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(Yahoo)   Eagle Scouts return their medals to the Boy Scout of America. Upset over the organization's pro-heterosexual stance   (news.yahoo.com ) divider line
    More: Misc, Eagle Scout, batty boys, Boy Scouts of America, heterosexuals, molest children, Boing Boing, Christopher Baker  
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13767 clicks; posted to Main » on 24 Jul 2012 at 11:28 PM (4 years ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2012-07-24 06:16:45 PM  
Goes to show that Scouting does turn boys into men with good principles.
 
2012-07-24 06:32:49 PM  

BarkingUnicorn: Goes to show that Scouting does turn boys into men with good principles.


SHMOOTH

Eh, I don't think homosexuality is right myself, but I do advocate free will. Of course, anyone that is for the topic, why would I be with them?

/In other words, I agrees.
 
2012-07-24 06:45:44 PM  
Actually, it's more of a pro-bigotry stance, but who's counting?
 
2012-07-24 06:56:11 PM  

BarkingUnicorn: Goes to show that Scouting does turn boys into men with good principles.


Heh heh. Point.
 
2012-07-24 07:45:43 PM  
Don't let the door hit you on the way out...
 
2012-07-24 07:47:04 PM  
Because it's as if we all needed more evidence to respect individual scouts than the club they joined?
 
2012-07-24 07:50:36 PM  
My best friend is an Eagle Scout. I have no idea whether he will be turning in his medal, but during his promotion ceremony, a sparrow landed on my shoulder and stayed there for a few minutes. This was 20 years ago.

I'm sure it's a sign, but I'm not sure of what.
 
2012-07-24 07:52:25 PM  

Vodka Zombie: Actually, it's more of a pro-bigotry stance, but who's counting?

 
2012-07-24 07:59:01 PM  
So uh...do the um, Girl Scouts allow...nothing, nothing.
 
2012-07-24 08:00:22 PM  

BKITU: My best friend is an Eagle Scout. I have no idea whether he will be turning in his medal, but during his promotion ceremony, a sparrow landed on my shoulder and stayed there for a few minutes. This was 20 years ago.

I'm sure it's a sign, but I'm not sure of what.


Keep your eye on the sparrow when the going gets narrow.
 
2012-07-24 08:05:54 PM  

BKITU: My best friend is an Eagle Scout. I have no idea whether he will be turning in his medal, but during his promotion ceremony, a sparrow landed on my shoulder and stayed there for a few minutes. This was 20 years ago.

I'm sure it's a sign, but I'm not sure of what.


Probably the bird was saying, "Get outta my way! I'm migratin' here!"
 
2012-07-24 08:10:54 PM  
Uh, why does this thread not have the Hero tag?

That takes a lot of balls, and principles to do. The amount of your life you spend earning that Eagle Scout medal is incredible, and to willingly hand it back over their bigotry is a huge step to take.
 
2012-07-24 08:26:17 PM  

BKITU: My best friend is an Eagle Scout. I have no idea whether he will be turning in his medal, but during his promotion ceremony, a sparrow landed on my shoulder and stayed there for a few minutes. This was 20 years ago.

I'm sure it's a sign, but I'm not sure of what.



I hate to break it to you, but it probably means that you have to go to the Ball and wear glass shoes.
Sorry.

i105.photobucket.com


Research wizards throughout the multiverse have tried to stop this, or at least figure out why it happens, but they're stumped.
 
2012-07-24 08:47:09 PM  
I greatly enjoyed Scouting as a kid and would like to get my son into it next year. I really hope I can find a troop that at least takes a neutral position on this. Been trying very hard to not teach him any bigotry and I sure don't need it coming from an organization I am encouraging him to join.
 
2012-07-24 08:55:09 PM  

Mugato: So uh...do the um, Girl Scouts allow...nothing, nothing.


They have a DADT policy.

Also, again, why is this suddenly a thing? BSOA has had this policy for years.
 
2012-07-24 09:03:20 PM  

Mugato: So uh...do the um, Girl Scouts allow...nothing, nothing.


The Girl Scouts allow LGBTQ members and volunteers, if that's what you're asking.

All couples have to sleep in separate tents, however.
 
2012-07-24 09:11:49 PM  
I disagree with the stupid rules currently in action, but still stand by the organization and its principles. Sending back your Eagle is like moving to Canada because you don't like the guy that got elected as President.
 
2012-07-24 09:12:48 PM  

platedlizard: Mugato: So uh...do the um, Girl Scouts allow...nothing, nothing.

The Girl Scouts allow LGBTQ members and volunteers, if that's what you're asking.

All couples have to sleep in separate tents, however.


Outrage! I'm going to send back my...eagle...cookie...or whatever it is they give out.
 
2012-07-24 09:31:14 PM  

BarkingUnicorn: Goes to show that Scouting does turn boys into men with good principles.

 
2012-07-24 09:34:53 PM  
serial_crusher: I disagree with the stupid rules currently in action, but still stand by the organization and its principles. Sending back your Eagle is like moving to Canada because you don't like the guy that got elected as President.

Uh, no.

Sending back your Eagle Medal is like returning your Presidential Medal of Freedom because the Administration is doing something flippiantly idiotic. It's a major statement of protest against their bigotry. Being an Eagle Scout is a big deal in the adult world - it gives you an edge on getting into certain colleges, getting into education programs that are restricted access, getting certain jobs and political appointments, consideration for military rank upon enlistment, and even getting loans and financhial aid.

You're basically saying you accomplished one of the hardest things to do as an adolescent. It signifies that you have commited a substantial amount of years of your life, starting at the age of 11, to completeing the requirements and obtaining over 21 merit badges which each have their own individual, time consuming criteria, that you've served in multiple positions of leadership in your troop, and that you've spent hundreds of hours doing community service projects, not to mention an individual Eagle Scout project which you spend a lot of time and money doing, and has to be approved at a regional level by the BSA. And you have to be done BEFORE your 18th birthday, and have your approval for the award. Otherwise, you become inelegable. Less than 10% of Boy Scouts ever get to the point where they are even considered.

This isn't something you get just for being in Scouts until you're 18. You work your ass off to earn this thing. And it means a LOT outside of scouts.
 
2012-07-24 09:35:27 PM  

serial_crusher: platedlizard: Mugato: So uh...do the um, Girl Scouts allow...nothing, nothing.

The Girl Scouts allow LGBTQ members and volunteers, if that's what you're asking.

All couples have to sleep in separate tents, however.

Outrage! I'm going to send back my...eagle...cookie...or whatever it is they give out.


Friendship bracelet, if I recall correctly from my brief stint as a Girl Scout.
 
2012-07-24 09:47:57 PM  
That's an admirable thing that they're doing.

I have to say that I'm so glad I was a Girl Scout. They'll take anyone, regardless of religion or sexual orientation. I'm very proud of being associated with that organization. I wish these men returning their Eagle Medals could say the same.
 
2012-07-24 09:48:42 PM  

BronyMedic: serial_crusher: I disagree with the stupid rules currently in action, but still stand by the organization and its principles. Sending back your Eagle is like moving to Canada because you don't like the guy that got elected as President.

Uh, no.

Sending back your Eagle Medal is like returning your Presidential Medal of Freedom because the Administration is doing something flippiantly idiotic. It's a major statement of protest against their bigotry. Being an Eagle Scout is a big deal in the adult world...


I meant to add that I'm an Eagle myself. Yes to all those things you said. It's hard work. I earned it fair and square, regardless of some stupid rules I don't agree with, which is why I'm not sending it back.

The folks who are sending theirs back (ok, it's really just that one guy) are commendable. Being that dedicated to something you believe is a good thing. I'm just saying I wouldn't go that far, and I don't feel it's necessary to go that far. Ideally I'd like to change the BSA from within, but realistically I haven't been that active in my adult years.
 
2012-07-24 09:57:26 PM  
So, the organization in which grown men take young boys to frolic overnight in the woods and help sew things on their sashes, doesn't like gay people?
 
2012-07-24 10:04:21 PM  

PhiloeBedoe: So, the organization in which grown men take young boys to frolic overnight in the woods and help sew things on their sashes, doesn't like gay people?


To be fair, nobody really cares about sewing merit badges on their sash until they make Eagle, at which point their mom freaks out about having them look presentable, and she's the one who gets stuck sewing the stuff on. So, the sewing part stays as the wimmin's work that it's supposed to be.

/ That's how it went for me anyhow.
 
2012-07-24 10:28:55 PM  
serial_crusher: Ideally I'd like to change the BSA from within, but realistically I haven't been that active in my adult years.

Good luck with that. The structure of the BSA is that of an organization which not only condones religious fundamentalism, but actively works to encourage it. Local member organizations are given a blank slate to run out those who are not religious - Atheists and Agnostics - and it's a rather uncomfortable position for anyone who is NOT a Christian due to their close ties with local churches. On the surface, the BSA tries to appear all inclusive and tolerant, but once you're in, the reality is quite different.
 
2012-07-24 10:39:02 PM  

BronyMedic: serial_crusher: Ideally I'd like to change the BSA from within, but realistically I haven't been that active in my adult years.

Good luck with that. The structure of the BSA is that of an organization which not only condones religious fundamentalism, but actively works to encourage it. Local member organizations are given a blank slate to run out those who are not religious - Atheists and Agnostics - and it's a rather uncomfortable position for anyone who is NOT a Christian theist due to their close ties with local churches. On the surface, the BSA tries to appear all inclusive and tolerant, but once you're in, the reality is quite different.


Plenty of Jewish scouts out there. I didn't grow up in an area with a significant Muslim community so I don't think there were any in my troop, but I remember enough from my various handbooks to know they would have been welcome.

There might be an Abrahamic preference, but I believe members of other, non-Abrahamic faiths would have been welcome as well (I'm not so certain of this as for Abrahamic theists, but fairly sure).
 
2012-07-24 10:45:54 PM  

BronyMedic: Good luck with that. The structure of the BSA is that of an organization which not only condones religious fundamentalism, but actively works to encourage it. Local member organizations are given a blank slate to run out those who are not religious - Atheists and Agnostics - and it's a rather uncomfortable position for anyone who is NOT a Christian due to their close ties with local churches.


i can't speak to any national aspects, as...well...i didn't last long enough....but at the local level i partook of the boyscout's splendor, it wasn't even a matter of 'running out the non christians', it was a subset of a group of pentecostal churches that wanted to run out anybody who wouldn't jabber and flail along with them.

tying knots? i'm cool.
starting fires? alright.
making leather bracelets? getting borderline on my arts and crafts phobia, but ok.
jabbering for jesus? erm....i'll be over....there.
 
2012-07-24 10:47:04 PM  
They're a private organization, so they should be allowed to be bigots. It's just unfortunate that it's a youth organization teaching and enforcing bigotry on children. I really hate to see kids discriminated against or made to feel less than human. At that age, that can be extremely emotionally scarring.
 
2012-07-24 10:55:24 PM  
BKITU: Plenty of Jewish scouts out there. I didn't grow up in an area with a significant Muslim community so I don't think there were any in my troop, but I remember enough from my various handbooks to know they would have been welcome.

Many of the local troops are parternered with protestant churches, or run through them as ministries of that church as well as attached to the BSA.
 
2012-07-24 11:07:54 PM  
Lots of my friends (Mormons) got their Eagle, and it is a big deal and a LOT of work. I respect any young man who puts in the service, time, effort, and sacrifice. It speaks volumes about his character. It also says a lot to send back something he worked so hard for in protest.

Also, what BarkingUnicorn said.
 
2012-07-24 11:10:18 PM  

WorldCitizen: They're a private organization, so they should be allowed to be bigots.


...without government support for them while they're bigots.
 
2012-07-24 11:15:07 PM  

abb3w: WorldCitizen: They're a private organization, so they should be allowed to be bigots.

...without government support for them while they're bigots.


kinda my thoughts. they are more than welcome to private their asses out of our schools, municipal functions, and federal funding.

hell, as long as they get federal funding to the extent they do, the pretense of being 'a private organization' is a punchline to a bad joke.
 
2012-07-24 11:17:33 PM  

heap: abb3w: WorldCitizen: They're a private organization, so they should be allowed to be bigots.

...without government support for them while they're bigots.

kinda my thoughts. they are more than welcome to private their asses out of our schools, municipal functions, and federal funding.

hell, as long as they get federal funding to the extent they do, the pretense of being 'a private organization' is a punchline to a bad joke.


Well, yes, this. They should be cut off from the use and funding of anything public if they are going to have discriminatory membership practices. They should have to be bigots on their own dime and using their own resources.
 
2012-07-24 11:30:33 PM  

Skywolf Philosopher: BarkingUnicorn: Goes to show that Scouting does turn boys into men with good principles.

SHMOOTH

Eh, I don't think homosexuality is right myself I'm not gay or nothin', but I do advocate free will. Of course, anyone that is for the topic, why would I be with them?

/In other words, I agrees.


Fixed for accuracy.
 
2012-07-24 11:33:24 PM  

BronyMedic: serial_crusher: I disagree with the stupid rules currently in action, but still stand by the organization and its principles. Sending back your Eagle is like moving to Canada because you don't like the guy that got elected as President.

Uh, no.

Sending back your Eagle Medal is like returning your Presidential Medal of Freedom because the Administration is doing something flippiantly idiotic. It's a major statement of protest against their bigotry. Being an Eagle Scout is a big deal in the adult world - it gives you an edge on getting into certain colleges, getting into education programs that are restricted access, getting certain jobs and political appointments, consideration for military rank upon enlistment, and even getting loans and financhial aid.

You're basically saying you accomplished one of the hardest things to do as an adolescent. It signifies that you have commited a substantial amount of years of your life, starting at the age of 11, to completeing the requirements and obtaining over 21 merit badges which each have their own individual, time consuming criteria, that you've served in multiple positions of leadership in your troop, and that you've spent hundreds of hours doing community service projects, not to mention an individual Eagle Scout project which you spend a lot of time and money doing, and has to be approved at a regional level by the BSA. And you have to be done BEFORE your 18th birthday, and have your approval for the award. Otherwise, you become inelegable. Less than 10% of Boy Scouts ever get to the point where they are even considered.

This isn't something you get just for being in Scouts until you're 18. You work your ass off to earn this thing. And it means a LOT outside of scouts.


Well stated.
 
2012-07-24 11:34:40 PM  
Of all the troops I was involved with, the military ones were the best. Anything attached to a church was a fustercluck of bullshiat church politics. Having a small detachment from SEAL Team 1 (Kodiak) as assistant scoutmasters was awesome.

/most important thing I learned from Scouting was the proper way to tie knots
//Mrs. Smurf loves I earned my Eagle
 
2012-07-24 11:34:57 PM  
Great. Now where is my son going to go to tie sailor knots and wear neckerchiefs?
 
2012-07-24 11:35:19 PM  

PhiloeBedoe: So, the organization in which grown men take young boys to frolic overnight in the woods and help sew things on their sashes, doesn't like gay people?


i.ytimg.com

Hehe, very clever
 
2012-07-24 11:35:44 PM  

Vodka Zombie: Actually, it's more of a pro-bigotry stance, but who's counting?


This. I'm pro heterosexual. I'm also pro homosexual. Being one doesn't exclude the other.

/pissed off at anti-gay-marriage types whose only opposition seems based on their own misunderstanding that legalising gay marriage and making it compulsory for everyone are somehow the same thing.
 
2012-07-24 11:36:44 PM  

BKITU: BronyMedic: serial_crusher: Ideally I'd like to change the BSA from within, but realistically I haven't been that active in my adult years.

Good luck with that. The structure of the BSA is that of an organization which not only condones religious fundamentalism, but actively works to encourage it. Local member organizations are given a blank slate to run out those who are not religious - Atheists and Agnostics - and it's a rather uncomfortable position for anyone who is NOT a Christian theist due to their close ties with local churches. On the surface, the BSA tries to appear all inclusive and tolerant, but once you're in, the reality is quite different.

Plenty of Jewish scouts out there. I didn't grow up in an area with a significant Muslim community so I don't think there were any in my troop, but I remember enough from my various handbooks to know they would have been welcome.

There might be an Abrahamic preference, but I believe members of other, non-Abrahamic faiths would have been welcome as well (I'm not so certain of this as for Abrahamic theists, but fairly sure).


I've been aware of a few mosques, Hindu temples, Buddhist temples, and Sikh temples sponsoring Boy Scout troops. They're all welcomed without question.
 
2012-07-24 11:37:33 PM  

Skywolf Philosopher: I don't think homosexuality is right myself,



I don't think anyone should marry outside their race
 
2012-07-24 11:39:11 PM  
I would send my eagle scout award back, but I was abused and run out of scouting before I got one.

so.....

that.
 
2012-07-24 11:40:02 PM  
Meh.

Who cares? Kids do stupid stuff, even Eagle Scouts.
 
2012-07-24 11:40:55 PM  

BarkingUnicorn: Goes to show that Scouting does turn boys into men with good principles.


Agreed.

And for the record the Girl Scouts are NOT homophobic jerks.

/camp counselor in college
//directors were married in England
///slept in separate tents while girls were around but wore rings and it was never an issue, especially since NO counselor was allowed to be alone with a girl EVER anyway.
////feel sorry for the Boy Scouts who fought for what was right
 
2012-07-24 11:42:06 PM  
I'm sick and tired of all this whining. Don't join Boy Scouts then, go start queer scouts or something.
 
2012-07-24 11:42:11 PM  

BronyMedic: serial_crusher: Ideally I'd like to change the BSA from within, but realistically I haven't been that active in my adult years.

Good luck with that. The structure of the BSA is that of an organization which not only condones religious fundamentalism, but actively works to encourage it. Local member organizations are given a blank slate to run out those who are not religious - Atheists and Agnostics - and it's a rather uncomfortable position for anyone who is NOT a Christian due to their close ties with local churches. On the surface, the BSA tries to appear all inclusive and tolerant, but once you're in, the reality is quite different.


It somewhat varies by region. But, in a lot of the country, the LDS has run the show since the early 90s. They've pretty much taken over BSA district/council leadership around here (a not-notably-Mormon part of the country), partially because no one else really cares enough to volunteer, and partially because they have a lot of sons involved per capita.

So, in some ways they've actually toned down the evangelical fundamentalism that was strong was I was a boy in the 80s. If half the leaders are LDS and a third of the boys are, they aren't going to sit for much non-LDS-theology, but also can't really get too LDS-y, either. So, they instead focus more on generally conservative politics (anti-gay, anti-agnostic, 2nd Amendment NRA brochures, etc).
 
2012-07-24 11:42:37 PM  

BronyMedic: Uh, why does this thread not have the Hero tag?

That takes a lot of balls, and principles to do. The amount of your life you spend earning that Eagle Scout medal is incredible, and to willingly hand it back over their bigotry is a huge step to take.


So the 'Freedom of Association' allowed by the Constitution is wrong and leads to bigotry?

You're pretty farking stupid.
 
2012-07-24 11:43:33 PM  
What type of backwater redneck moron wants to be in the boy scouts anyway?

Let them keep sodomizing themselves.
 
2012-07-24 11:43:44 PM  

BronyMedic: serial_crusher: I disagree with the stupid rules currently in action, but still stand by the organization and its principles. Sending back your Eagle is like moving to Canada because you don't like the guy that got elected as President.

Uh, no.

Sending back your Eagle Medal is like returning your Presidential Medal of Freedom because the Administration is doing something flippiantly idiotic. It's a major statement of protest against their bigotry. Being an Eagle Scout is a big deal in the adult world - it gives you an edge on getting into certain colleges, getting into education programs that are restricted access, getting certain jobs and political appointments, consideration for military rank upon enlistment, and even getting loans and financhial aid.

You're basically saying you accomplished one of the hardest things to do as an adolescent. It signifies that you have commited a substantial amount of years of your life, starting at the age of 11, to completeing the requirements and obtaining over 21 merit badges which each have their own individual, time consuming criteria, that you've served in multiple positions of leadership in your troop, and that you've spent hundreds of hours doing community service projects, not to mention an individual Eagle Scout project which you spend a lot of time and money doing, and has to be approved at a regional level by the BSA. And you have to be done BEFORE your 18th birthday, and have your approval for the award. Otherwise, you become inelegable. Less than 10% of Boy Scouts ever get to the point where they are even considered.

This isn't something you get just for being in Scouts until you're 18. You work your ass off to earn this thing. And it means a LOT outside of scouts.


Hear hear!

I am really disapointed with the BSA decision on this, but I feel like the organization has been very anti-homosexual for a longtime now and I dont think turning in my medal would really do anything to change their minds.
 
2012-07-24 11:43:50 PM  
I never was a boy scout, but I did turn in my Chick Fil-A card.
 
2012-07-24 11:44:51 PM  
Former Eagle Scout. I did this exact thing in protest of a gay boy in my area being tossed out of the Boy Scouts for nothing except being gay.

Wrote a scathing letter to the bsa, and enclosed in the certified-mail box was my Eagle Scout medal, badge, and patch.

Only diff is that i didnt AW about it like this guy is.
 
2012-07-24 11:46:08 PM  
Why is this headline. Two sentences?
 
2012-07-24 11:46:55 PM  
Since we have changed the subject of our Fark driven ridicule. Can I buy Chick-fil-a sandwiches again?
 
2012-07-24 11:47:36 PM  

BKITU: I didn't grow up in an area with a significant Muslim community so I don't think there were any in my troop, but I remember enough from my various handbooks to know they would have been welcome.


heap: abb3w: WorldCitizen: They're a private organization, so they should be allowed to be bigots.

...without government support for them while they're bigots.

kinda my thoughts. they are more than welcome to private their asses out of our schools, municipal functions, and federal funding.

hell, as long as they get federal funding to the extent they do, the pretense of being 'a private organization' is a punchline to a bad joke.


THIS.

They are either private or they aren't. Using federal, state, and municipal resources, and receiving federal funding, and then claiming they can be bigoted fundy assholes because they are a private entity is bullshiat.
 
2012-07-24 11:47:52 PM  

The more you eat the more you fart: Former Eagle Scout. I did this exact thing in protest of a gay boy in my area being tossed out of the Boy Scouts for nothing except being gay.

Wrote a scathing letter to the bsa, and enclosed in the certified-mail box was my Eagle Scout medal, badge, and patch.

Only diff is that i didnt AW about it like this guy is.


The thing is, if you don't make a scene about it, nothing is going to change.

Do you think the BSA actually cares if some kid returns all his badges?

They only care that they are getting bad press. So if you're not giving it to them, they're still farking homosexuals over.
 
2012-07-24 11:48:01 PM  
Eagle Scout earned: Jan 1995.
Eagle Scout returned: Jan 2011
 
2012-07-24 11:48:14 PM  
The amount of herp derp stupidity in the comments is pretty epic.
 
2012-07-24 11:48:25 PM  
Also it is, in an 'aisle seat please' way, got-damned hilarious to see a council full of BSA leaders go into full-on Salem Witch Trials mode with one anonymous phone call accusing one unmarried father/asst scoutmaster of being gay. Seen it happen....
 
2012-07-24 11:48:32 PM  

BKITU: There might be an Abrahamic preference, but I believe members of other, non-Abrahamic faiths would have been welcome as well (I'm not so certain of this as for Abrahamic theists, but fairly sure).


Trust me I look at the list of religious emblems. They got one for just about every one. They acknowledge Zoroastrianism for crying out loud. No medal but still. Still bullshiat that you can't be an atheist. I know that reverent is a part of the pledge but still.
 
2012-07-24 11:48:48 PM  

BKITU: My best friend is an Eagle Scout. I have no idea whether he will be turning in his medal, but during his promotion ceremony, a sparrow landed on my shoulder and stayed there for a few minutes. This was 20 years ago.

I'm sure it's a sign, but I'm not sure of what.


I think it's a sign that birds need to rest occasionally.
 
2012-07-24 11:49:17 PM  

douchebag/hater: BronyMedic: Uh, why does this thread not have the Hero tag?

That takes a lot of balls, and principles to do. The amount of your life you spend earning that Eagle Scout medal is incredible, and to willingly hand it back over their bigotry is a huge step to take.

So the 'Freedom of Association' allowed by the Constitution is wrong and leads to bigotry?

You're pretty farking stupid.


The fark are you going on about?
 
2012-07-24 11:50:19 PM  

BKITU: My best friend is an Eagle Scout. I have no idea whether he will be turning in his medal, but during his promotion ceremony, a sparrow landed on my shoulder and stayed there for a few minutes. This was 20 years ago.

I'm sure it's a sign, but I'm not sure of what.


4.bp.blogspot.com

On your shoulder? Awesome!
 
2012-07-24 11:50:19 PM  
I'm a live and let live person. I honestly could give a fark if someone likes the cack or the crack. But, for the life of me, I'll never understand why a parent should think it's appropriate to send a teen boy or younger into the woods with a stranger/gay man.
 
2012-07-24 11:51:48 PM  

serial_crusher:

The folks who are sending theirs back (ok, it's really just that one guy) are commendable. Being that dedicated to something you believe is a good thing. I'm just saying I wouldn't go that far, and I don't feel it's necessary to go that far. Ideally I'd like to change the BSA from within, but realistically I haven't been that active in my adult years.



Way more then just one guy now: http://boingboing.net/2012/07/23/eagle-scouts-stand-up-to-the-b.html
 
2012-07-24 11:52:19 PM  
I went to Life Scout during my years, never made it to Eagle, though I had started. I'm also a member of the military. As the military just recently changed from "don't ask, don't tell" to "just don't make it awkward," I would assume the boy scouts won't be too awful far behind. People may be trying to condemn them, but its still a very fine organization that teaches kids a lot, and "promotes" pyromaniacs. At least that's how it was back when I was in.

