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(WFTV Orlando)   Teachers union members outraged, OUTRAGED when told that they must pass tests on subjects they are "teaching" to children   (wftv.com) divider line 272
    More: Florida, FCAT, professional certification, Florida Department of Education, pay per clicks, Titusville, standards, teachers  
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12390 clicks; posted to Main » on 18 Jul 2012 at 4:54 AM (2 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



272 Comments   (+0 »)
   
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2012-07-18 06:55:07 AM  

untaken_name: We already pay more than any other country per child. How do those other countries manage to have decent teachers while spending less money than we spend?


They direct students who show a propensity towards excellence in certain subjects or fields towards teachers who specialize in teaching such things.

You might otherwise call it "choice" or as the FarkLibs call it, "Somalia"
 
2012-07-18 06:55:11 AM  
welcome to Costco. i love you.
 
OKO
2012-07-18 06:57:22 AM  
Sadly, you get what you pay for. in all areas of life. pay more and good people stay, better people enter the field. Pay and treat them like shiat, and you get what you sowed.
 
2012-07-18 07:00:00 AM  

KrispyKritter: welcome to Costco. i love you.


Brought to you by Carl's Jr.
 
2012-07-18 07:01:01 AM  

Muta: I think elected officials need to pass a test demonstrating their knowledge of the Constitution as well as the subject matter of bills on which they are voting.


What?!? Add more burdensome requirements beyond a minimum age, citizenship, a local address? Madness I say!
 
2012-07-18 07:02:24 AM  

o5iiawah: They direct students who show a propensity towards excellence in certain subjects or fields towards teachers who specialize in teaching such things.


The two best school systems in Europe have no such thing. They have no tracking, steering, anything.

SockMonkeyHolocaust: Someone keep repeating "Hey, you're lucky to have a job in this economy!" over and over again until they just don't care if they get fired or not because if they're lucky to have such a shiat job then why bother living.


Every time I hear someone express that attitude, I just want to kick their ass. Expecting people to kiss ass and grovel just for having a job is indefensible. Be nice if we started emphasizing employers providing for their employees again.
 
2012-07-18 07:06:14 AM  
But yet, there are very few, if any, requirements for parents who home-school their kids, right?
 
2012-07-18 07:10:41 AM  

bubbadave1056: But yet, there are very few, if any, requirements for parents who home-school their kids, right?


We don't pay parents who home-school their kids, right?
 
2012-07-18 07:10:49 AM  

Muta: I think elected officials need to pass a test demonstrating their knowledge of the Constitution as well as the subject matter of bills on which they are voting.


And if you cant answer 8 out 10 questions about the bill, you cant vote on it.
 
2012-07-18 07:11:05 AM  
I thought the only things teachers needed to know how to do was teach how to pass standardized tests, alter standardized test results if they don't pass and get caught having sex with students once in a while.

/At least according to most teacher-related Fark headlines
 
2012-07-18 07:13:57 AM  
How do you get a degree in Biblical Universe Creation anyways?
 
2012-07-18 07:16:15 AM  
How hard is it to pass a science teaching exam? The Earth is only 6000 years old, so there really isn't that much two it. Jesus made all the rocks, and Satan made 'dinosaur' bones to confuse everyone.

Same for biology. Children are made by love between a man and women when Jesus sends an angel to live in the woman's belly. And diseases are cured by praying. How much else is there to teach?
 
2012-07-18 07:18:54 AM  

MythDragon: How much else is there to teach?


Evolution is wrong. Because Bananas. gotta teach that.
 
2012-07-18 07:19:02 AM  

SevenizGud: God-is-a-Taco: In 50 years will we even have science being taught in schools at all?

No, because we are too busy teaching kids how to put condoms on bananas, and gender studies courses.


Perhaps you're too stupid to take a science class AND learn other things like safe banana sex, but I bet a casual MR student is capable of doing it.
 
