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(Guardian)   New study shows that the rich are hiding between $21-32 trillion in offshore tax havens around the world. A sum greater than the entire US economy and enough to bail out all of the EU and put Africa on its feet   (guardian.co.uk) divider line 306
    More: Asinine, tax havens  
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3864 clicks; posted to Politics » on 22 Jul 2012 at 2:47 AM (2 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2012-07-22 09:29:21 AM  

mark rathburn:

No, I am saying the progressive ideology was behind the worst atrocities of the last century - see China, The Soviet Union ...


Yeah, see, this is where you need to actually read up on ideologies instead of believing everything Glenn Beck's 'university' tells you. Authoritarian governments (such as the 2 you posted, which are actually authoritarian governments, not true 'communist' countries) are in no way 'progressive'.

But in the end, I'm sure you're just an annoying troll who can spout right wing soundbites just as well as the rest of the troll brigade here.
 
2012-07-22 09:29:28 AM  

mark rathburn: No, I am saying the progressive ideology was behind the worst atrocities of the last century - see China, The Soviet Union, Korea and Cambodia. And that many Farkers seem to want to bring back those halcyon days.


3.bp.blogspot.com

You're even boring Zombie Pol Pot.
 
2012-07-22 09:29:30 AM  
mark rathburn is either an alt of skinnyhead, or they had the same, butterfingered obstetrician.
 
2012-07-22 09:31:07 AM  

AurizenDarkstar: But in the end, I'm sure you're just an annoying troll who can spout right wing soundbites just as well as the rest of the troll brigade here.


I think he's the real thing. Two posts in and he was already a victim.
 
2012-07-22 09:31:45 AM  

GGracie: And??? People are money grubbing scumbags. Next...


...and you're part of the problem.

/Roll over, go back to sleep. It'll all be over soon...
 
2012-07-22 09:32:29 AM  
The progressive mindset at its root is an authoritarian one. It has to be beacuse it goes against human nature (which, horror of horrors, is selfish), and so can only be implemented by force
 
2012-07-22 09:32:47 AM  
Comedian Jimmy Carr became the public face of tax-dodging in the UK earlier this year when it emerged that he had made use of a Cayman Islands-based trust to slash his income tax bill.

But the important question is, how fast will he be going around the Top Gear track this time around?

i3.ytimg.com
 
2012-07-22 09:35:02 AM  

mark rathburn: Tor_Eckman: mark rathburn: This just in - people don't like to pay taxes and will avoid it if possible.
Progressives have killed hundreds of millions of people in the last 200 years trying to change human nature because they just can't accept the fact that some people could possibly have an unfair advantage somehow. From the violent masturbatory fantasies I read on just about every Fark politics thread, there is a large portion of the population so filled with hate and envy that they can't wait for the next revolution to begin so they can slit some throats, hopefully of 'the rich', but it really doesn't matter.
Really, why does this surprise anyone? When the president comes out and demonizes you because you're rich, when he tells you flat out he's coming after your money because the government deserves it more than you do, and knows how to spend it more wisely, when he has shown from his record that his intent is to take your wealth and redistribute it to his union cronies and campaign contributors, and when he pours massive amounts of wealth down a black hole without any idea of what he is doing, of course people will try to hide their money from him
.

Is there a StopArrestingMe-type theme here, or are you just another "new" idiot troll?

Is there a point you're trying to make, or shall I just assume you're an ass?


Login: mark rathburn (Want to sponsor this Farker for TotalFark?) (What's TotalFark?)
Fark account number: 781436
Account created: 2012-05-03 13:23:11
Submitted links approved: None

Guess which one.
 
2012-07-22 09:43:50 AM  

mark rathburn: The progressive mindset at its root is an authoritarian one. It has to be beacuse it goes against human nature (which, horror of horrors, is selfish), and so can only be implemented by force


You're funny. When did they let you out of your rubber room to post to the internet?
 
2012-07-22 09:47:38 AM  

IlGreven: GGracie: And??? People are money grubbing scumbags. Next...

...and you're part of the problem.

/Roll over, go back to sleep. It'll all be over soon...


People will always be money-grubbing scumbags - that is human nature. Therefor, according to you, the entire human race is part of the problem.
 