Smeggy Smurf: Of all the troops I was involved with, the military ones were the best. Anything attached to a church was a fustercluck of bullshiat church politics. Having a small detachment from SEAL Team 1 (Kodiak) as assistant scoutmasters was awesome.

/most important thing I learned from Scouting was the proper way to tie knots
//Mrs. Smurf loves I earned my Eagle


We had an ex-marine who was the father of another scout, he made things a blast when camping and at summer camps!
 
2012-07-24 11:52:28 PM  

CuttySupreme: I'm sick and tired of all this whining. Don't join Boy Scouts then, go start queer scouts or something.


Like baseball and the Negro League?

"Whining" wouldn't be necessary if it wasn't for bigots, but sure, blame the victim.
 
2012-07-24 11:53:26 PM  

AverageAmericanGuy: The more you eat the more you fart: Former Eagle Scout. I did this exact thing in protest of a gay boy in my area being tossed out of the Boy Scouts for nothing except being gay.

Wrote a scathing letter to the bsa, and enclosed in the certified-mail box was my Eagle Scout medal, badge, and patch.

Only diff is that i didnt AW about it like this guy is.

The thing is, if you don't make a scene about it, nothing is going to change.

Do you think the BSA actually cares if some kid returns all his badges?

They only care that they are getting bad press. So if you're not giving it to them, they're still farking homosexuals over.


I guess i see the point, but think it means more if something is done independently knowing u arent gonna have news stories about it....and i know of at least 4 other men that were in BSA when i was that have done the same thing.

Less than 2% of scouts earn Eagle. It takes YEARS of work and hundreds of hours of service work, and literally thousands of hours of effort.

Turning in an Eagle Scout medal is giving back something that represents more than a decade of hard work and dedication.
 
2012-07-24 11:53:59 PM  
Now with linky link: http://boingboing.net/2012/07/23/eagle-scouts-stand-up-to-the-b.html

/Why no hero tag on this thread? There should be a hero tag for each and every one of these guys that sends eagle back to those bigots.
 
2012-07-24 11:56:21 PM  

CuttySupreme: I'm sick and tired of all this whining. Don't join Boy Scouts then, go start qQueer sScouts or something.


Sorry, pet peeve.
 
2012-07-24 11:56:41 PM  

ununcle: I'm a live and let live person. I honestly could give a fark if someone likes the cack or the crack. But, for the life of me, I'll never understand why a parent should think it's appropriate to send a teen boy or younger into the woods with a stranger/gay man.


You obviously haven't seen the South Park episode about Big Gay Al getting kicked out of his scout leader position.
 
2012-07-24 11:56:42 PM  
Being gay isn't a choice and gay adults should be able to do whatever they want with other gay adults...including get married, but I think the Boy Scouts are right here. Those that want to allow gay men to go out into the woods with preteen and teen boys seem perfectly willing to put the safety of these kids in peril in the name of political correctness. The simple truth of the matter is that if men that are known to be attracted to young men are put in a position of power over a group of them and then be permitted to take them out to secluded places, abuse of that power is bound to happen. 99% of gay men wanting to serve as scoutmasters would probably serve admirably, but undoubtedly there would be those looking to abuse that power for sexual gratification. The Jerry Sanduskys of the world would all be applying to be scoutmasters.
 
2012-07-24 11:56:51 PM  

LordJiro: The fark are you going on about?


If you google 'Freedom of Association' there's a wealth of information on it. I think that's his point. Good luck on future understanding in all your endeavors.
 
2012-07-24 11:56:54 PM  
The committee, Smith said, represented "a diversity of perspectives and opinions."

No they didn't.
 
2012-07-24 11:57:24 PM  

The more you eat the more you fart: I guess i see the point, but think it means more if something is done independently knowing u arent gonna have news stories about it....and i know of at least 4 other men that were in BSA when i was that have done the same thing.


Means more to who, precisely?
 
2012-07-24 11:57:24 PM  
bufordp.com
 
2012-07-24 11:57:54 PM  

CokeBear: serial_crusher:

The folks who are sending theirs back (ok, it's really just that one guy) are commendable. Being that dedicated to something you believe is a good thing. I'm just saying I wouldn't go that far, and I don't feel it's necessary to go that far. Ideally I'd like to change the BSA from within, but realistically I haven't been that active in my adult years.


Way more then just one guy now: http://boingboing.net/2012/07/23/eagle-scouts-stand-up-to-the-b.html


Myself included, i know of four other eagle scouts that turned in our medals more than a year ago...when a local boy was forced out of boy scouts just because he was gay.

/guess we all did it too early bc we'd be famous if we waited until now.
//or is the principle more important
 
2012-07-24 11:58:27 PM  

NateAsbestos: Why is this headline. Two sentences?


i.somethingawful.com

Rorschach wrote it. Possible homosexual. Must investigate.
 
2012-07-24 11:58:35 PM  

Pumpernickel bread: The Jerry Sanduskys of the world would all be are now and have always been applying to be scoutmasters, teachers, priests, or other positions where they can interact with boys.


Sorry. But that's reality.
 
2012-07-24 11:58:53 PM  

The more you eat the more you fart: I guess i see the point, but think it means more if something is done independently knowing u arent gonna have news stories about it....and i know of at least 4 other men that were in BSA when i was that have done the same thing. Less than 2% of scouts earn Eagle. It takes YEARS of work and hundreds of hours of service work, and literally thousands of hours of effort. Turning in an Eagle Scout medal is giving back something that represents more than a decade of hard work and dedication.


It means more to you; it represents work and dedication to you. The BSA doesn't give a rat's ass, and it won't until the court of public opinion finds out. Thankyou for standing up for our rights, sincerely, but you need to get your name out there or the whole exercise was a waste.
 
2012-07-24 11:59:04 PM  
douchebag/hater: So the 'Freedom of Association' allowed by the Constitution is wrong and leads to bigotry?

You're pretty farking stupid.


Your name describes you accurately.

No one made that argument, at all, and you're a horribly obvious troll. Now, go back to politics.
 
2012-07-24 11:59:07 PM  

GAT_00: Also, again, why is this suddenly a thing? BSOA has had this policy for years.


That. It's been in place as long as I can remember. TFLW doesn't seem to recognize a private organization's power to do bigoted things. Fascinating.

Smeggy Smurf: Of all the troops I was involved with, the military ones were the best.


That. There wasn't a lot else for us to do at some of the places my dad was stationed.

Smeggy Smurf: Anything attached to a church was a fustercluck of bullshiat church politics.


Only was involved with one church-based troop; rather large Catholic church in a suburb in the Northeast. The only politics involved whenever the Catholic school where we met was upset that they had to compete for cafeteria time on Monday nights. Sorry, debate club, you're going to have to meet on Thursdays....

One of the troops I was in overseas was sponsored by a minority men's organization; I think they weren't terribly happy that only a few of us weren't white. (I'm an interesting racial and ethnic mix.)

Smeggy Smurf: Having a small detachment from SEAL Team 1 (Kodiak) as assistant scoutmasters was awesome.


I bet. Heard some interesting stories from crusty vets....Vietnam, a few who'd been in Iran when the Shah fell, etc.

Smeggy Smurf: /most important thing I learned from Scouting was the proper way to tie knots


I'm sure my skills have deteriorated. But I also learned how to cook well enough to make a halfway decent meal.

Smeggy Smurf: //Mrs. Smurf loves I earned my Eagle


My wife couldn't care less. She was a Brownie at one point.
 
2012-07-24 11:59:21 PM  

The more you eat the more you fart: Former Eagle Scout. I did this exact thing in protest of a gay boy in my area being tossed out of the Boy Scouts for nothing except being gay.

Wrote a scathing letter to the bsa, and enclosed in the certified-mail box was my Eagle Scout medal, badge, and patch.

Only diff is that i didnt AW about it like this guy is.


While it's commendable that you did this without trying to gain publicity for the act, I believe that bringing it to the public's attention is just bad publicity that the BSA wouldn't want. So even if these people are AW's for it, it is serving a good purpose.
 
2012-07-24 11:59:35 PM  
On the internet, everyone has earned their Eagle.

Who knew?
 
2012-07-24 11:59:42 PM  

Pumpernickel bread: Those that want to allow gay men to go out into the woods with preteen and teen boys seem perfectly willing to put the safety of these kids in peril in the name of political correctness.


So all gay men are predators. Got it.
 
2012-07-24 11:59:46 PM  
Saying pro-heterosexual is like saying pro-life. Being pro-homosexual rights is not being anti-heterosexual. Hetero's lose nothing by allowing civil rights to gays.
 
2012-07-24 11:59:53 PM  

Pumpernickel bread: Being gay isn't a choice and gay adults should be able to do whatever they want with other gay adults...including get married, but I think the Boy Scouts are right here. Those that want to allow gay men to go out into the woods with preteen and teen boys seem perfectly willing to put the safety of these kids in peril in the name of political correctness. The simple truth of the matter is that if men that are known to be attracted to young men are put in a position of power over a group of them and then be permitted to take them out to secluded places, abuse of that power is bound to happen. 99% of gay men wanting to serve as scoutmasters would probably serve admirably, but undoubtedly there would be those looking to abuse that power for sexual gratification. The Jerry Sanduskys of the world would all be applying to be scoutmasters.


Because Jerry Sandusky is so gay. The wife of 45 years, how totally gay that was.
 
2012-07-25 12:00:01 AM  
xfinity.comcast.net
Oh Canteen Boy you rascal!
 
2012-07-25 12:00:25 AM  

BronyMedic: Being an Eagle Scout is a big deal in the adult world - it gives you an edge on getting into certain colleges, getting into education programs that are restricted access, getting certain jobs and political appointments, consideration for military rank upon enlistment, and even getting loans and financhial aid.


Come on... that's stretching it a bit.

I've never filled out a job application and had a check box that said "Eagle Scout".
The mortgage paperwork I had to fill out didn't ask.
Scouting has never come up in conversation with friends or co-workers, and I don't see any doors that were shut to me because I wasn't an Eagle Scout.

And to be honest, if someone did mention to me they were an Eagle Scout today, my first thought, sadly, would be, "So how's the gay bashing going?" ...even though I know better (some of my family members are Scouts).

That's how bad the mental association between Scouting and bigotry has gotten. This is a real PR nightmare for the 'Scouts.
 
2012-07-25 12:01:40 AM  
well I'm against Scouts cause they're anti drugs.
 
2012-07-25 12:01:43 AM  
My fraternity (Honors, not social or Professional) is a fraternity of Eagle Scouts (Link) and while we are not associated with the BSA in any formal manner, we do disagree with their stance. Our Founders have even stated that should a student come to us, having earned his Eagle but having been kicked out for being gay, we would have accepted him. (As for being kicked out prior to earning, not sure.)

That, and the Council in Minnesota that stands against this policy is kinda cool too.
 
2012-07-25 12:01:45 AM  

MurphyMurphy: On the internet, everyone has earned their Eagle.

Who knew?


Yeah, shiat, I've only heard about Outside from the wikipedia page.
 
2012-07-25 12:02:26 AM  

Aussie_As: The Jerry Sanduskys of the world would all be applying to be scoutmasters.


As if they aren't already!? Are you that delusional, or just trolling?

/A month's TF on the latter.
 
2012-07-25 12:04:34 AM  

FlyingLizardOfDoom: Don't let the door hit you on the way out...


Rather snide response to members of the Scouting community who are actually using that strong spine earning Eagle builds.
 
2012-07-25 12:04:46 AM  

BronyMedic: serial_crusher: Ideally I'd like to change the BSA from within, but realistically I haven't been that active in my adult years.

Good luck with that. The structure of the BSA is that of an organization which not only condones religious fundamentalism, but actively works to encourage it. Local member organizations are given a blank slate to run out those who are not religious - Atheists and Agnostics - and it's a rather uncomfortable position for anyone who is NOT a Christian due to their close ties with local churches. On the surface, the BSA tries to appear all inclusive and tolerant, but once you're in, the reality is quite different.


I would just like to state this varies from troop to troop, council to council. Some have busybody bible-bashing leaders, others don't give a fark.
 
2012-07-25 12:05:02 AM  
Clearly a lot of ethnic or religious groups have been beaten, bullied and killed much more than gays have so why the big deal? Why are gays suddenly such a special cause? It's like the latest fad cause. Save the children, save the cheerleader, save the gays.
 
2012-07-25 12:05:41 AM  
It is nice to see people standing up against religious hate.

Hopefully they will continue this stand against their own churches if they belong to one of the many hateful ones.
 
2012-07-25 12:06:40 AM  
Looks like Farkers have learned a new word: bigot.

I have no problem with either: BSA having a pro-hetero stance, nor the Eagle Scouts sending back their medals. We all make choices in life and our lives are made better, worse or unchanged by them. In this case, the symbolic gesture will only make the Eagle Scouts feel better by making a stand for what they believe, but ultimately will not make their lives any better or worse.

Sorry Farkers, but on this one you're just trolling...
 
2012-07-25 12:07:03 AM  

douchebag/hater: BronyMedic: Uh, why does this thread not have the Hero tag?

That takes a lot of balls, and principles to do. The amount of your life you spend earning that Eagle Scout medal is incredible, and to willingly hand it back over their bigotry is a huge step to take.

So the 'Freedom of Association' allowed by the Constitution is wrong and leads to bigotry?

You're pretty farking stupid.


No possible rational nor honest interpretation of BronyMedic's statement could allow for the conclusion that you have speculated. Did you ask such a question because you are irrational, or did you ask it because you are dishonest?
 
2012-07-25 12:07:15 AM  

douchebag/hater: BronyMedic: Uh, why does this thread not have the Hero tag?

That takes a lot of balls, and principles to do. The amount of your life you spend earning that Eagle Scout medal is incredible, and to willingly hand it back over their bigotry is a huge step to take.

So the 'Freedom of Association' allowed by the Constitution is wrong and leads to bigotry?

You're pretty farking stupid.


Nice strawman you've built yourself there. No one said a farking thing about the constitution.
 
2012-07-25 12:07:47 AM  

Slives: I really hope I can find a troop that at least takes a neutral position on this.


That shouldn't be too hard, just ask Penn and Teller.

/Or former Mormon scouts, who probably have experiences with scouts their own age that'll make anyone blush...
 
2012-07-25 12:07:58 AM  
stiletto_the_wise: Come on... that's stretching it a bit.

I've never filled out a job application and had a check box that said "Eagle Scout".
The mortgage paperwork I had to fill out didn't ask.
Scouting has never come up in conversation with friends or co-workers, and I don't see any doors that were shut to me because I wasn't an Eagle Scout.

And to be honest, if someone did mention to me they were an Eagle Scout today, my first thought, sadly, would be, "So how's the gay bashing going?" ...even though I know better (some of my family members are Scouts).


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eagle_Scout_(Boy_Scouts_of_America)#Afte r _becoming_an_Eagle_Scout

Eagle Scouts are expected to set an example for other Scouts and to become the leaders in life that they have demonstrated themselves to be in Scouting. As such, they are disproportionately represented in the military, service academy graduates, in higher education and academia, major professions, the clergy, business and politics.[36][37] Eagle Scouts who enlist in the U.S. Armed Forces may receive advanced rank in recognition of their achievements.[38][39][40]
Adult Scouters who earned Eagle Scout as a youth may wear a square knot emblem with a red, white, and blue striped square knot above the left shirt pocket; the medal may be worn on formal occasions[23]. Eagle Scouts may join the National Eagle Scout Association (NESA), which serves as a fellowship and communications board for all Eagle Scouts.
NESA directly administers several Eagle Scout scholarships.[41] The American Legion,[42] the National Jewish Committee on Scouting,[43] and the Sons of the American Revolution[44] offer scholarships directed toward Eagle Scouts. Many colleges and universities, local businesses, churches and other organizations may offer similar scholarships.
The Distinguished Eagle Scout Award is given only to Eagle Scouts for distinguished service in their profession and the community for a period of at least 25 years after earning Eagle Scout.

It's a big farking deal.
 
2012-07-25 12:08:52 AM  
I'd say give it a few years. Right now the BSA has their hands full trying to get rid of all the grown men who like boys, so now may not be the best time to also invite in boys and adolescents who like boys. One problem at a time, I guess.
 
2012-07-25 12:09:04 AM  

diaphoresis: ... pro-hetero ...


I'm going to guess that you submitted this, because until this headline, I'd never seen "Pro-heterosexual" before.

Just for the record, you aren't very good at inventing words.
 
2012-07-25 12:09:14 AM  
I AM an Eagle Scout, and this is stupid. It's not like this is a new stance for the Scouts. These Eagle Scouts knew(or should have known) this was policy when they got their medals, and now they turn them back in? What's the point? It would make sense if it was a reversal of ideals, but it's not. Same with the Chick-Fil-A thing. Besides, what does it matter? Chick-Fil-A makes food, not pointy things to skewer gay people, their thoughts about homosexuality, or quantum physics, or is the sky really blue does not affect that. Same with the scouts. They teach real world problem solving, survival skills, integrity, and yes some religion....but who cares, they get the boys away from the TV for a little bit and make them that much better. It's not like (I will preface this with a huge MOST) they are teaching kids that "gay are bad, mmkay", they just, as a private club, decided not to allow openly gay members and leaders. Narrow line, but there it is.
 
2012-07-25 12:09:15 AM  

TOG85: I went to Life Scout during my years, never made it to Eagle, though I had started. I'm also a member of the military. As the military just recently changed from "don't ask, don't tell" to "just don't make it awkward," I would assume the boy scouts won't be too awful far behind. People may be trying to condemn them, but its still a very fine organization that teaches kids a lot, and "promotes" pyromaniacs. At least that's how it was back when I was in.

Smeggy Smurf: Of all the troops I was involved with, the military ones were the best. Anything attached to a church was a fustercluck of bullshiat church politics. Having a small detachment from SEAL Team 1 (Kodiak) as assistant scoutmasters was awesome.

/most important thing I learned from Scouting was the proper way to tie knots
//Mrs. Smurf loves I earned my Eagle

We had an ex-marine who was the father of another scout, he made things a blast when camping and at summer camps!


My dad had an ex-marine as a scoutmaster. Problem was that he had PTSD from Vietnam.... Yeah there are some interesting stories there.
 
2012-07-25 12:09:44 AM  

Pumpernickel bread: Being gay isn't a choice and gay adults should be able to do whatever they want with other gay adults...including get married, but I think the Boy Scouts are right here. Those that want to allow gay men to go out into the woods with preteen and teen boys seem perfectly willing to put the safety of these kids in peril in the name of political correctness. The simple truth of the matter is that if men that are known to be attracted to young men are put in a position of power over a group of them and then be permitted to take them out to secluded places, abuse of that power is bound to happen. 99% of gay men wanting to serve as scoutmasters would probably serve admirably, but undoubtedly there would be those looking to abuse that power for sexual gratification. The Jerry Sanduskys of the world would all be applying to be scoutmasters.


This,,
My daughter has a passion for photography/wedding planner/ have fun , and her first wedding was a gay one. She asked if I had a problem with that and I said no. I have no problem with gay people. I only have a problem with the "agenda' that wants to flip sexuality upside down where it's supposed to be appropriate for a gay man to be surrounded by teen boys in the middle of the woods, yet considered lunacy for a hetero male to be surrounded by teen girls in the woods. Neither one is appropriate. She understood.
 
2012-07-25 12:10:28 AM  

serial_crusher: I disagree with the stupid rules currently in action, but still stand by the organization and its principles. Sending back your Eagle is like moving to Canada because you don't like the guy that got elected as President.


You'd have more of a point if positions at the National Council were elected, or even representatively elected by proxy, based on the vote of the rank and file membership. This is more like moving to Florida because Castro named himself dictator for life. I mean, if we're going to use hyperbole by stupid metaphor, at least get the symbols right.
 
2012-07-25 12:10:50 AM  

stiletto_the_wise: BronyMedic: Being an Eagle Scout is a big deal in the adult world - it gives you an edge on getting into certain colleges, getting into education programs that are restricted access, getting certain jobs and political appointments, consideration for military rank upon enlistment, and even getting loans and financhial aid.

Come on... that's stretching it a bit.

I've never filled out a job application and had a check box that said "Eagle Scout".
The mortgage paperwork I had to fill out didn't ask.
Scouting has never come up in conversation with friends or co-workers, and I don't see any doors that were shut to me because I wasn't an Eagle Scout.

And to be honest, if someone did mention to me they were an Eagle Scout today, my first thought, sadly, would be, "So how's the gay bashing going?" ...even though I know better (some of my family members are Scouts).

That's how bad the mental association between Scouting and bigotry has gotten. This is a real PR nightmare for the 'Scouts.


I do more then my share of hiring (more like recommending to HR, but still, they have to get through me first) and I've seen more then a few list "Eagle Scout" somewhere on their CV. Next time one crosses my desk, I might just interview to ask him if he's sent it back yet. Definitely not hiring any bigots here.

/If there's one thing I can't tolerate, its intolerance.
 
2012-07-25 12:10:51 AM  

BarkingUnicorn: Goes to show that Scouting does turn boys into men with good principles.


Only the ones who leave?
 
2012-07-25 12:12:00 AM  

serial_crusher: platedlizard: Mugato: So uh...do the um, Girl Scouts allow...nothing, nothing.

The Girl Scouts allow LGBTQ members and volunteers, if that's what you're asking.

All couples have to sleep in separate tents, however.

Outrage! I'm going to send back my...eagle...cookie...or whatever it is they give out.


Gold Award. I know this because my high school sweetheart earned it. Then promptly joined the Explorers and got a job at the same Boy Scout camp I worked at.
 
2012-07-25 12:13:17 AM  

Pumpernickel bread: Being gay isn't a choice and gay adults should be able to do whatever they want with other gay adults...including get married, but I think the Boy Scouts are right here. Those that want to allow gay men to go out into the woods with preteen and teen boys seem perfectly willing to put the safety of these kids in peril in the name of political correctness. The simple truth of the matter is that if men that are known to be attracted to young men are put in a position of power over a group of them and then be permitted to take them out to secluded places, abuse of that power is bound to happen. 99% of gay men wanting to serve as scoutmasters would probably serve admirably, but undoubtedly there would be those looking to abuse that power for sexual gratification. The Jerry Sanduskys of the world would all be applying to be scoutmasters.


You have posted this exact comment in a previous discussion. It is no less intellectually dishonest then than it was when you initially posted it.
 
2012-07-25 12:13:41 AM  

Biological Ali: The more you eat the more you fart: I guess i see the point, but think it means more if something is done independently knowing u arent gonna have news stories about it....and i know of at least 4 other men that were in BSA when i was that have done the same thing.

Means more to who, precisely?


How can it "mean more" if nobody knows that highly esteemed members of a bigoted organization are opposing the organization's evil and bigotry? What make changes occur is when those highly esteemed members attack the evil at its root.

Not unlike us here on Fark solving the problems of the world and not letting anyone else know about it.
 
2012-07-25 12:13:51 AM  

BronyMedic: It's a big farking deal.


25-30 years back, far more so. Now? I'm not at the sending back my Eagle level (even though the BSA have been in frequent fight mode with my liberal church), but I'm not putting on my resume either. Because, for a whole lot of Americans (like stilleto_the_wise above mentions), 'reactionary stance' is the first thing they free-associate with Boy Scouts.
 
2012-07-25 12:13:57 AM  

BronyMedic: ...

It's a big farking deal.


OK, so a few scholarships and you get a head start on your rank if you happen to join the military. Hardly the leg up on life some people paint it as.
 
2012-07-25 12:13:58 AM  
if I hand't been fondled as a boy scout, I'd be against this.
 
2012-07-25 12:14:10 AM  
Can't gay boys just join the girl scouts and vis-versa? I'm sure the Scouts could get on board with that.
 
2012-07-25 12:14:20 AM  

RadioAaron: Aussie_As: The Jerry Sanduskys of the world would all be applying to be scoutmasters.

As if they aren't already!? Are you that delusional, or just trolling?

/A month's TF on the latter.


Well you lose, because you have attributed a statement to me I never made. You need to be pointing that one at Pumpernickel Bread. The stuff in italics is the bit where I WAS QUOTING SOMEONE ELSE. The bit NOT in italics is what I said. Please come back when you've actually got the hang of this site.

/Looking forward to my month's TF.
 
2012-07-25 12:14:28 AM  
again, i didn't last too long in scouts, so maybe my experience isn't the norm

were all of you being taken out in the woods with one single solitary adult in charge of your activities?

there were always at least 3 parents, including mothers (complete with mommy parts) involved in herding our retarded little asses around, whether it was camping or any other activity.

do gay people emit 'solitarium' from their pores that somehow changes this situation to where they're able to corral 30 9 year olds in the wilderness themselves, so they may properly roger them?
 
2012-07-25 12:14:29 AM  

Fluorescent Testicle: diaphoresis: ... pro-hetero ...

I'm going to guess that you submitted this, because until this headline, I'd never seen "Pro-heterosexual" before.

Just for the record, you aren't very good at inventing words.


Just for the record, your stupid is showing. Didn't submit, and I simply shortened it using language with my life partner.
 
2012-07-25 12:14:59 AM  

stiletto_the_wise:

And to be honest, if someone did mention to me they were an Eagle Scout today, my first thought, sadly, would be, "So how's the gay bashing going?" ...even though I know better (some of my family members are Scouts).



That's like going up to a white guy and asking how the racism is going. Or a Muslim and asking how the terrorism is going. Guilt by association does not become you.
 
2012-07-25 12:15:01 AM  
kingmust64: I AM an Eagle Scout, and this is stupid. It's not like this is a new stance for the Scouts. These Eagle Scouts knew(or should have known) this was policy when they got their medals, and now they turn them back in? What's the point? It would make sense if it was a reversal of ideals, but it's not. Same with the Chick-Fil-A thing. Besides, what does it matter? Chick-Fil-A makes food, not pointy things to skewer gay people, their thoughts about homosexuality, or quantum physics, or is the sky really blue does not affect that. Same with the scouts. They teach real world problem solving, survival skills, integrity, and yes some religion....but who cares, they get the boys away from the TV for a little bit and make them that much better. It's not like (I will preface this with a huge MOST) they are teaching kids that "gay are bad, mmkay", they just, as a private club, decided not to allow openly gay members and leaders. Narrow line, but there it is.

