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(ABC)   A Scout is trustworthy, loyal, helpful, friendly, courteous, kind, obedient, cheerful, thrifty, brave, clean, reverent, and totally not gay   (abcnews.go.com) divider line 80
    More: Followup, Eagle Scout, acceptance of responsibility, special committee, General Services Administration, discriminations, youth organizations, Boy Scouts of America  
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7508 clicks; posted to Main » on 17 Jul 2012 at 11:56 PM (2 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



Voting Results (Smartest)
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Archived thread
2012-07-17 11:02:29 PM
7 votes:
The majority of child molesters are straight, middle class married men with religious and community ties.
2012-07-17 11:53:56 PM
6 votes:

pudding7: As an Eagle Scout, this makes me sad.


Ditto.

To be honest, I'm an Eagle Scout (and OA) and an atheist, which puts me at odds with the BSA as much as homosexuality.

Anyway, this is how I try to view the issue:

I think GWB was a terrible president, but that doesn't mean that I decided that the US was a terrible country incapable of doing good (and neither did I disagree with everything Bush did). In a similar vein, I find it disgraceful that the BSA continues to take this stance, but at the same time, I know for a fact that there is value to be had in Scouting, and that it should not be wholly condemned for the myopic views of a few people at the top.
2012-07-17 09:17:19 PM
5 votes:

FriarReb98: some_beer_drinker: bdub77: Because clearly going camping with a bunch of dudes is an entirely heterosexual experience.

hey now! it's traditional. i was a scout for 10 years, i never ever saw anything gay. we learned how to start fires, and build things, and live outside. that's useful in canada, or after the bank has taken your house.

We were more the "make huge farking fires and act like pricks in the woods" types, actually. Or you could be like me: by the last summer I went to Cachalot Scout Reservation, I won the top shot award for .22 rifle shooting. Still have the award & my NRA Sharpshooter medallion.


That's the way to do it. My troop started off like that, but by my last couple of years we got a bunch of new nanny-leaders who eliminated all the fun (aka marginally dangerous) stuff and turned the troop into a merit badge factory. Those kind of leaders are infinitely more of a threat than the gheys.
2012-07-17 09:04:31 PM
5 votes:

bdub77: Because clearly going camping with a bunch of dudes is an entirely heterosexual experience.


hey now! it's traditional. i was a scout for 10 years, i never ever saw anything gay. we learned how to start fires, and build things, and live outside. that's useful in canada, or after the bank has taken your house.
2012-07-17 08:42:04 PM
5 votes:
it's funny; i left scouting at 14 because i discovered girls and thought that camping with a bunch of boys sounded kinda gay.
2012-07-17 08:31:54 PM
5 votes:
You know what libs? Sometimes I just don't get this country.

On one hand you have everyone getting their pantys in a wad over gays over at Penn State molesting kids. "Boo Hoo, they should have done something about that big bad Sanduskie guy..." yet on the other hand when an organization tries to take a stand against pedifiles you cry that they are being excluded.

Some facts (I know libs don't like them, but tough cheese loosers)

1. The Boy Scouts are founded on the beliefs of God and Country. There is no place in the eyes of either for degenerates.

2. Why would sexually confused young men want to hang out with a God fearing group like the scouts. Camping, being with your fellow men alone in the woods, long girl-free summer camps, sharp uniforms, songs, handicrafts? Go watch glee or something, and leave Scouting to the real men.

3. Scouts are a private organization. They never use community centers, public spaces, parks, etc, so your namby pamby laws about "oh lets hold hands and poop rainbows and sing KumByA" don't apply here.

Suck it libs. Suck it long and hard. Just don't go trying to gay up the Scouts.

Keep the 12 points alive and well, America!!!

i35.photobucket.com
2012-07-17 08:22:44 PM
5 votes:
As an Eagle Scout, this makes me sad.
2012-07-18 07:23:13 AM
4 votes:
I do not understand this idea that by allowing gays you take away a families right to decide for themselves how to handle sexual preference issues. I know plenty of gay people. They are no different than straights. They date, some have sex, they go to the movies, etc. Big deal. Ive known plenty of straights who had to talk a bout the ppl they farked and nobody raises an eyebrow. But a gay guy talking about his boyfriend taking him to see a movie and its OMGZ thats wrong!

A guy who likes dick is no different than how one guy like fat chicks, another likes to be tied up and another prefers his women submissive. It aint got shiat to do with you so get over it.
2012-07-17 08:35:48 PM
4 votes:

alywa: You know what libs? Sometimes I just don't get this country.

On one hand you have everyone getting their pantys in a wad over gays over at Penn State molesting kids. "Boo Hoo, they should have done something about that big bad Sanduskie guy..." yet on the other hand when an organization tries to take a stand against pedifiles you cry that they are being excluded.

Some facts (I know libs don't like them, but tough cheese loosers)

1. The Boy Scouts are founded on the beliefs of God and Country. There is no place in the eyes of either for degenerates.

2. Why would sexually confused young men want to hang out with a God fearing group like the scouts. Camping, being with your fellow men alone in the woods, long girl-free summer camps, sharp uniforms, songs, handicrafts? Go watch glee or something, and leave Scouting to the real men.

3. Scouts are a private organization. They never use community centers, public spaces, parks, etc, so your namby pamby laws about "oh lets hold hands and poop rainbows and sing KumByA" don't apply here.

Suck it libs. Suck it long and hard. Just don't go trying to gay up the Scouts.

Keep the 12 points alive and well, America!!!


