Do you have adblock enabled?
If you can read this, either the style sheet didn't load or you have an older browser that doesn't support style sheets. Try clearing your browser cache and refreshing the page.

(Talking Points Memo)   PA Secretary of State: "I have no idea what the voter ID law says, but I'm certain nobody will be prevented from voting because of it"   (tpmmuckraker.talkingpointsmemo.com) divider line 278
    More: Dumbass, PA Secretary of State, ID laws, secretary of states, voter ID  
•       •       •

2098 clicks; posted to Politics » on 31 Jul 2012 at 5:53 PM (3 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



278 Comments   (+0 »)
   
View Voting Results: Smartest and Funniest

Archived thread
 
2012-07-31 04:48:45 PM  
"I mean, except the people we don't want voting. Y'know, those people."
 
2012-07-31 04:56:48 PM  
This new crew in Harrisburg doesn't have a clue.
 
2012-07-31 05:08:45 PM  
That look on her face is somewhere between "deer in headlights" and "are you a wizard?".
 
2012-07-31 05:13:06 PM  

Marcus Aurelius: This new crew in Harrisburg doesn't have a clue.


I think there's something in the water in Harrisburg. Methinks there's residual fallout from 3 Mile island, which makes all of our elected officials dumber than a box of rocks.
 
2012-07-31 05:20:45 PM  

Angry Drunk Bureaucrat: Marcus Aurelius: This new crew in Harrisburg doesn't have a clue.

I think there's something in the water in Harrisburg. Methinks there's residual fallout from 3 Mile island, which makes all of our elected officials dumber than a box of rocks.


Carol Aichele was a local state senator at one point down in SEPA. She only got this gig because she was connected to Corbett. So no consideration of her talent or suitability went into her choice for this post.

Not that any of the others in the past were any better....
 
2012-07-31 05:53:10 PM  

Diogenes: That look on her face is somewhere between "deer in headlights" and "are you a wizard?".


talkingpointsmemo.com
I heard, from my dear friend Tiberius Ogden, that you can produce a Patronus?
 
2012-07-31 05:57:28 PM  
Wow, the quote wasn't far off at all.
 
2012-07-31 05:57:34 PM  
Just show your picture ID and you'll fly right through. You know, that thing you have to show to buy beer, cash a check, drive a car, show a cop if he wants to see it, etc....

Who doesn't have a photo ID, especially when state will give you one if you can't afford it.
 
2012-07-31 05:58:27 PM  

shotglasss: Just show your picture ID and you'll fly right through. You know, that thing you have to show to buy beer, cash a check, drive a car, show a cop if he wants to see it, etc....

Who doesn't have a photo ID, especially when state will give you one if you can't afford it.


If you don't have supporting evidence it becomes very difficult and expensive to get that "free" ID.
 
2012-07-31 05:59:24 PM  
If they were serious about voter fraud, there'd be a free national ID card and purple fingers.
 
2012-07-31 05:59:39 PM  

shotglasss: Just show your picture ID and you'll fly right through. You know, that thing you have to show to buy beer, cash a check, drive a car, show a cop if he wants to see it, etc....

Who doesn't have a photo ID, especially when state will give you one if you can't afford it.


10% of voters don't according to those stubborn "facts". Why they don't is a mute point, the fact is that they don't.
 
2012-07-31 06:00:51 PM  
There should be unlimited liability for legislators that back legislation which proves to be unconstitutional. Let the disenfranchised voters bring a class action lawsuit against the offending legislators and take every nickle and piece of property they own. There's absolutely no excuse for the state to indemnify malicious or incompetent actions.
 
2012-07-31 06:01:26 PM  
The Republicans are the party that says government doesn't work and then they get elected and prove it.
-PJ O'Rourke
 
2012-07-31 06:01:54 PM  

shotglasss: Just show your picture ID and you'll fly right through. You know, that thing you have to show to buy beer, cash a check, drive a car, show a cop if he wants to see it, etc....

Who doesn't have a photo ID, especially when state will give you one if you can't afford it.


If buying beer, cashing checks, or driving cars were constitutionally guaranteed rights, you might have a point. Since they're not, what are you talking about?
 
2012-07-31 06:02:15 PM  
Well, we were told we need leaders not readers.
 
2012-07-31 06:02:28 PM  
How the hell do you leave your house to go testify about something and not even read about it first?

/get a brain
 
2012-07-31 06:02:52 PM  
stood by her unsupported claim that 99 percent of voters had valid identification

By a quick Google it looks like the voting population of PA is just a shade under 10 million people. So even if her wild-assed guess is correct that's still around 100,000 people who won't be able to vote.

This is such a bald-faced attempt to steal elections for Republicans I don't know how they can make these claims with a straight face.
 
2012-07-31 06:05:03 PM  

shotglasss: Just show your picture ID and you'll fly right through. You know, that thing you have to show to buy beer, cash a check, drive a car, show a cop if he wants to see it, etc....

Who doesn't have a photo ID, especially when state will give you one if you can't afford it.


None of those things you listed are an absolute right of citizenship.

Not being required to hold/carry an ID card is.

Just because most of us choose to voluntarily carry a form of State-issued ID, doesn't mean that it should be a requirement to exercise our rights as citizens.

/knows some people who live "off the grid"
//not the life for me, but they still have the farking right to vote
 
2012-07-31 06:05:18 PM  
The culturally inferior ones should not be allowed to vote. This means only mormons (male, white Mormons, that is) should be allowed to vote.
 
2012-07-31 06:05:27 PM  

Rich Cream: How the hell do you leave your house to go testify about something and not even read about it first?

/get a brain


So you can feign ignorance and act surprised when your obviously unconstitutional law is overturned so you aren't put in jail for deliberately trying to deny people their rights.
 
2012-07-31 06:06:29 PM  

fusillade762: stood by her unsupported claim that 99 percent of voters had valid identification

By a quick Google it looks like the voting population of PA is just a shade under 10 million people. So even if her wild-assed guess is correct that's still around 100,000 people who won't be able to vote.

This is such a bald-faced attempt to steal elections for Republicans I don't know how they can make these claims with a straight face.



Because the Media won't call them out on it. The MSM is nothing more than the PR Dept for Global Corporate Socialism. It is over.
 
2012-07-31 06:06:47 PM  

fusillade762: This is such a bald-faced attempt to steal elections for Republicans I don't know how they can make these claims with a straight face.


They've convinced themselves that the ends justify the means. You can't argue with them once that's happened.
 
2012-07-31 06:08:10 PM  

shotglasss: Just show your picture ID and you'll fly right through. You know, that thing you have to show to buy beer, cash a check, drive a car, show a cop if he wants to see it, etc....



And showing that ID would solve this rampant problem:

The state has agreed it will not argue that there is any evidence of in-person voter impersonation fraud.

oh, wait.
 
2012-07-31 06:08:28 PM  

shotglasss: Just show your picture ID and you'll fly right through. You know, that thing you have to show to buy beer, cash a check, drive a car, show a cop if he wants to see it, etc....

Who doesn't have a photo ID, especially when state will give you one if you can't afford it.


Drinking alcohol is not a constitutionally protected right. I'd argue that purchasing beer does not involve the government, but this is Pennsylvania, so it does there.

Cashing a check is a transaction between private entities, not the government.

You do not need photo ID to drive a car. You need to be licensed to drive a car and the license takes the form of valid photo ID.

You do not need to show a cop your photo ID if he requests it. You must identify yourself, but you do not need to "present your papers" on demand. If a cop asks for your license while driving a car it is to verify that you are a licensed driver. If he asks for your drivers license while you're walking down the street, you can tell him "No, but my name is John Smith".

And while we're at it, show me where you can get a free photo ID from Pennsylvania. You can get a photo ID card from the DMV for $13.50, but that's not free. If you require this, then you're stating that it costs $13.50 to cast a vote in an election (minimally).
 
2012-07-31 06:09:08 PM  

shotglasss: Just show your picture ID and you'll fly right through. You know, that thing you have to show to buy beer, cash a check, drive a car, show a cop if he wants to see it, etc....

Who doesn't have a photo ID, especially when state will give you one if you can't afford it.


PAPERS, PLEASE, CITIZEN!
 
2012-07-31 06:10:35 PM  
I think this sums up what I've come to expect from politicians.
 
2012-07-31 06:11:13 PM  
It's so weird that so many people get worked up over the possibility majority-white, poor, welfare leech, Republicans, who vote against their own self-interests anyway, might be prevented from doing it...
 
2012-07-31 06:12:13 PM  

Agent Smiths Laugh: I think this sums up what I've come to expect from politicians.


I love the dumb look that grows on his face after a few seconds when he realizes he just called himself a blithering idiot. Hi-lar-i-ous.
 
2012-07-31 06:12:56 PM  

A Dark Evil Omen: shotglasss: Just show your picture ID and you'll fly right through. You know, that thing you have to show to buy beer, cash a check, drive a car, show a cop if he wants to see it, etc....

Who doesn't have a photo ID, especially when state will give you one if you can't afford it.

If you don't have supporting evidence it becomes very difficult and expensive to get that "free" ID.


For the record, I don't live in the state in question, so this is a generality with sort of an assumption that it probably applies, but the only documentation required to get a state ID in any of the three states I've lived in is a piece of traceable mail addressed to you with an in-state address (specifically, the address you're claiming on the ID). Traceable generally meaning a utility bill.

Of course, this would be the minimum, you could show up with a copy of a lease with your name on it, a letter from your landlord attesting you lived at x address, etc. At the very worst they might ask you to have such a reference letter notarized and witnessed, which costs like a buck and involves a notary specifically working with you to get some form of acceptable proof of identity.

Not terribly hard to do if you're not waiting until the absolute last minute to get it done, basically.

//This doesn't mean the ID law isn't a bad law, it's just a bad law because it's pointless and doesn't accomplish anything but inconveniencing a few people, not because it constitutes a poll tax.
 
2012-07-31 06:13:04 PM  
b>12349876: If they were serious about voter fraud, there'd be a free national ID card and purple fingers.

MOTHERFARKING THIS THIS THIS
 
2012-07-31 06:14:02 PM  

shotglasss: Just show your picture ID and you'll fly right through. You know, that thing you have to show to buy beer, cash a check, drive a car, show a cop if he wants to see it, etc....

Who doesn't have a photo ID, especially when state will give you one if you can't afford it.


Apparently half the counties in PA either don't have a DMV or the one they do have has very limited hours. How much inconveinence must one endure to exercise their constitutional right?

Pennsylvania also has some of the worst voting registation restrictions around? Why not relax the registration deadline when instituting mandatory voter ID, unless the purpose is supress turnout?

Opponents of the law have also paraded out an array of people that, for whatever reason, have been unable to obtain an eligible voter ID.
 
2012-07-31 06:15:03 PM  

Jim_Callahan: A Dark Evil Omen: shotglasss: Just show your picture ID and you'll fly right through. You know, that thing you have to show to buy beer, cash a check, drive a car, show a cop if he wants to see it, etc....

Who doesn't have a photo ID, especially when state will give you one if you can't afford it.

If you don't have supporting evidence it becomes very difficult and expensive to get that "free" ID.

For the record, I don't live in the state in question, so this is a generality with sort of an assumption that it probably applies, but the only documentation required to get a state ID in any of the three states I've lived in is a piece of traceable mail addressed to you with an in-state address (specifically, the address you're claiming on the ID). Traceable generally meaning a utility bill.

Of course, this would be the minimum, you could show up with a copy of a lease with your name on it, a letter from your landlord attesting you lived at x address, etc. At the very worst they might ask you to have such a reference letter notarized and witnessed, which costs like a buck and involves a notary specifically working with you to get some form of acceptable proof of identity.

Not terribly hard to do if you're not waiting until the absolute last minute to get it done, basically.

//This doesn't mean the ID law isn't a bad law, it's just a bad law because it's pointless and doesn't accomplish anything but inconveniencing a few people, not because it constitutes a poll tax.


If that is the only documentation required to get the ID , requiring the ID at the polls is pointless. It proves absolutely nothing.
 
2012-07-31 06:15:53 PM  

Jim_Callahan: A Dark Evil Omen: shotglasss: Just show your picture ID and you'll fly right through. You know, that thing you have to show to buy beer, cash a check, drive a car, show a cop if he wants to see it, etc....

Who doesn't have a photo ID, especially when state will give you one if you can't afford it.

If you don't have supporting evidence it becomes very difficult and expensive to get that "free" ID.

For the record, I don't live in the state in question, so this is a generality with sort of an assumption that it probably applies, but the only documentation required to get a state ID in any of the three states I've lived in is a piece of traceable mail addressed to you with an in-state address (specifically, the address you're claiming on the ID). Traceable generally meaning a utility bill.

Of course, this would be the minimum, you could show up with a copy of a lease with your name on it, a letter from your landlord attesting you lived at x address, etc. At the very worst they might ask you to have such a reference letter notarized and witnessed, which costs like a buck and involves a notary specifically working with you to get some form of acceptable proof of identity.

Not terribly hard to do if you're not waiting until the absolute last minute to get it done, basically.

//This doesn't mean the ID law isn't a bad law, it's just a bad law because it's pointless and doesn't accomplish anything but inconveniencing a few people, not because it constitutes a poll tax.


If it costs money and is a requirement to vote, it is a poll tax and is unconstitutional. Period.
 
2012-07-31 06:16:57 PM  

Serious Black: Agent Smiths Laugh: I think this sums up what I've come to expect from politicians.

I love the dumb look that grows on his face after a few seconds when he realizes he just called himself a blithering idiot. Hi-lar-i-ous.


Yeah here's a better clip that contains that.
 
2012-07-31 06:18:13 PM  
As I've said in most every other Voter ID thread; when asked why there is a sudden need for identification at the voting booth when there are almost zero cases of voter fraud, the answer will be how easy they are to obtain.
 
2012-07-31 06:18:50 PM  

Captain_Ballbeard: fusillade762: stood by her unsupported claim that 99 percent of voters had valid identification

By a quick Google it looks like the voting population of PA is just a shade under 10 million people. So even if her wild-assed guess is correct that's still around 100,000 people who won't be able to vote.

This is such a bald-faced attempt to steal elections for Republicans I don't know how they can make these claims with a straight face.


Because the Media won't call them out on it. The MSM is nothing more than the PR Dept for Global Corporate Socialism. It is over.


The media wants a horse race. More people voting means more people voting for Democrats, which in turn means less "neck-and-neck, down-to-the-wire horse race with a photo finish" and more "auto race between an RB7 and a Chevy Celebrity."
 
2012-07-31 06:20:39 PM  
Either she's lying about all of it, or she really doesn't know what the law says, but has blind faith that laws passed by Republicans must be a good thing.

Either way, kick her out of office.
 
2012-07-31 06:24:45 PM  
This is what you support when you vote for the GOP...
 
2012-07-31 06:25:23 PM  

A Dark Evil Omen: shotglasss: Just show your picture ID and you'll fly right through. You know, that thing you have to show to buy beer, cash a check, drive a car, show a cop if he wants to see it, etc....

Who doesn't have a photo ID, especially when state will give you one if you can't afford it.

If you don't have supporting evidence it becomes very difficult and expensive to get that "free" ID.


Meh. $30 tops. Just turn off the all access cable/dish channel, put down the crack pipe, stand out in front of your house and sell a couple of blowjobs. Skip 5 McDonalds meals, whatever. If you can't find a way to shiat $30 nowdays, you're not smart enough to vote.
 
2012-07-31 06:25:57 PM  

Tumunga: A Dark Evil Omen: shotglasss: Just show your picture ID and you'll fly right through. You know, that thing you have to show to buy beer, cash a check, drive a car, show a cop if he wants to see it, etc....

Who doesn't have a photo ID, especially when state will give you one if you can't afford it.

If you don't have supporting evidence it becomes very difficult and expensive to get that "free" ID.

Meh. $30 tops. Just turn off the all access cable/dish channel, put down the crack pipe, stand out in front of your house and sell a couple of blowjobs. Skip 5 McDonalds meals, whatever. If you can't find a way to shiat $30 nowdays, you're not smart enough to vote.


What part of the 24th Amendment do you not understand?
 
2012-07-31 06:28:39 PM  

Tumunga: A Dark Evil Omen: shotglasss: Just show your picture ID and you'll fly right through. You know, that thing you have to show to buy beer, cash a check, drive a car, show a cop if he wants to see it, etc....

Who doesn't have a photo ID, especially when state will give you one if you can't afford it.

If you don't have supporting evidence it becomes very difficult and expensive to get that "free" ID.

Meh. $30 tops. Just turn off the all access cable/dish channel, put down the crack pipe, stand out in front of your house and sell a couple of blowjobs. Skip 5 McDonalds meals, whatever. If you can't find a way to shiat $30 nowdays, you're not smart enough to vote.


You are a disgusting human being.
 
2012-07-31 06:30:32 PM  

qorkfiend: shotglasss: Just show your picture ID and you'll fly right through. You know, that thing you have to show to buy beer, cash a check, drive a car, show a cop if he wants to see it, etc....

Who doesn't have a photo ID, especially when state will give you one if you can't afford it.

If buying beer, cashing checks, or driving cars were constitutionally guaranteed rights, you might have a point. Since they're not, what are you talking about?


If you can't figure that out, you don't deserve to drink, and ice cream don't have bones.
 
2012-07-31 06:30:52 PM  

Angry Drunk Bureaucrat: I think there's something in the water in Harrisburg. Methinks there's residual fallout from 3 Mile island, which makes all of our elected officials dumber than a box of rocks.


No, it's more to do with the fact that the majority of our elected officials are chosen by people who live in the big, green, empty parts of this state. You know, morons.

Corbett's crew is managing to set the bar amazingly low, though.
 
2012-07-31 06:32:24 PM  
You shouldn't need an ID to buy a firearm either.
 
2012-07-31 06:32:28 PM  

Tumunga: qorkfiend: shotglasss: Just show your picture ID and you'll fly right through. You know, that thing you have to show to buy beer, cash a check, drive a car, show a cop if he wants to see it, etc....

Who doesn't have a photo ID, especially when state will give you one if you can't afford it.

