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(Fark)   Question for computer nerds: Compared to my first computer, my current computer has a CPU that's over 300 times faster and has 500 times more memory and storage. So WHY DOES EVERYTHING STILL TAKE JUST AS LONG?   (fark.com) divider line 394
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5142 clicks; posted to Main » on 11 Jul 2012 at 2:30 PM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2012-07-11 02:54:30 PM

InfamousBLT: Quasar: Your computer has more to do now.

Also B, you have another bottleneck somewhere else. Possibly hard drive read/write speed.


You probably don't have enough CPU fluid ...check the resivoiur and if it's at the full line you need to see if you need to add I & H Dead-Water Copper Sulfate Biocidal PC Coolant Additive

www.frozencpu.com
 
2012-07-11 02:54:34 PM

thejoyofpi: t3knomanser: Developer time is expensive. CPU time is very cheap.

What about my time as I sit here waiting for an unresponsive Chrome tab to stop choking my browser?


Chrome is free.
 
2012-07-11 02:55:05 PM
Your computer always seems to be about as fast, no matter the internals, because the problem is you, not the computer.

Even with a clean OS install, most people will gradually expand their computing habits to fill the available resources.
It's just a thing they do. They keep piling shiat on and leaving shiat running, until things tip over the line of "it's now annoyingly slow".

Then they'll close some stuff, delete some stuff, uninstall some stuff -- but only *just* enough that they cross back over the line and get back to a place where they don't find the delays too annoying. Then they slowly expand again, become annoyed again, shrink back down again and repeat. Just ping-pong-ing back and forth across the annoyance threshold.

Different people have different subjective points for where the annoyance kicks in, but the basic behavior seems pretty universal.
 
2012-07-11 02:56:02 PM

Phoenix87ta: Nadie_AZ: Wish I could fire up some of the 90s Lucas Arts games ....

Ah 90s Star Wars games. You were awesome.

[www.ibiblio.org image 640x480]

I love that I can still play all the Lucasarts adventure games in ScummVM. Hell, they even ported it to PSP.


Wait, what? Tell me more.
 
2012-07-11 02:56:44 PM

OgreMagi: TheHappTroll: All you guys calling for SSDs why not more RAM? Win7 Pro 192GB

Because RAM costs about 10x the price of SSD and because when you turn off your computer you lose everything in RAM. And since Windows will crash (not "might crash", it will farking crash), you can't just say, "don't turn it off".


Point taken. But, I would think that running programs should certainly be faster if not having to hit any harddrive. I don't usually blame my OS for the slow downs. Does the SSD help with graphics as much as the quality and memory of the graphics card?
 
2012-07-11 02:56:55 PM
Mikey1969: 2. Everything is doing more. Webpages aren't a few lines of text, a banner, a few ads and nothing more, they contain embedded videos, popup animations, like RSS feeds, etc.

As an old school web developer (that moved over to traditional programming), I think all of this embedded shiat has gotten totally out of hand. Now you go to a page and it's trying to serve you things from 20+ different domains (note the scroll arrows), WTF.

lordargent.com
 
2012-07-11 02:56:55 PM
This was my first system... circa 1982

www.mew3.us

Hooked it into out HUGE 19 inch color TV.
 
2012-07-11 02:56:59 PM

paygun: Every year hardware gets faster and software gets slower.

I've been writing a system to create videos from still photos at work. I bought a 6 core server and my vendor laughed when I called it high performance. It is high performance when you put Slackware on it.


...iMovie?
 
2012-07-11 02:57:01 PM

MrSteve007: The problem is that your computer doesn't have a "Turbo" button:
[4.bp.blogspot.com image 640x445]
From 33 mhz, to a blistering 66 mhz!!!


Pshh. The turbo button on the ol' Compuadd 286 went from 6 mhz to 12 mhz and we only had a 5.25" disk drive because that's the way we liked it.
 
2012-07-11 02:57:23 PM
Get Puppy Linux.

/Zork was pretty fast.
 
2012-07-11 02:57:26 PM
Andy giveth and Bill taketh away.

The problem largely comes down to abstraction. An abstraction is a layer that makes programming easier at the cost of performance. Different abstractions provide the user interface, the graphics, the input and the system security. Other layers exist to speed up the application development process. And a lot of other things are limited by the speed of your internet connection. The page can't fully render until it finishes downloading.
 