2012-07-22 09:48:58 AM  
"You know, I think it's fine to talk about those things in quiet rooms..."

www.washingtonpost.com
 
2012-07-22 09:50:41 AM  

mark rathburn: The progressive mindset at its root is an authoritarian one. It has to be beacuse it goes against human nature (which, horror of horrors, is selfish), and so can only be implemented by force


You're changing the topic. Why don't you want to talk about taxes any more, Mark?
 
2012-07-22 09:51:45 AM  

mark rathburn: The progressive mindset at its root is an authoritarian one. It has to be beacuse it goes against human nature (which, horror of horrors, is selfish), and so can only be implemented by force


all laws of civilized society go against "human nature"

if you want true individual liberty to the nth degree go live by yourself in the mountains away from society. forage and hunt for your own sustenance and quit biatching about the benefits of society that allow you to prosper.
 
2012-07-22 09:53:49 AM  

AurizenDarkstar: mark rathburn: The progressive mindset at its root is an authoritarian one. It has to be beacuse it goes against human nature (which, horror of horrors, is selfish), and so can only be implemented by force

You're funny. When did they let you out of your rubber room to post to the internet?


Any political ideology which fundamentally contradicts human nature, which is selfish and tribal, is doomed to failure. Hundreds of millions died last century to prove that point, but let's just keep fighting those class wars, shall we?
 
2012-07-22 09:54:06 AM  

mark rathburn: Tor_Eckman: mark rathburn: Tor_Eckman: mark rathburn: This just in - people don't like to pay taxes and will avoid it if possible.
Progressives have killed hundreds of millions of people in the last 200 years trying to change human nature because they just can't accept the fact that some people could possibly have an unfair advantage somehow. From the violent masturbatory fantasies I read on just about every Fark politics thread, there is a large portion of the population so filled with hate and envy that they can't wait for the next revolution to begin so they can slit some throats, hopefully of 'the rich', but it really doesn't matter.
Really, why does this surprise anyone? When the president comes out and demonizes you because you're rich, when he tells you flat out he's coming after your money because the government deserves it more than you do, and knows how to spend it more wisely, when he has shown from his record that his intent is to take your wealth and redistribute it to his union cronies and campaign contributors, and when he pours massive amounts of wealth down a black hole without any idea of what he is doing, of course people will try to hide their money from him
.

Is there a StopArrestingMe-type theme here, or are you just another "new" idiot troll?

Is there a point you're trying to make, or shall I just assume you're an ass?

Your screed is so full of ridiculous right-wing, Fox News, Glen Beck, Obama Derangement Syndrome talking points that I thought it was most certainly some sort of parody.

It appears I was in error.

What part do you disagree with - that progressives have killed millions last century? That Obama has rewarded his union cronies with tax money? That a large portion of Farkers write about their violent fantasies against the rich? Or that people don't like to pay taxes?


I think the part that folks disagree with is that you might possibly be anything more than a talking point spout.

Folks are going to be burning through Troll accounts this Silly Season...
 
2012-07-22 09:58:12 AM  

mark rathburn: AurizenDarkstar: mark rathburn: The progressive mindset at its root is an authoritarian one. It has to be beacuse it goes against human nature (which, horror of horrors, is selfish), and so can only be implemented by force

You're funny. When did they let you out of your rubber room to post to the internet?

Any political ideology which fundamentally contradicts human nature, which is selfish and tribal, is doomed to failure. Hundreds of millions died last century to prove that point, but let's just keep fighting those class wars, shall we?


Right. And if progressivism were anything like what you are saying, I would agree with you. However progressivism =/= authoritarianism, no matter how you want to try and shoehorn it in. Unless you think that the abolition of slavery, the suffrage of women, and a lot of the things that a certain President (Teddy Roosevelt) suggested for our country as being authoritarian.
 
2012-07-22 10:01:53 AM  

Hobodeluxe: mark rathburn: The progressive mindset at its root is an authoritarian one. It has to be beacuse it goes against human nature (which, horror of horrors, is selfish), and so can only be implemented by force

all laws of civilized society go against "human nature"

if you want true individual liberty to the nth degree go live by yourself in the mountains away from society. forage and hunt for your own sustenance and quit biatching about the benefits of society that allow you to prosper.


All laws to some extent impinge on individual liberty, true. I am talking about not laws, but ideologies - any political system which contradicts human nature must fail.
 
