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(CNN)   DOJ doubles down on anti-Apple ebook derp   (tech.fortune.cnn.com) divider line 22
    More: Stupid, Apple Inc., DOJ, e-books, cherry-picks, public comment  
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7388 clicks; posted to Business » on 23 Jul 2012 at 8:56 PM (2 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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Archived thread
2012-07-24 07:34:26 AM  
2 votes:

MithrandirBooga: Wait, people are actually dumb enough to defend Apple in this?


But look at my chart! You see if you add in all the free, really cheap and fan fiction books by no name authors, we can see that prices didn't shoot up like people are saying.
2012-07-23 10:54:10 PM  
2 votes:

idsfa: Rincewind53: Well, mainly because Amazon, who is the main pusher of this entire thing (they've been working directly with the DOJ and went to them in a snit after the whole deal occured) had a 90% or so market share on e-books at the time of the deal. So a lot of people are, I think quite legitimately, asking why is it that the companies that tried to work out some deal to survive Amazon's monopolistic power are the ones that the DOJ is going after.


Remember that thing that two wrongs don't make?


An airplane?
2012-07-23 09:40:44 PM  
2 votes:
Apple trying to set a price point much higher than it should be... say it ain't so...
2012-07-26 02:07:27 PM  
1 votes:

Vaneshi: malaktaus: Honest Bender: If they just can't save themselves, then maybe we don't need middle-man publishers anymore.

What do they actually, you know, do these days? I mean, promotion, fine, and also editing, but there are other ways to do both. Even more than record companies, it seems to me that publishers are in a business that has no future. They provide no essential services and the artists they depend on don't really need them.

Editing, typesetting & layout, cover art, advertising and in some cases PR related duties. Even going straight to e-book with no need to layout the pages for printing there is a lot of tidying and tarting up of a manuscript before it ever makes it to market.

You'd be surprised just how much editing and how many revisions it takes for that well crafted book you enjoyed to appear from it's original draft.

I can see publishers changing their form but I can't see them going anywhere soon, self publishing is nice but... unless you are shiat hot in the required skills AND can write like a demon you aren't going to get anywhere.


"just how much editing" and yet they still sell just as well as utter trash like Twilight and 50 Shades of Gray.
2012-07-26 02:05:21 PM  
1 votes:

ZiegZeon: Swoop1809: I was going to buy a copy of the Great Gatsby the other day. I go to amazon and see the ebook price at 12.99, which by itself is ridiculous for an ebook. But next to it is the paperback for 9.99. I decided the publisher doesn't deserve any of my money.

Pretty much why I don't give 2 shiats about ebooks. I see no reason for any e-book to cost more then 5.00. That data is just so damn expensive after all.


At of the start of this thread, I would have said $5. Now I'm closer to $2.

If Netflix is $8/month and I can read 4 books a month with the time I watch Netflix, then ebooks should be no more than $2.
2012-07-26 02:03:54 PM  
1 votes:

Nem Wan: It is derp. Apple has always preferred to have flat or simply tiered pricing. Every song on the iTunes Store was 99 cents originally. This no different than a brick and mortar dollar store pricing everything at a dollar. Apple has simple terms for content owners: if you want to sell something in Apple's store, Apple gets 30%. This is not collusion or a "deal", it's Apple informing everybody that these are the terms under which Apple will resell your product. Apple was only trying to do the exact same thing with their iBookstore that they've done with their iTunes Store and App Store.


0/10 Obvious troll is obvious.
2012-07-26 01:31:29 PM  
1 votes:

jvl: RexTalionis: Remember when ebooks were $9.99 for most books? Remember how prices everywhere suddenly jumped to $14.99 overnight for new books? Yeah, that was because of Apple.

You know there's an actual graph of prices in the linked article? And that it disproves what you just said?


Average ebook price takes into account the 1 copy of "My Life of Living in the Basement Posting on Fark" that someone published and sold for a penny through Amazon.

They need to look at the average price of books that actually sell. (Classics, current hits, etc).

As another poster said, most of the time ebooks and paper books cost the same, or the ebook costs more. That is price fixing.
2012-07-26 01:29:09 PM  
1 votes:

MugzyBrown: ApatheticMonkey: I've been wondering why in general, it only costs a couple bucks more to get a physical copy of a book (sometimes even hardcover!) than the ebook version. I'm a little annoyed to know this was the reason. That was a major driver in me not ever having bought an actual ebook, despite having a dedicated ebook reader. (I've been downloading from the local library.) If it only costs me a little more to get a physical copy that I know won't suddenly disappear, I have almost zero incentive to bother buying a digital copy. Yes, I can carry dozens of books with me with the ereader, but honestly, I'm only reading one at a time.