2012-07-18 07:20:30 AM  
I know a lot of teachers. Most of them get to school an hour or two early and stay late gving extra help. They work at home grading papers and tests and making lesson plans. They often spend their own money on supplies. They get paid crap for what they do and for their education level. I'm sure they're not happy about having to brush up to take tests as well.

Also, I went back to school to get a teaching cert for physics. I was told I didn't need one to teach in Florida. I could start that week. In fact they only cared if you were at least in school getting your degree while you taught. Even fresh out of high school. That was a few years back.
 
2012-07-18 07:26:48 AM  

AirForceVet: Troll headline as no teachers expressed outrage over these tests, only explained they would have fewer teachers qualified by these tests.

Let's put this bluntly. If you want teachers highly qualified to teach complex subjects like chemistry, physics, trigonometry, calculus, biology, information technology, etc., skills normally used by scientists, technicians, and engineers, you had better pay them the salary of scientists, technicians, and engineers (or college professors equivalents). Otherwise, scientists, technicians, and engineers won't take pay cuts to teach your snowflakes.

/Which is highly unlikely with the current mentality that public school teachers are all overpaid babysitters.
//And that all problems in public schools are teachers' fault, not parents, administrators, and especially politicians.


All This.

Also, while I'd like to think that most of our teachers are at least passably competent in the fields they're teaching, expertise in a subject does not give one expertise in TEACHING a subject. Anyone who has ever had a typical math teacher / professor can tell you that. This sort of testing is a VERY poor way to assess the quality of a teacher.
 
2012-07-18 07:26:48 AM  
Oddly enough, for whatever reason, this discussion made me remember an episode of the Twilight Zone (circa 1985) called "Examination Day."
 
2012-07-18 07:29:16 AM  
http://saintpetersblog.com/2011/03/getting-rid-of-bad-teachers/
 
2012-07-18 07:30:34 AM  
Firing Bad Teachers Link

Of course, teachers should have 2 to 5 years before they're fired.
 
2012-07-18 07:31:39 AM  

mamoru: So, in principle, I agree with the idea. However, in practice, it's probably pretty much what hubiestubert said.


I feel exactly the same way.
 
2012-07-18 07:33:53 AM  
Is this some new kind of story writing where you bold a bunch of the words, but not necessarily the important ones?
 
2012-07-18 07:37:31 AM  
This position that the system is far more important than the people in the system sound familiar.
They must have gone to Penn State.
 
2012-07-18 07:39:17 AM  

pianomom: I guess we are spoiled by having most public schools in my state (Ohio) offering anywhere from general math classes to algebra to calculus to trigonometry to AP math courses.


Is this unusual?
puffy mentioned that first-semester calculus is a typical ceiling which is what I've generally observed, and which appears to be what your Ohio schools are offering as well. It's a very small minority of HS students that will go beyond that -- they usually send them to local junior colleges after that. Not that I've gone looking, but I've only very rarely heard of high schools offering 2nd-semester or multivariable calculus, and I've never heard of one offering DiffEQs.
 
2012-07-18 07:46:31 AM  

Mean Daddy: Firing Bad Teachers Link

Of course, teachers should have 2 to 5 years before they're fired.


Jesus. I can see why some people get so fired up over unions. Especially public-sector unions. I never knew there were SO MANY protections for (bad) teachers.

Seems to me "raising the standards" (i.e., testing) isn't the answer. Making teachers more accountable should be at LEAST part of the solution. I'm fine with protections, but those in your link are insane. If I fark up here at work, I can *expect* to be fired. The same standard should be applied EVERYWHERE.
 
2012-07-18 07:48:28 AM  

xanadian: Seems to me "raising the standards" (i.e., testing) isn't the answer. Making teachers more accountable should be at LEAST part of the solution.


Testing is the closest we have to an objective standard by which we can hold teachers accountable.
 
