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(MSNBC)   1 in 13 women drink when pregnant, name their kids Dwayne Elizondo Mountain Dew Herbert Camacho   (msnbc.msn.com ) divider line
    More: Fail, brain development  
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3101 clicks; posted to Main » on 20 Jul 2012 at 3:46 AM (4 years ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2012-07-19 10:54:52 PM  
The occasional drink when pregnant is not harmful. Even a couple times a week is fine, provided you are sensible and don't get intoxicated.. The danger lies in getting drunk regularly, that's when it's harmful to the fetus.
 
2012-07-20 12:07:04 AM  

platedlizard: The occasional drink when pregnant is not harmful. Even a couple times a week is fine, provided you are sensible and don't get intoxicated.. The danger lies in getting drunk regularly, that's when it's harmful to the fetus.


^^ this
 
2012-07-20 03:05:21 AM  

platedlizard: The occasional drink when pregnant is not harmful. Even a couple times a week is fine, provided you are sensible and don't get intoxicated.. The danger lies in getting drunk regularly, that's when it's harmful to the fetus.


True.

You should try to avoid drinking when skateboarding though.

wac.450f.edgecastcdn.net
 
2012-07-20 03:48:37 AM  

platedlizard: The occasional drink when pregnant is not harmful. Even a couple times a week is fine, provided you are sensible and don't get intoxicated.. The danger lies in getting drunk regularly, that's when it's harmful to the fetus.


It depends on the kind of alcohol you drink. If you drink Natty Light, you can expect to have a Natty Light kind of child. Of course if you drink Natty Light, you're probably a Natty Light kind of parent in the first place.
 
2012-07-20 03:53:20 AM  
Low to Moderate Alcohol Use During Pregnancy and the Risk of
Specific Neurodevelopmental Effects in Five Year-Old Children

The Lifestyle During Pregnancy Study examined a subset of five-year-old children and their mothers from the Danish National Birth Cohort. The study investigated three neurodevelopmental effects in five-year-old children whose mothers reported drinking low to moderate amounts of alcohol* during pregnancy. The purposes of this study, funded in part by CDC through a cooperative agreement, were to (1) gain a better understanding of how different amounts of alcohol can affect child development, (2) improve study methods to better understand the less obvious effects of low to moderate prenatal alcohol use, and (3) address some of the challenges with measuring subtle effects of drinking alcohol on neurodevelopment.

Main findings from this study:

BJOG: An International Journal of Obstetrics and Gynaecology has published five papers from the Lifestyle During Pregnancy Study which examined three specific neurodevelopmental outcomes in five-year-old children whose mothers reported drinking low to moderate amounts of alcohol during pregnancy. The findings, specific to the outcomes of intelligence, attention, executive function†, and in combination with each other, were as follows:

Drinking low to moderate amounts of alcohol during pregnancy did not predict intelligence scores and was not associated with decreased intelligence scores for five-year-old children. In addition, no association was found between binge drinking early in pregnancy and child intelligence except that women who binged in gestational weeks 1-2 were less likely to have children with low IQ. This latter finding has not been reported previously in the literature.
Drinking low to moderate amounts of alcohol during pregnancy was not associated with attention skills for five-year-old children. However, there was an association between drinking nine or more drinks per week and low overall attention scores. No consistent associations were observed between binge drinking and attention test scores.
Drinking low to moderate amounts of alcohol during pregnancy was not associated with executive functioning in five-year-old children. Only weak and inconsistent associations between binge drinking and executive functions were observed.
Drinking low to moderate amounts of alcohol or any binge drinking during early to mid-pregnancy was not associated with five-year-old children's intelligence, attention, and executive function, when studied in combination with each other.

Party on ladies!
 
2012-07-20 03:56:43 AM  
How the fark else are they supposed to get their electrolytes!
 
2012-07-20 04:01:21 AM  
And that kid will tell us his Three Point Plan to fix everything.

/shait is crazy right now
 
2012-07-20 04:04:26 AM  
The House of Representin' better propose a bill on this shiat, yo!
 
2012-07-20 04:05:08 AM  
if there was no alcohol most of us wouldn't be here. party on, girls.
 
2012-07-20 04:07:05 AM  

vrax: How the fark else are they supposed to get their electrolytes!


