liam76: calbert: digistil: Red Shirt Blues: I hate to be that guy but.......this could be self inflicted. Kind of like that woman who threw acid in her own face. I was looking at pics of the messages left on her walls. Pretty good printing for spray paint. I mean if you're an attacker all stoked up smashing doors in committing violence and arson.......
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In one way I hope I am wrong, that nobody could contrive this, OTOH I hope I am right that nobody would be sick enough to storm somebody's house and mutilate her because she's gay.

Very good point. Can you link to the source of the pics? I don't see them on the news story page.

do a GIS for 'Lincoln hate crime' and there they are.

If I was going to carve someone up and burn their house down, I don't think I woudl bother witht he spray paint.

I can't help thinking you are right.



Ok lets say for one second you are right - its self inflicted.

The news coverage that this is getting is enough to incite some small-minded dipshait somewhere that it is OK to do this, and guess what?

No matter what, someone, somewhere will get hurt because of this. We have far too many morons here in the US. It only takes one to get the idea that this is somehow justified and you get violence as a result.

We are rapidly swirling down the shiatter, IMO.

The All-Powerful Atheismo: IlGreven: The All-Powerful Atheismo: IlGreven: Ambivalence: TheDumbBlonde: No Christian was involved in this heinous crime.

That's not really for you to say.

Sure it is. They may call themselves Christian, but no tenet of any Christian sect I've ever seen advocates shiat like this.

If a man lies with a male as he lies with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination. They shall surely be put to death. Their blood shall be upon them. (NKJ, Leviticus 20:13)

And if they merely had put her to death, then maybe you'd have a point. Nowhere does the Bible say "bind him, mutilate him, and set his domicile ablaze".

Besides that, it's believer mentality that should be condemned here, not any religion. Dehumanizing those who dare think differently from you so that anything you do to them is "justified" is not at all confined to Christianity, or religion in general.

If it weren't for the fact that a LARGE percentage of "Christians" consider homosexuality "EVIL"...

...and remember "evil" is NOT a throw-away word, nor a meaningless adjective, especially to these people...

...then it wouldn't be an issue, and then "outlier" explanation would be fine.

It is possible for a group of believers to become dissociated from the belief that they play lip service to. What they label themselves doesn't matter in the long run, as their actions don't fit the label that they've given themselves. It's like a group calling themselves the "Taxed Enough Already" Party eventually advocating for measures that would increase their own taxes (while lowering taxes for the uber-wealthy in the process): Labels don't matter, actions do. And these days, most people who call themselves Christians don't go around assaulting other people for their views, even if they held them in contempt.

TheDumbBlonde: No Christian was involved in this heinous crime.

Ummm, The Bible tells Christians to kill gays.

Being unchristian would be not doing this sort of thing.

LowbrowDeluxe: Oznog: And it just keeps going- started a fire which conveniently didn't burn the place down. Come on. Who throws gasoline around and DOESN'T make a real fire?? You gotta pay close attention to just how you spill it to NOT burn the place down. Mysterious strangers who spill only a small, controlled amount of gasoline and light it and walk away? Naaaaw.

You either watch too many movies, or are one of those near-hypochondriac fire fighters who after seeing a couple of bad burns immediately start lecturing out anytime you see a power strip plugged into a power strip or a space heater of any style any where. Now it certainly could go either way. I've yet to see any /actual/ evidence leaning towards fake. So far it's just as likely some homegrown idiots watch the same stupid movies you do.

Fire's only ONE of the problems here. Basically, all of it's a problem for plausibility.

Joce678: TheDumbBlonde: No Christian was involved in this heinous crime.

Ummm, The Bible tells Christians to kill gays.

Being unchristian would be not doing this sort of thing.

No it doesn't. You are wrong and have no idea what you're talking about.

This guy is going to find out what prison sex really is after Bubba gets done with him.

/sick story.
//thinking about your friend subby.
///I'll cut his balls off for a nominal fee.
////Ok, I'd do it for free.

