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(ESPN)   Penn State gets Sandusky'd   (espn.go.com) divider line 1081
    More: News, Penn State, Sandusky'd, Mark Emmert, President Ma, College Coach, Beaver Stadium, defensive coordinator, Joe Schad  
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16148 clicks; posted to Main » on 23 Jul 2012 at 9:44 AM (2 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2012-07-23 12:50:18 PM

A Fark Handle: kirk's never right...


*snort*
 
2012-07-23 12:50:19 PM
Punish the guilty, hard.

Collective punishment is for the lazy and unintelligent. It's even prohibited by the Geneva Convention.
 
2012-07-23 12:50:32 PM

A Fark Handle: WhyteRaven74: Kirk Herbstreit on ESPN was saying a few minutes ago that it'll be at least a decade before Penn State is competitive again at any level.

shiat, that means they be playing for the national championship in five. kirk's never right...

/ok, i'm just being mean now...


The thing is, they weren't competitive before the penalties.
 
2012-07-23 12:50:46 PM

Vodka Zombie: dj_spanmaster: I_Can't_Believe_it's_not_Boutros: Screw vacating wins. If the NCAA wants to hurt a team, they need to go back to TV bans. No appearances, no TV money from your conference.

If you want to kill a school's football program, this is a fantastic way to do it.

Not really. You're just pretending they don't exist with a TV ban, and you'd be hurting whatever team they happen to be playing that week by preventing their fans from watching.


Such a flippant statement reflects broad misunderstanding of the importance of television contracts to a football-driven university such as Penn State.
 
2012-07-23 12:50:53 PM

TheManofPA: Captain Steroid: Okay. I know I said in a previous thread that if Penn State didn't get the "death penalty", I would be done with college football. Even though that is not what the NCAA did, I do like the decision to strip them of all their wins from 1998 to today, and give the players the chance to transfer to any school that will take them.

Penn State football was not killed; it was just beaten to near-death with a crowbar, had its fingers cut off with a cigar cutter, and left in a ditch by the side of the road.

And I'm okay with that.

I do believe I'm allowed to rib you during the 1000th Raw thread for immediately hotshotting your face/heel turn with regard to college football.


Yeah, you are. -_-

\ #HEEL
 
2012-07-23 12:52:28 PM

A Fark Handle: Saza: Woah, did anyone see the part where any other school accepting players transferring from Penn State gets an extra spot on their roster and an extra scholarship for that transferring player - so that they don't have to bump anyone off their team?

The NCAA is giving every other school an incentive and the capability to go raid PSU's football program. PSU won't even have a team this year.

i hadn't seen that. got a source? god, i hope it's true.


I saw it as well but now I can't find the article...

Yeah, it any player can transfer out without penalizing the team TAKING that player....

Yeah, NCAA might have just have burned Penn State's program to the ground.

/or the players will go all "we are" on the situation and circle the wagons.
 
2012-07-23 12:53:06 PM

robsul82: [i63.photobucket.com image 640x427]


Ok, that was funnier than it should have been. On a football note, I never got to ask you how relieved you are about Brees signed long-term
 
2012-07-23 12:53:28 PM

nekom: treesloth: Ah, OK. I thought that perhaps it was a particularly subtle, and well-deserved, dig at the Catholic Church leadership. The name "pontiff" means, in effect, "bridge builder".

That never occurred to me, but it's true in their case as well. It's also true in both cases that covering things up in an attempt to make them go away turns out a lot worse when they finally do come to light. Plenty of parallels really.


No doubt. I mean, really, even if some administrator is acting entirely out of self-interest (and I'd like to hope for more enlightenment than that), blowing open the cover-up is still the smart move. It instantly cements a reputation for unimpeachable integrity and makes any institution that fires or refuses to hire them immediately suspect. As long as they're minimally competent at their regular job, they're guaranteed employment for life. And book deals, appearances on Oprah, whatever else.
 
2012-07-23 12:54:20 PM
Not speaking about this case specifically but I always wondered about the no bowl appearance penalty. Half the time they penalize a program such that they wouldn't have made a bowl game anyway, so the bowl ban essentially does nothing.

One year bowl ban, a team goes 5 - 7, what did the one year bowl ban do?

They should probably change it from "one year bowl ban" to "one bowl ban" meaning a team would be banned from a bowl whenever they qualified for one. So if a team goes 5 - 7 a couple of years it may be a while before the bowl ban is applied.
 