2012-07-18 07:51:01 AM  

liam76: xanadian: Seems to me "raising the standards" (i.e., testing) isn't the answer. Making teachers more accountable should be at LEAST part of the solution.

Testing is the closest we have to an objective standard by which we can hold teachers accountable.


So it should be a little of column A (standards), column B (accountability) and column C (other stuff).
 
2012-07-18 07:52:58 AM  
Fark Me To Tears [TotalFark]
2012-07-17 11:53:19 PM

FTFA: Critics say higher standards could create teacher shortages

In Florida? I have no doubt about that. Teachers down here get no respect whatsoever from the state government, let alone their individual school districts. The positions really don't pay very well, compared to teaching positions outside the state. And now, on top of all that, we're going to crank up the standards?

Yeah. Good luck with that.

If your kids are grown and you're thinking about moving to Florida, then come on down and take a look. If you've got kids who need to go to public school... well... you'd probably be better going somewhere else.


Yeah, somewhere where teachers are respected (feared) by the legislature. Somewhere like California where teachers are fighting to keep pedo's in their ranks.
 
2012-07-18 07:53:16 AM  
Really, knowledge of the material is not necessary, the teachers books have the answers in them.

/ I could teach anything. if ive ever heard of the subject or not. Math? Sure! History? Sure! Plutonian lateral field hierarchy reversals? uh....sure!
// teaching isnt hard. whats hard is putting up with all y'all's pain in the ass snowflakes.
 
2012-07-18 07:57:06 AM  
Nice to see a lot of great comments in this thread and not the teacher-hate I usually see.

Personally, I am glad I stuck through the tough years. I have been in this game for 17 years and I have found it highly rewarding. Back in 1993, I was at a critical point in my college career. With only FIVE MORE CLASSES (and ditching all of the "how to teach" stuff), I could go into a dozen of other math-related careers that involved getting a LOT MORE MONEY but it involved staring at a computer screen. However, I decided to be a teacher because:

1. My friends and family respected teachers
2. Good benefits
3. Tenure system to protect the job

If I was in college now, none of the above 3 reasons would be true. Even my dad doesn't believe in #1 anymore. The Fox news and anti-Union noise machine got to him (even though he is on social security, medicare, disability, and an ex-union employee...) Ya know, it sucks to have your own dad diss your career even when I get recognized as an "Influential Teacher" by a graduating senior.

On a lighter note, check out The Onion for a great POINT/COUNTERPOINT about the idea of just plopping any college grad into a class. It's satire, but it hits the nail on the head about the backwards thinking about a popular idea.
 
2012-07-18 07:57:08 AM  

Darth_Lukecash: You know, it's simple economics.

If you want to do the test to get better teachers...fine.

But be prepare to PAY for those better teachers. People with higher skills will just go do something else.


That's fine. Currently, we have too many teachers anyway. There is a glut of teachers in the market, at least in my area. I have a neighbor who is a certified teacher who can't get a job because enrollment is down. I'm sure we could keep overall funding levels the same with fewer, more skilled teachers getting paid more.

I actually work at a college whose bread and butter is education degrees (something north of 2/3rds of our undergrad students are working towards an education degree, and more than 3/4ths of our grad students), and even I see that it's a problem. I know a few people who have gone into education, and it takes luck to get into a school.

Also, our school district, we've had to consolidate elementary schools. We used to have 4, and now we have 3. That's because declining enrollment made it uneconomical to staff, heat, and maintain 4 separate buildings, so they closed one down and spread the students and some of the teaching staff among the other schools. It actually worked out quite well: The 3 schools left are being utilized better, and paradoxically class sizes have decreased from about 25 kids per class to about 20. Win-win all around, except for those teachers who lost their jobs.
 
2012-07-18 07:58:44 AM  
Inexpensive, foreign teachers will come in to do the jobs that American teachers don't want to do.

We should let them but give them IDs and allow them to vote.

AMIRITE?!?!?!
 