It's got what fetuses crave.
 
rmz
2012-07-20 04:07:29 AM  
But then the kid grows up to be a porn star and the President, so it's all right.
 
2012-07-20 04:07:33 AM  
Meh, the odd drink doesn't do any harm. There was a BBC article to this effect the other day, reporting on a study that found no harm at all to mothers having a small amount on fairly frequent basis.

Of course the very same day I saw an ad on Australian tv with a friendly looking lady doctor saying "we just don't know the effects, which is why I say no alcohol at all!".
I'm also amused by the signs on a lot of beer bottles in the US, you know the ones, with the silhouette of a pregnant lady inside the standard warning/stop sign.

It's basically hysteria, and a certain segment of society seems to have decided that people as a whole are stupid, and so need to be told not to ever, ever, ever touch a drop EVAR OR YOUR UNBORN CHILD WILL DIE, in case they spend the entire 9 months in an alcoholic coma. We see this same effect with pretty much every aspect of government advice to the population in the western world now. Treat the population like stupid, naughty children because they can't be trusted to with the real data, it's too nuanced.

This, by the way, is exactly the attitude that causes so much trouble with drugs.
"All drugs are bad and will kill you!"
"But I just smoked weed and it feels pretty good... and a bit of research turns up that it's pretty low on the scale of harmful things. why should I believe you any more?"
 
2012-07-20 04:09:21 AM  

vrax: How the fark else are they supposed to get their electrolytes!


It's got what unborn foetuses crave?
 
2012-07-20 04:10:48 AM  

The Shatner Incident: vrax: How the fark else are they supposed to get their electrolytes!

It's got what fetuses crave.


Oh god dammit.....
 
2012-07-20 04:26:30 AM  

KrispyKritter: if there was no alcohol most of us wouldn't be here.


And Maury Povich would be out of business.
 
2012-07-20 04:33:16 AM  

rmz: But then the kid grows up to be a porn star and the President, so it's all right.


Once there was this guy. and his mom named him Philander. So he went ahead and got 16 women pregnant with 29 babbies. And after he ran away from them in the army they found him so he ran all the way to the Philipines where he hid from them successfully for a long long time. He made a living at Rodman's rainbow Obama burger putting rainbows on french frys. Then his son Dennis Rodman came by the Philipines to play basketball some more and he shook Philanders hand. Dennis wouldnt really talk to Philander much because you know, Dennis is shy or something but now they are good friends after the handshake so its a happy ending.
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I do have a source for that infuemation!
 
2012-07-20 04:35:49 AM  
Smoking makes baby's heart and lungs work harder, therefore they get stronger.
 
2012-07-20 06:51:34 AM  
That's nothing compared to the damage that could be caused by loud jackhammers!
www.mopo.ca
Clearly her priorities are in order.
 
2012-07-20 06:56:01 AM  
Since when is four drinks considered binge drinking? I've always defined binge drinking as going on a serious bender, perhaps even several days in a row. Four drinks would barely give most people a buzz.
 
2012-07-20 07:21:23 AM  

ReapTheChaos: Four drinks would barely give most people Farkers a buzz.


I have a friend that gets drunk off one drink.
 
2012-07-20 07:23:05 AM  
You know, if the science bears it out that there is an acceptable range of drinking that wont hurt the baby, that's cool. Good to know. Yay science and all that. But I think my attitude will always be, "Why risk it?"

It's 10 months. Suck it up, eat healthy, take your vitamins, and don't ingest drugs/alcohol. Glob forbid you end up as a statistical outlier.
 
2012-07-20 07:30:36 AM  

Honest Bender: You know, if the science bears it out that there is an acceptable range of drinking that wont hurt the baby, that's cool. Good to know. Yay science and all that. But I think my attitude will always be, "Why risk it?"

It's 10 months. Suck it up, eat healthy, take your vitamins, and don't ingest drugs/alcohol. Glob forbid you end up as a statistical outlier.


No, dude, it's 9 months + 8-10 months of breastfeedning.

Multiply that with the 'goddammitIneedadrinktodrownoutthatnoise!'-factor.
 
2012-07-20 07:30:59 AM  

platedlizard: The occasional drink when pregnant is not harmful. Even a couple times a week is fine, provided you are sensible and don't get intoxicated.. The danger lies in getting drunk regularly, that's when it's harmful to the fetus.


