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(Boing Boing)   Female gamer creates a Kickstarter to study women in video games. Male gamer responds by a) donating money, b) creating his own Kickstarter, or c) creating a video game that allows the player to beat the female gamer into a bloody pulp   (boingboing.net) divider line 216
    More: Asinine, Kickstarter, women in video games  
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5229 clicks; posted to Geek » on 09 Jul 2012 at 6:22 PM (2 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2012-07-09 10:36:32 PM

Avery614: t3knomanser: Congrats Avery614, not only are you a moron, but you're peers with Skinnyhead and RandomJSA! A WINNER IS YOU!

WTF did I say to piss you off? Just wondering....



Ok now I'm confused. I actually agree with your posts in this thread and in no way condone what the asshat is doing to the girl. If it's the boys girls men women thing I was implying that only children do what he did and only children pay attention to it and cry about it. Adults just ignore the troll. I was just telling Arami76, if he was so invested in his proposal he should go to kickstarter and try to make money off the trolls, because well, fark those guys. If he can use that to discredit someone else's research well then good on him, it was poor research then.
 
2012-07-09 10:36:50 PM

tlchwi02: really, my question is more off topic (and lazy.) I'm just honestly curious what her web series was supposed to accomplish/teach us/prove. its obviously some sort of documentary/critique/learning thing, but it seems kind of redundent. its been documented out the wazoo that the game industry is still really male (and juvenile) oriented. what was she trying to bring to the table that was new and interesting, and why would it lead to this sort of reaction, when the usual "games are juvenile male fantasy" articles that periodically pop up don't seem to get this much hate?


There are plenty of things that have been documented, analyzed, and studied out the wazoo. The Civil War. Pandas. Mesopotamian Farming Techniques. Doesn't stop people from attempting to perform new research/attack a subject from a new angle. Why is this woman so hated for doing just that?
 
2012-07-09 10:37:14 PM

Arami76: One thing I don't agree with is that fact that she's selectively approving her comments. Sure the derogatory comments need to go, but what about the others that are truly subjective? Her goal is to do that to games, why can't others do that to her goal? It make it one sided.

I suggested she take all that money and make a game that makes women what she would like to see in a game. Comment allowed? Nope.
.


I can see your point. But in practice, I'm thinking a Kickstarter project is basically an advertisement. Just because the project is crowdsourced does a company lose control of its advertising space? It's already common for companies to censor certain posts in their product support forum. I don't particularly like that practice, but acknowledge the necessity to control the information on a company-branded site. Otherwise, can you imagine the tech support trolling by angry customers?

Even your comment, while not in any way offensive, could inspire someone to not contribute to this project because he liked your idea better. Appropriate in a company-owned forum? Sure. Appropriate in a company-owned advertisement? Not so much. Kickstarter has created a new gray area where those things merge, and we haven't worked out how to deal with it yet.

Thanks for the inspiration. Maybe I'll Kickstart a project to study how the net keeps creating new gray areas. ;)
 
2012-07-09 10:39:56 PM

Avery614: Avery614: t3knomanser: Congrats Avery614, not only are you a moron, but you're peers with Skinnyhead and RandomJSA! A WINNER IS YOU!

WTF did I say to piss you off? Just wondering....


Ok now I'm confused. I actually agree with your posts in this thread and in no way condone what the asshat is doing to the girl. If it's the boys girls men women thing I was implying that only children do what he did and only children pay attention to it and cry about it. Adults just ignore the troll. I was just telling Arami76, if he was so invested in his proposal he should go to kickstarter and try to make money off the trolls, because well, fark those guys. If he can use that to discredit someone else's research well then good on him, it was poor research then.


Might be a case of mistaken identity, you and Arami76 have names that start with A and end with a number. I know when I scan down the page I sometimes get mixed up that way.
 
