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(Talking Points Memo)   Congress wants to know how Mitt Romney accrued a 100 million dollar IRA when the limit for them is $6000 a year. May subpoena his tax returns for the last 16,666 years   (tpmdc.talkingpointsmemo.com) divider line 413
    More: Interesting, IRAs, Mitt Romney, Sander Levin, restrictions, Chris Van Hollen, subpoenas, Ways and Means Committee  
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9289 clicks; posted to Politics » on 04 Aug 2012 at 7:31 PM (2 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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NFA [TotalFark]
2012-08-04 03:22:02 PM
I'll tell you how he did it. He used his business to deposit funds into a company managed retirement fund, then he rolled it over into a Roth IRA. BOOM, no taxes on $100,000,000.00 of retirement income.

Business owners and executives do this all the time.
 
2012-08-04 03:33:00 PM

NFA: I'll tell you how he did it. He used his business to deposit funds into a company managed retirement fund, then he rolled it over into a Roth IRA. BOOM, no taxes on $100,000,000.00 of retirement income.

Business owners and executives do this all the time.


Sounds like a tax loophole that a congressional committee should examine. Perhaps they could even subpoena a real world example for evidence.
 
2012-08-04 03:43:47 PM
"Romney's most recent financial disclosure form revealed that his tax-deferred individual retirement account holds upwards of $100 million - an amount that awkwardly showcases his enormous wealth but also raises legal and ethical questions."

Whose ethics? Certainly not Mitt's.
 
2012-08-04 04:09:03 PM

Dogberry:
Whose ethics? Certainly not Mitt's.


Only because he doesn't actually have any. If he did, we would certainly question them.
 
2012-08-04 04:57:45 PM
Is this a good time to remember that Romney was the ONLY executive, the ONLY MEMBER of the Board of directors, and the ONLY shareholder of Bain Capital?

Whatever happened, there is exactly one person who did it.
 
2012-08-04 04:59:58 PM

Sliding Carp: Whatever happened, there is exactly one person who did it.


Obama?
 
2012-08-04 05:38:31 PM
But socialism
 
2012-08-04 05:57:01 PM

NFA: I'll tell you how he did it. He used his business to deposit funds into a company managed retirement fund, then he rolled it over into a Roth IRA. BOOM, no taxes on $100,000,000.00 of retirement income.

Business owners and executives do this all the time.


Is that legal?
 
2012-08-04 06:02:20 PM

GAT_00: NFA: I'll tell you how he did it. He used his business to deposit funds into a company managed retirement fund, then he rolled it over into a Roth IRA. BOOM, no taxes on $100,000,000.00 of retirement income.

Business owners and executives do this all the time.

Is that legal?


Well, considering how farked up and confusing our laws on financial acts are, its pretty damn hard to know.
 
2012-08-04 06:05:15 PM

cman: GAT_00: NFA: I'll tell you how he did it. He used his business to deposit funds into a company managed retirement fund, then he rolled it over into a Roth IRA. BOOM, no taxes on $100,000,000.00 of retirement income.

Business owners and executives do this all the time.

Is that legal?

Well, considering how farked up and confusing our laws on financial acts are, its pretty damn hard to know.


That's what I figure. It probably lives in some kind of grey area where that isn't intended, but isn't expressly illegal.
 
2012-08-04 06:05:40 PM
clearly he's been retroactively contributing to his IRA for 16,666 years.

next question!
 
2012-08-04 06:08:36 PM

GAT_00: NFA: I'll tell you how he did it. He used his business to deposit funds into a company managed retirement fund, then he rolled it over into a Roth IRA. BOOM, no taxes on $100,000,000.00 of retirement income.

Business owners and executives do this all the time.

Is that legal?


I will make it legal.
 
2012-08-04 06:12:54 PM
Last time I checked, the House was a bit too derpy to allow this to gain any real traction.
 
2012-08-04 06:20:55 PM

cptjeff: NFA: I'll tell you how he did it. He used his business to deposit funds into a company managed retirement fund, then he rolled it over into a Roth IRA. BOOM, no taxes on $100,000,000.00 of retirement income.

Business owners and executives do this all the time.

Sounds like a tax loophole that a congressional committee should examine


Yeah I'm sure the Republican congress will get right on that.
 
2012-08-04 06:24:57 PM
Doesn't this make Romney a hero to them?
 
2012-08-04 06:31:53 PM
He could just be using a self-directed IRA. I think you can make one a shareholder in a corporation and whatever percentage of the income flows through the corporation into the IRA. The IRA itself is earning the money rather than you depositing money, so the limit is irrelevant.

It's basically the same as how an IRA can have stock investments that turn a profit in excess of the normal deposit limit. I first read about them years ago and as I understand it, it's entirely legal and I'd be surprised if many members of congress aren't doing this as well -- anyone can do this if they structure their business right.