2012-07-23 12:54:31 PM

A Fark Handle:

//dibs on the linemen.


Pervert.
 
2012-07-23 12:55:02 PM

A Fark Handle: Saza: Woah, did anyone see the part where any other school accepting players transferring from Penn State gets an extra spot on their roster and an extra scholarship for that transferring player - so that they don't have to bump anyone off their team?

The NCAA is giving every other school an incentive and the capability to go raid PSU's football program. PSU won't even have a team this year.

i hadn't seen that. got a source? god, i hope it's true.


They're considering it. Not a done deal yet.
NCAA Website
 
2012-07-23 12:55:46 PM

KiwDaWabbit: they weren't competitive before the penalties.


True enough. I think Kirk meant competitive as a college football program in general.
 
2012-07-23 12:57:21 PM

jbtilley: Not speaking about this case specifically but I always wondered about the no bowl appearance penalty. Half the time they penalize a program such that they wouldn't have made a bowl game anyway, so the bowl ban essentially does nothing.

One year bowl ban, a team goes 5 - 7, what did the one year bowl ban do?

They should probably change it from "one year bowl ban" to "one bowl ban" meaning a team would be banned from a bowl whenever they qualified for one. So if a team goes 5 - 7 a couple of years it may be a while before the bowl ban is applied.


Now THAT would be unprecedented.
 
2012-07-23 12:57:38 PM

TheManofPA: robsul82: [i63.photobucket.com image 640x427]

Ok, that was funnier than it should have been. On a football note, I never got to ask you how relieved you are about Brees signed long-term


It's funny, knowing down to my bones that he'd sign eventually still didn't take away one iota of relief and happiness when he DID sign, lol. Spent the rest of the day fielding texts from friends about $40M for this season, etc.
 
2012-07-23 12:57:51 PM

treesloth: No doubt. I mean, really, even if some administrator is acting entirely out of self-interest (and I'd like to hope for more enlightenment than that), blowing open the cover-up is still the smart move. It instantly cements a reputation for unimpeachable integrity and makes any institution that fires or refuses to hire them immediately suspect. As long as they're minimally competent at their regular job, they're guaranteed employment for life. And book deals, appearances on Oprah, whatever else.


Just imagine if JoePa had first heard of that and said "WHAT??? Not on MY watch!" His legacy would be a legendary football coach and his statue would be there for generations to come. Even those acting in their own interests are often short sighted it seems. After all, it was the cover-up of Watergate, rather than the crime itself, that brought down the Nixon administration. Sometimes it's better to just take the damage up front instead of putting it off for awhile only for it to grow into something 10 times worse.
 
2012-07-23 12:58:20 PM

KiwDaWabbit: A Fark Handle: WhyteRaven74: Kirk Herbstreit on ESPN was saying a few minutes ago that it'll be at least a decade before Penn State is competitive again at any level.

shiat, that means they be playing for the national championship in five. kirk's never right...

/ok, i'm just being mean now...

The thing is, they weren't competitive before the penalties.


img845.imageshack.us

"Would that be 'pelaties' that we're talkin' about" ?
 
2012-07-23 12:58:21 PM

Nick Nostril: A Fark Handle:

//dibs on the linemen.

Pervert.


that's not true. they're adults...
 
2012-07-23 01:00:40 PM

treesloth: I mean, really, even if some administrator is acting entirely out of self-interest (and I'd like to hope for more enlightenment than that), blowing open the cover-up is still the smart move.


Which is why I make the points that this happened precisely because Paterno was old (from an era where you COULD cover things up and not from an era where whistleblowers are afforded much more protection and credit) and that the university president would have been untouchable by any imagined power Paterno had if he'd brought Sandusky's charges to light. Hell, Paterno goes two ways if the president does that - he fights against it and gets fired and looks terrible and like what he currently looks like, or he lets it go and eventually realizes that the president made the right choice and owes his career (and record) to him.
 
2012-07-23 01:00:46 PM

A Fark Handle: Nick Nostril: A Fark Handle:

//dibs on the linemen.

Pervert.

that's not true. they're adults...


You sound like someone who's never paid a hooker to tie him to the bed and slap him in the face with raw beef liver.
 
2012-07-23 01:01:13 PM
Here's 2 sources mentioning what will happen to players transferring - the article claiming that the teams accepting them would get extra roster spots has been taken down. Still looking for that from another source, but since it went down so fast maybe that was not true.

