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(Daily Kos)   Anyone remember the DHS report on right-wing extremism? Just asking. No real reason   (dailykos.com) divider line 115
    More: Followup, right-wing extremism, DHS, diplomatic note, Fast Forward, extremisms, Gary Ackerman, Health Care, International, Radical Islam  
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7231 clicks; posted to Politics » on 06 Aug 2012 at 5:56 PM (2 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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Archived thread
2012-08-06 02:34:23 PM  
7 votes:

cman: Grand standing of "I told you so" does not befit you, Kos, like it does not befit anyone else who does it


We don't have to grandstand. We can investigate right wing extremists.
2012-08-06 02:23:00 PM  
5 votes:
Lets not let ONE Neo Nazi give all Neo Nazis a bad name.
2012-08-06 02:16:23 PM  
5 votes:

ginandbacon: I wonder if anyone has any regrets about quashing it.


That would require a conscience.
2012-08-06 03:19:11 PM  
4 votes:

ShawnDoc: GAT_00: Nonsense, just because there are two incidents of it two days in a row doesn't mean Christian extremists are a threat.

2 incidents? The shooter at the Sikh temple and ?


Mosque burned down in Missouri.

I'd also include a Christian who demanded that all LGBT people be put to death in Mississippi and a state Constitutional Amendment set to pass by a wide margin in Missouri that bans non-Christian teaching.

I am so farking sick of Christians. You can't say the fundamentalists aren't the majority when fundamentalist Christian law is set to pass on the state level.
2012-08-06 03:10:50 PM  
4 votes:

Nadie_AZ:

Well, then they'd do to their Christian movement what they are doing to the GOP- redefine what it is to be Christian and non-Christian and divide themselves further and further. There is no way in hell my mormon homophobic bigoted aunt is ever going to accept a southern baptists view on things or acquiesce to their rules.


welcome to the past 2000 years of history. we've been killing one another over various/sundry gods for a long time now. that said, the US has been able to largely avoid massive disruptions due to religions conflicts. well, at least as far as recent history goes. But...we're starting to see a shift among religions fundies in the US - they're getting more desperate.
2012-08-06 02:37:22 PM  
4 votes:
and this is before the possible arson at the missouri mosque today.
2012-08-06 02:17:00 PM  
4 votes:
Bush had a lot of years to educate these assholes, but, instead, he chose to exploit and capitalize on their hatred by stoking their ignorance and fear.
2012-08-06 02:11:43 PM  
4 votes:
White Supremacists determined to strike in US.
2012-08-06 03:05:20 PM  
3 votes:

FlashHarry: and this is before the possible arson at the missouri mosque today.


It's going to get worse, sadly.

As pointless of an exercise as I see religion to be, I would never terrorize any group or individual's right to practice their religion in America. And, that's what makes me (and hopefully most Americans) better than the worthless, bedwetting cowards who resort to shooting up temples or burning down mosques or blowing up churches. There should be no room in America for people who do these things because we, as a nation, need to be better than that.

Unfortunately, we're currently not better, and with several Conservative politicians' rhetoric helping to fuel these terrorists, we're never going to be better.
2012-08-06 02:45:36 PM  
3 votes:

cman: Grand standing of "I told you so" does not befit you, Kos, like it does not befit anyone else who does it


"By observing that they were racist wrong, you are actually the one who is racist wrong."

Is there nothing this rebuttal can't do?
2012-08-07 01:51:59 AM  
2 votes:
Why are conservatives so violent?

www.apfn.org

upload.wikimedia.org

i.huffpost.com

sfist.com

msnbcmedia2.msn.com

Partial list of recent right-wing killers:

* Jim D. Adkisson, the "I hate liberals" shooter, who killed 2 and injured several when he shot up a liberal Unitarian church.
* Timothy McVeigh, registered Republican and anti-government nut case killed 168 Americans when he blew up a federal building.
* Joseph Paul Franklin, right-wing serial murderer who targeted minorities including Democrats Larry Flynt in 1978 and Vernon Jordan.
* Anders Breivik, Norwegian right-wing anti-muslim nut case who blew up a building and killed 69 sons and daugthers of liberal politicians.
* James Von Brunn, the holocaust museum shooter and white supremecist believed the media and gov't was controlled by jews
* Byron Williams, was on his way to killing liberals at the Tides Foundation and the ACLU before being stopped by cops.
* Timothy Johnson, walked into a Democrat Party headquarters and murdered the State Chair of the Democratic Party of Arkansas, Bill Gwatney, a man he had never met!
* Ted Kaczynski, aka the Unabomber killed several through cowardly mail bombs. His manifesto is riddled with hatred of liberals.
* Richard Poplawski, believed that jews controlled the media and that Obama was going to take his guns and shot dead three cops sent to evict him from mommy's home
* Bruce and Joshua Turnidge, father and son team and anti-government nut case "Patriots" bombed a bank and killed two police officers.
* Keith Luke, thought that the white race was dying off, raped a women, killed her sister, and shot dead a homeless man. He planned to kill as many blacks, hispanics, and jews as he could.
* Jerry and Joseph Kane, father and son team and Aryan church members killed two cops and injured two others in a traffic stop.
* Joseph Ray Stack, angry anti-tax protester flies a plane into an IRS building.
* John Patrick Bedell, anti-governemnt liberterian conspiracy theorist attemped to kill dozens at the Pentagon but was shot dead after injuring two.
* Shawna Forde, leader of the Minuteman American Defense group shot dead Raul Flores and his 9 year old daugther. The wife surved by playind dead.
* Bruce Ivins, suspected of mailing anthraz spores to two Democratic US Senators and several "liberal media" outlets, killing 5 and infecting 17 others.
* Eric Rudolph, anti-abortion murderer
* Michael Griffin, anti-abortion murderer
* Paul Hill, anti-abortion murderer and christian preacher
* John Salvi, anti-abortion murderer
* James Kopp, anti-abortion murderer
* Scott Roeder, anti-abortion murderer


The right wing needs to tone down the violence.
2012-08-06 09:19:55 PM  
2 votes:

cabbyman: Has anyone mentioned that the amount of violence displayed in this incident is literally a weekly occurrence in Chicago?


Yeah, who gives a fark if a bunch of Sikh's got shot by a deranged white supremecist. Some black people in Chicago got shot this weekend!

/sarcasm btw
2012-08-06 08:19:09 PM  
2 votes:

Aarontology: GAT_00: I'm not killing people. I think if these people stopped legislating their beliefs, they stopped persecuting, I wouldn't care. Im perfectly happy to live along side everyone, but not when i have to wonder what it will take for my neighbor to start demanding laws that will throw me in jail. But as long as they are trying to install a religious theocracy, as long as they have majority support, I think I have every right to care.

You can care all you want. I never said otherwise.

But when you flat out admit your bigotry towards all Christians, your statements that you'll be happy to live alongside them ring hollow. But since you've normalized your hatred for them and justified it, I don't think you'll ever not see them as oppressors waiting to come get you.

Also, when you say things like "But I do wonder quite a lot about what I can do to stop these people, and I wish I could think of a good answer. Well, besides falling to the last refuge of the incompetent that is. I'd like to think there is, but I can't figure it out."

It kinda makes it seem like you're at least considering violence. Because that kinda sounded like a freeper post against Muslims.


What if a person's 'bigotry' towards Christians is based in the fact that a belief in an imaginary sky wizard is demonstratively stupid, and makes it difficult to take them seriously? Couple that with the tendency of Christians in America to want to legislate based on made up stories from a 2000 year old death cult, and you've got fertile ground for what you might term 'bigotry.' However, true bigotry is based on traits which cannot be altered - race, gender, sexual preference, etc. A Christian most certainly can stop being a Christian at any point in time. Therefore the argument is against his BELIEFS, not who he is as a person.

You might look at it as not liking someone for a personality flaw which isn't fixed... they could work on it and become a better person if they wanted, but they don't see the problem so they do not change.
2012-08-06 07:34:46 PM  
2 votes:

dameron: When Obama wins, the far right will go into an apoplectic rage. I mean, these are the people who said Clinton, a white, chubby, good old boy from Arkansas who was nicknamed "Bubba", was a murdering, drug dealing pederast.