2012-07-22 10:02:35 AM  

mark rathburn: AurizenDarkstar: mark rathburn: The progressive mindset at its root is an authoritarian one. It has to be beacuse it goes against human nature (which, horror of horrors, is selfish), and so can only be implemented by force

You're funny. When did they let you out of your rubber room to post to the internet?

Any political ideology which fundamentally contradicts human nature, which is selfish and tribal, is doomed to failure. Hundreds of millions died last century to prove that point, but let's just keep fighting those class wars, shall we?


Did you just bring that from your philosophy class homework? Society has been inventing new forms of government to bring an order to the chaos of the world around for thousands of years, seems like it keeps on going and with few exceptions we are not exactly living in a world dominated by small tribes or familial ties alone. I guess that means human nature is "progressive" and you're a regressive idiot.
 
2012-07-22 10:03:22 AM  

mark rathburn: AurizenDarkstar: mark rathburn:

What part do you disagree with - that progressives have killed millions last century? That Obama has rewarded his union cronies with tax money? That a large portion of Farkers write about their violent fantasies against the rich? Or that people don't like to pay taxes?

Really? So you're saying that things done by progressives in this country have directly attributed to the deaths of AurizenDarkstar: mark rathburn:

What part do you disagree with - that progressives have killed millions last century? That Obama has rewarded his union cronies with tax money? That a large portion of Farkers write about their violent fantasies against the rich? Or that people don't like to pay taxes?

Really? So you're saying that things done by progressives in this country have directly attributed to the deaths of millions? I'm sure you have more evidence than your fevered imagination, right? Or are you somehow equating authoritarians around the world as being your evil 'progressives'? I'm sure in your addled mind, you equate authoritarian governments (like the former Soviet Union) as being composed of your imaginary 'progressives', right?

If so, you may want to start actually reading up on governmental theory and how each form of governing is not like the other, no matter what the right wing noise machine tells you.

millions? I'm sure you have more evidence than your fevered imagination, right? Or are you somehow equating authoritarians around the world as being your evil 'progressives'? I'm sure in your addled mind, you equate authoritarian governments (like the former Soviet Union) as being composed of your imaginary 'progressives', right?

If so, you may want to start actually reading up on governmental theory and how each form of governing is not like the other, no matter what the right wing noise machine tells you.

No, I am saying the progressive ideology was behind the worst atrocities of the last century - see China, The Soviet Union ...


Semantic arguments are for children. i could label the people you listed as "reactionary extremists" as casually and accurately as you label them "progressives". What you have laid down here is an emotional, melodramatic screed consisting almost entirely of hyperbole, and there is no rational response to it. You are wasting your own, and other people's time.
 
2012-07-22 10:05:13 AM  

mark rathburn: All laws to some extent impinge on individual liberty, true. I am talking about not laws, but ideologies - any political system which contradicts human nature must fail.


Are you familiar with the straw man fallacy?

Also, "human nature" is a pretty funny thing, and more often than not throwing your hands in the air and saying something is natural is only an excuse to allow crap to happen when it can be stopped.

Also, your Boobies made you sound like a troll or a lunatic.
 
2012-07-22 10:10:34 AM  
What did we do with hoarders in World War 2? Let's do that.
 
2012-07-22 10:19:27 AM  

starsrift: mark rathburn: The progressive mindset at its root is an authoritarian one. It has to be beacuse it goes against human nature (which, horror of horrors, is selfish), and so can only be implemented by force

You're changing the topic. Why don't you want to talk about taxes any more, Mark?


People don't like to see their hard earned dollars taken from them and dumped down a black hole of fraud and cronyism. Rich people have the means to hide their money so this does not happen. They have always had this power, and always will. Democrats and Republicans alike have set up the laws so they can do this legally, and Democrats and Republicans alike take full advantage of these laws to keep as much of their money as they can. That is human nature, and all the butthurt in the world is not going to change this.


How's that?
 
2012-07-22 10:22:24 AM  

mark rathburn: People don't like to see their hard earned dollars taken from them and dumped down a black hole of fraud and cronyism.


It may surprise you to learn that many of us do not consider 'the manipulation of numbers to create bigger numbers' to be 'hard-earned dollars' or even 'earned dollars'.
 
2012-07-22 10:23:28 AM  

mark rathburn: People don't like to see their hard earned dollars taken from them and dumped down a black hole of fraud and cronyism.