The owner of the IRA can withdraw money and pay capital gains only if done before the age of 55.5 years, or no tax at all if withdrawn after that if the IRA has existed for at least 5 years. At least, that's how I recall it working.
 
2012-08-04 06:36:41 PM
Subby, there's a large portion of Congress that doesn't want to know anything about Romney. They need to beat the black guy, nothing else matters.
 
2012-08-04 06:42:20 PM
"[W]e are alarmed to learn that wealthy taxpayers may be taking advantage..."

can't...stop...laughing...
 
2012-08-04 06:45:30 PM
I hope $100 million is enough to retire on.
 
2012-08-04 06:49:06 PM

Mentat: I hope $100 million is enough to retire on.


If it's bills, sure. If it's kugerands, that might be a bit uncomfortable.
 
2012-08-04 06:52:53 PM

Mentat: I hope $100 million is enough to retire on.


Fortunately our inflation rate is considerably low compared to what it could be. I still think there is a good chance of hyper-inflation in the near future. I really cannot see the USD being the most powerful currency for much longer.
 
2012-08-04 07:00:24 PM

cman: I still think there is a good chance of hyper-inflation in the near future.


Why? The yen isn't the most powerful currency in the world. Neither is the Euro. Neither is the yuan. Currencies don't suffer hyperinflation just because they aren't super powerful.
 
2012-08-04 07:05:02 PM

cman: I still think there is a good chance of hyper-inflation in the near future.


Of course you do.
 
2012-08-04 07:06:48 PM

GAT_00: cman: I still think there is a good chance of hyper-inflation in the near future.

Why? The yen isn't the most powerful currency in the world. Neither is the Euro. Neither is the yuan. Currencies don't suffer hyperinflation just because they aren't super powerful.


Everything that isn't based on gold is going to hyperinflate, dontcha know.

/RON PAUL
 
2012-08-04 07:06:55 PM

GAT_00: cman: I still think there is a good chance of hyper-inflation in the near future.

Why? The yen isn't the most powerful currency in the world. Neither is the Euro. Neither is the yuan. Currencies don't suffer hyperinflation just because they aren't super powerful.


This is just my personal opinion. I am not an economist.

I think that there is going to be an economic depression very soon. The numbers and stats show that the recession is over, but in all reality, everyone knows the economy sucks. This could just be a matter of people having a negative perception about the economy, and perception is reality. Or, what I think, is that these jumps in stats are only temp. I dont complain about CEO pay; in fact, I usually avoid those threads. But considering that their compensation was raised 26% with job losses and stagnant wages lead me to believe that our economic indicators are a bit farked up.
 
2012-08-04 07:07:09 PM

cman: Mentat: I hope $100 million is enough to retire on.

Fortunately our inflation rate is considerably low compared to what it could be. I still think there is a good chance of hyper-inflation in the near future. I really cannot see the USD being the most powerful currency for much longer.


Well not with that attitude.
 
2012-08-04 07:09:41 PM

cman: GAT_00: cman: I still think there is a good chance of hyper-inflation in the near future.

Why? The yen isn't the most powerful currency in the world. Neither is the Euro. Neither is the yuan. Currencies don't suffer hyperinflation just because they aren't super powerful.

This is just my personal opinion. I am not an economist.

I think that there is going to be an economic depression very soon. The numbers and stats show that the recession is over, but in all reality, everyone knows the economy sucks. This could just be a matter of people having a negative perception about the economy, and perception is reality. Or, what I think, is that these jumps in stats are only temp. I dont complain about CEO pay; in fact, I usually avoid those threads. But considering that their compensation was raised 26% with job losses and stagnant wages lead me to believe that our economic indicators are a bit farked up.


And none of that even suggests hyperinflation. Do you know what causes hyperinflation? Go read why it happens. Depressions and recessions don't cause hyperinflation.
 
2012-08-04 07:11:38 PM

GAT_00: cman: GAT_00: cman: I still think there is a good chance of hyper-inflation in the near future.

Why? The yen isn't the most powerful currency in the world. Neither is the Euro. Neither is the yuan. Currencies don't suffer hyperinflation just because they aren't super powerful.

This is just my personal opinion. I am not an economist.

I think that there is going to be an economic depression very soon. The numbers and stats show that the recession is over, but in all reality, everyone knows the economy sucks. This could just be a matter of people having a negative perception about the economy, and perception is reality. Or, what I think, is that these jumps in stats are only temp. I dont complain about CEO pay; in fact, I usually avoid those threads. But considering that their compensation was raised 26% with job losses and stagnant wages lead me to believe that our economic indicators are a bit farked up.

And none of that even suggests hyperinflation. Do you know what causes hyperinflation? Go read why it happens. Depressions and recessions don't cause hyperinflation.