Sanctions

Penalties
 
2012-07-23 01:01:40 PM

mrsirjojo: Punish the guilty, hard.

Collective punishment is for the lazy and unintelligent. It's even prohibited by the Geneva Convention.


I'm pretty certain that this is why the sanctions were directed at Penn State University. I don't think anyone was calling for other universities to be punished. I'm sure we can all agree that would make no sense.
 
2012-07-23 01:03:14 PM

Saza: Still looking for that from another source, but since it went down so fast maybe that was not true.


the NCAA is considering doing it, so it might happen, might not.
 
2012-07-23 01:03:31 PM
Sorry if someone already mentioned this, but this means Mike McQueary is now the last Penn State QB to lead the team to a winning record.

SUDDENLY HIS DIABOLICAL PLOT MAKES SENSE
 
2012-07-23 01:05:22 PM

jesus_is_dead: A Fark Handle: Saza: Woah, did anyone see the part where any other school accepting players transferring from Penn State gets an extra spot on their roster and an extra scholarship for that transferring player - so that they don't have to bump anyone off their team?

The NCAA is giving every other school an incentive and the capability to go raid PSU's football program. PSU won't even have a team this year.

i hadn't seen that. got a source? god, i hope it's true.

They're considering it. Not a done deal yet.
NCAA Website


"Penn State cannot restrict in any way a student-athlete from pursuing a possible transfer. Student-athletes must simply inform Penn State of their interest in discussing transfer options with other schools. Interested schools also must inform Penn State of their intention to open discussions with the student-athlete."

Yep - that's an open invitation for the vultures. However - don't practices for many schools start this weekend (or are already in progress)? Can new students get into classes at this stage in the game? Can most "student-athletes" realistically afford to move quickly from, say, Pennsylvania to Virginia, let alone to California?

I'll bet the majority of transfers occur next year.
 
2012-07-23 01:05:45 PM

robsul82: TheManofPA: robsul82: [i63.photobucket.com image 640x427]

Ok, that was funnier than it should have been. On a football note, I never got to ask you how relieved you are about Brees signed long-term

It's funny, knowing down to my bones that he'd sign eventually still didn't take away one iota of relief and happiness when he DID sign, lol. Spent the rest of the day fielding texts from friends about $40M for this season, etc.


I was in Vegas during it and really debating the under on their total wins. It had dropped a game though when I was there. The minute he signed, I debated the over but really didn't want to risk money on what could be a random year for them. They might win 10 games and the wild card or they could bottom out and win 4 games.

All I know if Vick promised a dynasty so I'm ready for a 7-win Eagle year. Going to be sad when Andy goes after it, as much as people mock him, he provided many good years for Philly fans.
 
2012-07-23 01:07:21 PM
Wheee, PIG PILE!

Big Ten announced their sanctions:

Sanctions include a five-year probation period during which the conference will work closely with the NCAA and the school to ensure compliance. Penn State is also ineligible for the Big Ten championship game for four years, the same length of the postseason ban issued by the NCAA. Lastly, Penn State will forfeit its share of bowl revenue over the course of the postseason ban. The conference estimates the fine to be $13 million. The money will be donated to child protection charities in Big Ten communities.
 
2012-07-23 01:07:49 PM
T-Boy: So LSU just won the 2010 Capital One Bowl. Geaux Tigers!!

No they didn't, the game never happened. Vacated wins don't go to the other team.



I've got my GED in law, but I'm just spitballing here:

(1) Sponsor who loves Penn State enters contract with NCAA that says NCAA will provide bowl game in exchange for money.
(2) Penn State wins said bowl game.
(3) NCAA vacates victory, says game never happened.
(4) Sponsor sues for breech of contract?
 
2012-07-23 01:08:30 PM

Robo Beat: So are they rioting in State College yet?


I think the answer to that is "summer"

Summertime has probably saved that campus from major damage and injuries
 
2012-07-23 01:08:49 PM

IAmRight: professorkowalski: It's the NCAA wanting to make some kind of symbolic shot at a dead man, for shiats and giggles. Really, if they wanted to they could have vacated every win of Paterno's, but I'm guessing they just picked a number.

It would've made more sense if they went to 2001, which is where the coverup of the McQueary incident began, rather than 1998, which is the time of the one incident that WAS reported directly to the police and child welfare agencies and they said "Hey, so the guy likes showering with kids and hugging them naked. BFD."


You just don't know when to shut up do you?
 
