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(Toronto Star)   People of Ontario: "Can we have beer & liquor sold in local stores and supermarkets instead of government licensed areas?" Premier of Ontario: "DENIED"   (thestar.com) divider line 167
    More: Stupid, supermarkets  
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4464 clicks; posted to Main » on 25 Jul 2012 at 1:56 PM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2012-07-25 03:37:42 PM

howdoibegin: I've lived in provinces where you can get beer at the corner stores, and it sucks. Every place only has the top 12 selling beers, you gotta travel to get anything better than the Blue, Canadian, Corona, etc (ugh). I'll take The Beer Store situation any day of the week.


This. If it goes to private stores, the only places stocking it are going to triple the price of anything not made by the big 2. I'm okay with government-mandates selection, since it's better than what free enterprise would offer at most stores.

I've shopped at plenty of American stores with their free market booze. shiattier selection 99% of the time except for offering more at the bottom end. Socialist alcohol ftw.
 
2012-07-25 03:37:53 PM
farm6.staticflickr.com
 
2012-07-25 03:40:50 PM

sn0wblind: surprised nobody mentioned SAQ...
worst.liquor.store

I think the state of NH does it right: giant selection, government run, locations everywhere including off the highway, and non-taxed.
Alcohol there literally costs me half as much as it does in Quebec.



SAQ worked in a pinch when I grew up in NB - I could cross the bridge and instantly be of legal age, and set my watch back an hour!

You're right about NH, though. Great website, too, which helps narrow down my choices (so much Scotch). My gf and I are driving from Ottawa to NB next month for a friend's wedding, and decided to drive through NH expressly for the booze (and no tax and free shipping from US-only online merchants). Well, that, and Mt. Washington (hope the weather holds so we can summit).
 
2012-07-25 03:54:58 PM

ptelg: Alcohol is a harmful substance and should only be available heavily taxed and in a tightly controlled environment.

Prove me wrong.

You can't.


Can, but can't be bothered. We have important drinking to do, after all.
 
2012-07-25 03:56:37 PM

bigbadideasinaction: howdoibegin: I've lived in provinces where you can get beer at the corner stores, and it sucks. Every place only has the top 12 selling beers, you gotta travel to get anything better than the Blue, Canadian, Corona, etc (ugh). I'll take The Beer Store situation any day of the week.

This. If it goes to private stores, the only places stocking it are going to triple the price of anything not made by the big 2. I'm okay with government-mandates selection, since it's better than what free enterprise would offer at most stores.

I've shopped at plenty of American stores with their free market booze. shiattier selection 99% of the time except for offering more at the bottom end. Socialist alcohol ftw.


I don't know where these "plenty of American stores" you shopped at were, but I live in Podunk Nowhere, USA and I can buy 25+ different brands of beer and most any brand or type of hard liquor you could want at most Von's stores within 10 minutes of my house...I don't drink wine, but they also have a HUGE selection of that as well....as I said upthread, even Wal Mart here has two full aisles of booze.
 
2012-07-25 03:58:26 PM
I just thought it was really ironic that pharmacies like walgreens and cvs sell cigarettes and wine and beer.

Never saw that in Nova Scotia.
I love that no matter what - if I want beer, I can get it. (Except for between 12AM and 12PM sunday) stupid rule but whatever.
 
2012-07-25 03:58:49 PM
GOOD



-10/10 for being such a retarded douche bag submittard.
 
2012-07-25 04:01:41 PM
As an Albertan, I shrug on my way to my corner Liquor store, wondering how on earth private liquor stores manage to screw up variety in other places. I haven't ever seen a store anywhere in Alberta that doesn't have at least 40 types of beer, and a decent wine and liquor selection to boot, even in the most backwater dreggy towns.

After all, if your selection sucks, I'm going across the street!
 
2012-07-25 04:03:09 PM

Porous Horace: Who cares? Nobody likes Ontarians.


Really, that's not what your mom said....well, at least that's what I think she said. It was hard to hear her screaming into the pillow while I was banging her from behind.
 
2012-07-25 04:09:10 PM
WA privatized hard-alcohol sales on Costco's dime and look where it got us, a price hike and people flocking to Oregon to stock up on booze.
 
2012-07-25 04:13:10 PM
LCBO has changed a lot over the years.

I remember the old days when i'd go there with my dad. They had ONE sample bottle on the shelf, and you walked about with a notepad and pencil and wrote down the ID of what you wanted.

You'd bring it to the clerk and he'd go to the back and get what you wanted and wrap it in a brown paper bag, like porn.

