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(MSNBC)   Cash-strapped city sells a $140.00 unpaid sewer bill to an investment group. Group forecloses against homeowner, but they kindly allow him to keep his house for a mere $37,500.00 added to his mortgage   (economywatch.msnbc.msn.com) divider line 236
    More: Asinine, escrow, National Consumer Law Center, National League of Cities, loan modification, Dominick Vulpis, tax bill, school boards  
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18471 clicks; posted to Main » on 24 Jul 2012 at 7:08 PM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2012-07-24 04:50:56 PM
That's not criminal?

Sooner than later someone is going to take a hit like this and go all book tower.
 
2012-07-24 04:57:16 PM
there ought to be some kind of protection from this. The guy didn't sign any contracts with the investment group. You shouldn't be able to sell debt without the consent of the debtor.
 
2012-07-24 04:58:45 PM
Thats insane
 
2012-07-24 05:04:05 PM
This is not right.
 
2012-07-24 05:08:26 PM
I don't necessarily have a problem with selling debt, my main issue is how a sewer bill is secured by someone's house. That seems nuts to me, and it doesn't really seem relevant who holds the security. That kind of security shouldn't exist in the first place.
 
2012-07-24 05:09:38 PM
How do these people sleep at night?

....oh right, like babies.
 
2012-07-24 05:10:52 PM
does this happen in any other western country?
 
2012-07-24 05:11:22 PM
If he went Killdozer on the town hall I wouldn't hold it against him.
 
2012-07-24 05:12:44 PM

FlashHarry: does this happen in any other western country?


Which part? The selling of debt, or having minor bills secured by your home?
 
2012-07-24 05:19:19 PM

James!: there ought to be some kind of protection from this. The guy didn't sign any contracts with the investment group. You shouldn't be able to sell debt without the consent of the debtor.


You're joking, aren't you? You don't OWN a debt if you OWE it!
 
2012-07-24 05:20:16 PM
Sounds unlikely that nobody told him about the overdue bill AND nobody told him they were foreclosing on his house.
Maybe, just maybe, he's so irresponsible that he ignored both.
 
2012-07-24 05:23:55 PM
Investors bid for the right to collect the debt plus interest that can run as high as 18 percent, attorney fees and other expenses that are not capped in some states.

Really? So the city/state can auction off a lien against your house for $X of unpaid taxes and the winning bidder can then claim that you owe them whatever amount of money they feel like pulling out of their asses?
 
2012-07-24 05:25:04 PM

BarkingUnicorn: James!: there ought to be some kind of protection from this. The guy didn't sign any contracts with the investment group. You shouldn't be able to sell debt without the consent of the debtor.

You're joking, aren't you? You don't OWN a debt if you OWE it!


Nothing you said contradicted anything he said.
 
2012-07-24 05:25:27 PM

BarkingUnicorn: James!: there ought to be some kind of protection from this. The guy didn't sign any contracts with the investment group. You shouldn't be able to sell debt without the consent of the debtor.

You're joking, aren't you? You don't OWN a debt if you OWE it!


Let me have my dreams.
 
2012-07-24 05:25:32 PM

serial_crusher: Sounds unlikely that nobody told him about the overdue bill AND nobody told him they were foreclosing on his house.
Maybe, just maybe, he's so irresponsible that he ignored both.


Maybe, just maybe, you can see the bigger picture here.

/not likely?
 
2012-07-24 05:26:25 PM

serial_crusher: Sounds unlikely that nobody told him about the overdue bill AND nobody told him they were foreclosing on his house.
Maybe, just maybe, he's so irresponsible that he ignored both.


Even if this is true, does it seem like a just penalty for an overdue $140 bill?
 
2012-07-24 05:28:13 PM

DamnYankees: serial_crusher: Sounds unlikely that nobody told him about the overdue bill AND nobody told him they were foreclosing on his house.
Maybe, just maybe, he's so irresponsible that he ignored both.

Even if this is true, does it seem like a just penalty for an overdue $140 bill?


