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(Daily Mail)   Scientists say 'smart food' could tell the brain when to stop eating. They say people with self control could, too, but there doesn't seem to be any way to engineer that   (dailymail.co.uk) divider line 42
    More: Interesting, foods, small molecule, University of Copenhagen, University of Aberdeen, peptides, Australian newspapers, prominences, hormones  
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1039 clicks; posted to Geek » on 28 Jul 2012 at 11:08 AM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2012-07-28 11:10:26 AM
Stop eating so much, fatties!
 
2012-07-28 11:12:32 AM
"They hope the foods will contain a special chemical that mimics the message our gut sends the brain when it is full."

Such as fats and proteins?
 
2012-07-28 11:18:23 AM

DerAppie: "They hope the foods will contain a special chemical that mimics the message our gut sends the brain when it is full."

Such as fats and proteins?


No, it would be certain hormones
 
2012-07-28 11:19:03 AM
And in the end we'll get synthetic glop that dissolves our internal organs, and we can't stop eating it.

Because the food industry wants us to stop eating and be healthy. Sure.
 
2012-07-28 11:25:30 AM

Kibbler: Because the food industry wants us to stop eating and be healthy. Sure.


The food industry wants us to do whatever is most profitable. That's why they offer you the choice of cheap manufactured junk in large volume, or expensive healthy food in small portions. It's called segmentation.
 
2012-07-28 11:25:31 AM
That tomato just ejected itself!
 
2012-07-28 11:29:15 AM
Leptin?
 
2012-07-28 11:29:41 AM

StoPPeRmobile: Stop eating so much, fatties!


Hey, cool. You're a message transmitting whore moan.
 
2012-07-28 11:31:25 AM
I don't see how that would help any, most overweight people eat despite the fact that they aren't even hungry. They'll eat comfort food out of boredom, when depressed or simply because they have a craving, it really has nothing to do with being hungry.

Everyone has done it, you see a food commercial on TV and despite not even feeling hungry you find yourself in the kitchen or running to the store.
 
2012-07-28 11:36:30 AM

the_sidewinder: DerAppie: "They hope the foods will contain a special chemical that mimics the message our gut sends the brain when it is full."

Such as fats and proteins?

No, it would be certain hormones


The more we learn about appetite, the more we understand why it is not so simple as "just eat less" or "just exercise more".

Appetite is controlled by a complex chain of processes from the gut to the brain, and any step in that process -- from production of hormones to transmission of signals to reception and processing -- can work better, worse, or not at all in different people. (That may be partly why stress can make you fat -- not just because of eating more for comfort). Part of the process, it's turning out, depends not on our bodies but on microbes hosted in our gut -- and consequently, antibiotics can make you fat, it turns out.

Think about it: how do most people maintain normal weight? Not by counting calories (your body is not a calorimeter, anyway); not by eyeballing portion size (I can probably make you eat more by giving you a bigger plate or sitting you in a more calming environment); but by their brain telling them that they have eaten enough. Do you have any idea how that works? Or what kind of things can screw it up? (hint: it's not "sheer force of will").

Other research is suggesting that a big part of the effectiveness of gastric bypass surgery is not the physical reduction in size of the stomach, but that it causes changes in the hormonal response of the gut. If we can figure out the details, that teases the prospect that potentially, people could get the benefits of gastric bypass without the costs and risks of actual surgery.

Anyway, telling people "eat less, fatties" is about as useful as telling somebody that they can win the Olympic marathon if they just "run faster, lazyass".
 
2012-07-28 11:51:25 AM
Clearly these scientists have never heard of shock therapy.
 
2012-07-28 11:59:10 AM
static.caloriecount.about.com
 
2012-07-28 12:04:08 PM

czetie: Think about it: how do most people maintain normal weight? Not by counting calories (your body is not a calorimeter, anyway);


This is correct, although not how you intend it to mean.

You can never gain weight while ingesting fewer calories than you expend. Absolutely impossible.

You can lose weight while expending fewer calories than you ingest.

Your body is not a calorimeter, because it does not always put every calorie to use, or indeed even process all ingested calories. Drink 500 calories-worth of alcohol, and several-hundred of those calories will simply evaporate out of your skin, be exhaled, and simply be pissed away.