If buying beer, cashing checks, or driving cars were constitutionally guaranteed rights, you might have a point. Since they're not, what are you talking about?

If you can't figure that out, you don't deserve to drink, and ice cream don't have bones.


You're the one saying that people who don't drink, drive, or cash checks do not deserve the right to vote.
 
2012-07-31 06:32:51 PM  
Aichele also couldn't provide any evidence that 99 percent of voters already have a valid form of ID, as the state has claimed. CBS reported that when lawyers cited testimony from a Department of State official calling the number likely inaccurate, Aichele responded "I disagree."

Goddam you liberals...why do always insist that statements be factual?
 
2012-07-31 06:33:04 PM  

Giltric: You shouldn't need an ID to buy a firearm either.


TIL: Voting Kills
 
2012-07-31 06:37:15 PM  

Tumunga: Meh. $30 tops. Just turn off the all access cable/dish channel, put down the crack pipe, stand out in front of your house and sell a couple of blowjobs. Skip 5 McDonalds meals, whatever. If you can't find a way to shiat $30 nowdays, you're not smart enough to vote.


See how easy it is to get an ID that doesn't do anything to affect voter fraud because there is none?

"And when a friend gave him an hour-long ride to the PennDOT center nearest his house, the clerk refused to issue the photo ID because the name on his New York birth certificate is Daniel Guerra -- changed later to Daniel Rosa after his mother married his stepfather. Rosa is the name on his discharge papers and his Veterans Administration ID card."

Stupid veterans should just put down the crack pipe and sell a couple of blowjobs. $30 tops.
 
2012-07-31 06:38:31 PM  

Big_Fat_Liar: It's so weird that so many people get worked up over the possibility majority-white, poor, welfare leech, Republicans, who vote against their own self-interests anyway, might be prevented from doing it...


I am actually. I want to make sure no unnecessary barriers to voting are put up for anyone, for any reason. 18 years of age as the restriction is about the only one I'm ok with.

As someone else said, if they were really super duper concerned, they'd give out a free id at the national level, and more importantly, purple ink for your finger so you cannot vote twice.
 
2012-07-31 06:40:21 PM  

Tumunga: If you can't figure that out, you don't deserve to drink, and ice cream don't have bones.


Imagined voice-over:
cache.gawker.com
 
2012-07-31 06:43:46 PM  

fusillade762: stood by her unsupported claim that 99 percent of voters had valid identification

By a quick Google it looks like the voting population of PA is just a shade under 10 million people. So even if her wild-assed guess is correct that's still around 100,000 people who won't be able to vote.

This is such a bald-faced attempt to steal elections for Republicans I don't know how they can make these claims with a straight face.


My

fusillade762: stood by her unsupported claim that 99 percent of voters had valid identification

By a quick Google it looks like the voting population of PA is just a shade under 10 million people. So even if her wild-assed guess is correct that's still around 100,000 people who won't be able to vote.

This is such a bald-faced attempt to steal elections for Republicans I don't know how they can make these claims with a straight face.


Nope:

1. Indiana has a voter ID law.
2. It was in effect in 2008.
3. Indiana = Repubtard state
4. President Obama carried the state.

Unconstitutional? Here's your liberal rag citation: Link

oh, and

1mut.com
 
2012-07-31 06:43:49 PM  

qorkfiend: shotglasss: Just show your picture ID and you'll fly right through. You know, that thing you have to show to buy beer, cash a check, drive a car, show a cop if he wants to see it, etc....

Who doesn't have a photo ID, especially when state will give you one if you can't afford it.

If buying beer, cashing checks, or driving cars were constitutionally guaranteed rights, you might have a point. Since they're not, what are you talking about?


Kuroshin: shotglasss: Just show your picture ID and you'll fly right through. You know, that thing you have to show to buy beer, cash a check, drive a car, show a cop if he wants to see it, etc....

Who doesn't have a photo ID, especially when state will give you one if you can't afford it.

None of those things you listed are an absolute right of citizenship.

Not being required to hold/carry an ID card is.

Just because most of us choose to voluntarily carry a form of State-issued ID, doesn't mean that it should be a requirement to exercise our rights as citizens.

/knows some people who live "off the grid"
//not the life for me, but they still have the farking right to vote


Kuroshin and qorkfiend expressed it pretty well, but maybe it needs to be expressed more on the level of those who would even try to make an argument like shotglass's.
 
2012-07-31 06:45:03 PM  

Donnchadha: shotglasss: Just show your picture ID and you'll fly right through. You know, that thing you have to show to buy beer, cash a check, drive a car, show a cop if he wants to see it, etc....

Who doesn't have a photo ID, especially when state will give you one if you can't afford it.

Drinking alcohol is not a constitutionally protected right. I'd argue that purchasing beer does not involve the government, but this is Pennsylvania, so it does there.

Cashing a check is a transaction between private entities, not the government.

You do not need photo ID to drive a car. You need to be licensed to drive a car and the license takes the form of valid photo ID.

You do not need to show a cop your photo ID if he requests it. You must identify yourself, but you do not need to "present your papers" on demand. If a cop asks for your license while driving a car it is to verify that you are a licensed driver. If he asks for your drivers license while you're walking down the street, you can tell him "No, but my name is John Smith".

And while we're at it, show me where you can get a free photo ID from Pennsylvania. You can get a photo ID card from the DMV for $13.50, but that's not free. If you require this, then you're stating that it costs $13.50 to cast a vote in an election (minimally).


Only $13.50 is practically free. That at least gets you some skin in the game. I'm a bit sick of all these people complaining that a photo ID is so damn hard for some people to get. Why is that? How is it so difficult for someone to get a photo ID?

Face it, it's about the voter fraud, pure and simple. Require photo ID, and it hurts people who want to vote under someone else's name.
 
2012-07-31 06:45:54 PM  

COMALite J: qorkfiend: shotglasss: Just show your picture ID and you'll fly right through. You know, that thing you have to show to buy beer, cash a check, drive a car, show a cop if he wants to see it, etc....

Who doesn't have a photo ID, especially when state will give you one if you can't afford it.

If buying beer, cashing checks, or driving cars were constitutionally guaranteed rights, you might have a point. Since they're not, what are you talking about?

Kuroshin: shotglasss: Just show your picture ID and you'll fly right through. You know, that thing you have to show to buy beer, cash a check, drive a car, show a cop if he wants to see it, etc....

Who doesn't have a photo ID, especially when state will give you one if you can't afford it.

None of those things you listed are an absolute right of citizenship.

Not being required to hold/carry an ID card is.

Just because most of us choose to voluntarily carry a form of State-issued ID, doesn't mean that it should be a requirement to exercise our rights as citizens.

/knows some people who live "off the grid"
//not the life for me, but they still have the farking right to vote

Kuroshin and qorkfiend expressed it pretty well, but maybe it needs to be expressed more on the level of those who would even try to make an argument like shotglass's.


Voter fraud, pure and simple. That's what it's about.
 
2012-07-31 06:46:06 PM  
It will be interesting to see what the results are.

Why is it that in some threads rural folk are always white trash poverty queens who vote republican but in threads like this something that affects poor people only affects people who vote democrat?
 
2012-07-31 06:46:32 PM  

shotglasss: Just show your picture ID and you'll fly right through. You know, that thing you have to show to buy beer, cash a check, drive a car, show a cop if he wants to see it, etc....

Who doesn't have a photo ID, especially when state will give you one if you can't afford it.


Do you have your photo gun owner's ID?
 
2012-07-31 06:46:43 PM  

meat0918: and more importantly, purple ink for your finger so you cannot vote twice.


Now, there's an interesting point: that works everywhere else in th world. In the GOP is so worried about voter fraud, why not just pass a law requiring those who vote to have their thumb inked and leave their thumbprint?

/or is it really not about voter fraud?
 
2012-07-31 06:47:54 PM  

birchman: mute point


"Moot."

/peate pev
 
2012-07-31 06:49:52 PM  
Voter ID:
www.apfn.net
 
2012-07-31 06:50:53 PM  

Serious Black: Tumunga: A Dark Evil Omen: shotglasss: Just show your picture ID and you'll fly right through. You know, that thing you have to show to buy beer, cash a check, drive a car, show a cop if he wants to see it, etc....

Who doesn't have a photo ID, especially when state will give you one if you can't afford it.

If you don't have supporting evidence it becomes very difficult and expensive to get that "free" ID.

Meh. $30 tops. Just turn off the all access cable/dish channel, put down the crack pipe, stand out in front of your house and sell a couple of blowjobs. Skip 5 McDonalds meals, whatever. If you can't find a way to shiat $30 nowdays, you're not smart enough to vote.

What part of the 24th Amendment do you not understand?


The part where you're allowed to vote multiple times by misrepresenting yourself to the poll workers.

I'm all for purple fingers.
 
2012-07-31 06:52:03 PM  

A Dark Evil Omen: Tumunga: A Dark Evil Omen: shotglasss: Just show your picture ID and you'll fly right through. You know, that thing you have to show to buy beer, cash a check, drive a car, show a cop if he wants to see it, etc....

Who doesn't have a photo ID, especially when state will give you one if you can't afford it.

If you don't have supporting evidence it becomes very difficult and expensive to get that "free" ID.

Meh. $30 tops. Just turn off the all access cable/dish channel, put down the crack pipe, stand out in front of your house and sell a couple of blowjobs. Skip 5 McDonalds meals, whatever. If you can't find a way to shiat $30 nowdays, you're not smart enough to vote.

You are a disgusting human being.


Thanks, Mr. Evil Omen.
 
2012-07-31 06:53:28 PM  

Tumunga: A Dark Evil Omen: shotglasss: Just show your picture ID and you'll fly right through. You know, that thing you have to show to buy beer, cash a check, drive a car, show a cop if he wants to see it, etc....

Who doesn't have a photo ID, especially when state will give you one if you can't afford it.

If you don't have supporting evidence it becomes very difficult and expensive to get that "free" ID.

Meh. $30 tops. Just turn off the all access cable/dish channel, put down the crack pipe, stand out in front of your house and sell a couple of blowjobs. Skip 5 McDonalds meals, whatever. If you can't find a way to shiat $30 nowdays, you're not smart enough to vote.


That constitution conservatives are always worshiping as if it were written by Jesus himself guarentees the right to vote to all. If the intent is to exclude some by reason of their knowledge, wisdom, or intelligence; then you best get to the amendment process. For a law passed with your stated intend would certainly be unconstitutional.
 
2012-07-31 06:53:59 PM  

Kuroshin: shotglasss: Just show your picture ID and you'll fly right through. You know, that thing you have to show to buy beer, cash a check, drive a car, show a cop if he wants to see it, etc....

Who doesn't have a photo ID, especially when state will give you one if you can't afford it.

None of those things you listed are an absolute right of citizenship.

Not being required to hold/carry an ID card is.

Just because most of us choose to voluntarily carry a form of State-issued ID, doesn't mean that it should be a requirement to exercise our rights as citizens.

/knows some people who live "off the grid"
//not the life for me, but they still have the farking right to vote


I've actually started going out with no ID on me most of the time, and just enough cash to do whatever it is I'm doing.

A right not exercised is lost.
 
2012-07-31 06:54:09 PM  
CBS reported that when lawyers cited testimony from a Department of State official calling the number likely inaccurate, Aichele responded "I disagree."

I disagree with you. Therefore, I am correct.

I am for passing a law which says if you are a politician who makes claims supporting legislation without providing a citation you will be fired into the sun. Has to be included in notes somewhere, and has to be provided when giving testimony. Does not matter how unreliable the source is or factually incorrect the information is as long as you have the source.
 
2012-07-31 06:55:52 PM  

youl100: Voter ID:
[www.apfn.net image 331x450]


Why get your finger messy when you get one of these:

bloximages.chicago2.vip.townnews.com

Well, unless you like sticking your finger in a hole, and pulling purple goo out with it. You've either stuck your finger in a grape pie, or a sphincter infested with internal bleeding.
 
2012-07-31 06:56:54 PM  

Tumunga: Well, unless you like sticking your finger in a hole, and pulling purple goo out with it


Like you've never fingerbanged a muppet.
 
2012-07-31 06:59:10 PM  
People who can't make it to an office to get an ID aren't going to get to a voting booth either.
 
2012-07-31 06:59:13 PM  

Seabon: Tumunga: A Dark Evil Omen: shotglasss: Just show your picture ID and you'll fly right through. You know, that thing you have to show to buy beer, cash a check, drive a car, show a cop if he wants to see it, etc....

Who doesn't have a photo ID, especially when state will give you one if you can't afford it.

If you don't have supporting evidence it becomes very difficult and expensive to get that "free" ID.

Meh. $30 tops. Just turn off the all access cable/dish channel, put down the crack pipe, stand out in front of your house and sell a couple of blowjobs. Skip 5 McDonalds meals, whatever. If you can't find a way to shiat $30 nowdays, you're not smart enough to vote.

That constitution conservatives are always worshiping as if it were written by Jesus himself guarentees the right to vote to all. If the intent is to exclude some by reason of their knowledge, wisdom, or intelligence; then you best get to the amendment process. For a law passed with your stated intend would certainly be unconstitutional.


Unconstitutional? Wrong answer, sir:

Link
 
2012-07-31 07:00:12 PM  

12349876: If they were serious about voter fraud, there'd be a free national ID card and purple fingers.


I seem to recall there was quite the shiatstorm last time they tried to implement a national ID card.
 
2012-07-31 07:01:16 PM  

Tumunga: The part where you're allowed to vote multiple times by misrepresenting yourself to the poll workers.


Oh look, another disposable amendment to the Constitution. I forget, how many have dropped off the Republican version?
 
2012-07-31 07:02:01 PM  

consider this: People who can't make it to an office to get an ID aren't going to get to a voting booth either.


Paul Carroll
Paul is an 86-year-old World War II veteran who has lived in the same Ohio town for four decades. Yet when he attempted to vote in the recent Ohio primary, he was told his photo ID from the Department of Veterans Affairs was not good enough because it did not include his address.

Thelma Mitchell
Thelma is a 93-year-old woman who cleaned the Tennessee Capitol for 30 years. She never received a birth certificate, however, because she was delivered by a midwife in Alabama in 1918 and there was no record of her birth. When she attempted to obtain a voter ID, she was turned away for lack of a birth certificate by a clerk who suggested she could be an illegal immigrant.

Ricky Tyrone Lewis
Ricky is a 58 year-old Marine Corps veteran. Despite the fact that he was able to offer Wisconsin voting officials proof of his honorable discharge from the Marines, Milwaukee County has been unable to find the record of his birth that he needs in order to obtain a voter ID card.

Link

Bunch a lazy assholes amirite?
 
2012-07-31 07:02:36 PM  

shotglasss: Only $13.50 is practically free. That at least gets you some skin in the game.


"Practically free" is not "free". When Mississippi's poll tax law went into effect around the beginning of the 20th century, the poll tax was $2, which is about $14 today.

Also, "skin in the game": HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
 
2012-07-31 07:04:10 PM  

Soup4Bonnie: Tumunga: Meh. $30 tops. Just turn off the all access cable/dish channel, put down the crack pipe, stand out in front of your house and sell a couple of blowjobs. Skip 5 McDonalds meals, whatever. If you can't find a way to shiat $30 nowdays, you're not smart enough to vote.

See how easy it is to get an ID that doesn't do anything to affect voter fraud because there is none?

"And when a friend gave him an hour-long ride to the PennDOT center nearest his house, the clerk refused to issue the photo ID because the name on his New York birth certificate is Daniel Guerra -- changed later to Daniel Rosa after his mother married his stepfather. Rosa is the name on his discharge papers and his Veterans Administration ID card."

Stupid veterans should just put down the crack pipe and sell a couple of blowjobs. $30 tops.


Sure, if you wanna vote.

So what you're saying, money wasn't an issue for this fine American? He just needs to clear up a discrepancy? Oh noes! He's a vet. He should be able to suck it up, and get everything squared away. We're supposed to be trained to do so.

/Veteran
//Owns a state issued ID
 
2012-07-31 07:05:06 PM  

Tumunga: The part where you're allowed to vote multiple times by misrepresenting yourself to the poll workers.


shotglasss: Voter fraud, pure and simple. That's what it's about.


Fairy tales. Might as well issue Voter IDs to stop unicorns from voting more than once. That problem doesn't exist, either.
 
2012-07-31 07:05:44 PM  

Tumunga: Sure, if you wanna vote.


No, sorry. Denied the right to vote on the basis of not paying a tax or other fee is explicitly unconstitutional.
 
2012-07-31 07:07:28 PM  

consider this: People who can't make it to an office to get an ID aren't going to get to a voting booth either.


Not true at all, at least in the urban parts of Pennsylvania.

Here in Philly, we vote by subdivisions of wards, which means the polling places are every couple of blocks. They're easy to get to, and it's unusual to see a line at any of them, except around 5-7PM as people get off work.

On the other hand, we only have FOUR DMV locations in the entire city.

See the problem?
 
2012-07-31 07:10:40 PM  

Tumunga: So what you're saying, money wasn't an issue for this fine American? He just needs to clear up a discrepancy? Oh noes! He's a vet. He should be able to suck it up, and get everything squared away. We're supposed to be trained to do so.


No, what I'm saying is that he shouldn't need an ID to vote because the voter fraud you imagine to exist, doesn't. It's been pretty clear in all of my posts. Maybe you can show me some voter fraud to change my mind on why we need to spend millions of dollars and disenfranchise hundreds of thousands of voters in every state to do what we've effectively been doing for decades upon decades without any problems.

Tumunga: /Veteran
//Owns a state issued ID


I'm also a veteran. I don't have a state issued ID. You are missing the point.
 
2012-07-31 07:11:41 PM  

Dusk-You-n-Me: Bunch a lazy assholes amirite?


Pretty much, there's no excuse for any of them not having a valid ID.
 
2012-07-31 07:13:19 PM  

thamike: Tumunga: Well, unless you like sticking your finger in a hole, and pulling purple goo out with it

Like you've never fingerbanged a muppet.


i636.photobucket.com
 
2012-07-31 07:13:44 PM  

thamike: shotglasss: Just show your picture ID and you'll fly right through. You know, that thing you have to show to buy beer, cash a check, drive a car, show a cop if he wants to see it, etc....

