original cut it was too hard to understand him, so they pumped up the voice.
 
2012-08-10 10:06:07 AM
I could have done a little more with the back story of Bane's leadership of the League of Shadows, I felt the most impressive thing about him was his men's unquestionable loyalty to him. IMHO the best line of the movie was during the beginning where Bane says "No, they'll expect one of us in the wreckage brother" and his guy just sort of nods and prepares to die so that the authorities find a body.

Also, one thing that still irks me is the final scene, I didn't understand why they needed a huge brawl between the freed cops and Bane's men. It seems like a stealthy approach to disabling the bomb would be better, but if lets say you wanted a distraction or something, when you're divying up teams I feel like Batman should have been put on "team track down the nuclear bomb and deploy the jamming device" vs "team riotous mob and punching people in the face".
 
2012-08-10 10:08:20 AM
DerAppie: bulldg4life: I thought it was kinda lame that Talia showed up only at the very end. She shows up and two seconds later the major bad guy from the whole movie is done in by a single batpod shot and that's it. I would've liked a grander final battle between Batman and Bane.

But she had to show up in some form or another. She was the only one who knew where the reactor was. As soon as bane('s henchmen) breached the wall and decided to bombify the thing, you should have known that she was evil.


It was even sooner than that. She slept with Bruce, after his 8 years of wallowing in self pity.

But Nolan didn't do enough make the viewer think she was the romantic interest, ala Rachel in the first two. She was in too many scenes, gets some booty, but nothing really develops beside her getting close to the machine which she's been harping on since the beginning. Talk about lights and sirens.

I knew as soon as she slept with Wayne that she was either going to be Banes right hand woman, or the reverse. Was pretty sure she'd reveal herself as Talia, but there wasn't any foreshadowing of that.
 
2012-08-10 10:12:36 AM

Bullseyed: omeganuepsilon: I vote for off his rocker. He is a fairly unhinged character mentioned bluntly in all 3 movies. I don't know about dual personalities, but different persona's where he has to act a certain way(he does go on at length about what batman is as if it's somewhat separate from him

I think you just don't understand the movies at all. The Dark Knight goes to great lengths discussion how "batman" isn't a person it is a concept. How the idiot masses need heroes and villains to cope with reality. That is why Bruce talks about "the batman" as a person removed from himself. He is just the vessel for the concept. He doesn't act for himself, he acts for the common good.

It is kind of a messianic complex, but he is a reluctant messiah for the people of Gotham.


So, I don't understand, but you go on to paraphrase me....

Whatever dude.

Sane people don't put on that kind of complex at great personal cost/injury. He is unhinged. Hell, people equate normal eccentricity as crazy as a loon, this guy pretty much throws himself in front of a moving train on a regular basis, and you think that's completely rational?
 
2012-08-10 10:18:55 AM

TyrantII: DerAppie: bulldg4life: I thought it was kinda lame that Talia showed up only at the very end. She shows up and two seconds later the major bad guy from the whole movie is done in by a single batpod shot and that's it. I would've liked a grander final battle between Batman and Bane.

But she had to show up in some form or another. She was the only one who knew where the reactor was. As soon as bane('s henchmen) breached the wall and decided to bombify the thing, you should have known that she was evil.

It was even sooner than that. She slept with Bruce, after his 8 years of wallowing in self pity.

But Nolan didn't do enough make the viewer think she was the romantic interest, ala Rachel in the first two. She was in too many scenes, gets some booty, but nothing really develops beside her getting close to the machine which she's been harping on since the beginning. Talk about lights and sirens.

I knew as soon as she slept with Wayne that she was either going to be Banes right hand woman, or the reverse. Was pretty sure she'd reveal herself as Talia, but there wasn't any foreshadowing of that.


Apart from all the comics and cartoons saying Raz had a daughter, not a son?
 
2012-08-10 10:19:14 AM

bulldg4life: jonny_q: I loved that Scarecrow was putting on mock trials, but it would have been made more me if his lines were amped up a bit with a little more crazy. He was just too tame during those scenes.

Well, had Heath still been around...I'd assume that would be A+ perfect job for the Joker


There is zero chance that the Joker would play second fiddle to any other villain.
 
