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(Wired)   Rumsfeld's mini-me: Invasion of Iraq "one of the great strategic decisions of the first half of the 21st century, if it proves not to be the greatest"   (wired.com ) divider line
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2473 clicks; posted to Politics » on 31 Jul 2012 at 11:54 AM (4 years ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2012-07-31 10:17:52 AM  
What was the greatest strategic decision of the 20th century? Hitler invading Russia?
 
2012-07-31 10:31:57 AM  

vernonFL: What was the greatest strategic decision of the 20th century? Hitler invading Russia?


along with the escalation of US involvement in vietnam.

i wouldn't be surprised to see this guy on rmoney's foreign policy team. his campaign is lousy with bushies as it is.
 
2012-07-31 10:36:37 AM  
Oh, I'd love to see the reasoning on this one.

*goes to RTFA*
 
2012-07-31 10:40:39 AM  
First of all, F*ck you

Secondly, you're declaring - in 2012 - a decision made three years into a century Teh Greatest of the first half?? You realize we have 38 years to go, right?

Finally, f*ck you
 
2012-07-31 10:42:31 AM  
FTFA: "After Syria comes Lebanon and after Lebanon come Jordan, and after those come Saudi Arabia; this place is in motion in a way that it hasn't been for a century - and we have an opportunity to shape that."

Be careful what you wish for.
 
2012-07-31 10:58:49 AM  
So what you're suggesting is that the "one of the great strategic decisions of the first half of the 21st century, if it proves not to be the greatest" was predicated on a lie, sold to the public on a lie, and ruined a once honourable military man.

If that's your idea of a resounding victory and great strategic thinking, god help us all when you lose.
 
2012-07-31 11:33:49 AM  
[themotherofallfacepalms.jpg]
 
2012-07-31 11:36:18 AM  
"'Great' meaning large or immense, we use it in the pejorative sense!"

i1079.photobucket.com
 
2012-07-31 11:56:07 AM  
For who? Weapons manufacturers?
 
2012-07-31 11:56:32 AM  

SuburbanCowboy: For who? Weapons manufacturers?


Body bag manufacturers.
 
2012-07-31 11:57:54 AM  
It will be a festering shiat hole within a decade.
 
2012-07-31 11:58:03 AM  
yeah in a world where just a handful of years later douchebag dictators were falling like dominos under actions from their own people? Saddam would have been kicked to the curb during the arab spring for pennies on the dollar, asshat.
 
2012-07-31 11:59:04 AM  
Man, I wish we could drag every single one of the idiots who orchestrated this clusterfark out of their bubble and drop them into the middle of the worst parts of Iraq.
 
2012-07-31 11:59:23 AM  

HotWingConspiracy: It will be a festering shiat hole within a decade.


implies that it's not already a festering shiathole
 
2012-07-31 11:59:54 AM  
Great strategy for the 1%ers, oil companies, and military undustrial complex......
 
2012-07-31 12:00:08 PM  

Jake Havechek: SuburbanCowboy: For who? Weapons manufacturers?

Body bag manufacturers.


Halliburton and Xe.
 
2012-07-31 12:00:11 PM  

Jake Havechek: SuburbanCowboy: For who? Weapons manufacturers?

Body bag manufacturers.


Prosthesis manufacturers also
 
2012-07-31 12:00:15 PM  

SuburbanCowboy: For who? Weapons manufacturers?


Iran.
 
2012-07-31 12:00:39 PM  

vernonFL: What was the greatest strategic decision of the 20th century? Hitler invading Russia?


US entering into Vietnam, duh. Seriously Iraq II was a chance for them to fight and prove their world domination theories, unfortunately it failed miserable, meaning that all Republican foreign policies since after the Berlin wall fell have been a failure.

The Republicans just can't accept that you can not invade and dominate a culture into a compliant Democratic client state. The best you can do is oppress the populace and set up a puppet fascists dictator.

But hey they keep farking that chicken.
 
2012-07-31 12:00:51 PM  
Greatest as in most significant?

You know, like Napoleon deciding to invade Russia in 1812.
 
2012-07-31 12:00:54 PM  

sprawl15: HotWingConspiracy: It will be a festering shiat hole within a decade.

implies that it's not already a festering shiathole


But we painted all of those schools!
 
2012-07-31 12:01:48 PM  
So basically it's a good idea to invade a country because your spiritual guidance counselor advises it by giving you passages from the bible.
 
2012-07-31 12:02:17 PM  
Guys, he said "Great", as in "large".