People like to throw that saying "your body is not a calorimeter" around as if it means that you can get fat by eating less and working out more. It means the exact opposite. The calories-in:calories-out still applies, but with the caveat that "calories-in" does not mean "calories-eaten." If calories-in is less than calories-out, then you automatically lose weight through loss of body mass (fat or muscle).

You can't add body mass without eating more than you exert, period.
 
2012-07-28 12:04:44 PM
Is this where people who have never been fat come to tell us all how easy it is to lose weight?
 
2012-07-28 12:05:38 PM

KellyX: [static.caloriecount.about.com image 199x250]


There is nothing smart about this cheesy popcorn. After I eat it I need to go to the dentist not to mention having to wash my hands with heavy duty gojo orange shop soap.
 
2012-07-28 12:08:21 PM

KellyX: [static.caloriecount.about.com image 199x250]


Came here for this. I'll take a bag of smart over any other junk food, except for these:

images.productwiki.com

Get to the end of a bag without tearing up and you are a stronger person than I.

/Spice addict
 
2012-07-28 12:15:54 PM

bingethinker: Is this where people who have never been fat come to tell us all how easy it is to lose weight?


From the time I was full grown (5'10") to 28 years old, I weighed 150 lbs. It was probably a metabolic thing.
Then I quit smoking, was laid up, and had a desk job. I ballooned to 220.
Now at 33 years old, I'm down to 185.
It's easy to lose weight... if you actually want to.

It's not just diet. It's not just exercise. It's diet AND exercise. And I don't mean "diet" as in chugging Slim Fast and taking the bun off of your cheeseburger. I mean three balanced meals per day, and managing your sugar and salt intake. If polishing off a whole bag of Doritos is more important to you than being fit and healthy, then that's your fate.
 
2012-07-28 12:19:44 PM
dontdrinkbeer.files.wordpress.com

/the curves meeting will be starting in 5 minutes, please take your seat
 
2012-07-28 12:22:23 PM

the_sidewinder: DerAppie: "They hope the foods will contain a special chemical that mimics the message our gut sends the brain when it is full."

Such as fats and proteins?

No, it would be certain hormones


I know, I was merely referring to the fact that fatty foods and proteins will make you feel full whereas a bag of over salted, re-sweetened potato chips will not (at least not in the long term).
 
2012-07-28 12:25:15 PM
Eating slower helps a lot
 
2012-07-28 12:32:01 PM

czetie: Anyway, telling people "eat less, fatties" is about as useful as telling somebody that they can win the Olympic marathon if they just "run faster, lazyass".


THIS.
 
2012-07-28 12:41:36 PM

Kibbler: And in the end we'll get synthetic glop that dissolves our internal organs, and we can't stop eating it.

Because the food industry wants us to stop eating and be healthy. Sure.


t3.gstatic.com
 
2012-07-28 01:19:17 PM

czetie: the_sidewinder: DerAppie: "They hope the foods will contain a special chemical that mimics the message our gut sends the brain when it is full."
...
Anyway, telling people "eat less, fatties" is about as useful as telling somebody that they can win the Olympic marathon if they just "run faster, lazyass".


I agree with everything you said; except that last line.

We do actively and trivially control what we eat. I can get up right now and eat more. Or I can decide not to eat anything for the next hour. It's pretty easy, within some reasonable limits. Yes - we all do need to eat. Still, eating 'less' is something anyone can decide to do. It's like 'smoking less'.

And the goal here, with eating less, is to achieve a normal body weight.

Comparing that to achieving a win in an Olympic marathon is completely unjustified, IMHO. First - the goal isn't to achieve a 'normal / healthy mile time'; the marathon itself is pretty extreme and winning an Olympic marathon is like saying 'Eat less THAN EVERYONE ELSE IN THE WORLD'. That's pretty damn extreme.

AND, even if we accept that; once you reach a certain point, running faster isn't possible. Everyone runs 'as fast as they can' once you reach a certain level. It's trivial for someone who eats 3200 calories per day to eat 3000 calories per day. It's not trivial to go from a 2 hour and 15 minute marathon time to a 2 hour and 13 minute marathon. It's not just something you can decide.

Naturally gifted athletes train their entire life, make it their full-time career and even then only the smallest percentage of them will win an Olympic marathon.
That's not the same as saying 'Eat less'.
 