Someone let this get out of hand. It should not have happened.
 
2012-07-24 05:29:44 PM
Man, I'm sure glad we don't need business regulation. The free market will totally keep us safe.
 
2012-07-24 05:30:52 PM

cman: DamnYankees: serial_crusher: Sounds unlikely that nobody told him about the overdue bill AND nobody told him they were foreclosing on his house.
Maybe, just maybe, he's so irresponsible that he ignored both.

Even if this is true, does it seem like a just penalty for an overdue $140 bill?

Someone let this get out of hand. It should not have happened.


Outside of regulating these kinds of things to make them unenforceable and illegal, they will always happen.
 
2012-07-24 05:32:32 PM

DamnYankees: serial_crusher: Sounds unlikely that nobody told him about the overdue bill AND nobody told him they were foreclosing on his house.
Maybe, just maybe, he's so irresponsible that he ignored both.

Even if this is true, does it seem like a just penalty for an overdue $140 bill?


It doesn't. I guess they could have garnished his wages or something, assuming he's employed?
I should probably pay more attention to these things. Henrico County, Virginia still thinks I owe them property taxes on my car from 2008, even though I moved to Texas in July of 2007. I'll probably end up in one of these articles one day, then you can laugh at me for not just paying the stupid $79.95 to get it over with.
 
2012-07-24 05:33:48 PM

serial_crusher: DamnYankees: serial_crusher: Sounds unlikely that nobody told him about the overdue bill AND nobody told him they were foreclosing on his house.
Maybe, just maybe, he's so irresponsible that he ignored both.

Even if this is true, does it seem like a just penalty for an overdue $140 bill?

It doesn't. I guess they could have garnished his wages or something, assuming he's employed?
I should probably pay more attention to these things. Henrico County, Virginia still thinks I owe them property taxes on my car from 2008, even though I moved to Texas in July of 2007. I'll probably end up in one of these articles one day, then you can laugh at me for not just paying the stupid $79.95 to get it over with.


If only you were in favor of some kind of regulation to protect you from companies treating you like shiat...
 
2012-07-24 05:41:26 PM

James!: there ought to be some kind of protection from this. The guy didn't sign any contracts with the investment group. You shouldn't be able to sell debt without the consent of the debtor.


At this point everyone should be aware that your debt gets sold almost as soon as you take it out.

That was the cause of the whole "Great Recession." Remember the market for mortgage-backed securities collapsing?
 
2012-07-24 05:42:22 PM

GAT_00: Man, I'm sure glad we don't need business regulation. The free market will totally keep us safe.


You realize this was over a muni tax lien don't you?
 
2012-07-24 05:47:04 PM

GAT_00: If only you were in favor of some kind of regulation to protect you from companies treating you like shiat...


what this guy said:

Dancin_In_Anson: GAT_00: Man, I'm sure glad we don't need business regulation. The free market will totally keep us safe.

You realize this was over a muni tax lien don't you?


Counties in Virginia shouldn't be allowed to impose taxes on residents of other states. That doesn't have anything to do with business regulation. If they use some craziness to get my house foreclosed, I'll first and foremost be arguing that the debt they foreclosed over was invalid from the start, not that my feewings got hurt by big mean corporations.
 
2012-07-24 05:56:13 PM

serial_crusher: GAT_00: If only you were in favor of some kind of regulation to protect you from companies treating you like shiat...

what this guy said:
Dancin_In_Anson: GAT_00: Man, I'm sure glad we don't need business regulation. The free market will totally keep us safe.

You realize this was over a muni tax lien don't you?

Counties in Virginia shouldn't be allowed to impose taxes on residents of other states. That doesn't have anything to do with business regulation. If they use some craziness to get my house foreclosed, I'll first and foremost be arguing that the debt they foreclosed over was invalid from the start, not that my feewings got hurt by big mean corporations.


My bad, I was sticking with the premise of the link, that your debt was sold to a company who then farked you over.
 
