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(Orlando Sentinel)   Rare skin disorder bonds families at conference. Ewww   (articles.orlandosentinel.com) divider line 53
    More: Sick, families  
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11999 clicks; posted to Main » on 02 Aug 2012 at 10:29 AM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2012-08-02 05:42:20 AM
The girl's rare skin disease, called EB (for dystrophicepidermolysis bullosa)

Oh come on, it's dystrophic epidermolysis bullosa. How could they miss that? Apathy, that's how.
I have keratosis pilaris, which is also incurable and absolutely devastating. That's how I know how much it hurts when people don't take these conditions seriously enough to get the information right. We get it douche nozzles, even the words to describe us are too unpleasant to look at. Let's all just hide in shame and wait to die and stop disgusting the world with our presence. YOU MONSTERS!
 
2012-08-02 05:47:18 AM
Well, now that's a surprise! I'm used to every asshole smoothskin in this town giving me shiat 'cause I look like a corpse
 
2012-08-02 10:36:16 AM

staplermofo: The girl's rare skin disease, called EB (for dystrophicepidermolysis bullosa)

Oh come on, it's dystrophic epidermolysis bullosa. How could they miss that? Apathy, that's how.
I have keratosis pilaris, which is also incurable and absolutely devastating. That's how I know how much it hurts when people don't take these conditions seriously enough to get the information right. We get it douche nozzles, even the words to describe us are too unpleasant to look at. Let's all just hide in shame and wait to die and stop disgusting the world with our presence. YOU MONSTERS!


drugstore-mercury.com
 
2012-08-02 10:36:36 AM
I think it's more sad than sick. those poor kids.
 
2012-08-02 10:38:25 AM
4.bp.blogspot.com
 
2012-08-02 10:39:25 AM
I think I knew one once who grew to adulthood. He was my boss -- forever butt hurt and talk about thin-skinned.
 
2012-08-02 10:39:49 AM
Is this one of those diseases that without the miracle of modern science would have simply fallen out of our gene pool but instead we keep it afloat just enough so that people can suffer with it and reproduce?

*checks article*
 
2012-08-02 10:39:59 AM

staplermofo: The girl's rare skin disease, called EB (for dystrophicepidermolysis bullosa)

Oh come on, it's dystrophic epidermolysis bullosa. How could they miss that? Apathy, that's how.
I have keratosis pilaris, which is also incurable and absolutely devastating. That's how I know how much it hurts when people don't take these conditions seriously enough to get the information right. We get it douche nozzles, even the words to describe us are too unpleasant to look at. Let's all just hide in shame and wait to die and stop disgusting the world with our presence. YOU MONSTERS!


Thank you for understanding.
 
2012-08-02 10:43:05 AM
why is this labeled "sick?" Isn't that typically used for pedos, politicians, etc? Yeah yeah, I get that it is a health issue...a medical disorder...etc. But really, wouldn't "sad" be just a tad bit better/more appropriate?
 
2012-08-02 10:43:22 AM

trappedspirit: Is this one of those diseases that without the miracle of modern science would have simply fallen out of our gene pool but instead we keep it afloat just enough so that people can suffer with it and reproduce?

*checks article*


I seriously doubt people with this disorder are capable of having sex, regardless of whether they survive to adulthood or not. Friction destroys their skin, and sex is a lot of friction.

Anyway, these diseases don't die out naturally because they're recessive (and may provide some survival benefit to carriers).
 
2012-08-02 10:46:48 AM
That sounds like one of the shiatties diseases ever.
 
2012-08-02 10:47:57 AM

trappedspirit: Is this one of those diseases that without the miracle of modern science would have simply fallen out of our gene pool but instead we keep it afloat just enough so that people can suffer with it and reproduce?

*checks article*


Not really. I actually have epidermolysis bullosa, although a very very mild case, and both my father and grandfather had it as well. To me it's more than a nuisance than anything, I couldn't imagine having it anywhere near as bad as the kids in the article.

And could you imagine sex if just touching your skin causes a blister? That sounds horrible.
 
2012-08-02 10:51:22 AM
What a wonder and a tragedy that the human being can survive so many deep and integral biological errors. On the one hand, it's fascinating. On the other... Those poor people.
 