2012-07-09 10:40:10 PM
this Listing of the harassment, including the rape-her 'comic' is horrific

/its not humor; the hostility has tipped it into harassment - they must be great fun at parties
 
2012-07-09 10:42:52 PM
i1172.photobucket.com

Ok, i guess it is up to me to set the record straight because the politically correct media doesnt have the balls to do their job. She is a gender feminist doing a series of videos about the supposed misogyny in video games. The video game-o-sphere exploded in opposition to the project for the following reasons:

1. she is a misandric feminist who minimizes male experiences while exaggerating female ones as demonstrated by the above quote in the picture.
2. men use video games to get away from the pervasive influence of women in rest of the world who seek to control the way men speak, think, and act. they just want a space to be left alone so that they can be men.
3. they believe feminism has turned so many institutions openly hostile to men (k-12 and college education, marriage and family court, work, etc) that they now fiercely protect the few remaining male institutions.
4. they believe that claiming female victim hood in a decade where women are considered to be doing better than men in most if not all respects is symbolic of the neglect that society in general has given men and the monopoly that feminism has on discussion about gender relations.

in conclusion, the game-o-sphere doesn't hate women, it hates gender feminists. just my 2 cents on the story which i have been following for the last week or so.
 
2012-07-09 10:43:37 PM

platedlizard: Avery614: Avery614: t3knomanser: Congrats Avery614, not only are you a moron, but you're peers with Skinnyhead and RandomJSA! A WINNER IS YOU!

WTF did I say to piss you off? Just wondering....


Ok now I'm confused. I actually agree with your posts in this thread and in no way condone what the asshat is doing to the girl. If it's the boys girls men women thing I was implying that only children do what he did and only children pay attention to it and cry about it. Adults just ignore the troll. I was just telling Arami76, if he was so invested in his proposal he should go to kickstarter and try to make money off the trolls, because well, fark those guys. If he can use that to discredit someone else's research well then good on him, it was poor research then.

Might be a case of mistaken identity, you and Arami76 have names that start with A and end with a number. I know when I scan down the page I sometimes get mixed up that way.


That makes sense, I was really perplexed because I only had 1 eight line post in the entire thread, and I wasn't even my usual dickish self.....
 
2012-07-09 10:47:28 PM

GF named my left testicle thundercles: i1172.photobucket.com


If that is an actual quote from her
, that's weapons grade stupid/immoral/insensitive/farktarded, pick one or all.
 
2012-07-09 10:51:22 PM

Avery614: GF named my left testicle thundercles: i1172.photobucket.com

If that is an actual quote from her, that's weapons grade stupid/immoral/insensitive/farktarded, pick one or all.


i1172.photobucket.com
it is. Note how similar it is to another famous quote by a well known feminist.
 
2012-07-09 10:53:27 PM
The problem isn't that she's a woman. It's that, as far as I've seen, she has no idea what the hell she is talking about. If she wants to do her point of view justice, she'll go spend some of that money on a couple of hundred games, play them, do her research, and then provide input on the topic, and only if she's capable of doing so. Until then, you guys aren't doing any favors by giving her attention.
 
2012-07-09 10:55:43 PM

GF named my left testicle thundercles: 2. men use video games to get away from the pervasive influence of women in rest of the world who seek to control the way men speak, think, and act. they just want a space to be left alone so that they can be men.


I have been a man for a little while, at least. Never once have I felt the need to retire to a place devoid of women so I can talk about raping women, beating women, and/or in general espouse a mindset that treats women as barely human without getting hounded for talking about raping women, beating women, and/or in general espousing a mindset that treats women as barely human. Usually when I want to retire to a place that is devoid of women, I want it devoid of men too because I just want to be left alone with my work or my thoughts for a little while. Why is it when men say they want to have some place there aren't women, it's usually so they can do or say or express thoughts that are patently offensive towards people who consider women people? Guys who use this as a line of defense to critique her really need to grow up.

Also, honestly, given the massive pervasiveness of misogyny both on and offline, in this country and around the world, I'd posit - again, as a guy - that a good number of men probably do need to have their words thoughts and actions controlled a little bit since they obviously don't seem to be able to or willing to exert any self-control. It's like a parent washing a child's mouth out with soap kind of situation. If you can't or won't exercise some basic degree of civility, you probably do deserve to taste Irish Springs for a while.

No matter how radical a feminist she may be (which, having followed this story since the early stages, I should say that to me I don't see anything that is particularly radical about her brand of feminism), anyone who makes a rape threat against her or makes a f*cking game that centers entirely around physically abusing her is de facto evidence that she's not radical enough since there exists a sizable population of men who think it's okay to threaten to rape her or to make a f*cking game that centers entirely around physically abusing her.
 