Joce678: TheDumbBlonde: No Christian was involved in this heinous crime.

Ummm, The Bible tells Christians to kill gays.

Being unchristian would be not doing this sort of thing.

Well, the alternative is the Gay Steamroller, clearly.

hbk72777: Link

Superficial cuts, isn't it always when self inflicted? If you really hate someone, you'd dig in, wouldn't you? Hate messages written on the basement walls, yet they tried to set the house on fire? Seems to be contradictory. And zip ties instead of rope, how convenient, a person can zip tie themselves easily, rope on the other hands, needs help. Just not adding up. I've just seen this too many times before, people working themselves up into a frenzy, then finding out it's not true.

Or if you think like an anthropologist, you can see it as very likely to occur. People usually go to great lengths to prepare sacrifices. They also write very personalized messages that only have one intended recipient and are meant to be destroyed.

By your logic, all the Second World War photographs with pictures of messages to Hitler scrawled on bombs by Allied flight crews are probably fakes, as are Viking funeral pyres, as are the various graffiti written by soldiers on the walls of cities they sack and burn throughout history, as are threatening notes given to geeks who get beaten up by grade ten greasers.

*sigh*

I really wish the "usual suspects" wouldn't rush into cases like this. We don't know who did it, and what religion - if any - they were. Blaming it on Christians is extremely premature. As for the "she should have had a gun" people - unless you walk around the house with it in your hand at all times, if 3 people barge into your house, there's a good chance they can grab you before you could even get the gun, let alone use it.

Ugh, tragedies like this are bad enough without people piling on. And that's ignoring the obvious idiot.

Ed Grubermann: I'm sorry, but this just smells fishy.

That's an awful pun, Ed Gruberman.

*boottothehead*

namegoeshere: Is there any reason besides religion to oppose same sex relationships? Because I'm having a really big problem reconciling the idea that being gay is HORRIBLE and BAD and a SIN but stripping a woman naked, beating her, binding her with zip ties, carving hateful words into her skin, and attempting to burn her alive is good Christian behavior.

Yes. There's your plain old violent homophobes. They don't hold rallies or write slogans on signs. They hate homosexuals enough to want to physically harm them. Yes, some of the christians are hateful hateful people, but they usually don't assault people in their homes and torture them. I've never heard of a gay bashing motivated by religion, and it certainly isn't the norm. I'm surprised that farkers so quickly turned this into a Christian bashing thread with no sense of irony.

Wait. No I'm not

Dadoody: [i73.photobucket.com image 767x431]

Could you throw me $100 to my paypal? I will donate 100% of it to a local kitten rescue.

Benevolent Misanthrope
The Pacific Northwest. Hell - it's an event when I meet a woman who isn't gay.

Um, that's just what they tell you

All you people who are outraged and publicly proclaiming the awful things you'd like to do to the (most likely imaginary) perpetrators here should keep this in mind as an example of how you can all be manipulated and how easy it is for certain people to do it.

Dadoody: [i73.photobucket.com image 767x431]

Just so you know, that picture is giving me the exact opposite reaction of what you're intending. Briefcases of money are for super-villains and the insecure.

You white people are crazy.

Ambivalence:
That's not really for you to say. I understand not wanting to be associated with this kind of filth, but if they say they're christian, then they are christian. They may be really bad at BEING Christian, but it's not like there's an authoritity with the power to kick out bad examples from the entire suite of Christian religions.

"If a man also lie with mankind, as he lieth with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination: they shall surely be put to death; their blood shall be upon them." (Leviticus 20:13 KJV)

I'd say they were just following The Bible.

Before you go all "New Testament" on me, remember the words of Jesus:

"Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them. For truly I tell you, until heaven and earth disappear, not the smallest letter, not the least stroke of a pen, will by any means disappear from the Law until everything is accomplished. Therefore anyone who sets aside one of the least of these commands and teaches others accordingly will be called least in the kingdom of heaven, but whoever practices and teaches these commands will be called great in the kingdom of heaven." (Matthew 5:17)

This incident makes me feel really uncomfortable and ashamed of my own disgusting beliefs. Maybe it should cause me to reflect inwards? Nah, I'll just say it was all faked, and then I'll feel ok to carry on smoldering with hatred against the sodomites.

