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(Wired)   Amazon brings its Cloud and video player to the iPad   (wired.com) divider line 55
    More: Ironic, Kindle Fire, video player, iPads, Amazon, Kindle, clouds, Apple TV, Sons Of Anarchy  
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1752 clicks; posted to Geek » on 01 Aug 2012 at 11:29 PM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2012-08-01 08:49:32 PM
Hey, Amazon - we want an app for Android! You already have an Android APK for the Kindle, just port it over for the rest of us.
 
2012-08-01 10:05:56 PM

RexTalionis: Hey, Amazon - we want an app for Android! You already have an Android APK for the Kindle, just port it over for the rest of us.


Don't worry, you can already use it on the Fire. Or are we not claiming that's an Android tablet unless we're arguing about sales figures?

/flamebait
 
2012-08-01 10:19:44 PM

MacEnvy: RexTalionis: Hey, Amazon - we want an app for Android! You already have an Android APK for the Kindle, just port it over for the rest of us.

Don't worry, you can already use it on the Fire. Or are we not claiming that's an Android tablet unless we're arguing about sales figures?

/flamebait


Shaddup.
 
2012-08-01 10:35:08 PM

RexTalionis: MacEnvy: RexTalionis: Hey, Amazon - we want an app for Android! You already have an Android APK for the Kindle, just port it over for the rest of us.

Don't worry, you can already use it on the Fire. Or are we not claiming that's an Android tablet unless we're arguing about sales figures?

/flamebait

Shaddup.


Well argued. I concede the point.
 
2012-08-01 11:36:10 PM
Keep your friends close, and your enemies closer.
 
2012-08-01 11:37:43 PM
[Ironic] Service distribution company brings service to multiple platforms

Amazon, has shopping apps on all platforms, kindle apps on all platforms. They have a simple strategy of selling as much stuff to as many people as possible.
 
2012-08-01 11:43:01 PM
Hooray! I actually got useful news from FARK!
 
2012-08-01 11:43:37 PM

Faddy: [Ironic] Service distribution company brings service to multiple platforms

Amazon, has shopping apps on all platforms, kindle apps on all platforms. They have a simple strategy of selling as much stuff to as many people as possible.


I have an Android tablet running ICS. No Amazon shopping app for it. Yet. At last since the last time I checked (Monday)
 
2012-08-01 11:44:38 PM
So, will Apple sue Amazon for doing this?
 
2012-08-01 11:53:37 PM

Fark Me To Tears: So, will Apple sue Amazon for doing this?


It's in the Apple Store, so I'd say no. If I remember right, Amazon's been trying to get it in for a while.

I wouldn't be surprised if the threat of a lawsuit/anti-trust action finally forced Apple to let it in.
Either way, as long as Apple and Amazon are competing openly, I'm ok with it.

I prefer Amazon Video over iTunes because you can play it from a browser on a PC/laptop and don't need a special app for it.
 
2012-08-02 12:06:59 AM

MacEnvy: RexTalionis: Hey, Amazon - we want an app for Android! You already have an Android APK for the Kindle, just port it over for the rest of us.

Don't worry, you can already use it on the Fire. Or are we not claiming that's an Android tablet unless we're arguing about sales figures?

/flamebait


I wouldn't mind the app being Fire only as much if the thing had an HDMI port
 
2012-08-02 12:11:23 AM

ScreamingHangover: Fark Me To Tears: So, will Apple sue Amazon for doing this?

It's in the Apple Store, so I'd say no. If I remember right, Amazon's been trying to get it in for a while.

I wouldn't be surprised if the threat of a lawsuit/anti-trust action finally forced Apple to let it in.
Either way, as long as Apple and Amazon are competing openly, I'm ok with it.

I prefer Amazon Video over iTunes because you can play it from a browser on a PC/laptop and don't need a special app for it.


It's also broadly supported when it comes to streaming devices for your HDTV. Roku, Xbox, and PS3 all have apps for it. Amazon is also nice because they combine the cheap streaming library of Netflix with the instant gratification of iTunes or Redbox. Their daily deals on movie rentals are also nice. I just grabbed HD rentals of Sherlock Holmes: Game of Shadows, Friends with Kids, and 21 Jump Street for $2 each today.
 
