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(Some Guy)   As minimum wage goes up, so does teenage unemployment. Wonder if there's some kind of connection between the two?   (sayanythingblog.com) divider line 136
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1707 clicks; posted to Business » on 26 Jul 2012 at 12:18 PM (2 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2012-07-26 10:17:21 AM  
As the number of derp headlines goes up, so do page hits. Wonder if there's some kind of connection between the two?
 
2012-07-26 10:40:10 AM  
Repeating Bachmann talking points is a winning strategy.
 
2012-07-26 10:48:17 AM  
Hmmm...I wonder if this has anything to do with the number of adults who've lost their jobs and can't find gainful employment and are just taking a minimum wage job in order to survive?
 
2012-07-26 10:57:08 AM  
That's funny, because the minimum wage hasn't gone anywhere in recent memory. But who needs evidence when you can just make shiat up?
 
2012-07-26 11:41:22 AM  
Oh joy, another minimum wage thread where liberals spout BS about a "living wage" without any facts or research.

Only 5.2% of hourly wage earners, earn minimum wage.
Of that 5.2%, 80% are between 16-25.

So yes, raising the minimum wage will force businesses to cut jobs or invest in technology that will increase productivity. So in short, people want to raise the minimum wage for a little more than 1% of the workforce so they can feel better about themselves.

http://www.bls.gov/cps/minwage2011.htm
 
2012-07-26 11:53:32 AM  

slayer199: Oh joy, another minimum wage thread where liberals spout BS about a "living wage" without any facts or research.

Only 5.2% of hourly wage earners, earn minimum wage.
Of that 5.2%, 80% are between 16-25.

So yes, raising the minimum wage will force businesses to cut jobs or invest in technology that will increase productivity. So in short, people want to raise the minimum wage for a little more than 1% of the workforce so they can feel better about themselves.

http://www.bls.gov/cps/minwage2011.htm


Conversely, those that traditionally oppose raising the minimum wage come from a surprising demographic...

http://m.npr.org/story/140116142?url=/ 2011/09/04/140116142/avoiding-la st-place-some-things-we-dont-outgrow
 
vpb [TotalFark]
2012-07-26 11:58:07 AM  

slayer199: Oh joy, another minimum wage thread where liberals spout BS about a "living wage" without any facts or research.

Only 5.2% of hourly wage earners, earn minimum wage.
Of that 5.2%, 80% are between 16-25.

So yes, raising the minimum wage will force businesses to cut jobs or invest in technology that will increase productivity. So in short, people want to raise the minimum wage for a little more than 1% of the workforce so they can feel better about themselves.

http://www.bls.gov/cps/minwage2011.htm


Only 5.2% of hourly workers make minimum wage therefore raising minimum wage will (somehow) force businesses to cut jobs, even though it is a tiny part of their payrolls and business hire people because they need them not because they can "afford" to.

Brilliant logic there.
 
2012-07-26 12:01:42 PM  

vpb: Only 5.2% of hourly workers make minimum wage therefore raising minimum wage will (somehow) force businesses to cut jobs, even though it is a tiny part of their payrolls and business hire people because they need them not because they can "afford" to.

Brilliant logic there.


Since many of businesses with unskilled labor jobs work on thin margins, then yes...it is logical.
 
2012-07-26 12:02:17 PM  

Marcus Aurelius: That's funny, because the minimum wage hasn't gone anywhere in recent memory.


It was increased in 2007, 2008, and 2009.
 
2012-07-26 12:18:03 PM  
Did the author not even look at the figures they are citing? Minimum wage is higher and teen unemployment is lower in 2008 than it was in 2003, 2005, and 2006. Then there was thing called THE RECESSION. Someone needs a headinassectomy.
 
2012-07-26 12:20:58 PM  

Lor M. Ipsum: Did the author not even look at the figures they are citing? Minimum wage is higher and teen unemployment is lower in 2008 than it was in 2003, 2005, and 2006. Then there was thing called THE RECESSION. Someone needs a headinassectomy.