I think you're missing the point here.

As a private organization with no federal funding, the Scouts are free to do and say what they want. Just like the Klan, The Aryan Nation, and the Nation of Islam are free to say and do what they want.

And, as individuals, we have the right to stand up for what we believe in, and criticise the scouts for the position they have taken. Just because they are a private group, does not give them a free pass for what they do that is discriminatory and bigoted. They deserve to be called out on that.

The reason it matters is because the push a belief that someone is flawed and evil, and worthy of being excluded from something, simply because of a trait they had no control over, and does not define who they are any more than your heterosexuality defines you. That's the tantamount issue here. They are teaching these kids and teenagers to hate someone for their sexual orientation, not the character of their being.
 
2012-07-25 12:15:04 AM  
I grew up camping almost every weekend and most of the summer, clearing land, building, gold mining, fishing, hunting... and in my circle, the scouts were all campfire rings, marshmallows and minivans full of school-type discipline. We were actually out there doing it without all the medals and tush pats. My eagle medal? Having my own commercial fishing business... teaching a series of crewmen to fish effectively... who knows. We certainly didn't need no stinking badges.
 
2012-07-25 12:15:11 AM  
You know who else returned his medals?
www.westernjournalism.com
(picture taken before said medal return but after committing heinous war crimes)
 
2012-07-25 12:16:02 AM  
I was in scouting and made it all the way up to Senior Patrol Leader, before starting an Explorer unit.
Catholic troop (troop 50 St Mary's Menasha WI if I recall)
Yes all us kids did the "circle jerk" in a tent to see who was the biggest.
Had an assistant scoutmaster "Speedy" who was looking back yes gay.
They were called "lifelong bachelors" at the time (late 70's).
But hey at least to this day I can tie my shoes and recite the words to "Kumbaya" from memory...
 
2012-07-25 12:17:04 AM  

Pumpernickel bread: Being atheist isn't a choice and atheist adults should be able to do whatever they want with other atheist adults...including get married, but I think the Boy Scouts are right here. Those that want to allow atheist men to go out into the woods with pre-religious and religious boys seem perfectly willing to put the faith of these kids in peril in the name of political correctness. The simple truth of the matter is that if men that are known to be attracted to deconverting the religious are put in a position of power over a group of them and then be permitted to take them out to secluded places, abuse of that power is bound to happen. 99% of atheist men wanting to serve as scoutmasters would probably serve admirably, but undoubtedly there would be those looking to abuse that power for philosophical gratification. The Richard Dawkinses of the world would all be applying to be scoutmasters.


FTFY.

Over a hundred Eagle Scouts have already returned their Eagle Scout badge over this policy. Doesn't seem to make the news as much, and there's far less justification for it.
 
2012-07-25 12:17:25 AM  

BronyMedic: think you're missing the point here.

As a private organization with no federal funding, the Scouts are free to do and say what they want.


as a 'private organization' that does receive federal funding, this middle ground between private and public hinging on the convenience of the stance at hand is a goddamned joke.
 
2012-07-25 12:17:33 AM  

stiletto_the_wise: BronyMedic: ...

It's a big farking deal.

OK, so a few scholarships and you get a head start on your rank if you happen to join the military. Hardly the leg up on life some people paint it as.


Oh, and this is not meant to diminish the amount of work it takes to become an Eagle Scout. I've seen it--it's a lot of work and dedication. It's just that---well, if I had it, I wouldn't put it on my resume if I was looking for a job in San Francisco :-)
 
2012-07-25 12:18:21 AM  

CuttySupreme: I'm sick and tired of all this whining. Don't join Boy Scouts then, go start queer scouts or something.


This isn't about whether or not we can join or not. See, I am 1) Straight, 2) Too old for the scouts, and 3) Wasn't interested in them even when I was a kid.

My beef is that they are using -our- money and -our- resources to do -their- bigoted fundy thing.
Got why I have a beef now?
 
2012-07-25 12:18:52 AM  

BronyMedic: Less than 10% of Boy Scouts ever get to the point where they are even considered.


As of 2000, it was 2%. And a little over half of that 2% don't make the cut. I was one of the ones that got close but didn't make the cut (though three other members of my patrol (typ. 7 or 8 members, five were the same every year) got Eagle, and my troop usually had a new eagle every 8 or 9 months...T592 was something of a supertroop).

/csb...
 
2012-07-25 12:19:27 AM  

ununcle: Pumpernickel bread: Being gay isn't a choice and gay adults should be able to do whatever they want with other gay adults...including get married, but I think the Boy Scouts are right here. Those that want to allow gay men to go out into the woods with preteen and teen boys seem perfectly willing to put the safety of these kids in peril in the name of political correctness. The simple truth of the matter is that if men that are known to be attracted to young men are put in a position of power over a group of them and then be permitted to take them out to secluded places, abuse of that power is bound to happen. 99% of gay men wanting to serve as scoutmasters would probably serve admirably, but undoubtedly there would be those looking to abuse that power for sexual gratification. The Jerry Sanduskys of the world would all be applying to be scoutmasters.

This,,
My daughter has a passion for photography/wedding planner/ have fun , and her first wedding was a gay one. She asked if I had a problem with that and I said no. I have no problem with gay people. I only have a problem with the "agenda' that wants to flip sexuality upside down where it's supposed to be appropriate for a gay man to be surrounded by teen boys in the middle of the woods, yet considered lunacy for a hetero male to be surrounded by teen girls in the woods. Neither one is appropriate. She understood.


Then either you or Pumpernickel bread should be able to demonstrate that problems result from the British "Scout Association" due to that organization's failure to prohibit membership of homosexual individuals. Please do so.
 
2012-07-25 12:19:29 AM  

Aussie_As: /Looking forward to my month's TF.


On snap. You're right.

You're still not eligible to win, but yeah, good catch. Sorry to mix you up in all of this.
 
2012-07-25 12:19:55 AM  
Don't like it? Go start your own club and leave ours alone.
 
2012-07-25 12:19:58 AM  

serial_crusher: BronyMedic: serial_crusher: I disagree with the stupid rules currently in action, but still stand by the organization and its principles. Sending back your Eagle is like moving to Canada because you don't like the guy that got elected as President.

Uh, no.

Sending back your Eagle Medal is like returning your Presidential Medal of Freedom because the Administration is doing something flippiantly idiotic. It's a major statement of protest against their bigotry. Being an Eagle Scout is a big deal in the adult world...

I meant to add that I'm an Eagle myself. Yes to all those things you said. It's hard work. I earned it fair and square, regardless of some stupid rules I don't agree with, which is why I'm not sending it back.

The folks who are sending theirs back (ok, it's really just that one guy) are commendable. Being that dedicated to something you believe is a good thing. I'm just saying I wouldn't go that far, and I don't feel it's necessary to go that far. Ideally I'd like to change the BSA from within, but realistically I haven't been that active in my adult years.


FTA: Koerth-Baker said she is continuing to get more letters from men who have resigned from the Eagle Scouts. "I actually have another half-dozen letters that I'm going to post later this week," she said.
 
2012-07-25 12:20:34 AM  

Alleyoop: Don't like it? Go start your own club and leave ours alone.


step away from the tax teat, and your wish may be granted.
 
2012-07-25 12:21:13 AM  

Aussie_As: /Looking forward to my month's TF.


I doubt he's gonna make good on the promise, but I did just because I hate it when people do that.
 
2012-07-25 12:21:51 AM  

Aussie_As: Because Jerry Sandusky is so gay. The wife of 45 years, how totally gay that was.


Okay so he's bi. Either that or closeted for 45 years which sounds a lot more likely. By definition the only thing gay means is wanting to have sex with other males. That's it. Whether you're a pedo or are into some specific fetish not does not affect whether you are gay, straight or bi. The only thing that affects it is what gender(s) you have sex with. That's it.
 
2012-07-25 12:21:54 AM  
Here's my Scouting experience: Became a Cub Scout at nine, a Boy Scout at twelve. My Scoutmaster's son took three years to make Eagle, and when he did, Daddy Scoutmaster disbanded the troop, with with only a few months before I'd have made Eagle. Sure, I was Scribe, Quartermaster and Senior Assistant Scoutmaster, but feeling cheated out of making Eagle sometimes gives me pangs even today, fifty years later.
 
2012-07-25 12:22:00 AM  

Slives: I greatly enjoyed Scouting as a kid and would like to get my son into it next year. I really hope I can find a troop that at least takes a neutral position on this. Been trying very hard to not teach him any bigotry and I sure don't need it coming from an organization I am encouraging him to join.


Good for you. I assuming he doesn't attend church either. Letting him wait until after the age of consent to choose a religion is the right way to go. Kudos!
 
2012-07-25 12:22:09 AM  

Dimensio: No possible rational nor honest interpretation of BronyMedic's statement could allow for the conclusion that you have speculated. Did you ask such a question because you are irrational, or did you ask it because you are dishonest?


Dude, look at his username. It's not subtle.

If somebody is posting purely for the purpose of negative attention, just don't give them any. Or if you must reply, reply with something scathingly clever that turns their trolling against them.

Right now he's checking and rechecking the thread to see if people are taking him seriously, and your post just made him happier. Knock it off.
 
2012-07-25 12:22:13 AM  

untaken_name: I doubt he's gonna make good on the promise, but I did just because I hate it when people do that.


Atta boy. ;)
 
2012-07-25 12:22:26 AM  

BronyMedic:

And, as individuals, we have the right to stand up for what we believe in, and criticise the scouts for the position they have taken. Just because they are a private group, does not give them a free pass for what they do that is discriminatory and bigoted. They deserve to be called out on that.

The reason it matters is because the push a belief that someone is flawed and evil, and worthy of being excluded from something, simply because of a trait they had no control over, and does not define who they are any more than your heterosexuality defines you. That's the tantamount issue here. They are teaching these kids and teenagers to hate someone for their sexual orientation, not the character of their being.


All throughout my scouting days, gayness never once came up, I wasn't taught anything about it, one way or another. We concentrated on merit badges and camping. You are also associating freedoms with bigotry. I once tried to join the NAACP, much to my surprise, those racist bigots didn't let my white butt in. Kinda sounds a little like that....again, my point in the Boobies, before I sorta drifted, was that these guys knew(or should have known) the policy when they earned their Eagle Awards, now it kinda seems like grandstanding.
 
2012-07-25 12:22:38 AM  

Pumpernickel bread: Being gay isn't a choice and gay adults should be able to do whatever they want with other gay adults...including get married, but I think the Boy Scouts are right here. Those that want to allow gay men to go out into the woods with preteen and teen boys seem perfectly willing to put the safety of these kids in peril in the name of political correctness. The simple truth of the matter is that if men that are known to be attracted to young men are put in a position of power over a group of them and then be permitted to take them out to secluded places, abuse of that power is bound to happen. 99% of gay men wanting to serve as scoutmasters would probably serve admirably, but undoubtedly there would be those looking to abuse that power for sexual gratification. The Jerry Sanduskys of the world would all be applying to be scoutmasters.


Upon reviewing my history, I have discovered that I am mistaken; you did not post your previous comment in a previous discussion. Instead, another poster presented a similar argument in a previous discussion. However, your repetition of that argument remains intellectually dishonest, unless you are able to demonstrate that problems result in the British Scouting Association, which does not prohibit homosexual membership.
 
2012-07-25 12:23:06 AM  

Gyrfalcon: Biological Ali: The more you eat the more you fart: I guess i see the point, but think it means more if something is done independently knowing u arent gonna have news stories about it....and i know of at least 4 other men that were in BSA when i was that have done the same thing.

Means more to who, precisely?

How can it "mean more" if nobody knows that highly esteemed members of a bigoted organization are opposing the organization's evil and bigotry? What make changes occur is when those highly esteemed members attack the evil at its root.

Not unlike us here on Fark solving the problems of the world and not letting anyone else know about it.


I suspect that he was treating this action as if it were an act of charity rather than protest. "It means more if nobody knows you did it" kind of applies to charitable actions, in that we consider them more meaningful if they were done just for the sake of doing them rather than getting positive attention.

With protest, however, an act which nobody hears about is not inherently better than one which is. All that would accomplish is making the protest less effective.
 
2012-07-25 12:23:20 AM  

jimk777: Okay so he's bi. Either that or closeted for 45 years which sounds a lot more likely.


or maybe he's a goddamned pedophile.
 
2012-07-25 12:24:10 AM  
What a dumb bunch of morons, like returning your worthless medal will do a damn thing to change a PRIVATE ORGANIZATION that you voluntarily joined and voluntarily fought to earn a piece of metal that you don't need to be successful. You failed to read the fine print of a PRIVATE ORGANIZATION. That means they can do what they want and don't have to give a shiate about your farking opinion while still supporting it. So EAGLE scouts that are so offended by a PRIVATE ORGANIZATION that is upholding its own policies, nothing you do with your medal is going to change that. There is nothing against the law about being a PRIVATE ORGANIZATION with your own laws and standards. If you don't want to be a boy scout, don't. If you are gay male and you want to be a boy scout, you can't. That is not against the law or bigotry in any way. Create the LBGT scouts if you want to. Nothing is stopping you.
 
2012-07-25 12:24:26 AM  
There are straight Eagle Scouts?
 
2012-07-25 12:24:54 AM  

serial_crusher: PhiloeBedoe: So, the organization in which grown men take young boys to frolic overnight in the woods and help sew things on their sashes, doesn't like gay people?

To be fair, nobody really cares about sewing merit badges on their sash until they make Eagle, at which point their mom freaks out about having them look presentable, and she's the one who gets stuck sewing the stuff on. So, the sewing part stays as the wimmin's work that it's supposed to be.

/ That's how it went for me anyhow.


Had to sew 'em myself. Same with my regular uniform insignia. Wasn't a big deal, though as a result, I was one of the few Scouts who actually had shirt pockets that worked.

/ Whoever thought it was a good idea to put temporary insignia on a pocket while disallowing velcro needs to have their head examined.
 
2012-07-25 12:25:17 AM  

captcaveman: What a dumb bunch of morons, like returning your worthless medal will do a damn thing to change a PRIVATE ORGANIZATION that you voluntarily joined and voluntarily fought to earn a piece of metal that you don't need to be successful. You failed to read the fine print of a PRIVATE ORGANIZATION. That means they can do what they want and don't have to give a shiate about your farking opinion while still supporting it. So EAGLE scouts that are so offended by a PRIVATE ORGANIZATION that is upholding its own policies, nothing you do with your medal is going to change that. There is nothing against the law about being a PRIVATE ORGANIZATION with your own laws and standards. If you don't want to be a boy scout, don't. If you are gay male and you want to be a boy scout, you can't. That is not against the law or bigotry in any way. Create the LBGT scouts if you want to. Nothing is stopping you.


farm9.staticflickr.com
 
2012-07-25 12:25:40 AM  

Skywolf Philosopher: BarkingUnicorn: Goes to show that Scouting does turn boys into men with good principles.

SHMOOTH

Eh, I don't think homosexuality is right myself, but I do advocate free will. Of course, anyone that is for the topic, why would I be with them?

/In other words, I agrees.


What do you mean by "I don't think homosexuality is right myself"? I'm assuming that if you are not gay that you would not practice homosexuality, and therefore it does not affect you. If this is the case how are your thoughts or feelings regarding homosexuality relevent?
 
2012-07-25 12:26:05 AM  

untaken_name: Aussie_As: /Looking forward to my month's TF.

I doubt he's gonna make good on the promise, but I did just because I hate it when people do that.


As we say in my part of the world, cheers mate.
 
2012-07-25 12:26:18 AM  

captcaveman: What a dumb bunch of morons, like returning your worthless medal will do a damn thing to change a PRIVATE ORGANIZATION that you voluntarily joined and voluntarily fought to earn a piece of metal that you don't need to be successful. You failed to read the fine print of a PRIVATE ORGANIZATION. That means they can do what they want and don't have to give a shiate about your farking opinion while still supporting it. So EAGLE scouts that are so offended by a PRIVATE ORGANIZATION that is upholding its own policies, nothing you do with your medal is going to change that. There is nothing against the law about being a PRIVATE ORGANIZATION with your own laws and standards. If you don't want to be a boy scout, don't. If you are gay male and you want to be a boy scout, you can't. That is not against the law or bigotry in any way. Create the LBGT scouts if you want to. Nothing is stopping you.


they're doing it out of HATE. cause they HATE themselves, and want to see a world where people put on diapers on THEM so they don't have to do ANYTHIGN.
 
2012-07-25 12:26:19 AM  
kingmust64: All throughout my scouting days, gayness never once came up, I wasn't taught anything about it, one way or another. We concentrated on merit badges and camping. You are also associating freedoms with bigotry. I once tried to join the NAACP, much to my surprise, those racist bigots didn't let my white butt in. Kinda sounds a little like that....again, my point in the Boobies, before I sorta drifted, was that these guys knew(or should have known) the policy when they earned their Eagle Awards, now it kinda seems like grandstanding.

So an organization making it a matter of public policy to exclude certain groups of people who have done nothing wrong, and are only done that way because of an inborn characteristic which they have no control over doesn't teach children and teens to discriminate against them?

I wish I lived in a fantasy world like you. It would me much more fun.
 
2012-07-25 12:26:20 AM  

captcaveman: That is not against the law or bigotry in any way.


That troll was kinda sorta plausible up until this sentence. You gotta learn when to quit, kid.
 
2012-07-25 12:26:25 AM  

RadioAaron: untaken_name: I doubt he's gonna make good on the promise, but I did just because I hate it when people do that.

Atta boy. ;)


You really should not welch on your bets. You'll have a hard time finding future action if you're known as a welcher.
 
2012-07-25 12:26:42 AM  

diaphoresis: Just for the record, your stupid is showing. Didn't submit, and I simply shortened it using language with my life partner.


In that case, next time, use quotation marks. Seriously, that's a stupid-as-fark word and we don't need it catching on.
 
2012-07-25 12:26:58 AM  

Fano: PhiloeBedoe: So, the organization in which grown men take young boys to frolic overnight in the woods and help sew things on their sashes, doesn't like gay people?

[i.ytimg.com image 480x360]

Hehe, very clever


WOW! that's great!
 
2012-07-25 12:27:02 AM  

Pumpernickel bread: Being gay isn't a choice and gay adults should be able to do whatever they want with other gay adults...including get married, but I think the Boy Scouts are right here. Those that want to allow gay men to go out into the woods with preteen and teen boys seem perfectly willing to put the safety of these kids in peril in the name of political correctness. The simple truth of the matter is that if men that are known to be attracted to young men are put in a position of power over a group of them and then be permitted to take them out to secluded places, abuse of that power is bound to happen. 99% of gay men wanting to serve as scoutmasters would probably serve admirably, but undoubtedly there would be those looking to abuse that power for sexual gratification. The Jerry Sanduskys of the world would all be applying to be scoutmasters.


You do know that being gay doesn't mean you're a pedophile, right? Or a sexual predator? Or a rapist?
 
2012-07-25 12:27:22 AM  
img137.imageshack.us
 
2012-07-25 12:27:59 AM  

untaken_name: You really should not welch on your bets. You'll have a hard time finding future action if you're known as a welcher.


I get a mulligan when I make stupid mistakes, such as quoting from the wrong post. That wasn't in your contract?
 
2012-07-25 12:28:38 AM  

PhiloeBedoe: So, the organization in which grown men take young boys to frolic overnight in the woods and help sew things on their sashes, doesn't like gay people?


Gays aren't pedophiles, numbnuts.
 
2012-07-25 12:29:05 AM  

BronyMedic: kingmust64: All throughout my scouting days, gayness never once came up, I wasn't taught anything about it, one way or another. We concentrated on merit badges and camping. You are also associating freedoms with bigotry. I once tried to join the NAACP, much to my surprise, those racist bigots didn't let my white butt in. Kinda sounds a little like that....again, my point in the Boobies, before I sorta drifted, was that these guys knew(or should have known) the policy when they earned their Eagle Awards, now it kinda seems like grandstanding.

So an organization making it a matter of public policy to exclude certain groups of people who have done nothing wrong, and are only done that way because of an inborn characteristic which they have no control over doesn't teach children and teens to discriminate against them?

I wish I lived in a fantasy world like you. It would me much more fun.


Hence the now bolded NAACP crack, dude. Good for the goose is NOT good for the gander?
 
2012-07-25 12:29:14 AM  

heap: jimk777: Okay so he's bi. Either that or closeted for 45 years which sounds a lot more likely.

or maybe he's a goddamned pedophile.


I bet he buggers the young lads during the Order of the Arrow ceremony, while dressed as an Indian, of course.
 
2012-07-25 12:29:21 AM  

Alleyoop: Don't like it? Go start your own club and leave ours alone.


For what reason do you support and endorse irrational bigotry?
 
2012-07-25 12:30:07 AM  

jimk777: Aussie_As: Because Jerry Sandusky is so gay. The wife of 45 years, how totally gay that was.

Okay so he's bi. Either that or closeted for 45 years which sounds a lot more likely. By definition the only thing gay means is wanting to have sex with other males. That's it. Whether you're a pedo or are into some specific fetish not does not affect whether you are gay, straight or bi. The only thing that affects it is what gender(s) you have sex with. That's it.


So by your logic, the Girl Guides and the Brownies need to be throwing out any straight men involved with these organisations? Because they are attracted to grown women? Riiiiight.
 
2012-07-25 12:30:31 AM  

Alleyoop: Don't like it? Go start your own club and leave ours alone.


Just as soon as this "private" club stops taking public money.
 
2012-07-25 12:30:32 AM  

thatboyoverthere:
My dad had an ex-marine as a scoutmaster. Problem was that he had PTSD from Vietnam.... Yeah there are some interesting stories there.


Ah hah, I can imagine that. Luckily, the father of the other scout's most previous deployment had been Desert Storm, so nothing near as gruesome as I imagine those were.
 
2012-07-25 12:31:03 AM  

heap: jimk777: Okay so he's bi. Either that or closeted for 45 years which sounds a lot more likely.

or maybe he's a goddamned pedophile.


I haven't read anything about Sandusky having sex with little girls. This probably is too difficult a concept for you to handle but age has nothing to do with gender. Sandusky is a gay or bi pedophile. Pedophilia is simply the form of sex he wants not the gender he wants it with.
 
2012-07-25 12:31:32 AM  

kingmust64: Hence the now bolded NAACP crack, dude. Good for the goose is NOT good for the gander?


White people can join the NAACP. You fail.
 
2012-07-25 12:31:36 AM  

captcaveman: What a dumb bunch of morons, like returning your worthless medal will do a damn thing to change a PRIVATE ORGANIZATION that you voluntarily joined and voluntarily fought to earn a piece of metal that you don't need to be successful. You failed to read the fine print of a PRIVATE ORGANIZATION. That means they can do what they want and don't have to give a shiate about your farking opinion while still supporting it. So EAGLE scouts that are so offended by a PRIVATE ORGANIZATION that is upholding its own policies, nothing you do with your medal is going to change that. There is nothing against the law about being a PRIVATE ORGANIZATION with your own laws and standards. If you don't want to be a boy scout, don't. If you are gay male and you want to be a boy scout, you can't. That is not against the law or bigotry in any way. Create the LBGT scouts if you want to. Nothing is stopping you.


The Boy Scouts of America's policy of prohibiting membership by homosexuals is, in fact, "bigotry". Your claim, therefore is a lie.
 
2012-07-25 12:31:49 AM  

Mistymtnhop: What do you mean by "I don't think homosexuality is right myself"?


i just assumed 'skywolf' was fark's resident name changing furry. redskychaserstormweirdothemagificent, or whatever. that wouldn't even be on a top 10 weirdest things said list if it were the case.
 
2012-07-25 12:31:57 AM  

kingmust64: Hence the now bolded NAACP crack, dude. Good for the goose is NOT good for the gander?


Probably be funnier if there weren't, you know, many hundreds of white members of the NAACP, and I didn't know more than one personally...
 
2012-07-25 12:32:33 AM  

BronyMedic: Local member organizations are given a blank slate to run out those who are not religious - Atheists and Agnostics - and it's a rather uncomfortable position for anyone who is NOT a Christian due to their close ties with local churches.


My troop met in the gymnasium of a Presbyterian church. Most of the membership was Other (Oregon's not exactly a religious place in general), then Episcopalian, Jewish, or Lutheran, in roughly that order of prevalence. It'd be news to me if anybody in my troop actually attended the church we met in except when invited to attend on Scout Sunday, in which a few would go through the motions with our host church to be polite (hey, where else are you going to get free rent for a troop in the 5-15 patrol range?). It would actually be news to me if anyone from my troop actually attended the church we met in regularly. Or any religious service at all outside that once-a-year instance.
 
2012-07-25 12:33:03 AM  

jimk777: Sandusky is a gay or bi pedophile.


Careful... your bigotry is showing.
 
2012-07-25 12:33:10 AM  
How far along in this merit-badge-obtaining process does one get, typically, when he learns to construct his closet?
 
2012-07-25 12:33:44 AM  

jimk777: heap: jimk777: Okay so he's bi. Either that or closeted for 45 years which sounds a lot more likely.

or maybe he's a goddamned pedophile.

I haven't read anything about Sandusky having sex with little girls. This probably is too difficult a concept for you to handle but age has nothing to do with gender. Sandusky is a gay or bi pedophile. Pedophilia is simply the form of sex he wants not the gender he wants it with.