2012-08-02 10:54:06 AM
samjmiller.com
//Approves
 
2012-08-02 10:55:08 AM
you know, if ever there was a sign your genes maybe shouldn't have been producing offspring, i would think this might be it
 
2012-08-02 10:55:19 AM
Did the Violent Femmes play at the conference?
 
2012-08-02 10:56:36 AM

Skweek: trappedspirit: Is this one of those diseases that without the miracle of modern science would have simply fallen out of our gene pool but instead we keep it afloat just enough so that people can suffer with it and reproduce?

*checks article*

Not really. I actually have epidermolysis bullosa, although a very very mild case, and both my father and grandfather had it as well. To me it's more than a nuisance than anything, I couldn't imagine having it anywhere near as bad as the kids in the article.

And could you imagine sex if just touching your skin causes a blister? That sounds horrible.


Well, you wouldn't need lube, so there's that.
 
2012-08-02 10:59:29 AM

trappedspirit: Is this one of those diseases that without the miracle of modern science would have simply fallen out of our gene pool but instead we keep it afloat just enough so that people can suffer with it and reproduce?

*checks article*


doesn't sound like it from the replies, but is it detectable during pregnancy? early enough it's cool to abort and try again if it's so rare?

I know people are like, what if it was einstein or something (or it's gods will) and want to have their baby and try and give it a good life no matter what, but what if the healthy kid you would have a year later to replace the defect (wouldnt' have been born otherwise) would be einstein and instead all you get is someone who lives in misery and makes your life super difficult too?
 
2012-08-02 10:59:55 AM

drg8r: [samjmiller.com image 450x338]
//Approves


I wonder if Zammis has it as well?
 
2012-08-02 11:00:48 AM

trappedspirit: Skweek: trappedspirit: Is this one of those diseases that without the miracle of modern science would have simply fallen out of our gene pool but instead we keep it afloat just enough so that people can suffer with it and reproduce?

*checks article*

Not really. I actually have epidermolysis bullosa, although a very very mild case, and both my father and grandfather had it as well. To me it's more than a nuisance than anything, I couldn't imagine having it anywhere near as bad as the kids in the article.

And could you imagine sex if just touching your skin causes a blister? That sounds horrible.

Well, you wouldn't need lube, so there's that.


FAP??
/or no....
 
2012-08-02 11:03:11 AM
I know someone who would be willing to offer these people a decent job...
www.stomptokyo.com
 
2012-08-02 11:07:18 AM
I recommend euthanasia for this.

Come to think of it, I also recommend euthanasia for my own condition. Will someone out there please oblige me? I'd be ever so grateful.
 
2012-08-02 11:14:48 AM

trappedspirit: Is this one of those diseases that without the miracle of modern science would have simply fallen out of our gene pool but instead we keep it afloat just enough so that people can suffer with it and reproduce?

*checks article*


These kids will never grow up to Reproduce so no you are wrong.
 
2012-08-02 11:15:17 AM
img.photobucket.com
 
2012-08-02 11:15:45 AM

geezus: trappedspirit: Is this one of those diseases that without the miracle of modern science would have simply fallen out of our gene pool but instead we keep it afloat just enough so that people can suffer with it and reproduce?

*checks article*

doesn't sound like it from the replies, but is it detectable during pregnancy? early enough it's cool to abort and try again if it's so rare?

I know people are like, what if it was einstein or something (or it's gods will) and want to have their baby and try and give it a good life no matter what, but what if the healthy kid you would have a year later to replace the defect (wouldnt' have been born otherwise) would be einstein and instead all you get is someone who lives in misery and makes your life super difficult too?


Man, abortion is always cool. This business about being "early enough" is just to make it legal too.

And yeah, any argument that tries to weigh in on the possibilities of what a particular fetus could become by default have already nulled themsevles out.
 
GBB
2012-08-02 11:16:52 AM

xkranda: I think it's more sad than sick. those poor kids.


The sick is for the thought that a rare skin disorder would actually bond people to each other... as in "adherence"
But yes, it is sad.

/the sick tag is actually an amalgam of (s)ad and s(ick)
//or is the sad tag an amalgam of (s)ick and s(ad)??
 
2012-08-02 11:17:32 AM

geezus: trappedspirit: Is this one of those diseases that without the miracle of modern science would have simply fallen out of our gene pool but instead we keep it afloat just enough so that people can suffer with it and reproduce?