2012-07-09 11:04:34 PM

Kome: Usually when I want to retire to a place that is devoid of women, I want it devoid of men too because I just want to be left alone with my work or my thoughts for a little while.


This man speaks the truth. When I want to talk about sci-fi or video games, then I want my guy friends around, the wife would prefer not to be there.. I have a feeling that this is specific to my wife and not all women.

/She's the sports nut
//I'd rather watch Star Trek
///My friends and I have a tendency to really nerd out
 
2012-07-09 11:06:55 PM

GF named my left testicle thundercles: [i1172.photobucket.com image 640x488]

Ok, i guess it is up to me to set the record straight because the politically correct media doesnt have the balls to do their job. She is a gender feminist doing a series of videos about the supposed misogyny in video games. The video game-o-sphere exploded in opposition to the project for the following reasons:

1. she is a misandric feminist who minimizes male experiences while exaggerating female ones as demonstrated by the above quote in the picture.
2. men use video games to get away from the pervasive influence of women in rest of the world who seek to control the way men speak, think, and act. they just want a space to be left alone so that they can be men.
3. they believe feminism has turned so many institutions openly hostile to men (k-12 and college education, marriage and family court, work, etc) that they now fiercely protect the few remaining male institutions.
4. they believe that claiming female victim hood in a decade where women are considered to be doing better than men in most if not all respects is symbolic of the neglect that society in general has given men and the monopoly that feminism has on discussion about gender relations.

in conclusion, the game-o-sphere doesn't hate women, it hates gender feminists. just my 2 cents on the story which i have been following for the last week or so.


I tried searching for any sort of source or reference for that quote. I couldn't find anything, but if you could share where you got it that would help out, thanks.

And the rest of your post is pretty standard MRA nonsense. But I do agree that the game-o-sphere doesn't hate women. Although there is definitely a very vocal segment that do hate women. I think that one of the real problems is that the rest of them tend to ignore that segment for various reasons. This is one of the issues that I think raising awareness and information can actually do a lot of good, so I think that the series will be helpful.
 
2012-07-09 11:13:07 PM

RyansPrivates: ...ashamed that this guy is a member of my gender. What an effing idiot. I think all of us good guys should strive to remove him from our gender.


You hear about moderate Muslims being told to police themselves/stop their more radical brethren. You hear the same about moderate Christians not out-voicing their more radical counterparts as well. How about men also police other men? Guys like this ought to be stopped.

How about - you do this for me, and I'll do for you. I'll gladly smack women who lie about Birth Control, rape, or paternity or otherwise embarrass my gender in various ways. First up, I'll lay a smackdown on Octomom. Seriously lady, 14 kids? No job? WTF? Next up, that girl that carved a B on her face...

So, are we cool?
 
2012-07-09 11:22:23 PM
and this has been another episode of TVTropes Will Ruin Your Life
 
2012-07-09 11:48:09 PM
I think I'll start a Kickstarter to raise money for the sole purpose of hiring some very talented hackers to go out and erase this guy's entire existence from every database or system he can be found in. I'm talking financial, government, academic, credit, and so on.

"I'm sorry but we have no records of you ever having a bank account with our institution"
"I'm sorry sir, but we have no record of you having ever attended this school, much less graduating."
"You were denied the loan because we could not verify your driver's license or social security number Mr. Spurr, nor can we find any previous credit history for you what so ever."
"Sir please step out of the car and place your hands behind your back, you are under arrest for the possession of a false driver's license. The DMV has no record of you ever having a license in this state or any other."
 
2012-07-09 11:50:59 PM

GF named my left testicle thundercles: Avery614: GF named my left testicle thundercles: i1172.photobucket.com

If that is an actual quote from her, that's weapons grade stupid/immoral/insensitive/farktarded, pick one or all.

[i1172.photobucket.com image 640x222]
it is. Note how similar it is to another famous quote by a well known feminist.


Shame. If you replace the word women with families you have a reasonable, considerate, thoughtful, truthful quote.

/need to add the word daughters too
//it seems she forgets that women fight in wars nowadays, they don't just stay home barefoot with the kids.......
 
2012-07-09 11:53:40 PM
so wait, is she into bukkake or what? im confused.
 