FAIL
under 18 (16-17 in some juristdictions) there is NO classification of who you're having sex with.
 
2012-07-25 12:33:45 AM  

RadioAaron: kingmust64: Hence the now bolded NAACP crack, dude. Good for the goose is NOT good for the gander?

White people can join the NAACP. You fail.


Not in South Texas. LULAC either. also, joke.
 
2012-07-25 12:33:48 AM  

jimk777: I haven't read anything about Sandusky having sex with little girls


i haven't seen anything about sandusky having sex with men, either.

to say he's 'closeted' is implicit - he's a goddamned pedophile. there is no out of the closet for pedophilia, there's just jail for being a sick twisted fark.

that has shiat nor shinola to do with 'gay'. gay men have sex with other men. not children. conflating the two is deliberately goofy.
 
2012-07-25 12:34:18 AM  

Dimensio: Then either you or Pumpernickel bread should be able to demonstrate that problems result from the British "Scout Association" due to that organization's failure to prohibit membership of homosexual individuals. Please do so.


I don't know what you mean.
 
2012-07-25 12:34:20 AM  

kingmust64: I AM an Eagle Scout, and this is stupid. It's not like this is a new stance for the Scouts. These Eagle Scouts knew(or should have known) this was policy when they got their medals, and now they turn them back in? What's the point? It would make sense if it was a reversal of ideals, but it's not. Same with the Chick-Fil-A thing. Besides, what does it matter? Chick-Fil-A makes food, not pointy things to skewer gayblack people, their thoughts about homosexualityAfricans, or quantum physics, or is the sky really blue does not affect that. Same with the scouts. They teach real world problem solving, survival skills, integrity, and yes some religion....but who cares, they get the boys away from the TV for a little bit and make them that much better. It's not like (I will preface this with a huge MOST) they are teaching kids that "gaynegros are bad, mmkay", they just, as a private club, decided not to allow openly gaynegro members and leaders. Narrow line, but there it is.


FTFY
 
2012-07-25 12:34:55 AM  

kingmust64: also, joke troll.


Go away.
 
2012-07-25 12:35:24 AM  

Dimensio: captcaveman: What a dumb bunch of morons, like returning your worthless medal will do a damn thing to change a PRIVATE ORGANIZATION that you voluntarily joined and voluntarily fought to earn a piece of metal that you don't need to be successful. You failed to read the fine print of a PRIVATE ORGANIZATION. That means they can do what they want and don't have to give a shiate about your farking opinion while still supporting it. So EAGLE scouts that are so offended by a PRIVATE ORGANIZATION that is upholding its own policies, nothing you do with your medal is going to change that. There is nothing against the law about being a PRIVATE ORGANIZATION with your own laws and standards. If you don't want to be a boy scout, don't. If you are gay male and you want to be a boy scout, you can't. That is not against the law or bigotry in any way. Create the LBGT scouts if you want to. Nothing is stopping you.

The Boy Scouts of America's policy of prohibiting membership by homosexuals is, in fact, "bigotry". Your claim, therefore is a lie.


Its still a private organization. Your argument is invalid.
 
2012-07-25 12:36:26 AM  

Skywolf Philosopher: Eh, I don't think homosexuality is right myself, but I do advocate free will.


If you believe people should be allowed to live their lives to suit their preferences, you do not believe homosexuality is wrong. You just need to admit it to yourself.
 
2012-07-25 12:37:16 AM  

BronyMedic: serial_crusher: I disagree with the stupid rules currently in action, but still stand by the organization and its principles. Sending back your Eagle is like moving to Canada because you don't like the guy that got elected as President.

Uh, no.

Sending back your Eagle Medal is like returning your Presidential Medal of Freedom because the Administration is doing something flippiantly idiotic. It's a major statement of protest against their bigotry. Being an Eagle Scout is a big deal in the adult world - it gives you an edge on getting into certain colleges, getting into education programs that are restricted access, getting certain jobs and political appointments, consideration for military rank upon enlistment, and even getting loans and financhial aid.

You're basically saying you accomplished one of the hardest things to do as an adolescent. It signifies that you have commited a substantial amount of years of your life, starting at the age of 11, to completeing the requirements and obtaining over 21 merit badges which each have their own individual, time consuming criteria, that you've served in multiple positions of leadership in your troop, and that you've spent hundreds of hours doing community service projects, not to mention an individual Eagle Scout project which you spend a lot of time and money doing, and has to be approved at a regional level by the BSA. And you have to be done BEFORE your 18th birthday, and have your approval for the award. Otherwise, you become inelegable. Less than 10% of Boy Scouts ever get to the point where they are even considered.

This isn't something you get just for being in Scouts until you're 18. You work your ass off to earn this thing. And it means a LOT outside of scouts.


I think the Army will even bump you up to E-2, giving you a 4 month advantage over your peers!
 
2012-07-25 12:37:41 AM  
good.
 
2012-07-25 12:38:04 AM  

kingmust64: also, joke.


netlor.ru
 
2012-07-25 12:38:18 AM  

Skywolf Philosopher: I don't think homosexuality is right myself



It's right if you're a homosexual.
 
2012-07-25 12:38:59 AM  

jimk777: heap: jimk777: Okay so he's bi. Either that or closeted for 45 years which sounds a lot more likely.

or maybe he's a goddamned pedophile.

I haven't read anything about Sandusky having sex with little girls. This probably is too difficult a concept for you to handle but age has nothing to do with gender. Sandusky is a gay or bi pedophile. Pedophilia is simply the form of sex he wants not the gender he wants it with.


Pedophilia, like rape, is non-consensual. It's not about sex. It's about violation and power. Mixing it up with a regular discussion about homosexuality is simply offensive to all non-pedophiles and non-rapists, because what you say about gay men and boys would by definition apply to straight men and girls.
 
2012-07-25 12:39:47 AM  

kingmust64: RadioAaron: kingmust64: Hence the now bolded NAACP crack, dude. Good for the goose is NOT good for the gander?

White people can join the NAACP. You fail.

Not in South Texas. LULAC either. also, joke.


That is an absolute lie.
 
2012-07-25 12:40:02 AM  
Funny the people here calling the scouts bigots are bigots against Christians. Hypocrites.
 
2012-07-25 12:40:15 AM  

Lawnchair: BronyMedic: serial_crusher: Ideally I'd like to change the BSA from within, but realistically I haven't been that active in my adult years.

Good luck with that. The structure of the BSA is that of an organization which not only condones religious fundamentalism, but actively works to encourage it. Local member organizations are given a blank slate to run out those who are not religious - Atheists and Agnostics - and it's a rather uncomfortable position for anyone who is NOT a Christian due to their close ties with local churches. On the surface, the BSA tries to appear all inclusive and tolerant, but once you're in, the reality is quite different.

It somewhat varies by region. But, in a lot of the country, the LDS has run the show since the early 90s. They've pretty much taken over BSA district/council leadership around here (a not-notably-Mormon part of the country), partially because no one else really cares enough to volunteer, and partially because they have a lot of sons involved per capita.

So, in some ways they've actually toned down the evangelical fundamentalism that was strong was I was a boy in the 80s. If half the leaders are LDS and a third of the boys are, they aren't going to sit for much non-LDS-theology, but also can't really get too LDS-y, either. So, they instead focus more on generally conservative politics (anti-gay, anti-agnostic, 2nd Amendment NRA brochures, etc).


The bigoted BS is just that, the 2nd amendment stuff is COMPETELY within the purview of scouting. Remeber that boyscouts was a small offshoot of lord Powell's attempts to teach basic scouting techniques including survival, cooking, tracking, hunting and sharpshooting to both uneducated working class folks and near worthless gentry officers. Basically it's a paramilitary organization dedicated to teaching the youth the skills they would need to be good front line soldiers.
 
2012-07-25 12:40:34 AM  

phrawgh: Slives: I greatly enjoyed Scouting as a kid and would like to get my son into it next year. I really hope I can find a troop that at least takes a neutral position on this. Been trying very hard to not teach him any bigotry and I sure don't need it coming from an organization I am encouraging him to join.

Good for you. I assuming he doesn't attend church either. Letting him wait until after the age of consent to choose a religion is the right way to go. Kudos!


you don't think it might be bigotry of your own to categorically state that all churches espouse bigotry?
 
2012-07-25 12:41:44 AM  

captcaveman: Dimensio: captcaveman: What a dumb bunch of morons, like returning your worthless medal will do a damn thing to change a PRIVATE ORGANIZATION that you voluntarily joined and voluntarily fought to earn a piece of metal that you don't need to be successful. You failed to read the fine print of a PRIVATE ORGANIZATION. That means they can do what they want and don't have to give a shiate about your farking opinion while still supporting it. So EAGLE scouts that are so offended by a PRIVATE ORGANIZATION that is upholding its own policies, nothing you do with your medal is going to change that. There is nothing against the law about being a PRIVATE ORGANIZATION with your own laws and standards. If you don't want to be a boy scout, don't. If you are gay male and you want to be a boy scout, you can't. That is not against the law or bigotry in any way. Create the LBGT scouts if you want to. Nothing is stopping you.

The Boy Scouts of America's policy of prohibiting membership by homosexuals is, in fact, "bigotry". Your claim, therefore is a lie.

Its still a private organization. Your argument is invalid.


Actually, its not.
 
2012-07-25 12:41:55 AM  

Aussie_As: jimk777: heap: jimk777: Okay so he's bi. Either that or closeted for 45 years which sounds a lot more likely.

or maybe he's a goddamned pedophile.

I haven't read anything about Sandusky having sex with little girls. This probably is too difficult a concept for you to handle but age has nothing to do with gender. Sandusky is a gay or bi pedophile. Pedophilia is simply the form of sex he wants not the gender he wants it with.

Pedophilia, like rape, is non-consensual. It's not about sex. It's about violation and power. Mixing it up with a regular discussion about homosexuality is simply offensive to all non-pedophiles and non-rapists, because what you say about gay men and boys would by definition apply to straight men and girls.


I'm pretty sure rape is at least a little bit about sex. I mean, it does involve having sex with someone.
 
2012-07-25 12:42:46 AM  

DempseySR26: Funny the people here calling the scouts bigots are bigots against Christians. Hypocrites.


This.
 
2012-07-25 12:43:26 AM  
My troop never talked religion, or any of this stuff. We also only wore the uniforms at meetings, never in public, thank god. It was pretty much all about camping, and was pretty awesome. I was on the cusp of being an Eagle scout, even did my project, but can't recall what I never got around to.

/whitewater rafting, fishing, backpacking
//no talk about bigotry
 
2012-07-25 12:43:33 AM  
DempseySR26: Funny the people here calling the scouts bigots are bigots against Christians. Hypocrites.

I don't care if you're Christian, Islamic, Jewish, or worship Celestia herself.

Your beliefs don't give you a blank check to actively and unquestioningly exclude or discriminate against anyone for inborn characteristics - be it race, sexual orientation, or ethnic origin. And it's not intolerance to speak out against anyone who would publically hide behind their percieved righteousness and holiness to spout out such nonsense.
 
2012-07-25 12:43:42 AM  
People are just a bunch of braying donkeys with a myopic understanding of life. Who the fark cares about social constructs, morons, that's who. Because they are so farking pathetically stupid, small, and narrow minded that they want to make huge significant differences out of what is essentially nothing of meaning.
 
2012-07-25 12:44:46 AM  

ununcle: Dimensio: Then either you or Pumpernickel bread should be able to demonstrate that problems result from the British "Scout Association" due to that organization's failure to prohibit membership of homosexual individuals. Please do so.

I don't know what you mean.


The British "Boy Scouts of America" analog organization, "The Scouting Association", does not prohibit homosexuals from serving as members. If your concerns are valid, then you should be able to cite data from that British organization as supporting evidence.
 
2012-07-25 12:45:33 AM  

Aussie_As: jimk777: heap: jimk777: Okay so he's bi. Either that or closeted for 45 years which sounds a lot more likely.

or maybe he's a goddamned pedophile.

I haven't read anything about Sandusky having sex with little girls. This probably is too difficult a concept for you to handle but age has nothing to do with gender. Sandusky is a gay or bi pedophile. Pedophilia is simply the form of sex he wants not the gender he wants it with.

Pedophilia, like rape, is non-consensual. It's not about sex. It's about violation and power. Mixing it up with a regular discussion about homosexuality is simply offensive to all non-pedophiles and non-rapists, because what you say about gay men and boys would by definition apply to straight men and girls.


homosexuality isn't about sex either. it's about getting aides!

upload.wikimedia.org
 
2012-07-25 12:45:36 AM  

ununcle: DempseySR26: Funny the people here calling the scouts bigots are bigots against Christians. Hypocrites.

This.


Ah, I see we've moved to the "Your rejection of my bigotry is the real bigotry!" stage of the argument.
 
2012-07-25 12:45:48 AM  

ununcle: DempseySR26: Funny the people here calling the scouts bigots are bigots against Christians. Hypocrites.

This.


Repeating myself from another thread, but the Christian church I attended as a teenager welcomed gay people. So I have no idea what you're talking about. Jesus preached tolerance and love.
 
2012-07-25 12:45:53 AM  

captcaveman: The Boy Scouts of America's policy of prohibiting membership by homosexuals is, in fact, "bigotry". Your claim, therefore is a lie.

Its still a private organization. Your argument is invalid.


So's the Klan.
 
2012-07-25 12:46:48 AM  

Dow Jones and the Temple of Doom: Aussie_As: jimk777: heap: jimk777: Okay so he's bi. Either that or closeted for 45 years which sounds a lot more likely.

or maybe he's a goddamned pedophile.

I haven't read anything about Sandusky having sex with little girls. This probably is too difficult a concept for you to handle but age has nothing to do with gender. Sandusky is a gay or bi pedophile. Pedophilia is simply the form of sex he wants not the gender he wants it with.

Pedophilia, like rape, is non-consensual. It's not about sex. It's about violation and power. Mixing it up with a regular discussion about homosexuality is simply offensive to all non-pedophiles and non-rapists, because what you say about gay men and boys would by definition apply to straight men and girls.

I'm pretty sure rape is at least a little bit about sex. I mean, it does involve having sex with someone.


rape is a consequence by a judge, it doesn't have to do with sex.

i'm suprised nobody brings up that fact, and instead just say it has to do with power.
but no the power comes from a f***** judge.
 
2012-07-25 12:47:00 AM  

captcaveman: Dimensio: captcaveman: What a dumb bunch of morons, like returning your worthless medal will do a damn thing to change a PRIVATE ORGANIZATION that you voluntarily joined and voluntarily fought to earn a piece of metal that you don't need to be successful. You failed to read the fine print of a PRIVATE ORGANIZATION. That means they can do what they want and don't have to give a shiate about your farking opinion while still supporting it. So EAGLE scouts that are so offended by a PRIVATE ORGANIZATION that is upholding its own policies, nothing you do with your medal is going to change that. There is nothing against the law about being a PRIVATE ORGANIZATION with your own laws and standards. If you don't want to be a boy scout, don't. If you are gay male and you want to be a boy scout, you can't. That is not against the law or bigotry in any way. Create the LBGT scouts if you want to. Nothing is stopping you.

The Boy Scouts of America's policy of prohibiting membership by homosexuals is, in fact, "bigotry". Your claim, therefore is a lie.

Its still a private organization. Your argument is invalid.


That it is a private organization does not alter the fact of their bigotry. Your claim remains a lie, and you are therefore a liar. Consequently, I am now curious as to why any claim issued by you should be believed.
 
2012-07-25 12:47:32 AM  

DempseySR26: Funny the people here calling the scouts bigots are bigots against Christians. Hypocrites.


Poor persecuted Christians. Rejecting equality in the name of Jesus since 0.
 
2012-07-25 12:47:41 AM  

Hickory-smoked: captcaveman: The Boy Scouts of America's policy of prohibiting membership by homosexuals is, in fact, "bigotry". Your claim, therefore is a lie.

Its still a private organization. Your argument is invalid.

So's the Klan.


Brilliant observation. I sense a paradigm shift in the discussion thanks to your indelible contribution.
 
2012-07-25 12:48:00 AM  

CuttySupreme: I'm sick and tired of all this whining. Don't join Boy Scouts then, go start queer scouts or something.


False pretense is false. This is about trying to get the National Council to 1) accept the fact that orientation is a nonissue because if you're joining Scouting for the sex, you're doing it wrong, and if they can't do that, then 2) resign.
 
2012-07-25 12:48:25 AM  

WorldCitizen: they should be allowed to be bigots


They are allowed. But the rest of us are likewise allowed to call out their unjust behavior and to hold them accountable for it.
 
2012-07-25 12:49:05 AM  

serial_crusher: BronyMedic: serial_crusher: I disagree with the stupid rules currently in action, but still stand by the organization and its principles. Sending back your Eagle is like moving to Canada because you don't like the guy that got elected as President.

Uh, no.

Sending back your Eagle Medal is like returning your Presidential Medal of Freedom because the Administration is doing something flippiantly idiotic. It's a major statement of protest against their bigotry. Being an Eagle Scout is a big deal in the adult world...

I meant to add that I'm an Eagle myself. Yes to all those things you said. It's hard work. I earned it fair and square, regardless of some stupid rules I don't agree with, which is why I'm not sending it back.

The folks who are sending theirs back (ok, it's really just that one guy) are commendable. Being that dedicated to something you believe is a good thing. I'm just saying I wouldn't go that far, and I don't feel it's necessary to go that far. Ideally I'd like to change the BSA from within, but realistically I haven't been that active in my adult years.


Seriously? You take that much pride in being a farking Eagle scout? I think I was a Weeblo, that means about as much to me now as my Tee-Ball trophy.
 
2012-07-25 12:50:13 AM  

Slives: I greatly enjoyed Scouting as a kid and would like to get my son into it next year. I really hope I can find a troop that at least takes a neutral position on this. Been trying very hard to not teach him any bigotry and I sure don't need it coming from an organization I am encouraging him to join.



So you wouldn't let your son become a scout unless you could be certain that an out homosexual could take him out on a camping trip?

Having an open mind is one thing, setting your children up to be molested is another. Not all out homosexuals are honorable persons who would never abuse a boy.
 
2012-07-25 12:50:43 AM  
Scouts have been a deeply christian organization at least since i was a kid (late 70's)

I remember the scout leader sitting us all down & saying something along the lines of "i know you boys come here just to have fun & play games with your friends, but we are also here to glorify jesus. If you dont love jesus, dont come back."

I was horrified... and never went to another scout meeting.

I also never contribute to scouts... my kids arent in the scouts.

Screw the jesus scouts.

I hear the girl scouts arent as church-oriented though. so i do still buy their cookies.
 
2012-07-25 12:51:21 AM  
25.media.tumblr.com

THUPER!!
 
2012-07-25 12:52:10 AM  

chewd: Scouts have been a deeply christian organization at least since i was a kid (late 70's)

I remember the scout leader sitting us all down & saying something along the lines of "i know you boys come here just to have fun & play games with your friends, but we are also here to glorify jesus. If you dont love jesus, dont come back."

I was horrified... and never went to another scout meeting.

I also never contribute to scouts... my kids arent in the scouts.

Screw the jesus scouts.

I hear the girl scouts arent as church-oriented though. so i do still buy their cookies.


Damn, that sucks. I was in scouts, and nothing anywhere close to that ever happened. It was a completely secular experience for me.
 
2012-07-25 12:52:10 AM  

RadioAaron: DempseySR26: Funny the people here calling the scouts bigots are bigots against Christians. Hypocrites.

Poor persecuted Christians. Rejecting equality in the name of Jesus since 0.


Technically, the Christian ministry didn't pick up steam until about 36 A.D. - the figure you're referring to, assuming he's not apocryphal, was probably born about 3 A.D.

/yeah I know what you're going for
//but but but technically.....
 
2012-07-25 12:52:16 AM  

IamAwake: phrawgh: Slives: I greatly enjoyed Scouting as a kid and would like to get my son into it next year. I really hope I can find a troop that at least takes a neutral position on this. Been trying very hard to not teach him any bigotry and I sure don't need it coming from an organization I am encouraging him to join.

Good for you. I assuming he doesn't attend church either. Letting him wait until after the age of consent to choose a religion is the right way to go. Kudos!

you don't think it might be bigotry of your own to categorically state that all churches espouse bigotry?


Only if they ignore the teachings of the Good Book.
 
2012-07-25 12:52:56 AM  

WeenerGord: So you wouldn't let your son become a scout unless you could be certain that an out homosexual could take him out on a camping trip?


again, are these 1 chaperone camping trips real and if so, what special powers do gay people have that allow them to corral a dozen 11 year olds?

if fear of fondling keeps them in line, i guess i understand, but....yah. beyond that, i'm at a loss.
 
2012-07-25 12:53:35 AM  
browntimmy: Seriously? You take that much pride in being a farking Eagle scout? I think I was a Weeblo, that means about as much to me now as my Tee-Ball trophy.

Yeah, because having your mom pay the 50 buck a year membership fee, and making leather wallets while you set around the camp fire singing kumbiyah is the same as spending years of your life, thousands of hours, and a lot of money earning your Eagle Scout.
 
2012-07-25 12:53:59 AM  

untaken_name: /yeah I know what you're going for
//but but but technically.....


Ya know, I thought about that when going in, but wasn't sure of the proper range. 0 just seemed like a nice jumping off point.

Also, sounds funnier when said out loud. And sort of poignant.
 
2012-07-25 12:54:21 AM  

BronyMedic: inborn characteristics


Stop this. I know you mean well, but we shouldn't discriminate on any irrelevant basis, regardless of whether the condition originated at your birth. While framing sexual orientation as an anti-birthright issue makes the propaganda easier (due to a general acceptance of anti-birthright sentiments the same segments of the population that oppose equality for homosexuals) it's not really the right battle to fight -- you (presumably) wouldn't treat a armless man differently whether he lost his arms before birth or at 8 or at 48, so why does it make any difference whether or not people are "born gay"?
 
2012-07-25 12:54:24 AM  

BronyMedic: Yeah, because having your mom pay the 50 buck a year membership fee, and making leather wallets while you set around the camp fire singing kumbiyah is the same as spending years of your life, thousands of hours, and a lot of money earning your Eagle Scout.


for real, i take no joy in delivering this news, but....yah.

really, to the rest of the adult world, it kinda is.
 
2012-07-25 12:54:31 AM  

Lawnchair: Also it is, in an 'aisle seat please' way, got-damned hilarious to see a council full of BSA leaders go into full-on Salem Witch Trials mode with one anonymous phone call accusing one unmarried father/asst scoutmaster of being gay. Seen it happen....


Meanwhile, the local council I worked for, I recall going into my boss's office (a DE), with that morning's The Oregonian in hand with the Dale verdict as the top front page headline, asking if the Scout Oath and Law changed and nobody bothered to update the manual. Brief conversation (full of facepalming and headshaking later) basically confirmed what I had suspected: At least up to a midrange regional level, things were still sane, and nobody could figure out what kind of ragahol they had access to down in Texas...
 
2012-07-25 12:54:40 AM  

BronyMedic: serial_crusher: I disagree with the stupid rules currently in action, but still stand by the organization and its principles. Sending back your Eagle is like moving to Canada because you don't like the guy that got elected as President.

Uh, no.

Sending back your Eagle Medal is like returning your Presidential Medal of Freedom because the Administration is doing something flippiantly idiotic. It's a major statement of protest against their bigotry. Being an Eagle Scout is a big deal in the adult world - it gives you an edge on getting into certain colleges, getting into education programs that are restricted access, getting certain jobs and political appointments, consideration for military rank upon enlistment, and even getting loans and financhial aid.

You're basically saying you accomplished one of the hardest things to do as an adolescent. It signifies that you have commited a substantial amount of years of your life, starting at the age of 11, to completeing the requirements and obtaining over 21 merit badges which each have their own individual, time consuming criteria, that you've served in multiple positions of leadership in your troop, and that you've spent hundreds of hours doing community service projects, not to mention an individual Eagle Scout project which you spend a lot of time and money doing, and has to be approved at a regional level by the BSA. And you have to be done BEFORE your 18th birthday, and have your approval for the award. Otherwise, you become inelegable. Less than 10% of Boy Scouts ever get to the point where they are even considered.

This isn't something you get just for being in Scouts until you're 18. You work your ass off to earn this thing. And it means a LOT outside of scouts.


Yes. Exactly this.

My Eagle took years of hard work. Volunteering? I stopped counting when I hit 2000 hours in 3 years, volunteering as Council Historian and Curator of the council's museum. That's in addition to hundreds for the church, city, and others. My Eagle project took 600 hours over a year.
I finished off with 36 merit badges, certifications as an instructor for first aid/lifesaving, orienteering, pioneering and marksmanship. I proudly listed that medal right alongside my test scores when applying to college.

I took it off in 2001, when the scandals started to break of Scouts getting abused. I'd worked a year as Scoutmaster for an inner-city troop, and the complete lack of response from National Council was disturbing. They were largely ignoring it, while still holding atheists and gays as the greater evil.

I poured thousands of hours of my life into that uniform, from 1988 to 2001, Cubs on up. I'd held nearly every office you could hold at the Scout level aside from SPL. I'd been Council Staff, proudly represented my home at the Jamboree in 1997, and had put on the plain uniform of a Scoutmaster to continue my service.

I took the Eagle off in 2001, and it hasn't been back since. I'm proud of what I did, but I can't endorse what the organization has become.

/Eagle 1997
//Vigil 1998
 
2012-07-25 12:54:46 AM  

WeenerGord: Slives: I greatly enjoyed Scouting as a kid and would like to get my son into it next year. I really hope I can find a troop that at least takes a neutral position on this. Been trying very hard to not teach him any bigotry and I sure don't need it coming from an organization I am encouraging him to join.


So you wouldn't let your son become a scout unless you could be certain that an out homosexual could take him out on a camping trip?