English doctors used to suggest a bit of Guinness because of the Iron. The problem with America is stupid lawsuits which leads to laws of absolutes.

If any doctor in America suggested that it might be acceptable for the 'occasional drink'. You'd have someone out there drinking only 1/4" bottle of Jack a night instead of the full bottle and then suing the doctor when the kid comes out all republican.

So doctors say never, 0.
 
2012-07-20 07:57:53 AM  

ReapTheChaos: Four drinks would barely give most people a buzz.


I'm a bit beyond slightly 'buzzed' after four drinks, unless it takes me 4 or more hours to drink them.

Not necessary a lightweight as I typically have a drink or two a day, but rarely more than that, so when I start to get to the 4+ drinks territory unless it is over the course of a long afternoon/evening, then I'm skirting the 'I'm drunk' border. 3-4 drinks when enjoying a night out seems to be my sweet spot.

Most pregnant women I know will occasionally enjoy a small glass of wine here and there. Which makes sense and is generally not considered harmful by anyone other than teetotaler zealots.
 
2012-07-20 08:35:12 AM  
Inasmuch as a recent study out of Sweden shows that a few drinks per week does not harm a fetus in any way, this is unimportant. Only heavy drinking seems to be detrimental. So no fail. The truth: in the US, we attempt to make pregnancy an illness that requires high levels of medical intervention. In general, it doesn't. So why do we do it? $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$. Scare the hell out of women and profit.
 
2012-07-20 08:52:26 AM  
o.onionstatic.com

/explains this
 
2012-07-20 09:12:35 AM  
LemonJello and OrangeJello are appropriate names
 
2012-07-20 09:19:14 AM  

SN1987a goes boom: platedlizard: The occasional drink when pregnant is not harmful. Even a couple times a week is fine, provided you are sensible and don't get intoxicated.. The danger lies in getting drunk regularly, that's when it's harmful to the fetus.

It depends on the kind of alcohol you drink. If you drink Natty Light, you can expect to have a Natty Light kind of child. Of course if you drink Natty Light, you're probably a Natty Light kind of parent in the first place.


^^^This beautiful sliver of genius can be applied to so many things lol.^^^
 
2012-07-20 09:28:31 AM  
Have fun raising your flipper kids, ladies!
 
2012-07-20 09:34:20 AM  

Honest Bender: You know, if the science bears it out that there is an acceptable range of drinking that wont hurt the baby, that's cool. Good to know. Yay science and all that. But I think my attitude will always be, "Why risk it?"


Given the research that shows no link between light to moderate drinking and intelligence/attention outcomes, how far are you willing to take this risk-averse lifestyle? There are already a lot of sacrifices a pregnant woman must endure in terms of allergy/cold/pain medication/caffeine abstentions, gestational diabetes and preeclampsia in some, discomfort and pain from round ligament, pelvic and spinal changes, indigestion, incontinence, and all manner of hormonal shifts.

If the science shows no harmful link between a glass of wine and babby's development, I'm not going to tell some pregnant lady to not drink with me. Same with nursing; the milk only can reach an alcohol concentration equal to that of blood, so 0.16% (about equal to orange juice) even if mommy gets schnockered.
 
2012-07-20 09:36:03 AM  

darkscout: platedlizard: The occasional drink when pregnant is not harmful. Even a couple times a week is fine, provided you are sensible and don't get intoxicated.. The danger lies in getting drunk regularly, that's when it's harmful to the fetus.

English doctors used to suggest a bit of Guinness because of the Iron. The problem with America is stupid lawsuits which leads to laws of absolutes.

If any doctor in America suggested that it might be acceptable for the 'occasional drink'. You'd have someone out there drinking only 1/4" bottle of Jack a night instead of the full bottle and then suing the doctor when the kid comes out all republican.

So doctors say never, 0.


Ob-gyns see the effects first hand of women doing stupid while pregnant, so they have to go overboard trying to get the message across. Moderation in all things should be common sense, but so many people's definition of moderation is anything but moderate. Doctors don't want to get sued, and they aren't supposed to prejudge anyone, so everyone has to hear the over-the-top message.
 