The theories of Pure Free Market Economics exist independent of any real-world, empirical data.
It's the only way they can exist.
 
2012-07-26 12:22:50 PM  

slayer199: Only 5.2% of hourly wage earners, earn minimum wage.


No worries, I'm sure salaries will remain stagnant long enough to get that percentage up. Heck, some people may even start to get raises one day.
 
2012-07-26 12:25:12 PM  

PacManDreaming: Hmmm...I wonder if this has anything to do with the number of adults who've lost their jobs and can't find gainful employment and are just taking a minimum wage job in order to survive?


When I go into the supermarket, it seems like the employees are women and old, retired men. There are still plenty of young women being hired, but the retirees pounce when word of an opening gets out. When I was in high school, those were coveted jobs.
 
2012-07-26 12:28:11 PM  

jbuist: Marcus Aurelius: That's funny, because the minimum wage hasn't gone anywhere in recent memory.

It was increased in 2007, 2008, and 2009.


You call 25 cents a "raise"?

Let's hike it up to $10 and give the economy a REAL boost.
 
2012-07-26 12:28:17 PM  
A man must always live by his work, and his wages must at least be sufficient to maintain him. They must even upon most occasions be somewhat more, otherwise it would be impossible for him to bring up a family, and the race of such workmen could not last beyond the first generation.


Guess who?

/Also talks about the wealth of a nation being the measurement of the wages of the poorest among it.
 
2012-07-26 12:34:08 PM  
t2.gstatic.com
 
2012-07-26 12:34:13 PM  
Frankly, I'm not worried about teenagers being out of work because THEY HAVE PARENTS (for the most part). Hell, my parents wouldn't even let me get a job in high school because they didn't want me to be lured away from college by that awesome barely-above minimum wage job at Blockbuster.
 
2012-07-26 12:39:12 PM  
Screw minimum wage increase what we really need is an Employer of Last Resort (ELR). The government should step up and create this entity, then when or if you lose your job the ELR can step in and give you a paycheck and health insurance. The ELR would effectively set the minimum wage, so that if they were paying say $10 an hour and offering health benefits private employers would have to match. Now the question is what do to with all those workers, well you could sell the labor back to corporations at a discounted rate.

This becomes a win-win, companies can buy unskilled labor from the government at discounted rates, offsetting the cost of the program. Meanwhile we achieve 100% employment, everyone who wants to work will have a job. Then we can cut direct welfare payments to those who are able bodied and only provide welfare for the disabled.
 
2012-07-26 12:41:00 PM  
Oh that chart is adorable.
 
2012-07-26 01:08:05 PM  

Marcus Aurelius: You call 25 cents a "raise"?


It was actually 70 cents each year. That's a total of $2.10. A smidge under 41% increase from the 2006 minimum wage.

I would call that a raise. *shrug*
 
2012-07-26 01:08:05 PM  

Marcus Aurelius: jbuist: Marcus Aurelius: That's funny, because the minimum wage hasn't gone anywhere in recent memory.

It was increased in 2007, 2008, and 2009.


Let's hike it up to $10 and give the economy a REAL boost.


1 thing has nothing to do with the other.
 
2012-07-26 01:24:45 PM  
vpb

slayer199: Oh joy, another minimum wage thread where liberals spout BS about a "living wage" without any facts or research.

Only 5.2% of hourly wage earners, earn minimum wage.
Of that 5.2%, 80% are between 16-25.

So yes, raising the minimum wage will force businesses to cut jobs or invest in technology that will increase productivity. So in short, people want to raise the minimum wage for a little more than 1% of the workforce so they can feel better about themselves.

http://www.bls.gov/cps/minwage2011.htm

Only 5.2% of hourly workers make minimum wage therefore raising minimum wage will (somehow) force businesses to cut jobs, even though it is a tiny part of their payrolls and business hire people because they need them not because they can "afford" to.

Brilliant logic there.