Supply & demand. The demand for ebooks has risen, so the price has also risen. It's that simple. To think of a monopoly in e-books is silly. There is no reason for government interference.


Not sure if trolling or just completely retarded.

There is no limit to supply on an electronic file. There is no cost to supply past the labor to craft unit one.
2012-07-24 09:00:59 AM  
1 votes:

AdamK: i'm still waiting for school textbooks to go digital and be... at most... $5

until then, don't care about ebooks


Ever notice how the name on your textbook frequently seems to be very similar to the name of a professor at your university? It's almost as though they're requiring you to purchase a textbook knowing that doing so puts $50 in their pocket.
2012-07-24 08:33:24 AM  
1 votes:

Bungles: Apple totally molested the book market, and acted unlawfully, and generally dicked off against customer interest.

This isn't in debate by anyone who has looked at the facts.



(authors, incidentally, adore Amazon.... it's their publishers who don't. Just give it 10 years... those authors will be being published, paper and digitally, by Amazon, get a 70% cut, and those publishers simply won't exist any more).


This. So much this.
2012-07-24 08:08:19 AM  
1 votes:
Apple totally molested the book market, and acted unlawfully, and generally dicked off against customer interest.

This isn't in debate by anyone who has looked at the facts.



(authors, incidentally, adore Amazon.... it's their publishers who don't. Just give it 10 years... those authors will be being published, paper and digitally, by Amazon, get a 70% cut, and those publishers simply won't exist any more).
2012-07-24 08:03:50 AM  
1 votes:
is price fixing illegal?

I thought it was the main business model for most large companies these days.
2012-07-24 07:53:58 AM  
1 votes:

GAT_00: RexTalionis: Hard to see how that's derp.

You forgot the key thing. Someone dared to speak against Apple.


^^^^
this

How many of those letters the DOJ 'snippily' dismissed were iFans proclaiming submission to the nation of iJobs?

They just want them to Leave Steve Alone (waaahhh)
2012-07-24 06:56:19 AM  
1 votes:
Wait, people are actually dumb enough to defend Apple in this?
2012-07-24 03:26:32 AM  
1 votes:

Rincewind53: But at the same time, I can tell you that the publishers had all of their lawyers seriously going over this thing and were well aware of the Sherman Anti-Trust Act, and at the rate they pay those guys I'm pretty confident the agreement itself, the contract, probably ...


So what you're saying is that you've never worked in the operating levels of any industry, ever.
2012-07-23 10:53:16 PM  
1 votes:

Riche: As it stands now, I would have ZERO reservations against pirating old books like The Great Gatsby if more is charged than, say, $0.99. And only that much if some effort had been put in to make sure there's proper layout, cover art, etc. That book was written in the freaking 1920's for christ's sake. Fitzgerald has died and rotted in the ground a long time ago-- it's farking ridiculous that the book is still under copyright almost a century after it was written.


How can you pirate something that's in the public domain?
2012-07-23 09:48:21 PM  
1 votes:

Herr Flick's Revenge: So its far better for Amazon to have a monopoly, drive ebook prices down so publishers make nothing so they can make money on kindles?


So Apple is selflessly throwing themselves on the DOJ grenade because they care so much about publishers?
2012-07-23 09:42:51 PM  
1 votes:

jvl: RexTalionis: Remember when ebooks were $9.99 for most books? Remember how prices everywhere suddenly jumped to $14.99 overnight for new books? Yeah, that was because of Apple.

You know there's an actual graph of prices in the linked article? And that it disproves what you just said?


"Weighted by units sold"

The price of mainstream, big selling, e-book titles could have doubled but a growth in free or cheap titles at the amateur end would keep the "average" price down.

Not to mention it is a chart with no source quoted, making it difficult to check the raw data.
2012-07-23 09:31:02 PM  
1 votes:

Herr Flick's Revenge: So its far better for Amazon to have a monopoly, drive ebook prices down so publishers make nothing so they can make money on kindles?


Amazon is a publisher and they're making money just fine. If other publishers aren't making money, then they need to innovate. If they just can't save themselves, then maybe we don't need middle-man publishers anymore.
2012-07-23 09:18:44 PM  
1 votes:
This is AT&T's fault. Or the manufacturer. Or you're holding the device wrong.
2012-07-23 07:35:06 PM  
1 votes:
Philip Elmer-Dewitt
Editor, Apple 2.0, Fortune

Philip Elmer-DeWitt has been covering Apple since 1982, first for Time Magazine, and now on the Web for Fortune.com.


This guy is probably biased somewhat.
2012-07-23 07:03:03 PM  
1 votes:

RexTalionis: Hard to see how that's derp.


You forgot the key thing. Someone dared to speak against Apple.
 
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