2012-07-20 10:00:19 AM  
mikaloyd Smartest
Funniest
2012-07-20 04:33:16 AM


rmz: But then the kid grows up to be a porn star and the President, so it's all right.

Once there was this guy. and his mom named him Philander. So he went ahead and got 16 women pregnant with 29 babbies. And after he ran away from them in the army they found him so he ran all the way to the Philipines where he hid from them successfully for a long long time. He made a living at Rodman's rainbow Obama burger putting rainbows on french frys. Then his son Dennis Rodman came by the Philipines to play basketball some more and he shook Philanders hand. Dennis wouldnt really talk to Philander much because you know, Dennis is shy or something but now they are good friends after the handshake so its a happy ending.



I honestly thought you were either high or drunk while writing that. Imagine my surprise when I read that article you linked to....
 
d3
2012-07-20 10:01:15 AM  

Honest Bender: You know, if the science bears it out that there is an acceptable range of drinking that wont hurt the baby, that's cool. Good to know. Yay science and all that. But I think my attitude will always be, "Why risk it?"

It's 10 months. Suck it up, eat healthy, take your vitamins, and don't ingest drugs/alcohol. Glob forbid you end up as a statistical outlier.


A real risk analysis would say women shouldn't be allowed to ride in a car, smoke cigarettes, and a whole host of other activities that are proven to be a significantly higher risk to the developing child than having a drink.

When my wife was pregnant, I told her flat out. Do you think the women in Italy, France, Germany, Ireland, etc. stop having any wine or beer? Do you think women in Japan stop eating as much fish? No, they don't. Why? Because their cultures have been around for thousands of years and guess what. They don't have any significant differences in birth defects or IQ scores than the USA. So quit worrying about a drink or having sushi in moderation because the stress of all the worries foisted upon expecting mothers has also been shown to have more of an effect than that one glass of wine.
 
2012-07-20 10:04:10 AM  
Tell that to the kids with Fetal Alcohol Syndrome. A lifetime of low IQ, stunted social and emotional regulation skills and living off the gubment because mommy just had to have a drink while pregnant. If alcohol is THAT important to a person, they probably shouldn't be making babies in the first place.
/knows someone with FAS.
 
2012-07-20 10:06:39 AM  

DougExeter: Tell that to the kids with Fetal Alcohol Syndrome. A lifetime of low IQ, stunted social and emotional regulation skills and living off the gubment because mommy just had to have a drink while pregnant. If alcohol is THAT important to a person, they probably shouldn't be making babies in the first place.
/knows someone with FAS.


Our adopted daughter has FAS. She'll never go to college, hold a "real" job, or likely even move out of the house.

/but enjoy yourself ladies and have that drink... because it's all about *YOU*
 
2012-07-20 10:16:35 AM  

WhippingBoy: Our adopted daughter has FAS. She'll never go to college, hold a "real" job, or likely even move out of the house.

/but enjoy yourself ladies and have that drink... because it's all about *YOU*


Thank you for your appeals to emotion. How much did the mothers of these women drink during gestation? The answer is A LOT, ALL THE TIME. Just like the ones that give their kids screwed up digestive problems by eating terribly throughout their lives and pregnancy.

However, an honest kudos to you for adopting a special-needs child. I couldn't do it as I'm nearly overwhelmed with regular-needs kids.
 
2012-07-20 10:23:37 AM  

DougExeter: Tell that to the kids with Fetal Alcohol Syndrome. A lifetime of low IQ, stunted social and emotional regulation skills and living off the gubment because mommy just had to have a drink while pregnant. If alcohol is THAT important to a person, they probably shouldn't be making babies in the first place.
/knows someone with FAS.


Problem is, the mommies of those kids didn't have *a* drink. They had several, usually to the point of getting blind drunk, daily, for the entire nine months they were pregnant. (See the scientific study someone cited that found that low-to-moderate alcohol consumption during pregnancy was of no harm to the baby.)

There's also the confounding effect of poor nutrition, lack of access to prenatal care, etc., during pregnancy. Alcoholics tend not to take very good care of themselves in general. In fact, in the case of so-called "crack baby syndrome," when actual scientific studies were done some years later, it was found that the effects were not due to cocaine use during pregnancy but rather the circumstances that went with it, most notably poor nutrition. Alcohol OTOH does damage the fetus if consumed in sufficiently large quantities but I'm pretty sure all that other stuff that commonly goes along with alcohol abuse doesn't help.
 