I foresee some solid bites on this one.
2012-07-17 08:16:18 PM
4 votes:
Fine, do what you want, BSA. Be on the wrong side of history, but don't ask me for any help with anything, or for money, and we're good.
2012-07-18 09:30:22 AM
3 votes:
It has been my personal experience with the Scouts that they are getting some great results from the boys they have. When I had to choose new employees for my company, it was an automatic hire if someone put that they had been in the Boy Scouts on their resume. Only twice didn't it work out, out of about 60 or so. When I get the youth groups to help on the charity events that I run for the church, the Boy Scouts are on the top of the list--better than the IB program (the brainiac kids), the religious ed kids and way better than the kids from the local sports teams. Our little town is dotted with local Boy Scout Eagle projects--nothing big deal-- but here a wheel chair ramp, there a walkway through the grass at a public park and over there a fence for the local cemetery.

Whatever this organization is doing to get such results, they are doing it very well.

I know a whole lot of people who are politically correct in the extreme--the great majority of them are complete assh*les who wouldn't urinate upon you if you were afire but would be the first to sue you for the second hand smoke if you were. They are almost all folks who are very good at demanding things and causing problems but when you are attempting to run a project or produce something these are all negatives. I sympathize with the gays in their struggle for political equality, but this is an organization that is very decidedly NOT BROKEN. I don't reckon that allowing a bunch of politically correct assh*les to dictate to them how to run their business is going to improve upon it. Here's hoping that they don't.
2012-07-18 12:20:32 AM
3 votes:
The Unitarian Universalists got their religion medal discontinued from the scouts for supporting gays.
2012-07-18 12:16:31 AM
3 votes:
I'm keeping my kids out of BSA until the Mormons are banned from it.

/which will never happen, BSA is synonymous with LDS
//Fark the BSA. I'm better prepared knowing that they are nuts.
2012-07-17 10:58:21 PM
3 votes:
thrifty

My ass, thrifty. All the uniforms and that other crapola is expensive and it sure as shiat doesn't ever go on sale. If my local scouting chapter starts hard-selling the Jesus, that's as good an excuse as I need to have my son pick some other activity. If I want a time-suck spiritual lecture eating my weekend, I'll go to church.
bow
2012-07-17 10:37:06 PM
3 votes:
Good luck trying to keep us out.
2012-07-17 09:53:28 PM
3 votes:
The Mormon Church, the largest sponsor of Boy Scout troops in the United States is fiercely opposed to admitting homosexuals and has stated that it will end its nine-decade-long affiliation if gays are admitted. This decision would mean the departure of more than 412,000 Scouts who are sponsored by The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints. In total it is about twelve percent of the entire BSA organization's membership.

Link

I wonder if this had any impact on their decision. Hrm ...
2012-07-17 08:54:57 PM
3 votes:
Because clearly going camping with a bunch of dudes is an entirely heterosexual experience.
2012-07-17 08:07:47 PM
3 votes:
Let's look at it with our Conservative glasses: Some boys or men want to join the girl scouts. What do you? Stop them, obviously, to prevent a scene.

Basically, for the BSA, they're a super conservative institution willing to take a little egg on the face from GLAD to avoid taking something else on the face in a scandal should one erupt.

It almost makes sense. Except all the best cats I know who are gay joined up anyway. So, much like don't ask don't tell, it's a porous barrier that's nothing but a lot of hooey to fool doddering old hate mongers too far gone to remember how real life works, but not yet gone enough to keep funding an organization that lets them homersexuals in with their "good Christian boys"

Sad really.
2012-07-18 07:20:29 AM
2 votes:

Confabulat: I never understood the whole Webelos thing. When I was a Cub Scout, I got the idea of the Tiger, Wolf and Bear badges easy enough, sure, that's logical. And then maybe one day you'll be a Boy Scout and if God is willing and you do your damnest, one day maybe you can achieve the exalted position of Eagle Scout and all the USA will forever congratulate you.

That all makes sense when you are 9. But then there is Webelos. WTF is Webelos? Why do I have to interrupt my serious Cub Scout - to - Boy Scout career by spending a year in some weirdo culty sounding thing?


Tigers are dominated by parents (usually moms) --the parents should be staying and participating in the meetings. Heavily parent led.
Wolves should have parents that are still at meetings, but less hands on. Den leader leading.
Bears, again, should have parents in meetings or close by, but with very little participation.
During these three years, parents must attend any campouts or activities with their scouts.

Webelos are when the parents can stop attending the meetings, and limit participation to the family campouts. The boys should be transitioning (hence the 18 months or so) from relying on mom and dad and den leader to do things for and with them--into being boy led and directed, with just oversight by an adult. They wear the Boys scout uniform; parents do not have to camp with the Webelos, unless at a Pack campout (dens can camp by themselves). (At least, this is how we run things in our Pack; YMMV.)

Boy Scouts should be led by the older scouts, and only have the adults there to make sure nothing bad happens. Parents should not be involved in running events/meetings, unless they are there as a special guest--i.e. an engineer or graphic artist coming in to talk to the boys about these areas.

And for you slower Farkers, there is a difference between being gay and being a pedo. Wanting to fark an 18 year old guy is ok; wanting to fark a 9 year old boy is not. (Can also use this for reference with girls, btw)


/Master Jedana is a den leader--Bear this year--for our son's pack.
/I am Committee Chair for the pack
//Pack based in a church but it's not required to be a member of the church to join (unlike most LDS packs)
///don't care who you fark, as long as it's consensual and an adult.
2012-07-18 05:03:17 AM
2 votes:

sminkypinky: So lesbians are ok in girl scouts, but gays not allowed in boy scouts in the US? And you wonder why the rest of the world is laughing at you behind your back?