*checks article*

doesn't sound like it from the replies, but is it detectable during pregnancy? early enough it's cool to abort and try again if it's so rare?

I know people are like, what if it was einstein or something (or it's gods will) and want to have their baby and try and give it a good life no matter what, but what if the healthy kid you would have a year later to replace the defect (wouldnt' have been born otherwise) would be einstein and instead all you get is someone who lives in misery and makes your life super difficult too?


You know, it is probably incredibly selfish to think that way, but in all seriousness, what is the point in basically ending your life as you know it to care for a child born with this disease? The article mentioned that some of the families can go through $10,000 - $15,000 a month in just bandages. I'm sure some of that is picked up by insurance, maybe, but the family is still going to be on the hook for a large portion which will be exasperated by at least one of the parents needing to be home at all times to care for the child, so now you have to cover it all on a single income. I guess it depends on your views towards the idea that every life is sacred, but I would see it as a reminder that the natural world is wild, powerful and random and there are some situations where it doesn't pay to try to fight it. Cut your losses, try again and hope you don't win nature's worst lottery a second time.
 
2012-08-02 11:19:11 AM
Do you have a disfiguring skin condition?

profile.ak.fbcdn.net

No? Then whatever you do, don't shake his hand.
 
2012-08-02 11:19:17 AM

geezus: trappedspirit: Is this one of those diseases that without the miracle of modern science would have simply fallen out of our gene pool but instead we keep it afloat just enough so that people can suffer with it and reproduce?

*checks article*

doesn't sound like it from the replies, but is it detectable during pregnancy? early enough it's cool to abort and try again if it's so rare?

I know people are like, what if it was einstein or something (or it's gods will) and want to have their baby and try and give it a good life no matter what, but what if the healthy kid you would have a year later to replace the defect (wouldnt' have been born otherwise) would be einstein and instead all you get is someone who lives in misery and makes your life super difficult too?


The most confounding attribute of western culture, to me, is the belief that life in and of itself is precious without respect to the quality of that life. It seems so obvious to me that many, many people are forced to suffer through an awful existence because (fill in the blank, God, maternal instinct, etc.) told their parents the only option was to give life a chance. There are seven billion humans. We don't need more. We need more to have a fulfilling and productive experience on this earth. It never ceases to astound me that the quality of life takes a complete backseat to a culture of reverence for life itself to the vast majority of people. I want to whatevs but can't, this really pisses me off.

///Has no intention of withering away for years in a facility because others deem my life to be valuable when the valuable part is over.
 
2012-08-02 11:20:48 AM

The One True TheDavid: I recommend euthanasia for this.

Come to think of it, I also recommend euthanasia for my own condition. Will someone out there please oblige me? I'd be ever so grateful.


You want to be good at math?
 
2012-08-02 11:25:28 AM

GBB: xkranda:

/the sick tag is actually an amalgam of (s)ad and s(ick)
//or is the sad tag an amalgam of (s)ick and s(ad)??


favim.com

/hot like daria
 
2012-08-02 11:28:30 AM

trappedspirit: Is this one of those diseases that without the miracle of modern science would have simply fallen out of our gene pool but instead we keep it afloat just enough so that people can suffer with it and reproduce?

*checks article*


Right now, in your own personal germ line cells' genome, you have around 30 genetic time bombs waiting to go off in the event of an unlucky shuffle of the deck. We all do. You can't change that fact.

The ideas sloshing around inside your head? Those you can change.
 
2012-08-02 11:32:36 AM

xkranda: I think it's more sad than sick. those poor kids.


They seem a little thin skinned.
 
2012-08-02 11:41:34 AM

notatrollorami: geezus: trappedspirit: Is this one of those diseases that without the miracle of modern science would have simply fallen out of our gene pool but instead we keep it afloat just enough so that people can suffer with it and reproduce?

*checks article*

doesn't sound like it from the replies, but is it detectable during pregnancy? early enough it's cool to abort and try again if it's so rare?

I know people are like, what if it was einstein or something (or it's gods will) and want to have their baby and try and give it a good life no matter what, but what if the healthy kid you would have a year later to replace the defect (wouldnt' have been born otherwise) would be einstein and instead all you get is someone who lives in misery and makes your life super difficult too?