2012-07-24 05:57:28 PM

serial_crusher: DamnYankees: serial_crusher: Sounds unlikely that nobody told him about the overdue bill AND nobody told him they were foreclosing on his house.
Maybe, just maybe, he's so irresponsible that he ignored both.

Even if this is true, does it seem like a just penalty for an overdue $140 bill?

It doesn't. I guess they could have garnished his wages or something, assuming he's employed?
I should probably pay more attention to these things. Henrico County, Virginia still thinks I owe them property taxes on my car from 2008, even though I moved to Texas in July of 2007. I'll probably end up in one of these articles one day, then you can laugh at me for not just paying the stupid $79.95 to get it over with.


You might like to check on that. I know someone who got pulled over and arrested for driving while suspended for something that stupid. If you were subpeonad (sp?) and didn't show because you moved you could still be screwed.
IANAL but there are a few here.
 
2012-07-24 05:59:56 PM
From the comments:

In much of the U.S., if you live under any taxing authority, city, state, school district, flood district, MUD, etc., you don't really own your home. You're renting it from the taxing entities. Don't pay your rent (taxes), and they can have law enforcement physically force you out of what you thought was your home and throw your belongings in the street. That is not ownership in my book.

While you technically have a point, think of the alternative:

Bootstrappy teabagger buys a house, decides all taxes are theft, stops paying municipal property taxes, yet still requires clean water, sewage and stormwater service, garbage collection, roads, etc, etc, etc.

Much like a landlord that can evict a tenant that doesn't pay, the city may evict non-paying residents.
 
2012-07-24 06:01:31 PM

Rev.K: While you technically have a point, think of the alternative:

Bootstrappy teabagger buys a house, decides all taxes are theft, stops paying municipal property taxes, yet still requires clean water, sewage and stormwater service, garbage collection, roads, etc, etc, etc.

Much like a landlord that can evict a tenant that doesn't pay, the city may evict non-paying residents.



And before anyone goes all bootstrappy and wants to select their municipal services a la cartel; no, f*ck off. It doesn't work that way because it would be horrendously inefficient.
 
2012-07-24 06:19:43 PM
They should do this to everyone who doesn't purchase health insurance.
 
2012-07-24 06:24:00 PM
Well it was either them or the CHUDs.
 
2012-07-24 06:27:43 PM
drew3000.net
 
2012-07-24 06:38:53 PM
City should pay the whole thing and eat the $140.
\
This is one of the major problems with taking people out of the loop and letting computers run things. I'm sure if a human being had seen this they would have called the guy up and said, hey, you need to pay $140 and the guy would have paid it. How did this skip collections anyway?
 
2012-07-24 06:45:25 PM

GAT_00: serial_crusher: GAT_00: If only you were in favor of some kind of regulation to protect you from companies treating you like shiat...

what this guy said:
Dancin_In_Anson: GAT_00: Man, I'm sure glad we don't need business regulation. The free market will totally keep us safe.

You realize this was over a muni tax lien don't you?

Counties in Virginia shouldn't be allowed to impose taxes on residents of other states. That doesn't have anything to do with business regulation. If they use some craziness to get my house foreclosed, I'll first and foremost be arguing that the debt they foreclosed over was invalid from the start, not that my feewings got hurt by big mean corporations.

My bad, I was sticking with the premise of the link, that your debt was sold to a company who then farked you over.


By the way, care to actually respond to what I was saying?
 
2012-07-24 07:07:43 PM

Dancin_In_Anson: GAT_00: Man, I'm sure glad we don't need business regulation. The free market will totally keep us safe.

You realize this was over a muni tax lien don't you?


Well that makes it OK then.
 
2012-07-24 07:12:45 PM
The biggest asset grab in history
 
2012-07-24 07:13:59 PM

James!: there ought to be some kind of protection from this. The guy didn't sign any contracts with the investment group. You shouldn't be able to sell debt without the consent of the debtor.


Every mortgage in the known universe contains a clause allowing the debt to be sold. If he signed the note, then there's your consent.
 