Not "Best".
 
2012-07-31 12:02:22 PM  

Headso: yeah in a world where just a handful of years later douchebag dictators were falling like dominos under actions from their own people? Saddam would have been kicked to the curb during the arab spring for pennies on the dollar, asshat.


So much this.

Of course, the floor-humping hordes will simply point to the Arab Spring and say "look what WE did!"
 
2012-07-31 12:02:32 PM  
Even after seeing what a monumental clusterf*ck the invasion of Iraq had become, these right wingers are STILL in their La-La Land.

Absolutely gobsmacking!
 
2012-07-31 12:03:27 PM  
I hope my dad never hears anyone utter that aloud. I'm afraid the stupid would induce a stroke in him.

/he's a pretty staunch conservative
//glad he thinks that the Bush administration was run by a bunch of drunken monkeys
 
2012-07-31 12:05:48 PM  
There was a preponderance of evidence that led one to believe that it was reasonable to suppose that there was in fact weapons of mass destruction in that country,"

What can you say to that?
 
2012-07-31 12:06:26 PM  

Headso: yeah in a world where just a handful of years later douchebag dictators were falling like dominos under actions from their own people? Saddam would have been kicked to the curb during the arab spring for pennies on the dollar, asshat.


Well it could be argued with out the invasion of Iraq and Afghanistan the people of those countries would not have felt they had a chance to win and would not have risen up. That the US clearly showed the world dictators would not stand and that they would support a peoples revolution.

Furthermore the US could have afforded a larger more stimulating response to the Great Recession and prevented their economy from crashing so low, which would have prevented the world economy from crashing so low, which would have reduced the pressure on the economies of those dictators and it was the lousy performance of those economies, the lack of opportunity for the populace, and lack of economic resources that drove the revolutionaries anger at their ruling dictators.

It could be argued that with out the invasion of Iraq and Afghanistan the Arab spring would never have occurred.
 
2012-07-31 12:07:07 PM  
3.bp.blogspot.com
 
2012-07-31 12:08:03 PM  

The Jami Turman Fan Club: There was a preponderance of evidence that led one to believe that it was reasonable to suppose that there was in fact weapons of mass destruction in that country,"

What can you say to that?


Liar.
 
2012-07-31 12:08:05 PM  
Rummie's just disappointed Bush didn't get us involved in a land war in Asia.
 
2012-07-31 12:09:00 PM  

TV's Vinnie: Even after seeing what a monumental clusterf*ck the invasion of Iraq had become, these right wingers are STILL in their La-La Land.

Absolutely gobsmacking!


They are just mad that Obama single handedly started the Iraq war.
 
2012-07-31 12:09:16 PM  

Slaves2Darkness: It could be argued that with out the invasion of Iraq and Afghanistan the Arab spring would never have occurred.


I've yet to hear any of the participants cite the invasion and occupation of Iraq as inspiration.
 
2012-07-31 12:10:51 PM  

Lionel Mandrake: You realize we have 38 years to go, right?


38?
 
2012-07-31 12:11:09 PM  

HotWingConspiracy: I've yet to hear any of the participants cite the invasion and occupation of Iraq as inspiration.


The Iraqis will eternally be grateful that we removed all those dangerous stores of biological and chemical weapons from their country.
 
2012-07-31 12:11:39 PM  
"It will be one of the greatest strategic victories of the United States because.... of the aftershocks that you see flowing through the region, whether it be in Libya, or in Egypt, or now in Syria," he said.

I honestly don't know if Iraq could be considered a factor in the whole Arab Spring thing, my gut feeling is theres little relation but even if there was isn't it a little disingenuous to take credit for a clusterfark that happens to have unforeseen beneficial consequences?

We don't know if the *Arab Spring* is going to be a good thing itself yet. Egypt going from a dictatorship to a theocracy isn't exactly a major improvement.
 
2012-07-31 12:12:54 PM  
www.american-buddha.com
 
2012-07-31 12:13:07 PM  

Slaves2Darkness: It could be argued that with out the invasion of Iraq and Afghanistan the Arab spring would never have occurred.


It could be argued, but it would be wrong. Iraq wasn't anything even slightly resembling a "people's revolution." Iraq was literally the exact opposite of everything that happened during the Arab Spring, which is why Republicans trying to take credit for it is so farking funny.

The Arab spring happened because we didn't do anything. Once the people learned that they could overturn their despotic leaders without foreign intervention, it spread like wildfire. If the Iraq war contributed to the Arab Spring in any way, it was to hold it back a decade, not speed it up.
 