2012-07-10 12:47:51 AM
I play games to escape reality, why would I play a game with mediocre looking chicks and ordinary guys? I want giant tits and muscles made for punching holes through the heads of titanium robots.

That guy is a douche but so is she.
 
2012-07-10 01:07:39 AM
I play games to escape reality, why would I play a game with mediocre looking chicks and ordinary guys? I want giant tits and muscles made for punching holes through the heads of titanium robots.

That guy is a douche but so is she.


I have a friend that only plays as female characters in 3rd person games, if they have the option. The way he sees it, it's better to be staring at a girl's ass over some dude's for 20-50 hours.
 
2012-07-10 01:11:06 AM
I kind of defended her ealier....but then I watched her videos. She's a shrieking harpy, I really don't care what the internet does to her. The quote underneath this is from her series on tropes in the media, in fact her entire website is devoted to finding conspiracy in everyday things around her.


"The Girls are influenced by Femme Fatale's malicious rhetoric to see benign, routine every day things as a conspiracy against women and against them personally.

The writers of the Powerpuff Girls have carefully created a fantasy world without gender oppression, so that they can have the Girls start seeing oppression where none exists."
 
2012-07-10 01:27:46 AM
Really lady? The Powerpuff Girls live in a gender equality world!?

Have you even watched the show!? You freakin' moron!
 
2012-07-10 01:33:12 AM

Kome: I have been a man for a little while, at least. Never once have I felt the need to retire to a place devoid of women so I can talk about raping women, beating women, and/or in general espouse a mindset that treats women as barely human without getting hounded for talking about raping women, beating women, and/or in general espousing a mindset that treats women as barely human.


Right? A real man talks about that shiat in front of biatches so they can learn their place....
 
2012-07-10 01:34:13 AM

Avery614: I play games to escape reality, why would I play a game with mediocre looking chicks and ordinary guys? I want giant tits and muscles made for punching holes through the heads of titanium robots.

That guy is a douche but so is she.

I have a friend that only plays as female characters in 3rd person games, if they have the option. The way he sees it, it's better to be staring at a girl's ass over some dude's for 20-50 hours.


Exactly, and any gamer females I know go on about the guys in the same way.
 
2012-07-10 01:36:22 AM

doglover: Really lady? The Powerpuff Girls live in a gender equality world!?

Have you even watched the show!? You freakin' moron!


media.tumblr.com
 
2012-07-10 01:38:24 AM

Jim_Callahan: Eh, as an actual for-reals scientist that's expected to be rigorous and shiat when I publish, I can't help but feel the slightest bit of Schadenfreude that an amateur jackass is getting relentlessly mocked for basically doing an op-ed piece where she selectively edits data to make a political point and calling it "research".

I mean, intellectually, I know that I don't actually agree with the reason she's being mocked, but emotionally there's a degree of satisfaction with the workings of karma involved, like if a robber grabbed a little old lady's purse and then tripped in a manhole while escaping or something.

//I'd maybe be more on the girl's side if she was either up-front about the editorial/opinion nature of the project or if some actual harm had been done to her. Frankly people making fun of you on the internet being called oppression or a "silencing technique" is an insult to all the people in the world that are actually oppressed and silenced.


Well done, sir. I agree.
 
2012-07-10 01:43:25 AM
I did find it amusing on her webpage that she says she was going to youtube because she believes that video blogging is where the "learning is actually happening" and that academia was "pretty hostile towards hostile culture".

Taking her views to be vetted by the youtube crew of 14 year olds might have opened her eyes as to why that hostility exists.
 
2012-07-10 01:45:49 AM
I wonder what would happened if I tried to create the same type of Kickstarter for male tropes in video games.

I'm not a muscular he-man that can pulled a helicopter down with my teeth and I'm offended that is how they portray men to be.
 
2012-07-10 02:29:50 AM
Can it also be said that this woman does not understand what tropes are or how they work?

Her thesis sucks since she declares tropes are cliches; cliches are a trope that also has a few different uses including: discredited tropes, dead horse trope, and Seinfeld is Unfunny.

She doesn't even have the sense to research the term she is lambasting. Such a shame since the tropes pages are a wealth of information on how all fiction and non-fiction work.