Girls Scouts and Boy Scouts have very different sociopolitical outlooks.
2012-07-18 02:30:15 AM
2 votes:
Well, I think it is time to begin a new tradition, with an all-inclusive group... the Nerd Scouts of America!
2012-07-18 02:05:13 AM
2 votes:

unatnaes: Sid_6.7:

Current & recent scouts will be future leaders and newsmakers, and they will have to squirm and disavow likewise. In 2030, participation in this bigoted program will be indefensible. And by then, they will have come around, but who will join? Just the kids of bigots. And the BSA as we know it will be done, relegated to the fringe.

Ashamed to be an Eagle today.


Honestly, we should be ashamed. If being an Eagle connoted any sort of social leadership, there should be a public effort by Eagle scouts to overturn this policy. I am aware of no such effort, which is disappointing.
2012-07-18 01:32:24 AM
2 votes:

clyph: Monongahela Misfit: The Goal was to give them a Moral compass

You can have a moral compass that doesn't point due right.

Monongahela Misfit: train them to be Community leaders that gave a shiat about others as much as, if not more than themselves

That's pretty much the complete opposite of the Conservative agenda. Unless by "others" you mean "people who look, think, vote, and pray exactly like I do and don't do anything in private that I think is yukky or gross"


I would never pretend that what they teach is open ended, or not subjective to their own agendas, nor should anyone demand that they be wholly objective.
The training is sound and effective. A mature person should learn to appreciate the good points, and disregard the bs that they disagree with.

We should all demand that of each other.

The greatest Offense in Life, is Being offended, when no offense is intended. That goes for everyone, regardless of all differences of opinion.
2012-07-18 01:24:01 AM
2 votes:
Being anti-gay is not a "value", it's just you being a bigot.
2012-07-18 01:12:26 AM
2 votes:

Cheesus: I disapprove, but they're a private organization so more power to them. I do, however, think they shouldn't be allowed to recruit at the schools. Every year, sometimes twice I think, we'd have to go listen to their spiel.


Maybe they shouldn't be allowed to use public school facilities for free to hold their meetings either. Publicly funded facilities should be used for events accessible to all.
2012-07-18 12:17:29 AM
2 votes:

thisiszombocom: why hasnt a boy/girl sued to join the girl/boy scouts anyways? seems like the sort of thing people would do


Interestingly, a transgendered boy recently joined the girl scouts. The reaction from the troop? There wasn't one. Though a few troops in a completely different state had complete hissy fits.
2012-07-18 12:09:02 AM
2 votes:
I read "Scout" as "Scot" in the headline, and was amused, and was thinking I would see a defense of sheep-banging.

I dnrtfa, but scouting is so gay. And my Eagle Scout super-gay friend agrees. He got so much old guy and young guy action at those campouts.

Also, I'm a middle aged man who you've barely met once or twice, but I seemed friendly enough. Can I take your 12 year old girl out into the woods for the weekend for a camping trip? No? Awww... Well, how about your 11 year old boy? Great! He'll have so much fun.
2012-07-17 08:49:24 PM
2 votes:

GleeUnit: alywa: You know what libs? Sometimes I just don't get this country.

On one hand you have everyone getting their pantys in a wad over gays over at Penn State molesting kids. "Boo Hoo, they should have done something about that big bad Sanduskie guy..." yet on the other hand when an organization tries to take a stand against pedifiles you cry that they are being excluded.

Some facts (I know libs don't like them, but tough cheese loosers)

1. The Boy Scouts are founded on the beliefs of God and Country. There is no place in the eyes of either for degenerates.

2. Why would sexually confused young men want to hang out with a God fearing group like the scouts. Camping, being with your fellow men alone in the woods, long girl-free summer camps, sharp uniforms, songs, handicrafts? Go watch glee or something, and leave Scouting to the real men.

3. Scouts are a private organization. They never use community centers, public spaces, parks, etc, so your namby pamby laws about "oh lets hold hands and poop rainbows and sing KumByA" don't apply here.

Suck it libs. Suck it long and hard. Just don't go trying to gay up the Scouts.

Keep the 12 points alive and well, America!!!

I foresee some solid bites on this one.


Nah, it's a little too heavy handed and it would take a real moron to group that many logical fallacies in one comment unintentionally.
2012-07-19 02:25:59 PM
1 votes:

OneFretAway: unatnaes: Privately, keep writing letters and arguing with your Council Executive. My local one is pretty DADT about it, which I respect given the ex oficio restrictions on him, but it's still not good enough.

Thanks. My contribution to date has been limited to fuming about it. I will send a letter, for starters. Change for the scouts will probably have to come from within.


I agree 100%. I've been writing to NESA, BSA, OA and my Council/Lodge. Keep fuming, but channel that heat at the right places!
2012-07-18 02:01:53 PM
1 votes:
Sid_6.7
I think GWB was a terrible president, but that doesn't mean that I decided that the US was a terrible country incapable of doing good (and neither did I disagree with everything Bush did). In a similar vein, I find it disgraceful that the BSA continues to take this stance, but at the same time, I know for a fact that there is value to be had in Scouting, and that it should not be wholly condemned for the myopic views of a few people at the top.