Can you imagine what they'll come up with when the black guy named Hussein wins a second term? I think someone will take a shot at him. I hope I'm wrong. But if you read the mainstream conservative websites comments sections you'll see that kind of talk is commonplace.


Yeah, you gotta wonder what will go through the minds of people who are now saying, "If Barack HUSSEIN Obama wins reelection, the United States is over. We're done as a country."

Really? It's all over? So . . . um . . . whatcha gonna do? Sounds like we're in desperate times and have nothing to lose, if you catch my drift . . .

But yeah, I hope we're wrong.
2012-08-06 07:28:08 PM  
2 votes:

dameron: When Obama wins, the far right will go into an apoplectic rage. I mean, these are the people who said Clinton, a white, chubby, good old boy from Arkansas who was nicknamed "Bubba", was a murdering, drug dealing pederast.

Can you imagine what they'll come up with when the black guy named Hussein wins a second term? I think someone will take a shot at him. I hope I'm wrong. But if you read the mainstream conservative websites comments sections you'll see that kind of talk is commonplace.


I will seriously cry if that happens. He's trying, as hard as a politician can try for gods sake. He has to fight a republican controlled congress, the richest and most powerful corporations in america, racism, and the farking CHURCHES to pass legislation that is common place in other civilized countries of the world.
2012-08-06 07:25:58 PM  
2 votes:

edmo: Captain Steroid: Yes. :-(

My dad keeps sending me dumb emails about how Muslims kill all these people. I need a good list of Christians killing epopel to return to him. Shouldn't be hard to come up with this year.


www.christopher-columbus.eu

www.traditioninaction.org

www.sonofthesouth.net

www.adonde.com

edu.glogster.com

www.flyingchariotministries.com
2012-08-06 07:13:28 PM  
2 votes:

Sgt Otter: ShawnDoc: rufus-t-firefly: And besides - Kos didn't tell you so. The Department of Homeland Security did, and you scoffed. SCOFFED, I say.

Not just scoffed, but created such a backlash that the report was retracted.

[img.photobucket.com image 778x653]

There was also a similar DHS report on left-wing extremists. Funny how that one didn't generate more butthurt than a Penn State locker room.


Maybe because liberals don't like left-wing extremists so they didn't complain. It was the right-whingers who wallowed in a persecution-complex over the report.
2012-08-06 07:12:14 PM  
2 votes:

vernonFL: White Supremacists determined to strike in US.


Terrifying.

What's even more distressing is the aspects of the apocalyptic hard-right that seem to be gaining footholds in the discourse. Remember when torture was being openly debated? It seems to me unimaginably barbaric and obscene for this to even be a discussion topic. And the way the right has cynically tapped into "dark side" of populisim on the one hand -- feeding on hate, alienation/atomism, furthering political hostility and social antagonisms for short-term electoral advantage -- also seems very dangerous in this light. The fact that any meaningful leftist analysis is completely absent from the debate today I think is the last element that makes the powderkeg we are in truly disastrous: the debate today is between a vaguely unified center and a hard-right nativist abyss. There is no muscular leftist opposition that is capable of gaining any traction; maybe this is a symptom that our democracy has simply been thoroughly dissolved by capital. We can begin rehabilitate a legitimate politics once we have surmounted the corruption of our institutions. The strange problem is that there is no real will to do this -- nobody wants to actually deal with the actual problems of regulation and accountability in large-scale social instutions, whether in the public or the private spheres.

/We need massive overhauls everywhere, not just in health or finance.
2012-08-06 06:50:22 PM  
2 votes:

Aarontology: I don't think you'll ever not see them as oppressors waiting to come get you.


I can't speak for GAT, but this doesn't seem fair. Where exactly do you draw the line between "justifiable hatred" and "unjustifiable bigotry". Can you think of anyone in this country today that just might be rightly pissed off about very real oppression? Maybe they know enough about history to be scared as well.

I see a country where the Christians are increasingly demanding that their beliefs be codified into law and they're getting it. They call for the deaths of homosexuals, torch mosques and take rights away from women -- and nobody, not even the so-called "moderate Christians", stands in their way or shouts them down.
How far does it need to go before he's not a 'bigot' anymore, but was one of the first to see the writing on the wall? What if they really are oppressors coming to get us? What if you're in the next shot-up theater, or torched health clinic, or bombed federal building?
2012-08-06 06:29:46 PM  
2 votes:
House Minority Leader John Boehner called the report "Offensive and Unacceptable" and demanded an "explanation for why she has abandoned using the term 'terrorist' to describe those, such as al Qaeda, who are plotting overseas to kill innocent Americans, while her own Department is using the same term to describe American citizens who disagree with the direction Washington Democrats are taking our nation."

Muslim terrorists = evil, should be killed or locked up

Christian terrorists = just misunderstood and only want to put America back on the "right" direction

/I think I threw up a little reading that quote from him.
2012-08-06 06:22:20 PM  
2 votes:

GAT_00: I'd also include a ChristianMississippi State Rep. Andy Gipson(R) who demanded that all LGBT people be put to death in Mississippi


FTFY...
2012-08-06 06:14:53 PM  
2 votes:

Aarontology:

I don't understand why you're hiding from your admitted bigotry.


IANAL, but doesn't bigotry require hating someone for who they are (gay, black, female, etc.)? That's how I've always used it.

I don't see how it would apply to hating someone for what they do.
2012-08-06 06:14:11 PM  
2 votes:
"We came unarmed THIS time"
"2nd Amendment Solutions"
...shucks, we were just joking about those, we didn't' think anybody took them seriously.
2012-08-06 03:57:38 PM  
2 votes:

Aarontology: GAT_00: Aarontology: GAT_00: Aarontology: GAT_00: Aarontology: GAT_00: I am so farking sick of Christians. You can't say the fundamentalists aren't the majority when fundamentalist Christian law is set to pass on the state level.

Someone once said that freedom of speech isn't the freedom to hate.

Well it still is officially so as long as I'm being oppressed I'm free to hate.

Gonna burn down a church or something? Your words about Christians are eerily similar to Michelle Bachmann's words about Muslims.

I don't want to, and I have no intent on doing so.

But I do wonder quite a lot about what I can do to stop these people, and I wish I could think of a good answer. Well, besides falling to the last refuge of the incompetent that is. I'd like to think there is, but I can't figure it out.

Well, I'd suggest voting, but the vast majority of people who run for office are Christians, and you hate them so that's not an option. Still, I wonder why you mock the people who hate Obama because of his race when you clearly hate him because of his faith.

I haven't been a fan of the President for a while. But while he hasn't tried to, at least to a large degree, legislate his religion, I can't help but wonder if he would under the right conditions. As I see it, any Christian isn't that far off from fundamentalism. They all go off the same book after all.

His religion is down the list for why I don't like him though.

Well then I don't understand why you particularly care which party wins. Both of them are vastly majority Christian, and you believe there's no difference between any Christian.

Still, I do appreciate you being so candid about your bigotry. It's refreshing to see someone being honest about their hatred. I do wonder hwy you find it acceptable to spew hate speech though, while you condemn others for saying essentially the same thing.

Must be one of those "It's ok when I do it, even if it goes against my own core beliefs" things like those Christians you hate so much. You're more alike than you realize.


I'm not killing people. I think if these people stopped legislating their beliefs, they stopped persecuting, I wouldn't care. Im perfectly happy to live along side everyone, but not when i have to wonder what it will take for my neighbor to start demanding laws that will throw me in jail. But as long as they are trying to install a religious theocracy, as long as they have majority support, I think I have every right to care.
2012-08-06 03:53:06 PM  
2 votes:

eraser8: Nadie_AZ: Clinton had the crazies imagining the UN dropping troops all over in black helicopters and taking guns away and putting people in prison camps. On and on. I remember because I believed it.

Serious question: WHY?


Eh, old story of me being very conservative and very religious. I was born and raised mormon. I believed all of it. Couple that with finding Rush Limbaugh and AM Radio at just the right age and being married to someone from a rural town. And there you go.