2012-08-02 12:14:37 AM

Insane_Cellist: MacEnvy: RexTalionis: Hey, Amazon - we want an app for Android! You already have an Android APK for the Kindle, just port it over for the rest of us.

Don't worry, you can already use it on the Fire. Or are we not claiming that's an Android tablet unless we're arguing about sales figures?

/flamebait

I wouldn't mind the app being Fire only as much if the thing had an HDMI port


The Fire downloads and streams are barely DVD quality, so an HDMI output wouldn't be very good quality. You're better off with a cheap Roku if you want to stream to a TV.
 
2012-08-02 12:16:09 AM
Interestingly enough, the DirecTv android app can stream video from channels you are subscribed to. The DirecTv Fire App doesn't have that capability.
 
2012-08-02 12:16:52 AM
It's not ironic. It's a big "fark your garden wall business model for a fairly open platform".

Unlike the Kindle Fire adaptation, which actually seems pretty locked down.

/My fondleslab is a year old Asus tablet.
//The web browser is all I use.
 
2012-08-02 12:22:05 AM

Mad_Radhu: Insane_Cellist: MacEnvy: RexTalionis: Hey, Amazon - we want an app for Android! You already have an Android APK for the Kindle, just port it over for the rest of us.

Don't worry, you can already use it on the Fire. Or are we not claiming that's an Android tablet unless we're arguing about sales figures?

/flamebait

I wouldn't mind the app being Fire only as much if the thing had an HDMI port

The Fire downloads and streams are barely DVD quality, so an HDMI output wouldn't be very good quality. You're better off with a cheap Roku if you want to stream to a TV.


I have success with an Apple mini rigged to output to my TV and use the browser to play video with a handheld keyboard/thumbpad I use as a remote.

/got it off craigslist for dirt cheap... mini remote keyboards on Amazon for 30 bucks.
 
2012-08-02 12:26:16 AM

Mad_Radhu: Insane_Cellist: MacEnvy: RexTalionis: Hey, Amazon - we want an app for Android! You already have an Android APK for the Kindle, just port it over for the rest of us.

Don't worry, you can already use it on the Fire. Or are we not claiming that's an Android tablet unless we're arguing about sales figures?

/flamebait

I wouldn't mind the app being Fire only as much if the thing had an HDMI port

The Fire downloads and streams are barely DVD quality, so an HDMI output wouldn't be very good quality. You're better off with a cheap Roku if you want to stream to a TV.


I got a Blackberry Playbook for free when it came out, and it was just about worthless for entertainment purposes until Amazon started up the streaming in HD, which worked flawlessly for a few months before Amazon killed it to force people to buy Kindle Fires.

This is all the more ironic because Amazon used the reference build of the Playbook for the Kindle Fire.

Someone at Blackberry must have really pissed off someone at Amazon, because I was at a conference where an Amazon VP announced a Kindle App for the Playbook (before it launched). Not only has that app not materialized, Amazon is doing it's best to make the browser version of the reader incompatible on the Playbook, in addition to the video streaming block.
 
2012-08-02 12:41:33 AM
Now if they would only add search capabilities to the app, it would be almost perfect.
Why does Android need an app, I thought they had flash?
Does that not work?
 
2012-08-02 01:02:07 AM

Mad_Radhu: The Fire downloads and streams are barely DVD quality, so an HDMI output wouldn't be very good quality. You're better off with a cheap Roku if you want to stream to a TV.


ScreamingHangover: I have success with an Apple mini rigged to output to my TV and use the browser to play video with a handheld keyboard/thumbpad I use as a remote.

/got it off craigslist for dirt cheap... mini remote keyboards on Amazon for 30 bucks.


I appreciate the suggestions, but I'm in the market for a 7-inch tablet with HDMI, microSD and mini USB. Unfortunately such a thing doesn't yet exist.

/Has an original Transformer
//Works to watch movies but too heavy to hold for surfing/games
///power cord is far to short
 
2012-08-02 01:44:20 AM

BravadoGT: Faddy: [Ironic] Service distribution company brings service to multiple platforms

Amazon, has shopping apps on all platforms, kindle apps on all platforms. They have a simple strategy of selling as much stuff to as many people as possible.

I have an Android tablet running ICS. No Amazon shopping app for it. Yet. At last since the last time I checked (Monday)


The very tab I am typing this on is a touch pad with ICS on it. I have the Amazon storefront app on it and have had it since the end of May.
 