As an Eagle Scout, I read the latest announcement with dismay. Yes, scouting does some good. I know that well. However, the BSA has shown itself to be an openly bigoted organization. The values of the leadership can't help but get passed down to those in the organization. I cannot in good conscience support a bigoted organization. I also cannot recommend that others do so or enroll their children in such an organization. There are other options out there for kids.

The BSA is reprehensible. Don't support them until they change their policy.

Nowhere in the Boy Scout Law do I find the word Bigoted.
2012-07-18 01:42:55 PM
1 votes:

RocketRay: My parents pulled me from BSA when we got a new scoutmaster who was an alcoholic. Guy before him was no prize either, his son got multiple merit badges in Favoritism.


It's a shame you didn't shop around. Different troops run a bit differently. There's also the Lone Scout program for those who want to be involved with Scouting, just not necessarily the locally available troops' baggage.
2012-07-18 12:29:32 PM
1 votes:

Confabulat: Aqua Buddha: Why would someone object to their 10 year old daughter camping overnight with a straight man, but have no problem with their 10 year old son camping overnight with a gay man?

I usually don't assume everyone is a pedophile, do you?


You don't have a daughter, do you?
2012-07-18 12:01:42 PM
1 votes:

Confabulat: Joe Blowme: I thought we were talking about gays in the BSA.

Sure let's talk about it. I'm sure you think there should be a gay Boy Scouts, if that's what the gays want, and you can't understand why you are so goddamned stupid for thinking this.

You honestly aren't that smart.


First, the disclaimers: I took my son out of BSA after three years, because too many of the leaders seemed to be creepy, cultish home-schoolers I didn't want around my kid. I realized after reading their materials they are a conservative Christian organization, and I defend their right to maintain their dogma, just without my participation and support. SCOTUS seems to concur.

I'm replying to this post, however, to express my dismay with people of otherwise-goodwill, like Confabulat, who I'm sure consider themselves paragons of tolerance, and then resort to playground-bully tactics against anyone whose opinion differs from their own. This seems to be particularly prevalant lately in the GLBT community and their supporters, the latter of which I am one.

When one repeatedly presumes to know that another person they've never met "(doesn't) understand," or is "Goddamn stupid, " one engages in the same sort of bigotry and oppression which we all seek to end. This same sort of tolerance of all diversity, except that of opinion, evidenced itself in the attacks on Brad Pitt's mother by Perez Hilton and others.

One has to ask one's self, which is worse; the private religious organization which excludes those who don't share its beliefs, or the individual who launches a vitriolic verbal attack on another who doesn't share his or her political opinions?

I know, welcome to Fark.
2012-07-18 10:04:11 AM
1 votes:

Joe Blowme: So you are also against the NAACP, Congressional Black Caucus, HIspanic Caucus, Ladies night, women only gyms, sex segregated restrooms, ect...? If you are then at least you are consistent and i cant fault that.


Ah, the age-old argument for "WHY CAN'T WE JUST HAVE THINGS FOR STRAIGHT CHRISTIAN WHITE GUYS WITHOUT PEOPLE THINKING WE ARE LIKE RACISTS OR SOMETHING?" after basically turning society into that for centuries but pretending that's all over now, and WHAA it was better then anyway, am I right?

There's a reason smart and decent people mock your sort. You'll never understand it. I bet you will whine about it though.
2012-07-18 09:54:18 AM
1 votes:
My wife is a Girl Scout leader and she was talking to one of the parents who was a boy scout (I don't know if he made eagle scout or not) and he made an observation:

When the girls were doing an introduction to sailing at a local camp the counselors gave them a life jacket and a 5 minute lecture on what to expect and set them loose on the lake. He was shocked how the GS let the girls discover/learn how things worked rather than forcing them to go through an endless series of classes and only entrusting them to actual water after they earned a badge. He noted that the BS are more about excluding others who haven't earned their badges rather than learning as a team...

/not really a csb, but kind of interesting.
2012-07-18 08:15:21 AM
1 votes:

some_beer_drinker: doglover: Let's look at it with our Conservative glasses: Some boys or men want to join the girl scouts. What do you? Stop them, obviously, to prevent a scene.

Basically, for the BSA, they're a super conservative institution willing to take a little egg on the face from GLAD to avoid taking something else on the face in a scandal should one erupt.

It almost makes sense. Except all the best cats I know who are gay joined up anyway. So, much like don't ask don't tell, it's a porous barrier that's nothing but a lot of hooey to fool doddering old hate mongers too far gone to remember how real life works, but not yet gone enough to keep funding an organization that lets them homersexuals in with their "good Christian boys"

Sad really.

you'll get over it. it was only a few scant years ago that a certain government stopped classifying the gay as a mental illness that needed curing. im sure in a few years all the homos can be as gay as they want and no one will give a shiat. i sure don't.


While crudely put, that. When I was a Scout I was more worried about the jackass in charge of the Troop who used our camping trips as an excuse to lapse back into violent alcoholism than the queer who actually taught us shiat and would argue with the drunk in charge constantly. Gay =/= pedophile. That old queen taught me how to clean rabbit, set a bone, and manage myself while violently ill on a hiking trip in Arizona(ended up taking a helicopter out, said drunk's oldest son managed to convince him the kid with the shakes so bad he could barely eat, who was puking every twenty feet and falling over under his pack wasn't going to be able to hike twenty miles out in 100+ weather) the guy actually in charge just taught me how to NOT hide a horrendous drinking habit. The other kids taught me such valuable lessons as how to find a spot to smoke meth outdoors.