2012-07-28 01:38:56 PM

Quantum Apostrophe: Leptin?


Two rashers of bacon and two eggs seems to stimulate leptin in me and within minutes of licking the plate I feel sated. Mmm, bacon...
 
2012-07-28 01:50:14 PM
www.realage.com

http://www.cnn.com/2012/02/03/living/overweight-pets/index.html

"This is the sentinel for childhood obesity. When I see dogs who are overweight, I see a child that's at risk for excess weight, because nobody's exercising. The kid's playing video games all day, the dog sits around all day," and "everybody's eating poorly."

http://games.slashdot.org/story/08/01/11/1543201/mcdonalds-uk-ceo-bl am es-video-games-for-childhood-obesity

i44.tinypic.com
 
2012-07-28 02:06:03 PM

Aeonite: http://games.slashdot.org/story/08/01/11/1543201/mcdonalds-uk-ceo-bl am es-video-games-for-childhood-obesity

i44.tinypic.com


Apparently, the chart maker doesn't realize that 360 came out before Wii.

Oh, and also:

img142.imageshack.us
 
2012-07-28 02:37:28 PM

I Like Bread: bingethinker: Is this where people who have never been fat come to tell us all how easy it is to lose weight?

From the time I was full grown (5'10") to 28 years old, I weighed 150 lbs. It was probably a metabolic thing.
Then I quit smoking, was laid up, and had a desk job. I ballooned to 220.
Now at 33 years old, I'm down to 185.
It's easy to lose weight... if you actually want to.


Every single study ever conducted everywhere says that you're wrong. There is not a single scientific study anywhere that says that a significant number of participants can lose more than around 10% of their body weight and keep it off for a significant period of time.
 
2012-07-28 02:54:26 PM

meanmutton: Every single study ever conducted everywhere says that you're wrong. There is not a single scientific study anywhere that says that a significant number of participants can lose more than around 10% of their body weight and keep it off for a significant period of time.


If so, I've got bigger problems. These studies you speak of say that I don't exist!
 
2012-07-28 02:57:46 PM
I've lost 20 lbs in the past 30 days (240 to 220). I'm 6'4 and my target is 200 lbs. I had tried counting calories, 'watching what I eat', snacking throughout the day, etc for a while with little effect. Then I came across an article about intermittent fasting, and read everything I could find about it. It works, and it's great.

I just eat dinner only. Throughout the day I drink water with lemon, and coffee. I cut soda completely out. My body burns fat as I am active throughout the day. At night I eat a dinner of protein (steak, pork, seafood, or chicken) with veggies and/or fruit. Last night's dinner was rotisserie chicken with broccoli and mandarin oranges. The night before was 2 bacon-wrapped top sirloin steaks and a salad with oil and vinegar. I farking love those little Babybel cheeses, so I'll have a few of those (the 'light' ones), a mozzarella stick, or a low-fat yogurt for 'dessert'. I've cut out most bread and virtually ALL sugar.

So it's not like I'm suffering - I'm not eating lackluster food. I greatly enjoy my dinners (and cooking them - I don't get fast food any more, I try to cook everything I eat myself). At first it was hard - I'd get tired around lunchtime - but before long my body got used to it, I guess, and I have more energy during the day than I have in years! Energy is provided via ketosis as I burn fat throughout the day. My appetite has diminished greatly and now I don't even get hungry until dinnertime. I can now easily join friends at lunchtime without eating and not suffer when I smell their food.

My pants are now all too big. :) With the extra energy I'm feeling (and the loss of weight) exercise has gotten easier. I'm biking more and have started doing push-ups regularly for the first time in years.

It makes sense. For 99% of human history, we were hunter/gatherers. Food was not always readily available. Days might go by without eating. The body stores fat as a mechanism to store energy during those periods without sustenance. Now we've built an entire culture around food and drink. I never thought about it before starting this routine, and now as I drive down the street I'm painfully aware of how many eateries there are. Eating has gone from being what we do to survive, to being a form of recreation or pleasure, or a social activity. People eat three meals a day and snack between them, and wash down their fatty, carb-y meals with drinks that contain an obscene amount of sugar/corn syrup. This isn't natural. It's not what millions of years of evolution prepared us for.