You are correct. Hyper-inflation is not always begat by a depression. But, we Americans dont have the discipline that we need to keep the printing press offline.
 
2012-08-04 07:11:55 PM

cman: GAT_00: cman: I still think there is a good chance of hyper-inflation in the near future.

Why? The yen isn't the most powerful currency in the world. Neither is the Euro. Neither is the yuan. Currencies don't suffer hyperinflation just because they aren't super powerful.

This is just my personal opinion. I am not an economist.

I think that there is going to be an economic depression very soon. The numbers and stats show that the recession is over, but in all reality, everyone knows the economy sucks. This could just be a matter of people having a negative perception about the economy, and perception is reality. Or, what I think, is that these jumps in stats are only temp. I dont complain about CEO pay; in fact, I usually avoid those threads. But considering that their compensation was raised 26% with job losses and stagnant wages lead me to believe that our economic indicators are a bit farked up.


What does anything in here have to do with hyperinflation? Are you under the impression "hyperinflation" is a synonym for "bad stuff"?
 
2012-08-04 07:12:35 PM
I'm not sure Romney really wants to be having this sort of discussion in public. so...he'll probably biatch about it very loudly, claim he's being persecuted (which is kind of half true - i'm sure this will help Obama's message about Romney being rich and out of touch) and then the GOP will close ranks around their candidate. the fox news crowd will crow about how unfair everyone is being to Romney, Obama will avoid commenting about it in any direct manner, and the pundits will tear each other apart over the minute details regarding tax shelter laws. eventually everyone will get bored, the press will drop the matter and Romney will walk away with his millions of possibly illegal cash.

And the world rolls onwards.
 
2012-08-04 07:13:57 PM

cman: GAT_00: cman: I still think there is a good chance of hyper-inflation in the near future.

Why? The yen isn't the most powerful currency in the world. Neither is the Euro. Neither is the yuan. Currencies don't suffer hyperinflation just because they aren't super powerful.

This is just my personal opinion. I am not an economist.

I think that there is going to be an economic depression very soon. The numbers and stats show that the recession is over, but in all reality, everyone knows the economy sucks. This could just be a matter of people having a negative perception about the economy, and perception is reality. Or, what I think, is that these jumps in stats are only temp. I dont complain about CEO pay; in fact, I usually avoid those threads. But considering that their compensation was raised 26% with job losses and stagnant wages lead me to believe that our economic indicators are a bit farked up.


anecdote does not equal data

anecdote does not equal data

anecdote does not equal data

anecdote does not equal data

anecdote does not equal data

anecdote does not equal data
 
2012-08-04 07:13:59 PM

DamnYankees: cman: GAT_00: cman: I still think there is a good chance of hyper-inflation in the near future.

Why? The yen isn't the most powerful currency in the world. Neither is the Euro. Neither is the yuan. Currencies don't suffer hyperinflation just because they aren't super powerful.

This is just my personal opinion. I am not an economist.

I think that there is going to be an economic depression very soon. The numbers and stats show that the recession is over, but in all reality, everyone knows the economy sucks. This could just be a matter of people having a negative perception about the economy, and perception is reality. Or, what I think, is that these jumps in stats are only temp. I dont complain about CEO pay; in fact, I usually avoid those threads. But considering that their compensation was raised 26% with job losses and stagnant wages lead me to believe that our economic indicators are a bit farked up.

What does anything in here have to do with hyperinflation? Are you under the impression "hyperinflation" is a synonym for "bad stuff"?


it's just a distraction tactic. god knows, we can't talk about Romney's finances and how he might have violated the law....I think we'd break fark with that sort of discussion.
 
2012-08-04 07:14:04 PM

Mentat: I hope $100 million is enough to retire on.


They may have to cut back on the filet de panda and condor egg omelets, but I'm sure they'll squeak by.
 
2012-08-04 07:15:03 PM

cman: But, we Americans dont have the discipline that we need to keep the printing press offline.


If that was the reason we'll have hyperinflation, why didn't it just happen? Why didn't it happen during the Great Depression?
 
2012-08-04 07:15:59 PM

Weaver95: DamnYankees: cman: GAT_00: cman: I still think there is a good chance of hyper-inflation in the near future.

Why? The yen isn't the most powerful currency in the world. Neither is the Euro. Neither is the yuan. Currencies don't suffer hyperinflation just because they aren't super powerful.

This is just my personal opinion. I am not an economist.

I think that there is going to be an economic depression very soon. The numbers and stats show that the recession is over, but in all reality, everyone knows the economy sucks. This could just be a matter of people having a negative perception about the economy, and perception is reality. Or, what I think, is that these jumps in stats are only temp. I dont complain about CEO pay; in fact, I usually avoid those threads. But considering that their compensation was raised 26% with job losses and stagnant wages lead me to believe that our economic indicators are a bit farked up.