2012-07-31 12:13:36 PM  
Another jackhole that should be in front of the farkin' Hague alongside Rumsfeld, Cheney and Bush.

Fark off, Cambone. Why don't you go door to door to a few thousand greiving families and try to sell that line of crap?
 
2012-07-31 12:17:16 PM  
It's not that the war was such a big blunder; it's how the country chose to pay for it.

Which is to say it didn't.

And all problems today stem from this sober and stubborn fact.
 
2012-07-31 12:17:52 PM  
So, pulling our troops out after 4000+ American lives lost and hundreds of billions of dollars wasted was strategic because....
 
2012-07-31 12:18:12 PM  

Ishkur: It's not that the war was such a big blunder; it's how the country chose to pay for it.


No, it's also that the war was a huge farking blunder.
 
2012-07-31 12:18:27 PM  
Anyone else catch this gem? "There was a preponderance of evidence[1] that led one to believe[2] that it was reasonable to suppose[3] that there was in fact weapons of mass destruction in that country..."

3. Three separate weaselly clauses in that one totally-bereft-of-hindsight statement. "It was the evidence! It led me to believe things! Things which led me to suppose things! Suppositions!!"

Almost Clintonian, eh?

// you shiat-weasel
 
2012-07-31 12:18:56 PM  

the opposite of charity is justice: "It will be one of the greatest strategic victories of the United States because.... of the aftershocks that you see flowing through the region, whether it be in Libya, or in Egypt, or now in Syria," he said.

I honestly don't know if Iraq could be considered a factor in the whole Arab Spring thing, my gut feeling is theres little relation but even if there was isn't it a little disingenuous to take credit for a clusterfark that happens to have unforeseen beneficial consequences?

We don't know if the *Arab Spring* is going to be a good thing itself yet. Egypt going from a dictatorship to a theocracy isn't exactly a major improvement.


I knew I forgot something in my comment:

I thought the general conservative consensus was that the Arab Spring was a bad thing because it has allowed a lot of populist religious parties take control and we are better off with the old dictators who we knew were either friends or enemies rather than an unknown element who have made it known that they aren't thrilled with their old leaders or the world nations who helped keep them in power.
 
2012-07-31 12:19:45 PM  
These guys are so obsessed with their legacy it is comical.

They had a grand (and I think good) idea of promoting democracy in the middle east, but had no idea how to correctly implement it.


The greatest failure of the Bush administration was their abject incompetence at all levels. This is probably because Bush never had to acheive anything on his own so he didn't respect anyone competent enough to become leaders in their fields by pure skill and hard work.... but I digress.

The Obama administration actually has the same main goal, but he is actually COMPETENT enough to get it done. He is doing it by promoting good will with the middle east, by not backing dictators, and intervening in measured way that utilizes our allies in the world to make sure we are not looking like the US is imposing its will accross the world. Just smart, and it is working to make the middle east more democratic. The next step is to get through the initial trials of democracy while not abandoning it. In other words they will not initially vote in US-friendly leaders in the new democracies, but democracy will work and if the new leaders don't perform they will be voted out, if we let democracy take its course.

Iraq was the wrong way to promote democracy in the middle east (unilateral US military action). Libya, Tunisia, Egypt and now Syria are the right ways to do it.
 
2012-07-31 12:19:59 PM  
"in what respect, Charlie?"
 
2012-07-31 12:20:09 PM  
Rumsfeld's mini-me: Invasion of Iraq "one of the great strategic decisions of the first half of the 21st century, if it proves not to be the greatest to clean up the mess we created in Iraq by selling them those weapons in the 70s and 80s" (wired.com)
 
2012-07-31 12:20:11 PM  

xanadian: FTFA: "After Syria comes Lebanon and after Lebanon come Jordan, and after those come Saudi Arabia; this place is in motion in a way that it hasn't been for a century - and we have an opportunity to shape that."

Be careful what you wish for.


He's cheering the idea of unrest hitting US allies and stable countries? What the fark, how big of a damn moron is this idiot?
 
2012-07-31 12:20:20 PM  
It was so fantastically great, the minds of both the country and of all of its citizens are still trying to wrap around it, yeah.
 
2012-07-31 12:20:51 PM  
a.abcnews.go.com

You mean like how Hasselhoff gave the greatest concert of the 20th century, because the Wall fell shortly afterward?
 
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