It's shame that people just threw money behind this when any modicum of research would have shown how stupid her premise is.
 
2012-07-10 03:00:42 AM

Avery614: Kome: Usually when I want to retire to a place that is devoid of women, I want it devoid of men too because I just want to be left alone with my work or my thoughts for a little while.

This man speaks the truth. When I want to talk about sci-fi or video games, then I want my guy friends around, the wife would prefer not to be there.. I have a feeling that this is specific to my wife and not all women.

/She's the sports nut
//I'd rather watch Star Trek
///My friends and I have a tendency to really nerd out


Eh, it's different when you're both geeks. That said we do have some differing interests. Biggest biatch is calling the console in time.

/I'd rather watch Trek too
 
2012-07-10 04:38:22 AM

GF named my left testicle thundercles: [i1172.photobucket.com image 640x488]

Ok, i guess it is up to me to set the record straight because the politically correct media doesnt have the balls to do their job. She is a gender feminist doing a series of videos about the supposed misogyny in video games. The video game-o-sphere exploded in opposition to the project for the following reasons:

1. she is a misandric feminist who minimizes male experiences while exaggerating female ones as demonstrated by the above quote in the picture.
2. men use video games to get away from the pervasive influence of women in rest of the world who seek to control the way men speak, think, and act. they just want a space to be left alone so that they can be men.
3. they believe feminism has turned so many institutions openly hostile to men (k-12 and college education, marriage and family court, work, etc) that they now fiercely protect the few remaining male institutions.
4. they believe that claiming female victim hood in a decade where women are considered to be doing better than men in most if not all respects is symbolic of the neglect that society in general has given men and the monopoly that feminism has on discussion about gender relations.

in conclusion, the game-o-sphere doesn't hate women, it hates gender feminists. just my 2 cents on the story which i have been following for the last week or so.



I disagree.

I don't personally think that misogyny is necessarily the root of their abuse. Yes, it has been expressed in those terms but in my experience many gamers are simply incredibly thin-skinned when it comes to anyone criticising their hobby.

Remember the response when Roger Ebert wrote an article claiming that games aren't art and never will be. The actual debate that issued was completely drowned out by gamer butthurt.

As for her own argument, I do agree with her to a point. Many games, particularly mainstream games, do rely on a short list of common archetypes for female characters. But they do as well for most male characters. There's no end to the brooding young man with spiky hair, the mute space marine or the arrogant commanding officer secretly betraying his own kind, just to name a few off the top of my head.

Part of the reason, IMO, is that just like any other medium, games are relatively new and the expressive and narrative language is still very much in development. I have seen quite a few experimental independent games that are exploring new avenues in storytelling through games. In time, just like with cinema, the more successful techniques will be adopted by the mainstream.

The other reason is, again as with all other media, archetypes (or tropes if you prefer) are very useful tools for telling a story. Writers and directors need to be able to define characters and situations quickly, efficiently a subtly to an audience without ambiguity. Reality falls by the wayside in favour of getting your point across.

Case in point. We know perfectly well that real scientists don't run around in white lab coats behind tables filled with flasks of multicoloured liquids with a large microscope in the background. But they'll be depicted that way because the audience will instantly recognise that person as a scientist without any further explanation. We know there's no sound in space but there will still be an audible boom when a spaceship explodes. The same reason, it communicates the plot point.

You certainly can write rich, full, realistic characters that defy or ignore stereotypes. But in order to do so you need to carefully plan how to define that character and do so without overburdening your piece with excessive and dull description or stating information directly by forcing it into dialogue. It's not easy to do this without getting bogged down in explanation and bringing the flow of your story to a screeching halt.


sorry if this was tl and you dr.
 
2012-07-10 05:33:32 AM

t3knomanser: doglover: How is there outcry?

It's the outcry that's offensive. I basically ignored the project the first time I saw it- not my bag. But then a dishe of douches came out to play, and I found myself contributing just to spite them.

//Dishe is the collective noun for douchebags. It's like a murder of crows, or a pride of lions, except you want to punch them.


Exactly the same reason why she got 20 of my human moneys.
 
2012-07-10 06:22:49 AM
i.imgur.com
 
2012-07-10 07:16:39 AM

Sultan Of Herf: Sounds typical of a group that by and large dont know how to relate to women other human beings.