2012-07-18 08:01:57 AM  

beefoe: Is this some new kind of story writing where you bold a bunch of the words, but not necessarily the important ones?


It's the newest thing. When composing a post, you keep a die around, and roll for each word. If it's a 1 or a 2, you bold that word.
 
2012-07-18 08:06:54 AM  

hubiestubert: This ISN'T about higher standards. Not in the least.

In order to get your teaching certificate, you have to actually pass a few tests. Not just the actual coursework, but the NTEs or other national scholastic exams. You have to actually have those scores current in order to GET your teaching cert. In order to stay certified as a teacher, there are a bunch of hoops to continue your professional development.

These tests are similar to how Massachusetts put up its own teacher's exam, which tossed out the NTEs and I guess other commie tests, for the MTE. The MTE is necessary to get certified in the state of Massachusetts. It is equal or so to the NTE and others.

What it also is, is a subsidy to the exam company that gets to administer and evaluate said exam. It is an extra hoop that some folks don't want to go through, especially since the tests actually cost teachers out of pocket, and not a small sum.

This move is NOT about standards. It is a subsidy to a testing company. Let's call it what it is. NCLB is NOT about standards, it is a subsidy to a testing industry. That education is bound to test that is ill equipped to evaluate real life skills, and instead focuses on easier to evaluate multiple choice questions that don't get into actual skills or cross disciplinary questioning is part of the issue. Teaching to a test with lowered standards and questionable education goals, and tying performance on such a test with funding--punishing those schools who are in trouble, so that they are even MOAR at risk is my biggest problem with NCLB. NCLB is essentially a way of not just covering up the issues that plague schools, but then exacerbates the problems by gutting programs in need. On top of it, it is essentially a state by state giveaway to testing companies.

This move is just another way to subsidize said testing industry, for a "feel good" approach that does nothing to address the real issues. Better to do something, I guess, than do something useful...


We were talking about all of this in my in-service yesterday (we're opening a new school, so we're doing a bunch of training and team-building, Yay!). Our principal, who's doctoral dissertation was on the negative effects of constant testing of students and teachers, was very clear on the fact that we will NOT focus on the test but that we will focus on the skills needed to prepare them for 50 years from now. It was rather refreshing to hear an administrator say something like that after years of "TEST TEST TEST YOU SUCK BECAUSE 99% OF YOUR KIDS PASSED! YOU SUCK!" from other administrators.
 
2012-07-18 08:09:41 AM  
I think we all know where this is going.

upload.wikimedia.org

Green Day basket case lyrics

I had visions, I was in them
I was looking into the mirror
To see a little bit clearer
The rottenness and evil in me

Fingertips have memories
And I can't forget the curves of your body
And when I feel a bit naughty
I run it up the flagpole and see
Who salutes, but no-one ever does

I'm not sick, but I'm not well
And I'm so hot, cos I'm in hell

Been around the world and found that only stupid people are breeding
The cretins cloning and feeding
And I don't even own a TV

Put me in the hospital for nerves and then they had to commit me
You told them all I was crazy
They cut off my legs, now I'm an amputee
God damn you

I'm not sick, but I'm not well
And I'm so hot, cos I'm in hell

I'm not sick, but I'm not well
And it's a sin, to look so well

I want to publish scenes
And rage against machines
I wanna pierce my tongue, it doesn't hurt it feels fine
But you don't look so fine
I'd like to turn off time
To kill my mind
To kill my mind

Paranoia, paranoia
Everybody's coming to get me
Just say you never met me
I'm running underground with the moles
Digging in holes

Hear the voices in my head, I swear to god it sounds like they're snoring
But if you're bored, then you're boring
The agony and the irony, they're killing me

I'm not sick, but I'm not well
And I'm so hot, cos I'm in hell

I'm not sick, but I'm not well
And it's a sin, to look this well
 
2012-07-18 08:14:04 AM  

marcand: On a lighter note, check out The Onion for a great POINT/COUNTERPOINT about the idea of just plopping any college grad into a class. It's satire, but it hits the nail on the head about the backwards thinking about a popular idea.