The most confounding attribute of western culture, to me, is the belief that life in and of itself is precious without respect to the quality of that life. It seems so obvious to me that many, many people are forced to suffer through an awful existence because (fill in the blank, God, maternal instinct, etc.) told their parents the only option was to give life a chance. There are seven billion humans. We don't need more. We need more to have a fulfilling and productive experience on this earth. It never ceases to astound me that the quality of life takes a complete backseat to a culture of reverence for life itself to the vast majority of people. I want to whatevs but can't, this really pisses me off.

///Has no intention of withering away for years in a facility because others deem my life to be valuable when the valuable part is over.


Won't be too long before genetic disorders like this are curable, from what I've read. Something about using genetically-modified retroviruses to replace faulty genes, keratin genes in this case, with ones that work.
 
2012-08-02 11:48:00 AM
So weird since I had somehow stumbled upon this blog a few months ago. Having a one year old makes this so awful to read. Personally, I don't know how she hasn't quit her blog. I assume a lot of it is for her own "therapy."

geezus: doesn't sound like it from the replies, but is it detectable during pregnancy? early enough it's cool to abort and try again if it's so rare?


From Tripp's blog, I don't think many know beforehand. Perhaps if you have a genetic test done during pregnancy because you know it runs in the family, you CAN test for it. But if you don't know you're a carrier ... Well, come on. There's only so many tests a pregnant woman can take before it's like "Wtf, do I really NEED another farking test?"
 
2012-08-02 11:52:34 AM
...which sounds expensive, yeah, but the same method could presumably give a rich wrinkly old hag who's spent the last 50 years in the sun the skin she used to have when she was 16.

Sometimes it's hard to move rare disease medicine forward given the lack of economic incentives, but dermatology's special. Ex-wife has a rare form of Ichthyosis, but treatments exist because they double as wrinkle and zit potions.
 
2012-08-02 12:05:31 PM

phaseolus: Won't be too long before genetic disorders like this are curable, from what I've read. Something about using genetically-modified retroviruses to replace faulty genes, keratin genes in this case, with ones that work.


I certainly hope so.
 
2012-08-02 12:08:07 PM

phaseolus: notatrollorami: geezus: trappedspirit: Is this one of those diseases that without the miracle of modern science would have simply fallen out of our gene pool but instead we keep it afloat just enough so that people can suffer with it and reproduce?

*checks article*

doesn't sound like it from the replies, but is it detectable during pregnancy? early enough it's cool to abort and try again if it's so rare?

I know people are like, what if it was einstein or something (or it's gods will) and want to have their baby and try and give it a good life no matter what, but what if the healthy kid you would have a year later to replace the defect (wouldnt' have been born otherwise) would be einstein and instead all you get is someone who lives in misery and makes your life super difficult too?

The most confounding attribute of western culture, to me, is the belief that life in and of itself is precious without respect to the quality of that life. It seems so obvious to me that many, many people are forced to suffer through an awful existence because (fill in the blank, God, maternal instinct, etc.) told their parents the only option was to give life a chance. There are seven billion humans. We don't need more. We need more to have a fulfilling and productive experience on this earth. It never ceases to astound me that the quality of life takes a complete backseat to a culture of reverence for life itself to the vast majority of people. I want to whatevs but can't, this really pisses me off.

///Has no intention of withering away for years in a facility because others deem my life to be valuable when the valuable part is over.

Won't be too long before genetic disorders like this are curable, from what I've read. Something about using genetically-modified retroviruses to replace faulty genes, keratin genes in this case, with ones that work.


Certainly that would have to factor into any potential parents decision if that were the case. My point was about the philosophical underpinnings of a lot of western medical decisions. But I do think the most comprehensive possible (safe) level of tests should be standard for any pregnancy and the world would be a better place if all parents were able to set aside preconcieved/force fed notions and simply consider "if I bring this child to fruition will he or she live a life that is more enjoyment/pleasure than pain/displeasure". And, similarly, I sincerely wish our culture had respect for people determining when their productive/enjoyable life was over and allow them to make their peace with the world and exit on their own terms. Not just in a legal sense, though that is tremendously important, but in a sense of family and friends genuinely respecting one anothers right to their own lives and deaths.