2012-07-20 10:25:38 AM  

d3: Honest Bender: You know, if the science bears it out that there is an acceptable range of drinking that wont hurt the baby, that's cool. Good to know. Yay science and all that. But I think my attitude will always be, "Why risk it?"

It's 10 months. Suck it up, eat healthy, take your vitamins, and don't ingest drugs/alcohol. Glob forbid you end up as a statistical outlier.

A real risk analysis would say women shouldn't be allowed to ride in a car, smoke cigarettes, and a whole host of other activities that are proven to be a significantly higher risk to the developing child than having a drink.

When my wife was pregnant, I told her flat out. Do you think the women in Italy, France, Germany, Ireland, etc. stop having any wine or beer? Do you think women in Japan stop eating as much fish? No, they don't. Why? Because their cultures have been around for thousands of years and guess what. They don't have any significant differences in birth defects or IQ scores than the USA. So quit worrying about a drink or having sushi in moderation because the stress of all the worries foisted upon expecting mothers has also been shown to have more of an effect than that one glass of wine.


I'm not going to tell you not to live the way you see fit. Especially since the science seems to bear out in your (everyones?) favor. Statistics tend to have outliers (the rare extremes). Now, if you crunch the numbers on the risk avoidance, then some light drinking is probably not a problem. If that's the decision you want to make for you and your family it's none of my business and, quite frankly, I don't care either way. But when the "risky" behavior is so easily avoided (just don't drink) then it seems like a no brainer to me. Just don't drink. It's a much easier activity to avoid than, as you pointed out, not riding in a car, etc.

I'll go ahead and point out, again, that it's your life style and the science seems to point out that there's no real risk to that life style. But when it's such an easy activity to avoid entirely, why not just eliminate the possibility entirely?
 
2012-07-20 10:27:36 AM  
But it's got Electrolytes...
 
2012-07-20 10:27:57 AM  

factoryconnection: WhippingBoy: Our adopted daughter has FAS. She'll never go to college, hold a "real" job, or likely even move out of the house.

/but enjoy yourself ladies and have that drink... because it's all about *YOU*

Thank you for your appeals to emotion. How much did the mothers of these women drink during gestation? The answer is A LOT, ALL THE TIME. Just like the ones that give their kids screwed up digestive problems by eating terribly throughout their lives and pregnancy.

However, an honest kudos to you for adopting a special-needs child. I couldn't do it as I'm nearly overwhelmed with regular-needs kids.


Our daughter's birth mother claimed to have only drank about 2 drinks a day (I do realize that that claim is highly suspect, but it's *possible* that she's telling the truth).

I guess my point is that because the effects are so devastating, why would you even take a chance? (I know, I know, I'm "body policing", which makes me worse that Hitler).
 
2012-07-20 10:48:48 AM  
I've never understood why it's so hard for some women to just give up alcohol for 9 farking months of life. You can make up for it after the kid arrives.
 
t8p
2012-07-20 10:54:28 AM  
I see what studies say, but the idea of feeding your unborn baby poison in moderation still sounds stupid. There's a safe level of rat poison you could consume that would loosen you up and not harm your unborn child but for some reason that would make you a "psychopath".
 
2012-07-20 11:22:10 AM  

WhippingBoy: I guess my point is that because the effects are so devastating, why would you even take a chance? (I know, I know, I'm "body policing", which makes me worse that Hitler).


Probably because they aren't taking the chance.

Seriously. I know you have a rough life, I know it's difficult. But that still doesn't make these similar behaviors the same. All the research indicates roughly the same 0% chance for a healthy adult eating properly, drinking alcohol with meals and possibly a few after dinner cocktails as for the healthy adult that doesn't drink.

They've shown over and over there's two at risk behaviors:

1) Consistent binge drinking and nutritional problems leading to fetus damage
2) Alcoholic parents don't tend to watch their kids and teach them to behave\

Neither of those is covered by the occasional drink. The analogy is saying why bother owning a BB gun, because owning a gun may make you more likely to be shot by a handgun.

People have so much trouble with the concept of moderation and limits these days.
 