Keep thinking, continue to follow the logic and you will get there. Minimum wage is a base off of which most hourly rates are set. If min wage is 8 and you are paid 10 how would you feel if min wage moved to 9.50. Would you expect another 1.50 an hr or 25% raise cause you were making 25% higher than min wage.

How high would labor costs go if you have a contract that pays you 3 times minimum wage. How much more in taxes in SSI and other employment tax would the business incur, etc.

It is not just about min wage workers
 
2012-07-26 01:27:37 PM  
Marcus Aurelius

jbuist: Marcus Aurelius: That's funny, because the minimum wage hasn't gone anywhere in recent memory.

It was increased in 2007, 2008, and 2009.

You call 25 cents a "raise"?

Let's hike it up to $10 and give the economy a REAL boost.


shiat why stop there. Let's make it $50/hr and really kick the economy into overdrive. Yee haw. Go Baby Go.
 
2012-07-26 01:29:41 PM  

slayer199: Oh joy, another minimum wage thread where liberals spout BS about a "living wage" without any facts or research.

Only 5.2% of hourly wage earners, earn minimum wage.
Of that 5.2%, 80% are between 16-25.

So yes, raising the minimum wage will force businesses to cut jobs or invest in technology that will increase productivity. So in short, people want to raise the minimum wage for a little more than 1% of the workforce so they can feel better about themselves.

http://www.bls.gov/cps/minwage2011.htm


I'm having trouble following your logic. Why is a living wage a bad thing?
 
2012-07-26 01:30:07 PM  
Slaves2Darkness




Screw minimum wage increase what we really need is an Employer of Last Resort (ELR). The government should step up and create this entity, then when or if you lose your job the ELR can step in and give you a paycheck and health insurance. The ELR would effectively set the minimum wage, so that if they were paying say $10 an hour and offering health benefits private employers would have to match. Now the question is what do to with all those workers, well you could sell the labor back to corporations at a discounted rate.

This becomes a win-win, companies can buy unskilled labor from the government at discounted rates, offsetting the cost of the program. Meanwhile we achieve 100% employment, everyone who wants to work will have a job. Then we can cut direct welfare payments to those who are able bodied and only provide welfare for the disabled.


God I hope you are just trolling.
 
2012-07-26 01:31:36 PM  

Buffalo77: vpb

slayer199: Oh joy, another minimum wage thread where liberals spout BS about a "living wage" without any facts or research.

Only 5.2% of hourly wage earners, earn minimum wage.
Of that 5.2%, 80% are between 16-25.

So yes, raising the minimum wage will force businesses to cut jobs or invest in technology that will increase productivity. So in short, people want to raise the minimum wage for a little more than 1% of the workforce so they can feel better about themselves.

http://www.bls.gov/cps/minwage2011.htm

Only 5.2% of hourly workers make minimum wage therefore raising minimum wage will (somehow) force businesses to cut jobs, even though it is a tiny part of their payrolls and business hire people because they need them not because they can "afford" to.

Brilliant logic there.

Keep thinking, continue to follow the logic and you will get there. Minimum wage is a base off of which most hourly rates are set. If min wage is 8 and you are paid 10 how would you feel if min wage moved to 9.50. Would you expect another 1.50 an hr or 25% raise cause you were making 25% higher than min wage.

How high would labor costs go if you have a contract that pays you 3 times minimum wage. How much more in taxes in SSI and other employment tax would the business incur, etc.

It is not just about min wage workers


Nonsense. When the minimum wage is raised, people making $30/hr. don't ask for raises. They just thank God they're not working for minimum wage.
 
2012-07-26 01:35:26 PM  

Buffalo77: Slaves2Darkness

Screw minimum wage increase what we really need is an Employer of Last Resort (ELR). The government should step up and create this entity, then when or if you lose your job the ELR can step in and give you a paycheck and health insurance. The ELR would effectively set the minimum wage, so that if they were paying say $10 an hour and offering health benefits private employers would have to match. Now the question is what do to with all those workers, well you could sell the labor back to corporations at a discounted rate.

