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(ESPN)   Penn State gets Sandusky'd   (espn.go.com) divider line 1081
    More: News, Penn State, Sandusky'd, Mark Emmert, President Ma, College Coach, Beaver Stadium, defensive coordinator, Joe Schad  
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16149 clicks; posted to Main » on 23 Jul 2012 at 9:44 AM (2 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2012-07-23 10:00:40 AM  

R.A.Danny: This is the winner?


it sure is - and well earned if you ask me.

/not subby
 
2012-07-23 10:00:44 AM  
so what reggie bush did was less than half as bad as facilitating child rape for over a decade?
 
2012-07-23 10:00:50 AM  
I just want to point out that I checked the Wikipedia entry for the all time coaching wins record around 8:30 and Paterno's record had already been corrected.
 
2012-07-23 10:00:51 AM  

Endive Wombat: Nabb1: 13 years of Joe Paterno victories have been knocked off

But on a technicality by the governing body. I mean, they still won.

I guess my question is will this affect say...betting number and stat matrices in Vegas?


Well, any bets on Penn State winning a bowl game in the next four years suddenly become really long shots.

/just think of the potential payout though!
 
2012-07-23 10:00:53 AM  

Tenga: So Bobby Bowden is now the winningest coach?


Ya. Paterno will still be in the record books, but it will be for most consecutive losses.
 
2012-07-23 10:00:58 AM  

cameroncrazy1984: mister aj: One man touches a kid in his special place, and that means that you can:

- Travel back in time, pretend some wins never happened
- Destroy an entire university
- Take away scholarships from people that need them
- Taint the reputations of the best of the student body, and possibly destroy their future football careers

Yup, that's justice.

Oh yeah, just pretend that a 14 year cover-up never happened.


Oh come on, they were kids that had never been shown any love in their lives. What he was doing is showing what love is like when you become an adult.

Am I doing it right?
 
2012-07-23 10:01:03 AM  

stonicus: Well, it hurts students on many levels. One, it's a huge farking distraction for them. College is hard enough.


Oh god, not a distraction! That's so terrible. PSU students should be shielded from the reality that their university officials covered up child abuse at their campus for 14 years. Because they are precious little snowflakes.
 
2012-07-23 10:01:14 AM  
But does it say how long before Joe Paterno can coach again?
 
2012-07-23 10:01:19 AM  

RumsfeldsReplacement: kdawg7736: I can accept the other punishments but vacating the last 14 years is bs to me.

Why? That makes perfect sense to me. JoePa doesn't get those wins, which means that ALL he will be remembered for 20 years from now is kiddie rape. That's as much justice as there will ever be with him.

As for the other punishments, $60 million that will go towards fighting other abuses is good, no bowls for a while is OK. I still would have like a total suspension of play for a couple of years, but we can't get everything I guess.


I love, love, love this punishment. So great.
 
2012-07-23 10:01:29 AM  

brobdiggy: Did Sandusky somehow give the team an onfield advantage such that the wins were illegitimate?



YES. Of course it did. Do you know nothing of college football recruiting? How many down-to-the-wire battles for big recruits would PSU have lost if this had been public knowledge? "Pedo State" would have suffered big time in the recruiting fight against other schools -- those schools would have skewered them with this. Better recruits means more wins. So they ABSOLUTELY did better than they would have. Not to mention, there's a good chance Paterno would have been forced out a decade ago if this had become public.
 
2012-07-23 10:01:35 AM  

mister aj: One man touches a kid in his special place, and that means that you can:


Well, for starters, it wasn't one kid, it was several kids over several years, and there was a conspiracy among those in the football program, including the head coach to cover it up.

Furthermore, no one is losing scholarships. Players are allowed to transfer. Penn State won't be destroied by this (though the Civil suits may be another story).

Paterno's legacy needed to be destroyed. He protected a child molester, and created a situation where a man was able to rape at least three children.
 