Having an open mind is one thing, setting your children up to be molested is another. Not all out homosexuals are honorable persons who would never abuse a boy.


So much fail....
 
2012-07-25 12:54:59 AM  

heap: WeenerGord: So you wouldn't let your son become a scout unless you could be certain that an out homosexual could take him out on a camping trip?

again, are these 1 chaperone camping trips real and if so, what special powers do gay people have that allow them to corral a dozen 11 year olds?

if fear of fondling keeps them in line, i guess i understand, but....yah. beyond that, i'm at a loss.


Yeah, on all my scout camping trips, we had a shiatload of scout leaders, and also a lot of parents going along too. It was never a lone scoutmaster deep in the woods with a harem of supple adolescent males.
 
2012-07-25 12:56:13 AM  

Dimensio: ununcle: Dimensio: Then either you or Pumpernickel bread should be able to demonstrate that problems result from the British "Scout Association" due to that organization's failure to prohibit membership of homosexual individuals. Please do so.

I don't know what you mean.

The British "Boy Scouts of America" analog organization, "The Scouting Association", does not prohibit homosexuals from serving as members. If your concerns are valid, then you should be able to cite data from that British organization as supporting evidence.


I have no data, only common sense. Are you saying because the Brits do it I need to find in instace of molestation?
 
2012-07-25 12:56:15 AM  

BronyMedic: DempseySR26: Funny the people here calling the scouts bigots are bigots against Christians. Hypocrites.

I don't care if you're Christian, Islamic, Jewish, or worship Celestia herself.

Your beliefs don't give you a blank check to actively and unquestioningly exclude or discriminate against anyone for inborn characteristics - be it race, sexual orientation, or ethnic origin. And it's not intolerance to speak out against anyone who would publically hide behind their percieved righteousness and holiness to spout out such nonsense.


I don't see how Christians are making holding back any gay person from sticking his manhood in a place where another man evacuates his bowels. All they are saying is what they believe. They aren't keeping gay people from doing anything. Want to get married? Get religion because it's a religious ritual. Then go find a priest, preacher, rabbi, imam, wiccan, tree, cow or whatever and just say your vowels. Leave other people alone. It's not cute.
 
2012-07-25 12:56:26 AM  

BarkingUnicorn: Goes to show that Scouting does turn boys into men with good principles.

 
2012-07-25 12:56:36 AM  
It would be kinda funny if leather queens started giving out merit badges.
Cruise any ten of the various "Eagle" bars, become an "Eagle" scout.
 
2012-07-25 12:56:43 AM  

GAT_00: Mugato: So uh...do the um, Girl Scouts allow...nothing, nothing.

They have a DADT policy.

Also, again, why is this suddenly a thing? BSOA has had this policy for years.


Election year.
 
2012-07-25 12:56:45 AM  

Dow Jones and the Temple of Doom: Yeah, on all my scout camping trips, we had a shiatload of scout leaders, and also a lot of parents going along too. It was never a lone scoutmaster deep in the woods with a harem of supple adolescent males.


that's the thing, i don't remember anybody being up in arms that females were out in the woods with us, complete with all their mommy parts, either.
 
2012-07-25 12:56:58 AM  

ununcle: I'm a live and let live person. I honestly could give a fark if someone likes the cack or the crack. But, for the life of me, I'll never understand why a parent should think it's appropriate to send a teen boy or younger into the woods with a stranger/gay man.


Sandusky was ostensibly straight, so the gay thing is sort of irrelevant. But it is a good idea to learn who the active members of the troop committee are.
 
2012-07-25 12:57:19 AM  

WeenerGord: Slives: I greatly enjoyed Scouting as a kid and would like to get my son into it next year. I really hope I can find a troop that at least takes a neutral position on this. Been trying very hard to not teach him any bigotry and I sure don't need it coming from an organization I am encouraging him to join.


So you wouldn't let your son become a scout unless you could be certain that an out homosexual could take him out on a camping trip?

Having an open mind is one thing, setting your children up to be molested is another. Not all out homosexuals are honorable persons who would never abuse a boy.


/facepalm

So on this basis any straight man involved with the Brownies or Girl Guides needs to be castrated before the next meeting? If you answer 'no' then can you explain your apparent bigotry?

If gay men must be assumed to be molestors of boys, then straight men must equally assumed to be molesters of girls.

Congrats, you've offended all non-predatory men in one go.
 
2012-07-25 12:57:28 AM  
I am getting so sick and tired of the gay community telling people what they should and should not believe as well as think. Being gay is not a normal behavior no matter how much you try to tell me it is. Furthermore there is no reason on earth that will make me think being gay is "ok". Keep the homo out of scouts, for god sakes the organization is gay enough without having actual gays running it.
 
2012-07-25 12:57:29 AM  

WeenerGord: Slives: I greatly enjoyed Scouting as a kid and would like to get my son into it next year. I really hope I can find a troop that at least takes a neutral position on this. Been trying very hard to not teach him any bigotry and I sure don't need it coming from an organization I am encouraging him to join.


So you wouldn't let your son become a scout unless you could be certain that an out homosexual could take him out on a camping trip?

Having an open mind is one thing, setting your children up to be molested is another. Not all out homosexuals are honorable persons who would never abuse a boy.


I'm not sure if you're serious, but on the off chance that you are...

You do realize that gay people are not more likely than straight people to abuse children, even those of the same sex, right? If you're seriously going to go down the "Think of the children" route, the logical conclusion would be to prevent them from having contact with all adults, because you won't actually make them any safer by just removing "out homosexuals" from the picture. Indeed, you'd only be making them slightly less safe if you did that.
 
2012-07-25 12:58:33 AM  

Aussie_As: ununcle: DempseySR26: Funny the people here calling the scouts bigots are bigots against Christians. Hypocrites.

This.

Repeating myself from another thread, but the Christian church I attended as a teenager welcomed gay people. So I have no idea what you're talking about. Jesus preached tolerance and love.


Nice coin flip.
 
2012-07-25 12:59:34 AM  
DempseySR26: I don't see how Christians are making holding back any gay person from sticking his manhood in a place where another man evacuates his bowels. All they are saying is what they believe. They aren't keeping gay people from doing anything. Want to get married? Get religion because it's a religious ritual. Then go find a priest, preacher, rabbi, imam, wiccan, tree, cow or whatever and just say your vowels. Leave other people alone. It's not cute.I'm a complete and utter idiot who cannot/will not understand the difference between the physical act of intercourse, and sexual orientation, and I cannot comprehend and/or accept that marriage is an invariably secular institution in the United States, with significance for certain religions who would like for us to forget the secular part..

Fixed that for you. It's an understandable mistake.
 
2012-07-25 12:59:58 AM  

BronyMedic: DempseySR26: Funny the people here calling the scouts bigots are bigots against Christians. Hypocrites.

I don't care if you're Christian, Islamic, Jewish, or worship Celestia herself.

Your beliefs don't give you a blank check to actively and unquestioningly exclude or discriminate against anyone for inborn characteristics - be it race, sexual orientation, or ethnic origin. And it's not intolerance to speak out against anyone who would publically hide behind their percieved righteousness and holiness to spout out such nonsense.


Massive Brohoof

Rockin
 
2012-07-25 01:00:18 AM  

golem222: I am getting so sick and tired of the gay community telling people what they should and should not believe as well as think. Being gay is not a normal behavior no matter how much you try to tell me it is. Furthermore there is no reason on earth that will make me think being gay is "ok". Keep the homo out of scouts, for god sakes the organization is gay enough without having actual gays running it.


Now that's how you troll.
 
2012-07-25 01:00:24 AM  

Aussie_As: ununcle: I'm a live and let live person. I honestly could give a fark if someone likes the cack or the crack. But, for the life of me, I'll never understand why a parent should think it's appropriate to send a teen boy or younger into the woods with a stranger/gay man.

You obviously haven't seen the South Park episode about Big Gay Al getting kicked out of his scout leader position.


Cripple Fight! A season five classic pretty much every Scouter with a sense of humor (or at least understands the object lesson of the episode) has on their favorites list.
 
2012-07-25 01:00:51 AM  

Biological Ali: jimk777: Sandusky is a gay or bi pedophile.

Careful... your bigotry is showing.


Yeah, it's amazing to me how some people will on the one hand argue that gays are just normal people yet not accept that means that some are not good people either. I find it hilarious how gays or gay rights activists try to do anything to avoid the obvious point that Sandusky is either gay or bi. Yes he by definition is but so what? I just enjoy calling the activist types on their hypocrisy.

Just because of percentage of the population I assume there are plenty more straight pedophiles who go after little girls but Sandusky didn't go after girls. That doesn't have anything to do with how most gay males would behave but also the fact that there are plenty of straight pedophiles doesn't mean most men would wish to have sex with young girls yet I strongly suspect the girl scouts would not just allow a male to take a bunch of teenage girls into the woods. Really all it means though is not that gays can't be scoutmasters but that boy scouts have similar rules about multiple leaders and so on if in fact hey already do not. Probably best anyway since no matter what boy scouts do they're not going to drive out all the closeted gay or bi pedophiles since there will always be the ones such as Sandusky that almost no one knows about.
 
2012-07-25 01:01:10 AM  

kingmust64: BronyMedic:

And, as individuals, we have the right to stand up for what we believe in, and criticise the scouts for the position they have taken. Just because they are a private group, does not give them a free pass for what they do that is discriminatory and bigoted. They deserve to be called out on that.

The reason it matters is because the push a belief that someone is flawed and evil, and worthy of being excluded from something, simply because of a trait they had no control over, and does not define who they are any more than your heterosexuality defines you. That's the tantamount issue here. They are teaching these kids and teenagers to hate someone for their sexual orientation, not the character of their being.

All throughout my scouting days, gayness never once came up, I wasn't taught anything about it, one way or another. We concentrated on merit badges and camping. You are also associating freedoms with bigotry. I once tried to join the NAACP, much to my surprise, those racist bigots didn't let my white butt in. Kinda sounds a little like that....again, my point in the Boobies, before I sorta drifted, was that these guys knew(or should have known) the policy when they earned their Eagle Awards, now it kinda seems like grandstanding.


You're full of shiat.

Here's the NAACP membership signup link:

https://donate.naacp.org/page/contribute/naacp-adult-membership

Go ahead, look at it. Nowhere on there does it even ask what your race is. The page does show pictures of a few white guys, though. This guy look black to you?

donate.naacp.org

And as a former boy scout, I had absolutely no idea they had any such bigoted policy about being gay until MANY years after I aged out. As a long-time atheist who would leave the god bit out of the boy scout oath and made it damn clear that I had no intention of saying it, I KNOW that they didn't care about that back then.
 
2012-07-25 01:02:30 AM  

BronyMedic: DempseySR26: I don't see how Christians are making holding back any gay person from sticking his manhood in a place where another man evacuates his bowels. All they are saying is what they believe. They aren't keeping gay people from doing anything. Want to get married? Get religion because it's a religious ritual. Then go find a priest, preacher, rabbi, imam, wiccan, tree, cow or whatever and just say your vowels. Leave other people alone. It's not cute.I'm a complete and utter idiot who cannot/will not understand the difference between the physical act of intercourse, and sexual orientation, and I cannot comprehend and/or accept that marriage is an invariably secular institution in the United States, with significance for certain religions who would like for us to forget the secular part..

Fixed that for you. It's an understandable mistake.



Funny all I read was derpy derpy dooo.
 
2012-07-25 01:02:50 AM  

Baloo Uriza: ununcle: I'm a live and let live person. I honestly could give a fark if someone likes the cack or the crack. But, for the life of me, I'll never understand why a parent should think it's appropriate to send a teen boy or younger into the woods with a stranger/gay man.

Sandusky was ostensibly straight, so the gay thing is sort of irrelevant. But it is a good idea to learn who the active members of the troop committee are.


Ha! Is that what the gay community believes? Sandusky was a hetero guy giving gays a bad name. OMG!!! Your farked. Wow.
 
2012-07-25 01:03:02 AM  

DarkVader: kingmust64: BronyMedic:

And, as individuals, we have the right to stand up for what we believe in, and criticise the scouts for the position they have taken. Just because they are a private group, does not give them a free pass for what they do that is discriminatory and bigoted. They deserve to be called out on that.

The reason it matters is because the push a belief that someone is flawed and evil, and worthy of being excluded from something, simply because of a trait they had no control over, and does not define who they are any more than your heterosexuality defines you. That's the tantamount issue here. They are teaching these kids and teenagers to hate someone for their sexual orientation, not the character of their being.

All throughout my scouting days, gayness never once came up, I wasn't taught anything about it, one way or another. We concentrated on merit badges and camping. You are also associating freedoms with bigotry. I once tried to join the NAACP, much to my surprise, those racist bigots didn't let my white butt in. Kinda sounds a little like that....again, my point in the Boobies, before I sorta drifted, was that these guys knew(or should have known) the policy when they earned their Eagle Awards, now it kinda seems like grandstanding.

You're full of shiat.

Here's the NAACP membership signup link:

https://donate.naacp.org/page/contribute/naacp-adult-membership

Go ahead, look at it. Nowhere on there does it even ask what your race is. The page does show pictures of a few white guys, though. This guy look black to you?

And as a former boy scout, I had absolutely no idea they had any such bigoted policy about being gay until MANY years after I aged out. As a long-time atheist who would leave the god bit out of the boy scout oath and made it damn clear that I had no intention of saying it, I KNOW that they didn't care about that back then.


That dude doesn't look black, but he's definitely gay.
 
2012-07-25 01:03:35 AM  

DempseySR26: I don't see how Christians are making holding back any gay person from sticking his manhood in a place where another man evacuates his bowels.


Wait...

Wait, wait, WAIT!

Is THIS what those people do!?

Gotta say: this changes everything.
 
2012-07-25 01:03:53 AM  

Biological Ali: golem222: I am getting so sick and tired of the gay community telling people what they should and should not believe as well as think. Being gay is not a normal behavior no matter how much you try to tell me it is. Furthermore there is no reason on earth that will make me think being gay is "ok". Keep the homo out of scouts, for god sakes the organization is gay enough without having actual gays running it.

Now that's how you troll.


Yeah, that was pretty good.
 
2012-07-25 01:04:07 AM  
From the group's statement: "The BSA is a voluntary, private organization ..."

Just like Southern Baptists (except for the black guy they recently elected, OK)
The John Birch Society.
The KKK.
The Citizens' Councils.

Someone should just figure out an alternate way for boys to learn good citizenship and outdoor skills. Either that, or the integrationist forces need to get clever in their protests and rabble-rousing and really force the issue.

/"Integrationist? More like inte-gay-tionist!"
 
2012-07-25 01:04:44 AM  

Pumpernickel bread: Those that want to allow gay men to go out into the woods with preteen and teen boys seem perfectly willing to put the safety of these kids in peril in the name of political correctness.


Two words you might want to look up in the dictionary: "homosexual" and "pedophile." Please note the distinction. Two names you might want to google: "James Dale" and "Jerry Sandusky." Please note the difference between these two individuals.
 
2012-07-25 01:05:23 AM  

jimk777: Yeah, it's amazing to me how some people will on the one hand argue that gays are just normal people yet not accept that means that some are not good people either. I find it hilarious how gays or gay rights activists try to do anything to avoid the obvious point that Sandusky is either gay or bi. Yes he by definition is but so what? I just enjoy calling the activist types on their hypocrisy.


It pays to do a little research before making claims that fall outside one's own spheres of expertise. It can help one avoid making confident assertions that turn out to be laughably wrong.
 
2012-07-25 01:07:01 AM  

RadioAaron: DempseySR26: I don't see how Christians are making holding back any gay person from sticking his manhood in a place where another man evacuates his bowels.

Wait...

Wait, wait, WAIT!

Is THIS what those people do!?

Gotta say: this changes everything.


Well Darwin did hate days. From a science point of view. There is not evolutionary benefit to being gay. Look on the bright side. Religious people here just don't approve of your life style. Waaaaaa they don't approve! Your Muslim pals you fark libs always defend will cut your head off if they found out your gay.
 
2012-07-25 01:07:04 AM  
ununcle: Ha! Is that what the gay community believes? Sandusky was a hetero guy giving gays a bad name. OMG!!! Your farked. Wow.

I hate to break into your tirade, but you do realize that pedophilia is considered, as a matter of both psychiatric study, and pathological basis, completely a separate concept from sexual orientation, right?

There are gay, and there are straight pedophiles. The pedophilic attraction in an offender transcends their sexual orientation, and is based on the age and physical maturity of that particular person's attraction range. Someone who is completely straight can be attracted to the androgynous picture of a three year old boy, and someone who is flamingly gay can be attracted to a nine year old girl.

DempseySR26: Funny all I read was derpy derpy dooo.Funny, all I wrote was derp. Thank you for translating it for the rest of FARK.

FTFY.
 
2012-07-25 01:07:18 AM  
HERO.

Thanks dude.

/Oh, and if God was against gays....why did he make men so they could have such great sex with each other?
 
2012-07-25 01:08:40 AM  

antron: [img137.imageshack.us image 412x284]


Funny you should mention that. Back in the 1990 Brimfrost my troop helped administrativly "blow up" a SOSUS station with simulated C4. They gave the troop a tour of the station without first verifying if the scoutmasters were on the other side. They were.
 
2012-07-25 01:08:46 AM  

BronyMedic: ununcle: Ha! Is that what the gay community believes? Sandusky was a hetero guy giving gays a bad name. OMG!!! Your farked. Wow.

I hate to break into your tirade, but you do realize that pedophilia is considered, as a matter of both psychiatric study, and pathological basis, completely a separate concept from sexual orientation, right?

There are gay, and there are straight pedophiles. The pedophilic attraction in an offender transcends their sexual orientation, and is based on the age and physical maturity of that particular person's attraction range. Someone who is completely straight can be attracted to the androgynous picture of a three year old boy, and someone who is flamingly gay can be attracted to a nine year old girl.

DempseySR26: Funny all I read was derpy derpy dooo.Funny, all I wrote was derp. Thank you for translating it for the rest of FARK.

FTFY.


Look another derp.
 
2012-07-25 01:09:27 AM  

Jon iz teh kewl: I haven't read anything about Sandusky having sex with little girls. This probably is too difficult a concept for you to handle but age has nothing to do with gender. Sandusky is a gay or bi pedophile. Pedophilia is simply the form of sex he wants not the gender he wants it with.

FAIL
under 18 (16-17 in some juristdictions) there is NO classification of who you're having sex with.


Umm, English isn't your first language is it? I never said there was a legal classification for gay or straight pedophiles. You're not seriously trying to argue that it is more or less of a crime and classed according to gender in any jurisdiction, are you? All I said was that by definition being gay is males having sex with males and straight is males having sex only with females. What age you have sex with or what fetish or how you have sex has nothing to do with whether you are gay or straight. As you may not understand, gay or straight is not the crime, pedo is the crime and gay or straight is the orientation of the person committing the crime. So again by definition, Sandusky is either a closeted gay or perhaps bi and the sex he seems to like is the illegal act of having sex with male children.
 
2012-07-25 01:09:33 AM  
DempseySR26: Look another derp.

Do you have anything constructive to contribute, or should I just go ahead and ignore you like the troll you're proving yourself to be?
 
2012-07-25 01:10:24 AM  

Biological Ali: jimk777: Yeah, it's amazing to me how some people will on the one hand argue that gays are just normal people yet not accept that means that some are not good people either. I find it hilarious how gays or gay rights activists try to do anything to avoid the obvious point that Sandusky is either gay or bi. Yes he by definition is but so what? I just enjoy calling the activist types on their hypocrisy.

It pays to do a little research before making claims that fall outside one's own spheres of expertise. It can help one avoid making confident assertions that turn out to be laughably wrong.


Great link. It may well pop up in other threads on similar issues.
 
2012-07-25 01:10:26 AM  
The deputy director of NSA Chris Inglis is an Eagle Scout and, yes, he knows who you all are.
 
2012-07-25 01:10:43 AM  

jimk777: All I said was that by definition being gay is males having sex with males and straight is males having sex only with females.


That's not what being gay is, unless this is a "definition" that you've just made up.
 
2012-07-25 01:11:06 AM  

DempseySR26: [guess who's back]


Shut up, TatsRS6.
 
2012-07-25 01:11:07 AM  

BronyMedic: DempseySR26: Look another derp.

Do you have anything constructive to contribute, or should I just go ahead and ignore you like the troll you're proving yourself to be?


Just ignore me. It's all you dip shiats are good at. farking pathetic.
 
2012-07-25 01:11:28 AM  

Triumph: The deputy director of NSA Chris Inglis is an Eagle Scout and, yes, he knows who you all are.


hell, the honorary president of the boy scouts of america is near.
 
2012-07-25 01:11:50 AM  

DempseySR26: Well Darwin did hate days. From a science point of view. There is not evolutionary benefit to being gay. Look on the bright side. Religious people here just don't approve of your life style. Waaaaaa they don't approve! Your Muslim pals you fark libs always defend will cut your head off if they found out your gay.


lol
 
2012-07-25 01:12:02 AM  

DempseySR26: From a science point of view. There is not evolutionary benefit to being gay.


Thats not necessarily true.

There are numerous possible evolutionary explanations for it.
 
2012-07-25 01:12:02 AM  
Biological Ali: jimk777: All I said was that by definition being gay is males having sex with males and straight is males having sex only with females.

That's not what being gay is, unless this is a "definition" that you've just made up.


Man, it would blow his mind to learn that there are straight men who engage in anal and oral sex with other men, and enjoy anal sex from a replica phallus worn by their partner.
 
2012-07-25 01:12:27 AM  

studebaker hoch: /Oh, and if God was against gays....why did he make men so they could have such great sex with each other?


Note that I have no special words from any deity regarding this (I'm agnostic), but I would imagine it's for the same reason that pig tastes delicious and monogamy is boring - as a test. Again note that I am not promoting any religion, but I have studied the Abrahamic sourcebook and there is a fairly constant thread of "self-denial in life equals rewards in the afterlife".
 
2012-07-25 01:13:25 AM  
DempseySR26: Just ignore me. It's all you dip shiats are good at. farking pathetic.

You sound mad. You really should relax, Dempsy. It's just the internet.

You don't like the thought of being ignored, do you? It must be rather lonely over there, what with the caked on cheetos dust on your fingertips, and that strange stain you just can't seem to get off your keyboard.
 
2012-07-25 01:13:46 AM  
"A 34-year-old grandmother sought by Palmetto police after her grandson allegedly ingested crack cocaine surrendered to authorities Tuesday afternoon, "

Wait, if the crack cocaine was surrendered to the police on Tuesday isn't it there fault for leaving it where the kid could get to it?

hehehe... punctuation much?
 
2012-07-25 01:13:46 AM  
So how come the honorary head of the Boy Scouts of America hasn't turned in his hat and quit ??

Oh, yeah it's an election year and it's Obama.
 
2012-07-25 01:14:40 AM  

Baloo Uriza: Pumpernickel bread: Those that want to allow gay men to go out into the woods with preteen and teen boys seem perfectly willing to put the safety of these kids in peril in the name of political correctness.

Two words you might want to look up in the dictionary: "homosexual" and "pedophile." Please note the distinction. Two names you might want to google: "James Dale" and "Jerry Sandusky." Please note the difference between these two individuals.


2 words you may wanna look up, appropriate and inappropriate. For thousands of years men (hetero) have not been able (legaly) to go out into the woods to teach a group of young girls how to rub sticks together to make heat. Therefore, it will never be appropriate for a gay man to go into said woods to teach young men the facts of life. No matter how much you wish it, it ain't happening. Are you gatting me sweetheart?
 
2012-07-25 01:15:41 AM  

chiett: Oh, yeah it's an election year and it's Obama.


My favourite pizza topping is pepperoni and pineapple.

...

What? That had just as much to do with the discussion as your post did. More, even.
 
2012-07-25 01:16:44 AM  

ununcle: Pumpernickel bread: Being gay isn't a choice and gay adults should be able to do whatever they want with other gay adults...including get married, but I think the Boy Scouts are right here. Those that want to allow gay men to go out into the woods with preteen and teen boys seem perfectly willing to put the safety of these kids in peril in the name of political correctness. The simple truth of the matter is that if men that are known to be attracted to young men are put in a position of power over a group of them and then be permitted to take them out to secluded places, abuse of that power is bound to happen. 99% of gay men wanting to serve as scoutmasters would probably serve admirably, but undoubtedly there would be those looking to abuse that power for sexual gratification. The Jerry Sanduskys of the world would all be applying to be scoutmasters.

This,,
My daughter has a passion for photography/wedding planner/ have fun , and her first wedding was a gay one. She asked if I had a problem with that and I said no. I have no problem with gay people. I only have a problem with the "agenda' that wants to flip sexuality upside down where it's supposed to be appropriate for a gay man to be surrounded by teen boys in the middle of the woods, yet considered lunacy for a hetero male to be surrounded by teen girls in the woods. Neither one is appropriate. She understood.


you're a farking tard. so what should we do about school teachers? many of them interact with young adults of their various sexual persuasion. what about athletic coaches? what about men coaching girls' sport (long bus rides, position of authority, over night stay on road trips, etc)? thinking that a gay man is going to molest a boy is straight out bigotry. turns out that most pedos are outwardly and normatively "straight", they just happen to also be sick sick farks that deserve a shovel to the face.

/she just said that to shut your bigot mouth.
 
2012-07-25 01:17:24 AM  

Alleyoop: Don't like it? Go start your own club and leave ours alone.


The irony being y'all had me on the payroll for five years before I turned 21 and got a job working for that Mitt Romney asshole...worst career move ever, shoulda stayed with the Scouts.
 
2012-07-25 01:18:02 AM  
Pedophilia isn't often tied with gender. Sure, you have people who are into "types" but even those types aren't cemented to gender. Little boys are very similar to little girls, if prepubescent is what you're into.
 