/I got better
2012-08-06 03:47:26 PM  
2 votes:

GAT_00: Weaver95: GAT_00:

But I do wonder quite a lot about what I can do to stop these people, and I wish I could think of a good answer. Well, besides falling to the last refuge of the incompetent that is. I'd like to think there is, but I can't figure it out.

education and making sure you let the religious nutballs have a public forum in which to rant to any/all who want to listen. education is important because you can show people why it's a bad idea to vote for religious crazy people and a public forum because when the religious nutters are ranting you know they're not quietly building a bomb in their backyards or stockpiling ammo for a murder spree.

There is no evidence that these people lose votes when they speak.


Romney sure seems to be losing votes.
2012-08-06 03:35:33 PM  
2 votes:

Aarontology: GAT_00: Aarontology: GAT_00: I am so farking sick of Christians. You can't say the fundamentalists aren't the majority when fundamentalist Christian law is set to pass on the state level.

Someone once said that freedom of speech isn't the freedom to hate.

Well it still is officially so as long as I'm being oppressed I'm free to hate.

Gonna burn down a church or something? Your words about Christians are eerily similar to Michelle Bachmann's words about Muslims.


I don't want to, and I have no intent on doing so.

But I do wonder quite a lot about what I can do to stop these people, and I wish I could think of a good answer. Well, besides falling to the last refuge of the incompetent that is. I'd like to think there is, but I can't figure it out.
2012-08-06 03:35:16 PM  
2 votes:

dameron: When Obama wins, the far right will go into an apoplectic rage. I mean, these are the people who said Clinton, a white, chubby, good old boy from Arkansas who was nicknamed "Bubba", was a murdering, drug dealing pederast.

Can you imagine what they'll come up with when the black guy named Hussein wins a second term? I think someone will take a shot at him. I hope I'm wrong. But if you read the mainstream conservative websites comments sections you'll see that kind of talk is commonplace.


all I know is that the secret service has their hands full keeping Obama safe from religious nutballs and right wing fanatics who just wanna kill the black man in the white house. that, my friends, is a thankless job and i'm glad they're doing it.
2012-08-06 03:33:01 PM  
2 votes:
When Obama wins, the far right will go into an apoplectic rage. I mean, these are the people who said Clinton, a white, chubby, good old boy from Arkansas who was nicknamed "Bubba", was a murdering, drug dealing pederast.

Can you imagine what they'll come up with when the black guy named Hussein wins a second term? I think someone will take a shot at him. I hope I'm wrong. But if you read the mainstream conservative websites comments sections you'll see that kind of talk is commonplace.
2012-08-06 03:23:16 PM  
2 votes:

Nadie_AZ:

No, I know. I just tire of the whole 'we are a christian nation' argument in which they demand we all be christians. The moment you ask them to define it, it goes to a pile of shiat, derp and aborted fetuses.


the 'we are a christian nation' people offend me on an almost genetic level. that is a demonstrably false allegation and it's something on a dominionist theologian would make up. it implies that ONLY christians are valid citizens of the US and that just pisses me the hell off.
2012-08-06 03:22:17 PM  
2 votes:

GAT_00: I am so farking sick of Christians. You can't say the fundamentalists aren't the majority when fundamentalist Christian law is set to pass on the state level.


Someone once said that freedom of speech isn't the freedom to hate.
2012-08-06 03:21:18 PM  
2 votes:

Weaver95: Nadie_AZ:

Well, then they'd do to their Christian movement what they are doing to the GOP- redefine what it is to be Christian and non-Christian and divide themselves further and further. There is no way in hell my mormon homophobic bigoted aunt is ever going to accept a southern baptists view on things or acquiesce to their rules.

welcome to the past 2000 years of history. we've been killing one another over various/sundry gods for a long time now. that said, the US has been able to largely avoid massive disruptions due to religions conflicts. well, at least as far as recent history goes. But...we're starting to see a shift among religions fundies in the US - they're getting more desperate.


No, I know. I just tire of the whole 'we are a christian nation' argument in which they demand we all be christians. The moment you ask them to define it, it goes to a pile of shiat, derp and aborted fetuses.
2012-08-06 03:17:03 PM  
2 votes:

ShawnDoc: GAT_00: Nonsense, just because there are two incidents of it two days in a row doesn't mean Christian extremists are a threat.

2 incidents? The shooter at the Sikh temple and ?


the suspected arson at a missouri mosque today. try to keep up.
2012-08-06 03:07:01 PM  
2 votes:

cman: Grand standing of "I told you so" does not befit you, Kos, like it does not befit anyone else who does it


Not so much "I told you so" as "maybe we ought to go back and look into this evident problem that the right wing shut down with a 1000 db whinefest when it was first suggested".
2012-08-06 02:59:59 PM  
2 votes:
Republicans objected to the fact that the majority of their tea bag supporters are a fringe group.
2.bp.blogspot.com
2012-08-06 02:47:21 PM  
2 votes:

ShawnDoc: rufus-t-firefly: And besides - Kos didn't tell you so. The Department of Homeland Security did, and you scoffed. SCOFFED, I say.

Not just scoffed, but created such a backlash that the report was retracted.


img.photobucket.com

There was also a similar DHS report on left-wing extremists. Funny how that one didn't generate more butthurt than a Penn State locker room.
2012-08-06 02:43:42 PM  
2 votes:

rufus-t-firefly: And besides - Kos didn't tell you so. The Department of Homeland Security did, and you scoffed. SCOFFED, I say.


Not just scoffed, but created such a backlash that the report was retracted.
2012-08-06 02:32:16 PM  
2 votes:

cman: Grand standing of "I told you so" does not befit you, Kos, like it does not befit anyone else who does it


Except that people like cman are always saying "Kos? WHAAARGARBL."

And besides - Kos didn't tell you so. The Department of Homeland Security did, and you scoffed. SCOFFED, I say.
2012-08-06 02:23:01 PM  
2 votes:

Vodka Zombie: Bush had a lot of years to educate these assholes, but, instead, he chose to exploit and capitalize on their hatred by stoking their ignorance and fear.


Um, I wouldn't blame him for this. Clinton had the crazies imagining the UN dropping troops all over in black helicopters and taking guns away and putting people in prison camps. On and on. I remember because I believed it. But they were upset about a 'New World Order'- in a speech given by George HW Bush. Anyways, they are the ones that bought the yellow magnets and trumpeted their patriotism the loudest after 9/11.

Their anger was turned towards 'them', no matter who they were. Remember 'you are either with us or you are against us'? That's eaten up by these people. Well, they'd spent 7 years being pissed off at muslim fascist democratic socialist terrorists when Obama was elected. With all the mis-information being passed around, these people turned it up to a 9. You only see a few of these guys going to 11 (JT Ready, this guy in Wisconsin), but they are there and they are jacked. And they preceded Bush.
2012-08-06 02:14:25 PM  
2 votes:
I wonder if anyone has any regrets about quashing it.
2012-08-07 03:59:12 AM  
1 votes:

Sabyen91: bk3k: Sabyen91: bk3k: Bush always controlled the message to rein these xenophobes in.

Oh, bullshiat. He had one cute little speech about Muslims. That is all.

Its pretty well known the right wing message/propaganda talking points gets assembled/controlled/distributed behind the scenes. They all have the exact same thing to say at exactly the same time - pretty well every time. I mainly mean the talking heads, but their politicians tend to follow suit closely.

Now if you need evidence of the Bush administration doing this - look at what was said during their term versus what is openly said now. It is very clearly gotten much worse. In fact, the change was just about instant. Consider his connections to the Saudi family(for example), and you can see his motivations in doing this.

These wingers have ALWAYS been this hateful/xenophobic, but during his term where not (publicly) this brazen in showing their hatred. I don't mean your neighbor/coworker/etc - I mean the talking heads. The people who clearly control the message - and through the message - the thought processes of so many Americans.

So yes, he/his administration had these nutjobs on a leash. The comparison then-to-now clearly shows this.

I really hate how people give Bush a pass now that he is not in power. He was a horrible person and a horrible president. I know it is natural to give him a pass now that he has no power but no...he was farking horrible and caused hundreds of thousands of deaths.