Homosexuals are the least of the problems with that organization, blatant drug use by the kids(it sure as fark wasn't just my troop, it was rampant at the summer camps and made me a good load of cash although I didn't even smoke pot until years after I was out) and the drunk jackasses in charge on the other hand... I learned quite a bit during my stint(mom was too busy jockeying for position on the troop's council to notice any of this bullshiat while I was begging to quit), and I'm not sorry I did it, but holy hell, it was pretty bad.

On the other hand, I'm a damn good emergency medic thanks to my training there, and I've saved lives thanks to that training since, and developed a set of ethics that won't let me ignore an injured person, I feel obligated to help out anytime I'm around someone who's been hurt, so I guess it wasn't all just a dangerous waste of time. I kept up on my first aid training, and I'm seriously considering taking the classes to work as an EMT thanks to my experiences there, I'm getting really tired of working concrete and asphalt and I can't find a permanent position doing HVAC or electrical work, or any other technical profession I'm good at.

There's a lot of potential there though, I learned my first bits of programming and electronic engineering as a Scout, but I got so sick of all the jerkoff drunk "leadership" and jackasses who used our trips as an excuse to take drugs I quit long before I managed Eagle Scout. To be honest, the old queen(his descriptor, not mine, once we interacted outside of the Scouts) I mentioned above is the only person who was in a leadership position that I'm still friendly with when I run into, I've gone hunting and fishing with him quite a few times since I quit and he's gotten me into a few classes and seminars on first aid and emergency medicine I couldn't have taken otherwise, even covered the cost for me when I was broke, and I'm generally a better person for having made his acquaintance. He still works with them too, for some damn reason.

I still think it's funny that the only person I have contact with from the BSA anymore is a sixty five year old homosexual, he's a good guy and just genuinely believes in an organization that would ostracize him in half a second if they could put two and two together. I can't really disagree either, there's more than one person running around who's alive because of my training.

/slept with his daughter and we parted amiably actually. Only female friend I still have.
//seriously BSA, the least of your problems is gays, but keep pointing fingers.
///guess it's easier than just getting rid of the drunk pieces of shiat you let lead us into the wilderness.
2012-07-18 07:44:26 AM
1 votes:
My parents made me join the Boy Scouts when I was a kid. I doubt they would have sent me on all those camping trips and such if they thought there was a chance my 12-year-old self would be sharing a tent with a 16-year-old openly gay kid. While I hope the gay community gets marriage equality and all that, that's just reality.
2012-07-18 07:43:09 AM
1 votes:
When I became a scout in Junior High - I think you call it "Middle School" or some such twaddle now, we were boys. Not black boys, or oriental boys, or white boys, although I think in East Richmond Heights, most of us were white. In 7th grade we were just entering puberty - our sexual identity hadn't been determined yet. At that age, we hadn't considered which path we'd choose, or if we were to stay in the middle, if you get my drift. And, it's only been in this last generation that teenage sexuality is no longer taboo, that it's out in the open, that everybody does it, and it's all ok!

No, It's not, and it's all because we as parents don't give a DAMN about how our kids grow up. Morality's been tossed out like yesterday's potato skins because it's inconvenient. Instead of attempting to teach our children right from wrong at home and at school, we teach them how to subvert the system, that cheating is normal, to be expected, and that, hell, even our heroes & athletes do it.

The fact that there's still a faction out there that stands up to morality should be applauded, not laughed at and condemned for being out of step with the times.
2012-07-18 05:21:11 AM
1 votes:

pudding7: As an Eagle Scout, this makes me sad.


I wasn't an Eagle, nut I left scouting when I aged out. I have a son in Cub Scouts. Between my time and his the organization was taken over by complete idiots. This has made me sad for several years.
2012-07-18 04:34:32 AM
1 votes:
thisiszombocom: why hasnt a boy/girl sued to join the girl/boy scouts anyways? seems like the sort of thing people would do

WhyteRaven74: Interestingly, a transgendered boy girl recently joined the girl scouts. The reaction from the troop? There wasn't one. Though a few troops in a completely different state had complete hissy fits.


ftfy.

I am disappoint.
2012-07-18 04:24:41 AM
1 votes:
What is there to say? Bigots will be bigots, after all.
2012-07-18 03:35:59 AM
1 votes:

buckler: The SCA did all that for me, and I still got to do deviant stuff. I could have done gay stuff, If I wanted.


As they say, If you can't get laid in the SCA, you can't get laid at all.

Boy Scouts know how to camp in a nylon pop-up tent and cook beanie-weenie on a fire.

SCAdians know how to camp in a 20x30 period pavilion with hot running water and cook a 5 course feast on a bank of propane stoves.
2012-07-18 03:23:05 AM
1 votes:

zymosan: Don't like their policy's? Start your own club. May I suggest "Science Scouts" or "Survival Scouts" something more inclusive. Private, religion based club, fark um, start your own.


"Private" except for all those federal dollars they receive.
2012-07-18 03:19:01 AM
1 votes:

sminkypinky: So lesbians are ok in girl scouts, but gays not allowed in boy scouts in the US? And you wonder why the rest of the world is laughing at you behind your back?


I don't believe these organizations share any affiliation. Except when the scouts get together work on their rutting merit badges.
2012-07-18 03:16:51 AM
1 votes:

TommyymmoT: pciszek: serial_crusher: What would be another good name for an alternative scouting organization without all the goofy rules?

How about, "Camp Fire USA"? Link

I took a look at that link.
"up until age 21?"