2012-07-23 01:09:04 PM
FYI, Big 10 added a small slap on the wrist: Link

Apparently the post-season ban from the NCAA didn't actually include the Big 10 title game which makes it look like a slightly weaker punishment.
 
2012-07-23 01:09:36 PM

TheManofPA: I was in Vegas during it and really debating the under on their total wins. It had dropped a game though when I was there. The minute he signed, I debated the over but really didn't want to risk money on what could be a random year for them. They might win 10 games and the wild card or they could bottom out and win 4 games.


Yeah, anything could happen this year, but I think we're gonna shock a lot of people. :)

TheManofPA: All I know if Vick promised a dynasty so I'm ready for a 7-win Eagle year. Going to be sad when Andy goes after it, as much as people mock him, he provided many good years for Philly fans.


I can't wait for Angry Greg Ryan to have an aneurysm live on the air, lol. That guy was classic last year.
 
2012-07-23 01:09:53 PM
good
 
2012-07-23 01:11:16 PM

solitary: good


better
 
2012-07-23 01:12:21 PM
Let's see, a group of mid-Westerners shielded a serial child molester for decades and some people are having an issue with the fact that those child molesting enablers are being punished using a language that they understand.

What does that say about the morality of sports fans? Particularly, Penn State sports fans. Perhaps they thought that punishment was just something that you could slough off and continue with things the way they are.

Maybe Penn State fans can find some other team of Catholic priests that they can cheer for?
 
2012-07-23 01:12:41 PM

Elegy: A Fark Handle: Saza: Woah, did anyone see the part where any other school accepting players transferring from Penn State gets an extra spot on their roster and an extra scholarship for that transferring player - so that they don't have to bump anyone off their team?

The NCAA is giving every other school an incentive and the capability to go raid PSU's football program. PSU won't even have a team this year.

i hadn't seen that. got a source? god, i hope it's true.

I saw it as well but now I can't find the article...

Yeah, it any player can transfer out without penalizing the team TAKING that player....

Yeah, NCAA might have just have burned Penn State's program to the ground.

/or the players will go all "we are" on the situation and circle the wagons.


One commentary I've heard on that particular point is when the NCAA levys scholarship penalties as here, you don't generally see too many defections among the players that are already there, since they all know each other and have all that shared experience of practices and camps and training together and whatall.

But where it really does hurt the team is in recruiting, since (a) the recruits for the next few years don't have those shared trials and tribulations to bind themselves together, so they're much more self-oriented in their decisions, and (b) the cuts in scholarships makes it that much more difficult to build a deep program, since while some of those players have indeed always wanted to play for Penn State and wear the blue and white, many of them just want to play top-flight football and would rather do it somewhere where they can get a scholarship to do so instead of paying tuition.
 
2012-07-23 01:13:35 PM

AliceBToklasLives: jesus_is_dead: A Fark Handle: Saza: Woah, did anyone see the part where any other school accepting players transferring from Penn State gets an extra spot on their roster and an extra scholarship for that transferring player - so that they don't have to bump anyone off their team?

The NCAA is giving every other school an incentive and the capability to go raid PSU's football program. PSU won't even have a team this year.

i hadn't seen that. got a source? god, i hope it's true.

They're considering it. Not a done deal yet.
NCAA Website

"Penn State cannot restrict in any way a student-athlete from pursuing a possible transfer. Student-athletes must simply inform Penn State of their interest in discussing transfer options with other schools. Interested schools also must inform Penn State of their intention to open discussions with the student-athlete."

Yep - that's an open invitation for the vultures. However - don't practices for many schools start this weekend (or are already in progress)? Can new students get into classes at this stage in the game? Can most "student-athletes" realistically afford to move quickly from, say, Pennsylvania to Virginia, let alone to California?

I'll bet the majority of transfers occur next year.


"One of the stranger sights of the day, and one the NCAA most likely did not anticipate, was the number of recruiters from other institutions that were on campus for the news. They descended upon the Hilltop like buzzards, to pick at the carcass of the SMU football program. The better players were besieged with offers from other schools."

Granted that happened in February and not July, but I guarantee that every coach in the country is trying to find a way to make room on his roster to bring in some player that he targeted in the past.
 
2012-07-23 01:13:57 PM

Publikwerks: Same thing really, asterisking and vacating the wins. The other team doesn't get a win. Penn St just doesn't get a win either.


The thing is, Penn State really did win those games. Football games aren't a contest of moral superiority.
 