And yet, the current system of banking still stands.
 
2012-07-22 10:24:42 AM  

USP .45: If you're not allowed to move yourself, or labor or property out of your own country, then you live under totalitarianism. It couldn't be more clear what political affiliation is against this.


This isn't about labor or property or your body. It's about taxes. Congress has the absolutely Constitutional right to tax them. Even Roberts (R) made that clear. Is it fair that these 47%s don't pay their fair share while you and I do?
 
2012-07-22 10:26:37 AM  

hubiestubert: Folks are going to be burning through Troll accounts this Silly Season...


I like Fark. There are some exceptionally articulate folks here. All your posts are green for a reason.

But, the trolls muck things up. Therefore, I use a color code. Their posts start out favorited in a nice purple hue, then they move to shades of gray and then they get ignored. They are like the guy in the Aesop's fable. They may even believe what they post is the truth, but for all their effort, they are shouting into a hole in the ground.
 
2012-07-22 10:28:23 AM  

mark rathburn: AurizenDarkstar: mark rathburn: The progressive mindset at its root is an authoritarian one. It has to be beacuse it goes against human nature (which, horror of horrors, is selfish), and so can only be implemented by force

You're funny. When did they let you out of your rubber room to post to the internet?

Any political ideology which fundamentally contradicts human nature, which is selfish and tribal, is doomed to failure. Hundreds of millions died last century to prove that point, but let's just keep fighting those class wars, shall we?


You must hang out with some real winners. Yes, many people are assholes, but many are not. Funny thing about civilization is that it tends to reward that second group and makes them more likely to succeed in life. Do you know what happens when you apply that kind of selective pressure to a species? That's what progressives want to see, that self-reinforcing upwards spiral towards global non-dickery.
 
2012-07-22 10:28:47 AM  
You can fleece the rich until they're but a dim memory, but in the long run its not going to make any difference at all unless the make-a-wish economics and fantasy accounting practices of modern governments are abolished in favor of reality-based policies.

Taking all the rich people's money just gets these governments another fix or two, and soon they're right back to needing more; eventually there will be no one left to loot. Who's going to be their scapegoat then?
 
2012-07-22 10:31:58 AM  

mark rathburn: People will always be money-grubbing scumbags - that is human nature.



Citation needed
 
2012-07-22 10:33:31 AM  

shotglasss: mark rathburn: Waiting...

And you will for a while, Mark. They're waiting for the fax from DNC HQ to tell them how to respond.



Respond to what? A Glenn Beck chalk board diagram? Not sure if serious.
 
2012-07-22 10:35:54 AM  

Lernaeus: You can fleece the rich until they're but a dim memory, but in the long run its not going to make any difference at all unless the make-a-wish economics and fantasy accounting practices of modern governments are abolished in favor of reality-based policies.

Taking all the rich people's money just gets these governments another fix or two, and soon they're right back to needing more; eventually there will be no one left to loot. Who's going to be their scapegoat then?


You sound concerned. Ask them.
 
2012-07-22 10:37:06 AM  

Lernaeus: You can fleece the rich until they're but a dim memory, but in the long run its not going to make any difference at all unless the make-a-wish economics and fantasy accounting practices of modern governments are abolished in favor of reality-based policies.

Taking all the rich people's money just gets these governments another fix or two, and soon they're right back to needing more; eventually there will be no one left to loot. Who's going to be their scapegoat then?


This - it would be much more productive if, instead of whining how we can't squeeze any more money out of the evil rich, we tried to live within our means for a change.

/US borrows $40,000 per second
/GOP and Dems are both responsible
 
2012-07-22 10:39:25 AM  

mark rathburn: we tried to live within our means for a change.



Says a guy supporting a group of a few thousand people who control 90% of the worlds wealth
 
2012-07-22 10:42:50 AM  
Can we maybe invade the Bahamas or Cayman Islands like pirates and walk off with all the booty?
 
2012-07-22 10:45:34 AM  

WaitWhatWhy: mark rathburn: AurizenDarkstar: mark rathburn: The progressive mindset at its root is an authoritarian one. It has to be beacuse it goes against human nature (which, horror of horrors, is selfish), and so can only be implemented by force

You're funny. When did they let you out of your rubber room to post to the internet?