2012-08-02 02:34:26 AM

Fark Me To Tears: So, will Apple sue Amazon for doing this?


They've had the Kindle app for both iOS and Mac for several years. Once again, reality trumps your anti-Apple brainwashing.
 
2012-08-02 03:28:11 AM

BravadoGT: Faddy: [Ironic] Service distribution company brings service to multiple platforms

Amazon, has shopping apps on all platforms, kindle apps on all platforms. They have a simple strategy of selling as much stuff to as many people as possible.

I have an Android tablet running ICS. No Amazon shopping app for it. Yet. At last since the last time I checked (Monday)


Just side load the Amazon apk. I did it on my Nexus 7, and it works fine. You can find links for the latest apk at almost any android forum.
 
2012-08-02 03:38:44 AM

Abe Vigoda's Ghost: BravadoGT: Faddy: [Ironic] Service distribution company brings service to multiple platforms

Amazon, has shopping apps on all platforms, kindle apps on all platforms. They have a simple strategy of selling as much stuff to as many people as possible.

I have an Android tablet running ICS. No Amazon shopping app for it. Yet. At last since the last time I checked (Monday)

Just side load the Amazon apk. I did it on my Nexus 7, and it works fine. You can find links for the latest apk at almost any android forum.


Or just go to amazon and get them.
 
2012-08-02 04:55:04 AM

bingethinker: Fark Me To Tears: So, will Apple sue Amazon for doing this?

They've had the Kindle app for both iOS and Mac for several years. Once again, reality trumps your anti-Apple brainwashing.


I'm reasonably sure he was joking.

I was under the impression that Amazon and Apple were fighting over the Amazon app. I thought Apple wanted 30% of whatever Amazon sold via their app which Amazon didn't really like.
 
2012-08-02 06:22:23 AM

Insane_Cellist: I appreciate the suggestions, but I'm in the market for a 7-inch tablet with HDMI, microSD and mini USB. Unfortunately such a thing doesn't yet exist.


And likely never will. All manufacturers are moving away from additional ports in an effort to control costs and size.

Why not just stream it from a Nexus 7?
 
2012-08-02 07:41:02 AM

Herr Flick's Revenge: Now if they would only add search capabilities to the app, it would be almost perfect.
Why does Android need an app, I thought they had flash?
Does that not work?


Know how I know you've never used Flash on Android?
 
2012-08-02 07:56:52 AM
Too bad the Amazon video app doesn't mirror to AppleTV with AirPlay. Audio-only right now. *slow sarcastic clap*
 
2012-08-02 08:31:28 AM

change1211: bingethinker: Fark Me To Tears: So, will Apple sue Amazon for doing this?

They've had the Kindle app for both iOS and Mac for several years. Once again, reality trumps your anti-Apple brainwashing.

I'm reasonably sure he was joking.

I was under the impression that Amazon and Apple were fighting over the Amazon app. I thought Apple wanted 30% of whatever Amazon sold via their app which Amazon didn't really like.


Apple has been accepting third-party apps that feature a competing product as long as they either get 30% of the price or there is no way to sell that competing product from within the app. None of the Amazon digital apps have any way to buy their product from within the app; you have to go to the website directly.
 
2012-08-02 08:32:54 AM
Cool! I've been waiting for this.
 
2012-08-02 08:44:08 AM
"Whispersync for Instant Video keeps track of your progress in a piece of content, and syncs a video placeholder with other devices tied to your account. So, if you're at a pivotal scene during a Doctor Who episode and you stop the video, you can pick up where you left off on another device that supports Amazon Instant Video"

Because remembering whether you stopped at the 15:20 point or the 22:38 point is hard
 
2012-08-02 08:57:57 AM
This is a good thing, in a way.
If tablets become app/music/cloud store neutral, Apple no longer has a lock on the market and it becomes all about who can make the fastest and cheapest tablets. Anyone can build a device that accesses any store.

/Not exactly what's happening.
/Amazon is opening its own store in Apple turf.
/Still hopeful.
 
2012-08-02 09:14:35 AM
Watching tv is eventually going to get so complicated that people are going to just give up and go outside before all the different organization fighting over your eyeballs get their acts together.