2012-07-23 01:15:35 PM

Kome: Donations to the school are going to all but disappear, student enrollment is going to drop, and a fine educational institution is going to be irrevocably damaged because of the football program.


Voltaire said it best:

Mais, dit Candide, l'amiral français était aussi loin de l'amiral anglais que celui-ci l'était de l'autre! Cela est incontestable, lui répliqua-t-on; mais dans ce pays-ci il est bon de tuer de temps en temps un amiral pour encourager les autres.
 
2012-07-23 01:15:35 PM
Here's a pic of the PSU student union building as the punishment was announced.

i.imgur.com

Really? I'm fanatical about football as much as the next person but this is really silly behaviour.
 
2012-07-23 01:15:37 PM

fireclown: The thing is, Penn State really did win those games. Football games aren't a contest of moral superiority.


I will agree with that once Jesus stops getting credit for successful play.
 
2012-07-23 01:16:08 PM

TheManofPA: FYI, Big 10 added a small slap on the wrist: Link

Apparently the post-season ban from the NCAA didn't actually include the Big 10 title game which makes it look like a slightly weaker punishment.


Meh. The NCAA has no control over the conferences and their championship game. The same thing happened with USC. The NCAA imposed a two-year bowl ban, but it was the PAC-12 that banned them from the championship game.
 
2012-07-23 01:16:27 PM

rosebud_the_sled: Let's see, a group of mid-Westerners shielded a serial child molester for decades and some people are having an issue with the fact that those child molesting enablers are being punished using a language that they understand.

What does that say about the morality of sports fans? Particularly, Penn State sports fans. Perhaps they thought that punishment was just something that you could slough off and continue with things the way they are.

Maybe Penn State fans can find some other team of Catholic priests that they can cheer for?


Good point. Through this all, a lot of Penn State fans have been pretty disgusting. I think a lot of that will change once their team starts losing again and again.
 
2012-07-23 01:17:35 PM

rugman11: "One of the stranger sights of the day, and one the NCAA most likely did not anticipate, was the number of recruiters from other institutions that were on campus for the news. They descended upon the Hilltop like buzzards, to pick at the carcass of the SMU football program. The better players were besieged with offers from other schools."

Granted that happened in February and not July, but I guarantee that every coach in the country is trying to find a way to make room on his roster to bring in some player that he targeted in the past.


i really want to see this. sort of the reserve of joepa's now creepy "COME TO PENN STATE!" big10 commercial a few years back. need that on campus recruiting b-roll in hd.
 
2012-07-23 01:17:52 PM

carnifex2005: Here's a pic of the PSU student union building as the punishment was announced.

[i.imgur.com image 600x400]

Really? I'm fanatical about football as much as the next person but this is really silly behaviour.


Is this the See No Evil, Smell No Evil theory?
 
2012-07-23 01:19:15 PM

A Fark Handle: sort of the reserve of joepa's now creepy "COME TO PENN STATE!" big10 commercial a few years back.


That commercial was creepy the moment it aired. It just added another level with these incidents.
 
2012-07-23 01:19:49 PM

IAmRight: WhyteRaven74: Outside of some Penn State fanatics, no one gives a damn about Paterno's record any more.

Outside of the coaches involved and trivia nerds, no one really gives a damn about which coach has the most wins in general.


Bobby Bowden cares daggummit.
 
2012-07-23 01:20:06 PM
I'm not sure how to react to that headline. What does that even mean?
 
2012-07-23 01:20:08 PM

fireclown: Publikwerks: Same thing really, asterisking and vacating the wins. The other team doesn't get a win. Penn St just doesn't get a win either.

The thing is, Penn State really did win those games. Football games aren't a contest of moral superiority.


I'm not sure the sting of former NCAA players losing a game to Penn State 10 years ago will wear on them. Thankfully, though, vacating the wins unraped those kids and gave them a wholesome family life and instilled trust, stability, and confidence to their consciences.
 
2012-07-23 01:20:20 PM
Forgive me, I know nothing about college football. Would anyone want to play for them if they can't participate in the post season? It'd be like playing for an NFL team that's ineligible for the Super Bowl, right?
 
2012-07-23 01:20:37 PM

IAmRight: A Fark Handle: sort of the reserve of joepa's now creepy "COME TO PENN STATE!" big10 commercial a few years back.

That commercial was creepy the moment it aired. It just added another level with these incidents.


yeah it was sad watching a man clearly suffering from dementia embarrass himself in a commercial...silly old people.
 
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