Oh I agree on all points that he was a HORRIBLE president - and illegitimately "elected" in the first place. He did so very many things wrong, and assembling a complete/comprehensive list could take solid weeks of free time. I'm so very not interested in giving him a "free pass." But consider that when there is so very much LEGITIMATE material to criticize him on, that hitting him on probably the only half-decent thing he ever did is absolutely needless and just senseless. It muddies the water and de-legitimizes his critics.

Yes, his horrible presidency should never be forgiven. You absolutely are correct to shiat on his administration, but lets stick to the facts. Thanks.
2012-08-07 03:31:38 AM  
1 votes:

mrshowrules: Nobodyn0se: mrshowrules: cabbyman: Has anyone mentioned that the amount of violence displayed in this incident is literally a weekly occurrence in Chicago?

More Americans died of accidental shootings since 9/11 than on 9/11. Compare the news coverage on that gem.

An incident involving thousands of people dying at the same time on national television got more press coverage than a series of accidents in which random people died one at a time?!?!?!

THE HORROR!111111

You missed my point. I was reflecting the lameness of the original point.


I get it. Let me try:

Every three years, more Americans are strangled to death by their own bedsheets then were killed by terrorists on 9/11. Where's the outrage?

Nope, doesn't work. Crib death isn't funny, and we should do more to prevent it, though we perhaps shouldn't go as far as banning bedding. But by the same token, there are far more accidental firearms deaths each year than there should be, including kids shooting other kids while playing with their parents' guns, fathers shooting sons while hunting together, etc. Better education and stricter regulation could prevent many of these deaths. So your attempt at satire doesn't quite work either.
2012-08-07 03:30:35 AM  
1 votes:

Sabyen91: bk3k: Bush always controlled the message to rein these xenophobes in.

Oh, bullshiat. He had one cute little speech about Muslims. That is all.


Its pretty well known the right wing message/propaganda talking points gets assembled/controlled/distributed behind the scenes. They all have the exact same thing to say at exactly the same time - pretty well every time. I mainly mean the talking heads, but their politicians tend to follow suit closely.

Now if you need evidence of the Bush administration doing this - look at what was said during their term versus what is openly said now. It is very clearly gotten much worse. In fact, the change was just about instant. Consider his connections to the Saudi family(for example), and you can see his motivations in doing this.

These wingers have ALWAYS been this hateful/xenophobic, but during his term where not (publicly) this brazen in showing their hatred. I don't mean your neighbor/coworker/etc - I mean the talking heads. The people who clearly control the message - and through the message - the thought processes of so many Americans.

So yes, he/his administration had these nutjobs on a leash. The comparison then-to-now clearly shows this.
2012-08-07 01:13:45 AM  
1 votes:

theorellior: It's really weird how everyone has piled on to GAT_00 for some reason in the last couple of weeks. While I don't always share his views I've never come across him saying anything that would strike me as any more authoritarian or weird than any of the regulars to the Politics Tab who aren't in the League of FAIL™. Maybe it's his stance on gun control? Sometimes I think gun people just need to understand that others don't share their passion for weapons.


He also isn't much of a 1st amendment fan. And is a Penn State apologist.
2012-08-06 10:19:40 PM  
1 votes:
img839.imageshack.us

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2012-08-06 09:49:52 PM  
1 votes:
You guys(some of you) got it lucky. These crazy right wingers are easy to spot and usually have only small support groups within a community.

I, however, live in the heart of Dixie and I could throw a rock into a crowd and hit ten people who think this Wisconsin nutbag is a martyr.
2012-08-06 09:48:10 PM  
1 votes:

mrshowrules: cabbyman: Has anyone mentioned that the amount of violence displayed in this incident is literally a weekly occurrence in Chicago?

More Americans died of accidental shootings since 9/11 than on 9/11. Compare the news coverage on that gem.


An incident involving thousands of people dying at the same time on national television got more press coverage than a series of accidents in which random people died one at a time?!?!?!

THE HORROR!111111
2012-08-06 09:01:42 PM  
1 votes:

Mikey1969: GAT_00: I'd also include a ChristianMississippi State Rep. Andy Gipson(R) who demanded that all LGBT people be put to death in Mississippi

FTFY...


He was using bible verses to justify it, so yes, he was a christian using christian doctrine to justify LGBT people be put to death in Mississippi.
2012-08-06 08:54:55 PM  
1 votes:

timmmmah!: Aarontology: GAT_00: I'm not killing people. I think if these people stopped legislating their beliefs, they stopped persecuting, I wouldn't care. Im perfectly happy to live along side everyone, but not when i have to wonder what it will take for my neighbor to start demanding laws that will throw me in jail. But as long as they are trying to install a religious theocracy, as long as they have majority support, I think I have every right to care.

You can care all you want. I never said otherwise.

But when you flat out admit your bigotry towards all Christians, your statements that you'll be happy to live alongside them ring hollow. But since you've normalized your hatred for them and justified it, I don't think you'll ever not see them as oppressors waiting to come get you.

Also, when you say things like "But I do wonder quite a lot about what I can do to stop these people, and I wish I could think of a good answer. Well, besides falling to the last refuge of the incompetent that is. I'd like to think there is, but I can't figure it out."

It kinda makes it seem like you're at least considering violence. Because that kinda sounded like a freeper post against Muslims.

What if a person's 'bigotry' towards Christians is based in the fact that a belief in an imaginary sky wizard is demonstratively stupid, and makes it difficult to take them seriously? Couple that with the tendency of Christians in America to want to legislate based on made up stories from a 2000 year old death cult, and you've got fertile ground for what you might term 'bigotry.' However, true bigotry is based on traits which cannot be altered - race, gender, sexual preference, etc. A Christian most certainly can stop being a Christian at any point in time. Therefore the argument is against his BELIEFS, not who he is as a person.

You might look at it as not liking someone for a personality flaw which isn't fixed... they could work on it and become a better person if they wanted, but they don't ...


I'm bigoted towards anyone who is stupid. Because I can't take them seriously. And I believe this post falls into that category.
2012-08-06 08:54:41 PM  
1 votes:

Cletus C.: But seriously, white supremacists are like radiation. Not even their mothers love them. They sometimes get a missing-teethed, abused-by-father, firth-grade dropout babe to fight over but they're hated. By everybody.


I can't tell if you're being sarcastic (which would mean you actually like white supremacists) or if you're doing one of those 5th-grade-esque course reversals in a desperate attempt to keep everyone from thinking you're an idiot.
2012-08-06 08:45:33 PM  
1 votes:

intelligent comment below:

The difference between left extremists and right extremists is the left throws paint on fur and torches parking lots full of SUVs while the right assassinates and tortures.


Wait. I thought "not doing what a Republican wants you to do for him/her right now" qualified as extremism from the left.
2012-08-06 08:34:04 PM  
1 votes:
I'll just leave this here.

Link
2012-08-06 08:22:23 PM  
1 votes:

Chimperror2: There were plenty of OWS arrests. Remember the bridge bombers? Sorry, but if OWS can deny violence even while they actively support the violence makers then surely those that disavow violence AND the people that actively engage in it have more moral authority to condemn it. Remember kids, Loughner and Holmes are left wingers but they somehow lose their tag when they pull a trigger. Not because they aren't left-wingers but because left-wingers dislike being painted with the broad brush they use for the right.



That's funny considering OWS kicked them out for wanting to incite violence. But keep farking that chicken

Loughner was a gold standard government conspiracy theorist nut libertarian

I have no idea what Holmes was but if you can find proof of his political leanings good luck with that

The difference between left extremists and right extremists is the left throws paint on fur and torches parking lots full of SUVs while the right assassinates and tortures.
2012-08-06 08:15:03 PM  
1 votes:

Mrbogey: intelligent comment below: So you're saying a report is useless if it doesn't describe 100% of the threats? You should volunteer your services to the FBI

"Be on the look out for a white male 6'2" with a moustache."

*Find 5'6" hispanic man with moustache*

"Well at least we got the moustache part right! Derp de doo!"