Yep, and the founders of Campfire Girls(before they added boys) were best friends with, and often the same people as the folks that started the BSA. Dan Beard for one. Campfire Girls were the Original sister org. to the BSA.
Julia Gordon Low modeled her Girl Scouts more closely to Lord Paden Powells scouts. ie. without the religious component etc.
2012-07-18 03:14:45 AM
1 votes:
Don't like their policy's? Start your own club. May I suggest "Science Scouts" or "Survival Scouts" something more inclusive. Private, religion based club, fark um, start your own.
2012-07-18 02:21:21 AM
1 votes:
Wait, this is an official policy for the scouts now as well? When the hell did that happen?

I mean, I made it through Eagle rank in the '90s and no one in our troop cared about anyone else's sex life. Pretty sure several of the guys from the troop turned out gay, as well, though I haven't talked to most of them in a while.

You see, we had real trouble to get into, not irrelevant theoretical social trouble. Boy scout problems were more like "oh, shiat, we forgot to pull Jim down from the tree where we duct taped him two hours ago" and "crap, the tent's on fire, who built the fire ring?" and "seriously, man? spider-wiring the clothes to the clothesline? gimme a second to find the bloody knife". Maybe it comes of being from a troop that wasn't farking useless.

//Admittedly the national level of the organization being a bunch of dicks doesn't really surprise me either. Honestly the idea of the national org having "policies" beyond managing the BSA campgrounds (Philmont, the FL Sea Base, etc) is kind of a joke to begin with, most troops don't even have any contact with the state branches beyond mailing in member lists and who has what badges.

//Also, the Bear/Tiger/Etc is Cub Scouts. Different organization, though they're related. Boy scouts can be as old as 18, so sexuality could potentially be relevant for some of them. Cub scouts stops at age... ten, I guess? So not really an issue there.
2012-07-18 02:05:18 AM
1 votes:
Interesting. Lots o' Eagles here on Fark.

/me too.
2012-07-18 01:57:54 AM
1 votes:

Sid_6.7: I think GWB was a terrible president, but that doesn't mean that I decided that the US was a terrible country incapable of doing good (and neither did I disagree with everything Bush did). In a similar vein, I find it disgraceful that the BSA continues to take this stance, but at the same time, I know for a fact that there is value to be had in Scouting, and that it should not be wholly condemned for the myopic views of a few people at the top.


I used to agree 100%, and I know the news is fresh, but this might be the last straw for me. I think BSA is a flawed but good institution worth saving, but I swear they have sealed their fate. This will turn out to be something to be ashamed for in the decades ahead, and will kill the institution.

Sen. Byrd joined KKK for politics & patriotism, but he spent the rest of his life regretting his participation, and apologizing for it. (Good on him.)

Current & recent scouts will be future leaders and newsmakers, and they will have to squirm and disavow likewise. In 2030, participation in this bigoted program will be indefensible. And by then, they will have come around, but who will join? Just the kids of bigots. And the BSA as we know it will be done, relegated to the fringe.

Ashamed to be an Eagle today.
2012-07-18 01:53:20 AM
1 votes:

Sid_6.7: I think GWB was a terrible president, but that doesn't mean that I decided that the US was a terrible country incapable of doing good (and neither did I disagree with everything Bush did). In a similar vein, I find it disgraceful that the BSA continues to take this stance, but at the same time, I know for a fact that there is value to be had in Scouting, and that it should not be wholly condemned for the myopic views of a few people at the top.


SMART! x eleventy
2012-07-18 01:51:15 AM
1 votes:
But you, when you pray, enter into your room, and when you have shut your door, pray to your Father who is in secret; and your Father who sees in secret shall reward you openly.
2012-07-18 01:46:00 AM
1 votes:

SubBass49: Yeah guys...nothing gay here...just some young men dressed in snappy uniforms, wearing neckerchiefs, with lots of colorful ribbons everywhere. You start out as a young "tiger" on the scene...graduate to being a lone "wolf" prowling the nightlife...then as you get older, you're a "bear," you might even have some body hair by then...but as you age out of being a "bear" they just call you by the name, "WEBELOS." We-Blows. It's all you have left at that point...all that's available to you.

Nothing gay about that at all....NTTAWWT


You kids really need to separate Cub Scouts, as pictured, from Boy Scouts. Cub packs are Parent, and Adult planned.

Boy Scouts plan and organize their own program with only just enough Adult oversight/supervision to prevent truly aweful results.
2012-07-18 01:35:51 AM
1 votes:

omnibus_necanda_sunt: Suck it libs. Suck it long and hard. Just don't go trying to gay up the Scouts.


It's all handled on a local level anyway. The national organization can do what it wants but the per troop admins really do what ever the hell they want. Anywhere from a DADT to "You're gay? Isn't that special, now lets do boy scout stuff"
2012-07-18 01:13:15 AM
1 votes:
The Scouts were without a doubt a major influence on me while I was forming my value system as a kid. This stand falls far below the standards of contact I learned from them.

I am gay, and I'm an Eagle Scout. I really hate the fact that a bunch of pinheads have made those two things to be incompatible.
2012-07-18 01:10:46 AM
1 votes:
I was a Girl Scout for 9 years. Whenever we would go camping, at least one other parent would join us, in addition to our leaders. Pretty sure Boy Scouts are the same. It's not like a random stranger can become a leader, and then take all the boys camping on his own.