Any political ideology which fundamentally contradicts human nature, which is selfish and tribal, is doomed to failure. Hundreds of millions died last century to prove that point, but let's just keep fighting those class wars, shall we?

You must hang out with some real winners. Yes, many people are assholes, but many are not. Funny thing about civilization is that it tends to reward that second group and makes them more likely to succeed in life. Do you know what happens when you apply that kind of selective pressure to a species? That's what progressives want to see, that self-reinforcing upwards spiral towards global non-dickery.


Then why did the Progressives give us Jim Crow laws, eugenics laws and drug laws?
 
2012-07-22 10:46:29 AM  

Lernaeus: You can fleece the rich until they're but a dim memory,



What fleecing? The rich have never been richer

Lernaeus: but in the long run its not going to make any difference at all unless the make-a-wish economics and fantasy accounting practices of modern governments are abolished in favor of reality-based policies.



You mean the policies that allowed them to create this massive wealth in the first place? I don't think they want a change in policies

Lernaeus: Taking all the rich people's money just gets these governments another fix or two, and soon they're right back to needing more; eventually there will be no one left to loot.


Taking their money? No, they have taken everyone elses money

Lernaeus: Who's going to be their scapegoat then?


The same scapegoat you have created now, the poor and evil governments
 
2012-07-22 10:47:32 AM  

DrPainMD: Then why did the Progressives give us Jim Crow laws, eugenics laws and drug laws?



You spelled conservative wrong

Nice try though
 
2012-07-22 10:49:34 AM  

mark rathburn: starsrift: mark rathburn: The progressive mindset at its root is an authoritarian one. It has to be beacuse it goes against human nature (which, horror of horrors, is selfish), and so can only be implemented by force

You're changing the topic. Why don't you want to talk about taxes any more, Mark?

People don't like to see their hard earned dollars taken from them and dumped down a black hole of fraud and cronyism. Rich people have the means to hide their money so this does not happen. They have always had this power, and always will. Democrats and Republicans alike have set up the laws so they can do this legally, and Democrats and Republicans alike take full advantage of these laws to keep as much of their money as they can. That is human nature, and all the butthurt in the world is not going to change this.

How's that?


That's a lot better, Mark! See, you're able to learn! We've gone from WHAARRGARBL OBAMA to "both sides are bad", in about two hours. That's making pretty good time, though you've got a ways to go yet.

Your point is simplistic, however, and not very insightful or conducive to the topic of offshore tax havens. Congratulations, you stated the obvious. Did you bring anything meaningful to the discussion of offshore tax havens you'd like to share?
 
2012-07-22 10:50:02 AM  
The rich cannot hear your cries of anguish in their $1.5 million Crystal bathtub that is inside their $72 million home

thesuiteworld.com
 
2012-07-22 10:50:49 AM  

intelligent comment below: mark rathburn: we tried to live within our means for a change.


Says a guy supporting a group of a few thousand people who control 90% of the worlds wealth


I don't necessarily support the rich, but I don't hate them either. If you think you can change the system so that rich people end up paying what you feel is their 'fair share', then please, go for it. But considering that both parties in Washington are bought and paid for by these same rich folks, and each and every representative and senator is neck deep in the same trough, it's not going to happen, despite the metric tonnage of whining done on Fark.

Or, like some Farkers, (not you), you can sit in the dark and fantasize about how the rich will be the first against the wall when the revolution comes
 
2012-07-22 10:54:45 AM  

mark rathburn: AurizenDarkstar: mark rathburn: The progressive mindset at its root is an authoritarian one. It has to be beacuse it goes against human nature (which, horror of horrors, is selfish), and so can only be implemented by force

You're funny. When did they let you out of your rubber room to post to the internet?

Any political ideology which fundamentally contradicts human nature, which is selfish and tribal, is doomed to failure. Hundreds of millions died last century to prove that point, but let's just keep fighting those class wars, shall we?


Ideologies like dominionism? If so, I'd agree. Problem is, dominionism is much more pervasive in government and much more of a threat. Yet you ignore it.
 
2012-07-22 10:56:33 AM  

starsrift: mark rathburn: starsrift: mark rathburn: The progressive mindset at its root is an authoritarian one. It has to be beacuse it goes against human nature (which, horror of horrors, is selfish), and so can only be implemented by force

You're changing the topic. Why don't you want to talk about taxes any more, Mark?