Totally a holdout from the days of the temperance movement. These days, here's what an LCBO looks like (even in a small town):

www.forumarchitect.com

No thanks. Keep your Two-Buck Chuck and convenient corner stores, America.
 
2012-07-25 04:25:53 PM

The_Sponge: You know what every city and town in Canada needs? Their own local version of Special Brews:

Link

It's a beer bar/bottle shop not too far from my house, and if you live in the Seattle area, I highly recommend it.

And in the interest of full disclosure, I am not a part of that business, nor am I friends with the owner.


And if you make it to Redmond, try the Malt and Vine. I'm not affiliated with that place either.

I think we can agree, every place needs more places to get good beer.
 
2012-07-25 04:37:53 PM
The LCBO may be a government liquor store, but it's a *good* liquor store. I wouldn't have a problem with corner store wine and beer, but I don't see any reason to abandon the LCBO.
 
2012-07-25 04:40:31 PM

toraque: And if you make it to Redmond, try the Malt and Vine. I'm not affiliated with that place either.

I think we can agree, every place needs more places to get good beer.



Looks great...I'll have to check it out. Have you been to Fine Wine & Cigars? They carry some decent beers, but the selection isn't much.
 
2012-07-25 04:44:30 PM
Wish the Beer Store had a better selection, only the bigger LCBO stores have a decent selection, and will order for you if you purchase a good amount.

farm5.staticflickr.com
 
2012-07-25 04:45:43 PM
content6.flixster.com
I found this mouse in a bottle of your beer, eh?

/fixed it for you
 
2012-07-25 05:00:42 PM

oldfarthenry: tgregory: What happens when your government doesn't put the rights of free people and free enterprise first... legislation can be bought.

Yeah - how's the RIAA legally hacking into your computer working out, Freedom-Pants?


It sucks, which was exactly the point tgregory was making.
 
2012-07-25 05:03:14 PM

towatchoverme: LCBO has changed a lot over the years.

I remember the old days when i'd go there with my dad. They had ONE sample bottle on the shelf, and you walked about with a notepad and pencil and wrote down the ID of what you wanted.

You'd bring it to the clerk and he'd go to the back and get what you wanted and wrap it in a brown paper bag, like porn.

Totally a holdout from the days of the temperance movement. These days, here's what an LCBO looks like (even in a small town):

[www.forumarchitect.com image 500x375]

No thanks. Keep your Two-Buck Chuck and convenient corner stores, America.


media.sacbee.com

Welcome to Total Wine & More, where our Cabernet Sauvignon section is larger than your entire state liquor store. My nearest TW&M is larger than the Home Depot next door to it.
 
2012-07-25 05:04:51 PM

Lerxst2k: Socalized Alcohol


Well, I am a social drinker.
 
2012-07-25 05:08:14 PM

This text is now purple: towatchoverme:

[media.sacbee.com image 640x480]

Welcome to Total Wine & More, where our Cabernet Sauvignon section is larger than your entire state liquor store. My nearest TW&M is larger than the Home Depot next door to it.


WANT!
 
2012-07-25 05:14:16 PM

This text is now purple: towatchoverme: LCBO has changed a lot over the years.

I remember the old days when i'd go there with my dad. They had ONE sample bottle on the shelf, and you walked about with a notepad and pencil and wrote down the ID of what you wanted.

You'd bring it to the clerk and he'd go to the back and get what you wanted and wrap it in a brown paper bag, like porn.

Totally a holdout from the days of the temperance movement. These days, here's what an LCBO looks like (even in a small town):

[www.forumarchitect.com image 500x375]

No thanks. Keep your Two-Buck Chuck and convenient corner stores, America.

[media.sacbee.com image 640x480]

Welcome to Total Wine & More, where our Cabernet Sauvignon section is larger than your entire state liquor store. My nearest TW&M is larger than the Home Depot next door to it.


And yet it still probably doesn't have whatever semi-obscure liqueur I'm trying to find for my friend at any given moment.
 
2012-07-25 05:15:44 PM

howdoibegin: I've lived in provinces where you can get beer at the corner stores, and it sucks. Every place only has the top 12 selling beers, you gotta travel to get anything better than the Blue, Canadian, Corona, etc (ugh). I'll take The Beer Store situation any day of the week.


Absolutely untrue. Every single Sobey's liquor store I've frequented sells Grasshopper as well as many other diverse beer brands. The prices have NOT raised at all in relation to when it was ALCB, in fact competition has forced them to put on sales and specials to get your butt into their store. Also, I know of 2 specialty liquor stores in my small town of Sherwood Park that have a huge selection and will order it in for you if they don't carry it, but seriously, they all have Grasshopper, Jack Daniels, Stoli, and Wolf Blas. What more could a budding alcomoholic ask for?
 