Because that's exactly what a report on extremists is designed for... could you be any more of an idiot?
2012-08-06 08:07:43 PM  
1 votes:

ginandbacon: I wonder if anyone has any regrets about quashing it.


Quashing it? Those people are probably going to launch a Congressional investigation as to why this patriotic white citizen had been stalked by the Feds for a decade, simply for his political beliefs.

"The argument that diversity is our strength has really never been backed up by logic." -- Steve King, R-ightarded CoQsmoker, August 2nd, 2012
2012-08-06 08:07:32 PM  
1 votes:
But seriously, white supremacists are like radiation. Not even their mothers love them. They sometimes get a missing-teethed, abused-by-father, firth-grade dropout babe to fight over but they're hated. By everybody.
2012-08-06 07:48:00 PM  
1 votes:
A bunch of blacks got shot in Chicago over the weekend, therefore we should stop worrying about a white guy shooting up a Sikh Temple...or something.

/Thought I'd get that out of the way before the "white power" contingent of Fark shows up
2012-08-06 07:40:54 PM  
1 votes:

Nadie_AZ: Vodka Zombie: Bush had a lot of years to educate these assholes, but, instead, he chose to exploit and capitalize on their hatred by stoking their ignorance and fear.

Um, I wouldn't blame him for this. Clinton had the crazies imagining the UN dropping troops all over in black helicopters and taking guns away and putting people in prison camps. On and on. I remember because I believed it. But they were upset about a 'New World Order'- in a speech given by George HW Bush. Anyways, they are the ones that bought the yellow magnets and trumpeted their patriotism the loudest after 9/11.

Their anger was turned towards 'them', no matter who they were. Remember 'you are either with us or you are against us'? That's eaten up by these people. Well, they'd spent 7 years being pissed off at muslim fascist democratic socialist terrorists when Obama was elected. With all the mis-information being passed around, these people turned it up to a 9. You only see a few of these guys going to 11 (JT Ready, this guy in Wisconsin), but they are there and they are jacked. And they preceded Bush.


Pretty much this.

I was hearing about the black helicopters coming to take ar gunz back in the early 90's when I lived in Nevada, and that was WAAAAYY before Clinton was in office. There's a reason these groups and their douchebag followers are all on the Southern Poverty Law Center's hate lists. They've been around for eons. If they're more visible now than they were then, it's only because they have a wider forum and news gets reported on faster.

That said, quashing a report because you didn't like the tone or the message has been around since Paleolithic times. Most of you all are too young to remember the "missile gap" that never existed, and which was created to avoid Johnson's temper tantrums; or the reports on the Vietcong showing they were kicking our asses in Vietnam which had to be forcibly leaked by Ellsburg well after the war; etc. etc.

None of this is new, or even surprising. It's a mainstay of my new club, the Cassandra Club.
2012-08-06 07:39:42 PM  
1 votes:

intelligent comment below: If a Democrat said the rich should have their money and land taken from them, and something happens to it, I'd say they are indeed hate preachers who enabled some lunatic.


INB4: "Democrats do say that! THEY WANT TO RAISE TAXES ONE MILLION PERCENT ON THE RICH! WEALTH REDISTRIBUTIONGARRRBLL!"
2012-08-06 07:28:39 PM  
1 votes:

Cletus C.: Therefore, whistle, whistle, Sarah Palin shot those people in WIsconsin, just like she shot that congresswoman in Arizona.

Do I have that right?



I love how you make valid points, then realize your mistake and where it's leading you, so you have to create this strawman to pretend it invalidates what you said above it

If you preach hate of Muslims, then some Mosque's get torched, don't pretend you aren't an enabler of violence.
2012-08-06 07:11:01 PM  
1 votes:

Captain Steroid: Yes. :-(


My dad keeps sending me dumb emails about how Muslims kill all these people. I need a good list of Christians killing epopel to return to him. Shouldn't be hard to come up with this year.
2012-08-06 07:07:35 PM  
1 votes:

sabreWulf07: Aarontology: I don't think you'll ever not see them as oppressors waiting to come get you.

I can't speak for GAT, but this doesn't seem fair. Where exactly do you draw the line between "justifiable hatred" and "unjustifiable bigotry". Can you think of anyone in this country today that just might be rightly pissed off about very real oppression? Maybe they know enough about history to be scared as well.

I see a country where the Christians are increasingly demanding that their beliefs be codified into law and they're getting it. They call for the deaths of homosexuals, torch mosques and take rights away from women -- and nobody, not even the so-called "moderate Christians", stands in their way or shouts them down.
How far does it need to go before he's not a 'bigot' anymore, but was one of the first to see the writing on the wall? What if they really are oppressors coming to get us? What if you're in the next shot-up theater, or torched health clinic, or bombed federal building?


I take issue with none of those concerns when it comes to dealing with (groups of) people who actually fit that description.

What I do object to is reducing this kind of oppression to the religion itself, as if it is a necessary and inevitable result of religious belief. There are almost as many traditions of scriptural interpretation as there are chapters in the Bible, and even many of those allow for considerable sway between moderate and hardline views. There is no one-to-one correlation between what is on the page and what message the reader receives, and that goes for any text. What is for one person a literal command to kill non-believers might be for another person an allegorical exhortation to extinguish sin in one's own soul.

Now, don't take me as white-knighting for American Christianity here. The church, broadly speaking, in this country has some very serious problems with bigotry and oppression. I'd argue that a majority of Christians here are indeed much closer to being oppressors than benign believers. But, again, reducing it to the religion or the Bible itself is simply disingenuous.
2012-08-06 06:33:37 PM  
1 votes:

Mrbogey: Kos diarists are dumb.

The DHS profile didn't fit the anarchists who targeted that bridge. It didn't fit Loughner. It didn't fit Holmes. It didn't fit Hassan. In fact, this guy didn't use any sort of organization to carry out his attack... and he was a veteran in that he was drummed out 14 years ago... so it really doesn't fit this guy.

Keep humping that chicken Kos.



So you're saying a report is useless if it doesn't describe 100% of the threats? You should volunteer your services to the FBI

Yeah white terrorists aren't a real problem in America, nothing to see here, just evil libtards humping that chicken.
2012-08-06 06:32:35 PM  
1 votes:

WizardofToast: McVeigh was not just someone that disagreed with Clinton's politics.



Don't tell that to Boehner. Any white guy who does violent acts against America just disagrees with the direction Washington Democrats are taking OUR nation.
2012-08-06 06:31:08 PM  
1 votes:

intelligent comment below: House Minority Leader John Boehner called the report "Offensive and Unacceptable" and demanded an "explanation for why she has abandoned using the term 'terrorist' to describe those, such as al Qaeda, who are plotting overseas to kill innocent Americans, while her own Department is using the same term to describe American citizens who disagree with the direction Washington Democrats are taking our nation."

Muslim terrorists = evil, should be killed or locked up

Christian terrorists = just misunderstood and only want to put America back on the "right" direction

/I think I threw up a little reading that quote from him.


McVeigh was not just someone that disagreed with Clinton's politics.
2012-08-06 06:26:12 PM  
1 votes:

Aarontology: GAT_00: I'm not killing people. I think if these people stopped legislating their beliefs, they stopped persecuting, I wouldn't care. Im perfectly happy to live along side everyone, but not when i have to wonder what it will take for my neighbor to start demanding laws that will throw me in jail. But as long as they are trying to install a religious theocracy, as long as they have majority support, I think I have every right to care.

You can care all you want. I never said otherwise.

But when you flat out admit your bigotry towards all Christians, your statements that you'll be happy to live alongside them ring hollow. But since you've normalized your hatred for them and justified it, I don't think you'll ever not see them as oppressors waiting to come get you.

Also, when you say things like "But I do wonder quite a lot about what I can do to stop these people, and I wish I could think of a good answer. Well, besides falling to the last refuge of the incompetent that is. I'd like to think there is, but I can't figure it out."

It kinda makes it seem like you're at least considering violence. Because that kinda sounded like a freeper post against Muslims.


