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(MSNBC)   "It's as if words no longer have any meaning, and Americans politics has become so blisteringly stupid, candidates believe they can say literally anything and get away with it"   (maddowblog.msnbc.com) divider line 196
    More: Obvious, Mitt Romney, President Obama, Americans politics, Americans, swing vote, electoral colleges, shorthand, candidates believe  
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5564 clicks; posted to Politics » on 06 Aug 2012 at 3:08 PM (2 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2012-08-06 12:34:34 PM  
The media is more afraid of charges of liberal bias than they are of looking incompetent. So Mitt gets to lie with impunity, and both sides are still always equally bad.
 
2012-08-06 12:38:06 PM  
It's not that they think they can get away with it, Maddow-dick sucker, it's that they have a media arm that can spin it. Just like when a democrat says something that isn't true, MSNBC is there to spin. I'd say MSNBC and Fox News are the same thing, but apparently that gets you called a right-wing idiot by people who can't see the forest for the trees.
 
2012-08-06 12:40:18 PM  
On the contrary: when it concerns what Romney says, words have EVERY meaning.

/Schroedingerspeak
 
2012-08-06 12:44:04 PM  

WTF Indeed: I'd say MSNBC and Fox News are the same thing, but apparently that gets you called a right-wing idiot by people who can't see the forest for the trees.


It must be hard being persecuted so.
 
2012-08-06 12:44:53 PM  
So try f*cking calling them on in it on occasion you festering gobswilling twits, instead of letting comedians do it for you...
 
2012-08-06 12:48:01 PM  

Vodka Zombie: It must be hard being persecuted so.


Don't bother showing him any evidence, he's the real victim here.
 
jbc [TotalFark]
2012-08-06 12:48:40 PM  

WTF Indeed: It's not that they think they can get away with it, Maddow-dick sucker, it's that they have a media arm that can spin it. Just like when a democrat says something that isn't true, MSNBC is there to spin. I'd say MSNBC and Fox News are the same thing, but apparently that gets you called a right-wing idiot by people who can't see the forest for the trees.


That's not the only reason right-wing idiots get called right-wing idiots, but nice try.
 
2012-08-06 12:48:44 PM  

Vodka Zombie: It must be hard being persecuted so.


I guess it could be worse. I could be stupid enough to think this article is "quality reporting".
 
2012-08-06 12:51:07 PM  
It is rare that a headline, ripped from tfa, is so spot on that even a 'done in one' would be late
 
2012-08-06 12:52:09 PM  

WTF Indeed: Vodka Zombie: It must be hard being persecuted so.

I guess it could be worse. I could be stupid enough to think this article is "quality reporting".


Tell us who hurt you. What did the bad man do?
 
2012-08-06 12:53:19 PM  
LOL! The fark is going on in this thread??
 
2012-08-06 12:54:32 PM  

Dusk-You-n-Me: The media is more afraid of charges of liberal bias than they are of looking incompetent. So Mitt gets to lie with impunity, and both sides are still always equally bad.


I strenuously disagree with this. The media is very unafraid of being accused of having a liberal bias and they are far more interested in gathering massive profits the likes of which exist during political contention and/or a GOP president. The liberal bias argument is one they have allowed to survive because it gives them a convenient harmless-shrug way out when challenged as to why they have abandoned their role as the fourth estate.

WTF Indeed: It's not that they think they can get away with it, Maddow-dick sucker, it's that they have a media arm that can spin it. Just like when a democrat says something that isn't true, MSNBC is there to spin. I'd say MSNBC and Fox News are the same thing, but apparently that gets you called a right-wing idiot by people who can't see the forest for the trees.


We can have this argument all over again, but I think it will boil down to

One side: "FOX is demosntrably worse because of the blatant lies, misrepresentation, and consistent organization of political entities and rallies."

Other side: "Yeah but they're still the SAME."

It's like arguing the difference between first degree murder, and manslaughter. In both instances someone's dead, but in one case it was clearly purposeful and premeditated, and in the other maybe it was or wasn't, we don't know, but we do know someone died because of negligence.
 
2012-08-06 12:55:14 PM  
WTF Indeed I'd say MSNBC and Fox News are the same thing, but apparently that gets you called a right-wing idiot by people who can't see the forest for the trees.

Actually, you don't have to say that at all for me to call you a right-wing idiot. It's a factual statement. And you know what your team says about facts...
 