This becomes a win-win, companies can buy unskilled labor from the government at discounted rates, offsetting the cost of the program. Meanwhile we achieve 100% employment, everyone who wants to work will have a job. Then we can cut direct welfare payments to those who are able bodied and only provide welfare for the disabled.

God I hope you are just trolling.


No not trolling at all.
Link
Link
Link
 
2012-07-26 01:38:15 PM  
bingethinker [T



Nonsense. When the minimum wage is raised, people making $30/hr. don't ask for raises. They just thank God they're not working for minimum wage.


Not sure where you get your logic but a raise in minimum wage leads to an overall increase in business cost which cause prices to rise.

If at $30/hr you are at a certain standard of living, when prices go up, your standard of living goes down. You will then be looking to employer for a COL raise.
 
2012-07-26 01:41:58 PM  

Buffalo77: Slaves2Darkness

Screw minimum wage increase what we really need is an Employer of Last Resort (ELR). The government should step up and create this entity, then when or if you lose your job the ELR can step in and give you a paycheck and health insurance. The ELR would effectively set the minimum wage, so that if they were paying say $10 an hour and offering health benefits private employers would have to match. Now the question is what do to with all those workers, well you could sell the labor back to corporations at a discounted rate.

This becomes a win-win, companies can buy unskilled labor from the government at discounted rates, offsetting the cost of the program. Meanwhile we achieve 100% employment, everyone who wants to work will have a job. Then we can cut direct welfare payments to those who are able bodied and only provide welfare for the disabled.

God I hope you are just trolling.


Yeah, what kind of dummy would want to put people to work?

Serious thinkers such as you and I know the proper way to deal with the low-skilled unemployed is to point the finger at welfare recipients and public school teachers as we watch our mutual funds grow from the profits reaped by sending their jobs to slaves in Asia.
 
2012-07-26 01:44:40 PM  

slayer199: Oh joy, another minimum wage thread where liberals spout BS about a "living wage" without any facts or research.

Only 5.2% of hourly wage earners, earn minimum wage.
Of that 5.2%, 80% are between 16-25.

So yes, raising the minimum wage will force businesses to cut jobs or invest in technology that will increase productivity. So in short, people want to raise the minimum wage for a little more than 1% of the workforce so they can feel better about themselves.

http://www.bls.gov/cps/minwage2011.htm


FUn fact: Just because you make a dollar over minimum wage doesn't mean you can really survive.
 
2012-07-26 01:45:32 PM  
Minimum wage is sooooo irrelevant. Suck it, Libs.
 
2012-07-26 01:45:58 PM  
Slaves2Darkness


Buffalo77: Slaves2Darkness

Screw minimum wage increase what we really need is an Employer of Last Resort (ELR). The government should step up and create this entity, then when or if you lose your job the ELR can step in and give you a paycheck and health insurance. The ELR would effectively set the minimum wage, so that if they were paying say $10 an hour and offering health benefits private employers would have to match. Now the question is what do to with all those workers, well you could sell the labor back to corporations at a discounted rate.

This becomes a win-win, companies can buy unskilled labor from the government at discounted rates, offsetting the cost of the program. Meanwhile we achieve 100% employment, everyone who wants to work will have a job. Then we can cut direct welfare payments to those who are able bodied and only provide welfare for the disabled.

God I hope you are just trolling.

No not trolling at all.


Any time this has been tried it has been proven unsuccessful. It is anti free market and leads to corruption.

What is does is stagnate the economy by sucking up all available resources to grow a business. Who pays your employees on this program. Taxes, which will require greater revenue or higher taxes at the time when you are strangling businesses and driving up labor costs which drives down income for the business.
 
2012-07-26 01:47:52 PM  
Aar1012

slayer199: Oh joy, another minimum wage thread where liberals spout BS about a "living wage" without any facts or research.

Only 5.2% of hourly wage earners, earn minimum wage.
Of that 5.2%, 80% are between 16-25.