People don't like to see their hard earned dollars taken from them and dumped down a black hole of fraud and cronyism. Rich people have the means to hide their money so this does not happen. They have always had this power, and always will. Democrats and Republicans alike have set up the laws so they can do this legally, and Democrats and Republicans alike take full advantage of these laws to keep as much of their money as they can. That is human nature, and all the butthurt in the world is not going to change this.

How's that?

That's a lot better, Mark! See, you're able to learn! We've gone from WHAARRGARBL OBAMA to "both sides are bad", in about two hours. That's making pretty good time, though you've got a ways to go yet.

Your point is simplistic, however, and not very insightful or conducive to the topic of offshore tax havens. Congratulations, you stated the obvious. Did you bring anything meaningful to the discussion of offshore tax havens you'd like to share?


Don't believe I mentioned Obama - but since you brought him up, why, since he was elected, have so many corporations decided that the regulatory and tax structure of the United States is too unstable, and since they can't know for sure what new rules and taxes will be coming down the pike, have decided to sit on their cash until someone more business-friendly is in the White House?

Let me answer that for you - it's because their evil, right?
 
2012-07-22 10:58:15 AM  

mark rathburn: I don't necessarily support the rich, but I don't hate them either. If you think you can change the system so that rich people end up paying what you feel is their 'fair share', then please, go for it. But considering that both parties in Washington are bought and paid for by these same rich folks, and each and every representative and senator is neck deep in the same trough, it's not going to happen, despite the metric tonnage of whining done on Fark.



So vote Romney

mark rathburn: Or, like some Farkers, (not you), you can sit in the dark and fantasize about how the rich will be the first against the wall when the revolution comes


Pointing out they should pay more in taxes means Farkers want to execute them? Nice strawman you got going there
 
2012-07-22 11:01:00 AM  

AurizenDarkstar: You're funny. When did they let you out of your rubber room to post to the internet?


The rubber room is the Internet.
 
2012-07-22 11:01:55 AM  

kyrg: If the same amount of time and effort were put into stemming the waste, fraud and abuse of the tax money now being collected, there would be plenty of cash to go around.
That requires hard work and people being held accountable though,
sooo lets just raise more taxes because that's easy and no one gets hurt but the rich.
You just have to admire the simplicity of the liberal mind.


You just have to admire your own circular reasoning.
 
2012-07-22 11:02:08 AM  

mark rathburn: Don't believe I mentioned Obama - but since you brought him up, why, since he was elected, have so many corporations decided that the regulatory and tax structure of the United States is too unstable, and since they can't know for sure what new rules and taxes will be coming down the pike, have decided to sit on their cash until someone more business-friendly is in the White House?



Right, because it's not like money stuck offshore has never happened before, it must be thanks to Obama and his policies.

Business friendly? The stock market is at a decade long high, taxes never lower, profits have never been higher. How much more business friendly can you get?
 
2012-07-22 11:02:54 AM  

mark rathburn: Don't believe I mentioned Obama - but since you brought him up, why, since he was elected, have so many corporations decided that the regulatory and tax structure of the United States is too unstable, and since they can't know for sure what new rules and taxes will be coming down the pike, have decided to sit on their cash until someone more business-friendly is in the White House?

Let me answer that for you - it's because their evil, right?


Boy, there's someone you oughta talk to, you from two hours ago....

mark rathburn: When the president comes out and demonizes you because you're rich, when he tells you flat out he's coming after your money because the government deserves it more than you do, and knows how to spend it more wisely, when he has shown from his record that his intent is to take your wealth and redistribute it to his union cronies and campaign contributors, and when he pours massive amounts of wealth down a black hole without any idea of what he is doing, of course people will try to hide their money from him.


Now, to address your latest point, I can only reiterate my Weeners to you in this thread:

The tax code is set by?
A) The President
B) Congress

This, of course, leads to "both sides are bad", which you so nicely recapitulated moments ago.
Now, I'd like to contrast this to MY very Boobies in this thread,

starsrift: To be honest - if I was that rich, I wouldn't know what to do with the money either. I could get a mansion and live in a new house every day for the rest of my life? I suppose I could see myself running broke on five million, or ten, maybe even thirty. Start a business and run it into the ground, Curt Schilling style. Start a whole bunch of businesses that fail? I don't know. Anything more than thirty, maybe fifty mil tops, my mind just blows.