2012-08-06 01:03:31 PM  

Vodka Zombie: Tell us who hurt you. What did the bad man do?


This is a story for people who have a certain point of view and wish to feed it. The author does not go into detail about why politicians can say things and get away with it to a certain degree. This article is more an attack on other media outlets, than it is a critique of a news media that prefers ratings to journalism. The job of Romney's comments where to outrage his voting block that is currently wanning, and the job of this article to outrage the liberal voting block whose support of the President is rocky at best. It's a prime example of "Okay, so you don't like me as much anymore, but you should see how terrible the other guy is!"
 
2012-08-06 01:05:02 PM  

ginandbacon: LOL! The fark is going on in this thread??


I'm a conservative for saying this article sucks. Help me, ginandbacon...I'm so scared.
 
2012-08-06 01:05:04 PM  

WTF Indeed: Vodka Zombie: Tell us who hurt you. What did the bad man do?

This is a story for people who have a certain point of view and wish to feed it. The author does not go into detail about why politicians can say things and get away with it to a certain degree. This article is more an attack on other media outlets, than it is a critique of a news media that prefers ratings to journalism. The job of Romney's comments where to outrage his voting block that is currently wanning, and the job of this article to outrage the liberal voting block whose support of the President is rocky at best. It's a prime example of "Okay, so you don't like me as much anymore, but you should see how terrible the other guy is!"


Okay. That's not working. Can you show me on the doll where the bad man hurt you?
 
2012-08-06 01:05:58 PM  

Elandriel: The media is very unafraid of being accused of having a liberal bias and they are far more interested in gathering massive profits the likes of which exist during political contention and/or a GOP president.


I don't think these two goals are mutually exclusive.

Elandriel: The liberal bias argument is one they have allowed to survive because it gives them a convenient harmless-shrug way out when challenged as to why they have abandoned their role as the fourth estate.


Allowed to survive? The bottom line is Romney has been lying every single day of this campaign. These aren't small exaggerations or moving a decimal point on accident or instances of him 'mispeaking' - these are big, huge lies about big and important topics. He does this because he can get away with it. And when a news outlet does call him out on a lie, like in the link, you have people like WTF Indeed immediately claiming this is MSNBC spin. And so the media continues to be liberal and Romney continues skipping his way down no-consequence lane.
 
2012-08-06 01:09:09 PM  

Dusk-You-n-Me: The media is more afraid of charges of liberal bias than they are of looking incompetent. So Mitt gets to lie with impunity,


this, entirely

and both sides are still always equally bad.

but, maybe not. There is still the warmongering, anti-intellectual, sociopathic behavior of the far right to consider. And don't forget that the same crazies who started two unnecessary wars in the Dick and Dubya years haven't gone away. They are waiting for another figurehead just like Mitt to let them break out again like a lingering virus infection.
 
2012-08-06 01:09:50 PM  

WTF Indeed: ginandbacon: LOL! The fark is going on in this thread??

I'm a conservative for saying this article sucks. Help me, ginandbacon...I'm so scared.


I'm sorry, Baby! If they could only know you like I know you, they'd love you.

And the article does kind of suck. Benen's okay, but not a great writer. And no one at MSNB has ever called out Obama on his lies.
 
2012-08-06 01:13:51 PM  
And in an age where it's easier and easier to research and refute.

I don't understand how the two trends can coexist.
 
2012-08-06 01:18:54 PM  

Dusk-You-n-Me: Allowed to survive? The bottom line is Romney has been lying every single day of this campaign. These aren't small exaggerations or moving a decimal point on accident or instances of him 'mispeaking' - these are big, huge lies about big and important topics. He does this because he can get away with it. And when a news outlet does call him out on a lie, like in the link, you have people like WTF Indeed immediately claiming this is MSNBC spin. And so the media continues to be liberal and Romney continues skipping his way down no-consequence lane.


It sounds to me like you're reading skills are lacking. I was referring to whom the candidate lies too, not that this is automatically liberal spin because Romney is telling the truth. Politicians on a national level get away with small lies because they have a media arms to take of the spin. GOP has Fox, and the Democrats have MSNBC. Now there is more than one way to spin a story. Sometimes you ignore the story and hope it goes away in the cycle, or you say it on a Saturday so no one covers it fully until Monday. However, most of the time when a candidate lies to the media, it's to a friendly member of the media.
 