What does anything in here have to do with hyperinflation? Are you under the impression "hyperinflation" is a synonym for "bad stuff"?

it's just a distraction tactic. god knows, we can't talk about Romney's finances and how he might have violated the law....I think we'd break fark with that sort of discussion.


Come on, Weaver. You know that I could give two shiats about Romney.
 
2012-08-04 07:18:14 PM

GAT_00: cman: But, we Americans dont have the discipline that we need to keep the printing press offline.

If that was the reason we'll have hyperinflation, why didn't it just happen? Why didn't it happen during the Great Depression?


Because the US wasnt the great nation of instant gratification in the great depression. We want everything and we want it now. We do not have the stomach to take short term losses for long term gains.
 
2012-08-04 07:20:15 PM

cman: GAT_00: cman: But, we Americans dont have the discipline that we need to keep the printing press offline.

If that was the reason we'll have hyperinflation, why didn't it just happen? Why didn't it happen during the Great Depression?

Because the US wasnt the great nation of instant gratification in the great depression. We want everything and we want it now. We do not have the stomach to take short term losses for long term gains.


So why didn't it happen in 2008? Or at any time since? We're still in trouble now. Why hasn't someone just turned the presses on overdrive?

There's no logic in this. You're just a doomsayer because you hate everything.
 
2012-08-04 07:22:44 PM

GAT_00: cman: GAT_00: cman: But, we Americans dont have the discipline that we need to keep the printing press offline.

If that was the reason we'll have hyperinflation, why didn't it just happen? Why didn't it happen during the Great Depression?

Because the US wasnt the great nation of instant gratification in the great depression. We want everything and we want it now. We do not have the stomach to take short term losses for long term gains.

So why didn't it happen in 2008? Or at any time since? We're still in trouble now. Why hasn't someone just turned the presses on overdrive?

There's no logic in this. You're just a doomsayer because you hate fear everything.


FTFY
 
2012-08-04 07:22:55 PM

cman: GAT_00: cman: But, we Americans dont have the discipline that we need to keep the printing press offline.

If that was the reason we'll have hyperinflation, why didn't it just happen? Why didn't it happen during the Great Depression?

Because the US wasnt the great nation of instant gratification in the great depression. We want everything and we want it now. We do not have the stomach to take short term losses for long term gains.


Yes, because the Roaring Twenties were known as a time of moderation and forward thinking.
 
2012-08-04 07:23:39 PM
GAT_00:
There's no logic in this. You're just a doomsayer because you hate everything.

That may be true. As I said its just my simple opinion. I aint the sharpest tool in the shed.
 
2012-08-04 07:25:21 PM

cman: GAT_00:
There's no logic in this. You're just a doomsayer because you hate everything.

That may be true. As I said its just my simple opinion. I aint the sharpest tool in the shed.


Neither am I, but I don't think we're going to suffer hyperinflation, because I understand it.
 
2012-08-04 07:32:43 PM

cman: Come on, Weaver. You know that I could give two shiats about Romney.


Says the man posting in a Romney thread.
 
2012-08-04 07:33:59 PM

cman:

Come on, Weaver. You know that I could give two shiats about Romney.


And yet, here we are in the middle of a non sequiturconversation about hyper-inflation instead of pondering just how in the hell Romney managed to get past the limits on IRA contributions.
 
2012-08-04 07:34:34 PM
dammit...that should have been 'Non Sequitur conversation'.
 
2012-08-04 07:36:36 PM
Started humming a tune when I read the article.. "You're playing checkers baby..... now the Mitt has hit the fan.."
 
2012-08-04 07:38:07 PM

cman: Fortunately our inflation rate is considerably low compared to what it could be. I still think there is a good chance of hyper-inflation in the near future. I really cannot see the USD being the most powerful currency for much longer.


So the libertarian nut balls have been saying this for how many decades now?''Weren't we suppose to be in "HYPERINFLATION" years ago?

Great put all your money in gold, who is stopping you?
 
2012-08-04 07:38:16 PM
See, if Mitt had released his tax returns early, there might have been momentary outrage at whatever is in it, but he could've swept it under the rug before November.

Now, people smell blood in the water.
 
2012-08-04 07:40:30 PM
I'm not a lawyer or accountant, but would this work?

Step 1: Set up company started with 1000 shares with fair market value of $6000 each.
Step 2: Have your IRA buy 1 share, you own other 999
Step 3: Do a share buy back of all shares outside the IRA
Step 4: Ta-Da! The one share in the IRA is now worth $6 million.
 
2012-08-04 07:40:32 PM
Congress wants to know how Mitt Romney accrued a 100 million dollar IRA when the limit for them is $6000 a year.

memecrunch.com
 
2012-08-04 07:41:22 PM
I don't really know what hyperinflation is, but it sounds very scary, so I guess I'd better vote Republican.
 
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