That's as may be, but teachers should have a competence level in what they teach. A teacher who teaches science should be, well, a science geek. It's telling that with one exception that stands out simply because she was so competent, as a student I generally looked down upon my science teachers. Often, they were outside of their core competency level, and were basically teaching to the textbook. I had one who was a nice guy, but who would have been more effective as a gym teacher, as sports were obviously his core competency and interest. How effective was he as a science teacher? Not very. He taught the syllabus, but when questions arose about something, he would struggle for an answer, often having to look it up (pre-Internet!), or occasionally brushing it off.

I don't have a problem with requiring teachers to know the subject matter they are teaching. Certainly, one would *HOPE* that they have at least a basic mastery of that which they are trying to explain to young, impressionable minds.
 
2012-07-18 08:16:10 AM  

david_gaithersburg: Dang, there they go again trying to bust up the unions. Unions can not survive without the stupid.


Neither could the American right - but, hey - 50% of the population are of below-average intelligence, don'cha know. :)
 
2012-07-18 08:18:03 AM  
FTCEs are not difficult but are expensive, yet the cost of negligible compared to wasting an education degree. Due to being taken several years into a program, since you should be taught what is tested in those courses, a person who fails the test will simply take another, and another, until passing. This does nothing to keep away poor teachers, just poor test takers in order to extract another dollar.

How about providing worthwhile professional development?
 
2012-07-18 08:19:14 AM  

Gyrfalcon: What did they think would happen? Well, teachers started getting pressured to teach to the test, because most states can't afford to lose their federal funds, not when the first thing gutted every election is education (right behind mental health). So people like subby can only blame themselves. You can't have standardized testing tied to funding without the mess we've got today.


Exactly. I used to work for a school district and some of my best friends still teach there. One of them is a biology teacher and he hates how NCLB has forced him to teach now. He used to teach biology, now he teaches the test.

What no one apparently has figured out yet that if you have a good teacher that can teach the subject and an understanding of the subject, you don't have to teach to the test because the understanding will enable a student to figure out the grey areas and off the wall questions they come across. Many/most teachers did that (I know mine did, some 20 years ago) but now they don't have time to do that because the test is mandated to be more important and has to be used in lesson plans for a great part of class time per administration.

The focus from learning concepts and practices has been shifted to a very narrow band of memorization of information most likely on the exams. And that is what we want to base teacher's employment and salary on? How much they can try and force kids to remember bits of information rather than actually learning a mastery of the subject as a whole? Learning is interesting, keeps kids motivated. Memorization is tedious and some kids simply do not have the capacity to keep an entire standardized test bank in their heads. With real teaching, you don't need that Rolodex of answers. it's more efficient in the long run to do it that way and easier on the students and teachers, but we aren't interested in the long ball. Just the FIX IT NOW,
 
2012-07-18 08:21:16 AM  

neversubmit: I think we all know where this is going.



Green Day basket case lyrics

I had visions, I was in them
I was looking into the mirror
To see a little bit clearer
The rottenness and evil in me

Fingertips have memories
And I can't forget the curves of your body
And when I feel a bit naughty
I run it up the flagpole and see
Who salutes, but no-one ever does

I'm not sick, but I'm not well
And I'm so hot, cos I'm in hell

Been around the world and found that only stupid people are breeding
The cretins cloning and feeding
And I don't even own a TV

Put me in the hospital for nerves and then they had to commit me
You told them all I was crazy
They cut off my legs, now I'm an amputee
God damn you

I'm not sick, but I'm not well
And I'm so hot, cos I'm in hell

I'm not sick, but I'm not well
And it's a sin, to look so well

I want to publish scenes
And rage against machines
I wanna pierce my tongue, it doesn't hurt it feels fine
But you don't look so fine
I'd like to turn off time
To kill my mind
To kill my mind

Paranoia, paranoia
Everybody's coming to get me
Just say you never met me
I'm running underground with the moles
Digging in holes

Hear the voices in my head, I swear to god it sounds like they're snoring
But if you're bored, then you're boring
The agony and the irony, they're killing me

I'm not sick, but I'm not well
And I'm so hot, cos I'm in hell

I'm not sick, but I'm not well
And it's a sin, to look this well


Reads more like Harvey Danger.
 