2012-07-25 01:18:14 AM  

BronyMedic: Someone who is completely straight can be attracted to the androgynous picture of a three year old boy, and someone who is flamingly gay can be attracted to a nine year old girl.


I know you're already copping a lot of heat in this thread, but I wanted to know if there's any real scientific backing for this. I always thought this was a bit of popular wisdom that isn't actually true.
 
2012-07-25 01:18:51 AM  

RadioAaron: Pumpernickel bread: Those that want to allow gay men to go out into the woods with preteen and teen boys seem perfectly willing to put the safety of these kids in peril in the name of political correctness.

So all gay men are predators. Got it.


Some gay men are predators, and you know it.

SN1987a goes boom: Hetero's lose nothing by allowing civil rights to gays.


Gay men's civil rights do not include getting access to other people's children. Hetero's could lose a lot if they gave in to political correctness and forced their sons into bad situations. it's a good thing that some parents have better sense than that.

Also did it ever occur to anyone that this could be an insurance decision? Maybe the BSA were forced to enact this policy by their insurance carrier.
 
2012-07-25 01:18:55 AM  

spectrek: Here's my Scouting experience: Became a Cub Scout at nine, a Boy Scout at twelve. My Scoutmaster's son took three years to make Eagle, and when he did, Daddy Scoutmaster disbanded the troop, with with only a few months before I'd have made Eagle.


I'll take "people who I'd like to hit in the face with a brick" for $100, Alex.
 
2012-07-25 01:20:16 AM  
Fluorescent Testicle

Rocket scientist.
Obama is the honorary head of the BSA.
Boys are turning in their medals in protest, so why doesn't a "leader" like Obama do something too ??
See the connection ??


And your favorite topping is baloney.
 
2012-07-25 01:21:25 AM  

DempseySR26: Funny the people here calling the scouts bigots are bigots against Christians. Hypocrites.


Hypocritical Bigoted Christians you mean.

www.chicagonow.com
 
2012-07-25 01:21:58 AM  

ununcle: Baloo Uriza: Pumpernickel bread: Those that want to allow gay men to go out into the woods with preteen and teen boys seem perfectly willing to put the safety of these kids in peril in the name of political correctness.

Two words you might want to look up in the dictionary: "homosexual" and "pedophile." Please note the distinction. Two names you might want to google: "James Dale" and "Jerry Sandusky." Please note the difference between these two individuals.

2 words you may wanna look up, appropriate and inappropriate. For thousands of years men (hetero) have not been able (legaly) to go out into the woods to teach a group of young girls how to rub sticks together to make heat. Therefore, it will never be appropriate for a gay man to go into said woods to teach young men the facts of life. No matter how much you wish it, it ain't happening. Are you gatting me sweetheart?


What's wrong with this? A gay man/woman is just as capable of having a "birds and bees" conversation with their kids (sorry if that came as a shock, but gay people DO have kids) as any other adult.

Man these threads make me depressed. I hope most of the ignorant posters are just trolls but I know in reality there's a lot of closed minded people out there. It's just so sad.
 
2012-07-25 01:22:04 AM  
Good to see there are a few good scouts left out there.
 
2012-07-25 01:22:31 AM  

WeenerGord: Some gay men are predators, and you know it.


Yup. And so are some straight men.

Are you really going with the slippery slope route here? Because you'll just end up looking silly/-ier.
 
2012-07-25 01:23:31 AM  
spamdog: I know you're already copping a lot of heat in this thread, but I wanted to know if there's any real scientific backing for this. I always thought this was a bit of popular wisdom that isn't actually true.

UC Davis Psych department has a rather long dissertation on the topic.

http://psychology.ucdavis.edu/rainbow/html/facts_molestation.html

There are some within the psychology community that argue pedophilia should garner it's own label as a sexual orientation, rather than being treated as a separate paraphilia independant of sexual orientation. The reason for this is that it doesn't fit under any of the currently established criteria for heterosexuality, bisexuality, or homosexuality. Pedophilic attraction is unique - each person who suffers from it is attracted to a specific age range, and a specific sex of child. Even then, their adult sexual attractions can be completely different. There are many pedophiles who target boys who identify as straight, for example.

This is not to justify it as a legitimate and harmless sexual orientation, but rather to simplify the classification of it, and it should be noted that it is completely different than traditional sexual orientation, which involves relationships between two or more consenting teenage or of-age parties.
 
2012-07-25 01:24:11 AM  

WeenerGord: Some gay men are predators, and you know it.


Also, some gay predators pretend to be straight, and will go out of there way to be involved in boys' sports, organizations, clubs, etc.

What do you suppose we do about that?
 
2012-07-25 01:24:56 AM  

RadioAaron: WeenerGord: Some gay men are predators, and you know it.

Yup. And so are some straight men.

Are you really going with the slippery slope route here? Because you'll just end up looking silly/-ier.


Yes, but are straight men allowed to be girl scout troop leaders? I'm honestly asking here, because I have no idea.
 
2012-07-25 01:25:04 AM  

gadian: Pedophilia isn't often tied with gender. Sure, you have people who are into "types" but even those types aren't cemented to gender. Little boys are very similar to little girls, if prepubescent is what you're into.


And this - I'm yet to actually see any evidence that this is the norm.
 
2012-07-25 01:25:36 AM  

captcaveman: There is nothing against the law about being a PRIVATE ORGANIZATION with your own laws and standards


United States Code, Title 36, Chapter 309. The Boy Scouts are a federally chartered, public institution and have been since June 1916.
 
2012-07-25 01:26:47 AM  
what a scout master may look like:

dvdmedia.ign.com
 
2012-07-25 01:26:52 AM  

HeathenHealer: What's wrong with this? A gay man/woman is just as capable of having a "birds and bees" conversation with their kids (sorry if that came as a shock, but gay people DO have kids) as any other adult.

Man these threads make me depressed. I hope most of the ignorant posters are just trolls but I know in reality there's a lot of closed minded people out there. It's just so sad.


Fine, I just don't want you having that conversation with my kids. I'll do that thank you.
 
2012-07-25 01:26:59 AM  

untaken_name: Yes, but are straight men allowed to be girl scout troop leaders? I'm honestly asking here, because I have no idea.


I don't know, are women allowed to be Boy Scout leaders?

/No, seriously, I have no idea on either of these points
//I do know they're pretty equivalent
 
2012-07-25 01:27:44 AM  

stiletto_the_wise: BronyMedic: Being an Eagle Scout is a big deal in the adult world - it gives you an edge on getting into certain colleges, getting into education programs that are restricted access, getting certain jobs and political appointments, consideration for military rank upon enlistment, and even getting loans and financhial aid.

Come on... that's stretching it a bit.

I've never filled out a job application and had a check box that said "Eagle Scout".
The mortgage paperwork I had to fill out didn't ask.
Scouting has never come up in conversation with friends or co-workers, and I don't see any doors that were shut to me because I wasn't an Eagle Scout.

And to be honest, if someone did mention to me they were an Eagle Scout today, my first thought, sadly, would be, "So how's the gay bashing going?" ...even though I know better (some of my family members are Scouts).

That's how bad the mental association between Scouting and bigotry has gotten. This is a real PR nightmare for the 'Scouts.


No one said 'doors were shut' because he was not an Eagle Scout. But I've found being an Eagle does have cache, and still will. I liken it somewhat to being a Mason- there is a connection among those who are members. Being an Eagle Scout is something I've proudly included on resumes and such, and it has often led to memorable conversations and a way to stand out. I've had hiring managers and others liken it to being a military officer...... it shows character, dedication, and work ethic. Agree with the national stance on gays or not, being an Eagle Scout is still a point of pride and achievement.
 
2012-07-25 01:28:28 AM  

BronyMedic: spamdog: I know you're already copping a lot of heat in this thread, but I wanted to know if there's any real scientific backing for this. I always thought this was a bit of popular wisdom that isn't actually true.

UC Davis Psych department has a rather long dissertation on the topic.

http://psychology.ucdavis.edu/rainbow/html/facts_molestation.html

There are some within the psychology community that argue pedophilia should garner it's own label as a sexual orientation, rather than being treated as a separate paraphilia independant of sexual orientation. The reason for this is that it doesn't fit under any of the currently established criteria for heterosexuality, bisexuality, or homosexuality. Pedophilic attraction is unique - each person who suffers from it is attracted to a specific age range, and a specific sex of child. Even then, their adult sexual attractions can be completely different. There are many pedophiles who target boys who identify as straight, for example.

This is not to justify it as a legitimate and harmless sexual orientation, but rather to simplify the classification of it, and it should be noted that it is completely different than traditional sexual orientation, which involves relationships between two or more consenting teenage or of-age parties.


exactly. pedos are their own very farked up and sick group that has nothing to do with what most people understand as sexuality. gay scoutmasters aren't the issue. pedo scoutmaster would be...
 
2012-07-25 01:28:32 AM  
Here's a group that only exists to do good deeds and people attack them because of one of their private beliefs. Unbelievable. Yeah let's attack the ahoy Scouts. Great idea.
 
2012-07-25 01:28:38 AM  

ununcle: Fine, I just don't want you having that conversation with my kids. I'll do that thank you.


Ummm... would you want ANYONE having that conversation with your kid (aside from close family)? Like, anyone else at all?
 
2012-07-25 01:29:18 AM  

browntimmy:
Seriously? You take that much pride in being a farking Eagle scout? I think I was a Weeblo, that means about as much to me now as my Tee-Ball trophy.


And that is exactly why Eagle Scouts take pride in what they earned. No one gives a shiat if you are a weeblo, you show up you are a weeblo. Many people that are Eagle Scouts had opportunities for them early in life that are directly related to being an Eagle Scout. For a lot of people in particular in HR they recognize the commitment and effort that goes into becoming an Eagle Scout, that is something that directly applies to any job. The same goes for education opportunities. Not to mention the projects you work on have direct impacts on local communities, and once you get outside of large cities those projects can have very apparent impacts on the community.

All that being said. Fark Eagle Scouts why are you all so bad at making fires. It does not take 10 minutes to light a fire no matter how you build it. It does not take multiple attempts to light the fire, if it takes multiple attempts to light the fire then you built it wrong (even if it is wet out). You do not need any form of combustible liquid to start a fire, even if it is wet out, unless you are doing it for fun and want to see a fire ball.
 
2012-07-25 01:29:42 AM  

spamdog: gadian: Pedophilia isn't often tied with gender. Sure, you have people who are into "types" but even those types aren't cemented to gender. Little boys are very similar to little girls, if prepubescent is what you're into.

And this - I'm yet to actually see any evidence that this is the norm.


it is if your BI.
rdelagarza.com
 
2012-07-25 01:29:43 AM  

STRYPERSWINE: Here's a group that only exists to do good deeds and people attack them because of one of their private beliefs.


Is this another veiled Christian persecution post? Cuz I think that quota has already been met.
 
2012-07-25 01:29:47 AM  

susansto-helit: That's an admirable thing that they're doing.

I have to say that I'm so glad I was a Girl Scout. They'll take anyone, regardless of religion or sexual orientation. I'm very proud of being associated with that organization. I wish these men returning their Eagle Medals could say the same.


Same. I had a blast as a Girl Scout, even though I dropped out when I entered middle school. Though, the Scouts of today are drastically different than the troops we were in as kids. Can't imagine so many troops now being involved in camping or mechanical engineering stuff. I'm sure a lot of the stuff that I learned as a GS, I'd have learned from my dad (he wanted a boy sooooo bad), but still. I feel like a lot of the badges now are so technology based and less about life lessons and common sense. And selling the shiat out of cookies that are nowhere near as good as they used to be.
 
2012-07-25 01:30:02 AM  

Aussie_As: jimk777: heap: jimk777: Okay so he's bi. Either that or closeted for 45 years which sounds a lot more likely.

or maybe he's a goddamned pedophile.

I haven't read anything about Sandusky having sex with little girls. This probably is too difficult a concept for you to handle but age has nothing to do with gender. Sandusky is a gay or bi pedophile. Pedophilia is simply the form of sex he wants not the gender he wants it with.

Pedophilia, like rape, is non-consensual. It's not about sex. It's about violation and power. Mixing it up with a regular discussion about homosexuality is simply offensive to all non-pedophiles and non-rapists, because what you say about gay men and boys would by definition apply to straight men and girls.


Umm, yes it clearly does apply to straights equally. I've already said that. The funny thing is you are so defensive about gays that you can't even admit in a public forum that Sandusky is gay. By definition if gays are normal people then some are bad. And yeah, pedophilia and rape are really also about sex. That's sort of what Sandusky was doing in the shower.

I always find it humorous how so many activists try to pretend rape is all about power and not also about sex. Self evidently it requires both. Rape or pedophilia is not just some power trip that has nothing to do with sex. Both are also part of a failure in a normal sex drive. Yes, some rapes can be all about power and punishing some woman for example but sex is still involved even in those situations and just because some are mostly about power does not mean all are. It is grossly simplistic to think all rapes occur for the same reason. I think it's pretty idiotic to think for example that most prison rapes are all about power and not about sex. The person being raped could obviously have been beaten or punished in some other manner if the person doing it was not also enjoying the sex aspect of it. The problem is I suppose from the activist point of view they don't want to talk about a screwed up sex drive versus making it into some clinical power problem and pretending sex has nothing to do with it. Like most things sex spans a spectrum of good and bad. Sex is not automatically good and yes, rape and pedophilia are a depraved part of human sexuality. Pretending otherwise is just a joke.

Pedophilia could also include seduction of a child and there are pedophiles who think they actually love the children. That doesn't make it any less of a crime.
 
2012-07-25 01:30:12 AM  

RadioAaron: untaken_name: Yes, but are straight men allowed to be girl scout troop leaders? I'm honestly asking here, because I have no idea.

I don't know, are women allowed to be Boy Scout leaders?

/No, seriously, I have no idea on either of these points
//I do know they're pretty equivalent


Yeah, I mean, that's kind of my point. Not allowing men to be girl scout troop leaders - that would likely stem from a desire to protect adolescent girls from the small subsection of straight males who are sexual predators. It's not saying that all straight men are predators - only that you can't always tell who is one. I believe it's the same rationale for not allowing openly gay men to be boy scout troop leaders. But what I don't know is whether it's a realistic precaution. I just believe that is the rationale, whether it's a good one or not.
 
2012-07-25 01:31:09 AM  
STRYPERSWINE: Here's a group that only exists to do good deeds and people attack them because of one of their private beliefs. Unbelievable. Yeah let's attack the ahoy Scouts. Great idea.

Except they not only made those beliefs public, but instituted them as a matter of organizational policy.

Yes. I should feel sorry for them. Oh, poor, pitiful Scouts.
 
2012-07-25 01:31:33 AM  
gay is about power too.

the only kind of relationship that's not about power is a loving relationship between a man and a woman

go and deny it
but power FEELS HOT
LIKE SEX SEX SEX
 
2012-07-25 01:32:11 AM  

spamdog: And this - I'm yet to actually see any evidence that this is the norm.


Schiffer, 2008 & Chow 2002.
 
2012-07-25 01:32:51 AM  

jimk777: The funny thing is you are so defensive about gays that you can't even admit in a public forum that Sandusky is gay.


That's like saying "You are so defensive about Vietnam that you can't even admit in a public forum that Sandusky is Vietnamese."

Repeating the same false thing over and over again doesn't make it true.
 
2012-07-25 01:33:26 AM  

untaken_name: Yeah, I mean, that's kind of my point. Not allowing men to be girl scout troop leaders - that would likely stem from a desire to protect adolescent girls from the small subsection of straight males who are sexual predators. It's not saying that all straight men are predators - only that you can't always tell who is one. I believe it's the same rationale for not allowing openly gay men to be boy scout troop leaders. But what I don't know is whether it's a realistic precaution. I just believe that is the rationale, whether it's a good one or not.


Objectively speaking, fair enough.

Personally, I'd be more skeptical of the closeted "straight" guy looking to make his way in (pardon the pun) than an openly gay man.
 
2012-07-25 01:34:25 AM  

ununcle: Fine, I just don't want you having that conversation with my kids. I'll do that thank you.


great. do that. but if they happen to ask another adult maybe it's because they sense your hostility to anything not bigoted. or maybe they sense your hatred of sexuality as a topic. scoutmasters aren't there to be sex ed instructors (trust me no adult wants to have that conversation sprung upon them by a random teen, especially one that's not their own). but it does take a village and if the home environment is hostile...
 
2012-07-25 01:35:41 AM  
golem222:

So...should we tell 'em Scouts Canada doesn't give a shiat, or let him keep deluding himself?
 
2012-07-25 01:37:37 AM  

untaken_name: RadioAaron: untaken_name: Yes, but are straight men allowed to be girl scout troop leaders? I'm honestly asking here, because I have no idea.

I don't know, are women allowed to be Boy Scout leaders?

/No, seriously, I have no idea on either of these points
//I do know they're pretty equivalent

Yeah, I mean, that's kind of my point. Not allowing men to be girl scout troop leaders - that would likely stem from a desire to protect adolescent girls from the small subsection of straight males who are sexual predators. It's not saying that all straight men are predators - only that you can't always tell who is one. I believe it's the same rationale for not allowing openly gay men to be boy scout troop leaders. But what I don't know is whether it's a realistic precaution. I just believe that is the rationale, whether it's a good one or not.


Those are two completely different situations. We know that women (in general) are less likely to commit certain kinds of crimes (including rape and sexual assault) than men (in general). So a preference for women over men may have some small practical benefit in that sense.

On the other hand, there is no evidence indicating that gay people are more likely to commit any kind of offense than straight people. As such, a preference for straight people over gay people would yield no benefit, and would be based on nothing more than misinformation or outright bigotry.
 
2012-07-25 01:39:44 AM  
Biological Ali: Those are two completely different situations. We know that women (in general) are less likely to commit certain kinds of crimes (including rape and sexual assault) than men (in general). So a preference for women over men may have some small practical benefit in that sense.

No. We know that sexual assault and instances of molestation and sexual abuse by women are not only vastly under-reported, but that there is an active culture in society which makes this an acceptable thing if the victim is an adolescent boy.
 
2012-07-25 01:39:44 AM  

ununcle: For thousands of years men (hetero) have not been able (legaly) to go out into the woods to teach a group of young girls how to rub sticks together to make heat.


Criticism of the quality of the Girl Scouts' program aside, want to know how I know you've never had anything to do with the Girl Scouts?
 
2012-07-25 01:40:46 AM  

Slives: I greatly enjoyed Scouting as a kid and would like to get my son into it next year. I really hope I can find a troop that at least takes a neutral position on this. Been trying very hard to not teach him any bigotry and I sure don't need it coming from an organization I am encouraging him to join.


If you have a pet dog, why not let him join Dog Scouts of America instead?? They don't discriminate against LGBT, they only discriminate against people without dogs. ;-)
 
2012-07-25 01:41:19 AM  

chiett: Obama is the honorary head of the BSA.


Highlighted the operative word for you there, Einstein.

/I'll stop feeding this one now.
//It amuses the hell out of me when they prove themselves wrong, though.
 
2012-07-25 01:41:43 AM  

Dimensio: Then either you or Pumpernickel bread should be able to demonstrate that problems result from the British "Scout Association" due to that organization's failure to prohibit membership of homosexual individuals. Please do so.


Did you know that the founder of the original, British, Boy Scouts, Lord Baden-Powell, was probably a repressed homosexual?

upload.wikimedia.org

/advocating cold showers since 1908
 
2012-07-25 01:42:59 AM  

ununcle: HeathenHealer: What's wrong with this? A gay man/woman is just as capable of having a "birds and bees" conversation with their kids (sorry if that came as a shock, but gay people DO have kids) as any other adult.

Man these threads make me depressed. I hope most of the ignorant posters are just trolls but I know in reality there's a lot of closed minded people out there. It's just so sad.

Fine, I just don't want you having that conversation with my kids. I'll do that thank you.


Sounds good. Oh, by the way, are you going to go into the schools and make sure that the teacher who's teaching sex-ed to your kids is straight?
 
2012-07-25 01:43:25 AM  

HeathenHealer: What's wrong with this? A gay man/woman is just as capable of having a "birds and bees" conversation with their kids (sorry if that came as a shock, but gay people DO have kids) as any other adult.


Yeah, though Scouting isn't the time or place for that conversation. "Yeah, I'm not having this discussion. Go talk to your dad."
 
2012-07-25 01:44:10 AM  

PhiloeBedoe: So, the organization in which grown men take young boys to frolic overnight in the woods and help sew things on their sashes, doesn't like gay people?


The really ironic part is the founder of Boy Scouts was, himself alleged to be gay. So there you go.
 
2012-07-25 01:44:23 AM  

RadioAaron: I don't know, are women allowed to be Boy Scout leaders?


Yes, and I've seen some real hotties fill out a uniform.
 
2012-07-25 01:45:00 AM  

A Fark Handle: ununcle: Pumpernickel bread: Being gay isn't a choice and gay adults should be able to do whatever they want with other gay adults...including get married, but I think the Boy Scouts are right here. Those that want to allow gay men to go out into the woods with preteen and teen boys seem perfectly willing to put the safety of these kids in peril in the name of political correctness. The simple truth of the matter is that if men that are known to be attracted to young men are put in a position of power over a group of them and then be permitted to take them out to secluded places, abuse of that power is bound to happen. 99% of gay men wanting to serve as scoutmasters would probably serve admirably, but undoubtedly there would be those looking to abuse that power for sexual gratification. The Jerry Sanduskys of the world would all be applying to be scoutmasters.

This,,
My daughter has a passion for photography/wedding planner/ have fun , and her first wedding was a gay one. She asked if I had a problem with that and I said no. I have no problem with gay people. I only have a problem with the "agenda' that wants to flip sexuality upside down where it's supposed to be appropriate for a gay man to be surrounded by teen boys in the middle of the woods, yet considered lunacy for a hetero male to be surrounded by teen girls in the woods. Neither one is appropriate. She understood.

you're a farking tard. so what should we do about school teachers? many of them interact with young adults of their various sexual persuasion. what about athletic coaches? what about men coaching girls' sport (long bus rides, position of authority, over night stay on road trips, etc)? thinking that a gay man is going to molest a boy is straight out bigotry. turns out that most pedos are outwardly and normatively "straight", they just happen to also be sick sick farks that deserve a shovel to the face.

/she just said that to shut your bigot mouth.


You sound angry. Gay people teach, and coach, heck some doctors and lawyers are of the cock persuasion. I don't care. You have me mixed up with someone who hates sex. I don't care if someone prefers what ever they prefer. What I believe is that if someone prefers something, then you don't gift wrap it for them. As a heterosexual male, could I coach the local high school cheer leading team? You bet your ass I could. I would be the best freakin high school cheer leading team coach there ever was. But, as fate has it,,,, I have no lobby in Wasington. Because people hate me. The only reason they won't let me coach these girls is because I'm straight.
 
2012-07-25 01:45:02 AM  

BronyMedic: Biological Ali: Those are two completely different situations. We know that women (in general) are less likely to commit certain kinds of crimes (including rape and sexual assault) than men (in general). So a preference for women over men may have some small practical benefit in that sense.

No. We know that sexual assault and instances of molestation and sexual abuse by women are not only vastly under-reported, but that there is an active culture in society which makes this an acceptable thing if the victim is an adolescent boy.


Even if you account for under-reporting in the most generous manner you plausibly could, you wouldn't even come close to having parity between the two sexes on this.
 
2012-07-25 01:45:05 AM  

Biological Ali: jimk777: Yeah, it's amazing to me how some people will on the one hand argue that gays are just normal people yet not accept that means that some are not good people either. I find it hilarious how gays or gay rights activists try to do anything to avoid the obvious point that Sandusky is either gay or bi. Yes he by definition is but so what? I just enjoy calling the activist types on their hypocrisy.

It pays to do a little research before making claims that fall outside one's own spheres of expertise. It can help one avoid making confident assertions that turn out to be laughably wrong.


It would be even more amazing if you could actually send a relevant link or understand what you read. Non of those ten myths address my comment. I never said gays were more likely to abuse, that all Nazis were gay or any of the other "myths". You just can't seem to accept that gays are not saints but simply normal people and that means some of them have to be bad. So, yes, Sandusky is gay or bi. It only means gender. Show me one example of Sandusky having sex with a little girl. You can't. Being a closeted gay or bi does not make Sandusky a criminal but just because he is a pedophile does not mean he is straight. He went after boys exclusively and not girls. That pretty much proves right there he was gay and nowhere am I saying there are more gay pedophiles than straight pedophiles. Outside of the Catholic church I'm sure there a lot more men having sex with underage girls than with underage boys but that does not make Sandusky any less gay.
 
2012-07-25 01:45:06 AM  
Don't know if it's been pointed out yet...

One word on BSOA..

Webelo
 
2012-07-25 01:45:12 AM  

kingmust64: It's not like (I will preface this with a huge MOST) they are teaching kids that "gay are bad, mmkay", they just, as a private club, decided not to allow openly gay members and leaders. Narrow line, but there it is.


THEY ARE.

You know what raises - considerably - support for gay rights? Knowing someone who is gay. That's why us young'uns support it far more than old people.

Creating an environment in which no "openly" gay person (and that worked SO WELL in the military didn't it) can join or serve is artificially creating a sheltered environment that either purposefully or not will lead more kids to think that being gay is a motherf--king choice.

Again, i was damn impressed when after a five year hiatus I went back to the Girl Scouts as a counselor - the gay directors, counselors, and older out already girls didn't have a pride parade march in the middle of camp, but also had no fear of accidentally mentioning their girlfriend and losing their job or counselor-in-training (older girls) status.