2012-07-11 02:57:35 PM
codinghorror.typepad.com

It's all of your smooth curved edges and your color gradients and your fancy pants animations! In the 90s I remember getting along on 16 colors with square corners and I was thankful for it!
 
2012-07-11 02:57:37 PM

DerAppie: Read before you click. Windows Update asks if you want to reboot now or wait.


And two minutes later it pops up the damn dialog box again saying it wants to reboot. It won't leave me the fark alone!

I'm a Linux admin, so I am spoiled. I install updates, there are no reboots. I install a new kernel, it doesn't force a reboot, so I can put it in place now and schedule a reboot at 3am when it's unlikely anyone will be accessing the system.
 
2012-07-11 02:57:49 PM
cause you never upgraded your 300 baud modem.
 
2012-07-11 02:58:31 PM

tuna fingers: Two words:
Micro Soft


Not true.
Your precious Mac uses very similar hardware. Your hard drive can only sling data so fast. The system bus can only move data at certain rates. Your streamlined OS? Not really so.

So while the Windows users at least have an easy to get to log file, to see WTF happened, you just sit right back and enjoy the spinning beach ball of failure.

/Owned 2 iMacs, 3PC (windows), and dabbles with Linux.
 
2012-07-11 02:59:14 PM

lordargent: Then: 1GB was a shiatload of drive space.


My first hard drive was 5 Megs. My geek friends asked me what I could possibly do with all that much space. It was attached to a Vector Graphics S100 cp/m computer.
 
2012-07-11 02:59:20 PM

Nadie_AZ: Wish I could fire up some of the 90s Lucas Arts games ....

Ah 90s Star Wars games. You were awesome.

[www.ibiblio.org image 640x480]


I loved that game. It played extremely well.
 
2012-07-11 02:59:33 PM
That 5GB 3000rpm HD that you are running Vista on, isn't helping much.
 
2012-07-11 02:59:49 PM

Nadie_AZ: Phoenix87ta: Nadie_AZ: Wish I could fire up some of the 90s Lucas Arts games ....

Ah 90s Star Wars games. You were awesome.

[www.ibiblio.org image 640x480]

I love that I can still play all the Lucasarts adventure games in ScummVM. Hell, they even ported it to PSP.

Wait, what? Tell me more.


ScummVM

Supported games list:

Compatibility

It's a beautiful thing. Full Throttle, Monkey Island and Sam and Max never get old.
 
2012-07-11 02:59:59 PM
Unrealistic expectations?

/also, this thread makes me want to find a copy of Commander Keen or ROTT
 
2012-07-11 03:00:29 PM

dv-ous: ...iMovie?


I can't say I wouldn't enjoy it if we hired some poor bastard to sit in front of imovie 24/7 and churn out videos. But it makes a lot more sense to just write something that does it all by itself. Last night it made 1400 videos while I read a book and slept.
 
2012-07-11 03:01:17 PM

MythDragon: That 5GB 3000rpm HD that you are running Vista on, isn't helping much.


That's not funny. I've seen people try that.
 
2012-07-11 03:01:26 PM
one word......

P0RN
 
2012-07-11 03:01:54 PM

zetar: Most programmers are incompetent and downright dangerous.

Almost all software is very poorly written these days.

In the 'old days' poorly written code would cause almost an immediate crash. Now, poorly written code is considered the standard. The most popular operating system is riddled with memory leaks.

/ And, yes, I do have a doctorate in computer science.


Jesus, another over-educated CS ass. You want to see the source of 90% of the bloatware out there? Sit in a meeting across the table from some CS PhD while they enchant a clueless program manager on the unparalleled virtues of their chosen framework/pattern/technology of the day. That they only heard about it at a conference and have never actually implemented it and are not responsible for the post-sales support costs and increased sales friction are of no matter to them.

Perfect example right now is Ruby. They talk teams into it, then miss all their dates and blow their dev budgets because they can't hire enough good Ruby developers. Products should be sold and used and changes lives first and foremost. If they're ideally realized that's great, but not at the cost of never seeing daylight.