2012-07-23 10:01:38 AM  

RexTalionis: Endive Wombat: So doesn't this fark over current students (players)? What about folks who went to Penn State and are now in the Pros? Are they not "allowed" to put their Penn State football achievements on their resume?

NCAA is allowing players to transfer to different universities with no penalties, so other schools are going to pick up Penn State's best players. Also, what do the people in the Pros care? They're already in the pros.


Looking into the future and getting into the hall of fame? Being able to shoot off bragging stats like:

In High School - X# of touchdowns and yards ran
In College - X# of touchdowns and yards ran
In the Pros - X# of touchdowns and yards ran
 
2012-07-23 10:01:51 AM  

R.A.Danny: austin_millbarge: /but that punishes the students and players right?

So? They hitched their wagons to a horribly corrupt program. That's the breaks.


That's kinda of what i was saying, yes. My slashie was what other people are likely saying.
 
2012-07-23 10:01:58 AM  

Funk Brothers: Penn State just got some urban renewal.


You can bet this scumbag will be on the PSU campus first thing to take players, most coaches are scumbags a few are better at hiding it namely saban, Meyer, and joepa
 
2012-07-23 10:02:11 AM  
Screw vacating wins. If the NCAA wants to hurt a team, they need to go back to TV bans. No appearances, no TV money from your conference.
 
2012-07-23 10:02:26 AM  
I'm thinking we need some perspective on this. It's unfortunate that the current players are being affected, but that's not the NCAA's fault. That's Jerry Sandusky's fault. And Joe Paterno's. And Tim Curley's. Point the finger at them. One call to the police back in 98 would have caused a scandal, but they would have recovered, and most likely would have been hailed as heroes for bringing a child rapist to justice.

Children were raped while the PSU athletic program chose to look the other way, and we're whining about whether a kid gets to play football as his first-choice school. Really?
 
2012-07-23 10:02:32 AM  

Endive Wombat: Looking into the future and getting into the hall of fame? Being able to shoot off bragging stats like:

In High School - X# of touchdowns and yards ran
In College - X# of touchdowns and yards ran
In the Pros - X# of touchdowns and yards ran


Hall of Fame only looks at your pro stats. There's a College Football Hall of Fame for what you did in College. So, I guess it could affect that.
 
2012-07-23 10:02:37 AM  
Show me on this bowl bracket where the NCAA touched you.
 
2012-07-23 10:02:44 AM  
So....free tattoos, accepting autograph fees and covering it up = 1 year bowl ban.
Facilitating child rape for over a decade and giving the child rapist a cash bonus and covering up multiple child rapes = 4-year bowl ban.

Does anyone really think what PSU did is only 4 times worse?
 
2012-07-23 10:02:47 AM  

mister aj: One man touches a kid in his special place, and that means that you can:

- Travel back in time, pretend some wins never happened
- Destroy an entire university
- Take away scholarships from people that need them
- Taint the reputations of the best of the student body, and possibly destroy their future football careers

Yup, that's justice.


Vacating the wins isn't a bad idea, actually, since it's the only way to punish Paterno (him being dead and all), but the rest is knee-jerk reactionism designed solely for PR purposes. If they actually want to do something legitimate, announce publicly that they're going to investigate, determine who was complicit in the cover-up, and ban them from working at NCAA member institutions for life.

But no, instead completely bypass your own rules and pass down punishment that only affects people who had nothing to do with the scandal you're supposedly addressing. Farking mob mentality.
 
2012-07-23 10:02:48 AM  
WhoIsWillo: Make no mistake, Beaver Stadium will be full. Joe Paterno will be worshiped and nothing about the football culture at Penn State will change. If anything, this will make them feel more victimized.

agree...but will they stadium fill after a few 2-9 seasons? i honestly don't know.
 
2012-07-23 10:02:55 AM  

brobdiggy: kdawg7736: I can accept the other punishments but vacating the last 14 years is bs to me.