2012-07-18 08:21:36 AM  

Gwyrddu: You know I've considered becoming a science teacher myself. It's probably one of the few ways I could get a real bachelor's degree without getting hopelessly in debt at this point, as opposed to the associates degree I'm currently pursuing. I love science and I did like my time as a volunteer GED science teacher.

However there seems to be little point in doing so right now. Republicans are in charge, states are slashing jobs left and right and teachers are increasingly seen as the enemy, and aren't paid the cost of their education even in the best of times.


While I tend to agree, it isn't just republicans slashing budgets on things like teaching (and it seems like little else). I'm more afraid of this widespread backlash that teachers are somehow the enemy. There is a belief that no teacher ever does anything and the only reason they can't be fired is the union, so we much destroy both. That's scary thinking. How is it that we've turned so harshly on people like teachers, but cops and firemen who have the same protections, etc. never see to get the same crap?

And some of you idiots want lower teacher pay. Fine. I'm not arguing with you anymore. Most school districts, specifically high need urban ones, desperately need teachers. Lower the pay and not a soul will enter those buildings. Especially for math and science, those jobs are nearly impossible to fill every year, because why the fark would you want to do it with a math or science degree?

But those who want lower pay perhaps are an example as to why. They had one or two bad teachers in their lifetime, or didn't like school, therefore all of our children and teachers should be punished because of it.
 
2012-07-18 08:21:49 AM  

Fark Me To Tears: FTFA: Critics say higher standards could create teacher shortages

In Florida? I have no doubt about that. Teachers down here get no respect whatsoever from the state government, let alone their individual school districts. The positions really don't pay very well, compared to teaching positions outside the state. And now, on top of all that, we're going to crank up the standards?

Yeah. Good luck with that.

If your kids are grown and you're thinking about moving to Florida, then come on down and take a look. If you've got kids who need to go to public school... well... you'd probably be better going somewhere else.


Can't be any worse than California where we spend more per child than any other state and the teachers are paid very, very well with awesome retirement packages. Yet for some odd reason we are second to last in test scores and the quality of education.
 
2012-07-18 08:22:51 AM  

AirForceVet: Troll headline as no teachers expressed outrage over these tests, only explained they would have fewer teachers qualified by these tests.


Is this better? Smoking Hot Teachers union members outraged...?

But seriously:

Let's put this bluntly. If you want teachers highly qualified to teach complex subjects like chemistry, physics, trigonometry, calculus, biology, information technology, etc., skills normally used by scientists, technicians, and engineers, you had better pay them the salary of scientists, technicians, and engineers (or college professors equivalents)....

More importantly, stop treating them like burger flippers, and cut out all the idiotic, non-teaching/classroom responsibilities and tasks teachers are required to do today so THEY CAN JUST TEACH! It's no wonder that so many young, qualified teachers leave the profession after just a few years.

Read this Huffington Post article on Improving Science Teaching, and read this blog that comments on the article
 
2012-07-18 08:23:00 AM  

AirForceVet: Let's put this bluntly. If you want teachers highly qualified to teach complex subjects like chemistry, physics, trigonometry, calculus, biology, information technology, etc., skills normally used by scientists, technicians, and engineers, you had better pay them the salary of scientists, technicians, and engineers (or college professors equivalents). Otherwise, scientists, technicians, and engineers won't take pay cuts to teach your snowflakes.