Who doesn't have a photo ID, especially when state will give you one if you can't afford it.

Do you have your photo gun owner's ID?


boomheadshot.jpg
 
2012-07-31 07:16:09 PM  

consider this: Pretty much, there's no excuse for any of them not having a valid ID.


There aren't excuses, there are reasons, and they're right there. I guess it's easier to dismiss them outright then to admit you support voter suppression. But you've been here a whole month now, so that absolutely makes sense.
 
2012-07-31 07:17:20 PM  

qorkfiend: shotglasss: Just show your picture ID and you'll fly right through. You know, that thing you have to show to buy beer, cash a check, drive a car, show a cop if he wants to see it, etc....

Who doesn't have a photo ID, especially when state will give you one if you can't afford it.

If buying beer, cashing checks, or driving cars were constitutionally guaranteed rights, you might have a point. Since they're not, what are you talking about?


Voting is not actually a constitutionally guaranteed right. There are prohibitions against denying the right to vote to persons for certain reasons, but outside of that, each state determines who may or may not vote. That's why felons can vote in some states, but not in others.
 
2012-07-31 07:17:39 PM  

Dusk-You-n-Me: But you've been here a whole month now, so that absolutely makes sense.


consider 9 beers and its other unknown alts has been here longer than that.
 
2012-07-31 07:17:39 PM  

Soup4Bonnie: Tumunga: So what you're saying, money wasn't an issue for this fine American? He just needs to clear up a discrepancy? Oh noes! He's a vet. He should be able to suck it up, and get everything squared away. We're supposed to be trained to do so.

No, what I'm saying is that he shouldn't need an ID to vote because the voter fraud you imagine to exist, doesn't. It's been pretty clear in all of my posts. Maybe you can show me some voter fraud to change my mind on why we need to spend millions of dollars and disenfranchise hundreds of thousands of voters in every state to do what we've effectively been doing for decades upon decades without any problems.

Tumunga: /Veteran
//Owns a state issued ID

I'm also a veteran. I don't have a state issued ID. You are missing the point.


I live in Indiana. The law says if you wanna vote, bring a picture ID with you. We can register to vote at the license branch while we're getting the state ID, or your driver's license. The law even passed constitutional muster:

Link
 
2012-07-31 07:19:36 PM  

Dwight_Yeast: On the other hand, we only have FOUR DMV locations in the entire city.


That's not true at all. I'm on the Pennsylvania DOT website and there are dozens of locations in Philadelphia for obtaining a state ID. If somebody can make it to a voting location, they can make it to a state ID office.
 
2012-07-31 07:19:56 PM  

consider this: Pretty much, there's no excuse for any of them not having a valid ID.


There is no excuse for not having an ID that will do nothing to abate the nonexistent problem of voter fraud. Are you sure about that?
 
2012-07-31 07:20:12 PM  

Tumunga: Seabon: Tumunga: A Dark Evil Omen: shotglasss: Just show your picture ID and you'll fly right through. You know, that thing you have to show to buy beer, cash a check, drive a car, show a cop if he wants to see it, etc....

Who doesn't have a photo ID, especially when state will give you one if you can't afford it.

If you don't have supporting evidence it becomes very difficult and expensive to get that "free" ID.

Meh. $30 tops. Just turn off the all access cable/dish channel, put down the crack pipe, stand out in front of your house and sell a couple of blowjobs. Skip 5 McDonalds meals, whatever. If you can't find a way to shiat $30 nowdays, you're not smart enough to vote.

That constitution conservatives are always worshiping as if it were written by Jesus himself guarentees the right to vote to all. If the intent is to exclude some by reason of their knowledge, wisdom, or intelligence; then you best get to the amendment process. For a law passed with your stated intend would certainly be unconstitutional.

Unconstitutional? Wrong answer, sir:

Link


Now show me where in the Indiana law is the intent to disallow people by reason of their knowledge, wisdom or intelligence as you espoused.
 
2012-07-31 07:22:05 PM  

birchman: Rich Cream: How the hell do you leave your house to go testify about something and not even read about it first?

/get a brain

So you can feign ignorance and act surprised when your obviously unconstitutional law is overturned so you aren't put in jail for deliberately trying to deny people their rights.


Unconstitutional? Ussc 2006 ruling begs to differ.
 
2012-07-31 07:22:15 PM  

consider this: Dusk-You-n-Me: Bunch a lazy assholes amirite?

Pretty much, there's no excuse for any of them not having a valid ID.


Valid only according to people who write laws to keep them from voting.
 
2012-07-31 07:23:24 PM  

Tumunga: I live in Indiana. The law says if you wanna vote, bring a picture ID with you. We can register to vote at the license branch while we're getting the state ID, or your driver's license. The law even passed constitutional muster:


Soup4Bonnie: As I've said in most every other Voter ID thread; when asked why there is a sudden need for identification at the voting booth when there are almost zero cases of voter fraud, the answer will be how easy they are to obtain.


Explain to me again how easy it is to get since that is not the issue I am addressing at all. Go ahead. It'll be about your third or fourth time.

If this were done Jerry Maguire style, right about now I would be Cuba jumping up and down shouting "SHOW ME THE VOTER FRAUD!"
 
2012-07-31 07:24:08 PM  

Angry Drunk Bureaucrat: Marcus Aurelius: This new crew in Harrisburg doesn't have a clue.

I think there's something in the water in Harrisburg. Methinks there's residual fallout from 3 Mile island, which makes all of our elected officials dumber than a box of rocks.


Must be confined to the downtown area, I live in Harrisburg and am just fine.
 
2012-07-31 07:24:37 PM  

Larry Mahnken: Voting is not actually a constitutionally guaranteed right. There are prohibitions against denying the right to vote to persons for certain reasons, but outside of that, each state determines who may or may not vote. That's why felons can vote in some states, but not in others.


What does Pennsylvania's constitution say about it? I'm pretty sure I heard on the radio that Pennsylvania's constitution does explicitly guarantee that right.
 
2012-07-31 07:25:45 PM  

Angry Drunk Bureaucrat: Marcus Aurelius: This new crew in Harrisburg doesn't have a clue.

I think there's something in the water in Harrisburg. Methinks there's residual fallout from 3 Mile island, which makes all of our elected officials dumber than a box of rocks.


But capable, apparently, of getting the ID necessary to vote. Unlike ... whoever the hell opponents of this are trying to protect.
 
2012-07-31 07:27:36 PM  

consider this: Dwight_Yeast: On the other hand, we only have FOUR DMV locations in the entire city.

That's not true at all. I'm on the Pennsylvania DOT website and there are dozens of locations in Philadelphia for obtaining a state ID. If somebody can make it to a voting location, they can make it to a state ID office.


That's a really stupid thing to lie about, as I checked PennDOT's website before I posted and there are FOUR:

PennDOT Photo & Exam Center


Arch Street

Columbus Blvd.

Island Avenue

West Oak Lane


Any other ones you get are NOT in Philadelphia.
 
2012-07-31 07:27:37 PM  

Dusk-You-n-Me: There aren't excuses, there are reasons, and they're right there. I guess it's easier to dismiss them outright then to admit you support voter suppression. But you've been here a whole month now, so that absolutely makes sense.


The first guy could have had a valid state ID if he wasn't so damn stupid. The 93 year old woman is full of shiat. You don't live 93 years in a country without having a photo ID or other proof of your existence. The last guy also wouldn't have had a problem had he showed up with a valid state ID.

Stop making bullshiat excuses.
 
2012-07-31 07:28:45 PM  

consider this: Dusk-You-n-Me: There aren't excuses, there are reasons, and they're right there. I guess it's easier to dismiss them outright then to admit you support voter suppression. But you've been here a whole month now, so that absolutely makes sense.

The first guy could have had a valid state ID if he wasn't so damn stupid. The 93 year old woman is full of shiat. You don't live 93 years in a country without having a photo ID or other proof of your existence. The last guy also wouldn't have had a problem had he showed up with a valid state ID.

Stop making bullshiat excuses.


PLONK!
 
2012-07-31 07:30:12 PM  

Dwight_Yeast: That's a really stupid thing to lie about, as I checked PennDOT's website before I posted and there are FOUR:


Wrong, there are dozens of places to get a valid state ID in Philly. I searched one zip code and there were 5 listed. You need to stop narrowing your search to certain facilities and expand it to any location capable of issuing a state ID card.
 
2012-07-31 07:31:03 PM  

Seabon: Tumunga: Seabon: Tumunga: A Dark Evil Omen: shotglasss: Just show your picture ID and you'll fly right through. You know, that thing you have to show to buy beer, cash a check, drive a car, show a cop if he wants to see it, etc....

Who doesn't have a photo ID, especially when state will give you one if you can't afford it.

If you don't have supporting evidence it becomes very difficult and expensive to get that "free" ID.

Meh. $30 tops. Just turn off the all access cable/dish channel, put down the crack pipe, stand out in front of your house and sell a couple of blowjobs. Skip 5 McDonalds meals, whatever. If you can't find a way to shiat $30 nowdays, you're not smart enough to vote.

That constitution conservatives are always worshiping as if it were written by Jesus himself guarentees the right to vote to all. If the intent is to exclude some by reason of their knowledge, wisdom, or intelligence; then you best get to the amendment process. For a law passed with your stated intend would certainly be unconstitutional.

Unconstitutional? Wrong answer, sir:

Link

Now show me where in the Indiana law is the intent to disallow people by reason of their knowledge, wisdom or intelligence as you espoused.


I'm gonna pull a Pelosi on that request. You read it that big mess, and show me that it's not in there.
 
2012-07-31 07:33:04 PM  

consider this: Wrong


Dude, I live in Philly. I know what I'm talking about.

And I didn't "narrow my search"; I searched for places where you can get a photo ID. There are four. I listed then above.

But keep claiming I'm wrong as it amuses me to see you look stupid.
 
2012-07-31 07:33:14 PM  

Soup4Bonnie: Tumunga: I live in Indiana. The law says if you wanna vote, bring a picture ID with you. We can register to vote at the license branch while we're getting the state ID, or your driver's license. The law even passed constitutional muster:

Soup4Bonnie: As I've said in most every other Voter ID thread; when asked why there is a sudden need for identification at the voting booth when there are almost zero cases of voter fraud, the answer will be how easy they are to obtain.

Explain to me again how easy it is to get since that is not the issue I am addressing at all. Go ahead. It'll be about your third or fourth time.

If this were done Jerry Maguire style, right about now I would be Cuba jumping up and down shouting "SHOW ME THE VOTER FRAUD!"


Here you go, Mr. Gooding, Jr.:

Link
 
2012-07-31 07:33:34 PM  

Tumunga: Seabon: Tumunga: Seabon: Tumunga: A Dark Evil Omen: shotglasss: Just show your picture ID and you'll fly right through. You know, that thing you have to show to buy beer, cash a check, drive a car, show a cop if he wants to see it, etc....

Who doesn't have a photo ID, especially when state will give you one if you can't afford it.

If you don't have supporting evidence it becomes very difficult and expensive to get that "free" ID.

Meh. $30 tops. Just turn off the all access cable/dish channel, put down the crack pipe, stand out in front of your house and sell a couple of blowjobs. Skip 5 McDonalds meals, whatever. If you can't find a way to shiat $30 nowdays, you're not smart enough to vote.

That constitution conservatives are always worshiping as if it were written by Jesus himself guarentees the right to vote to all. If the intent is to exclude some by reason of their knowledge, wisdom, or intelligence; then you best get to the amendment process. For a law passed with your stated intend would certainly be unconstitutional.

Unconstitutional? Wrong answer, sir:

Link

Now show me where in the Indiana law is the intent to disallow people by reason of their knowledge, wisdom or intelligence as you espoused.

I'm gonna pull a Pelosi on that request. You read it that big mess, and show me that it's not in there.


Yes, show him where it isn't.

I read it. It's not in there. Prove me wrong.
 
2012-07-31 07:34:49 PM  

Cletus C.: Unlike ... whoever the hell opponents of this are trying to protect.



Matt Barreto, a professor at the University of Washington, found that 12.6 percent of Pennsylvanians who voted in 2008 currently lack a valid ID. An analysis by the AFL-CIO showed that, when you factor in those whose IDs will have expired longer than a year by Election Day, as many as 20 percent of Pennsylvania voters-or 1.6 million Pennsylvanians-could be disenfranchised.

http://prospect.org/article/deep-dark-mysteries-pennsylvanias-voter-i d

The laziest of the lazy who went out and voted in 2008 but won't be able to in 2012 because of the new law that makes them lazy.
 
2012-07-31 07:35:31 PM  

Tumunga: I'm gonna pull a Pelosi on that request. You read it that big mess, and show me that it's not in there.


Or we can just hit up Justice Stephens's leading opinion in Wikipedia.

"Because Indiana's cards are free, the inconvenience of going to the Bureau of Motor Vehicles, gathering required documents, and posing for a photograph does not qualify as a substantial burden on most voters' right to vote, or represent a significant increase over the usual burdens of voting."

Well there you go.
 
2012-07-31 07:35:35 PM  

birchman: Tumunga: Seabon: Tumunga: Seabon: Tumunga: A Dark Evil Omen: shotglasss: Just show your picture ID and you'll fly right through. You know, that thing you have to show to buy beer, cash a check, drive a car, show a cop if he wants to see it, etc....

Who doesn't have a photo ID, especially when state will give you one if you can't afford it.

If you don't have supporting evidence it becomes very difficult and expensive to get that "free" ID.

Meh. $30 tops. Just turn off the all access cable/dish channel, put down the crack pipe, stand out in front of your house and sell a couple of blowjobs. Skip 5 McDonalds meals, whatever. If you can't find a way to shiat $30 nowdays, you're not smart enough to vote.

That constitution conservatives are always worshiping as if it were written by Jesus himself guarentees the right to vote to all. If the intent is to exclude some by reason of their knowledge, wisdom, or intelligence; then you best get to the amendment process. For a law passed with your stated intend would certainly be unconstitutional.

Unconstitutional? Wrong answer, sir:

Link

Now show me where in the Indiana law is the intent to disallow people by reason of their knowledge, wisdom or intelligence as you espoused.

I'm gonna pull a Pelosi on that request. You read it that big mess, and show me that it's not in there.

Yes, show him where it isn't.

I read it. It's not in there. Prove me wrong.


I didn't read it. It's in there. Prove you read it.
 
2012-07-31 07:36:18 PM  

Alphax: consider this: Dusk-You-n-Me: There aren't excuses, there are reasons, and they're right there. I guess it's easier to dismiss them outright then to admit you support voter suppression. But you've been here a whole month now, so that absolutely makes sense.

The first guy could have had a valid state ID if he wasn't so damn stupid. The 93 year old woman is full of shiat. You don't live 93 years in a country without having a photo ID or other proof of your existence. The last guy also wouldn't have had a problem had he showed up with a valid state ID.

Stop making bullshiat excuses.

PLONK!

Peggy also sad about so many new troll lately. Sometimes, Peggy cannot tell if person is troll or just really mental retard.
 
2012-07-31 07:37:28 PM  

Tumunga: Prove you read it


Why should we when its obvious you haven't either? How many 'FWD:'s were there in the email you got it from?
 
2012-07-31 07:38:43 PM  

Dwight_Yeast: Dude, I live in Philly. I know what I'm talking about.

And I didn't "narrow my search"; I searched for places where you can get a photo ID. There are four. I listed then above.

But keep claiming I'm wrong as it amuses me to see you look stupid.



Yes, because somebody living in Philly wouldn't think of leaving the city and making the half a mile drive to get an ID card from a neighboring office. OMG there are only 4 places they can possibly go for an ID!111111
 
2012-07-31 07:39:28 PM  
The thing that gets me about this voter fraud push (which is a total fraud itself) is that you'd need fraud on a truly MASSIVE scale for it to have any effect whatsoever. Is it bad that .09% of the votes are fraudulent? Well, I guess. But has it ever affected even one local crapshoot election, never mind something big like the presidency? Nope.

Obviously, it's a coordinated effort to keep certain groups of people from voting, and they pretty much admitted as much last week. What's sad is that these dopes keep standing in front of a podium acting like they're saving the world from these scofflaws who are ruining--ruining!--democracy for the rest of us. I wonder if they truly believe the bullshiat they're saying, or are they just saying it because someone told them to, even though they know damned well the truth lies elsewhere.

I mean, you're either a racist or retarded when you run with this idea. So which is it?
 
2012-07-31 07:40:14 PM  

USA Prime Credit Peggy: Peggy also sad about so many new troll lately. Sometimes, Peggy cannot tell if person is troll or just really mental retard.


I mark those people "stupid or trolling?"
 
2012-07-31 07:42:45 PM  

JerkStore: I mean, you're either a racist or retarded when you run with this idea. So which is it?


t.qkme.me
 
2012-07-31 07:43:33 PM  

consider this: Yes, because somebody living in Philly wouldn't think of leaving the city and making the half a mile drive


Oh, so you're actually an idiot and not just trolling. Good to know.

We're talking about people who don't have driver licenses. We're talking about people who don't have but will need state-issued ID cards to vote.

How is someone who doesn't have a driver's license going to drive to the DMV to get a photo ID?

/that's part of the problem with the DMV centers in Philly: they're laid out to be convenient to people who drive, but not to anyone else, unless you're lucky enough to live near one of them.
 
2012-07-31 07:45:06 PM  

Soup4Bonnie: Cletus C.: Unlike ... whoever the hell opponents of this are trying to protect.


Matt Barreto, a professor at the University of Washington, found that 12.6 percent of Pennsylvanians who voted in 2008 currently lack a valid ID. An analysis by the AFL-CIO showed that, when you factor in those whose IDs will have expired longer than a year by Election Day, as many as 20 percent of Pennsylvania voters-or 1.6 million Pennsylvanians-could be disenfranchised.

http://prospect.org/article/deep-dark-mysteries-pennsylvanias-voter-i d

The laziest of the lazy who went out and voted in 2008 but won't be able to in 2012 because of the new law that makes them lazy.