/one can dream
 
2012-08-02 09:49:28 AM

way south: This is a good thing, in a way.
If tablets become app/music/cloud store neutral, Apple no longer has a lock on the market and it becomes all about who can make the fastest and cheapest tablets. Anyone can build a device that accesses any store.


When did that happen?
 
2012-08-02 09:56:22 AM
Still somewhat patiently waiting for the ATV3 jailbreak so I can enjoy XBMC.
/otherwise I'll suck it up and get a mac mini
//those android sticks look kinda neat
 
2012-08-02 11:13:20 AM

digistil: Insane_Cellist: I appreciate the suggestions, but I'm in the market for a 7-inch tablet with HDMI, microSD and mini USB. Unfortunately such a thing doesn't yet exist.

And likely never will. All manufacturers are moving away from additional ports in an effort to control costs and size.

Why not just stream it from a Nexus 7?


Really? 7-inch Iconia doesn't exist in your world?
 
2012-08-02 11:39:45 AM

Cloudchaser Sakonige the Red Wolf: "Whispersync for Instant Video keeps track of your progress in a piece of content, and syncs a video placeholder with other devices tied to your account. So, if you're at a pivotal scene during a Doctor Who episode and you stop the video, you can pick up where you left off on another device that supports Amazon Instant Video"

Because remembering whether you stopped at the 15:20 point or the 22:38 point is hard


What a stupid thing to biatch about.

If you're in the middle of a TV show or movie and have to shut it off and walk away for whatever reason for however long, do you honestly remember, "I was at the 92:16 mark?" If so, good for you. But even still, are you saying it's not at all convienent to click the "Resume" button and have the video start up instantly from that point, rather than have to recall the exact time you stopped, start play, then skip up to that point? Not to mention the fact that works across any device to which your account is attached.
 
2012-08-02 11:55:09 AM

theurge14: way south: This is a good thing, in a way.
If tablets become app/music/cloud store neutral, Apple no longer has a lock on the market and it becomes all about who can make the fastest and cheapest tablets. Anyone can build a device that accesses any store.

When did that happen?


Read the bold section.
 
2012-08-02 12:05:38 PM
Who cares about a service that's inferior to Netflix.
 
2012-08-02 12:24:08 PM

change1211: theurge14: way south: This is a good thing, in a way.
If tablets become app/music/cloud store neutral, Apple no longer has a lock on the market and it becomes all about who can make the fastest and cheapest tablets. Anyone can build a device that accesses any store.

When did that happen?

Read the bold section.


Yes, and I was wondering why Apple was singled out when Google Play only works on Android devices and Marketplace on works on Windows Phone.

Perhaps the apps/music/cloud part really is the product?

/Razor blades for a Mach 3
//Inkjet cartridges...
 
2012-08-02 12:38:57 PM
[ turning blue holding my breath for Windows Phone 7.5 or 8 Amazon Cloud Player app. ]
 
2012-08-02 12:56:55 PM

theurge14: change1211: theurge14: way south: This is a good thing, in a way.
If tablets become app/music/cloud store neutral, Apple no longer has a lock on the market and it becomes all about who can make the fastest and cheapest tablets. Anyone can build a device that accesses any store.

When did that happen?

Read the bold section.

Yes, and I was wondering why Apple was singled out when Google Play only works on Android devices and Marketplace on works on Windows Phone.

Perhaps the apps/music/cloud part really is the product?

/Razor blades for a Mach 3
//Inkjet cartridges...


I am biased against Apple because they are the market leader and I own one of their tablets (and its a good tablet, I won't deny that).
The problem I have is the app software store has locked me in. If I switch tablets for something cheaper or faster, I lose access to a hundred bucks worth of stuff. If I switch from that tablet to a future apple product, I cant use the other stuff.
Compare that to a PC where I can use stuff that was written in the 90's and still runs just fine.

If the stores work across all devices, the customer can pick the store with the stuff he wants and the tablet design that works best.

/This probably wont happen, but a man can dream.
/I might as well ask for games to be compatible on different consoles.
 
2012-08-02 12:58:34 PM
I'm just pointing out that that's true for the entire mobile OS market.
 
2012-08-02 01:01:01 PM
I'm not sold on Cloud computing or networking at all. It just seems like hooking your house up to a mini-Skynet. Sure, I'd love to have my phone/computer/tablet/refrigerator/TV/microwave/AC all connected to the Cloud, until some douchebag net hacker from Singapore creates a worm that infects and crashes everything connected to it, or worse, gains access to all the information and shared files and steals all of your account info.