///Just watched one of my best friends dad kept alive 2 years too long, and if they hadn't changed oncologists it would have been another six months of rolling around in a delusional state with constant pain waiting for diaper changes. farking disrespectful to a strong man, a good father, a Marine Corps veteran. In my world when he reached the threshold (his choice) there'd be a ceremony and speeches followed by private goodbyes, hand holding, crying, and wife holding him while his final sleep came. Just like I did for my dog last winter. I didn't want to extend his pain either. Now I'm crying, dammit.
 
2012-08-02 12:11:47 PM
Subby, die with festering boils.

There are plenty of people out there who don't need to be reminded how miserable their lives are and how much of outcasts they are do to no fault of their own. They have a disease; they are not SICK.

Eeewwww, Subby, ewwwww. I hope the one whore in this world who finally breaks down and farks you (double rates just because it's you Subby) gives you the worst cocktail of STDs since penis found a warm tight place.

/WTF
/Welcome to Fark not What the Fark
 
2012-08-02 12:14:35 PM
Just like I did for my dog last winter. I didn't want to extend his pain either. Now I'm crying, dammit.

Now that I reread that I see it's going to come across as trite to some, but I believe it's a moral equivalent. In the case of a pet or pregnancy the caregiver has the difficult responsibility of honestly assessing whether the life has any quality. My poor dogs life, alas, no longer did:(
 
2012-08-02 12:26:37 PM

notatrollorami: Just like I did for my dog last winter. I didn't want to extend his pain either. Now I'm crying, dammit.

Now that I reread that I see it's going to come across as trite to some, but I believe it's a moral equivalent. In the case of a pet or pregnancy the caregiver has the difficult responsibility of honestly assessing whether the life has any quality. My poor dogs life, alas, no longer did:(


Nah, it's cool. It's an expression of love and respect, whether it's your dog or your friend's father. If we truly care for things, whether they be dogs or people, we would have more conversations about the quality of their lives, rather than the quantity.
 
2012-08-02 12:44:28 PM

wildcardjack: Do you have a disfiguring skin condition?

[profile.ak.fbcdn.net image 200x260]

No? Then whatever you do, don't shake his hand.


That's not Foul Old Ron.
 
2012-08-02 12:49:04 PM
Kirzania:
So weird since I had somehow stumbled upon this blog a few months ago. Having a one year old makes this so awful to read.

FFFFFUUUUUUUUUUU. Not reading that. No farking way, Jose.

/also has a baby
 
2012-08-02 12:54:30 PM

geezus: trappedspirit: Is this one of those diseases that without the miracle of modern science would have simply fallen out of our gene pool but instead we keep it afloat just enough so that people can suffer with it and reproduce?

*checks article*

doesn't sound like it from the replies, but is it detectable during pregnancy? early enough it's cool to abort and try again if it's so rare?

I know people are like, what if it was einstein or something (or it's gods will) and want to have their baby and try and give it a good life no matter what, but what if the healthy kid you would have a year later to replace the defect (wouldnt' have been born otherwise) would be einstein and instead all you get is someone who lives in misery and makes your life super difficult too?


It's a very tough decision, which is why some of us think it should be up to the individual, not the government, even though some...or even most...of those individuals may choose "wrongly".
 
2012-08-02 01:06:22 PM
Subby, that headline calls up some seriously disturbing images, not unlike those web memes of disturbing family photographs or disturbing pet photographs.

There is such a thing as too much family togetherness. If I had a skin disease that bonded me to my family, I'd kill myself with a potato-peeler. Nice people, but I wouldn't want to live with them and risk the mass murder-suicide thing like so many unfortunate members of my generation(s) (it's not quite clear which generation I belong to--they keep moving the lines).

To quote the Fridge Magnet, "Happiness is having a large, loving, caring, close-knit family in another city."--George Burns

George Burns really understood human nature. That is probably why he lived so long. Him and Bob Hope, who nearly made it to 100, well before some his jokes.
 
2012-08-02 01:25:01 PM

trappedspirit: Is this one of those diseases that without the miracle of modern science would have simply fallen out of our gene pool but instead we keep it afloat just enough so that people can suffer with it and reproduce?

*checks article*


Despite what conservatives and Ayn Randites fear, charity does not harm the gene pool.