Honestly, I have a hard time with this statement. Why do I have to support/stand/deal with/tolerate people who believe that I am going to hell and that my life choices are wrong (in my case I'm a single dad, i have sex outside of marriage, i support LGBT rights, etc)?

I do tolerate them but only b/c I feel that it's the right thing to do to let people believe what they want. HOWEVER : fark them if they want to take away my rights or the rights of others. They get all their goddamn tax breaks and free speech but I'm not allowed to think they are a bunch of farking pricks?

Does that make me a bigot?
2012-08-06 06:19:51 PM  
1 votes:

ShawnDoc: GAT_00: Nonsense, just because there are two incidents of it two days in a row doesn't mean Christian extremists are a threat.

2 incidents? The shooter at the Sikh temple and ?


Someone torched a mosque last night in Missouri. This is the same mosque that got torched last month.
2012-08-06 06:18:01 PM  
1 votes:
Kos diarists are dumb.

The DHS profile didn't fit the anarchists who targeted that bridge. It didn't fit Loughner. It didn't fit Holmes. It didn't fit Hassan. In fact, this guy didn't use any sort of organization to carry out his attack... and he was a veteran in that he was drummed out 14 years ago... so it really doesn't fit this guy.

Keep humping that chicken Kos.
2012-08-06 06:16:41 PM  
1 votes:

Nobodyn0se: Aarontology:

I don't understand why you're hiding from your admitted bigotry.

IANAL, but doesn't bigotry require hating someone for who they are (gay, black, female, etc.)? That's how I've always used it.

I don't see how it would apply to hating someone for what they do.


FWIW, we've been asked to let the whole thing lie. It's done.
2012-08-06 06:14:44 PM  
1 votes:
These poor Sikhs... The first "retaliation" attack after 9/11 was a Sikh, too. Some jackass in Mesa, Az shot the owner of the gas station down the street from my father in law's house, a real nice guy, and a Sikh, not a Muslim. I remember when it happened, and they originally decided that they 'weren't' going to consider it a hate crime, but apparently the little bird of reason spoke into someone's ear.

Just because they kinda look like Muslim's how are these poor deranged souls supposed to know the difference? If profiling was a bad thing, wouldn't we stop our cops from doing it as much as we can, same with people like the TSA?
2012-08-06 06:14:33 PM  
1 votes:

Weaver95: Nadie_AZ:

No, I know. I just tire of the whole 'we are a christian nation' argument in which they demand we all be christians. The moment you ask them to define it, it goes to a pile of shiat, derp and aborted fetuses.

the 'we are a christian nation' people offend me on an almost genetic level. that is a demonstrably false allegation and it's something on a dominionist theologian would make up. it implies that ONLY christians are valid citizens of the US and that just pisses me the hell off.


And that the bible supersedes the constitution.
2012-08-06 06:12:16 PM  
1 votes:
Rounding up the right wingers shouldn't be to hard, we could use the patriot act. After all keeping America safe is their number one priority.
2012-08-06 06:11:48 PM  
1 votes:
We need another
2012-08-06 05:25:21 PM  
1 votes:

Therion: Motherfarker should have followed his leader.


I'm surprised this guy didn't know most neo-Nazi orgs are populated with FBI informants.

I continued to be surprised the FBI didn't know what this guy was planning.
2012-08-06 04:47:45 PM  
1 votes:
2012-08-06 04:39:49 PM  
1 votes:

Aarontology: GAT_00: So cherry picking is the name of the game. Why do I bother with any degree of eloquence?

Then tell me what you meant by that statement. Because the last refuge of the incompetent means one thing. And saying you can't think of any other way kind of makes it seem like you've at least considered it.

I don't understand why you're hiding from your admitted bigotry. You're usually so quick and proud to proclaim it.


You never stopped to ask what I meant by it, you read what you wanted. You know where it is on the annoyance scale? Around where my annoyance is that Obama uses his hair color as a tool for speeches, not dying his hair when he was to look more serious. You know why it annoys me? Because he uses his Christianity as a weapon for politics. Not because he legislates on it. He might, but he isn't.

Of course, this won't matter. You read what you want to read, because your mind is utterly closed to anything I say. There is nothing I could say to change your mind, is there? Be honest.
2012-08-06 04:20:57 PM  
1 votes:

Aarontology: GAT_00: Now what Freeper have you ever heard talk like that? You realize you're doing the very thing you accuse me of? Dismissing me because you don't like what I'm saying? Assigning opinions to me that are not mine to discredit me?

There really isn't any other way to take "Well, besides falling to the last refuge of the incompetent that is. I'd like to think there is, but I can't figure it out." It's saying you wish you could think of another way besides violence, but you can't.

Accept it dude. You're a hateful little bigot. You've flat out said as much. Embrace it like the teabaggers do. Don't try to hide behind some BS veneer. shiat, you said one of the reasons you don't like Obama is because he's a Christian. Don't try to pretend this is about secularism. It's about your admitted bigotry and hatred.


So cherry picking is the name of the game. Why do I bother with any degree of eloquence?
2012-08-06 04:18:36 PM  
1 votes:

GAT_00: Now what Freeper have you ever heard talk like that? You realize you're doing the very thing you accuse me of? Dismissing me because you don't like what I'm saying? Assigning opinions to me that are not mine to discredit me?


There really isn't any other way to take "Well, besides falling to the last refuge of the incompetent that is. I'd like to think there is, but I can't figure it out." It's saying you wish you could think of another way besides violence, but you can't.

Accept it dude. You're a hateful little bigot. You've flat out said as much. Embrace it like the teabaggers do. Don't try to hide behind some BS veneer. shiat, you said one of the reasons you don't like Obama is because he's a Christian. Don't try to pretend this is about secularism. It's about your admitted bigotry and hatred.
2012-08-06 04:14:33 PM  
1 votes:

Aarontology: GAT_00: I'm not killing people. I think if these people stopped legislating their beliefs, they stopped persecuting, I wouldn't care. Im perfectly happy to live along side everyone, but not when i have to wonder what it will take for my neighbor to start demanding laws that will throw me in jail. But as long as they are trying to install a religious theocracy, as long as they have majority support, I think I have every right to care.

You can care all you want. I never said otherwise.

But when you flat out admit your bigotry towards all Christians, your statements that you'll be happy to live alongside them ring hollow. But since you've normalized your hatred for them and justified it, I don't think you'll ever not see them as oppressors waiting to come get you.

Also, when you say things like "But I do wonder quite a lot about what I can do to stop these people, and I wish I could think of a good answer. Well, besides falling to the last refuge of the incompetent that is. I'd like to think there is, but I can't figure it out."

It kinda makes it seem like you're at least considering violence. Because that kinda sounded like a freeper post against Muslims.


Do you're just choosing to ignore the part about where I consider violence to be the actions of the incompetent? That I don't want to have to worry about this? That I would like a law that completely removed the problem? I'd say a law already exists, but it clearly doesn't work. So i keep looking for any solution to stave off violence, to return to a place where I can actually not care about what someone else's religion is no matter what it is, because their religion can't affect me.

Now what Freeper have you ever heard talk like that? You realize you're doing the very thing you accuse me of? Dismissing me because you don't like what I'm saying? Assigning opinions to me that are not mine to discredit me?

I wish i didn't have to care, I really do. But I can't, because these people are destroying the country. So i keep looking for something, anything, to stave off destruction. Anything that can peacefully resolve. So tell me what Freeper do I sound like?
2012-08-06 04:06:30 PM  
1 votes:

eraser8: Thanks for the answer by the way, Nadie_AZ.


You are welcome.

/tom was an aberration
//i rooted for him so many times
2012-08-06 04:04:36 PM  
1 votes:

Xaxor: You never believed stupid stuff when you were young?


Sure I did.

I used to think dogs were male and cats were female...which somewhat explains why the Tom & Jerry cartoons were always a bit disturbing to me: Tom was an aberration (still better than Jerry, though).

In any case, keep in mind I wasn't doubting that Nadie_AZ believed something quite ridiculous. I wanted to know specifically what led him to believe those things. Now he's told me.