Am I the only one worried about this Cloud craze?
 
2012-08-02 01:10:42 PM

ScreamingHangover: Either way, as long as Apple and Amazon are competing openly, I'm ok with it.


It is a shame the reverse isn't true, we won't see iTunes on the Fire. Not for any locked down walled garden reasons but because it's just not something I can see Apple doing. Which is a pity because I live with this fanciful notion that one day someone will write a widget that makes an Android phone pretend to be an iPhone as far as the Mac it's connected to is concerned (i.e. it syncs without kludges).
 
2012-08-02 01:20:09 PM

BudTheSpud:

Am I the only one worried about this Cloud craze?


Nope. The cloud is this bubbles version of the dot com, it's the one stop shop for to fix your every problem. Now issues with this in the corporate space aside a consumer is faced with a much more irksome prospect, residential internet. It's usually asynchonus bandwidth and the upstream is very weak compared to the down... you're kinda going to need it beefy both ways if you want to edit your video and be all "to the cloud!" (FU Win7 adverts, FU) at the same time... yeah.

If the majority had this Google Fibre (and similar speeds from other services) and assuming it's duplex then yeah it'd all work wonderfully. But when you're on a 2Mbp/s upstream trying to edit the 3GB video of granny's birthday without local software you'll be wondering where it all went wrong.

I'd ear mark such time as being a decade away, just like fusion power plants.
 
2012-08-02 02:23:13 PM

way south: theurge14: change1211: theurge14: way south: This is a good thing, in a way.
If tablets become app/music/cloud store neutral, Apple no longer has a lock on the market and it becomes all about who can make the fastest and cheapest tablets. Anyone can build a device that accesses any store.

When did that happen?

Read the bold section.

Yes, and I was wondering why Apple was singled out when Google Play only works on Android devices and Marketplace on works on Windows Phone.

Perhaps the apps/music/cloud part really is the product?

/Razor blades for a Mach 3
//Inkjet cartridges...

I am biased against Apple because they are the market leader and I own one of their tablets (and its a good tablet, I won't deny that).
The problem I have is the app software store has locked me in. If I switch tablets for something cheaper or faster, I lose access to a hundred bucks worth of stuff. If I switch from that tablet to a future apple product, I cant use the other stuff.
Compare that to a PC where I can use stuff that was written in the 90's and still runs just fine.

If the stores work across all devices, the customer can pick the store with the stuff he wants and the tablet design that works best.

/This probably wont happen, but a man can dream.
/I might as well ask for games to be compatible on different consoles.


As an ex-Windows user, I used to worry about the same thing. "What if I want to switch/how future-proof is my software/data?" Having been an Apple user the last 5 years, I no longer care about this, and wonder why I ever did. Why would I want to switch? I'm on a platform I love and never want to leave (I always used Windows out of necessity, and certainly never "loved" it). Even if I did want to switch, in 10 years or whatever in case the Apple experience goes down the tubes somehow, is it worth compromising my experience today for something that might never happen anyway?

I would even go so far as to say that Windows users typically worry about this, because who in the hell ever wants to commit to Windows? I was always unconciously looking for a way to get off Windows, I just never realized it until I found the thing I wanted to go to instead.

"Worry is like interest paid on a debt that never comes due." If you love the platform you're on, then buy into it and commit. The lack of worry is an unnecessary burden relieved.
 
2012-08-02 02:36:07 PM

karmachameleon: I would even go so far as to say that Windows users typically worry about this, because who in the hell ever wants to commit to Windows? I was always unconciously looking for a way to get off Windows, I just never realized it until I found the thing I wanted to go to instead.


We worry about what's going to happen with the stuff we spent our money on if we decide to switch, something Apple users don't really care about considering how much they flushed to get their hardware. I would be pissed right the **** off if Steam went down, as much as I would if I bought a new tablet and realized my hundreds in appstore purchases couldn't travel with it because of a closed OS.
 
2012-08-02 03:37:39 PM

way south: theurge14: change1211: theurge14: way south: This is a good thing, in a way.
If tablets become app/music/cloud store neutral, Apple no longer has a lock on the market and it becomes all about who can make the fastest and cheapest tablets. Anyone can build a device that accesses any store.