2012-07-20 11:22:45 AM  

JackieRabbit: Inasmuch as a recent study out of Sweden shows that a few drinks per week does not harm a fetus in any way, this is unimportant. Only heavy drinking seems to be detrimental. So no fail. The truth: in the US, we attempt to make pregnancy an illness that requires high levels of medical intervention. In general, it doesn't. So why do we do it? $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$. Scare the hell out of women and profit.


This ^^
 
2012-07-20 11:35:07 AM  

WhippingBoy: Our daughter's birth mother claimed to have only drank about 2 drinks a day (I do realize that that claim is highly suspect, but it's *possible* that she's telling the truth).

I guess my point is that because the effects are so devastating, why would you even take a chance? (I know, I know, I'm "body policing", which makes me worse that Hitler).


Addicts are never honest about their habits, and if she admitted to "2 drinks/day" that means she was having at least two drinks, every day of her gestation. What is a "drink" to someone like that? No doubt one of those wine glasses that holds 12 ounces with a proper pour. So she may have filled her glass a mere 2 times per day, every day but actually was drinking an entire bottle of wine, every day.

It is personal to you, and you have every right to be sensitive about it having seen the damaging effects on someone you love. However, consider that 1-2 actual servings per week will have dramatically less effect than 2/day, much less 2 "party hard" beverages every day.

precious_crotchflake: I've never understood why it's so hard for some women to just give up alcohol for 9 farking months of life. You can make up for it after the kid arrives.


Pregnant women must make a ton of sacrifices that I've already listed, with reliable scientific merit behind them. Why should they force themselves to give up something else with no measurable benefit? This is the same polarized thinking that convinced people to urge pregnant women to not exercise... which is really, really bad advice!
 
2012-07-20 11:38:41 AM  

precious_crotchflake: I've never understood why it's so hard for some women to just give up alcohol for 9 farking months of life. You can make up for it after the kid arrives.


I think you're forgetting that it's a farking miserable 9 months.
 
2012-07-20 12:11:34 PM  
My wife drank heavily throughout both pregnancies (granted, it was Michelob Ultra, but still) and both of our sons are (so far) perfectly fine, at four years, and five months old.
 
2012-07-20 12:12:54 PM  

factoryconnection: WhippingBoy: Our daughter's birth mother claimed to have only drank about 2 drinks a day (I do realize that that claim is highly suspect, but it's *possible* that she's telling the truth).

I guess my point is that because the effects are so devastating, why would you even take a chance? (I know, I know, I'm "body policing", which makes me worse that Hitler).

Addicts are never honest about their habits, and if she admitted to "2 drinks/day" that means she was having at least two drinks, every day of her gestation. What is a "drink" to someone like that? No doubt one of those wine glasses that holds 12 ounces with a proper pour. So she may have filled her glass a mere 2 times per day, every day but actually was drinking an entire bottle of wine, every day.

It is personal to you, and you have every right to be sensitive about it having seen the damaging effects on someone you love. However, consider that 1-2 actual servings per week will have dramatically less effect than 2/day, much less 2 "party hard" beverages every day.

precious_crotchflake: I've never understood why it's so hard for some women to just give up alcohol for 9 farking months of life. You can make up for it after the kid arrives.

Pregnant women must make a ton of sacrifices that I've already listed, with reliable scientific merit behind them. Why should they force themselves to give up something else with no measurable benefit? This is the same polarized thinking that convinced people to urge pregnant women to not exercise... which is really, really bad advice!


No, it is not the same as urging women to give up exercise. There is also no measurable benefit to drinking that you can't make up for in other ways (antioxidants, etc) Giving up a vice =/ giving up a healthy habit.
 
2012-07-20 12:13:33 PM  

precious_crotchflake: I've never understood why it's so hard for some women to just give up alcohol for 9 farking months of life. You can make up for it after the kid arrives.


Some people are pathetically self-centered and weak-willed and can't make any changes to their routine, however minor, for any reason.
 
2012-07-20 12:16:20 PM  

Skirl Hutsenreiter: precious_crotchflake: I've never understood why it's so hard for some women to just give up alcohol for 9 farking months of life. You can make up for it after the kid arrives.

I think you're forgetting that it's a farking miserable 9 months.


yeah, well, it's a more miserable 18 years ahead, so you may as well refrain from building up your alcohol tolerance in the meantime...
 
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