I agree. Did Sandusky somehow give the team an onfield advantage such that the wins were illegitimate?
Hint: The answer is no.


Yeah, and despite the haters on here, we will recover and be back on top once this is all said and done. The next few years will be hard, but we will be back.
 
2012-07-23 10:02:59 AM  
Seems fair.

But it does remind of this passage from 1984 :

Most of the material that you were dealing with had no connexion with anything in
the real world, not even the kind of connexion that is contained in a direct lie.
Statistics were just as much a fantasy in their original version as in their rectified
version. A great deal of the time you were expected to make them up out of your
head. For example, the Ministry of Plenty's forecast had estimated the output of
boots for the quarter at 145 million pairs. The actual output was given as sixty-two
millions. Winston, however, in rewriting the forecast, marked the figure down to
fifty-seven millions, so as to allow for the usual claim that the quota had been
overfulfilled. In any case, sixty-two millions was no nearer the truth than fiftyseven
millions, or than 145 millions. Very likely no boots had been produced at all.



/hungover
 
2012-07-23 10:03:10 AM  

WhoIsWillo: One penalty the NCAA didn't issue that I would have:

All games for the next season must be played on the practice facility.

Make no mistake, Beaver Stadium will be full. Joe Paterno will be worshiped and nothing about the football culture at Penn State will change. If anything, this will make them feel more victimized.


Or, make them play every game on the road, no home games at all for four years. According to the story, that should be worth about $60 million dollars per year to Penn State. It would be a big fark you to the fan base who would otherwise worship Joe Pa.

Next, I want to see the Big Ten dump them from the conference.
 
2012-07-23 10:03:14 AM  

Arkham: 2: No post season for 4 years. This is very bad, because now there are no bowl games. Boosters will not give as much money, advertising revenue will drop, and PS will not be able to take part in the new playoff system. Even worse, referring to point #1, a lot of good quality talent will pass on PS to go to Michigan or Ohio for the post season games. Why play your ass off for a school that isn't going to have a post season?


They don't get to play in the post-season -- wondering if that also means that they don't get their 1/12 cut of the Big Ten bowl payout?
 
2012-07-23 10:03:14 AM  

austin_millbarge: ScouserDuck: and by saying a team has lost every game since '98, you demoralize the entire fanbase.

..no, it knocks the child molester sympathizer Paterno off his perch as the winningest coach.

/but that punishes the students and players right?


I was speaking as a college football fan. I would be crushed if my team's record was 0-14 years. But what you and others had said is correct too.
 
2012-07-23 10:03:26 AM  

Endive Wombat: RexTalionis: Endive Wombat: So doesn't this fark over current students (players)? What about folks who went to Penn State and are now in the Pros? Are they not "allowed" to put their Penn State football achievements on their resume?

NCAA is allowing players to transfer to different universities with no penalties, so other schools are going to pick up Penn State's best players. Also, what do the people in the Pros care? They're already in the pros.

Looking into the future and getting into the hall of fame? Being able to shoot off bragging stats like:

In High School - X# of touchdowns and yards ran
In College - X# of touchdowns and yards ran
In the Pros - X# of touchdowns and yards ran


Once you are in the pros no one cares what you did in college.
 
2012-07-23 10:03:30 AM  

brobdiggy: Well, that might be a bit dramatic, but I'm still concerned it might give people an incentive to keep their mouth shut. What if someone sees a coach or administrator doing something illegal, but doesn't say anything about because they don't want to feel responsible for losing 4 years of scholarships and vacating 10+ years of wins?


Sure... if they've already been covering up child rape for 10+ years. OTOH, this will give a coach or administrator incentive to immediately go public if they find out about something for the first time in the future.
 
2012-07-23 10:03:30 AM  

brobdiggy: Well, that might be a bit dramatic, but I'm still concerned it might give people an incentive to keep their mouth shut. What if someone sees a coach or administrator doing something illegal, but doesn't say anything about because they don't want to feel responsible for losing 4 years of scholarships and vacating 10+ years of wins?