/or maybe i fell for a troll
// not i didn't, WHARRGARBL
 
2012-07-11 03:02:08 PM

akula: InfamousBLT: Haha, this. Go play some super old DOS game. Watch as all of the animations are insanely fast, everything moves way too fast for your mind to even comprehend what is going on. It's actually kind of funny.

Many years ago I was talking to a guy, reminiscing about old computer games. I remarked how I liked the Test Drive series (especially TD2), but TD3 was unplayable on that 286... it ran, but only at something like 4 or 8 frames/second. He said he played the same game on a 386 and it ran properly, but on a 486 it just was way too fast for you to react.

We don't often go back and dust off old games from generations past, but yeah, when one does so the result is something that's really moving along.


I loved the TD series too. I also miss wordstar*, tried to save it off of some floppies in storage a couple years ago but they were all corrupt. Norton Utilities probably could have saved them but that disk was corrupt too.

*What I missed was the dictionary/thesaurus with definitions so you were selecting the correct word. That came in handy a plethora of times. I found wordweb though and now use that.
 
2012-07-11 03:02:10 PM

snake_beater: Unrealistic expectations?

/also, this thread makes me want to find a copy of Commander Keen or ROTT


I would imagine there are probably updated modern engines for both games so you don't have to dig up a copy of DOS to play them. In fact, I KNOW there's one for ROTT.
 
2012-07-11 03:02:39 PM

Nadie_AZ: Wish I could fire up some of the 90s Lucas Arts games ....

Ah 90s Star Wars games. You were awesome.

[www.ibiblio.org image 640x480]


Yeah, Tie Fighter was 'better' than X-Wing, but it's hard to beat the original.

X-Wing 1992 (floppies) : X-Wing 95 (CD) :: Star Wars 1977 : Star Wars 1997
 
2012-07-11 03:02:41 PM

LineNoise: Likewise because of the advances in memory\cpu\storage, people don't need to code as tight as they used to.


QFT.
 
2012-07-11 03:03:10 PM

Pockafrusta: This was my first system... circa 1982

[www.mew3.us image 640x566]

Hooked it into out HUGE 19 inch color TV.


I had a sinclair 1000 when i was a kid!
that thing was awesome.
 
2012-07-11 03:03:15 PM
Then:
www.mobygames.com
'Oh. look. A dragon'

Now:
andrewhemphill.files.wordpress.com
'OH FARKING FARK FARK! A FARKING DRAGON!'

That's why there is no difference in speed,
 
2012-07-11 03:03:32 PM

TheHappTroll: All you guys calling for SSDs why not more RAM? Win7 Pro 192GB


Because you'll have 4 GB of your 192GB RAM used, and your computer will STILL be dead slow.
RAM only helps when you don't have enough of it. You run out of performance benefit for a PC at ~6GB.

The SSD makes far more sense and makes a much, much bigger performance improvement.
 
2012-07-11 03:03:55 PM
Dark Helmet:
"F*ck! Even in the future nothing works!"
 
2012-07-11 03:03:58 PM
subby please do the following
go to start and run "msconfig"
click the startup tab
hit print screen
open up mspaint
hit ctrl+v
hit ctrl+s and save it
upload the image here so we can see how much crap your computer is loading
 
2012-07-11 03:04:29 PM
PEBCAK or ID - Ten - T error or Layor 8 error. Whatever you want to call it.
 
2012-07-11 03:04:52 PM
I remember having to run WinAmp in experimental integer mode in order to get just enough horsepower out of my 486SX to play an MP3 file. Now playing music doesn't even register on the CPU meter.

But yeah, computers haven't gotten any faster.
 
2012-07-11 03:04:59 PM

akula: The first PC I ever used was a 286 running DOS. It doesn't take too much to run a command line interface, text based everything, and 256 color graphics at 640x480 resolution.


You sure about this? Either your resolution/bit depth is incorrect or you are mistaken with the CPU.

320x200 most likely with CGA at the time if you had a 286.

Unless you had a Hercules card, that was 640x200 but monochrome so that nulls your statement.

I'm going to guess you meant a different CPU. :-)

/Without a Turbo button.
 