In other words - these people have trillions, and trillions of dollars, how the hell is it going to 'trickle down'? What could they possibly spend their wealth on?

Since you're not advancing any points of interest to talk about, I challenge you to take on my point. You have a trillion dollars. Hell, maybe two. How are you going to use that, as a "job creator", to ensure that wealth re-enters circulation in the economy?
 
2012-07-22 11:03:25 AM  

intelligent comment below: DrPainMD: Then why did the Progressives give us Jim Crow laws, eugenics laws and drug laws?


You spelled conservative wrong

Nice try though


The actual, factual Progressives were a small, unsuccessful political party founded by Teddy Roosevelt.
It was only slightly relevant between 1905 and 1918, and had ceased to exist for all practical purposes by 1930. No one involved with the Progressives did any of the things he stated, of course. Nor were Stalin, Hitler, or Mao Progressives.
It's semantic bullshiat - pick a label for people you don't like (progressive, conservative, atheist, Christian, whatever) and simply attribute evil deeds to people you choose to call that.
The beauty part is that no citation of fact or logical argument can be used against you - since you have couched the argument in subjective terms you have chosen to suit your ends - you cannot be disproven or logically impeached. It's a great way to "win" an argument, when you aren't in a real debate.
 
2012-07-22 11:10:38 AM  

jso2897: It's semantic bullshiat - pick a label for people you don't like (progressive, conservative, atheist, Christian, whatever) and simply attribute evil deeds to people you choose to call that.
The beauty part is that no citation of fact or logical argument can be used against you - since you have couched the argument in subjective terms you have chosen to suit your ends - you cannot be disproven or logically impeached. It's a great way to "win" an argument, when you aren't in a real debate.




If something comes along that you don't like, there are a few sort of four-letter words that you can use to push it out of the sphere of discussion. If you were in a bar downtown, they might have different words, but if you're an educated person what you use are complicated words like "conspiracy theory" or "Marxist." It's a way of pushing unpleasant questions off the agenda so that we can continue in our own happy ideology.

--Noam Chomsky
 
2012-07-22 11:11:01 AM  

jso2897: intelligent comment below: DrPainMD: Then why did the Progressives give us Jim Crow laws, eugenics laws and drug laws?


You spelled conservative wrong

Nice try though

The actual, factual Progressives were a small, unsuccessful political party founded by Teddy Roosevelt.
It was only slightly relevant between 1905 and 1918, and had ceased to exist for all practical purposes by 1930. No one involved with the Progressives did any of the things he stated, of course. Nor were Stalin, Hitler, or Mao Progressives.
It's semantic bullshiat - pick a label for people you don't like (progressive, conservative, atheist, Christian, whatever) and simply attribute evil deeds to people you choose to call that.
The beauty part is that no citation of fact or logical argument can be used against you - since you have couched the argument in subjective terms you have chosen to suit your ends - you cannot be disproven or logically impeached. It's a great way to "win" an argument, when you aren't in a real debate.


starsrift: mark rathburn: Don't believe I mentioned Obama - but since you brought him up, why, since he was elected, have so many corporations decided that the regulatory and tax structure of the United States is too unstable, and since they can't know for sure what new rules and taxes will be coming down the pike, have decided to sit on their cash until someone more business-friendly is in the White House?

Let me answer that for you - it's because their evil, right?

Boy, there's someone you oughta talk to, you from two hours ago....

mark rathburn: When the president comes out and demonizes you because you're rich, when he tells you flat out he's coming after your money because the government deserves it more than you do, and knows how to spend it more wisely, when he has shown from his record that his intent is to take your wealth and redistribute it to his union cronies and campaign contributors, and when he pours massive amounts of wealth down a black hole without any idea of what he is doing, of course people will try to hide their money from him.

Now, to address your latest point, I can only reiterate my Weeners to you in this thread:

The tax code is set by?
A) The President
B) Congress

Gee, you're right, I never heard Obama rant about how the rich aren't paying their fair share, or that there needs to be more environmental and financial regulation, or that banks and corporations are evil. It's almost like the president has NO ROLE in creating the economic and regulatory climate of the country. I can't imagine WHY those corporations would get nervous every time he takes the podium

 
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