2012-08-06 01:21:17 PM  

Dusk-You-n-Me: Allowed to survive? The bottom line is Romney has been lying every single day of this campaign. These aren't small exaggerations or moving a decimal point on accident or instances of him 'mispeaking' - these are big, huge lies about big and important topics. He does this because he can get away with it. And when a news outlet does call him out on a lie, like in the link, you have people like WTF Indeed immediately claiming this is MSNBC spin. And so the media continues to be liberal and Romney continues skipping his way down no-consequence lane.


They could quash the "liberal media" BS point. They're the media - the own the narrative. They ARE the narrative. They could have marginalized FOX News without any difficulty by banding together, or simply by ignoring them and their influence. FOX News would scream and cry, and be entirely shunned by each organization, and that would have been that; a mindless child shrieking in the corner. They could have manipulated public opinion into thinking "liberal" is a good thing, instead of negative. They deliberately chose not to, certainly not out of fear of the accusation. The liberal media accusation is a convenient misdirection that they make no effort to challenge.
 
2012-08-06 01:24:24 PM  

Diogenes: And in an age where it's easier and easier to research and refute.

I don't understand how the two trends can coexist.


Because most people still get their news from TV New Programs, and the TV news programs are afraid to call out a candidate on ANYTHING. Its so much easier to do as "So and so says "X". While his opponent said "Y". ", then it is to actually look into what they said and do an analysis. Plus, with ratings dwindling, if they actually comment on the validity of what was said, they fear they'll lose viewers who support that politician.
 
2012-08-06 01:25:03 PM  

ginandbacon: And the article does kind of suck. Benen's okay, but not a great writer. And no one at MSNB has ever called out Obama on his lies.


SHHHHHH!!!

Don't say that too loud, they will start to think you might not be one of them.

/one of them one of them
 
2012-08-06 01:28:51 PM  
It's politics.. People lie. They've lied since the history of politics began. They lied in Greece, they lied in Rome, they've lied in every empire in between and they lie today.

It's so ingrained in the culture that we allow them to lie.. We generally don't care if they lie and we expect them to. In fact I seriously doubt an honest politician would -ever- get elected to a high office.

Lincoln was a lawyer.
 
2012-08-06 01:29:15 PM  

WTF Indeed: ginandbacon: And the article does kind of suck. Benen's okay, but not a great writer. And no one at MSNB has ever called out Obama on his lies.

SHHHHHH!!!

Don't say that too loud, they will start to think you might not be one of them.

/one of them one of them


Tee hee hee!
 
2012-08-06 01:41:00 PM  

WTF Indeed: It sounds to me like you're reading skills are lacking. I was referring to whom the candidate lies too, not that this is automatically liberal spin because Romney is telling the truth.


Except Romney isn't telling the truth.
 
2012-08-06 01:48:56 PM  

timujin: Except Romney isn't telling the truth.


FFS, follow the line here, little buddy. A Farker said that I was claiming this story was MSNBC spin because Romney is telling the truth. I corrected them by returning to the article topic which was "why candidates can lie and get away with it.". The Faker assumed because I was badmouthing MSNBC that was, in fact, supporting Mitt Romney. When in reality I was insulting the intelligence level of the article's author.

Let's put this short phrases everyone can understand:

Romney = Liar. Author of Article = Moron.
 
2012-08-06 01:59:58 PM  

WTF Indeed: Romney = Liar.


On this, we agree. Allow me to expand.

- In the same interview, he asserted "we have not" increased trade with Latin America.

That's not true. Since early 2009, the exports of goods and services to Latin America have increased nearly 50 percent. (Obama also signed trade deals with Panama and Colombia.)

- Romney said "it was illegal" for the Aurora gunman to have his arsenal.

That's not true. The gunman in Aurora purchased his guns and ammunition legally.

- Romney told donors this week that Ronald Reagan was so focused on the economy after taking office in 1981, he told his aides not to schedule any national security meetings in his first 100 days as president.

That's so ridiculously false it seemed to thoroughly annoy Republican media figures, including Bill Kristol and Marc Thiessen.

- Romney went on to say, "I'm not looking for tax breaks for high-income folks."

Yes, he is.



There's four, on a page with TWENTY-SIX examples. Link

And that's volume one of TWENTY-SEVEN and counting.