I'm guessing a lot more than that are eligible to vote but don't. It's called culling the herd. If you have great difficulty figuring out how to vote, or when to vote or why to vote it's not really a big deal if you don't.
 
2012-07-31 07:45:24 PM  

Tumunga: Seabon: Tumunga: Seabon: Tumunga: A Dark Evil Omen: shotglasss: Just show your picture ID and you'll fly right through. You know, that thing you have to show to buy beer, cash a check, drive a car, show a cop if he wants to see it, etc....

Who doesn't have a photo ID, especially when state will give you one if you can't afford it.

If you don't have supporting evidence it becomes very difficult and expensive to get that "free" ID.

Meh. $30 tops. Just turn off the all access cable/dish channel, put down the crack pipe, stand out in front of your house and sell a couple of blowjobs. Skip 5 McDonalds meals, whatever. If you can't find a way to shiat $30 nowdays, you're not smart enough to vote.

That constitution conservatives are always worshiping as if it were written by Jesus himself guarentees the right to vote to all. If the intent is to exclude some by reason of their knowledge, wisdom, or intelligence; then you best get to the amendment process. For a law passed with your stated intend would certainly be unconstitutional.

Unconstitutional? Wrong answer, sir:

Link

Now show me where in the Indiana law is the intent to disallow people by reason of their knowledge, wisdom or intelligence as you espoused.

I'm gonna pull a Pelosi on that request. You read it that big mess, and show me that it's not in there.


You're the one claiming it as proof that my claim is false. Yet, I read a good part of it and I see nothing to support you're assertion that "If you can't find a way to shiat $30 nowdays, you're not smart enough to vote." went into their reasoning.
 
2012-07-31 07:45:34 PM  

consider this: Yes, because somebody living in Philly wouldn't think of leaving the city and making the half a mile drive to get an ID card from a neighboring office. OMG there are only 4 places they can possibly go for an ID!111111


What is this drive you speak of?
 
2012-07-31 07:47:18 PM  

Dwight_Yeast: Oh, so you're actually an idiot and not just trolling. Good to know.

We're talking about people who don't have driver licenses. We're talking about people who don't have but will need state-issued ID cards to vote.



Because most 93 year olds are able to make their way to a voting booth without somebody taking them there, right? There's an idiot in this conversation and it isn't me.
 
2012-07-31 07:48:13 PM  

shotglasss:
Only $13.50 is practically free. That at least gets you some skin in the game. I'm a bit sick of all these people complaining that a photo ID is so damn hard for some people to get. Why is that? How is it so difficult for someone to get a photo ID?

Face it, it's about the voter fraud, pure and simple. Require photo ID, and it hurts people who want to vote under someone else's name.



The poll tax struck down by the Supreme Court was less than $2.

If you can show there's a serious problem with people voting under other people's names, at least you're in the door for arguing why the government needs to act at all. But there's no evidence of that claim. And PA has essentially admitted this under oath.

So let's just assume that the state instead requires you to show your photo ID before you're allowed to speak on any political topic or log onto any website to discuss politics. Would you be cool with that? We'll make up a reason why since it'd probably be not-cool to say it's because we disagree with your politics....so let's just say it's to avoid people libeling and slandering each other in public without some way to track down the person to sue. That's good because freedom of speech doesn't protect slander, right?

And we can actually show people do slander each other on-line all the time and that it is tough to track 'em down to sue.

So we're good. Let's do that one. You're OK with that, right?
 
2012-07-31 07:48:41 PM  

Dwight_Yeast: USA Prime Credit Peggy: Peggy also sad about so many new troll lately. Sometimes, Peggy cannot tell if person is troll or just really mental retard.

I mark those people "stupid or trolling?"


I put down consider this as 'pro voter suppression'.
 
2012-07-31 07:49:51 PM  

Seabon: Larry Mahnken: Voting is not actually a constitutionally guaranteed right. There are prohibitions against denying the right to vote to persons for certain reasons, but outside of that, each state determines who may or may not vote. That's why felons can vote in some states, but not in others.

What does Pennsylvania's constitution say about it? I'm pretty sure I heard on the radio that Pennsylvania's constitution does explicitly guarantee that right.


Every citizen 21 years of age, possessing the following qualifications, shall be entitled to vote at all elections subject, however, to such laws requiring and regulating the registration of electors as the General Assembly may enact.
1. He or she shall have been a citizen of the United States at least one month.
2. He or she shall have resided in the State 90 days immediately preceding the election.
3. He or she shall have resided in the election district where he or she shall offer to vote at least 60 days immediately preceding the election, except that if qualified to vote in an election district prior to removal of residence, he or she may, if a resident of Pennsylvania, vote in the election district from which he or she removed his or her residence within 60 days preceding the election.


Hopefully the court decides that the Voter ID laws go beyond the "requiring and regulating" clause.
 
2012-07-31 07:52:06 PM  
No I.D.s! This is the 21st century people! It's time to act that way. I say we move voting to online polls. A valid e-mail address will be required to prevent abuse.
 
2012-07-31 07:52:23 PM  

consider this: Because most 93 year olds are able to make their way to a voting booth without somebody taking them there, right? There's an idiot in this conversation and it isn't me.


I covered that already: we have hundreds of polling places in Philly, but only four places to get a photo ID. Now do you see the problem?

And to answer your question: yes, my elderly neighbors have no trouble walking the TWO BLOCKS to the polling place.

People who need a ride to the polling place don't have trouble getting one, as it's not a great time commitment. But (based on personal experience) it takes four hours to get a photo ID from the DMV. Not a lot of people are going to take time off to drive some old person to the DMV and then spend four hours with them while they wait. People have more important things to do.

Also: the ward leaders of both parties organize rides for people who need transport to their polling place on election day. No one organizes ride to the DMV.
 
2012-07-31 07:54:53 PM  

Dwight_Yeast: Also: the ward leaders of both parties organize rides for people who need transport to their polling place on election day. No one organizes ride to the DMV.


Why not?
 
2012-07-31 07:59:55 PM  

Dwight_Yeast: I covered that already: we have hundreds of polling places in Philly, but only four places to get a photo ID. Now do you see the problem?


We've already covered the fact that you're wrong about the number of places to get a state ID in the Philadelphia area so lets just move past that. There's no difference than granny getting a 15 minute car ride to get a photo ID and a 5 minute drive to the nearest polling place.

This whole argument is silly anyways, just how many people do you really think are out there without a valid photo ID? It's almost impossible to exist without being able to prove who you are in a modern society.

The number of people who would be kept from voting if voter ID laws were passed would certainly be lower than the number of ineligible people casting ballots if they aren't.
 
2012-07-31 08:01:48 PM  

Tumunga: Here you go, Mr. Gooding, Jr.:

Link


That was an exciting read of Specfriggintacular's Blog, but he doesn't seem to know the difference between voter fraud and voter registration fraud. I'm also curious how Voter ID laws are going to stop absentee voter fraud. Want to help me out on that? Or maybe you can tell me how those people who did commit absentee voter fraud were caught without voter ID laws being in place?
 
2012-07-31 08:03:43 PM  

consider this: This whole argument is silly anyways, just how many people do you really think are out there without a valid photo ID? It's almost impossible to exist without being able to prove who you are in a modern society.

The number of people who would be kept from voting if voter ID laws were passed would certainly be lower than the number of ineligible people casting ballots if they aren't.


12 - 20% of the 2008 voters, so really just a couple of lazy people.
 
2012-07-31 08:05:23 PM  

shotglasss: Just show your picture ID and you'll fly right through. You know, that thing you have to show to buy beer, cash a check, drive a car, show a cop if he wants to see it, etc....

Who doesn't have a photo ID, especially when state will give you one if you can't afford it.


My mother is 76 years old. She was born in the South (Florida). Since black births were not always recorded, my mom doesn't have her true birthday or name. She shows up in the 1930 census as Lorena and in the following census, she was Lorene. She always thought that her name was Lorraine. This wasn't much of an issue until she went to take a cruise. She can't secure her birth certificate. She even tried going back to the school that she went to and the school had burned down. Since segreation was an issue at the time, the records were not preserved. My mother had to change her name back but still can't get the information. My mother doesn't even have parking tickets yet she doesn't vote now because she can't prove she is Lorraine (they took her driver's license at the DMV because they said even though they understood that it wasn't fake, it still wasn't correct). So please don't tell me that it is an easy problem to fix. So far, she has not been successful. She is frustrated and it causes her undo anxiety and stress. So please don't be so presumptous to think that it is *easy* to get the info needed cuz if you are old and black, it is not an easy endeavor.

And I believe that it was intentional to make sure that my mom (old and black) don't vote. If not personal, by design of who she is and the way the GOP believes that she will vote.
 
2012-07-31 08:07:05 PM  

Dwight_Yeast: And to answer your question: yes, my elderly neighbors have no trouble walking the TWO BLOCKS to the polling place.


But there's absolutely no way possible for them to make 1 trip to the local DMV for a photo ID? How do they get groceries, go to doctors appointments, pick up prescriptions, etc?

Somebody is obviously seeing to their needs, is it too much to ask that they make 1 trip a handful of miles away in order to get an ID? By the way, they're free for the elderly.
 
2012-07-31 08:07:43 PM  

Soup4Bonnie: 12 - 20% of the 2008 voters


That's a bullshiat number and you damn well know it.
 
2012-07-31 08:08:14 PM  

consider this: We've already covered the fact that you're wrong about the number of places to get a state ID in the Philadelphia


...except that I'm not and you've provided no information to the contrary.

consider this: There's no difference than granny getting a 15 minute car ride to get a photo ID and a 5 minute drive to the nearest polling place.


...except the part where voting takes 15 minutes (at the worst of times) and getting an ID takes four hours.

consider this: This whole argument is silly anyways, just how many people do you really think are out there without a valid photo ID?


I lived without one for years. I only finally broke down and got a photo ID (I don't have a driver's license) because I needed it for my business.

consider this: The number of people who would be kept from voting if voter ID laws were passed would certainly be lower than the number of ineligible people casting ballots if they aren't.


That statement is neither true, nor is it a valid reason to pass the voter ID law that's being challenged here.

let me ask you directly: are you trolling, are you honestly an idiot, or are you being paid to carry water for the GOP? I'm really curious.
 
2012-07-31 08:10:21 PM  
 
2012-07-31 08:11:27 PM  

Dwight_Yeast: except the part where voting takes 15 minutes (at the worst of times) and getting an ID takes four hours.


Funny since I've had to wait in line for over an hour to vote and the last time I got my license, I was in and out in 20 minutes.
 
2012-07-31 08:13:25 PM  

consider this: How many people really don't have photo ID's?


WordPress? Geoff?
 
2012-07-31 08:14:10 PM  

Dwight_Yeast: let me ask you directly: are you trolling, are you honestly an idiot, or are you being paid to carry water for the GOP? I'm really curious.


Are you trolling, an idiot or a paid shill for the anti-voter ID side? I'm really curious too.
 
2012-07-31 08:14:55 PM  

Jim_Tressel's_O-Face: Tumunga: Prove you read it

Why should we when its obvious you haven't either? How many 'FWD:'s were there in the email you got it from?


GS'd the damn thing, so no FWD here. I live in Indiana, so showing the ID to vote is instinctual, like a libtard and a rainbow flag.
 
2012-07-31 08:16:22 PM  

shotglasss: Face it, it's about the voter fraud, pure and simple. Require photo ID, and it hurts people who want to vote under someone else's name.


You have no clue what you're talking about.

Fact: There are ZERO documented cases of voter fraud in Pa.
Fact: The Pa. Republican House Majority Leader admitted that this voter ID law is designed to help Romney carry the state.
Fact: There are several counties in Pa. that are so rural they have no DMV and there are multitudes of instances of DMVs refusing to issue ID to persons who are entitled to one.
 
2012-07-31 08:16:39 PM  
 
2012-07-31 08:17:26 PM  

Seabon: Tumunga: Seabon: Tumunga: Seabon: Tumunga: A Dark Evil Omen: shotglasss: Just show your picture ID and you'll fly right through. You know, that thing you have to show to buy beer, cash a check, drive a car, show a cop if he wants to see it, etc....

Who doesn't have a photo ID, especially when state will give you one if you can't afford it.

If you don't have supporting evidence it becomes very difficult and expensive to get that "free" ID.

Meh. $30 tops. Just turn off the all access cable/dish channel, put down the crack pipe, stand out in front of your house and sell a couple of blowjobs. Skip 5 McDonalds meals, whatever. If you can't find a way to shiat $30 nowdays, you're not smart enough to vote.

That constitution conservatives are always worshiping as if it were written by Jesus himself guarentees the right to vote to all. If the intent is to exclude some by reason of their knowledge, wisdom, or intelligence; then you best get to the amendment process. For a law passed with your stated intend would certainly be unconstitutional.

Unconstitutional? Wrong answer, sir:

Link

Now show me where in the Indiana law is the intent to disallow people by reason of their knowledge, wisdom or intelligence as you espoused.

I'm gonna pull a Pelosi on that request. You read it that big mess, and show me that it's not in there.

You're the one claiming it as proof that my claim is false. Yet, I read a good part of it and I see nothing to support you're assertion that "If you can't find a way to shiat $30 nowdays, you're not smart enough to vote." went into their reasoning.


You only read the part you liked. Keep going.
 
2012-07-31 08:17:45 PM  

consider this: Somebody is obviously seeing to their needs, is it too much to ask that they make 1 trip a handful of miles away in order to get an ID? By the way, they're free for the elderly.


...in money, but not time.

consider this: But there's absolutely no way possible for them to make 1 trip to the local DMV for a photo ID? How do they get groceries, go to doctors appointments, pick up prescriptions, etc?


Let's take the case of the woman who lived next door to me when I was growing up: she never learned to drive (a fair number of people who live in cities don't) and when she worked -she was a nurse at a retirement home for decades- she took the bus to and from work.

In fact, she took the bus pretty much everywhere. It's how she got her groceries. It's how she got down town to see her doctors. It's how she did her major shopping at the department stores.
 
2012-07-31 08:18:15 PM  

Boxcutta: Fact: There are ZERO documented cases of voter fraud in Pa.
Fact: The Pa. Republican House Majority Leader admitted that this voter ID law is designed to help Romney carry the state.
Fact: There are several counties in Pa. that are so rural they have no DMV and there are multitudes of instances of DMVs refusing to issue ID to persons who are entitled to one.



Amazing how people like you will blatantly lie and distort the facts and then call people trolls and idiots for not agreeing with your position.
 
2012-07-31 08:18:57 PM  
Man this thread is full of second rate trolling and stupidity.
 
2012-07-31 08:20:09 PM  

consider this: Funny since I've had to wait in line for over an hour to vote and the last time I got my license, I was in and out in 20 minutes.


That's nice, but you don't live in Philadelphia.

You didn't answer my question: shill, idiot or troll? Which one are you?
 
2012-07-31 08:20:43 PM  

Dwight_Yeast: Let's take the case of the woman who lived next door to me when I was growing up: she never learned to drive (a fair number of people who live in cities don't) and when she worked -she was a nurse at a retirement home for decades- she took the bus to and from work.

In fact, she took the bus pretty much everywhere. It's how she got her groceries. It's how she got down town to see her doctors. It's how she did her major shopping at the department stores.


So taking the bus to get an ID would be impossible? Just how did this lady prove who she was when required to do so for things like writing checks, visiting her bank, picking up prescriptions and a dozen other things where a person has to prove their identity?
 
2012-07-31 08:20:56 PM  

Dwight_Yeast: consider this: Somebody is obviously seeing to their needs, is it too much to ask that they make 1 trip a handful of miles away in order to get an ID? By the way, they're free for the elderly.

...in money, but not time.


That, and the documentation required to get the IDs aren't free. I.e., $35 for a birth certificate here, $25 for another document there, etc. Then there's the issue of whether people know they're free, or even that they're going to be required this year.
 
2012-07-31 08:21:13 PM  

consider this: Dwight_Yeast: let me ask you directly: are you trolling, are you honestly an idiot, or are you being paid to carry water for the GOP? I'm really curious.

Are you trolling, an idiot or a paid shill for the anti-voter ID side? I'm really curious too.


Definitely trolling. Give it a rest Dwight, the terribly short article has more than enough information to damn the PA GOP on this one, no need to white knight it, they already did all the work for ya.
 
2012-07-31 08:21:21 PM  

consider this: Dwight_Yeast: Oh, so you're actually an idiot and not just trolling. Good to know.

We're talking about people who don't have driver licenses. We're talking about people who don't have but will need state-issued ID cards to vote.


Because most 93 year olds are able to make their way to a voting booth without somebody taking them there, right? There's an idiot in this conversation and it isn't me.


If you put the voting booth inside an Old Country Buffet, or a farmer's market, I'm sure there's not a 93 year old alive that would not be able to make it to the voting botth.
 
2012-07-31 08:21:55 PM  

Tumunga: A Dark Evil Omen: shotglasss: Just show your picture ID and you'll fly right through. You know, that thing you have to show to buy beer, cash a check, drive a car, show a cop if he wants to see it, etc....

Who doesn't have a photo ID, especially when state will give you one if you can't afford it.

If you don't have supporting evidence it becomes very difficult and expensive to get that "free" ID.

Meh. $30 tops. Just turn off the all access cable/dish channel, put down the crack pipe, stand out in front of your house and sell a couple of blowjobs. Skip 5 McDonalds meals, whatever. If you can't find a way to shiat $30 nowdays, you're not smart enough to vote.


Must be nice to be white and secure. Sounds like you would believe in literacy tests as well.
 
2012-07-31 08:21:56 PM  

consider this: Amazing how people like you will blatantly lie and distort the facts


Uh, actually, he's correct on all those points, while you have offered nothing but bullshiat and partisan hackery.

So, how much are they paying you? Is it by the post? how do I get in on that racket?
 
2012-07-31 08:22:00 PM  

Dwight_Yeast: That's nice, but you don't live in Philadelphia.

You didn't answer my question: shill, idiot or troll? Which one are you?



I live in a city larger than Philadelphia.