2012-07-25 05:17:47 PM

SirMadness: As an Albertan, I shrug on my way to my corner Liquor store, wondering how on earth private liquor stores manage to screw up variety in other places. I haven't ever seen a store anywhere in Alberta that doesn't have at least 40 types of beer, and a decent wine and liquor selection to boot, even in the most backwater dreggy towns.

After all, if your selection sucks, I'm going across the street!


This
 
2012-07-25 05:20:21 PM

SuperTran: Smeggy Smurf:

Non-MormonMoron Idaho is hoping for Costco do to it here as well. SuperValu has farked Albertsons so bad that they could close all of them and make them into booze stores to make some real money.

I rather like the system we have here in Idaho. Beer and Wine can be purchased anywhere, and I find the prices for liquor in the state store to be pretty reasonable. I've been hearing that since WA privatized, prices went way up, and people drive to Oregon to get all their booze.


The higher prices were due to the usual unethical ways of the Washington goobernment. That won't last long though once the big booze sellers start moving in. I've been advocating for grocery stores that are struggling to be shut down and replaced by large i.e. 45,000 square foot booze stores.

Albertsons is on it's way out. They're a store that still exists for reasons unknown. SuperValu could make a killing selling off 800 of their locations and turning the remaining 400 into liquor stores. Then again I'm a bit biased. I'm in a position to do the architectural work for such a remodel, I like booze and I can't stand Albertsons.
 
2012-07-25 05:26:12 PM
At least with one supplier of beer in Ontario, the prices are very good for the consumers.

/true dat
/Quebec does not exist
 
2012-07-25 05:30:07 PM
Whaaa??? I didn't know canadians are retarded.
 
2012-07-25 05:37:41 PM
The idea of buying alcohol at a grocery or corner store sounds weird- it seems like it'd be too easy for kids to steal booze- and buying whisky and eggs together sounds trashy- (even though they match perfectly -I'm not arguing that fact- it's the best way to start a day!)
And as for the situation in Ontario- why do liquor stores have to be run by the province- Why can't they be regular, privately run liquor stores? - it shouldn't be so complicated to sell people booze -- in different neighborhoods the store differs from area to area based on what the locals want- some have wicked selections of beer- others have racks and racks of wine-- easy and makes sense-happy medium - maybe I'm just understanding this wrong....
 
2012-07-25 05:38:48 PM
um if the ontario government makes 1 billion a year from LCBO purchases where will they make up the money? if everyone just goes to convenience stores and grocery stores they won't keep the LCBO open
so where do they make up the 1 billion? which services get cut?
 
2012-07-25 05:41:06 PM

ontariolightning: um if the ontario government makes 1 billion a year from LCBO purchases where will they make up the money? if everyone just goes to convenience stores and grocery stores they won't keep the LCBO open
so where do they make up the 1 billion? which services get cut?


they could probably just tax alcohol sales regardless of where it is sold.
 
2012-07-25 05:44:44 PM
The idea of having to go to government run liquor stores is so foreign to me that it's hard to even fathom. Between 6am and 2am I can buy beer, wine, and hard liquor from virtually all gas stations, supermarkets, drug stores, liquor stores, bars, restaurants, and big box Walmart/Targets.

For those that have to go to government liquor stores or can't buy booze after sundown or on Sundays all I can say is "Sucks for you!"
 
2012-07-25 05:48:00 PM
I like the LCBO the stores are clean and tidy and the people are actually helpful and friendly. I don't want to see a bunch of crappy rundown liquor stores on every corner I say let the hobos walk to the nearest LCBO for their box of wine.
 
2012-07-25 05:57:38 PM

RTOGUY: I like the LCBO the stores are clean and tidy and the people are actually helpful and friendly. I don't want to see a bunch of crappy rundown liquor stores on every corner I say let the hobos walk to the nearest LCBO for their box of wine.



Man, you Canadians used to be cool.
 
2012-07-25 06:02:01 PM

blahpers: And yet it still probably doesn't have whatever semi-obscure liqueur I'm trying to find for my friend at any given moment.


Total Wine's beer and booze selection is equally awesome. There are three aisles of craft brews before you even get to the big-name stuff. They often have multiple bottle sizes, single bottle and 4 or 6-pack (or case) sales, and descriptions of most of it. Same goes with the booze - aisles and aisles of it, both big names and no names.
 