Thanks for the answer by the way, Nadie_AZ.
2012-08-06 04:04:15 PM  
1 votes:

GAT_00:
I like it when people who consistently slam me for misinterpreting their beliefs constantly make up feelings and opinions for me, and then spit out psycho babble to go along with the made up opinions.


yes...i'm sure you do.
2012-08-06 04:03:36 PM  
1 votes:

Weaver95: Aarontology: Weaver95: Aarontology:
Must be one of those "It's ok when I do it, even if it goes against my own core beliefs" things like those Christians you hate so ...

GAT_00 is very much an authoritarian so he shares a lot of similar philosophical viewpoints with religious authoritarians. That said, he's more secular than religious. he'd use a similar methodology to impose his will on others, just without the theocratic trappings.

Oh, of course. But because it's secular, he thinks his admitted bigotry and hatred is somehow better, or more justifiable Look at his "I'm oppressed so it's ok for me to hate" reasoning. It's the same thing as the whackjobs who think they're being oppressed because people are boycotting chicken joints.

it's a common failing among authoritarians - they feel a compulsion to control the behavior of others. they tell themselves that what they are doing is for a 'greater good' or that they're oppressing the rights of others because 'people can't be trusted' to behave. the more people resist, the harder the authoritarian tries to crack down on dissident opinions. Religion is just window dressing, the problem is that authoritarians need to be actively resisted...and not everyone understands what it is they're really facing.

personally, I think authoritarians just need therapy (or the number of a very understanding and discrete dominatrix).


I like it when people who consistently slam me for misinterpreting their beliefs constantly make up feelings and opinions for me, and then spit out psycho babble to go along with the made up opinions.
2012-08-06 04:01:17 PM  
1 votes:

Aarontology: Weaver95: Aarontology:
Must be one of those "It's ok when I do it, even if it goes against my own core beliefs" things like those Christians you hate so ...

GAT_00 is very much an authoritarian so he shares a lot of similar philosophical viewpoints with religious authoritarians. That said, he's more secular than religious. he'd use a similar methodology to impose his will on others, just without the theocratic trappings.

Oh, of course. But because it's secular, he thinks his admitted bigotry and hatred is somehow better, or more justifiable Look at his "I'm oppressed so it's ok for me to hate" reasoning. It's the same thing as the whackjobs who think they're being oppressed because people are boycotting chicken joints.


it's a common failing among authoritarians - they feel a compulsion to control the behavior of others. they tell themselves that what they are doing is for a 'greater good' or that they're oppressing the rights of others because 'people can't be trusted' to behave. the more people resist, the harder the authoritarian tries to crack down on dissident opinions. Religion is just window dressing, the problem is that authoritarians need to be actively resisted...and not everyone understands what it is they're really facing.

personally, I think authoritarians just need therapy (or the number of a very understanding and discrete dominatrix).
2012-08-06 03:59:42 PM  
1 votes:

cman: Nadie_AZ: eraser8: Nadie_AZ: Clinton had the crazies imagining the UN dropping troops all over in black helicopters and taking guns away and putting people in prison camps. On and on. I remember because I believed it.

Serious question: WHY?

Eh, old story of me being very conservative and very religious. I was born and raised mormon. I believed all of it. Couple that with finding Rush Limbaugh and AM Radio at just the right age and being married to someone from a rural town. And there you go.

/I got better

Dont forget about Alex Jones


Yeesh. Yeah. I feel bad for people who are so insecure that they are afraid of everything and angry at everybody else. It is sad to see.
2012-08-06 03:59:41 PM  
1 votes:
eraser8:
Serious question: WHY?


You never believed stupid stuff when you were young? Some people realize how stupid X is, and then look back wondering how they could have believed it.
2012-08-06 03:58:37 PM  
1 votes:

ShawnDoc: FlashHarry: the suspected arson at a missouri mosque today. try to keep up.

pisceandreamer: Mosque in Missouri burned to the ground this morning.

Thanks guys. This is what happens when I only get my news from the front page at fark.


i find that fark is faster than just about any news source. really. and funnier.
2012-08-06 03:56:57 PM  
1 votes:

GAT_00: I haven't been a fan of the President for a while. But while he hasn't tried to, at least to a large degree, legislate his religion, I can't help but wonder if he would under the right conditions. As I see it, any Christian isn't that far off from fundamentalism. They all go off the same book after all.

His religion is down the list for why I don't like him though


I'm not sure Obama is really such a big believer. Unfortunately, in politics in America you have to be religious.
2012-08-06 03:51:08 PM  
1 votes:

Aarontology:
Must be one of those "It's ok when I do it, even if it goes against my own core beliefs" things like those Christians you hate so ...


GAT_00 is very much an authoritarian so he shares a lot of similar philosophical viewpoints with religious authoritarians. That said, he's more secular than religious. he'd use a similar methodology to impose his will on others, just without the theocratic trappings.
2012-08-06 03:48:56 PM  
1 votes:

Nadie_AZ: Clinton had the crazies imagining the UN dropping troops all over in black helicopters and taking guns away and putting people in prison camps. On and on. I remember because I believed it.


Serious question: WHY?
2012-08-06 03:48:32 PM  
1 votes:

GAT_00: Aarontology: GAT_00: Aarontology: GAT_00: Aarontology: GAT_00: I am so farking sick of Christians. You can't say the fundamentalists aren't the majority when fundamentalist Christian law is set to pass on the state level.

Someone once said that freedom of speech isn't the freedom to hate.

Well it still is officially so as long as I'm being oppressed I'm free to hate.

Gonna burn down a church or something? Your words about Christians are eerily similar to Michelle Bachmann's words about Muslims.

I don't want to, and I have no intent on doing so.

But I do wonder quite a lot about what I can do to stop these people, and I wish I could think of a good answer. Well, besides falling to the last refuge of the incompetent that is. I'd like to think there is, but I can't figure it out.

Well, I'd suggest voting, but the vast majority of people who run for office are Christians, and you hate them so that's not an option. Still, I wonder why you mock the people who hate Obama because of his race when you clearly hate him because of his faith.

I haven't been a fan of the President for a while. But while he hasn't tried to, at least to a large degree, legislate his religion, I can't help but wonder if he would under the right conditions. As I see it, any Christian isn't that far off from fundamentalism. They all go off the same book after all.

His religion is down the list for why I don't like him though.


Well then I don't understand why you particularly care which party wins. Both of them are vastly majority Christian, and you believe there's no difference between any Christian.

Still, I do appreciate you being so candid about your bigotry. It's refreshing to see someone being honest about their hatred. I do wonder hwy you find it acceptable to spew hate speech though, while you condemn others for saying essentially the same thing.

Must be one of those "It's ok when I do it, even if it goes against my own core beliefs" things like those Christians you hate so much. You're more alike than you realize.
2012-08-06 03:47:42 PM  
1 votes:
Just remember: it's not terrorism when a white person does it.
2012-08-06 03:44:55 PM  
1 votes:

Weaver95: GAT_00:

But I do wonder quite a lot about what I can do to stop these people, and I wish I could think of a good answer. Well, besides falling to the last refuge of the incompetent that is. I'd like to think there is, but I can't figure it out.

education and making sure you let the religious nutballs have a public forum in which to rant to any/all who want to listen. education is important because you can show people why it's a bad idea to vote for religious crazy people and a public forum because when the religious nutters are ranting you know they're not quietly building a bomb in their backyards or stockpiling ammo for a murder spree.


There is no evidence that these people lose votes when they speak.
2012-08-06 03:43:03 PM  
1 votes:

Aarontology: GAT_00: Aarontology: GAT_00: Aarontology: GAT_00: I am so farking sick of Christians. You can't say the fundamentalists aren't the majority when fundamentalist Christian law is set to pass on the state level.

Someone once said that freedom of speech isn't the freedom to hate.

Well it still is officially so as long as I'm being oppressed I'm free to hate.

Gonna burn down a church or something? Your words about Christians are eerily similar to Michelle Bachmann's words about Muslims.

I don't want to, and I have no intent on doing so.

But I do wonder quite a lot about what I can do to stop these people, and I wish I could think of a good answer. Well, besides falling to the last refuge of the incompetent that is. I'd like to think there is, but I can't figure it out.