I'm putting you down for 50% troll, 50% idiot and 100% on ignore.
 
2012-07-31 08:23:37 PM  

consider this: Dwight_Yeast: That's nice, but you don't live in Philadelphia.

You didn't answer my question: shill, idiot or troll? Which one are you?


I live in a city larger than Philadelphia.

I'm putting you down for 50% troll, 50% idiot and 100% on ignore.


What a coincidence. I just plonked somebody too. The actual troll shiatting on this thread.

/Hint: It isn't Dwight.
 
2012-07-31 08:25:20 PM  

bugontherug: That, and the documentation required to get the IDs aren't free. I.e., $35 for a birth certificate here, $25 for another document there, etc. Then there's the issue of whether people know they're free, or even that they're going to be required this year.


Senior citizens pay a reduced or in some cases, no fee in most places. Besides, how many people don't have a copy of their birth certificate? Let me guess, you think it's millions, right?
 
2012-07-31 08:26:20 PM  

consider this: Dwight_Yeast: That's nice, but you don't live in Philadelphia.

You didn't answer my question: shill, idiot or troll? Which one are you?


I live in a city larger than Philadelphia.

I'm putting you down for 50% troll, 50% idiot and 100% on ignore.


Hahahaha!

Fresh trolls are so touchy sometimes.
 
2012-07-31 08:26:57 PM  

consider this: I live in a city larger than Philadelphia.


So you don't even live in Pennsylvania, yet you seem to feel you're an expect on our ID and voting situation.

Really?

consider this: So taking the bus to get an ID would be impossible? Just how did this lady prove who she was when required to do so for things like writing checks, visiting her bank, picking up prescriptions and a dozen other things where a person has to prove their identity?


I've never had to show an ID to pick up a prescription. Hell, I used to pick up my neighbor's prescriptions for her, as well as my parents' and my brother's.

She paid her bills by mail and deposited her pension and SS checks in person to her account. you don't have to have an ID to make a banking deposit.

You'd likely be surprised how un-necessary a photo ID is in our society if you don't drive or own a car.
 
2012-07-31 08:28:52 PM  

consider this: Dwight_Yeast: Let's take the case of the woman who lived next door to me when I was growing up: she never learned to drive (a fair number of people who live in cities don't) and when she worked -she was a nurse at a retirement home for decades- she took the bus to and from work.

In fact, she took the bus pretty much everywhere. It's how she got her groceries. It's how she got down town to see her doctors. It's how she did her major shopping at the department stores.

So taking the bus to get an ID would be impossible? Just how did this lady prove who she was when required to do so for things like writing checks, visiting her bank, picking up prescriptions and a dozen other things where a person has to prove their identity?


"A good number of these people, particularly seniors, function well with the IDs they have long had - such as Medicaid cards, Social Security cards or bank cards. Among the elderly, many of them have banked at the same branch for so long that tellers recognize them without needing to see their IDs. They also may rarely need to cash or deposit checks, relying instead on the direct depositing of Social Security and pension payments.

'The people we're finding are very poor people, people who never drove - and it's surprising how many people are like that,' says Larry Dupuis of the American Civil Liberties Union of Wisconsin, which has filed suit to overturn that state's voter ID law. 'They tend to be older people, often women. They also never had a need for a state ID card. There are many things you don't need an ID card for that people think you actually need one for.'"
 
2012-07-31 08:30:00 PM  

consider this: Boxcutta: Fact: There are ZERO documented cases of voter fraud in Pa.
Fact: The Pa. Republican House Majority Leader admitted that this voter ID law is designed to help Romney carry the state.
Fact: There are several counties in Pa. that are so rural they have no DMV and there are multitudes of instances of DMVs refusing to issue ID to persons who are entitled to one.


Amazing how people like you will blatantly lie and distort the facts and then call people trolls and idiots for not agreeing with your position.


You nailed it. It's tough for blatant liars such as myself to cope once truth-tellers such as yourself demonstrate my falsehoods with proof. Thanks for setting me straight.

/You're a troll and/or idiot.
 
2012-07-31 08:30:16 PM  
To Get An ID, You Need An ID

In most states with voter ID laws, citizens must present birth certificates to obtain new photo IDs. Seniors and those born in rural areas, in particular, face a difficult time meeting the requirement because birth certificates weren't regularly generated in the 1930s and earlier. And many of these people were delivered by midwives, who often improperly spelled babies' and parents' names on birth documents.

People are caught in a Catch-22: You need a birth certificate to get this ID, but to get a birth certificate you have to have an ID.

- Elisabeth MacNamara, League of Women Voters.

If a state does have a person's birth certificate, they often must present a photo ID to obtain a copy. That can put an individual back at square one.

"People are caught in a Catch-22: You need a birth certificate to get this ID, but to get a birth certificate you have to have an ID," says Elisabeth MacNamara, who heads the League of Women Voters.

MacNamara also notes that a birth certificate may not be sufficient documentation for women who changed their names after marrying. States require them to present their marriage licenses or divorce decrees.
 
2012-07-31 08:30:43 PM  

Soup4Bonnie: Tumunga: Here you go, Mr. Gooding, Jr.:

Link

That was an exciting read of Specfriggintacular's Blog, but he doesn't seem to know the difference between voter fraud and voter registration fraud. I'm also curious how Voter ID laws are going to stop absentee voter fraud. Want to help me out on that? Or maybe you can tell me how those people who did commit absentee voter fraud were caught without voter ID laws being in place?


I don't know about the writer of the blog, but I recon he's a repubtard, so I understand your resistance to read the blog.

Anyway, I only know abuot the Lake County, Indana affair. Whether a law was in effect or not, I think, is irrelevant. Fraud is fraud. Here's a CNN (approved by Farkdom libtards) link explaining what, when, where, how, and why:

Link
 
2012-07-31 08:32:07 PM  

consider this: bugontherug: That, and the documentation required to get the IDs aren't free. I.e., $35 for a birth certificate here, $25 for another document there, etc. Then there's the issue of whether people know they're free, or even that they're going to be required this year.

Senior citizens pay a reduced or in some cases, no fee in most places. Besides, how many people don't have a copy of their birth certificate? Let me guess, you think it's millions, right?


Yes, the number is in the millions. Probably in the tens of millions. And I've never heard of senior citizens paying any reduced fees to obtain birth certificates, copies of marriage licenses, or divorce decrees.
 
2012-07-31 08:36:44 PM  

thenewmissus: Tumunga: A Dark Evil Omen: shotglasss: Just show your picture ID and you'll fly right through. You know, that thing you have to show to buy beer, cash a check, drive a car, show a cop if he wants to see it, etc....

Who doesn't have a photo ID, especially when state will give you one if you can't afford it.

If you don't have supporting evidence it becomes very difficult and expensive to get that "free" ID.

Meh. $30 tops. Just turn off the all access cable/dish channel, put down the crack pipe, stand out in front of your house and sell a couple of blowjobs. Skip 5 McDonalds meals, whatever. If you can't find a way to shiat $30 nowdays, you're not smart enough to vote.

Must be nice to be white and secure. Sounds like you would believe in literacy tests as well.


Naw, well, I guess you would have to be able to read the names on the ballot, or at least be able to tell the difference between a picture of a donkey, and a picture of an elephant, amirite?
 
2012-07-31 08:36:53 PM  

bugontherug: And I've never heard of senior citizens paying any reduced fees to obtain birth certificates, copies of marriage licenses, or divorce decrees.


Then you've never looked it up. In my state, they can get a state ID free and only pay $5 for a certified copy of a birth certificate. Most, if not all, states do the same thing.
 
2012-07-31 08:38:22 PM  

consider this: bugontherug: And I've never heard of senior citizens paying any reduced fees to obtain birth certificates, copies of marriage licenses, or divorce decrees.

Then you've never looked it up. In my state, they can get a state ID free and only pay $5 for a certified copy of a birth certificate. Most, if not all, states do the same thing.


Citation needed for both propositions.
 
2012-07-31 08:39:13 PM  
Do a Google search for "free senior citizen ID's" and you'll find countless references to the various programs across the country.
 
2012-07-31 08:40:02 PM  

consider this: bugontherug: And I've never heard of senior citizens paying any reduced fees to obtain birth certificates, copies of marriage licenses, or divorce decrees.

Then you've never looked it up. In my state, they can get a state ID free and only pay $5 for a certified copy of a birth certificate. Most, if not all, states do the same thing.


You mean you're not from Pennsylvania? Why, you seemed like such an expert on what the voter ID law here says and who is (not) affected. I am shocked.

Pro tip: in the future, have at least one of your alts in the thread pretend to have some actual knowledge about the particular piece of legislation you're discussing. When you call other people liars it makes it a bit more credible.
 
2012-07-31 08:40:38 PM  
For people who think voter fraud is a problem...just consider the cost. It's far, far cheaper to bribe one or two election officials/county clerks/etc, than it is to bribe the hundreds, if not thousands of people one would need to fraudulently swing an election. And they WOULD need to be bribed; either group would be risking serious jail time.

Furthermore, consider the risk; the more people that vote fraudulently, the better odds there are that they, and the people they work for, will be caught. Bribing the people who count the votes is much less risky.

THAT is why actual "voter fraud" isn't a problem, and requiring an ID wouldn't solve any electoral fraud.
 
2012-07-31 08:41:07 PM  

consider this: bugontherug: And I've never heard of senior citizens paying any reduced fees to obtain birth certificates, copies of marriage licenses, or divorce decrees.

Then you've never looked it up. In my state, they can get a state ID free and only pay $5 for a certified copy of a birth certificate. Most, if not all, states do the same thing.


In my state, senior citizens pay full price for all required documents like everyone else does. Most, if not all, states do the same thing.

And in any event, a $5 poll tax is still a $5 poll tax. Unless states make photo IDs, and all documents required to obtain them available free of charge, these laws are still wrong.
 
2012-07-31 08:43:24 PM  

consider this: Do a Google search for "free senior citizen ID's" and you'll find countless references to the various programs across the country.


Yes, we should do your homework for you. *eyeroll*

PLONK!
 
2012-07-31 08:43:25 PM  

Tumunga: thenewmissus: Tumunga: A Dark Evil Omen: shotglasss: Just show your picture ID and you'll fly right through. You know, that thing you have to show to buy beer, cash a check, drive a car, show a cop if he wants to see it, etc....

Who doesn't have a photo ID, especially when state will give you one if you can't afford it.

If you don't have supporting evidence it becomes very difficult and expensive to get that "free" ID.

Meh. $30 tops. Just turn off the all access cable/dish channel, put down the crack pipe, stand out in front of your house and sell a couple of blowjobs. Skip 5 McDonalds meals, whatever. If you can't find a way to shiat $30 nowdays, you're not smart enough to vote.

Must be nice to be white and secure. Sounds like you would believe in literacy tests as well.

Naw, well, I guess you would have to be able to read the names on the ballot, or at least be able to tell the difference between a picture of a donkey, and a picture of an elephant, amirite?


Once again, white and secure. There is no agency that can help my mom with this. We have verified all information through the census but she still can't get the paperwork she needs. It has been over 5 years with no progress. It's a shame that a person who never has to face this issue is making rules that affect my mom. They effectively took away her right to vote when she did nothing wrong. It would be different if she did some type of behavior to warrant the State of Florida removing her rights, but to take them away arbitrarily is just wrong on many levels.
 
2012-07-31 08:43:36 PM  

Sabyen91: consider this: Dwight_Yeast: That's nice, but you don't live in Philadelphia.

You didn't answer my question: shill, idiot or troll? Which one are you?


I live in a city larger than Philadelphia.

I'm putting you down for 50% troll, 50% idiot and 100% on ignore.

What a coincidence. I just plonked somebody too. The actual troll shiatting on this thread.

/Hint: It isn't Dwight.


Why would you ignore someone in the politics thread for trolling/idiocity? It's always 50/50 in here, dependant on what -tard side you're on. If you ignore everyone you don't agree with, it will be like a monestary in here.
 
2012-07-31 08:45:05 PM  

anindependent: Most, if not all, states do the same thing.


You should really search Google before you say anything else.
 
2012-07-31 08:46:15 PM  

thenewmissus: Once again, white and secure. There is no agency that can help my mom with this. We have verified all information through the census but she still can't get the paperwork she needs. It has been over 5 years with no progress. It's a shame that a person who never has to face this issue is making rules that affect my mom. They effectively took away her right to vote when she did nothing wrong. It would be different if she did some type of behavior to warrant the State of Florida removing her rights, but to take them away arbitrarily is just wrong on many levels.


Have her contact the ACLU. They exist to make sure people like her are not disenfranchised.
 
2012-07-31 08:48:28 PM  

Boxcutta: thenewmissus: Once again, white and secure. There is no agency that can help my mom with this. We have verified all information through the census but she still can't get the paperwork she needs. It has been over 5 years with no progress. It's a shame that a person who never has to face this issue is making rules that affect my mom. They effectively took away her right to vote when she did nothing wrong. It would be different if she did some type of behavior to warrant the State of Florida removing her rights, but to take them away arbitrarily is just wrong on many levels.

Have her contact the ACLU. They exist to make sure people like her are not disenfranchised.


Thank you for that information. I did not realize that they took cases like hers. I will call her tomorrow and give her the ACLU information. Actually, I will probably contact the ACLU and then see if I can have a conference call of some type. She is 76 years old and sometimes she gets nervous when she isn't sure how to proceed with a conversation. I don't want her to miss her shot at getting this crap resolved. Shame that she has to contact an attorney to exercise her right as an American.
 
2012-07-31 08:54:26 PM  

thenewmissus: Tumunga: thenewmissus: Tumunga: A Dark Evil Omen: shotglasss: Just show your picture ID and you'll fly right through. You know, that thing you have to show to buy beer, cash a check, drive a car, show a cop if he wants to see it, etc....

Who doesn't have a photo ID, especially when state will give you one if you can't afford it.

If you don't have supporting evidence it becomes very difficult and expensive to get that "free" ID.

Meh. $30 tops. Just turn off the all access cable/dish channel, put down the crack pipe, stand out in front of your house and sell a couple of blowjobs. Skip 5 McDonalds meals, whatever. If you can't find a way to shiat $30 nowdays, you're not smart enough to vote.

Must be nice to be white and secure. Sounds like you would believe in literacy tests as well.

Naw, well, I guess you would have to be able to read the names on the ballot, or at least be able to tell the difference between a picture of a donkey, and a picture of an elephant, amirite?

Once again, white and secure. There is no agency that can help my mom with this. We have verified all information through the census but she still can't get the paperwork she needs. It has been over 5 years with no progress. It's a shame that a person who never has to face this issue is making rules that affect my mom. They effectively took away her right to vote when she did nothing wrong. It would be different if she did some type of behavior to warrant the State of Florida removing her rights, but to take them away arbitrarily is just wrong on many levels.


I feel her pain.

/Spanish.
 
2012-07-31 08:55:11 PM  

Seabon: Tumunga: A Dark Evil Omen: shotglasss: Just show your picture ID and you'll fly right through. You know, that thing you have to show to buy beer, cash a check, drive a car, show a cop if he wants to see it, etc....

Who doesn't have a photo ID, especially when state will give you one if you can't afford it.

If you don't have supporting evidence it becomes very difficult and expensive to get that "free" ID.

Meh. $30 tops. Just turn off the all access cable/dish channel, put down the crack pipe, stand out in front of your house and sell a couple of blowjobs. Skip 5 McDonalds meals, whatever. If you can't find a way to shiat $30 nowdays, you're not smart enough to vote.

That constitution conservatives are always worshiping as if it were written by Jesus himself guarentees the right to vote to all. If the intent is to exclude some by reason of their knowledge, wisdom, or intelligence; then you best get to the amendment process. For a law passed with your stated intend would certainly be unconstitutional.


You went off track in your first sentence. The Constitution does not guarantee the right to vote to all. You must qualify in a number of ways. Citizenship is one way...in the county, state, city, or country you are trying to vote in. Illegal immigrants are not allowed to vote in US elections. Neither are felons who have not had their rights restored. These are two groups of people the Democrats desperately need to help them retain their offices, and that's why they're so mouth-frothingly opposed to any ID requirement.
 
2012-07-31 08:57:34 PM  

consider this: Do a Google search for "free senior citizen ID's" and you'll find countless references to the various programs across the country.


but are they accepted by the state for voting purposes?
 
2012-07-31 08:59:17 PM  

shotglasss: These are two groups of people the Democrats desperately need to help them retain their offices


*eyeroll*

[citation needed]
 
2012-07-31 09:00:40 PM  

Hobodeluxe: but are they accepted by the state for voting purposes?


They're state issued ID's, so yes.
 
2012-07-31 09:03:16 PM  

shotglasss: Seabon: Tumunga: A Dark Evil Omen: shotglasss: Just show your picture ID and you'll fly right through. You know, that thing you have to show to buy beer, cash a check, drive a car, show a cop if he wants to see it, etc....

Who doesn't have a photo ID, especially when state will give you one if you can't afford it.

If you don't have supporting evidence it becomes very difficult and expensive to get that "free" ID.

Meh. $30 tops. Just turn off the all access cable/dish channel, put down the crack pipe, stand out in front of your house and sell a couple of blowjobs. Skip 5 McDonalds meals, whatever. If you can't find a way to shiat $30 nowdays, you're not smart enough to vote.

That constitution conservatives are always worshiping as if it were written by Jesus himself guarentees the right to vote to all. If the intent is to exclude some by reason of their knowledge, wisdom, or intelligence; then you best get to the amendment process. For a law passed with your stated intend would certainly be unconstitutional.

You went off track in your first sentence. The Constitution does not guarantee the right to vote to all. You must qualify in a number of ways. Citizenship is one way...in the county, state, city, or country you are trying to vote in. Illegal immigrants are not allowed to vote in US elections. Neither are felons who have not had their rights restored. These are two groups of people the Democrats desperately need to help them retain their offices, and that's why they're so mouth-frothingly opposed to any ID requirement.