So yes, raising the minimum wage will force businesses to cut jobs or invest in technology that will increase productivity. So in short, people want to raise the minimum wage for a little more than 1% of the workforce so they can feel better about themselves.

http://www.bls.gov/cps/minwage2011.htm

FUn fact: Just because you make a dollar over minimum wage doesn't mean you can really survive.


Fun Fact: Your are not limited to working 40 Hours per week
 
2012-07-26 01:48:54 PM  

slayer199: vpb: Only 5.2% of hourly workers make minimum wage therefore raising minimum wage will (somehow) force businesses to cut jobs, even though it is a tiny part of their payrolls and business hire people because they need them not because they can "afford" to.

Brilliant logic there.

Since many of businesses with unskilled labor jobs work on thin margins, then yes...it is logical.


Not to mention that the minimum wage is regarded as a "floor" and that any increase in it triggers demands for a corresponding increase by higher-wage workers, particularly those in unions.
 
2012-07-26 01:49:47 PM  

Buffalo77: bingethinker [T



Nonsense. When the minimum wage is raised, people making $30/hr. don't ask for raises. They just thank God they're not working for minimum wage.

Not sure where you get your logic but a raise in minimum wage leads to an overall increase in business cost which cause prices to rise.

If at $30/hr you are at a certain standard of living, when prices go up, your standard of living goes down. You will then be looking to employer for a COL raise.


Employers who pay full-time workers minimum wage are being subsidized by the government through Medicaid, food stamps, and other programs those people use in order to bridge the gap between minimum wage and what they need to live. Personally, I think those costs should be picked up by people who purchase goods and services from that employer, not the taxpayer.
 
2012-07-26 01:52:16 PM  
As far as I can tell this guy, Rob Port, is notable for two things:

1. He writes a whole lot of blog entries.

2. He lived in Wasilla.

Thank god for this important greenlight....
 
2012-07-26 01:55:24 PM  
Wendy's Chili




Yeah, what kind of dummy would want to put people to work?

Serious thinkers such as you and I know the proper way to deal with the low-skilled unemployed is to point the finger at welfare recipients and public school teachers as we watch our mutual funds grow from the profits reaped by sending their jobs to slaves in Asia.


Yes it is serious but I suggest you think about how employment works and why business hire people.

Why would I want to outsource low skilled labor to Asia (Where by the way, wages are increasing at a greater rate than here). This has never been an argument, it high skilled (ie high cost) jobs to asia so get your rant right.

Don't know what public school teachers have to do with this or welfare recipients unless your still using leftover rant from Wisconsin election.
 
2012-07-26 02:01:12 PM  

Buffalo77: Why would I want to outsource low skilled labor to Asia (Where by the way, wages are increasing at a greater rate than here). This has never been an argument, it high skilled (ie high cost) jobs to asia so get your rant right.


I wasn't aware you needed a master's degree to get a job in a sweatshop.
 
2012-07-26 02:06:40 PM  
Nonsense. Clearly raising the minimum wage does nothing but good, period. It is a wonderful thing that is 100% positive in every way, manner, and form imaginable to man whatsoever.

What we need to do is have the government mandate 100% employment, and also mandate pay of $100 godzillion/hour.

Then we can all work 45 femtoseconds, and then retire in the lap of luxury unknown since the time of Nero.

Good plan, amirite?
 
2012-07-26 02:07:34 PM  
"Next up we'll look into the Alpaca market in lower Manhattan and see how that impacts production of cheese on the moon."

I must say that a few meager paragraphs and a chart does nothing for the argument, but all some people need is a stick with which to stir.
 
2012-07-26 02:07:50 PM  
Wendy's Chili



Buffalo77: Why would I want to outsource low skilled labor to Asia (Where by the way, wages are increasing at a greater rate than here). This has never been an argument, it high skilled (ie high cost) jobs to asia so get your rant right.

I wasn't aware you needed a master's degree to get a job in a sweatshop.