So yeah, it's really that simple. Most of these diet fads are junk (meal replacement shakes, hormone drops, pills, etc). It really is a matter of eating less. Once you get past the first 3-4 days it becomes pretty easy.

Link href="http://www.ajcn.org/content/86/1/7.full">Here's a study by the University of Berkeley that points out some of the other benefits of intermittent fasting. Summary: decreases cardiovascular disease risk, decreases cancer risk, lower diabetes risk, improves cognitive function, protects against some effects of Alzheimer's and Parkinson's diseases. Not bad.
 
2012-07-28 03:32:59 PM
Oh, and I've heard people say, 'losing weight is pointless, you'll just gain it all back again once the diet's over!'

This isn't just a diet, at least not for me. What I describe above is a complete lifestyle change, which I believe is what's necessary. I plan to eat like this for the rest of my life.
 
2012-07-28 03:52:08 PM

Samwise Gamgee: Oh, and I've heard people say, 'losing weight is pointless, you'll just gain it all back again once the diet's over!'

This isn't just a diet, at least not for me. What I describe above is a complete lifestyle change, which I believe is what's necessary. I plan to eat like this for the rest of my life.


I just cut lunch most days. I really don't need it when I sit in front of a computer all day. I'm only 10 lbs from college weight now.
 
2012-07-28 03:53:24 PM

Samwise Gamgee: Oh, and I've heard people say, 'losing weight is pointless, you'll just gain it all back again once the diet's over!'
This isn't just a diet, at least not for me. What I describe above is a complete lifestyle change, which I believe is what's necessary. I plan to eat like this for the rest of my life.


So you plan on losing 20 pounds a month for the rest of your life? That just can't be good for you.
 
2012-07-28 04:37:03 PM

czetie: the_sidewinder: DerAppie: "They hope the foods will contain a special chemical that mimics the message our gut sends the brain when it is full."

Such as fats and proteins?

No, it would be certain hormones

The more we learn about appetite, the more we understand why it is not so simple as "just eat less" or "just exercise more".

Appetite is controlled by a complex chain of processes from the gut to the brain, and any step in that process -- from production of hormones to transmission of signals to reception and processing -- can work better, worse, or not at all in different people. (That may be partly why stress can make you fat -- not just because of eating more for comfort). Part of the process, it's turning out, depends not on our bodies but on microbes hosted in our gut -- and consequently, antibiotics can make you fat, it turns out.

Think about it: how do most people maintain normal weight? Not by counting calories (your body is not a calorimeter, anyway); not by eyeballing portion size (I can probably make you eat more by giving you a bigger plate or sitting you in a more calming environment); but by their brain telling them that they have eaten enough. Do you have any idea how that works? Or what kind of things can screw it up? (hint: it's not "sheer force of will").

Other research is suggesting that a big part of the effectiveness of gastric bypass surgery is not the physical reduction in size of the stomach, but that it causes changes in the hormonal response of the gut. If we can figure out the details, that teases the prospect that potentially, people could get the benefits of gastric bypass without the costs and risks of actual surgery.

Anyway, telling people "eat less, fatties" is about as useful as telling somebody that they can win the Olympic marathon if they just "run faster, lazyass".


You sound fat.
 
2012-07-28 04:47:53 PM
Sugar and grains are poison. Whole grains are poison with added nutrients. If people start eating less grains and ate food with high fat and moderately high protein they would feel full and have energy and they would not be fat.

The problem is people think that fat makes people fat.
 
2012-07-28 05:30:48 PM
I've dropped 72 pounds, getting a kick. . .

/will admit that poverty and stress does help though
 
2012-07-28 05:51:50 PM

cryinoutloud: Samwise Gamgee: Oh, and I've heard people say, 'losing weight is pointless, you'll just gain it all back again once the diet's over!' This isn't just a diet, at least not for me. What I describe above is a complete lifestyle change, which I believe is what's necessary. I plan to eat like this for the rest of my life.

So you plan on losing 20 pounds a month for the rest of your life? That just can't be good for you.


Sarcasm noted, but that aside, so long as he continues to cut out the vast majority of carbs that are in the usual American diet, he will slide down to whatever weight his daily caloric intake will support. It might be 200 lbs, or anywhere from there down to as low as 150 or so.