Or maybe the Democrats are trying to protect people like my mom. Unless you know someone who has this problem, I can understand how it is easy to assume that you can solve this problem with ID. Once again, catch-22. So because she was born in the south and had the nerve to be black and had no birth certificate, she doetsn't deserve to vote? Not trying to put words in your mouth but you have to at least agree that the way the laws are written could possibly disenfranchise some undeserving people. If you can't agree with that, then we have no place to go from here. My mom has sat out several elections (not all Presidential, obviously). My mother cried because she couldn't cast a vote for Obama. Whether or not you agree with her vote, as a black woman, she was genuinely hurt by not being able to vote. She can't get that moment in time back. She is 76 years old, after all.
 
2012-07-31 09:05:17 PM  

thenewmissus: shotglasss: Seabon: Tumunga: A Dark Evil Omen: shotglasss: Just show your picture ID and you'll fly right through. You know, that thing you have to show to buy beer, cash a check, drive a car, show a cop if he wants to see it, etc....

Who doesn't have a photo ID, especially when state will give you one if you can't afford it.

If you don't have supporting evidence it becomes very difficult and expensive to get that "free" ID.

Meh. $30 tops. Just turn off the all access cable/dish channel, put down the crack pipe, stand out in front of your house and sell a couple of blowjobs. Skip 5 McDonalds meals, whatever. If you can't find a way to shiat $30 nowdays, you're not smart enough to vote.

That constitution conservatives are always worshiping as if it were written by Jesus himself guarentees the right to vote to all. If the intent is to exclude some by reason of their knowledge, wisdom, or intelligence; then you best get to the amendment process. For a law passed with your stated intend would certainly be unconstitutional.

You went off track in your first sentence. The Constitution does not guarantee the right to vote to all. You must qualify in a number of ways. Citizenship is one way...in the county, state, city, or country you are trying to vote in. Illegal immigrants are not allowed to vote in US elections. Neither are felons who have not had their rights restored. These are two groups of people the Democrats desperately need to help them retain their offices, and that's why they're so mouth-frothingly opposed to any ID requirement.


Or maybe the Democrats are trying to protect people like my mom. Unless you know someone who has this problem, I can understand how it is easy to assume that you can solve this problem with ID. Once again, catch-22. So because she was born in the south and had the nerve to be black and had no birth certificate, she doetsn't deserve to vote? Not trying to put words in your mouth but you have to at least agree that the way the ...


He seems to be conveniently ignoring the repeated examples of real people that would be affected by this, so I wouldn't expect a response. It doesn't fit his narrow worldview.
 
2012-07-31 09:11:23 PM  

thenewmissus: Or maybe the Democrats are trying to protect people like my mom.


Yeah that's it, I'm sure it has nothing to do with the millions of illegals that would vote democrat if given the chance.
 
2012-07-31 09:11:49 PM  
how drunk on the kool aid do you have to be to believe republicans are taking this issue up to preserve democracy and not to suppress and disenfranchise people who historically don't vote for them? I mean come on, it's laughable.
 
2012-07-31 09:13:41 PM  
thank you birchman. I believe that you may be right. My mother believes that it is just the way white people are trying to keep black people from voting. It is hard not to disagree with her when she knows other elderly people who are in the same boat. People forget history and think that the world was always logging births and such. My mother actually isn't sure if she was born in 1934 or 1936. We give her the two years and say 1936. My brother suggesting cutting her in half and counting the rings!!!!!
 
2012-07-31 09:16:18 PM  

consider this: Yeah that's it, I'm sure it has nothing to do with the millions of illegals that would vote democrat if given the chance.


Because if there's one thing illegals love doing, it's risking a felony conviction and deportation to cast a single vote. They're illegal, but they're also so patriotic. And there's millions of them. The illegals. That can't help but voting.
 
2012-07-31 09:16:30 PM  

consider this: thenewmissus: Or maybe the Democrats are trying to protect people like my mom.

Yeah that's it, I'm sure it has nothing to do with the millions of illegals that would vote democrat if given the chance.


Like the illegals have been doing all along right? I would bet that for every documented case of voter fraud, there are 2 cases of people who can't obtain the paperwork to secure their right to vote.
 
2012-07-31 09:18:39 PM  

thamike: Wow, the quote wasn't far off at all.


Yeah, huh?

she wasn't sure about the details of the law, but stood by her unsupported claim that 99 percent of voters had valid identification.

"I don't know what the law says," Aichele said under questioning, according to CBS.


Why o WHY are these cretins getting elected? (Or appointed by other elected cretins) Is the only job requirement "Yeah, I'm stupid!"
 
2012-07-31 09:19:57 PM  

LordJiro: For people who think voter fraud is a problem...just consider the cost. It's far, far cheaper to bribe one or two election officials/county clerks/etc, than it is to bribe the hundreds, if not thousands of people one would need to fraudulently swing an election. And they WOULD need to be bribed; either group would be risking serious jail time.

Furthermore, consider the risk; the more people that vote fraudulently, the better odds there are that they, and the people they work for, will be caught. Bribing the people who count the votes is much less risky.

THAT is why actual "voter fraud" isn't a problem, and requiring an ID wouldn't solve any electoral fraud.


Good lord, man! Reasonable arguments have no place in a politics thread!
 
2012-07-31 09:21:21 PM  

consider this: thenewmissus: Or maybe the Democrats are trying to protect people like my mom.

Yeah that's it, I'm sure it has nothing to do with the millions of illegals that would vote democrat if given the chance.


All you have to do is provide any proof at all that voter fraud happens at any sort of significant rate that it would remotely affect any election results. But you don't, because you can't, because the proof doesn't exist. You've been brainwashed, you've drank the kool-aid and went back for more. Quick being so ignorant. There is no good reason at all for this.
 
2012-07-31 09:23:26 PM  

consider this: thenewmissus: Or maybe the Democrats are trying to protect people like my mom.

Yeah that's it, I'm sure it has nothing to do with the millions of illegals that would vote democrat if given the chance.


You're like a bottomless pit of uneducated, incorrect and nonsensical opinions.
 
2012-07-31 09:31:25 PM  
The up-side of the Sec Commonwealth's performance today is that it doesn't exactly strengthen the position those arguing that we need this law.

As it currently stands, I'm pretty sure the court will strike it down.
 
2012-07-31 09:31:32 PM  

thenewmissus: thank you birchman. I believe that you may be right. My mother believes that it is just the way white people are trying to keep black people from voting. It is hard not to disagree with her when she knows other elderly people who are in the same boat. People forget history and think that the world was always logging births and such. My mother actually isn't sure if she was born in 1934 or 1936. We give her the two years and say 1936. My brother suggesting cutting her in half and counting the rings!!!!!


I hope she gets it figured out, that's really unfortunate. Too bad there are so many idiots out there (and in this thread) who have no problem trying to continue keeping her from voting. Empathy is a trait that the GOP lost a long time ago, and they've trained their faithful to act the same way.
 
2012-07-31 09:31:41 PM  

consider this: thenewmissus: Or maybe the Democrats are trying to protect people like my mom.

Yeah that's it, I'm sure it has nothing to do with the millions of illegals that would vote democrat if given the chance.


According to you, they have the chance now, without Voter ID laws in place. Why haven't they done it already? Are they just waiting for the laws to be in place so they can break them?
 
2012-07-31 09:31:49 PM  

thenewmissus: I would bet that for every documented case of voter fraud, there are 2 cases of people who can't obtain the paperwork to secure their right to vote.


So you want documented cases of voter fraud but are willing to believe that there are millions of people unable to cast a vote with no supporting evidence?

This is all a moot point anyways, voter ID laws have been ruled legal by the supreme court and are spreading around the country. In a few years, you won't be able to cast a ballot anywhere without proving your citizenship and that's the way it should be.
 
2012-07-31 09:34:10 PM  

consider this: This is all a moot point anyways, voter ID laws have been ruled legal by the supreme court and are spreading around the country. In a few years, you won't be able to cast a ballot anywhere without proving your citizenship and that's the way it should be.


Except for the fact that they're being overturned in FL, WI and now likely PA, you're right!
 
2012-07-31 09:35:03 PM  

cameroncrazy1984: According to you, they have the chance now, without Voter ID laws in place. Why haven't they done it already? Are they just waiting for the laws to be in place so they can break them?


There aren't voter ID laws in place now? Strange since what I'm reading online shows that around 31 states have some form of voter ID law.
 
2012-07-31 09:36:36 PM  

consider this: cameroncrazy1984: According to you, they have the chance now, without Voter ID laws in place. Why haven't they done it already? Are they just waiting for the laws to be in place so they can break them?

There aren't voter ID laws in place now? Strange since what I'm reading online shows that around 31 states have some form of voter ID law.


Prior to this election, how many states have this kind of voter ID law? Prior to this election, what was the occurrence of voter fraud in any one of those 31 states?
 
2012-07-31 09:37:38 PM  

consider this: thenewmissus: I would bet that for every documented case of voter fraud, there are 2 cases of people who can't obtain the paperwork to secure their right to vote.

So you want documented cases of voter fraud but are willing to believe that there are millions of people unable to cast a vote with no supporting evidence?

This is all a moot point anyways, voter ID laws have been ruled legal by the supreme court and are spreading around the country. In a few years, you won't be able to cast a ballot anywhere without proving your citizenship and that's the way it should be.


So when will we be extending this requirement to buying/owning/possessing a gun so we can track that only citizens are getting the benefits of the 2nd amendment? Seems only fair...
 
2012-07-31 09:39:01 PM  

birchman: So when will we be extending this requirement to buying/owning/possessing a gun so we can track that only citizens are getting the benefits of the 2nd amendment? Seems only fair...


Illegals can't legally buy guns now, can they?
 
2012-07-31 09:40:07 PM  

consider this: birchman: So when will we be extending this requirement to buying/owning/possessing a gun so we can track that only citizens are getting the benefits of the 2nd amendment? Seems only fair...

Illegals can't legally buy guns now, can they?


They aren't voting either, are they?

/don't answer that
//you already know they aren't.
 
2012-07-31 09:41:25 PM  

Donnchadha: Drinking alcohol is not a constitutionally protected right. I'd argue that purchasing beer does not involve the government, but this is Pennsylvania, so it does there.

Cashing a check is a transaction between private entities, not the government.

You do not need photo ID to drive a car. You need to be licensed to drive a car and the license takes the form of valid photo ID.

You do not need to show a cop your photo ID if he requests it. You must identify yourself, but you do not need to "present your papers" on demand. If a cop asks for your license while driving a car it is to verify that you are a licensed driver. If he asks for your drivers license while you're walking down the street, you can tell him "No, but my name is John Smith".


I'll sleep easy when voting requires the same amount of Identification as firearms ownership. The sliders between more/less are completely up to you but they have to be equal since both are rights.

birchman: Too bad there are so many idiots out there (and in this thread) who have no problem trying to continue keeping her from voting


No, it is about ensuring that the people who do vote:
Are who they say they are
live where they say they live
are actually eligible to vote

As much as some would like, we cant adopt a system of laws which says that voter ID is ok, except if you're granny and a couple of people can vouch for you. The law is supposed to be applied equally and going to the DMV or courthouse once every 10 years to get your free ID only disenfranchises the lazy or miscreant
 
2012-07-31 09:41:45 PM  

consider this: birchman: So when will we be extending this requirement to buying/owning/possessing a gun so we can track that only citizens are getting the benefits of the 2nd amendment? Seems only fair...

Illegals can't legally buy guns now, can they?


They can keep and bear them, whether they bought them legally or not. Better start asking for photo id everytime we see someone with a gun and documenting it.
 
2012-07-31 09:42:07 PM  

o5iiawah: No, it is about ensuring that the people who do vote:
Are who they say they are
live where they say they live
are actually eligible to vote


We have that already, it's called the registration process. How many people vote fraudulently? Give me a number.
 
2012-07-31 09:43:21 PM  

consider this: cameroncrazy1984: According to you, they have the chance now, without Voter ID laws in place. Why haven't they done it already? Are they just waiting for the laws to be in place so they can break them?

There aren't voter ID laws in place now? Strange since what I'm reading online shows that around 31 states have some form of voter ID law.


31 states? What, are you counting by fives?
 
2012-07-31 09:44:21 PM  

cameroncrazy1984: They aren't voting either, are they?


Who knows what they're doing in places without voter ID laws.
 
2012-07-31 09:45:12 PM  

consider this: cameroncrazy1984: They aren't voting either, are they?

Who knows what they're doing in places without voter ID laws.


We already do. And the occurrence is four one-thousandths of one percent. .0004%
 
2012-07-31 09:45:48 PM  

consider this: cameroncrazy1984: They aren't voting either, are they?

Who knows what they're doing in places without voter ID laws.


Not you, that's for sure.
 
2012-07-31 09:46:33 PM  

cameroncrazy1984: consider this: cameroncrazy1984: They aren't voting either, are they?

Who knows what they're doing in places without voter ID laws.

We already do. And the occurrence is four one-thousandths of one percent. .0004%


Sorry, .004%
 
2012-07-31 09:48:32 PM  

cameroncrazy1984: We already do. And the occurrence is four one-thousandths of one percent. .0004%


Unless every voter is being verified as a citizen of the USA, they have no idea how much fraud is taking place. Citing supposed facts from groups on your side of the issue proves nothing.
 
2012-07-31 09:50:37 PM  

consider this: cameroncrazy1984: We already do. And the occurrence is four one-thousandths of one percent. .0004%

Unless every voter is being verified as a citizen of the USA, they have no idea how much fraud is taking place. Citing supposed facts from groups on your side of the issue proves nothing.


As opposed to citing nothing...
 
2012-07-31 09:51:27 PM  

consider this: cameroncrazy1984: We already do. And the occurrence is four one-thousandths of one percent. .0004%

Unless every voter is being verified as a citizen of the USA, they have no idea how much fraud is taking place. Citing supposed facts from groups on your side of the issue proves nothing.


Right? It's much easier to cite no facts in support of your position. Keep it up.
 
2012-07-31 09:51:50 PM  

consider this: cameroncrazy1984: We already do. And the occurrence is four one-thousandths of one percent. .0004%

Unless every voter is being verified as a citizen of the USA, they have no idea how much fraud is taking place. Citing supposed facts from groups on your side of the issue proves nothing.


Supposed facts? You have no idea where the facts come from. You haven't even bothered to do the research into how much voter fraud is actually taking place. Lastly, you have zero concept of how statistics work. Do you actually think that polls are only accurate if they ask every single voter who they are going to vote for?
 
2012-07-31 09:53:04 PM  
In general, this type of response would be expected in Pa.
A politician or appointed bureaucrat here, is almost expected to be this insipid.
 
2012-07-31 09:55:22 PM  

consider this: Unless every voter is being verified as a citizen of the USA, they have no idea how much fraud is taking place


Also, I like how you just basically admitted that your entire argument is full if shiat. Nice work.
 
2012-07-31 09:59:40 PM  

birchman: Also, I like how you just basically admitted that your entire argument is full if shiat. Nice work.


My argument is sound, what there is absolutely no proof of is that large numbers of people are being disenfranchised due to voter ID laws.
 
2012-07-31 10:00:37 PM  

consider this: birchman: Also, I like how you just basically admitted that your entire argument is full if shiat. Nice work.

My argument is sound, what there is absolutely no proof of is that large numbers of people are being disenfranchised due to voter ID laws.


Only to those tho do not understand basic statistics. To those of us in the reality-based community, we understand that multiple studies have shown voter fraud to be on the order of less than one-tenth of a percent.
 
2012-07-31 10:05:14 PM  

cameroncrazy1984: Only to those tho do not understand basic statistics. To those of us in the reality-based community, we understand that multiple studies have shown voter fraud to be on the order of less than one-tenth of a percent.


Studies from the same people claiming millions of people being denied the right to vote.
 
2012-07-31 10:05:57 PM  

consider this: cameroncrazy1984: Only to those tho do not understand basic statistics. To those of us in the reality-based community, we understand that multiple studies have shown voter fraud to be on the order of less than one-tenth of a percent.

Studies from the same people claiming millions of people being denied the right to vote.


Do you have a specific problem with the methodology? If so, what is it?
 
2012-07-31 10:07:39 PM  

consider this: birchman: Also, I like how you just basically admitted that your entire argument is full if shiat. Nice work.

My argument is sound, what there is absolutely no proof of is that large numbers of people are being disenfranchised due to voter ID laws.


No, there is plenty of evidence on how many people do not have a valid ID for the purpose of staisfying these laws. In fact, several people testified in regards to this case about studies that have been done. Here, it took me 10 seconds to google it.

Link

But I'm sure that stuff "doesn't count" like all the other times people have tried to point this out to you, since it's not what you expect it to be and therefore, must be a lie. You and you're ilk are a sad bunch.
 
2012-07-31 10:08:47 PM  

cameroncrazy1984: consider this: cameroncrazy1984: Only to those tho do not understand basic statistics. To those of us in the reality-based community, we understand that multiple studies have shown voter fraud to be on the order of less than one-tenth of a percent.

Studies from the same people claiming millions of people being denied the right to vote.

Do you have a specific problem with the methodology? If so, what is it?


I think the only problem he can probably specify is that he doesn't like the result.
 
2012-07-31 10:09:31 PM  

birchman: cameroncrazy1984: consider this: cameroncrazy1984: Only to those tho do not understand basic statistics. To those of us in the reality-based community, we understand that multiple studies have shown voter fraud to be on the order of less than one-tenth of a percent.

Studies from the same people claiming millions of people being denied the right to vote.

Do you have a specific problem with the methodology? If so, what is it?

I think the only problem he can probably specify is that he doesn't like the result.


That's basically what I'm waiting for, if he answers at all.
 
2012-07-31 10:19:21 PM  

o5iiawah: Donnchadha: Drinking alcohol is not a constitutionally protected right. I'd argue that purchasing beer does not involve the government, but this is Pennsylvania, so it does there.

Cashing a check is a transaction between private entities, not the government.

You do not need photo ID to drive a car. You need to be licensed to drive a car and the license takes the form of valid photo ID.

You do not need to show a cop your photo ID if he requests it. You must identify yourself, but you do not need to "present your papers" on demand. If a cop asks for your license while driving a car it is to verify that you are a licensed driver. If he asks for your drivers license while you're walking down the street, you can tell him "No, but my name is John Smith".