2012-07-11 03:05:04 PM

zedster: subby please do the following
go to start and run "msconfig"
click the startup tab
hit print screen
open up mspaint
hit ctrl+v
hit ctrl+s and save it
upload the image here so we can see how much crap your computer is loading


$10 on Bonzi Buddy
 
2012-07-11 03:05:19 PM

DerAppie: Read before you click. Windows Update asks if you want to reboot now or wait.


Right, but it pops up in the background with a countdown clock. If I'm not sitting at the screen when it happens (which has happened more than twice) I come back to find the damn thing did it without me. It's just too bossy for my tastes.
 
2012-07-11 03:06:04 PM

Ponzholio: thejoyofpi: InfamousBLT: I recall tales of one game (I don't remember the name, and I have never played it), but it was a chess game. For some reason, the difficulty of the game increased with the processing power. So, the faster computer you had, the harder the game was.

Apparently it is unplayable on modern computers by anyone except chess geniuses, because they didn't put a cap on the difficulty.

brilliant.

Have you tried to play the original Oregon Trail on a current computer? The end where you have to navigate the river to reach Oregon is f*cking impossible...


I recall a program called MoSlow, which was designed to do nothing more than put a variable load on your CPU, just eating processing cycles. It was designed to overcome just that problem.
 
2012-07-11 03:06:35 PM

Phoenix87ta: zedster: subby please do the following
go to start and run "msconfig"
click the startup tab
hit print screen
open up mspaint
hit ctrl+v
hit ctrl+s and save it
upload the image here so we can see how much crap your computer is loading

$10 on Bonzi Buddy


I'll see you on that one and go $100 on shopathome
 
2012-07-11 03:06:48 PM
Because as computers get smarter, people get dumber.
 
2012-07-11 03:07:21 PM
Your computer is doing 300-500x as much stuff. What did you expect?

Also, it's written by people to human timescales. You're not getting any quicker.
 
2012-07-11 03:07:34 PM
Because the hard drive is only 1.2x faster.
 
2012-07-11 03:08:31 PM

Timanous: Aarontology: This is like a fat guy complaining that his pants are as tight as they were when he was skinny.

Silly man.

Fat people wear sweats with elastic waists.


I'll have you know that I have never in my adult life worn sweats.
 
2012-07-11 03:08:36 PM
Could subby talking about the internet not being any faster? Faster computer won't fix a slow internet connection...
 
2012-07-11 03:08:41 PM

zedster: Phoenix87ta: zedster: subby please do the following
go to start and run "msconfig"
click the startup tab
hit print screen
open up mspaint
hit ctrl+v
hit ctrl+s and save it
upload the image here so we can see how much crap your computer is loading

$10 on Bonzi Buddy

I'll see you on that one and go $100 on shopathome


And an extra $100 on unnecessary software bundled with subby's device drivers.
 
2012-07-11 03:08:51 PM
I have an analogy I like to use. It's the freeway one. Build a freeway, and traffic eases. (hardware) Developers come along and build a bunch of new houses/retail and the freeway becomes clogged. (software) Rinse, repeat.
 
2012-07-11 03:09:04 PM

kiteless: [codinghorror.typepad.com image 640x480]

It's all of your smooth curved edges and your color gradients and your fancy pants animations! In the 90s I remember getting along on 16 colors with square corners and I was thankful for it!


We had a guy in my office during the 90's who set the PCs to black text on a black background with the black scheme when he had the night shift.

Good times were had by all!
 
2012-07-11 03:09:34 PM

The Voice of Doom: thejoyofpi
The weirdness with Windows 7 is that it takes freaking forever to shut down.

Used to be computers would take a long time to boot up, they solved that, now most computers boot up quickly. But shutting down is like a 20 minute process.

Maybe you've got automatic updates enabled?
I don't know when Microsoft started doing this, but at some point they thought it would be a good idea to install updates when you shut down the computer.


Because it is a good idea. Way better than bugging you all the time and you clicking "remind me later" because you didnt feel like restarting. I remember wishing for an install updates next shutdown the whole time i was using XP.
 
2012-07-11 03:09:39 PM

thejoyofpi: The weirdness with Windows 7 is that it takes freaking forever to shut down.

Used to be computers would take a long time to boot up, they solved that, now most computers boot up quickly. But shutting down is like a 20 minute process.


You shouldn't really ever need to shut down a Windows 7 machine. Laptops - hibernate. Desktops - sleep.
 
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