My intention was not to confuse you but I fear I have.

I am not following you logic. What are the points you are trying to make. You seem to be all over the place.
 
2012-07-26 02:09:45 PM  
There is. When low-skilled jobs offers higher wages, they attract more young adults, who are better employees than teenagers. When minimum wage is low, no one except teenagers is willing to do low-skill work. Sorry, kids, but it's more important for a guy in his 20s to feed his baby daughter than it is for you to get that opportunity to make extra spending cash for your concert and handbag budget.
 
2012-07-26 02:25:48 PM  

Tommy Moo: There is. When low-skilled jobs offers higher wages, they attract more young adults, who are better employees than teenagers. When minimum wage is low, no one except teenagers is willing to do low-skill work. Sorry, kids, but it's more important for a guy in his 20s to feed his baby daughter than it is for you to get that opportunity to make extra spending cash for your concert and handbag budget.


And sorry to you, small businessman, it's more important for us to pander to our constituencies than for you to compete with those overseas companies that are eating your lunch.
 
2012-07-26 02:28:57 PM  

Buffalo77: Wendy's Chili



Buffalo77: Why would I want to outsource low skilled labor to Asia (Where by the way, wages are increasing at a greater rate than here). This has never been an argument, it high skilled (ie high cost) jobs to asia so get your rant right.

I wasn't aware you needed a master's degree to get a job in a sweatshop.

My intention was not to confuse you but I fear I have.

I am not following you logic. What are the points you are trying to make. You seem to be all over the place.


You claimed (or seem to have claimed, it's hard to tell with your grammar and spelling) that low-skilled jobs aren't outsourced to Asia. I don't think sewing and soldering are considered high-skilled work.
 
2012-07-26 02:40:24 PM  
Wages better go up soon. Ball crushing inflation is on the horizon. Coming this fall to a grocery store near you!
 
2012-07-26 02:46:00 PM  

Wendy's Chili: I don't think sewing and soldering are considered high-skilled work.


You've obviously never done either, then. Both are really tricky when you're working in non-pristine environments. This is doubly so when I have to unsolder cold joints on motherboards because SOMEONE in China couldn't be bothered to check the heat or flux the bloody thing before putting the core to it.
 
2012-07-26 02:46:31 PM  

jjorsett: Tommy Moo: There is. When low-skilled jobs offers higher wages, they attract more young adults, who are better employees than teenagers. When minimum wage is low, no one except teenagers is willing to do low-skill work. Sorry, kids, but it's more important for a guy in his 20s to feed his baby daughter than it is for you to get that opportunity to make extra spending cash for your concert and handbag budget.

And sorry to you, small businessman, it's more important for us to pander to our constituencies than for you to compete with those overseas companies that are eating your lunch.


Yeah, having working men and women live in squalor is a much better way to boost competitiveness than instituting responsible trade policies.
 
2012-07-26 02:46:31 PM  

Wendy's Chili: I'm having trouble following your logic. Why is a living wage a bad thing?


Try reading the facts again. Minimum wage jobs are unskilled labor. Only 5.2% of hourly wage earners earn minimum wage. Of that, 80% are 16-25. That leaves 1.04% age 26 and up. Of the 5.2% of minimum wage earners, 33% are full time, 66% are part-time.

What exactly is the criteria for raising the minimum wage? An arbitrary number based on what some politician feels is liveable? Why not $15/hour? How about $20/hour?

Try a logical argument other than the typical Appeal to Pity arguments about "a living wage." It's not a living wage, it's an entry-level wage for unskilled labor. A business isn't going to absorb the cost of any increased labor. They're going to cut staff or raise prices. These things don't exist in a vacuum.

http://epionline.org/study_detail.cfm?sid=98
 
2012-07-26 02:50:40 PM  
Wages have been stagnant for 20 years. All the wealth generated in the last two decades of unparalleled growth went only to the top. The average Joe "got his" on credit and now the bill is due.
 
2012-07-26 02:55:06 PM  
 
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