I'll sleep easy when voting requires the same amount of Identification as firearms ownership. The sliders between more/less are completely up to you but they have to be equal since both are rights.

birchman: Too bad there are so many idiots out there (and in this thread) who have no problem trying to continue keeping her from voting

No, it is about ensuring that the people who do vote:
Are who they say they are
live where they say they live
are actually eligible to vote

As much as some would like, we cant adopt a system of laws which says that voter ID is ok, except if you're granny and a couple of people can vouch for you. The law is supposed to be applied equally and going to the DMV or courthouse once every 10 years to get your free ID only disenfranchises the lazy or miscreant


Okay. First of all, what didn't you understand about my mom's story? Not her fault. Never has been her fault. You can spin this anyway that you like, but my mom has broken no laws and still can't vote. Tell me how that is fair to her. Are you going to say that it is fair to disenfranchise my mom?
 
2012-07-31 10:21:17 PM  

birchman: I think the only problem he can probably specify is that he doesn't like the result.


What result? The only thing I don't like is the possibility of people voting that shouldn't be. I couldn't give a fark less about the agendas of the republicans or democrats, I just don't see a problem with requiring ID in order to cast a ballot in an election, whether it's for a city council or president.
 
2012-07-31 10:21:33 PM  
Hmm, crickets. I wonder where he could have gone just now.
 
2012-07-31 10:22:36 PM  

consider this: The only thing I don't like is the possibility of people voting that shouldn't be.


Ok great. You don't like something that all of the math shows isn't happening. You support spending taxpayer money to combat something that all of the math shows isn't happening. I sure as hell hope you're not a conservative, because that seems like a gigantic waste of money to me.
 
2012-07-31 10:25:43 PM  

cameroncrazy1984: consider this: The only thing I don't like is the possibility of people voting that shouldn't be.

Ok great. You don't like something that all of the math shows isn't happening. You support spending taxpayer money to combat something that all of the math shows isn't happening. I sure as hell hope you're not a conservative, because that seems like a gigantic waste of money to me.


Welccome to my favorites. What took you so long? ; )
 
2012-07-31 10:26:59 PM  

thenewmissus: cameroncrazy1984: consider this: The only thing I don't like is the possibility of people voting that shouldn't be.

Ok great. You don't like something that all of the math shows isn't happening. You support spending taxpayer money to combat something that all of the math shows isn't happening. I sure as hell hope you're not a conservative, because that seems like a gigantic waste of money to me.

Welccome to my favorites. What took you so long? ; )


Well, you know, I don't like to make a great first impression.
 
2012-07-31 10:29:05 PM  

consider this: birchman: I think the only problem he can probably specify is that he doesn't like the result.

What result? The only thing I don't like is the possibility of people voting that shouldn't be. I couldn't give a fark less about the agendas of the republicans or democrats, I just don't see a problem with requiring ID in order to cast a ballot in an election, whether it's for a city council or president.


Well then I have good news for you, because there is no evidence that what you don't like is happening! Yay! And now we don't need to deny millions of people the right to vote just to make you feel better!

I'm glad we had this talk. Seems like it's going to work out for everyone.
 
2012-07-31 10:30:34 PM  

birchman: consider this: birchman: I think the only problem he can probably specify is that he doesn't like the result.

What result? The only thing I don't like is the possibility of people voting that shouldn't be. I couldn't give a fark less about the agendas of the republicans or democrats, I just don't see a problem with requiring ID in order to cast a ballot in an election, whether it's for a city council or president.

Well then I have good news for you, because there is no evidence that what you don't like is happening! Yay! And now we don't need to deny millions of people the right to vote just to make you feel better!

I'm glad we had this talk. Seems like it's going to work out for everyone.


Welcome to my favorites as well. Thank you for giving my the advice about the ACLU.
 
2012-07-31 10:32:02 PM  

cameroncrazy1984: Ok great. You don't like something that all of the math shows isn't happening.


You keep saying that but offer nothing reliable to back it up. Common sense tells me that when you don't require people to provide ID that fraud is a very real possibility.
 
2012-07-31 10:32:50 PM  

thenewmissus: birchman: consider this: birchman: I think the only problem he can probably specify is that he doesn't like the result.

What result? The only thing I don't like is the possibility of people voting that shouldn't be. I couldn't give a fark less about the agendas of the republicans or democrats, I just don't see a problem with requiring ID in order to cast a ballot in an election, whether it's for a city council or president.

Well then I have good news for you, because there is no evidence that what you don't like is happening! Yay! And now we don't need to deny millions of people the right to vote just to make you feel better!

I'm glad we had this talk. Seems like it's going to work out for everyone.

Welcome to my favorites as well. Thank you for giving my the advice about the ACLU.


I think that was someone else, but it's good advice. They very well may be able to help her, I hope they can.
 
2012-07-31 10:33:10 PM  

consider this: cameroncrazy1984: Ok great. You don't like something that all of the math shows isn't happening.

You keep saying that but offer nothing reliable to back it up. Common sense tells me that when you don't require people to provide ID that fraud is a very real possibility.


You have yet to demonstrate any issue with the methodologies of the studies, such that you can characterize them as "unreliable"
 
2012-07-31 10:38:41 PM  

consider this: cameroncrazy1984: Ok great. You don't like something that all of the math shows isn't happening.

You keep saying that but offer nothing reliable to back it up. Common sense tells me that when you don't require people to provide ID that fraud is a very real possibility.


Several people have provided data, it's up to you to show why you think it's unreliable. Speaking of providing data, you still haven't provided anything to back your assertions up that voter fraud is happening on a large scale. And if you're going to justify possibly preventing large amounts of people from legally voting, it better be pretty damn good data. We're waiting.
 
2012-07-31 10:39:29 PM  

birchman: consider this: cameroncrazy1984: Ok great. You don't like something that all of the math shows isn't happening.

You keep saying that but offer nothing reliable to back it up. Common sense tells me that when you don't require people to provide ID that fraud is a very real possibility.

Several people have provided data, it's up to you to show why you think it's unreliable. Speaking of providing data, you still haven't provided anything to back your assertions up that voter fraud is happening on a large scale. And if you're going to justify possibly preventing large amounts of people from legally voting, it better be pretty damn good data. We're waiting.


He's provided common sense! Isn't that just as good as scientific research? No? Damn!
 
2012-07-31 10:41:34 PM  

cameroncrazy1984: birchman: consider this: cameroncrazy1984: Ok great. You don't like something that all of the math shows isn't happening.

You keep saying that but offer nothing reliable to back it up. Common sense tells me that when you don't require people to provide ID that fraud is a very real possibility.

Several people have provided data, it's up to you to show why you think it's unreliable. Speaking of providing data, you still haven't provided anything to back your assertions up that voter fraud is happening on a large scale. And if you're going to justify possibly preventing large amounts of people from legally voting, it better be pretty damn good data. We're waiting.

He's provided common sense! Isn't that just as good as scientific research? No? Damn!


Since he's such a common sense expert, I'd like to hear the common sense argument behind how someone organizes a large scale voter fraud effort, involving an enormous amount of people to actually do all the voting and risk imprisonment, and not get caught. Especially since it's much cheaper to just buy off a politician for your cause with "donations".
 
2012-07-31 10:43:47 PM  

birchman: Since he's such a common sense expert, I'd like to hear the common sense argument behind how someone organizes a large scale voter fraud effort, involving an enormous amount of people to actually do all the voting and risk imprisonment, and not get caught. Especially since it's much cheaper to just buy off a politician for your cause with "donations".


The other thing I would like to know is if he thinks it's impossible to know without photo ID, how they have caught voter fraud up til this point.
 
2012-07-31 10:44:43 PM  

consider this: cameroncrazy1984: Ok great. You don't like something that all of the math shows isn't happening.

You keep saying that but offer nothing reliable to back it up. Common sense tells me that when you don't require people to provide ID that fraud is a very real possibility.


Check his profile, guys. This is someone's new alt account.
 
2012-07-31 10:46:04 PM  
Vote for no one.
no one is going to raise taxes.
No one is going to do anything.
Vote to no one.
 
2012-07-31 10:48:02 PM  

Satanic_Hamster: consider this: cameroncrazy1984: Ok great. You don't like something that all of the math shows isn't happening.

You keep saying that but offer nothing reliable to back it up. Common sense tells me that when you don't require people to provide ID that fraud is a very real possibility.

Check his profile, guys. This is someone's new alt account.


I know, I'm just keeping busy in between Olympic events.
 
2012-07-31 10:50:16 PM  

cameroncrazy1984: You have yet to demonstrate any issue with the methodologies of the studies, such that you can characterize them as "unreliable"


The studies you cite are bullshiat propaganda from groups opposed to voter ID laws. Here's the only study that matters....

US Supreme Court - 6 to 3
 
2012-07-31 10:51:18 PM  

consider this: cameroncrazy1984: You have yet to demonstrate any issue with the methodologies of the studies, such that you can characterize them as "unreliable"

The studies you cite are bullshiat propaganda from groups opposed to voter ID laws


Why do you feel they are inaccurate? What should they have done differently?
 
2012-07-31 10:51:51 PM  

consider this: cameroncrazy1984: You have yet to demonstrate any issue with the methodologies of the studies, such that you can characterize them as "unreliable"

The studies you cite are bullshiat propaganda from groups opposed to voter ID laws. Here's the only study that matters....

US Supreme Court - 6 to 3


A) You thinking they are "bullshiat propaganda groups" does not constitute a flaw in their methodology and

B) The Supreme Court has never once done any research into voter fraud.

Try again?
 
2012-07-31 10:52:18 PM  

Satanic_Hamster: Check his profile, guys. This is someone's new alt account.


Yes, being new means that I can't possibly disagree with the majority of the people here and am only trolling for attention.

I guess you missed the part where I posted a poll showing that 70% of the country is in favor of voter ID laws.
 
2012-07-31 10:53:18 PM  

cameroncrazy1984: consider this: cameroncrazy1984: According to you, they have the chance now, without Voter ID laws in place. Why haven't they done it already? Are they just waiting for the laws to be in place so they can break them?

There aren't voter ID laws in place now? Strange since what I'm reading online shows that around 31 states have some form of voter ID law.

Prior to this election, how many states have this kind of voter ID law? Prior to this election, what was the occurrence of voter fraud in any one of those 31 states?


According to the GOP, about 1000% voter fraud occurred in any state they didn't win.
 
2012-07-31 10:55:13 PM  

consider this: Satanic_Hamster: Check his profile, guys. This is someone's new alt account.

Yes, being new means that I can't possibly disagree with the majority of the people here and am only trolling for attention.

I guess you missed the part where I posted a poll showing that 70% of the country is in favor of voter ID laws.


At one point in time a majority of the country was in favor of not allowing women or black people to vote. Quick citing that as some sort of "proof" that voter fraud is a problem. It's not.
 
2012-07-31 10:55:48 PM  

birchman: consider this: Satanic_Hamster: Check his profile, guys. This is someone's new alt account.

Yes, being new means that I can't possibly disagree with the majority of the people here and am only trolling for attention.

I guess you missed the part where I posted a poll showing that 70% of the country is in favor of voter ID laws.

At one point in time a majority of the country was in favor of not allowing women or black people to vote. Quick citing that as some sort of "proof" that voter fraud is a problem. It's not.


*Quit
 
2012-07-31 10:57:02 PM  

birchman: At one point in time a majority of the country was in favor of not allowing women or black people to vote.


Well that's certainly the same thing.
 
2012-07-31 10:57:17 PM  

consider this: Satanic_Hamster: Check his profile, guys. This is someone's new alt account.

Yes, being new means that I can't possibly disagree with the majority of the people here and am only trolling for attention.

I guess you missed the part where I posted a poll showing that 70% of the country is in favor of voter ID laws.


That poll was conducted by Fox News for a special called "Stealing your Vote" and contains leading and biased questions, additionally, the poll consisted of 700 landline subscribers and only 200 cell phones, and sampled only 900 voters randomly, and does not reveal the breakdown of the respondents' demographics.

See? That is how you find a problem with a poll's methodology, not by claiming that it was done by a "bullsh*t propaganda" organization.
 
2012-07-31 10:58:07 PM  
Well it's been fun, later guys.
 
2012-07-31 10:58:19 PM  

consider this: birchman: At one point in time a majority of the country was in favor of not allowing women or black people to vote.

Well that's certainly the same thing.


It is. Discrimination is discrimination regardless of the group. Especially when you can find no legitimate reason to discriminate.
 
2012-07-31 10:58:54 PM  

consider this: Well it's been fun, later guys.


Oops, did you have a problem with me dismantling the only citation you had for your entire argument? Sorry to scare you off with reality
 
2012-07-31 11:00:46 PM  
This thread is painful to read.
 
2012-07-31 11:02:44 PM  

consider this: birchman: At one point in time a majority of the country was in favor of not allowing women or black people to vote.

Well that's certainly the same thing.


Yes, public opinion. Certainly not proof of anything. It's cute how you think a public opinion poll on a news website proves anything though, while actual studies do not. Good night little troll.
 
2012-07-31 11:07:01 PM  
CSB: When I voted in the last primary, I walked up to the table and was greeted with a cheerful "Hi Craptastic!" The following conversation ensued:

Me: Hi, Mrs Mac!
Her: I need to see your drivers license.
Me: Really? I've known you since I was a little kid. I went to school with your son. He's standing right over there. Hi, Chris! *waves*
Chris: Hi, Craptastic! *waves back*
Her: I'm sorry, son, new voter laws...
Me: *presents my DL* This is messed up, Mrs. Mac.
Her: It's required to keep illegals from voting.

The GOP in my state (or in ANY state) has presented zero evidence of widespread voter fraud, yet they've passed these laws to make it more difficult for citizens to vote. Why? Why do I have to present my ID to an old lady who I grew up across the street from? Perhaps voter suppression serves a purpose for a particular political party...

Chris & I still went out for beers that night to catch up (as he lives in a different state), and I still check on Mrs Mac a few times every week. She's a nice old broad. She'll ask me for my ID again in November.

/csb
 
2012-07-31 11:23:52 PM  

ronmexico27: This thread is painful to read.


Really painful to see so many people who should know better than to bite at the bait of such an obvious troll, yes.
 
2012-07-31 11:29:49 PM  

Aexia: ronmexico27: This thread is painful to read.

Really painful to see so many people who should know better than to bite at the bait of such an obvious troll, yes.


Trolls, plural.
 
2012-07-31 11:38:33 PM  
Because of this new law, this past primary was the first time since we moved to Straban Twp (2007) that my wife was able to vote. Every year since we moved here, some other woman was using her name to vote and none of the q-tip heads at the table in front of the room asked for ID. Since her work schedule didn't allow her to go to the polling place until the last hour of it being open, this other person had already voted for her. Every year I would always ask why they didn't ask for ID and they always said "We ask the voters if they live at so & so address and they say yes or no. If it's a no, we make a change in the ledger" Our address was never changed in the ledger so this woman either didn't listen carefully and just agreed or flat out lied or the blue tinted q-tips couldn't hear. Regardless, my wife was not allowed to vote despite showing her the proper ID because they said that she had already cast a ballot. This year, that didn't happen and she had her right restored again.
 
2012-07-31 11:41:17 PM  

Angry Drunk Bureaucrat: I think there's something in the water in Harrisburg.


That would be fracking fluids, I'd guess.
 
2012-07-31 11:46:37 PM  

crack-fiend: Because of this new law, this past primary was the first time since we moved to Straban Twp (2007) that my wife was able to vote. Every year since we moved here, some other woman was using her name to vote and none of the q-tip heads at the table in front of the room asked for ID. Since her work schedule didn't allow her to go to the polling place until the last hour of it being open, this other person had already voted for her. Every year I would always ask why they didn't ask for ID and they always said "We ask the voters if they live at so & so address and they say yes or no. If it's a no, we make a change in the ledger" Our address was never changed in the ledger so this woman either didn't listen carefully and just agreed or flat out lied or the blue tinted q-tips couldn't hear. Regardless, my wife was not allowed to vote despite showing her the proper ID because they said that she had already cast a ballot. This year, that didn't happen and she had her right restored again.


Your completely anecdotal evidence is surely damning and I'm certain it is 100% true.
 
2012-07-31 11:51:21 PM  

cameroncrazy1984: crack-fiend: Because of this new law, this past primary was the first time since we moved to Straban Twp (2007) that my wife was able to vote. Every year since we moved here, some other woman was using her name to vote and none of the q-tip heads at the table in front of the room asked for ID. Since her work schedule didn't allow her to go to the polling place until the last hour of it being open, this other person had already voted for her. Every year I would always ask why they didn't ask for ID and they always said "We ask the voters if they live at so & so address and they say yes or no. If it's a no, we make a change in the ledger" Our address was never changed in the ledger so this woman either didn't listen carefully and just agreed or flat out lied or the blue tinted q-tips couldn't hear. Regardless, my wife was not allowed to vote despite showing her the proper ID because they said that she had already cast a ballot. This year, that didn't happen and she had her right restored again.

Your completely anecdotal evidence is surely damning and I'm certain it is 100% true.


Your snark is noted and it is 100% true.
 
2012-08-01 12:00:21 AM  

crack-fiend: Your snark is noted and it is 100% true.


Here's a question, then. If it's 100% true, why didn't you challenge the ballot through your party officials? You do know that's a thing, right? She (your wife) could've cast a provisional ballot. Her registration was at a different address. You challenge the vote cast by the lady who said she lived at the previous address. Vote gets thrown out. No voter ID needed.

I guess you'd have to be smarter than a fifth grade civics student, though.
 
2012-08-01 12:02:32 AM  

crack-fiend: Because of this new law, this past primary was the first time since we moved to Straban Twp (2007) that my wife was able to vote. Every year since we moved here, some other woman was using her name to vote and none of the q-tip heads at the table in front of the room asked for ID. Since her work schedule didn't allow her to go to the polling place until the last hour of it being open, this other person had already voted for her. Every year I would always ask why they didn't ask for ID and they always said "We ask the voters if they live at so & so address and they say yes or no. If it's a no, we make a change in the ledger" Our address was never changed in the ledger so this woman either didn't listen carefully and just agreed or flat out lied or the blue tinted q-tips couldn't hear. Regardless, my wife was not allowed to vote despite showing her the proper ID because they said that she had already cast a ballot. This year, that didn't happen and she had her right restored again.