This disease is so rare that it remains latent in the population and pops up at a fairly constant rate. It's too rare to breed out (which is what first and second cousin marriages are for, if you believe some scientists who like to look on the bright side of things) and thus doesn't get concentrated enough to become more frequent. It severdly damages the reproductive chances of inviduals who get a bad case of the disease, but otherwise doesn't get selected for or against.

In a very small population, the "Founder Effect" can cause a mutation, even a damaging one, to spread through the small population, creating, for example, a tribe of ginger-haired freaks. But even in the places where this has happened, such as Scotland or Ireland), only a minority of people (14-15% in Ireland and the fairest bits of Scotland) would be ginger, because it is a recessive gene that survives through being spread by "carriers" who don't suffer the consequences. The blondest of races (the Blond Beast) is only about a quarter blond(e). This mutation is about 9,000 years old, IIRC. It has popped up more than once--there is a South Sea Island where many people are blond--this has been shown to be a local mutation, not breeding with blond sailors, although there may have been a bit of that.

The spread of hemophilia in Queen Victoria's descendance shows this pattern: many royals suffered from it, but most didn't and just passed it on. The gene defect that causes hemophilia would be inherited by both sexes, but only affects males who have one female chromosome rather than two. Unless a female has two defective female chromosomes (unlikely), she wouldn't suffer from hemophilia at all. There are many diseases that affect only men because of the Y chromosome being shorter than the X chromosome, the result of an accident that has turned the Y chromosome into a small repository for genes that affect maleness, notably the production of sperm. It is not going to disappear any time soon, by the way, despite rumours.

Modern science and humanitarian values do not encourage the spread of genes that kill. Genes that kill usually prevent their own spread unless they are very rare or recessive or both. Nature is self-correcting at all levels because mistakes kill, adaptations prosper.

Most of the unfortunate individuals who have bad cases of such diseases do not live to reproduce, and their family members are perfectly healthy, even if they chance to carry the gene or to have a feeble version of the disease.
 
2012-08-02 02:25:46 PM
My son, ex-wife, and her father all have a simplex version of EB. The skin doesn't fall right off, but they do blister very easily. Because of the long distance between classes, my son has to ride a scooter at school or his feet look like ground beef at the end of the week. Very rare disease, but it popped up three times in a row.
 
2012-08-02 02:56:03 PM

PunGent: geezus: trappedspirit: Is this one of those diseases that without the miracle of modern science would have simply fallen out of our gene pool but instead we keep it afloat just enough so that people can suffer with it and reproduce?

*checks article*

doesn't sound like it from the replies, but is it detectable during pregnancy? early enough it's cool to abort and try again if it's so rare?

I know people are like, what if it was einstein or something (or it's gods will) and want to have their baby and try and give it a good life no matter what, but what if the healthy kid you would have a year later to replace the defect (wouldnt' have been born otherwise) would be einstein and instead all you get is someone who lives in misery and makes your life super difficult too?

It's a very tough decision, which is why some of us think it should be up to the individual, not the government, even though some...or even most...of those individuals may choose "wrongly".


That would be nice if the parents could choose. I think i'd want equivalent of the 30 day return policy- if the baby isn't healthy or problems that would drastically affect the quality of life are discovered in the first 30 days after birth, the best move for for my family would be to abort and try again. I don't really see a baby as a small human until around a year or 2 old when they start to be self aware. Think of it more like gardening, where you cull the weak when young. You don't see any gardeners slaving away to give the sick plants the best life possible for the sake of life. sure a human is not a plant, but we're similar in many ways, and a baby isn't much of a human either. Just a potential one, just like my sperm, or an early fetus. It's like a blank slate until you teach and train it. A computer without the OS.
 
2012-08-02 03:14:19 PM

Quantum Apostrophe: phaseolus: Won't be too long before genetic disorders like this are curable, from what I've read. Something about using genetically-modified retroviruses to replace faulty genes, keratin genes in this case, with ones that work.

I certainly hope so.


It's been 20 year since my then-nine-year-old daughter was diagnosed with Cystic Fibrosis. The above is what the doctors told us at the time. It's still not here. She's on massive anti-biotics pretty much full time and has lost a quarter of her lung capacity, but we are grateful she's doing so well.

In other words, gene therapy is still pretty much pie in the sky.
 
2012-08-02 03:39:21 PM
Here's a short feature from BBC about a man who was living with this disorder, and its just about the most soul-crushing thing you will ever see:

Link
 
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