That's a valid concern, but what's a better alternative? Rewarding those who come forward? A cash prize for whistle blowers?
 
2012-07-23 10:03:33 AM  
How much damage will the scholarship ban really do? If a team can give out 25 new scholarships not more than 85 total. They lose ten now, they are down to 75 total football scholarships but they still get to add 15 more next year. I get that many students graduate and this will have a real impact, but is it really such a decisive blow or just a big pain in the ass...so to speak?
 
2012-07-23 10:03:36 AM  

Endive Wombat: FTFA: "The NCAA has hit Penn State with a $60 million sanction, a four-year football postseason ban and a vacation of all wins dating to 1998, the organization said Monday morning."

Can someone please explain to a non-sports fan why this is important?


imagine if ray lamontagne had his beard shorn off and all white stripes MP3s were deleted.
 
2012-07-23 10:03:38 AM  

Endive Wombat: RexTalionis: Endive Wombat: So doesn't this fark over current students (players)? What about folks who went to Penn State and are now in the Pros? Are they not "allowed" to put their Penn State football achievements on their resume?

NCAA is allowing players to transfer to different universities with no penalties, so other schools are going to pick up Penn State's best players. Also, what do the people in the Pros care? They're already in the pros.

Looking into the future and getting into the hall of fame? Being able to shoot off bragging stats like:

In High School - X# of touchdowns and yards ran
In College - X# of touchdowns and yards ran
In the Pros - X# of touchdowns and yards ran


They'll still get the # of touchdowns and yards ran.
 
2012-07-23 10:03:39 AM  

Endive Wombat: Can someone please explain to a non-sports fan why this is important?


The bowl ban (and the loss of scholarships) basically means that the university will lose hundreds of millions of dollars, and the football program will probably never recover.

The vacated wins basically means nothing.

As long as current players are allowed to transfer without penalty, then I have no problem with this. They should have decided this earlier, though, to give those kids time.
 
2012-07-23 10:03:53 AM  

AndreMA: I wonder how many innocent players whose careers the NCAA just harmed? How about just removing credit from Paterno for those wins, while allowing them to stand for the players, so as not to hurt their NFL recruitment prospects?

Talk about compounding the damage; I think the NCAA took a few too many hits to the head.


NONE, every football player on that program will have the option to immediately switch and play for another school. Normally to do this they have to wait 1 year before they are allowed to play, that is waived in this case.
 
2012-07-23 10:03:56 AM  
It's not enough.

You want to know what's enough? Nothing. Not a damn thing.

But I would have STARTED with one year of the death penalty for every count for which Sandusky was convicted.

GFY, Penn State.

You too, Emmert. If you're gonna make a stand, make a farking stand.
 
2012-07-23 10:03:58 AM  

stonicus: As for my resume analogy, it was a bad one. =)


Yeah, I do not know what else to compare it to.
 
2012-07-23 10:04:10 AM  

brobdiggy: Unintended Consequence:

*Meanwhile, at some other University*

"Holy crap! Look what the NCAA just dropped on Penn State! We'd better be extra careful now to cover up all of our legal indescretions. Delete all emails, burn all papers! Fix any 'leaks' by any means necessary! They have set a precedent now where they can punish us for any legal wrongdoing!"

Well, that might be a bit dramatic, but I'm still concerned it might give people an incentive to keep their mouth shut. What if someone sees a coach or administrator doing something illegal, but doesn't say anything about because they don't want to feel responsible for losing 4 years of scholarships and vacating 10+ years of wins?


The cover up is worse than the crime. If you're going to blow the whistle, make sure it's to an outside legal authority.
 
2012-07-23 10:04:12 AM  

brobdiggy: Well, that might be a bit dramatic, but I'm still concerned it might give people an incentive to keep their mouth shut. What if someone sees a coach or administrator doing something illegal, but doesn't say anything about because they don't want to feel responsible for losing 4 years of scholarships and vacating 10+ years of wins?