Cool story bro.
 
2012-08-01 12:18:41 AM  
I get so tired of arguing the absurdity of voter ID laws. I threw up my hands and gave up the last time, when I was told, "my wife and i *personally* spoke with the guy in charge of voter fraud in our county, and he said if people knew how much fraud went on, there would be OUTRAGE."

I'm done. People will fight tooth and nail to remain ignorant. So be it.
 
2012-08-01 12:40:23 AM  

crack-fiend:
Your snark is noted and it is 100% true.


You're saying that, for years, someone was appearing and voting in your wife's place and she did nothing when this was noticed at the polling place? No one thought, "Hmm, let's talk to the police. Maybe something should be done!"

You and she literally just turned around and walked out every time, year after year, like she had gotten to the movie theater too late and all the tickets were already sold?

Exactly how is it that the GOP hasn't hired your wife to spend every day of her life on TV talking about in-person voter fraud? And how is it that you have not been beaten senseless for such a lame-ass expression of citizenship....

Or has the GOP already hired you to troll this story on message boards but you're not so interested in filing a police report ...
 
2012-08-01 01:02:01 AM  

Tumunga: Soup4Bonnie: Tumunga: I live in Indiana. The law says if you wanna vote, bring a picture ID with you. We can register to vote at the license branch while we're getting the state ID, or your driver's license. The law even passed constitutional muster:

Soup4Bonnie: As I've said in most every other Voter ID thread; when asked why there is a sudden need for identification at the voting booth when there are almost zero cases of voter fraud, the answer will be how easy they are to obtain.

Explain to me again how easy it is to get since that is not the issue I am addressing at all. Go ahead. It'll be about your third or fourth time.

If this were done Jerry Maguire style, right about now I would be Cuba jumping up and down shouting "SHOW ME THE VOTER FRAUD!"

Here you go, Mr. Gooding, Jr.:

Link


now maybe you could tell us what voter id laws have to do with absentee ballot fraud
 
2012-08-01 01:07:20 AM  

cameroncrazy1984: crack-fiend: Your snark is noted and it is 100% true.

Here's a question, then. If it's 100% true, why didn't you challenge the ballot through your party officials? You do know that's a thing, right? She (your wife) could've cast a provisional ballot. Her registration was at a different address. You challenge the vote cast by the lady who said she lived at the previous address. Vote gets thrown out. No voter ID needed.

I guess you'd have to be smarter than a fifth grade civics student, though.


I will first mention that at that time, both parties poll observers weren't even in the building either as I had asked for them. I was told they weren't present. ACD and ACVR was contacted after the first year, both organizations said they would handle the situation on her behalf. She only made 2 follow up phone calls (work, children, school events & doctor appointments didn't allow her to sit on the phone all day) and nothing came out of it. Other than both organizations requested a copy of her voter registration card and a copy of her driver's license (weird, huh?) which she had to take in personally to both organizations during business hours

As for a provisional ballot, we didn't ask for that by name but she asked how was she going to vote. She was also told she could not cast a ballot as a ballot was already cast in her name. You do realize that the people at the table exercise what they believe is their authority and you must rely on them to hand the ballot cards out. If you as much 'start a scene' you are escorted out by security as I was notified because I "was speaking in a loud voice that is unsettling for the location" . As for the 'previous address' where do you get that from? There is no previous address as we moved from a different township thus a different voting precinct. Only our Straban Twp address was in the ledger. After 7 years of reading your posts, I see you still lack proper reading comprehension, damn son.

The issue is in this Township located in Adams County, Pennsylvania there is only one voter registered that has my wife's First, Middle, and Last names. That is her, my wife. What has been happening is there is another woman who A). Has the exact same name and isn't registered or B). Is falsely using my wife's name. This year I assume she was prevented from voting since there were no issues. Of course, it's possible she didn't show up. Why should my wife be denied the right to vote and then have to jump through 'hurdles', waste her breaks at work and take time off of work to provide documentation to prove to ACD and ACVR who she was? A simple flash of the drivers license (ID) fixes that.
 
2012-08-01 02:05:54 AM  
crack-fiend:

I'm fascinated that your approach to this was just to run around begging for the vote. But not run around much or very loudly. Except here. When what you're implying is that a crime occurred.

And you didn't want to create a scene so of course you didn't get a provisional ballot.

And you didn't send anything with all the facts to anyone like, e.g., the attorney general or other law enforcement. Or report the local election workers for not providing provisional ballots as required by law. Or...pretty much anything.

In fact most likely is the other lady with the identical name didn't realize her registration didn't transfer from one location to another. So it's a clusterfark where you might have to do more than just wish everyone else would make your life easier by making their own lives a bit harder.

And that's your thing -- You want potentially thousands of other people to be disenfranchised or badly inconvenienced so you and your wife do not have to spend "hours and hours" on the phone straightening something out. And knowing there were options to still vote, or deal with the issue, you instead opt for the "we're not screwing with this....everyone else has to be brought to heel..." approach.
 
2012-08-01 02:38:45 AM  

thenewmissus: shotglasss: Just show your picture ID and you'll fly right through. You know, that thing you have to show to buy beer, cash a check, drive a car, show a cop if he wants to see it, etc....

Who doesn't have a photo ID, especially when state will give you one if you can't afford it.

My mother is 76 years old. She was born in the South (Florida). Since black births were not always recorded, my mom doesn't have her true birthday or name. She shows up in the 1930 census as Lorena and in the following census, she was Lorene. She always thought that her name was Lorraine. This wasn't much of an issue until she went to take a cruise. She can't secure her birth certificate. She even tried going back to the school that she went to and the school had burned down. Since segreation was an issue at the time, the records were not preserved. My mother had to change her name back but still can't get the information. My mother doesn't even have parking tickets yet she doesn't vote now because she can't prove she is Lorraine (they took her driver's license at the DMV because they said even though they understood that it wasn't fake, it still wasn't correct). So please don't tell me that it is an easy problem to fix. So far, she has not been successful. She is frustrated and it causes her undo anxiety and stress. So please don't be so presumptous to think that it is *easy* to get the info needed cuz if you are old and black, it is not an easy endeavor.

And I believe that it was intentional to make sure that my mom (old and black) don't vote. If not personal, by design of who she is and the way the GOP believes that she will vote.


Your 76 year old mom is listed in the 1930 census? That's awesome. Is she like Benjamin Button, moving sideways through time?

Next time you spin the yarn, do the math first and make her 86.
 
2012-08-01 02:51:54 AM  

crack-fiend: Because of this new law, this past primary was the first time since we moved to Straban Twp (2007) that my wife was able to vote. Every year since we moved here, some other woman was using her name to vote and none of the q-tip heads at the table in front of the room asked for ID. Since her work schedule didn't allow her to go to the polling place until the last hour of it being open, this other person had already voted for her. Every year I would always ask why they didn't ask for ID and they always said "We ask the voters if they live at so & so address and they say yes or no. If it's a no, we make a change in the ledger" Our address was never changed in the ledger so this woman either didn't listen carefully and just agreed or flat out lied or the blue tinted q-tips couldn't hear. Regardless, my wife was not allowed to vote despite showing her the proper ID because they said that she had already cast a ballot. This year, that didn't happen and she had her right restored again.


You think there's a close neighbor with the same first, middle, and last name as your wife and the registrations got crossed, so that your wife's registration wiped out the other woman's registration?

Get out the phone book, call the other woman, and then go get it fixed so both women can vote.

Voted ID isn't going to magically fix shiat like you describe.
 
2012-08-01 03:38:29 AM  

Tumunga: Meh. $30 tops. Just turn off the all access cable/dish channel, put down the crack pipe, stand out in front of your house and sell a couple of blowjobs. Skip 5 McDonalds meals, whatever. If you can't find a way to shiat $30 nowdays, you're not smart enough to vote.


If intelligence were a requirement to vote, not many Republicans would be elected. You might want to think that one through.
 
2012-08-01 03:45:50 AM  
Forget the picture ID. It's a waste of time. Not as much a waste as a national ID card would be, but still a waste.

Written civics exam. Pass, you may vote.
Fail, you are sentenced to 40 hours community service.

Win/Win.

/not a troll. I'm serious.
 
2012-08-01 05:00:23 AM  

crack-fiend: cameroncrazy1984: crack-fiend: Because of this new law, this past primary was the first time since we moved to Straban Twp (2007) that my wife was able to vote. Every year since we moved here, some other woman was using her name to vote and none of the q-tip heads at the table in front of the room asked for ID. Since her work schedule didn't allow her to go to the polling place until the last hour of it being open, this other person had already voted for her. Every year I would always ask why they didn't ask for ID and they always said "We ask the voters if they live at so & so address and they say yes or no. If it's a no, we make a change in the ledger" Our address was never changed in the ledger so this woman either didn't listen carefully and just agreed or flat out lied or the blue tinted q-tips couldn't hear. Regardless, my wife was not allowed to vote despite showing her the proper ID because they said that she had already cast a ballot. This year, that didn't happen and she had her right restored again.

Your completely anecdotal evidence is surely damning and I'm certain it is 100% true.

Your snark is noted and it is 100% true.


So because one stupid old lady couldn't get the ledger changed, that means voter ID laws should be passed nationwide, Palin is now President, and Obama has to shine old-lady shoes for the rest of his life?
 
2012-08-01 05:11:22 AM  
So shouldn't absentee ballots also be forbidden now? Nobody knows who really is filling them out now. Why I could work at a retirement home, and simply take all the dementia patients ballets and fill them out.

BTW a lot of elderly, rural, and poor people do not have or need drivers licenses which is the most common photo ID. Not like I would think for a moment conservatives could give a shiat about anyone but themselves, but if they ever took the time to talk with some social workers and were able to obtain a brief moment of empathy then they would realize what utter bullshiat these laws are. This is NOT about free and fair elections, this is shameless voter suppression. This is Florida 2000 where they purge names without bothering to even check once.

God damn I have come to despise Republicans, they truly are the greatest threat to freedom and democracy. When can we do an Iraq on them?
 
2012-08-01 06:28:50 AM  
Wonder what happened to shotglasss.
 
2012-08-01 07:23:05 AM  

crack-fiend: Because of this new law, this past primary was the first time since we moved to Straban Twp (2007) that my wife was able to vote. Every year since we moved here, some other woman was using her name to vote and none of the q-tip heads at the table in front of the room asked for ID. Since her work schedule didn't allow her to go to the polling place until the last hour of it being open, this other person had already voted for her. Every year I would always ask why they didn't ask for ID and they always said "We ask the voters if they live at so & so address and they say yes or no. If it's a no, we make a change in the ledger" Our address was never changed in the ledger so this woman either didn't listen carefully and just agreed or flat out lied or the blue tinted q-tips couldn't hear. Regardless, my wife was not allowed to vote despite showing her the proper ID because they said that she had already cast a ballot. This year, that didn't happen and she had her right restored again.


www.memehumor.com
 
2012-08-01 07:52:13 AM  

Aexia: ronmexico27: This thread is painful to read.

Really painful to see so many people who should know better than to bite at the bait of such an obvious troll, yes.


What's painful and sad is seeing how many people on this site resort to calling people a troll for having an opinion different than theirs.
 
2012-08-01 08:23:28 AM  
I'm sad that nobody cares about South Dakota's voter ID law, enforced for years, because it's a small state that Republicans will always win anyway.
 
2012-08-01 08:44:17 AM  

thenewmissus: but my mom has broken no laws and still can't vote. Tell me how that is fair to her. Are you going to say that it is fair to disenfranchise my mom?


ignorantia lex non excusat est.

As a firearms owner who lives in PA and frequently travels to 4 other states, I have to spend a few hours every month brushing up on the latest laws and regulations heaven forbid I get caught with a hollowpoint .38 while driving through New Jersey and become an instant felon.

With rights come responsibilities.

cameroncrazy1984: We have that already, it's called the registration process. How many people vote fraudulently? Give me a number.


States dont need to show prior evidence of fraud in enacting voter ID laws. Until you overturn Crawford Vs. Marion county, where the court's most liberal justice wrote the opinion, then states can continue to do so. Voter fraud has happened. The idea is to prevent more of it.
 
2012-08-01 08:49:37 AM  

Larry Mahnken: qorkfiend: shotglasss: Just show your picture ID and you'll fly right through. You know, that thing you have to show to buy beer, cash a check, drive a car, show a cop if he wants to see it, etc....

Who doesn't have a photo ID, especially when state will give you one if you can't afford it.

If buying beer, cashing checks, or driving cars were constitutionally guaranteed rights, you might have a point. Since they're not, what are you talking about?

Voting is not actually a constitutionally guaranteed right. There are prohibitions against denying the right to vote to persons for certain reasons, but outside of that, each state determines who may or may not vote. That's why felons can vote in some states, but not in others.


================

Hi Larry,

While I hate to argue with you, this is from the PA Constitution:

"Elections shall be free and equal; and no power, civil or military, shall at any time interfere to prevent the free exercise of the right of suffrage."

So... yeah, elections are free and guaranteed.
 
2012-08-01 09:04:55 AM  

The Larch: thenewmissus: shotglasss: Just show your picture ID and you'll fly right through. You know, that thing you have to show to buy beer, cash a check, drive a car, show a cop if he wants to see it, etc....

Who doesn't have a photo ID, especially when state will give you one if you can't afford it.

My mother is 76 years old. She was born in the South (Florida). Since black births were not always recorded, my mom doesn't have her true birthday or name. She shows up in the 1930 census as Lorena and in the following census, she was Lorene. She always thought that her name was Lorraine. This wasn't much of an issue until she went to take a cruise. She can't secure her birth certificate. She even tried going back to the school that she went to and the school had burned down. Since segreation was an issue at the time, the records were not preserved. My mother had to change her name back but still can't get the information. My mother doesn't even have parking tickets yet she doesn't vote now because she can't prove she is Lorraine (they took her driver's license at the DMV because they said even though they understood that it wasn't fake, it still wasn't correct). So please don't tell me that it is an easy problem to fix. So far, she has not been successful. She is frustrated and it causes her undo anxiety and stress. So please don't be so presumptous to think that it is *easy* to get the info needed cuz if you are old and black, it is not an easy endeavor.

And I believe that it was intentional to make sure that my mom (old and black) don't vote. If not personal, by design of who she is and the way the GOP believes that she will vote.

Your 76 year old mom is listed in the 1930 census? That's awesome. Is she like Benjamin Button, moving sideways through time?

Next time you spin the yarn, do the math first and make her 86.


Unlike some people on this thread, I did not "spin a yarn." Didn't you understand part of the problem. I tried to help my mom with her problem and went on Ancenstry.com myself and saw the problem. My fault for misquoting. My mom is in the 1936 census as 2 years old. Then she shows up in the 1945 census as 9 years old. I tried to link the census document but I am no longer with Ancenstry.com since it doesn't really have a lot of records for African-Americans ( I usually say black people, but I am actually singling out the African American culture, not the race). My fault for causing this confusion about my mom but the story is 100% true. And unlike the woman in Pennsylvania, my mom still doesn't get to vote. You can try to call it a lie if you would like but it is the truth. My mom is in Sarasota County Florida and can't vote. Doesn't have a criminal record. Not even a traffic ticket. The state took away her right to vote. Pure and simple.
 
2012-08-01 09:08:13 AM  

o5iiawah: thenewmissus: but my mom has broken no laws and still can't vote. Tell me how that is fair to her. Are you going to say that it is fair to disenfranchise my mom?

ignorantia lex non excusat est.

As a firearms owner who lives in PA and frequently travels to 4 other states, I have to spend a few hours every month brushing up on the latest laws and regulations heaven forbid I get caught with a hollowpoint .38 while driving through New Jersey and become an instant felon.

With rights come responsibilities.

cameroncrazy1984: We have that already, it's called the registration process. How many people vote fraudulently? Give me a number.

States dont need to show prior evidence of fraud in enacting voter ID laws. Until you overturn Crawford Vs. Marion county, where the court's most liberal justice wrote the opinion, then states can continue to do so. Voter fraud has happened. The idea is to prevent more of it.


So it was my mom's responsibility to record her birth so she could vote?
 
2012-08-01 09:28:36 AM  

thenewmissus: o5iiawah: thenewmissus: but my mom has broken no laws and still can't vote. Tell me how that is fair to her. Are you going to say that it is fair to disenfranchise my mom?

ignorantia lex non excusat est.

As a firearms owner who lives in PA and frequently travels to 4 other states, I have to spend a few hours every month brushing up on the latest laws and regulations heaven forbid I get caught with a hollowpoint .38 while driving through New Jersey and become an instant felon.

With rights come responsibilities.

cameroncrazy1984: We have that already, it's called the registration process. How many people vote fraudulently? Give me a number.

States dont need to show prior evidence of fraud in enacting voter ID laws. Until you overturn Crawford Vs. Marion county, where the court's most liberal justice wrote the opinion, then states can continue to do so. Voter fraud has happened. The idea is to prevent more of it.

So it was my mom's responsibility to record her birth so she could vote?


Your mom certainly could have done more to rectify this, many years ago.
 
2012-08-01 09:57:01 AM  

tudorgurl: b>12349876: If they were serious about voter fraud, there'd be a free national ID card and purple fingers.

MOTHERFARKING THIS THIS THIS


Well, if we didn't have to spend so much money on Social Security, Medicare/Obamacare, and the education of bastard children, they're probably would be free national and state IDs.
 
Displayed 278 of 278 comments

View Voting Results: Smartest and Funniest


This thread is archived, and closed to new comments.

Continue Farking
Submit a Link »
Advertisement
On Twitter






In Other Media


  1. Links are submitted by members of the Fark community.

  2. When community members submit a link, they also write a custom headline for the story.

  3. Other Farkers comment on the links. This is the number of comments. Click here to read them.

  4. Click here to submit a link.

Report