A gay Boy Scout would probably keep his sexuality to himself. I just don't see it being a big deal. But they are making it one.
2012-07-18 01:03:52 AM
1 votes:
I disapprove, but they're a private organization so more power to them. I do, however, think they shouldn't be allowed to recruit at the schools. Every year, sometimes twice I think, we'd have to go listen to their spiel.
2012-07-18 01:03:38 AM
1 votes:

Monongahela Misfit: The Goal was to give them a Moral compass


You can have a moral compass that doesn't point due right.

Monongahela Misfit: train them to be Community leaders that gave a shiat about others as much as, if not more than themselves


That's pretty much the complete opposite of the Conservative agenda. Unless by "others" you mean "people who look, think, vote, and pray exactly like I do and don't do anything in private that I think is yukky or gross"
2012-07-18 12:59:12 AM
1 votes:
I bailed on the Boy Scouts after they insisted I participate in religious ceremonies (any of the major religions), but I couldn't consciously do that.

/ I wonder if they'd allow someone who was in the Church of Satan? Some of the more self indulgent ideas might not mesh well with scouting.
// Is there a Gay-sus?
2012-07-18 12:56:10 AM
1 votes:
Came for Canteen Boy. Leaving devastated.
2012-07-18 12:51:14 AM
1 votes:

serial_crusher: What would be another good name for an alternative scouting organization without all the goofy rules?


Spiral Scouts.
2012-07-18 12:43:11 AM
1 votes:

serial_crusher: I've been reading up on the Baden-Powell Service Association. It's a shame that congressional charters and BSA lawyers effectively ban them from using the word "scout" in their name, but surely they could come up with something a little catchier than what they've got now.
Young American Recon Group or something? I unno, calling yourself a Yarg seems kind of fun, but might not be for everyone.
What would be another good name for an alternative scouting organization without all the goofy rules?


American Boy Scouting was only loosely based on LBP's Scouts of Gilwell.
Dan Beard's Indian Guides, and the Predominantly Protestant Businessmen who founded the BSA wanted an organization that offered an exciting alternative to the roving gangs of teen boys running rampant at the turn of the century. The Goal was to give them a Moral compass, and train them to be Community leaders that gave a shiat about others as much as, if not more than themselves. The BSA still tries to meet that standard of what Scouting is in the US.

Sexual orientation is a distraction that too many "religious" sponsoring organizations just refuse to look away from. They control the BSA, and since they make up the Majority of Scouting Org's, They get to say what goes. That's as democratic as it gets.
2012-07-18 12:39:01 AM
1 votes:
Seriously. Wearing -that- uniform, your'e trying to tell me, with a straight face, you don't accept gay guys?


There's really only two kinds of folks with that knd of fashion sense. survivalist gays and facists.


So, basically, the BSA are telling us they'd rather be associated with nazis than with gay guys.. What in 40 farks is wrong with this world.

/Queer
//Proud of it.
2012-07-18 12:36:11 AM
1 votes:

jaylectricity: BSABSVR: And yet he got two bites.

So just quoting somebody is "biting" on a troll? Like I said...springboard.


No. Believing him is biting on a troll. As two people did. Pay f*cking attention once in awhile.
2012-07-18 12:26:49 AM
1 votes:
As an eagle scout and currently drunker than 2 skunks; I feel that the everyone deserves to be bullied enough by their mother(s) to get the eagle scout. Because, by that point, either the scout is already tots gehy or has a very insistent mother.

/ has a very insistent mother; she is 5' of fury
2012-07-18 12:25:54 AM
1 votes:

pudding7: As an Eagle Scout, this makes me sad.


i789.photobucket.com
2012-07-18 12:14:37 AM
1 votes:
My son was in cub scouts this year, a "tiger" meaning he was in first grade. Our den leader was a lesbian, and her domestic partner helped alot. Overall they were great at communicating, but the events were boring. No outdoor events to speak of, nothing exciting, the one campout we went to had a fire ban. I was the only person to bring a small propane stove to cook on and when I was making eggs and bacon on Saturday morning I looked around to see everyone else had macdonalds coffee cups and were hovering in around the smell of bacon. We left camp early and went to a state park to finish our trip.

Never went back to scouts, told folks his grades were slipping and he needed to focus on that first.
2012-07-18 12:12:13 AM
1 votes:

TommyymmoT: mikaloyd: feels your pain

[www.trbimg.com image 400x504]

/he's probably fapping to this thread right now if he has earned his internet privileges

They don't have internet privileges in prison, that's only on TV.


That's inhumane. We cant have that
2012-07-18 12:10:03 AM
1 votes:
img2.timeinc.net
I love you, but you have no idea what you are talking about
2012-07-17 11:59:18 PM
1 votes:
backyardgaming.files.wordpress.com

Approves.
2012-07-17 11:43:57 PM
1 votes:

ecmoRandomNumbers: Fine, do what you want, BSA. Be on the wrong side of history, but don't ask me for any help with anything, or for money, and we're good.


The above comment precisely reflects my opinion on the referenced matter
2012-07-17 11:09:23 PM
1 votes:
I could never earn my Bear badge in Cub Scouts so I was drummed out pretty early anyway.
2012-07-17 11:08:30 PM
1 votes:
Physically strong, mentally awake,and morally STRAIGHT
2012-07-17 10:30:34 PM
1 votes:

GleeUnit: alywa: You know what libs? Sometimes I just don't get this country.

On one hand you have everyone getting their pantys in a wad over gays over at Penn State molesting kids. "Boo Hoo, they should have done something about that big bad Sanduskie guy..." yet on the other hand when an organization tries to take a stand against pedifiles you cry that they are being excluded.