Self-inflected. I can tell by looking at the movie pixels. Real crimes like those depicted in Boys Don't Cry involve close knit bigot family members, booze, and murder. Fake crimes, like those seen in I Spit on Your Grave or Last House on the Left, incorrectly depict survival despite overwhelming odds.

Bhruic: Blaming it on Christians is extremely premature.

Alright, I'll play. Name me an ideology or belief system in this country that doesn't have it's roots in Christian Dogma and also has a burning hatred for gays that has credibly resulted in violence against them.

Go on. I'll wait.

Sounds staged. The fire is the key. Burning only a small amount. I bet any mementos and valuables were safe and sound. Wouldn't arsonist spread gas everywhere ?

TheDumbBlonde: No Christian was involved in this heinous crime.

Why not? Christians have been doing this sort of thing for 2000 years.

tarnok: Joce678: TheDumbBlonde: No Christian was involved in this heinous crime.

Ummm, The Bible tells Christians to kill gays.

Being unchristian would be not doing this sort of thing.

No it doesn't. You are wrong and have no idea what you're talking about.

See above.

xl5150: as an example of how you can all be manipulated and how easy it is for certain people to do it.

xl15150 is manipulating you right now, as a for-instance.

SkunkWerks: Bhruic: Blaming it on Christians is extremely premature.

Alright, I'll play. Name me an ideology or belief system in this country that doesn't have it's roots in Christian Dogma and also has a burning hatred for gays that has credibly resulted in violence against them.

Go on. I'll wait.
Fundamentalist muslims, fundamentalist Jews, secular ultra-masculine conservatism.

Because People in power are Stupid: Tea Party happened.

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Full derp in 4. Y'all are slipping.

How about we wait for more info on this? No one deserves to have this happen to them, but I'm not willing to jump straight to "It'z da Jeebus lubbers" either.

xl5150: All you people who are outraged and publicly proclaiming the awful things you'd like to do to the (most likely imaginary) perpetrators here should keep this in mind as an example of how you can all be manipulated and how easy it is for certain people to do it.

There is some seriously illogical leaping going on by the anti-Christian apologists here. Nobody said this was a religiously motivated crime. Homophobia is not religious, per se. What I want to know from you and the other self-inflicted set of posters is why you think it is likely the wounds were self-inflicted, given that there is no evidence discussed in the article about the wounds or the messages or the suspects. Surely you have about as much evidence of the psychological state of the victim as the posters in this thread have evidence of the suspects' religious orthodoxy.

Mid_mo_mad_man: The fire is the key. Burning only a small amount.

All fires are all-consuming. Without exception. This is undeniable.

Mid_mo_mad_man: Wouldn't arsonist spread gas everywhere ?

Lessee, middle of the day, the woman is seen shortly after the incident crawling from her own home bleeding and screaming by dozens of neighbors.

Staying around to make sure I was "thorough" in setting a fire?

Yeah, I'd totally do that.

mister aj: Fundamentalist muslims

Abrahamic Faith

mister aj: fundamentalist Jews

See above.

mister aj: secular ultra-masculine conservatism.

A White Whale. Go hunt it.

The whole Christian, non-christian thing doesn't matter as much as the fact that it happened in Nebraska. Nebraska seems to want to emulate the worst in every bit of their neighboring states. They have Kansas' open mindedness, Colorado's tendency towards egotistic piety punctuated by sudden acts of violence, S Dakota and Wyoming's desperate rural poverty, and the cynicism of the politics that would make any Iowan tip their hat and say "well played sir, now stay away from my children."

/Lived ten years in Central NE, but saw little evidence of either gays, proper Christians, or indeed claims to being part of a civilized society.
//Countdown to Ron Brown sticking his oar in in 5...4...3...2...