When did that happen?

Read the bold section.

Yes, and I was wondering why Apple was singled out when Google Play only works on Android devices and Marketplace on works on Windows Phone.

Perhaps the apps/music/cloud part really is the product?

/Razor blades for a Mach 3
//Inkjet cartridges...

I am biased against Apple because they are the market leader and I own one of their tablets (and its a good tablet, I won't deny that).
The problem I have is the app software store has locked me in. If I switch tablets for something cheaper or faster, I lose access to a hundred bucks worth of stuff. If I switch from that tablet to a future apple product, I cant use the other stuff.
Compare that to a PC where I can use stuff that was written in the 90's and still runs just fine.

If the stores work across all devices, the customer can pick the store with the stuff he wants and the tablet design that works best.

/This probably wont happen, but a man can dream.
/I might as well ask for games to be compatible on different consoles.


Depends on what sort of stuff you're talking about. I have an iPad, and a Nexus 7 tablet. As far as content (books, movies, and even music) I can access it on both systems. That is as long as the books, movies, and music is not purchased from Apple.
Any books or movies I get from Google Play, I can access it on the iPad with the Google apps. I can of course also read any ebooks from Amazon or Barnes and Noble.
 
2012-08-02 08:47:46 PM

karmachameleon: way south: theurge14: change1211: theurge14: way south: This is a good thing, in a way.
If tablets become app/music/cloud store neutral, Apple no longer has a lock on the market and it becomes all about who can make the fastest and cheapest tablets. Anyone can build a device that accesses any store.

When did that happen?

Read the bold section.

Yes, and I was wondering why Apple was singled out when Google Play only works on Android devices and Marketplace on works on Windows Phone.

Perhaps the apps/music/cloud part really is the product?

/Razor blades for a Mach 3
//Inkjet cartridges...

I am biased against Apple because they are the market leader and I own one of their tablets (and its a good tablet, I won't deny that).
The problem I have is the app software store has locked me in. If I switch tablets for something cheaper or faster, I lose access to a hundred bucks worth of stuff. If I switch from that tablet to a future apple product, I cant use the other stuff.
Compare that to a PC where I can use stuff that was written in the 90's and still runs just fine.

If the stores work across all devices, the customer can pick the store with the stuff he wants and the tablet design that works best.

/This probably wont happen, but a man can dream.
/I might as well ask for games to be compatible on different consoles.

As an ex-Windows user, I used to worry about the same thing. "What if I want to switch/how future-proof is my software/data?" Having been an Apple user the last 5 years, I no longer care about this, and wonder why I ever did. Why would I want to switch? I'm on a platform I love and never want to leave (I always used Windows out of necessity, and certainly never "loved" it). Even if I did want to switch, in 10 years or whatever in case the Apple experience goes down the tubes somehow, is it worth compromising my experience today for something that might never happen anyway?

I would even go so far as to say that Windows users typically worry about this, because who in the hell ever wants to commit to Windows? I was always unconciously looking for a way to get off Windows, I just never realized it until I found the thing I wanted to go to instead.

"Worry is like interest paid on a debt that never comes due." If you love the platform you're on, then buy into it and commit. The lack of worry is an unnecessary burden relieved.


The hardest part about switching to Mac is feeling stupid for talking so much shiat about Macs. Just cover it up by blaming mountain lion's quality or retina displays or something. Apple has enough compelling stuff coming out all the time to justify switching.

Or you could blame the windows 8 preview or say you wanna make iphone apps. But act real sad about it.

/fear is the anticipation of pain
 
2012-08-02 11:44:28 PM

UrCa: karmachameleon: I would even go so far as to say that Windows users typically worry about this, because who in the hell ever wants to commit to Windows? I was always unconciously looking for a way to get off Windows, I just never realized it until I found the thing I wanted to go to instead.

We worry about what's going to happen with the stuff we spent our money on if we decide to switch, something Apple users don't really care about considering how much they flushed to get their hardware. I would be pissed right the **** off if Steam went down, as much as I would if I bought a new tablet and realized my hundreds in appstore purchases couldn't travel with it because of a closed OS.


And what are the chances either Apple or Steam are going to go under any time soon, forcing a move? Answer: not worth worrying about. Seriously.
 
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