Well, I'd suggest voting, but the vast majority of people who run for office are Christians, and you hate them so that's not an option. Still, I wonder why you mock the people who hate Obama because of his race when you clearly hate him because of his faith.


I haven't been a fan of the President for a while. But while he hasn't tried to, at least to a large degree, legislate his religion, I can't help but wonder if he would under the right conditions. As I see it, any Christian isn't that far off from fundamentalism. They all go off the same book after all.

His religion is down the list for why I don't like him though.
2012-08-06 03:41:36 PM  
1 votes:

GAT_00:

But I do wonder quite a lot about what I can do to stop these people, and I wish I could think of a good answer. Well, besides falling to the last refuge of the incompetent that is. I'd like to think there is, but I can't figure it out.


education and making sure you let the religious nutballs have a public forum in which to rant to any/all who want to listen. education is important because you can show people why it's a bad idea to vote for religious crazy people and a public forum because when the religious nutters are ranting you know they're not quietly building a bomb in their backyards or stockpiling ammo for a murder spree.
2012-08-06 03:31:17 PM  
1 votes:

GAT_00: Weaver95: GAT_00:
I am so farking sick of Christians. You can't say the fundamentalists aren't the majority when fundamentalist Christian law is set to pass on the state level.

you aren't going to go out and shoot up a church or anything, are you?

I don't own a gun.


does it make you feel better or worse to know that there are a bunch of very devout christians who want to fight for your right to go out and buy a gun with no waiting period and almost zero restrictions or background checks on your purchase...?
2012-08-06 03:28:56 PM  
1 votes:

Weaver95: GAT_00:
I am so farking sick of Christians. You can't say the fundamentalists aren't the majority when fundamentalist Christian law is set to pass on the state level.

you aren't going to go out and shoot up a church or anything, are you?


I don't own a gun.
2012-08-06 03:28:36 PM  
1 votes:

Weaver95: Nadie_AZ:

No, I know. I just tire of the whole 'we are a christian nation' argument in which they demand we all be christians. The moment you ask them to define it, it goes to a pile of shiat, derp and aborted fetuses.

the 'we are a christian nation' people offend me on an almost genetic level. that is a demonstrably false allegation and it's something on a dominionist theologian would make up. it implies that ONLY christians are valid citizens of the US and that just pisses me the hell off.


Man... It's nice to see at least TWO people share my feelings.
2012-08-06 03:28:21 PM  
1 votes:

Aarontology: GAT_00: I am so farking sick of Christians. You can't say the fundamentalists aren't the majority when fundamentalist Christian law is set to pass on the state level.

Someone once said that freedom of speech isn't the freedom to hate.


Well it still is officially so as long as I'm being oppressed I'm free to hate.
2012-08-06 03:25:51 PM  
1 votes:
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/mobileweb/2012/08/04/missouri-prayer-ame ndment-vote_n_1739968.html

Read down for how this will effectively ban non-Christian teaching.
2012-08-06 03:24:26 PM  
1 votes:

GAT_00:
I am so farking sick of Christians. You can't say the fundamentalists aren't the majority when fundamentalist Christian law is set to pass on the state level.


you aren't going to go out and shoot up a church or anything, are you?
2012-08-06 03:20:54 PM  
1 votes:

serial_crusher: Is there any evidence that this guy had planned any of his attack with others, or did he just go on the rampage on his own?
Because it seems like the article is saying that DHS should have taken him off the streets already just because he was a veteran, White Supremacist, Neo-Nazi, and leader of a white power music band.
None of those things are illegal, so I'd rather not have the DHS going around spying on people just because of their political views.

That said, yes there should be more than one person in the DHS dealing with domestic terrorism.


Well, that would require a government job, so Republicans are fundamentally opposed to it, as well as Libertarians. After all, all government spending is bad.
2012-08-06 03:07:40 PM  
1 votes:

Weaver95: Nadie_AZ: Weaver95: GAT_00: Nonsense, just because there are two incidents of it two days in a row doesn't mean Christian extremists are a threat.

you know (sarcasm aside), I really hate it when you have a valid point. this does not look good for evangelical Christianity.

He said extremist. Fundamentalism is not evangelical, is it?

the definitions get a bit fuzzy. there's a LOT of crossover between the two groups. so I could have been a bit more clear in my phrasing. that said, there is a radical sect of christianity in this country that wouldn't shed a tear if every non-christian in the country suddenly keeled over and died tomorrow morning.


Well, then they'd do to their Christian movement what they are doing to the GOP- redefine what it is to be Christian and non-Christian and divide themselves further and further. There is no way in hell my mormon homophobic bigoted aunt is ever going to accept a southern baptists view on things or acquiesce to their rules.
2012-08-06 03:01:49 PM  
1 votes:

Nadie_AZ: Weaver95: GAT_00: Nonsense, just because there are two incidents of it two days in a row doesn't mean Christian extremists are a threat.

you know (sarcasm aside), I really hate it when you have a valid point. this does not look good for evangelical Christianity.

He said extremist. Fundamentalism is not evangelical, is it?


the definitions get a bit fuzzy. there's a LOT of crossover between the two groups. so I could have been a bit more clear in my phrasing. that said, there is a radical sect of christianity in this country that wouldn't shed a tear if every non-christian in the country suddenly keeled over and died tomorrow morning.
2012-08-06 02:59:14 PM  
1 votes:

Weaver95: GAT_00: Nonsense, just because there are two incidents of it two days in a row doesn't mean Christian extremists are a threat.

you know (sarcasm aside), I really hate it when you have a valid point. this does not look good for evangelical Christianity.


He said extremist. Fundamentalism is not evangelical, is it?
2012-08-06 02:55:07 PM  
1 votes:

GAT_00: Nonsense, just because there are two incidents of it two days in a row doesn't mean Christian extremists are a threat.


you know (sarcasm aside), I really hate it when you have a valid point. this does not look good for evangelical Christianity.
2012-08-06 02:53:00 PM  
1 votes:
Listen, I did not get any butthurt over the DHS releases.

I really didnt care at the time and I still dont.

I always assume that Christian militias and the white power folk are not to be trusted. Simple as that.
2012-08-06 02:51:47 PM  
1 votes:

Sgt Otter: ShawnDoc: rufus-t-firefly: And besides - Kos didn't tell you so. The Department of Homeland Security did, and you scoffed. SCOFFED, I say.

Not just scoffed, but created such a backlash that the report was retracted.

[img.photobucket.com image 778x653]

There was also a similar DHS report on left-wing extremists. Funny how that one didn't generate more butthurt than a Penn State locker room.


Maybe it's because they're lagging behind their Neo-Nazi counterparts in their violent shenanegans.
2012-08-06 02:47:16 PM  
1 votes:

sweetmelissa31: cman: Grand standing of "I told you so" does not befit you, Kos, like it does not befit anyone else who does it

We don't have to grandstand. We can investigate right wing extremists.


What is it that we constantly hear from the right wing?

"If they are innocent, there's nothing to fear from an investigation."
2012-08-06 02:37:38 PM  
1 votes:
Oh I admit it. I'll grandstand.

What? Somebody has to.
2012-08-06 02:29:04 PM  
1 votes:
Grand standing of "I told you so" does not befit you, Kos, like it does not befit anyone else who does it
2012-08-06 02:25:55 PM  
1 votes:
I think we were told we should investigate brown people with scarves on their heads rather than God fearing right wing Americans.
2012-08-06 02:24:41 PM  
1 votes:

vernonFL: Lets not let ONE Neo Nazi give all Neo Nazis a bad name.


JT Ready. Can I toss in Russel Pearce? That idiot who shot Gabby?
How bout Kris Kobach? Who? Oh, they guy who write SB 1070 and is on Romney staff of advisers.
2012-08-06 02:18:05 PM  
1 votes:
You mean using violence or the threat of violence to accomplish certain political, social, religious, or economic goals is terrorism?!?!? Since when?

/You know, besides since the farking dictionary was written
2012-08-06 02:10:20 PM  
1 votes:
Yes. :-(
 
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