SkunkWerks: xl15150 is manipulating you right now, as a for-instance.

Hardly. Trying to get people to actually stop and think about something instead of taking it at face value by default is really more of the opposite of trying to manipulate them.

SkunkWerks: mister aj: Fundamentalist muslims

Abrahamic Faith

Yes, not Christian dogma, Abrahamic dogma.

unavailable for questioning

xl5150: Hardly.

Yes, it's hard for you to manipulate people. I get that.

Bhruic: *sigh*

I really wish the "usual suspects" wouldn't rush into cases like this. We don't know who did it, and what religion - if any - they were. Blaming it on Christians is extremely premature. As for the "she should have had a gun" people - unless you walk around the house with it in your hand at all times, if 3 people barge into your house, there's a good chance they can grab you before you could even get the gun, let alone use it.

Ugh, tragedies like this are bad enough without people piling on. And that's ignoring the obvious idiot.

If people had guns there wouldn't be people storming into their house.
It simply never happens where I live. We all have guns.

There is no fixing people who do things like this.

I couldn't make it through the second paragraph

mister aj: SkunkWerks: mister aj: Fundamentalist muslims

Abrahamic Faith

Yes, not Christian dogma, Abrahamic dogma.

Fair enough.

Still, you've still got a serious lack of Hasidic Jews lynching gay folks to make up for here. And something tells me Muslims have enough to worry about what with all this terrorism stuff we're scrutinizing them for to bother pressing any issues they might have with gays.

But fair enough.

Dadoody: [edge.ebaumsworld.com image 363x480]

[www.jendhamuni.com image 380x270]

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no bites dude. Maybe try casting in a new spot?

xl5150: untaken_name: cptjeff: I sincerely hope the person who did this is sodomized with a branding iron.

"An eye for an eye leaves the whole world blind."

Not to mention the evidence is piling up that this was all self-inflicted.

The only "evidence" I've seen for your assertion is the claims of bigots who refuse to even imagine someone could have done this to someone else.

namegoeshere: Is there any reason besides religion to oppose same sex relationships?

Its more about plain old fashion hate than it is religion.
Some preachers interpret a few sentences in their holy book to mean Homosexuality is wrong (the same way they interpret that the earth is 6000 years old or that the world will end on X date (when the same book says specifically that you will never know that date)) so they can justify a previously existing bias. Probably descending from a long standing dislike for Roman era shenanigans or the woes of jilted lovers.
The Bible is mostly just a history book. The Christian Religion itself is meant to be about helping those in need and building community.
Unfortunately there is always someone who will use any podium to spread their personal vitriol.

If you want Gods opinion:
City Fire Inspector Damon Robbins said a match ignited vapors from a pool of gasoline on the woman's floor, but the flash fire did not continue to burn and caused no noticeable damage to the house.

There it is.
I think this is Gods way of telling us these assholes need to be rounded up and stoned to death.

I think God is also suggesting we should help these folks train more people in self defense:

Ambivalence: TheDumbBlonde: No Christian was involved in this heinous crime.

That's not really for you to say. I understand not wanting to be associated with this kind of filth, but if they say they're christian, then they are christian. They may be really bad at BEING Christian, but it's not like there's an authoritity with the power to kick out bad examples from the entire suite of Christian religions.

I'm a black guy! I'm just *really* bad at being a black guy!

Dwindle: Bhruic: *sigh*

I really wish the "usual suspects" wouldn't rush into cases like this. We don't know who did it, and what religion - if any - they were. Blaming it on Christians is extremely premature. As for the "she should have had a gun" people - unless you walk around the house with it in your hand at all times, if 3 people barge into your house, there's a good chance they can grab you before you could even get the gun, let alone use it.

Ugh, tragedies like this are bad enough without people piling on. And that's ignoring the obvious idiot.

If people had guns there wouldn't be people storming into their house.
It simply never happens where I live. We all have guns.

Where do you live?