dr_blasto: I'm not sure misrepresenting the market value of stocks and other securities for the purpose of reducing your tax burden is legal.
Lsherm: dr_blasto: I'm not sure misrepresenting the market value of stocks and other securities for the purpose of reducing your tax burden is legal.Of course it is! That's why the super rich do it!
NFA: dr_blasto: I'm not sure misrepresenting the market value of stocks and other securities for the purpose of reducing your tax burden is legal.If you were a small business owner and did this, you would eventually be looking out through the bars of a federal prison.
Pope Larry II: That is a brilliant scheme. It's so brilliant it should be illegal.Even if Rmoney releases his tax forms the damage has already been done. The speculation over this is probably more damaging than the truth.
Bontesla: That's probably the best explanation I've heard yet.Wow.I can't believe that Rmoney would DO this, expect to run and win the presidency, without ever having to account for it.
FloydA: Bontesla: That's probably the best explanation I've heard yet.Wow.I can't believe that Rmoney would DO this, expect to run and win the presidency, without ever having to account for it.Put yourself in his shoes for a moment. He has always been a spoiled rich kid. He has always been given everything he wanted. Nobody has ever said "no" to him. Ever. In his entire life.He honestly believes that he is entitled to the Presidency just for being Mitt Romney. It simply does not occur to people like Romney that the world doesn't owe him anything, because he has never encountered a situation where he didn't get everything he wanted.
coco ebert: Wow. I'm also curious if his reason for not releasing his 2009 tax returns in particular is because he was part of the IRS' tax amnesty for Swiss account holders.
doyner: Only in America can a class of people buy laws and protection that keep them from paying taxes and when the rest of us cry foul we get accused of waging class warfare.Why the fark do they care about socialism? They're not the ones paying for it.
make me some tea: Huh. Interesting way to get around that.Time to find a way to plug that hole.
Because People in power are Stupid: Romney gave money to the IRA?[3.bp.blogspot.com image 300x300]Certainly he's courting Irish voters; but then again he is a republican as they are.
Bontesla: I can't believe that Rmoney would DO this, expect to run and win the presidency, without ever having to account for it.
NEW YORK (CNNMoney) -- Mitt Romney's five sons -- Matt, Tagg, Craig, Ben and Josh -- are sitting pretty with a trust fund worth $100 million.Getting there took investments that produced great growth, according to the Romney campaign. It also took smart tax strategies.Romney and his wife Ann have been giving to the boys since 1995, and, according to a spokesperson for the Romney campaign, all of their contributions have been below gift-tax contribution limits.The limit for a couple in 1995 was $20,000 and has since grown to $26,000. In addition, there's a "lifetime gift-tax exclusion" for all the boys that totaled $1.2 million back in 1995 and has since grown to $10 million.Add it all up, and the Romneys could have gifted $1.3 million in 1995, and a total of $10.6 million through 2011. All tax free.
quatchi: Mitt Romney's five sons -- Matt, Tagg, Craig, Ben and Josh -- are sitting pretty with a trust fund worth $100 million.
doyner: quatchi: Mitt Romney's five sons -- Matt, Tagg, Craig, Ben and Josh -- are sitting pretty with a trust fund worth $100 million.Mitt sure has some hard-working bootstrappy boys!
Don't Troll Me Bro!: Bontesla: I can't believe that Rmoney would DO this, expect to run and win the presidency, without ever having to account for it.At this point I'm convinced he just figured he'd walk into the WH because he deserves it, and all the peons will recognize that he's the rightful heir to the throne.
Karac: This is the perfect response when someone asks "Why should Romney have to release his tax returns? It's not required, the way a birth certificate is".Why should he release them? Because he found a way to invest 5 grand a year for something like a 1000% annual increase. fark the presidency - I want to know how to do that myself for just on general principles.
Pope Larry II: That is a brilliant scheme. It's so brilliant it should be illegal.
401k... So you mean that when you looked at the evidence, you found out that the person who did the best was making 48 percent in a quarter and the person who was doing the worst was losing 9 percent a quarter.Yes, that's correct.That's big a gap.It was stunning. I couldn't assimilate it. I didn't know how to think about it. It was far beyond anything I would have ever guessed.And these are in the same 401(k) plan with the same investment options.That's correct. ... They were all large plans with $100 million, $200 hundred dollars in the plan and 1,000, 2,000 participants or more. So these were big plans, and they were scattered geographically, some up East and some on the West Coast.... So you're looking at the top performer and the bottom performer. That's individuals. But could you see a difference by categories?Yes. ... So we decided to look at the top 20 percent and the bottom 20 percent. ... We saw the same thing over and over. ... Say the bottom 20 percent had an investment return for the year of 4 percent. The top 20 percent would be anywhere between five and seven times that number. ...Like 30 percent? Yeah, 30 percent right. ... I label[ed] this yield disparity. I just coined the term. I thought, we have a yield disparity that is a financial cancer in our great, beautiful 401(k) movement. I had never seen it before, but it was everywhere I looked.What do you mean, a financial cancer?It would destroy the opportunity for ordinary workers to retire in dignity. They couldn't get there from here. There is no way. Number one, they are contributing too little, too late for the most part. They are contributing the least, and then they are getting lousy investment performance. ...But were your samples large enough for you to trust them?Absolutely. I'm looking at 50,000 people in a population of maybe 30 million people in 401(k) plans at that time, ... scattered in every ZIP code in this country, so I knew that what I saw was real, and I found it frightening. ...... So when you are looking at that concrete evidence of disparity in yield, is there any correlation between [investment income] and the kind of income and education people have?I don't know about education, because it wasn't a data element in our database, but annual income was. Every client that we did this examination of, in every case, the 20 percent at the top not only had the highest investment income -- like 30 percent or whatever -- they also had the highest average annual pay, whereas the bottom 20 percent not only had the lowest investment income, four percent, they had the lowest average annual pay. And ... the people at the top 20 percent often were putting in less money as a percentage of pay ... because there was a limitation imposed by the law on what they could contribute, so it wasn't driven by the fact that they were putting in more. ...Are you saying you found a correlation between the salary levels of people and their ability to manage their investment? Higher-paid people got better investment results and lower-paid people got worse?That's exactly what I'm saying. In fact, it was the only correlation; there was no other.So what you are saying is the best-paid people, the richest people are getting richer and the middle-class workers are falling further behind?Yes, that's exactly what I'm saying.----You're saying that the Department of Labor has numbers that [show that] back in 1974, companies were footing the bill for 89 percent, ... and 25 years later they're putting in 49 percent. So companies have saved 40 percent of their costs nationwide? There has been a cost shifting of 40 percent from contributions made by the employer to contributions made by the employee.
marsgwar: So how could Romney's IRA contain so much more? Allow me to speculate.No.
Nina_Hartley's_Ass: Don't Troll Me Bro!: Bontesla: I can't believe that Rmoney would DO this, expect to run and win the presidency, without ever having to account for it.At this point I'm convinced he just figured he'd walk into the WH because he deserves it, and all the peons will recognize that he's the rightful heir to the throne.[armagideon-time.com image 481x443]
Dwight_Yeast: The cap on IRA contributions is absolute; there's no other way for the money to have gotten there.
mjjt: Newsweek mag story coming out calling him a wimpDaily Beast story about the storybasically there's so much that he's trying to hide that he's running scared from all interviews(plus his character failings)
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