And if the Boy Scouts have policies where a adult is alone with a child then they have bigger things to worry about than openly gay people. For f--ks sake, if a girl woke me up at 2 AM too scared to go to the outhouse, she had to wake up her buddy before I could take them both. Firm rule. Multiple girls to a tent, multiple counselors in our own tent or cabin. I honestly think I was never alone with a girl for that entire summer - except maybe five minutes when a girl tripped and cut her leg as everyone else left lunch. The other counselor ran to get bleach to clean the floor as I patched her up. Five minutes max.

/On the plus side, after dealing with a grumpy as helllll buddy the first night they were woken up, by the end of the week I could generally sleep in peace.
 
2012-07-25 01:45:22 AM  

Baloo Uriza: Yes, and I've seen some real hotties fill out a uniform.


PICS NOW U FOOL
 
2012-07-25 01:46:27 AM  

jimk777: Non of those ten myths address my comment.


Read the first one more carefully. Seriously, read the whole thing. Get back to us when you're done.
 
2012-07-25 01:46:55 AM  

BronyMedic: We know that sexual assault and instances of molestation and sexual abuse by women are not only vastly under-reported, but that there is an active culture in society which makes this an acceptable thing if the victim is an adolescent boy.


Hence, every teacher molestation thread ever where the linked article includes a mugshot also tends to have commentary from subby on whether or not you would hit it.
 
2012-07-25 01:47:38 AM  
I'm just a bigoted redneck heterosexual male, so maybe I'm a little slow. Bear with me.

So any man who rapes boys is a pedophile but IS NOT GAY? Is that right?

While any man who rapes girls is, what, not straight?

I wonder if Jesse Dirkhising would like to be an Eagle Scout? Oh, wait, he's busy being dead after being repeatedly anally raped and then asphixiated by two men who, I'm sure, were NOT GAY.

Nobody is saying that every gay man is going to go after little boys and teen males. But that doesn't mean they need to sleep in the woods with them and be their role models. Ditto with "gay" teens, although how you'd tell a gay teen from any other confused horny teen I have no idea.

If you REALLY think that gay men should be leaders in Scouts, then you are either completely dishonest or just plain stupid. Dumb as a freaking post.
 
2012-07-25 01:48:00 AM  

Biological Ali: Those are two completely different situations.


While true, I would like to point out that I specifically stated that I didn't know if it was a good rationale, only that I believed (and still do) that it was the rationale used to form the policy originally. Whether it should be changed or whether it's correct - that's a whole other discussion, and I don't think we'd disagree if we were to have that discussion.
 
2012-07-25 01:48:27 AM  

Simonsezz: Don't know if it's been pointed out yet...

One word on BSOA..

Webelo


Webelos. Singular same as plural. It's an acronym.
 
2012-07-25 01:49:06 AM  

CuttySupreme: I'm sick and tired of all this whining.


Then STFU!
 
2012-07-25 01:50:03 AM  

bigstoopidbruce: I'm just a bigoted redneck heterosexual male, so maybe I'm a little slow.


Well, you got that much right.
 
2012-07-25 01:50:50 AM  

RadioAaron: Baloo Uriza: Yes, and I've seen some real hotties fill out a uniform.

PICS NOW U FOOL


Sorry, photos I have are from the pre-digital days and I've already packed my negatives away for a pending move.

/Also got some crazy photos from when i got the nickname Baloo...I'm seeing irony considering I was a beanpole more on par with Akela...
 
2012-07-25 01:51:26 AM  

Baloo Uriza: Simonsezz: Don't know if it's been pointed out yet...

One word on BSOA..

Webelo

Webelos. Singular same as plural. It's an acronym.


Yes, I know.

WE'll BE LOyal Scouts.

still blos though.
 
2012-07-25 01:51:41 AM  

ununcle: As a heterosexual male, could I coach the local high school cheer leading team? You bet your ass I could. I would be the best freakin high school cheer leading team coach there ever was.


turns out you can and could because no national cheer organization is banning you.

/there's no national agenda to give gays more rights...
 
2012-07-25 01:51:43 AM  

HeathenHealer: ununcle: HeathenHealer: What's wrong with this? A gay man/woman is just as capable of having a "birds and bees" conversation with their kids (sorry if that came as a shock, but gay people DO have kids) as any other adult.

Man these threads make me depressed. I hope most of the ignorant posters are just trolls but I know in reality there's a lot of closed minded people out there. It's just so sad.

Fine, I just don't want you having that conversation with my kids. I'll do that thank you.

Sounds good. Oh, by the way, are you going to go into the schools and make sure that the teacher who's teaching sex-ed to your kids is straight?


I didn't have to,,, are you gonna make sure the one who teaches yours is gay? Same question. I didn't have to. Do you?
 
2012-07-25 01:52:55 AM  

CuttySupreme: I'm sick and tired of all this whining. Don't join Boy Scouts then, go start queer scouts or something.


I'm sick and tired of assholes like you. Go start Troll Scouts or something.
 
2012-07-25 01:53:17 AM  

bigstoopidbruce: I'm just a bigoted redneck heterosexual male, so maybe I'm a little slow. Bear with me.

So any man who rapes boys is a pedophile but IS NOT GAY? Is that right?

While any man who rapes girls is, what, not straight?


If you boink children, it doesn't matter what gender they are: You're a pedophile regardless of what gender, if any, you're attracted to with adults.

I wonder if Jesse Dirkhising would like to be an Eagle Scout? Oh, wait, he's busy being dead after being repeatedly anally raped and then asphixiated by two men who, I'm sure, were NOT GAY.

Courts in South Carolina and Sweden have ruled that rape is between a man and a woman.
 
2012-07-25 01:53:38 AM  

BronyMedic: Uh, why does this thread not have the Hero tag?

That takes a lot of balls, and principles to do. The amount of your life you spend earning that Eagle Scout medal is incredible, and to willingly hand it back over their bigotry is a huge step to take.


Trolling headline is trolling. Expect no less here.
 
2012-07-25 01:53:55 AM  

bigstoopidbruce: So any man who rapes boys is a pedophile but IS NOT GAY? Is that right?

Not necessarily, no. Gender attraction is much more complicated than Gay or Straight, especially when pedophilia, hebephilia, or infantophila. It may be less subjective in ephebeophiles. Gay / Straight is usually more of a sliding scale anyways.

While any man who rapes girls is, what, not straight?
Either or all of the above.
 
2012-07-25 01:54:19 AM  
Baloo Uriza: BronyMedic: We know that sexual assault and instances of molestation and sexual abuse by women are not only vastly under-reported, but that there is an active culture in society which makes this an acceptable thing if the victim is an adolescent boy.

Hence, every teacher molestation thread ever where the linked article includes a mugshot also tends to have commentary from subby on whether or not you would hit it.


You're talking about a website which actively promotes the belief that not only can teenage boys and men not be raped, but they want it all the time, and they should just be thankful they got some ass rather than feel used and violated.
 
2012-07-25 01:54:51 AM  

Simonsezz: Don't know if it's been pointed out yet...

One word on BSOA..

Webelo


Daddy beat me with a hose. Kicked out of the webelos.
 
2012-07-25 01:55:05 AM  

bigstoopidbruce: I'm just a bigoted redneck heterosexual male, so maybe I'm a little slow.


This was the only part of your post that had even a passing acquaintance with the truth.

I will applaud the accuracy of your username, though.
 
2012-07-25 01:55:05 AM  

Biological Ali: jimk777: All I said was that by definition being gay is males having sex with males and straight is males having sex only with females.

That's not what being gay is, unless this is a "definition" that you've just made up.


Really, go ahead, describe for us what sexual orientation means if it does not mean what gender you are attracted to? You're going to seriously argue it's about what music you like or how you like to dance or what food you like to eat? Notice I am refraining from giving examples of the obvious gay lifestyle stereotypes instead. I hate to tell you this but being gay is not that special. It's about nothing but sexual orientation. Or, are you just a hopeless romantic and upset because I simplified it by describing it as sex and didn't include any romance?
 
2012-07-25 01:55:17 AM  
i read every one of these posts. not really. tl:dr
 
2012-07-25 01:55:40 AM  

A Fark Handle: ununcle: As a heterosexual male, could I coach the local high school cheer leading team? You bet your ass I could. I would be the best freakin high school cheer leading team coach there ever was.

turns out you can and could because no national cheer organization is banning you.

/there's no national agenda to give gays more rights...


Can I take them in the woods? This conversation proves there's an agenda.
 
2012-07-25 01:56:44 AM  

ununcle: HeathenHealer: ununcle: HeathenHealer: What's wrong with this? A gay man/woman is just as capable of having a "birds and bees" conversation with their kids (sorry if that came as a shock, but gay people DO have kids) as any other adult.

Man these threads make me depressed. I hope most of the ignorant posters are just trolls but I know in reality there's a lot of closed minded people out there. It's just so sad.

Fine, I just don't want you having that conversation with my kids. I'll do that thank you.

Sounds good. Oh, by the way, are you going to go into the schools and make sure that the teacher who's teaching sex-ed to your kids is straight?

I didn't have to,,, are you gonna make sure the one who teaches yours is gay? Same question. I didn't have to. Do you?


I don't care they're gay/straight/Bi/Bi-curious. If they are a good teacher i'm fine with them teaching the subject.

Something just popped into my head...My wife has an irrational fear of birds. She seriously believes that someday a bird will peck-out her eyeballs. It's kind of amusing, but I feel bad because she's genuinely afraid of birds getting anywhere near her.

/guess some people are afraid of getting a penis in the rear
 
2012-07-25 01:56:57 AM  

Pumpernickel bread: Being gay isn't a choice and gay adults should be able to do whatever they want with other gay adults...including get married, but I think the Boy Scouts are right here. Those that want to allow gay men to go out into the woods .... other uninformed, blatantly homophobic bullshiat follows, ad infinitum


The simple truth is that the vast majority of pedophiles self-identify as heterosexual, you stupid nonce!!
 
2012-07-25 01:58:50 AM  

RealFarknMcCoy2: Pumpernickel bread: Being gay isn't a choice and gay adults should be able to do whatever they want with other gay adults...including get married, but I think the Boy Scouts are right here. Those that want to allow gay men to go out into the woods .... other uninformed, blatantly homophobic bullshiat follows, ad infinitum

The simple truth is that the vast majority of pedophiles self-identify as heterosexual, you stupid nonce!!


Could that have anything to do with the vast majority of people self-identifying as heterosexual?
 
2012-07-25 01:58:51 AM  
jimk777: Really, go ahead, describe for us what sexual orientation means if it does not mean what gender you are attracted to? You're going to seriously argue it's about what music you like or how you like to dance or what food you like to eat? Notice I am refraining from giving examples of the obvious gay lifestyle stereotypes instead. I hate to tell you this but being gay is not that special. It's about nothing but sexual orientation. Or, are you just a hopeless romantic and upset because I simplified it by describing it as sex and didn't include any romance?

You do realize that you can be a straight male, attracted to women, and have a paraphilic attraction to oral or anal sex with another male (cuckolding fetish), or to being penetrated by a phallic object strapped to your female partner (pegging), right?

You can also be a gay man, and regularly engage in heterosexual intercorse with a female partner, and be arroused and achieve orgasm, as most gay men do for years before admitting their orientation to themselves and others.
 
2012-07-25 01:59:31 AM  
jimk777

At this point I have no choice left but to conclude that you're either a troll or somebody who lacks the basic cognitive functionality needed to understand simple statements and arguments.

Either way, I'm not going to waste any more energy attempting to correct the nonsense you've been spewing.
 
2012-07-25 02:00:11 AM  
Bigotry is as bad as it gets. This is a really simple situation. If you promote or allow bigotry, you're a farking idiot. If you don't, congrats, whatever your flaws, you're at least not THAT stupid.
 
2012-07-25 02:01:08 AM  

ununcle: A Fark Handle: ununcle: As a heterosexual male, could I coach the local high school cheer leading team? You bet your ass I could. I would be the best freakin high school cheer leading team coach there ever was.

turns out you can and could because no national cheer organization is banning you.

Can I take them in the woods? This conversation proves there's an agenda.


can you take your daughter's/son's cheer/soccer/basketball/baseball/softball team across state lines to a regional tournament? yes. can you stay in the same hotel as that whole team? yes. does that prove there's an agenda?

/why are the woods so scary in your eyes?
 
2012-07-25 02:04:08 AM  

StreetlightInTheGhetto: And if the Boy Scouts have policies where a adult is alone with a child then they have bigger things to worry about than openly gay people.


This.
 
2012-07-25 02:05:16 AM  

BronyMedic: spamdog: I know you're already copping a lot of heat in this thread, but I wanted to know if there's any real scientific backing for this. I always thought this was a bit of popular wisdom that isn't actually true.

UC Davis Psych department has a rather long dissertation on the topic.

http://psychology.ucdavis.edu/rainbow/html/facts_molestation.html

There are some within the psychology community that argue pedophilia should garner it's own label as a sexual orientation, rather than being treated as a separate paraphilia independant of sexual orientation. The reason for this is that it doesn't fit under any of the currently established criteria for heterosexuality, bisexuality, or homosexuality. Pedophilic attraction is unique - each person who suffers from it is attracted to a specific age range, and a specific sex of child. Even then, their adult sexual attractions can be completely different. There are many pedophiles who target boys who identify as straight, for example.

This is not to justify it as a legitimate and harmless sexual orientation, but rather to simplify the classification of it, and it should be noted that it is completely different than traditional sexual orientation, which involves relationships between two or more consenting teenage or of-age parties.


Yeah. You know the problem with that is the key phrase "some withing the psychology community." Leaving aside the news that it is a community versus some psychologists or some researchers the problem is that in any given year there are some within the psychological "community" that believe any number of things that next year or next decade are determined to be complete crap. I wouldn't be surprised if there are "some" somewhere that still think Freud was right just as there are "some" people who think the world is literally flat. Nothing makes any of those statements particularly relevant beyond the fact that "some" people are also all the time coming up with great ideas while stoned.
 
2012-07-25 02:05:33 AM  
Boing Boing writer Maggie Koerth-Baker Boobiesed a story about how her husband, Christopher Baker, a former Eagle Scout, returned his medal to the Boy Scouts of America.

Yeah, I'm sure being married to an obnoxious naggy ultra liberal woman had no impact on his decision....

"Have you sent the medal back yet?!"
"I don't really want to, it took me a long time to get it...."
"SEND IT BACK!! SEND IT NOW!! I WANT TO WRITE MY STORY!!"

As far as the boy scouts, I'm sure they couldn't care less. After the pedophilia incidents they had a few years pack they wouldn't touch a gay with a ten foot pole wrapped in a condom.
 
2012-07-25 02:05:47 AM  

A Fark Handle: /why are the woods so scary in your eyes?


I presume it's because of the increased privacy and lack of unrelated bystanders. Do you really believe that a school group staying in a hotel and a group of campers in the woods is typically equivalent? I mean, I'm not on the BSA's side here, but even I can see the difference.
 
2012-07-25 02:08:21 AM  

Slives: I greatly enjoyed Scouting as a kid and would like to get my son into it next year. I really hope I can find a troop that at least takes a neutral position on this. Been trying very hard to not teach him any bigotry and I sure don't need it coming from an organization I am encouraging him to join.


There are non-discriminatory troops. I used to work with a woman who's son was a scout, and when she would beg for money she would always highlight that his was a non-discriminatory troop. Nice lady. Nice kid.
 
2012-07-25 02:08:41 AM  

BronyMedic: Biological Ali: jimk777: All I said was that by definition being gay is males having sex with males and straight is males having sex only with females.

That's not what being gay is, unless this is a "definition" that you've just made up.

Man, it would blow his mind to learn that there are straight men who engage in anal and oral sex with other men, and enjoy anal sex from a replica phallus worn by their partner.


Yes, and they are called either bi in the first place or simply kinky in the second. The first is not straight and the second is. I know it's hard to understand but give it a try.
 
2012-07-25 02:10:49 AM  

BronyMedic: jimk777: Really, go ahead, describe for us what sexual orientation means if it does not mean what gender you are attracted to? You're going to seriously argue it's about what music you like or how you like to dance or what food you like to eat? Notice I am refraining from giving examples of the obvious gay lifestyle stereotypes instead. I hate to tell you this but being gay is not that special. It's about nothing but sexual orientation. Or, are you just a hopeless romantic and upset because I simplified it by describing it as sex and didn't include any romance?

You do realize that you can be a straight male, attracted to women, and have a paraphilic attraction to oral or anal sex with another male (cuckolding fetish), or to being penetrated by a phallic object strapped to your female partner (pegging), right?

You can also be a gay man, and regularly engage in heterosexual intercorse with a female partner, and be arroused and achieve orgasm, as most gay men do for years before admitting their orientation to themselves and others.


What? So a Cockold, is straight and a gay guy is straight, and a chick sporting pentagram tattoos burned into her nipples is Christian as long as you catch them on the right day? Whew!!!!
 
2012-07-25 02:10:57 AM  
is the fark award the "bend-over" or the "reach-around"?
 
2012-07-25 02:11:59 AM  
jimk777: Yeah. You know the problem with that is the key phrase "some withing the psychology community." Leaving aside the news that it is a community versus some psychologists or some researchers the problem is that in any given year there are some within the psychological "community" that believe any number of things that next year or next decade are determined to be complete crap. I wouldn't be surprised if there are "some" somewhere that still think Freud was right just as there are "some" people who think the world is literally flat. Nothing makes any of those statements particularly relevant beyond the fact that "some" people are also all the time coming up with great ideas while stoned.

The issue with that concern you're having is that there is a legitimate neurochemical and physiological basis to consider pedophilia a separate sexual orientation, which would be completely different than gender or emotional-based orientations, such as homosexuality.

As the article says, there are many pedophiles who never develop an adult sexual orientation or develop an incomplete one.

The problem is, like those orientations, rewiring a pedophile to not be attracted to children may prove to be impossible without physically altering the brain structure at the neuronal level, and as you well know, that's beyond modern technology. And unlike adult sexual orientations, this is a pathological and immensely destructive impulse to act on.
 
2012-07-25 02:12:58 AM  

jimk777: I always find it humorous how so many activists try to pretend rape is all about power and not also about sex. Self evidently it requires both. Rape or pedophilia is not just some power trip that has nothing to do with sex. Both are also part of a failure in a normal sex drive. Yes, some rapes can be all about power and punishing some woman for example but sex is still involved even in those situations and just because some are mostly about power does not mean all are. It is grossly simplistic to think all rapes occur for the same reason. I think it's pretty idiotic to think for example that most prison rapes are all about power and not about sex. The person being raped could obviously have been beaten or punished in some other manner if the person doing it was not also enjoying the sex aspect of it. The problem is I suppose from the activist point of view they don't want to talk about a screwed up sex drive versus making it into some clinical power problem and pretending sex has nothing to do with it. Like most things sex spans a spectrum of good and bad. Sex is not automatically good and yes, rape and pedophilia are a depraved part of human sexuality. Pretending otherwise is just a joke.

Pedophilia could also include seduction of a child and there are pedophiles who think they actually love the children. That doesn't make it any less of a crime.


Great post, rarely see this sex vs. power issue brought up.

Also, great link BronyMedic. I did read it. Although it's making a case that homosexuals aren't more likely to sexually abuse children, it's obvious that pedophile orientations do not mirror adult sexual orientations.
 
2012-07-25 02:13:07 AM  
I'm an Eagle Scout, and I'll return my medal and patch if and when the BSA ever decides to forgo its principles as a private, voluntary organization in favor of political correctness based on choices made by a particular group of people. So for now, I'll be keeping them.
 
2012-07-25 02:13:47 AM  
ununcle: What? So a Cockold, is straight and a gay guy is straight, and a chick sporting pentagram tattoos burned into her nipples is Christian as long as you catch them on the right day? Whew!!!!

It means sexuality is complicated, and that labeling someone based on the fact they take a cock in the ass is ignorant, and ignores the developmental, neurochemical and physiological complexities which define sexual orientation.
 
2012-07-25 02:13:51 AM  

VendorXeno: Bigotry is as bad as it gets


Bullshiat. There's worse things in this world than bigotry. Not everyone in this world can be forced to act like they like you. If you want more people to like you, try being a better person.

Maybe more people would trust gays if a few more of them were less slutty and predatory and outrageous than they have been for years.
 
2012-07-25 02:14:10 AM  
The Boy Scouts are acting like gayrods.
 
2012-07-25 02:14:33 AM  
I didn't need the scouts to teach me how to camp, start fires, fish, swim, be a good citizen, help my neighbor, be prepared or any of their other scout sayings.

I had a Dad.... that and I thought the Scouts were stupid, and gay.

My Dad did not teach me to like or dislike groups of people but rather an individual for their actions.

I may not personally like that Jack is Gay... but Jack is one hell of a mechanic so I can see past what I see is a personal choice I do not agree with and pay Jack to work on my truck. But that does not mean that I agree that Jack should not be a Scout leader. If Jack is a good Scout leader and can leave his personal life out of Scouts then sure. But Jack is not going to bring his "friend" to Scouting events. Jack must teach about Scouting and Scouting alone. If he can't do that then Jack can not be a scout leader... Same goes for straight Scout leaders or any adult who mentors children. I had a baseball coach who used to tell us about how he'd come home to his wife screwing the neighbor or some random guy before practices and games. We were 13... we didn't need to hear that or care.

We as a society have become far too personal. We know entirely too much about each other now. The less I know about people the more I like them.

Think about it... 40 years ago people pissed and moaned about someone reading their diary, their inner most thoughts. NOW... people piss and moan about nobody reading their blog.... their inner most thoughts.
 
2012-07-25 02:14:48 AM  

Alleyoop: Don't like it? Go start your own club and leave ours alone.


We'll leave yours alone when it's 100% self-funded.
 
2012-07-25 02:14:55 AM  

A Fark Handle: ununcle: A Fark Handle: ununcle: As a heterosexual male, could I coach the local high school cheer leading team? You bet your ass I could. I would be the best freakin high school cheer leading team coach there ever was.

turns out you can and could because no national cheer organization is banning you.

Can I take them in the woods? This conversation proves there's an agenda.

can you take your daughter's/son's cheer/soccer/basketball/baseball/softball team across state lines to a regional tournament? yes. can you stay in the same hotel as that whole team? yes. does that prove there's an agenda?

/why are the woods so scary in your eyes?


Because there the farking woods. Did you not see lions and tigers and bears?
 
2012-07-25 02:16:14 AM  

uatuba: I'm an Eagle Scout, and I'll return my medal and patch if and when the BSA ever decides to forgo its principles as a private, voluntary organization in favor of political correctness based on choices made by a particular group of people. So for now, I'll be keeping them.


It gets federal funding. It's not really a private organization, is it?
 
2012-07-25 02:16:48 AM  

BronyMedic: jimk7


BronyMedic: jimk777: Really, go ahead, describe for us what sexual orientation means if it does not mean what gender you are attracted to? You're going to seriously argue it's about what music you like or how you like to dance or what food you like to eat? Notice I am refraining from giving examples of the obvious gay lifestyle stereotypes instead. I hate to tell you this but being gay is not that special. It's about nothing but sexual orientation. Or, are you just a hopeless romantic and upset because I simplified it by describing it as sex and didn't include any romance?

You do realize that you can be a straight male, attracted to women, and have a paraphilic attraction to oral or anal sex with another male (cuckolding fetish), or to being penetrated by a phallic object strapped to your female partner (pegging), right?

You can also be a gay man, and regularly engage in heterosexual intercorse with a female partner, and be arroused and achieve orgasm, as most gay men do for years before admitting their orientation to themselves and others.


Again it simply means you're bi. You're trying to make it more complex than it really is. There are degrees to everything and all types of fetishes. Being bi for example does not have to mean equally attracted to the same forms of sex with the same frequency with all partners. Your big difficulty is you are trying to use the latest definition of whichever school of psychology you follow in a lay forum with lay terms. Got news for you though. A guy who likes occasional oral or anal sex with another male whether a female is present or not is pretty much the exact definition of the word bi for the general population.
 
2012-07-25 02:19:57 AM  

jimk777: Aussie_As: jimk777: heap: jimk777: Okay so he's bi. Either that or closeted for 45 years which sounds a lot more likely.

or maybe he's a goddamned pedophile.

I haven't read anything about Sandusky having sex with little girls. This probably is too difficult a concept for you to handle but age has nothing to do with gender. Sandusky is a gay or bi pedophile. Pedophilia is simply the form of sex he wants not the gender he wants it with.

Pedophilia, like rape, is non-consensual. It's not about sex. It's about violation and power. Mixing it up with a regular discussion about homosexuality is simply offensive to all non-pedophiles and non-rapists, because what you say about gay men and boys would by definition apply to straight men and girls.

Umm, yes it clearly does apply to straights equally. I've already said that. The funny thing is you are so defensive about gays that you can't even admit in a public forum that Sandusky is gay. By definition if gays are normal people then some are bad. And yeah, pedophilia and rape are really also about sex. That's sort of what Sandusky was doing in the shower.

I always find it humorous how so many activists try to pretend rape is all about power and not also about sex. Self evidently it requires both. Rape or pedophilia is not just some power trip that has nothing to do with sex. Both are also part of a failure in a normal sex drive. Yes, some rapes can be all about power and punishing some woman for example but sex is still involved even in those situations and just because some are mostly about power does not mean all are. It is grossly simplistic to think all rapes occur for the same reason. I think it's pretty idiotic to think for example that most prison rapes are all about power and not about sex. The person being raped could obviously have been beaten or punished in some other manner if the person doing it was not also enjoying the sex aspect of it. The problem is I suppose from the activist point of view they don't wan ...