Exactly, if you got a degree in chemistry, a teacher would have to be one of the lowest paid jobs you could get. I could see increasing the requirements to get the job, but then what is the incentive to have more highly achieving people want the job?
 
2012-07-18 08:24:09 AM  
And the dumbing down of 'Merca continues. We have seen a 40 year concentrated effort by the right to destroy public education as a right. The first thing they instilled in us is that "schools are failing." Are they? No, most are not. Some are.

Let's cut to the chase, Americans don't care about education. Degrees, certifications yes, but education no. In Asian countries teachers are revered, as is just about anyone educated. That's why Asians generally perform well, because education is important.

Some Americans care less about education than others. The Northeast and California generally care about education, in flyover country, they generally do not. Where are most of the good jobs in this country? In the northeast and California where education is respected. There is a reason pharma companies aren't concentrated in Arkansas and Texas- it's not because of the weather.

/Your mileage may vary
//Invest 6 years in a masters degree for $60k? Fark that.
 
2012-07-18 08:25:22 AM  

ecmoRandomNumbers: ^^^ What hubie said. ^^^


That's usually me on every hubie post.
 
2012-07-18 08:28:19 AM  
I'd consider teaching if I could get paid what I currently make and expect raises, don't have to be part of a union, could exile kids from the classroom that have no interest in being there, and could actually fail kids for lack of effort/bad grades, also I want the freedom to use whatever vocabulary I want in the classroom and when talking with parents.
 
2012-07-18 08:31:47 AM  
A friend of ours who works with my husband would LOVE to teach, but couldn't afford to support his family on the salary. He's a mechanical engineer who has worked for NASA and the nuclear industry, and currently teaches classes to other engineers and navy men and women about nuclear reactors. It's sad that people like him can't share their talents because of the disdain we have for teachers in this country.
 
2012-07-18 08:32:55 AM  
I find it interesting that pretty much no one in the thread is defending the teacher's apptitude (or lack thereof). on the contrary, most freely admit that the average teacher is lacking. it's the proposed higher standard and the prediction that students will end up smarter if they had better educated teachers teaching them that everyone seems to have an issue with.

what's wrong with this picture? critics? apologists? anyone?
 
2012-07-18 08:33:15 AM  

Job Creator: And the dumbing down of 'Merca continues. We have seen a 40 year concentrated effort by the right to destroy public education as a right. The first thing they instilled in us is that "schools are failing." Are they? No, most are not. Some are.

Let's cut to the chase, Americans don't care about education. Degrees, certifications yes, but education no. In Asian countries teachers are revered, as is just about anyone educated. That's why Asians generally perform well, because education is important.

Some Americans care less about education than others. The Northeast and California generally care about education, in flyover country, they generally do not. Where are most of the good jobs in this country? In the northeast and California where education is respected. There is a reason pharma companies aren't concentrated in Arkansas and Texas- it's not because of the weather.

/Your mileage may vary
//Invest 6 years in a masters degree for $60k? Fark that.




So you must be a Teacher and by respected you mean you being paid way more than the general population for the same job with retirement pay 80% plus medical. California Teachers are one of the best paid.

I know you're not talking about education outcome as we are almost dead last.
 
2012-07-18 08:33:43 AM  

Girion47: I'd consider teaching if I could get paid what I currently make and expect raises, don't have to be part of a union, could exile kids from the classroom that have no interest in being there, and could actually fail kids for lack of effort/bad grades, also I want the freedom to use whatever vocabulary I want in the classroom and when talking with parents.


I also don't want some christianity bullshiat trying to be shoved into my curriculum, you want to teach against evolution? fine do it at home, but teachers are meant to be purely objective and base their teaching on scientific theories, not sky fairies.
 
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  3. Other Farkers comment on the links. This is the number of comments. Click here to read them.

  4. Click here to submit a link.

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