You do realize that the underlined is exactly what happened, but they were avoiding 'feeling responsible' about giving the football program and/or the university a bad name.
 
2012-07-23 10:04:16 AM  
All you PSU apologists need to take a serious look in the mirror. Your blind worship of the program is part of what allowed this cover-up to occur!

Rub your faces in this pile of crap, and get used to it, because you earned it. It's only a game, he was only a man, and the school will accept its punishment and move on.
 
2012-07-23 10:04:23 AM  
Breaking News: The NCAA also ordered Penn State to change their mascot
i2.kym-cdn.com
 
2012-07-23 10:04:33 AM  

Carousel Beast: Farking mob mentality.


You Joepa White Knights keep throwing this term around. Please stop as it does not fit the situation and makes you look stupid.

Thanks!
 
2012-07-23 10:04:37 AM  

gimmegimme: So....free tattoos, accepting autograph fees and covering it up = 1 year bowl ban.
Facilitating child rape for over a decade and giving the child rapist a cash bonus and covering up multiple child rapes = 4-year bowl ban.

Does anyone really think what PSU did is only 4 times worse?


Sure, if that was the only sanction given to PSU. But it wasn't, so I'm not sure what your point is.
 
2012-07-23 10:04:40 AM  

Congratulations to Bobby Bowden, the retroactive all time wins leader! Oh, and good job to that Robertson guy from the black school too.

- Willard Mitt Romney (@MlTTR0MNEY) July 23, 2012
 
2012-07-23 10:04:46 AM  

AndreMA: I wonder how many innocent players whose careers the NCAA just harmed? How about just removing credit from Paterno for those wins, while allowing them to stand for the players, so as not to hurt their NFL recruitment prospects?

Talk about compounding the damage; I think the NCAA took a few too many hits to the head.


The NFL doesn't give a shiat how many games you've won. If you're a monster on a bad team, you'll get drafted. All the NFL cares about is performance. The worst player on Alabama this year still isn't getting drafted.
 
2012-07-23 10:05:00 AM  
Jim Delaney to announce Big 10 sanctions at 10.
 
2012-07-23 10:05:02 AM  
So Joe Pa is now only the 5th winningest coach in D-1 history? Eh, no wonder they tore down his statue.
 
2012-07-23 10:05:18 AM  
What's really scary is that PSU and other schools just got the message that covering up their faculty's and coaches' sexual assault of children is OK. Sandusky wasn't they only one doing this. So did Neisworth and Lasaga. I fully expect more stories in the future of university faculty abusing children with impunity.

/ooohh $60 million
//they'll just raise tuition
///baring bankruptcy faculty and coaches get their 6 figure salaries no matter what
 
2012-07-23 10:05:32 AM  
Let's kick 'em out of the Big Ten as well!
 
2012-07-23 10:05:36 AM  
I hope the Polk High Panthers never have a scandal like this. Al Bundy would be crushed...
 
2012-07-23 10:05:37 AM  

brobdiggy: Unintended Consequence:

*Meanwhile, at some other University*

"Holy crap! Look what the NCAA just dropped on Penn State! We'd better be extra careful now to cover up all of our legal indescretions. Delete all emails, burn all papers! Fix any 'leaks' by any means necessary! They have set a precedent now where they can punish us for any legal wrongdoing!"

Well, that might be a bit dramatic, but I'm still concerned it might give people an incentive to keep their mouth shut. What if someone sees a coach or administrator doing something illegal, but doesn't say anything about because they don't want to feel responsible for losing 4 years of scholarships and vacating 10+ years of wins?


If anyone looks at the NCAA's reaction to a nearly fifteen-year coverup of serial child rape and thinks "woah, we'd better cover whatever we're doing up even better!", that person is an idiot, and the administration that listens to that person will deserve the consequences.
 
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