Samwise Gamgee, how many calories a day on average are you eating?
 
2012-07-28 06:00:40 PM

czetie: Anyway, telling people "eat less, fatties" is about as useful as telling somebody that they can win the Olympic marathon if they just "run faster, lazyass".


Actually, it's more like telling someone they could run a marathon if they just "run more, lazyass. It's deceptively simple sounding, but it's actually true as far as it goes. The real uptick in obesity comes from the fact that people don't really have to exercise anymore: the average person doesn't need to put in any real physical exertion to get food, procure or maintain shelter, earn a living, stave off boredom, or (most recently) to connect socially with others. Since it's not seen as a need, it doesn't get done.

The problem is getting people to do something they do not, strictly speaking, have to do. Figure that out, and you've solved the obesity epidemic. You've probably also got a Nobel prize lined up.
 
2012-07-28 06:06:44 PM

KellyX: [static.caloriecount.about.com image 199x250]


I could definitely get behind this.
 
2012-07-28 07:15:12 PM

StoneColdAtheist: cryinoutloud: Samwise Gamgee: Oh, and I've heard people say, 'losing weight is pointless, you'll just gain it all back again once the diet's over!' This isn't just a diet, at least not for me. What I describe above is a complete lifestyle change, which I believe is what's necessary. I plan to eat like this for the rest of my life.

So you plan on losing 20 pounds a month for the rest of your life? That just can't be good for you.

Sarcasm noted, but that aside, so long as he continues to cut out the vast majority of carbs that are in the usual American diet, he will slide down to whatever weight his daily caloric intake will support. It might be 200 lbs, or anywhere from there down to as low as 150 or so.


Exactly... eventually my weight loss will halt and I'll reach an equilibrium.

Samwise Gamgee, how many calories a day on average are you eating?

I don't bother counting calories. I first tried to lose weight by doing so, and found that it kept me in the habit of eating all the time (even if I was being careful of what I ate). It was much harder to be disciplined and I found myself 'cheating' a lot. Making the decision to only eat dinner is much easier and I don't obsess over what I do eat.

I just use common sense and eat a dinner that's not obviously unhealthy. I make sure I get meats, fruits, and vegetables. I cut back on red meat and treat it as an occasional 'treat' - I'm usually eating chicken, turkey, pork, or fish. I just eat until I'm satisfied, and since my appetite has greatly diminished since starting this, I feel full sooner... since I don't finish some meals I couldn't really calculate how many calories I really put in if I wanted to.
 
2012-07-28 07:41:37 PM

Samwise Gamgee: I just use common sense and eat a dinner that's not obviously unhealthy. I make sure I get meats, fruits, and vegetables. I cut back on red meat and treat it as an occasional 'treat' - I'm usually eating chicken, turkey, pork, or fish. I just eat until I'm satisfied, and since my appetite has greatly diminished since starting this, I feel full sooner... since I don't finish some meals I couldn't really calculate how many calories I really put in if I wanted to.


Sounds to me like you are on the right track. I can't get by on one meal, or even two yet after a year as a hi-carb, lo-fat vegan who a month ago converted to hi-fat, lo-carb omnivore. I've dropped from my peak of 213 to 190 and eat as much as I like. I stay under 20 grams of carbs, but don't bother counting calories, either. The only downside I've noticed is that I have not yet recovered to the level of cycling endurance I had while hi-carb, but I read that it should recover in another month or so. I've nearly 60, so will be completely satisfied if my weight stabilizes at what I weighed at 35...150. Good luck!
 
2012-07-28 10:41:30 PM
You do not have to starve, eat nutritionally RICH foods. Don't go for calories go for whats in it. Avoid everything white and processed. Naturally raised meats as well.. where do you think all the additional growth hormones are going from the factory meat your eating?

Lost 30 pounds .. avoid taxing your insides and eat organic when possible. Non GMO as well as more Vegetables.

Im not close to starving HARDLY and my meals are not cardboard either. Hell I snack all day.
 
2012-07-29 08:20:05 AM
Two really good documentaries from Horizon about this subject:

Why are thin people not fat?

The Truth About Exercise

Spoilers:

It has little to do with self-control. Sorry thin people, but science disagrees with you. You aren't the masters of self-control you think you are.
 
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