I honestly have no idea if Sandusky is gay or straight or whatever. My comment was based on his long-standing marriage (could be closetted), and the fact that none of the college-age footballers he would have spent hours and hours with have suggested he ever came onto them, which you'd expect if he was gay. He's a pedophile, we can agree, and as a respected football coach he had much more access to boys than girls. Your "evidence" that he is gay because he targetted little boys is oversimplstic rubbish though, and the arguments why this is the case have been well spelled out, particularly the linked article debunking common myths about gays. I maintain rape is about power. Bashing someone and raping them are both about power, only the latter is probably far more effective in humiliating and demeaning the victim.
 
2012-07-25 02:20:22 AM  

BronyMedic: The amount of your life you spend earning that Eagle Scout medal is incredible


Speaking as an ex-scout, it's about 4-5 years of your spare time. I dunno if I'd call it "incredible", the amount of effort doesn't even come close to what's required to get a degree or hold down a job. Admittedly I do still keep the card around, so there's that. Like most of us I have not a damned clue where the medal and badge are, though. Possibly my parents still have 'em, but they've moved since as well so who knows. I couldn't return them if I wanted to.

What I'm saying here is that it's maybe not quite so big a deal for most of us as you're making it out to be. I mean, it's cool, and getting to do big volunteer projects and such is good experience, but it's not some major identity-defining experience that alters the very substance of your soul we're talking about here, it's a social club for kids that does some community service and keeps them out of their parents' hair for a night or two a week.

//"ex scout" because when you hit 18, you're out, Eagle or not. It's one of the few rules that's really universal (the anti-gay thing is not, I frankly didn't know that was an official position at all until recently).

//Someone who brings up their scout rank without prompting as an adult is one of those creepy people that probably keep their high school sports trophies and won't shut the hell up about that time their junior high football team almost made state, too. So I'm assuming the people in the article are relatively young for the sake of my faith in humanity.
 
2012-07-25 02:20:41 AM  

WeenerGord: VendorXeno: Bigotry is as bad as it gets

Bullshiat. There's worse things in this world than bigotry. Not everyone in this world can be forced to act like they like you. If you want more people to like you, try being a better person.

Maybe more people would trust gays if a few more of them were less slutty and predatory and outrageous than they have been for years.


If they didn't like "gays" because of their behavior, instead of being gay, it wouldn't be bigotry. But it's very, very clear that you're either a troll of a farking retard.
 
2012-07-25 02:21:28 AM  
A guy who likes occasional oral or anal sex with another male whether a female is present or not is pretty much the exact definition of the word bi for the general population.


Yeah... Gay.
 
2012-07-25 02:23:25 AM  
WeenerGord:

No, seriously, you a shiat little shiat man.
 
2012-07-25 02:23:55 AM  

uatuba: I'm an Eagle Scout, and I'll return my medal and patch if and when the BSA ever decides to forgo its principles as a private, voluntary organization in favor of political correctness based on choices made by a particular group of people. So for now, I'll be keeping them.


You sound like a pussy.
 
2012-07-25 02:26:09 AM  

DempseySR26: Funny the people here calling the scouts bigots are bigots against Christians. Hypocrites.


um, why would they be bigots against Christians. just morons. not all Christians think the same way, and in the case of the BSA, it shows not all of them even think.
 
2012-07-25 02:26:33 AM  
jimk777: Again it simply means you're bi

No, it does not. It means you enjoy a paraphilia. Paraphilia =/= Sexual Orientation. They are two different concepts.

jimk777: You're trying to make it more complex than it really is.

Because it is complicated. There are entire journals devoted to the study of human sexuality and sexual orientation.

jimk777: There are degrees to everything and all types of fetishes. Being bi for example does not have to mean equally attracted to the same forms of sex with the same frequency with all partners.

Being bisexual is not a paraphilia.

jimk777: Your big difficulty is you are trying to use the latest definition of whichever school of psychology you follow in a lay forum with lay terms. Got news for you though. A guy who likes occasional oral or anal sex with another male whether a female is present or not is pretty much the exact definition of the word bi for the general population.

Holy crap, you're a pretentious little example of Dunning-Kruger. Psychiatry and Neuroscience are evolving, changing sciences. Our understanding of sexuality and the biological and psychological basis of it have changed dramatically in the last 10 years, even. It does not matter what the general public calls something if it is factually incorrect.

Just because you repeat something over and over, doesn't make it any more true than the first time you repeated it.
 
2012-07-25 02:27:08 AM  

WeenerGord: [hateful derp]


I've seen you in hundreds of threads and you've always seemed sane before today. Recovering from a severe head injury, or what?
 
2012-07-25 02:27:48 AM  

WeenerGord: Maybe more people would trust gays if a few more of them were less slutty and predatory and outrageous than they have been for years.


Most pedos of male children are straight. Hahaha, you have been trusting straight guys to your son!
 
2012-07-25 02:28:59 AM  
Sabyen91: WeenerGord: Maybe more people would trust gays if a few more of them were less slutty and predatory and outrageous than they have been for years.

Most pedos of male children are straight. Hahaha, you have been trusting straight guys to your son!


They also tend to be overwhelmingly close family members or family friends who are trusted by the victim's family.
 
2012-07-25 02:29:06 AM  

gadian: uatuba: I'm an Eagle Scout, and I'll return my medal and patch if and when the BSA ever decides to forgo its principles as a private, voluntary organization in favor of political correctness based on choices made by a particular group of people. So for now, I'll be keeping them.

It gets federal funding. It's not really a private organization, is it?


Other than the fact that the BSA doesn't get federal funding, I guess you're right. The BSA gets to use facilities that are federally funded. I guess now that any private organizations who use the interstate highway system must relinquish their principles, because they're not really private any more, right?

Keep in mind, an LGBT event was held at the freaking Pentagon. That doesn't mean the event was federally funded, it simply means that the event was held at a federally funded facility. But if that's your hang up, I'm perfectly ok with the BSA no longer holding its jamborees at Fort AP Hill.
 
2012-07-25 02:29:37 AM  

WeenerGord: VendorXeno: Bigotry is as bad as it gets

Bullshiat. There's worse things in this world than bigotry. Not everyone in this world can be forced to act like they like you. If you want more people to like you, try being a better person.

Maybe more people would trust gays if a few more of them were less slutty and predatory and outrageous than they have been for years.


You are a horrible human being, aren't you?
 
2012-07-25 02:29:59 AM  

BronyMedic: Sabyen91: WeenerGord: Maybe more people would trust gays if a few more of them were less slutty and predatory and outrageous than they have been for years.

Most pedos of male children are straight. Hahaha, you have been trusting straight guys to your son!

They also tend to be overwhelmingly close family members or family friends who are trusted by the victim's family.


Poor, poor Weenergord.
 
2012-07-25 02:30:06 AM  

BronyMedic: ununcle: What? So a Cockold, is straight and a gay guy is straight, and a chick sporting pentagram tattoos burned into her nipples is Christian as long as you catch them on the right day? Whew!!!!

It means sexuality is complicated, and that labeling someone based on the fact they take a cock in the ass is ignorant, and ignores the developmental, neurochemical and physiological complexities which define sexual orientation.


I must say, that's one of the more thought out and well versed responses on fark I've seen in a long long time. Your good.
 
2012-07-25 02:31:19 AM  

VendorXeno: But it's very, very clear that you're either a troll of a farking retard.


If that's all you got, you are the one who is too stupid to clearly express an opinion. Assuming you even have one.
 
2012-07-25 02:31:40 AM  

ununcle: Because there the farking woods. Did you not see lions and tigers and bears?


shiat! there are lions and tigers in the woods? then no one should ever enter the wood ever.

untaken_name: I presume it's because of the increased privacy and lack of unrelated bystanders. Do you really believe that a school group staying in a hotel and a group of campers in the woods is typically equivalent? I mean, I'm not on the BSA's side here, but even I can see the difference.


yeah, that's some silly shiat. privacy is privacy. hell most kids would likely be more familiar in a hotel room rather than the scary woods with new sounds and what not.
 
2012-07-25 02:32:46 AM  
WeenerGord: VendorXeno: But it's very, very clear that you're either a troll of a farking retard.

If that's all you got, you are the one who is too stupid to clearly express an opinion. Assuming you even have one.


Ah, the I'm rubber and you're glue defense. I applaud you for going with the classics, WeenerGord.
 
2012-07-25 02:33:34 AM  
So if for personal or political reasons individuals reject organizations to which they used to belong, it's significant?

Because back when people were shredding their AARP cards and sending them back it was just a few people being 'petty' and 'stupid' and 'it didn't really matter'.

I was in the Boy Scouts as a kid, and over the years as an adult I've briefly encountered the Scouts again for short periods of time. What gets me about their flat out rejection of homosexuals being members is that they try to play up the Scouts as a bunch of good little Christian kids. All of my experience with them, kid or adult, has been that they were not quite juvenile delinquents and could only just be wrangled in to the actual Scout thing.

The funny thing is that at least some of the original "Scout Law" would seem to be highly agreeable to every liberal who isn't of the elitist type (IE, Obama type) as it encourages Scouts to disregard the concept of social class and rich/poor and to help people regardless, don't be a snob basically.
 
2012-07-25 02:34:40 AM  

BronyMedic: jimk777: Yeah. You know the problem with that is the key phrase "some withing the psychology community." Leaving aside the news that it is a community versus some psychologists or some researchers the problem is that in any given year there are some within the psychological "community" that believe any number of things that next year or next decade are determined to be complete crap. I wouldn't be surprised if there are "some" somewhere that still think Freud was right just as there are "some" people who think the world is literally flat. Nothing makes any of those statements particularly relevant beyond the fact that "some" people are also all the time coming up with great ideas while stoned.

The issue with that concern you're having is that there is a legitimate neurochemical and physiological basis to consider pedophilia a separate sexual orientation, which would be completely different than gender or emotional-based orientations, such as homosexuality.

As the article says, there are many pedophiles who never develop an adult sexual orientation or develop an incomplete one.

The problem is, like those orientations, rewiring a pedophile to not be attracted to children may prove to be impossible without physically altering the brain structure at the neuronal level, and as you well know, that's beyond modern technology. And unlike adult sexual orientations, this is a pathological and immensely destructive impulse to act on.



I hear what you are saying but at this point that is not proven versus simply a hypothesis with some evidence. That simply means it could be considered but not that it is at all necessarily the final answer. The problem in all of this is that people try to tie things up in neat little boxes and human sex and the human sex drive is not even remotely like that. Where does pedophilia stop and underage sex begin for example and why would anyone think all pedophiles are the same? All you can really say at this point is they have a screwed up sex drive and listing it as a third orientation may be true in some cases but that's still way up in the air and in any case unlikely to be true for all or that simplistic. The real issue here is that activists of any type are incredibly defensive for often good reason. The problem is that as gays have rapidly gained mainstream acceptance, gay activists have to make the same change the black community did and stop trying to cover up or hide anything bad by someone who is gay just because they think it will just be used to attack them. Now it just starts to make them look like there either lying or idiots when they try to hide it. At least for now in lay terms the only orientations are gay, straight or bi. In that sense by definition Sandusky is either gay or bi. I didn't bring up Sandusky. I only jumped in because I found it funny how the activist types were trying to avoid at all costs considering him gay versus simply saying that just because he is gay does not mean the average gay is any more likely to have sex with boys than the average straight male is going to have sex with girls.
 
2012-07-25 02:37:01 AM  

blahpers: WeenerGord: VendorXeno: Bigotry is as bad as it gets

Bullshiat. There's worse things in this world than bigotry. Not everyone in this world can be forced to act like they like you. If you want more people to like you, try being a better person.

Maybe more people would trust gays if a few more of them were less slutty and predatory and outrageous than they have been for years.

You are a horrible human being, aren't you?


Sabyen91: BronyMedic: Sabyen91: WeenerGord: Maybe more people would trust gays if a few more of them were less slutty and predatory and outrageous than they have been for years.

Most pedos of male children are straight. Hahaha, you have been trusting straight guys to your son!

They also tend to be overwhelmingly close family members or family friends who are trusted by the victim's family.

Poor, poor Weenergord.


It's sadly but obviously true, Weenergord is a ridiculous stain on society.
 
2012-07-25 02:39:14 AM  

randomjsa: Because back when people were shredding their AARP cards and sending them back it was just a few people being 'petty' and 'stupid' and 'it didn't really matter'.


Comparing AARP cards to being a freaking Eagle Scout. I like it.
 
2012-07-25 02:39:49 AM  

jimk777: I didn't bring up Sandusky. I only jumped in because I found it funny how the activist types were trying to avoid at all costs considering him gay....


because he's not gay or straight. he's a pedo. they are kiddy-diddlers. that's all...
 
2012-07-25 02:41:25 AM  

Fluorescent Testicle: WeenerGord: [hateful derp]

I've seen you in hundreds of threads and you've always seemed sane before today. Recovering from a severe head injury, or what?


Are you are serious? Do you actually know anything about gays? Maybe you should do some reading. Very many gays are into power play, abuse, S&M. B&D, the list is endless. Pick up a tell all book, read a news story. Did you read upthread where bigstoopidbruce mentioned Jesse Dirkhising? why don't you search that name and read the horrible thing that happened to that poor kid. Do you know about bug chasers, gays who try to catch AIDS to prove how gay they are? If you were gay and cared about other gays, why would you wish that on them?

And I'm a bad person for agreeing that the BSA can keep out the openly gay if they want to? Fark all ya'll who don't care if kids might be harmed just because YOU want to boast about how cool and open and non-bigoted you are. Maybe when you grow up you will learn better sense.
 
2012-07-25 02:42:42 AM  

WeenerGord: Fluorescent Testicle: WeenerGord: [hateful derp]

I've seen you in hundreds of threads and you've always seemed sane before today. Recovering from a severe head injury, or what?

Are you are serious? Do you actually know anything about gays? Maybe you should do some reading. Very many gays are into power play, abuse, S&M. B&D, the list is endless. Pick up a tell all book, read a news story. Did you read upthread where bigstoopidbruce mentioned Jesse Dirkhising? why don't you search that name and read the horrible thing that happened to that poor kid. Do you know about bug chasers, gays who try to catch AIDS to prove how gay they are? If you were gay and cared about other gays, why would you wish that on them?

And I'm a bad person for agreeing that the BSA can keep out the openly gay if they want to? Fark all ya'll who don't care if kids might be harmed just because YOU want to boast about how cool and open and non-bigoted you are. Maybe when you grow up you will learn better sense.


So, the answer is yes, he was wrong to think you aren't an idiot.
 
2012-07-25 02:42:58 AM  
Why cant gays start up there own boy scouts" ??
 
2012-07-25 02:45:11 AM  

ununcle: Why cant gays start up there own boy scouts" ??


BSA isn't gay enough for everybody?
 
2012-07-25 02:45:26 AM  

WeenerGord: re you are serious? Do you actually know anything about gays?


Do you? Oh wait...you "read" about "statistics." You must be smart.
 
2012-07-25 02:46:23 AM  

Sabyen91: So, the answer is yes,


Got anything else BESIDES name calling? Cos if all you got is name calling, you got nothing.
 
2012-07-25 02:46:30 AM  

Sabyen91: ununcle: Why cant gays start up there own boy scouts" ??

BSA isn't gay enough for everybody?


Beer through nose. Thank you.
 
2012-07-25 02:46:41 AM  

WeenerGord: [more hateful derp]


Ah, you're just trying to out-troll the other morons here.

Well, I'll leave you to do that, then. Bye now.
 
2012-07-25 02:47:38 AM  

Party-sized bucket of flan: Oh wait...you "read" about "statistics." You must be smart.


Here is every conservative/Fark Independent (tm) response to education ever.
 
2012-07-25 02:47:45 AM  

WeenerGord: Sabyen91: So, the answer is yes,

Got anything else BESIDES name calling? Cos if all you got is name calling, you got nothing.


Oh, you...
 
2012-07-25 02:47:55 AM  

ununcle: Why cant gays start up there own boy scouts ??


oh separate but equal. good plan... why can't the bsa go fark themselves?

/separation is bad. sharing opinions and believes is good.
 
2012-07-25 02:48:24 AM  

Fluorescent Testicle: WeenerGord: [more hateful derp]

Ah, you're just trying to out-troll the other morons here.

Well, I'll leave you to do that, then. Bye now.


Don't get testy with me, you nut.
 
2012-07-25 02:48:39 AM  

ununcle: Sabyen91: ununcle: Why cant gays start up there own boy scouts" ??

BSA isn't gay enough for everybody?

Beer through nose. Thank you.


Welcome. I know they don't call it an ascot but yes, it is an ascot.
 
2012-07-25 02:48:40 AM  

Sabyen91: So, the answer is yes, he was wrong to think you aren't an idiot.


Unfortunately. Corrected now, but what a waste. Fark has so few members who aren't just trolls.

/She, by the way. :)
 
2012-07-25 02:49:11 AM  
Also, this thread has dissolved into the pure, uncut, unfettered DERP we all predicted. Last one out is probably on dial-up.
 
2012-07-25 02:49:45 AM  

Fluorescent Testicle: Sabyen91: So, the answer is yes, he was wrong to think you aren't an idiot.

Unfortunately. Corrected now, but what a waste. Fark has so few members who aren't just trolls.

/She, by the way. :)


I am sorry for the improper pronoun. Farkied so I don't screw it up again.
 
2012-07-25 02:50:50 AM  
Bigotry from the left good.
Bigotry from the left bad.

Standing for one's beliefs and protecting children now equals bigotry, kay.
 
2012-07-25 02:51:46 AM  

david_gaithersburg: Bigotry from the left good.
Bigotry from the left bad.

Standing for one's beliefs and protecting children now equals bigotry, kay.


Oh, look. It is THIS guy.
 
2012-07-25 02:52:37 AM  

david_gaithersburg: protecting children


From what, exactly?

(Spoiler: your answer to this question will likely display the aforementioned bigotry.)
 
2012-07-25 02:53:14 AM  
Damn Weenergord really went full retard tonight, didn't he?
I mistook him for a rational sort, too. Then again, he never quite took us on such a personal tour of his inner thought processes like this either.
Its like a bag of rabid cats in there.

/Oh well, better latent then never.
 
2012-07-25 02:53:32 AM  

david_gaithersburg: Bigotry from the left good.
Bigotry from the left bad.

Standing for one's beliefs and protecting children now equals bigotry, kay.



Watch out David, they will call you a hateful stupid stain troll for making sense and being right.

The truth hurts those who are devoted to lies.
 
2012-07-25 02:53:58 AM  

Sabyen91: I am sorry for the improper pronoun. Farkied so I don't screw it up again.


No worries, I know the username doesn't help. ;)
 
2012-07-25 02:54:23 AM  
david_gaithersburg: Bigotry from the left good.
Bigotry from the left bad.

Standing for one's beliefs and protecting children now equals bigotry, kay.


Oh, dis gon' be good.

*grabs chair and popcorn*

Please elaborate on how they are "protecting children", David. Don't hold back now, explain your position to the rest of the class.
 
2012-07-25 02:54:36 AM  

WeenerGord: Are you are serious? Do you actually know anything about gays? Maybe you should do some reading. Very many gays are into power play, abuse, S&M. B&D, the list is endless. Pick up a tell all book, read a news story. Did you read upthread where bigstoopidbruce mentioned Jesse Dirkhising? why don't you search that name and read the horrible thing that happened to that poor kid. Do you know about bug chasers, gays who try to catch AIDS to prove how gay they are? If you were gay and cared about other gays, why would you wish that on them?

And I'm a bad person for agreeing that the BSA can keep out the openly gay if they want to? Fark all ya'll who don't care if kids might be harmed just because YOU want to boast about how cool and open and non-bigoted you are. Maybe when you grow up you will learn better sense.


oh, so you you're a bigot? sorry that your kids will be raise by a bigoted asshole. maybe they'll get over it. here's to hoping they aren't gay because you'll make their lives hell...
 
2012-07-25 02:55:26 AM  

CliChe Guevara: /Oh well, better latent then never.


You'd know, eh?
 
2012-07-25 02:56:08 AM  

Fluorescent Testicle: Sabyen91: I am sorry for the improper pronoun. Farkied so I don't screw it up again.

No worries, I know the username doesn't help. ;)


Heh, yes, the balls don't help.

/I blued you.
 
2012-07-25 02:56:43 AM  

WeenerGord: david_gaithersburg: Bigotry from the left good.
Bigotry from the left bad.

Standing for one's beliefs and protecting children now equals bigotry, kay.


Watch out David, they will call you a hateful stupid stain troll for making sense and being right.

The truth hurts those who are devoted to lies.


Circle jerk!
 
2012-07-25 02:56:52 AM  
WeenerGord: Are you are serious? Do you actually know anything about gays? Maybe you should do some reading. Very many gays are into power play, abuse, S&M. B&D, the list is endless.

So are many straight people. Your arguement is invalid on that basis alone. You honestly think it's a coincidence that 50 Shades of Grey made it into the best seller list?
 
2012-07-25 02:57:22 AM  

WeenerGord: david_gaithersburg: Bigotry from the left good.
Bigotry from the left bad.

Standing for one's beliefs and protecting children now equals bigotry, kay.


Watch out David, they will call you a hateful stupid stain troll for making sense and being right.

The truth hurts those who are devoted to lies.


Still trying to figure out the protecting children thing. If you want to run with actual statistics, that would mean they would be safer by keeping them away from straight adults and just having gay BSA counselors and leaders, but I doubt thats what they mean.
 
2012-07-25 02:58:05 AM  

randomjsa: So if for personal or political reasons individuals reject organizations to which they used to belong, it's significant?


When the reason is just and the rejection is meaningful, yes. Whether this qualifies is a personal decision.

Because back when people were shredding their AARP cards and sending them back it was just a few people being 'petty' and 'stupid' and 'it didn't really matter'.

You're comparing a denouncement of bigotry and hatred with policy wankery? Really? Well, if that's how you personally decide it. . . .

I was in the Boy Scouts as a kid, and over the years as an adult I've briefly encountered the Scouts again for short periods of time. What gets me about their flat out rejection of homosexuals being members is that they try to play up the Scouts as a bunch of good little Christian kids. All of my experience with them, kid or adult, has been that they were not quite juvenile delinquents and could only just be wrangled in to the actual Scout thing.

I've known plenty of Scouts over the years. Some of them were upstanding types, and some of them were not. The latter typically didn't make Eagle.

The funny thing is that at least some of the original "Scout Law" would seem to be highly agreeable to every liberal who isn't of the elitist type (IE, Obama type) as it encourages Scouts to disregard the concept of social class and rich/poor and to help people regardless, don't be a snob basically.

I . . . really have trouble following the worthwhile parts of your posts sometimes. In this case, I ignore your reflexive attempt at derailing the discussion into another "Obamfart is elitist!" discussion.

The reason there is such an outcry from liberals--strike that; from anybody who takes offense at bigotry--about this is exactly because the BSA is considered--to the point of being a cliché--to be a model organization, and would be so if only it didn't have those little bits of bigotry stapled to it. Nobody cares about Westboro Baptist being bigots--there's nothing worth redeeming there. They aren't tragic; they're just scum. The Boy Scouts of America situation is tragic, a classic case of an otherwise good thing tainted by unnecessary evil. It's like watching Mister Rogers for years, but every so often he says "we're all special, except for the japs."
 
2012-07-25 02:58:24 AM  

A Fark Handle: here's to hoping they aren't gay because you'll make their lives hell...


Here's to hoping your kids aren't straight cos the scoutmaster you chose will make their lives a living hell...no, you know what, you might sacrifice a child on the alter of your own self importance, but I wont. Fark you. I hope all the kids are safe tonight. Shame on you and anyone else for hoping otherwise.
 
2012-07-25 02:59:51 AM  

WeenerGord: Are you are serious? Do you actually know anything about gays? Maybe you should do some reading. Very many gays are into power play, abuse, S&M. B&D, the list is endless.


Yes, as a matter of fact they are, because they are a subset of humans.
As such, it is a true statement, as by and large humans are rather into those sorts of thing.
 
2012-07-25 03:00:00 AM  

blahpers: Obamfart


The hardest laugh I've had all day.

I need to go to bed.
 
2012-07-25 03:00:08 AM  

WeenerGord: A Fark Handle: here's to hoping they aren't gay because you'll make their lives hell...

Here's to hoping your kids aren't straight cos the scoutmaster you chose will make their lives a living hell...no, you know what, you might sacrifice a child on the alter of your own self importance, but I wont. Fark you. I hope all the kids are safe tonight. Shame on you and anyone else for hoping otherwise.


So...you ignored people when they told you about the straight pedos like Sandusky. Just because you don't understand it doesn't mean you are right.
 
2012-07-25 03:00:24 AM  

A Fark Handle: ununcle: Why cant gays start up there own boy scouts ??

oh separate but equal. good plan... why can't the bsa go fark themselves?

/separation is bad. sharing opinions and believes is good.


Not separate but equal. There you go again linking yourself to farking Jim Crow! Ya know, That's the farking problem. You farkers leech of of other peoples struggles as if it was your own. That's exactly why people get pissed. Get this through your heads,,,, you're not running the day cares!!! Got that!???
 
2012-07-25 03:01:23 AM  

Sabyen91: straight pedos like Sandusky.


Sandusky was not straight.
 
2012-07-25 03:04:09 AM  
WeenerGord: Sabyen91: straight pedos like Sandusky.

Sandusky was not straight.


There is only one thing we can say to that.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5OSMTvKK990

Man, you're so despirate to make reality conform to what you believe, aren't you?
 
2012-07-25 03:04:17 AM  

WeenerGord: Sandusky was not straight


Which we (being everyone except Doody and Joe-Pa) didn't know until well after the fact.

I'm telling you, the "straight" ones are far more dangerous than the openly gay ones.
 
2012-07-25 03:04:21 AM  

WeenerGord: Sabyen91: straight pedos like Sandusky.

Sandusky was not straight.


Yes he is.