Previous editions of Chronicling Mitt's Mendacity:

Vol.  IIIIIIIVVVIVIIVIIIIXXXIXII,XIIIXIVXVXVI, XVIIXVIII, XIX, XX, XXIXXII, XXIII, XXIV, XXV, XXVI

And why not a few more.

WaPo

Boston Phoenix

US News & World Report

Pensito Review

NY Mag

Pundit Wire

WaPo

Veracity Stew

Guardian UK

Politifact

Romney is a serial liar. A vote for him is a vote for nothing. Or anything, depending on the man's ambitions at that moment.
 
2012-08-06 02:03:05 PM  

Dusk-You-n-Me: Romney is a serial liar. A vote for him is a vote for nothing. Or anything, depending on the man's ambitions at that moment.


Okay, that's a nice block o' links there, but now that we know the obvious let's see if we can't understand HOW Romney and ALL politicians get away with lies.
 
2012-08-06 02:09:49 PM  

WTF Indeed: timujin: Except Romney isn't telling the truth.

FFS, follow the line here, little buddy. A Farker said that I was claiming this story was MSNBC spin because Romney is telling the truth. I corrected them by returning to the article topic which was "why candidates can lie and get away with it.". The Faker assumed because I was badmouthing MSNBC that was, in fact, supporting Mitt Romney. When in reality I was insulting the intelligence level of the article's author.

Let's put this short phrases everyone can understand:

Romney = Liar. Author of Article = Moron.


Sorry, didn't read all of the back-and-forth, just misread the line:

timujin: I was referring to whom the candidate lies too, not that this is automatically liberal spin because Romney is telling the truth.


So my reading skills are also apparently lacking.
 
2012-08-06 02:10:12 PM  

WTF Indeed: Dusk-You-n-Me: Romney is a serial liar. A vote for him is a vote for nothing. Or anything, depending on the man's ambitions at that moment.

Okay, that's a nice block o' links there, but now that we know the obvious let's see if we can't understand HOW Romney and ALL politicians get away with lies.


Easy. People keep voting for them blindly and not holding them accountable for this character flaw.

As Mittens so obviously lies at every chance he opens his mouth (just like Bush II did while he was President), I'm voting for President Obama because he's kept most of his promises from his 2008 campaign and been pretty straight with us over his first term.
 
2012-08-06 02:14:36 PM  

WTF Indeed: Dusk-You-n-Me: Romney is a serial liar. A vote for him is a vote for nothing. Or anything, depending on the man's ambitions at that moment.

Okay, that's a nice block o' links there, but now that we know the obvious let's see if we can't understand HOW Romney and ALL politicians get away with lies.


They can and do because people don't tend to question those with similar stated political ideologies. So-and-so says something that sorta aligns with their worldview-whether correct or not-and often people take it as truth. People like affirmation, that's why people listen to the nuttiest nutjobs that ever nutted on-air or online. It is because they are also incurious morons who would rather be affirmed than awakened to reality.

While both sides of the political spectrum use these tactics, that doesn't make them the same. The methods employed by the right, especially considering their overall message, are much more destructive. I can see the right is consistently better at propaganda as well.
 
2012-08-06 02:36:50 PM  

WTF Indeed:

It sounds to me like you're reading skills are lacking.



No YOU are reading skills are lacking.


/This thread has already gone to shiate. Might as well add some grammar nazism to it.
 
2012-08-06 03:03:57 PM  

Dusk-You-n-Me: The media is more afraid of charges of liberal bias than they are of looking incompetent. So Mitt gets to lie with impunity, and both sides are still always equally bad.


None of which would be an issue if the voting public weren't a bunch of low-information idiots who can't think critically.
 
2012-08-06 03:06:00 PM  
It's as if words no longer have any meaning, and Americans politics has become so blisteringly stupid, candidates believe they can say literally anything and get away with it.

"I don't know what you mean by 'glory,'" Alice said.
Humpty Dumpty smiled contemptuously. "Of course you don't-till I tell you. I meant 'there's a nice knock-down argument for you!'"
"But 'glory' doesn't mean 'a nice knock-down argument'," Alice objected.
"When I use a word," Humpty Dumpty said, in rather a scornful tone, "it means just what I choose it to mean-neither more nor less."
"The question is," said Alice, "whether you can make words mean so many different things."
"The question is," said Humpty Dumpty, "which is to be master that's all."
Alice was too much puzzled to say anything, so after a minute Humpty Dumpty began again. "They've a temper, some of them-particularly verbs, they're the proudest-adjectives you can do anything with, but not verbs-however, I can manage the whole lot! Impenetrability! That's what I say!"
 