Some facts (I know libs don't like them, but tough cheese loosers)

1. The Boy Scouts are founded on the beliefs of God and Country. There is no place in the eyes of either for degenerates.

2. Why would sexually confused young men want to hang out with a God fearing group like the scouts. Camping, being with your fellow men alone in the woods, long girl-free summer camps, sharp uniforms, songs, handicrafts? Go watch glee or something, and leave Scouting to the real men.

3. Scouts are a private organization. They never use community centers, public spaces, parks, etc, so your namby pamby laws about "oh lets hold hands and poop rainbows and sing KumByA" don't apply here.

Suck it libs. Suck it long and hard. Just don't go trying to gay up the Scouts.

Keep the 12 points alive and well, America!!!

I foresee some solid bites on this one.


Way over the top. Nobody here is dumb enough to believe that Alya believes this tripe. I mean, sure, maybe somebody will use it as a springboard to advance their own opinions, but is that really a "bite" in the context of a troll?

Anyway, this is all that really needs to be said:

FTA: "It's disappointing," he said. "The first value of the Scout's law, is a scout is trustworthy, and this process does not sound trustworthy. We don't know who the people are -- they are not named and they are not willing to accept responsibility for their actions."
2012-07-17 10:00:45 PM
1 votes:
I've been reading up on the Baden-Powell Service Association. It's a shame that congressional charters and BSA lawyers effectively ban them from using the word "scout" in their name, but surely they could come up with something a little catchier than what they've got now.
Young American Recon Group or something? I unno, calling yourself a Yarg seems kind of fun, but might not be for everyone.
What would be another good name for an alternative scouting organization without all the goofy rules?
2012-07-17 09:59:15 PM
1 votes:
You can be gay in the Scouts - right after you're promoted to Scoutmaster
2012-07-17 09:31:34 PM
1 votes:
New Boy Scout motto: If you're gay, go away

I wonder if they know their founder was a closeted gay?

From Wikipedia:
Sexuality

Early discussion of Baden-Powell's sexuality focused on his relationship with his close friend Kenneth McLaren. Tim Jeal's later biography discusses the relationship and finds that there is no conclusive evidence that this friendship was physical. Jeal then examines Baden-Powell's views on women, his appreciation of the male form, his military relationships, and his marriage, concluding that Baden-Powell might have been a repressed homosexual. Jeal's conclusion is shared by some biographers and disputed by others, but is not yet examined in any detail by other scholars
2012-07-17 09:13:01 PM
1 votes:

some_beer_drinker: bdub77: Because clearly going camping with a bunch of dudes is an entirely heterosexual experience.

hey now! it's traditional. i was a scout for 10 years, i never ever saw anything gay. we learned how to start fires, and build things, and live outside. that's useful in canada, or after the bank has taken your house.


We were more the "make huge farking fires and act like pricks in the woods" types, actually. Or you could be like me: by the last summer I went to Cachalot Scout Reservation, I won the top shot award for .22 rifle shooting. Still have the award & my NRA Sharpshooter medallion.
2012-07-17 08:50:14 PM
1 votes:

doglover: some_beer_drinker: the homos can be as gay as they want and no one will give a shiat.

Assuming anyone does now.

I think most things in society are always last changed officially. Hence the phrase "The writing's on the wall." The lowest common denomenator is always the first to accept things while officials relent only when all hope of procrastination is loss.


The problem with being gay in the minds of those who believe scripture is infallible is that, ignoring the fact that scripture has almost as many plot holes in it as it does chapters, they think that gayness is wrong. Then, when it gets rewarded by recognition and celebration, it causes all sorts of crises of faith and dogma, which is anxiety-laden at least and downright saddening and sickening at worst. These people, while moronic, are fighting for their happiness, which, when you look at it that way, you can't blame them for. Just like you can't blame gays for wanting to be happy with their lives.

With the lessening of faith in the world, eventually this too shall pass. As for the BSA, eventually it'll get to the point that they'll have to go 100% private or give it up.
2012-07-17 08:39:35 PM
1 votes:

alywa: You know what libs? Sometimes I just don't get this country.

On one hand you have everyone getting their pantys in a wad over gays over at Penn State molesting kids. "Boo Hoo, they should have done something about that big bad Sanduskie guy..." yet on the other hand when an organization tries to take a stand against pedifiles you cry that they are being excluded.

Some facts (I know libs don't like them, but tough cheese loosers)

1. The Boy Scouts are founded on the beliefs of God and Country. There is no place in the eyes of either for degenerates.

2. Why would sexually confused young men want to hang out with a God fearing group like the scouts. Camping, being with your fellow men alone in the woods, long girl-free summer camps, sharp uniforms, songs, handicrafts? Go watch glee or something, and leave Scouting to the real men.

3. Scouts are a private organization. They never use community centers, public spaces, parks, etc, so your namby pamby laws about "oh lets hold hands and poop rainbows and sing KumByA" don't apply here.

Suck it libs. Suck it long and hard. Just don't go trying to gay up the Scouts.

Keep the 12 points alive and well, America!!!

[i35.photobucket.com image 250x320]


Pi/10
2012-07-17 08:39:15 PM
1 votes:

some_beer_drinker: the homos can be as gay as they want and no one will give a shiat.


Assuming anyone does now.

I think most things in society are always last changed officially. Hence the phrase "The writing's on the wall." The lowest common denomenator is always the first to accept things while officials relent only when all hope of procrastination is loss.
 
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