2012-08-10 10:27:13 AM

DamnYankees: Most people would think "will Bane break his back?" If yes, that makes the scene predictable. If no, not.


Most people don't read comic books and had no idea that the comic book version of this story resulted in that outcome.

If you pay attention during the "healing rope" scene you'd know that he did not break batman's back, but rather caused a slipped disk.
 
2012-08-10 10:33:30 AM

jonny_q: DamnYankees: I didn't predict Bane would say the brilliant line "victory has defeated you".

Hot fark I would I would have understood that line. It would have been better for me. I'm still not crazy about that scene, though.

Regarding predictability... There was nearly 30 minutes of the movie I spent thinking "Ok, here's part where they chant and he fails the climb two more times before he miraculously succeeds" I'll say that Liam Neeson was a pleasant surprise during that part of the movie.


The first time they showed someone fail the jump I thought "the rope is too short... if they took off the rope they'd make it".
 
2012-08-10 10:34:41 AM

DerAppie: Apart from all the comics and cartoons saying Raz had a daughter, not a son?


That recollection clicked in a little late for me.
I didn't read many of the comics, but the animated series did do a league of shadows arc where batman had a thing with the daughter.

/Didn't help that the magic Chiropractor kept referencing the boy and didn't seem to identify him with the Bane he worked on.
/Altho I think its Batman that made the bad connection.
/Nolans Bruce Wayne is alot more ninja than detective.
 
2012-08-10 12:02:43 PM

Bullseyed: jonny_q: DamnYankees: I didn't predict Bane would say the brilliant line "victory has defeated you".

Hot fark I would I would have understood that line. It would have been better for me. I'm still not crazy about that scene, though.

Regarding predictability... There was nearly 30 minutes of the movie I spent thinking "Ok, here's part where they chant and he fails the climb two more times before he miraculously succeeds" I'll say that Liam Neeson was a pleasant surprise during that part of the movie.

The first time they showed someone fail the jump I thought "the rope is too short... if they took off the rope they'd make it".


It's not the length of the rope that caused him to fail. It's the security that it provides that makes him unable to jump the gap. He needs the fear of death to help him succeed, as stated by the old man.
 
2012-08-10 02:09:42 PM

Falco09: Bullseyed: jonny_q: DamnYankees: I didn't predict Bane would say the brilliant line "victory has defeated you".

Hot fark I would I would have understood that line. It would have been better for me. I'm still not crazy about that scene, though.

Regarding predictability... There was nearly 30 minutes of the movie I spent thinking "Ok, here's part where they chant and he fails the climb two more times before he miraculously succeeds" I'll say that Liam Neeson was a pleasant surprise during that part of the movie.

The first time they showed someone fail the jump I thought "the rope is too short... if they took off the rope they'd make it".

It's not the length of the rope that caused him to fail. It's the security that it provides that makes him unable to jump the gap. He needs the fear of death to help him succeed, as stated by the old man.


Yeah I saw the movie, herp dur.

Physics says you can jump further without the rope. Friction and all of that. The "OH EM GEE EMOOOOTIONS" stuff that passes for science these days isn't real.
 
2012-08-10 02:33:01 PM

Bullseyed: Falco09: Bullseyed: jonny_q: DamnYankees: I didn't predict Bane would say the brilliant line "victory has defeated you".

Hot fark I would I would have understood that line. It would have been better for me. I'm still not crazy about that scene, though.

Regarding predictability... There was nearly 30 minutes of the movie I spent thinking "Ok, here's part where they chant and he fails the climb two more times before he miraculously succeeds" I'll say that Liam Neeson was a pleasant surprise during that part of the movie.

The first time they showed someone fail the jump I thought "the rope is too short... if they took off the rope they'd make it".

It's not the length of the rope that caused him to fail. It's the security that it provides that makes him unable to jump the gap. He needs the fear of death to help him succeed, as stated by the old man.

Yeah I saw the movie, herp dur.

Physics says you can jump further without the rope. Friction and all of that. The "OH EM GEE EMOOOOTIONS" stuff that passes for science these days isn't real.


But those are the best part!!!!!
 
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