2012-07-25 06:12:06 PM

Ohlookabutterfly: Every single Sobey's liquor store I've frequented sells Grasshopper


Grasshopper is every damn place you look in Alberta, I don't think it's a fair measure of variety. Nothing wrong with it, just isn't really proving a lot.

mjoven1975: The idea of having to go to government run liquor stores is so foreign to me that it's hard to even fathom. Between 6am and 2am I can buy beer, wine, and hard liquor from virtually all gas stations, supermarkets, drug stores, liquor stores, bars, restaurants, and big box Walmart/Targets.


Don't people keep a decent supply at home? Not once in my life have I ever got around to 2am and wished I could go get more booze. I wouldn't be against the option of doing so, it just doesn't come up... Ever. At least for me.

mikefinch: The idea of buying alcohol at a grocery or corner store sounds weird- it seems like it'd be too easy for kids to steal booze- and buying whisky and eggs together sounds trashy- (even though they match perfectly -I'm not arguing that fact- it's the best way to start a day!)
And as for the situation in Ontario- why do liquor stores have to be run by the province- Why can't they be regular, privately run liquor stores? - it shouldn't be so complicated to sell people booze -- in different neighborhoods the store differs from area to area based on what the locals want- some have wicked selections of beer- others have racks and racks of wine-- easy and makes sense-happy medium - maybe I'm just understanding this wrong....


The LCBO stores do vary depending on the neighborhood tastes. Some have killer beer selections, the one closest to my house has a massive vintages section, one downtown has a great scotch selection, etc.

I don't think I'm alone in this, but I'm okay with the LCBO being a source of revenue for the province. Those stores make money hand over fist (because they're actually a solid retail enterprise, not *just* because they're a monopoly), and I'd rather it be directed into healthcare or education than some rich dude's pocket.
 
2012-07-25 06:52:14 PM
Used to live in a town of about 5,000 near Ottawa. No retail store can sell alcohol in the town unless one day the LCBO deems we are worth it.

10 minutes (driving) in one direction there is an LCBO and Beer Store in another town. Decent selection but the Beer Store closes 6pm most weekends and is only open 12-4 on Sundays....

10 minutes (driving) the other way and within City limits (30km from downtown) there is an agency store inside a local grocery/convenience store open until 10pm every night. Selection not as good as the LCBO but not bad. Great service and they always check ID. This type of store could easily be supported in my town, but isn't allowed in my town because it is within 10KM of an LCBO and Beer Store.

We have a really messed up oligopolic system:

-LCBO - government owned stores selling all types of alcohol products

-The Beer Store - store owned by multinational foreign

-Agency Store - beer sold in grocery/convenience stores but only in certain communities and limited # of licenses

-Breweries - allowed to sell on-site at their brewery but can't have other stores unless they happen to be one of the Big 3 owners of the Beer Store

-Wineries - allowed to sell at their winery but can't have off-site stores unless they have a winery retail store license...95+% of these licenses are owned by a foreign multi-national Constellation Brands or by the company Andrew Peller, and these stores will exclusively stock their companies' brands. Other wineries are shut out from opening these types of stores since they aren't issuing new licences (the existing licences are grandfathered pre-free trade). Incidentally many of these licenses have moved into auxiliary stores inside of large supermarkets, but Sobeys or Loblaws wouldn't be allowed to have their own wine section (unless of course they happened to be in a lucky small town)

It is ridiculous to say that privatization would create social problems since there is so much of it already in Ontario... but the privatization we have almost exclusively benefits a few large companies.
 
2012-07-25 06:52:15 PM
And deny me the pleasure of hearing the GPS try to pronounce "LICK-BO?" Yeah, you're right, I'd get over it.
 
2012-07-25 06:58:51 PM

costermonger:
I don't think I'm alone in this, but I'm okay with the LCBO being a source of revenue for the province. Those stores make money hand over fist (because they're actually a solid retail enterprise, not *just* because they're a monopoly), and I'd rather it be directed into healthcare ...


I think it's more due to the monopoly than to good management. Their retail employees are overpaid compared to the market and when suppliers like wineries come in with prices that the LCBO thinks are too low, the LCBO will actually ask the suppliers to raise their price and pay more for the product!
Link
 
2012-07-25 07:09:33 PM
This has more to do with convenience stores wanting to increase their business, than with any real demand from the public. LCBO and Beer Store locations are very plentiful, and are rarely more than a few miles away except maybe in the most rural communities. There may be some die hard anti-government people who want to see the province out of alcohol retail, but I think most could care less either way (except maybe for prices).

Link to a map of all liquor stores in the province.