2012-08-06 03:08:12 PM  
Well, SOME candidates can say literally anything they want to and get away with it.
 
2012-08-06 03:11:02 PM  

FloydA: WTF Indeed:

It sounds to me like you're reading skills are lacking.


No YOU are reading skills are lacking.


/This thread has already gone to shiate. Might as well add some grammar nazism to it.


This thread never had a chance.
 
2012-08-06 03:12:51 PM  
DRTFA, but I'm guessing it's about Harry Reid.
 
2012-08-06 03:12:52 PM  
Possibly because you jags CONTINUE TO LET THEM.
 
2012-08-06 03:13:25 PM  
Both candidates are saying things that appeal to their base populations.

Obama's base population is a little on the naive and idealistic side.

Romney's base is Derpistan and Herpville.
 
2012-08-06 03:15:39 PM  

WTF Indeed: It's not that they think they can get away with it, Maddow-dick sucker, it's that they have a media arm that can spin it. Just like when a democrat says something that isn't true, MSNBC is there to spin. I'd say MSNBC and Fox News are the same thing, but apparently that gets you called a right-wing idiot by people who can't see the forest for the trees.


MSNBC. Really.

What's next, worrying the Soviet Union is going to invade?
 
2012-08-06 03:15:44 PM  

WTF Indeed: It's not that they think they can get away with it, Maddow-dick sucker, it's that they have a media arm that can spin it. Just like when a democrat says something that isn't true, MSNBC is there to spin. I'd say MSNBC and Fox News are the same thing, but apparently that gets you called a right-wing idiot by people who can't see the forest for the trees.


This from the party of Atwater, Rove, Limbaugh, Coulter, Malkin, Breitbart, Beck, Hannity, Palin, Bachmann and the TeaBaggers?

You are truly hilarious!
 
2012-08-06 03:15:57 PM  
The general public is generally quite stupid. Lies work in elections even if they are asinine in nature and can be easily disproven.
 
2012-08-06 03:16:23 PM  

Empty Matchbook: Possibly because you jags CONTINUE TO LET THEM.


The media took a decided turn in 2001. It was amazing to me. Nobody called the President on anything- even when it was obvious he was full of sh*t. I had hoped it would improve with Obama in office, but Corporate Owned Media is pissed in its pants afraid of being called out by Fox News as 'unfair and unbalanced'.
 
2012-08-06 03:16:49 PM  

Cat Food Sandwiches: DRTFA, but I'm guessing it's about Harry Reid.


From MSNBC?!? Bwahahaha!

Harry Reid drops his "have you stopped beating your wife" hearsay of hearsay on Mitt's tax liability into the public forum and the MSNBC response is, "Well, show us your returns to prove Reid wrong."
 
2012-08-06 03:19:28 PM  

MrGMan: Cat Food Sandwiches: DRTFA, but I'm guessing it's about Harry Reid.

From MSNBC?!? Bwahahaha!

Harry Reid drops his "have you stopped beating your wife" hearsay of hearsay on Mitt's tax liability into the public forum and the MSNBC response is, "Well, show us your returns to prove Reid wrong."


...thereby demonstrating that Romney's claims are as unverifiable as Reid's.
 
2012-08-06 03:20:02 PM  
hmmmm....an msnbc article.

I think I'll pass over this one and save two minutes of my life.
 
2012-08-06 03:20:42 PM  
Floopy doople doopdoo? Frazzing forper flaglap chinzano kachansky!

/Fleeblepop
 
2012-08-06 03:20:47 PM  

This About That: Dusk-You-n-Me: The media is more afraid of charges of liberal bias than they are of looking incompetent. So Mitt gets to lie with impunity,

this, entirely

and both sides are still always equally bad.

but, maybe not. There is still the warmongering, anti-intellectual, sociopathic behavior of the far right to consider. And don't forget that the same crazies who started two unnecessary wars in the Dick and Dubya years haven't gone away. They are waiting for another figurehead just like Mitt to let them break out again like a lingering virus infection.


And you think that the other side will fix everythinganything?

Oh wait, you were serious?
 
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