2012-07-24 07:17:44 PM
Step 1. Create a company to put a fake lien against your house.
Step 2. Foreclose on the house for 1 dollar.
Step 3. ???? Somehow screw the bank out of the mortgage against the house.
Step 4. Profit.


I just don't understand how this is even possible.
 
2012-07-24 07:18:17 PM

James!: there ought to be some kind of protection from this. The guy didn't sign any contracts with the investment group. You shouldn't be able to sell debt without the consent of the debtor.


What? You want the deadbeat who doesn't pay his bills to have to give his consent before his debt is sold to another company?

I have a better solution...

Pay your farking bills
 
2012-07-24 07:19:33 PM

phildonnia: James!: there ought to be some kind of protection from this. The guy didn't sign any contracts with the investment group. You shouldn't be able to sell debt without the consent of the debtor.

Every mortgage in the known universe contains a clause allowing the debt to be sold. If he signed the note, then there's your consent.


This didn't start out as mortgage debt, though.
 
2012-07-24 07:19:56 PM

unlikely: That's not criminal?

Sooner than later someone is going to take a hit like this and go all book tower.


That's already happened. remember the guy that welded a steel shell around his D10 bulldozer and leveled several city council members' houses? (along with several other buildings) It was because they zoned out his business that he owned for twenty years and sent him into bankruptcy.
 
2012-07-24 07:20:07 PM

Krieghund: James!: there ought to be some kind of protection from this. The guy didn't sign any contracts with the investment group. You shouldn't be able to sell debt without the consent of the debtor.

At this point everyone should be aware that your debt gets sold almost as soon as you take it out.

That was the cause of the whole "Great Recession." Remember the market for mortgage-backed securities collapsing?


He didn't 'take out' debt. But good attempt, politics tab and derpvill 3 miles on the right.
 
2012-07-24 07:20:08 PM
upload.wikimedia.org

they dream in Middletown, NJ..
 
2012-07-24 07:20:32 PM
Money, what an evil thing.
 
2012-07-24 07:20:46 PM

Tarkus: Well that makes it OK then.


Not in the least...and you're doing it wrong.
 
2012-07-24 07:20:55 PM
This guy is a 100% liar and I would bet his $50,000 bill. The parties have either his signature on certified mail receipts or they have returned certified mail that he failed to claim. That is the process EVERY time. I understand this process completely and he's a liar. The reporter can never get the other side of these stories (the creditor's evidence) because they can't show it due to privacy reasons. They showed it to a judge though who gave them a lien.

That's all people need to know about this matter.

He admitted that he paid his bills late. If he admitted that then I'm willing to bet he is a chronic deadbeat who tries to beat his creditors for a living.

Screw him. No sympathy.
 
2012-07-24 07:21:16 PM

phildonnia: James!: there ought to be some kind of protection from this. The guy didn't sign any contracts with the investment group. You shouldn't be able to sell debt without the consent of the debtor.

Every mortgage in the known universe contains a clause allowing the debt to be sold. If he signed the note, then there's your consent.


How did the city take possession of his mortgage in order to sell it?

They sold the debt from the water bill. Somehow that entitled this debt collector to put a lien on this guy's house. I don't see how it happened, but somehow they pulled it off. farking lawyers.
 
2012-07-24 07:22:15 PM

Mugato: How do these people sleep at night?

....oh right, like babies.


on piles and piles of soft sweet cash
 
2012-07-24 07:22:27 PM

phildonnia: Every mortgage in the known universe contains a clause allowing the debt to be sold. If he signed the note, then there's your consent.


This was a sewer bill.
 
2012-07-24 07:22:36 PM

Ego edo infantia cattus: unlikely: That's not criminal?

Sooner than later someone is going to take a hit like this and go all book tower.

That's already happened. remember the guy that welded a steel shell around his D10 bulldozer and leveled several city council members' houses? (along with several other buildings) It was because they zoned out his business that he owned for twenty years and sent him into bankruptcy.


He didn't build that.
 
2012-07-24 07:23:09 PM
Farkers are soooo gullible.
 
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