/be sure to select the territory first, before you claim there are no stores outside Toronto
//for me, Wine Rack 1.5 miles away, LCBO and Beer Store located next to each other 2.5 miles away
 
2012-07-25 07:26:53 PM

Rev.K: If there's one thing to like about Alberta, it's this:

Liquor sales at private retailers from 10am - 2am, 365 days a year.


That, and the massive walk-in beer coolers with hundreds of varieties of beer.
 
2012-07-25 07:32:17 PM
Be still, my still B.

/still A is at the shop
//mmm...garage liquor.
 
2012-07-25 07:46:19 PM

Frizbone: [content6.flixster.com image 359x201]
I found this mouse in a bottle of your beer!!


It blew my mind when I figured out that movie was cribbing plot from "Hamlet". I'm sure everyone else figured that out in five minutes... it took me an hour.
 
2012-07-25 07:52:08 PM

danielscissorhands: Response from the average American: "What's an Ontario?"

/not known for their geographical skills


I know - every time I cross the bridge, everything is different! They act like it is a different country or something.
And if they are, and the stories are true, why aren't all the women walking around topless?
And how the heck did they stick that penny in a quarter? Is that a twenty six cent piece? What is the exchange rate on that?
And I can never get a straight answer from the Ontario women if it is true they use hockey pucks because they last three periods?
The Ontario Ballet (Windsor Ballet/Sarnia Ballet) is a cultural icon that needs to be supported though.
 
2012-07-25 08:40:32 PM
I'd be thrilled if the beer store in my home town stocked more than just the crap on the lowest legal price list. Sucks when I go home to visit and forget to stop at a real beer store first.
 
2012-07-25 08:51:48 PM

ottawaboy: but the privatization we have almost exclusively benefits a few large companies.


Yeah, that's the type of privatization I'm entirely against. If it's more of the same, it's not going to benefit anybody but a handful of big corporations. The agency store model is better.

ottawaboy: Their retail employees are overpaid compared to the market


I'm okay with this. If I owned a liquor store, I'd overpay my employees compared to a grocery store, gas station, etc. The potential for abuse (and that abuse to become my problem) in that environment is worth the premium, IMO.
 
2012-07-25 08:56:24 PM

Electrify: This has more to do with convenience stores wanting to increase their business, than with any real demand from the public. LCBO and Beer Store locations are very plentiful, and are rarely more than a few miles away except maybe in the most rural communities. There may be some die hard anti-government people who want to see the province out of alcohol retail, but I think most could care less either way (except maybe for prices).

Link to a map of all liquor stores in the province.

/be sure to select the territory first, before you claim there are no stores outside Toronto
//for me, Wine Rack 1.5 miles away, LCBO and Beer Store located next to each other 2.5 miles away


B-b-b-ut socializm!

I say again - LCBO brings in good product, at a good price, to everywhere, and puts lots and lots of revenue back into government so we can afford free health care for when our livers give out.

The only people who want to mess with a good thing are urban hipsters and Randian derpsters. Rest of us are just fine with the status quo, thanks.
 
2012-07-25 09:29:40 PM

ottawaboy: costermonger:
I don't think I'm alone in this, but I'm okay with the LCBO being a source of revenue for the province. Those stores make money hand over fist (because they're actually a solid retail enterprise, not *just* because they're a monopoly), and I'd rather it be directed into healthcare ...

I think it's more due to the monopoly than to good management. Their retail employees are overpaid compared to the market and when suppliers like wineries come in with prices that the LCBO thinks are too low, the LCBO will actually ask the suppliers to raise their price and pay more for the product!
Link


Roger that. I work there and I am embarrassed when I get paid.
 
2012-07-25 09:39:24 PM

indarwinsshadow: Porous Horace: Who cares? Nobody likes Ontarians.

Really, that's not what your mom said....well, at least that's what I think she said. It was hard to hear her screaming into the pillow while I was banging her from behind.


A comeback truly Ontarian in its lameness.
 
2012-07-25 09:44:22 PM

oldfarthenry: "it's odd that rural residents and cottagers can pick up beer and wine in the same store where they buy bread and milk but urban residents cannot"

Bumpkinville has its privileges.

Suck it, urban hipsters!
Love
Bumf**k, ON


Resident of Kinmount?
 
2012-07-25 09:49:52 PM

ptelg: Alcohol is a harmful substance and should only be available heavily taxed and in a tightly controlled environment.

Prove me wrong.

You can't.


but who cares?
 
2012-07-25 09:49:57 PM

oldfarthenry: "it's odd that rural residents and cottagers can pick up beer and wine in the same store where they buy bread and milk but urban residents cannot"

Bumpkinville has its privileges.

Suck it, urban hipsters!
Love
Bumf**k, ON Mike from Canmore

 
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