Umm, this chick is trying to make her own video game...what should we do?

Ummm...insult her and chase her away?

Yeah, totally...gaming is for guys.



No wonder these farks cant get laid.


more accurate
 
2012-07-10 08:04:03 AM

galactus5000: t3knomanser: doglover: How is there outcry?

It's the outcry that's offensive. I basically ignored the project the first time I saw it- not my bag. But then a dishe of douches came out to play, and I found myself contributing just to spite them.

//Dishe is the collective noun for douchebags. It's like a murder of crows, or a pride of lions, except you want to punch them.

Exactly the same reason why she got 20 of my human moneys.


You should have kept reading this thread. Appears that she's a man hating twuntwaffle with no conception of how to interpret a show as simple as the Powerpuff Girls, let alone all of video gamedom.

Sorry you've wasted twenty moneys. Moral of the story: don't support researchers who use words like "trope"
 
2012-07-10 08:13:33 AM
Well I read the entire thread. There are some farking weird people on this site.

And I'm sticking with my original assessment. This is a massive feminist wank that will be of little value to anyone outside of feminist circles. If this was her project in college, nobody would have ever heard of or cared about it.

She has obviously seen the monetary value of trolling, and for every entitled man-child posting about her on the internet, there are 10 people willing to kick her cash.

Also, jealousy is the main motivation behind all the nay saying. How many times has "why does she deserve 160k blah blah" been put out there? Just because your kickstarter only got 1% funded and you aren't as motivated as this woman is no reason to get all buttgriefed.
 
2012-07-10 08:22:45 AM

doglover: galactus5000: t3knomanser: doglover: How is there outcry?

It's the outcry that's offensive. I basically ignored the project the first time I saw it- not my bag. But then a dishe of douches came out to play, and I found myself contributing just to spite them.

//Dishe is the collective noun for douchebags. It's like a murder of crows, or a pride of lions, except you want to punch them.

Exactly the same reason why she got 20 of my human moneys.

You should have kept reading this thread. Appears that she's a man hating twuntwaffle with no conception of how to interpret a show as simple as the Powerpuff Girls, let alone all of video gamedom.

Sorry you've wasted twenty moneys. Moral of the story: don't support researchers who use words like "trope"


They didn't "waste" $20, they're buying a sense of social responsability. Sure the cause is probably dubious, but if they don't look closely, they'll never know, and they're not going to take the strident critics' word for it. So they still get the feeling. The net effect could be that the world will be a slightly stupider place, but on balance, it's effect is cancled out by a republican somewhere. This is something of the basis for wisdom of crowds. The idiots get together and go nowhere pushing against each other, the people possessing specific insights get together and make progress which is enjoyed by everyone.
 
2012-07-10 08:29:00 AM

Arami76: TheOmni: Arami76: One thing I don't agree with is that fact that she's selectively approving her comments. Sure the derogatory comments need to go, but what about the others that are truly subjective? Her goal is to do that to games, why can't others do that to her goal? It make it one sided.

I suggested she take all that money and make a game that makes women what she would like to see in a game. Comment allowed? Nope.

So you want to make observations on women's rules in games, but you don't want to be criticized for it, nor make a game to illustrate what your ideals should be?

Sorry. You might as well be the "nice" version of the horrid trolls that do the same to you in harsh and profound ways.

This is a weird comment. The article linked here briefly mentions that Anita Sarkeesian kickstarted a research project into female videogame tropes in a kind of background establishing way. The main point of the article was mentioning the various silencing tactics taken against her, most notably a video game made for the sole purpose of simulating beating her. So you ignore all this and instead are simply trying a different silencing tact. It's not even really clear what you are talking about though. You are upset that she is moderating comments somewhere? I assume her kickstarter page? Of course, even if she wanted to (which rightly she doesn't) she couldn't take all that money and do something else. That's not how kickstarter, or any type of crowdfunding, works. If you really do want to discuss your idea, I could explain why it's bad, but more importantly in this context it's irrelevant. She has no obligation to host your irrelevant and derailing comments, so filtering them out is appropriate, especially in the context of a crowdfunding project like this. And of course there's the classic accusation that someone being attacked is just as bad as their attackers. People have been accusing feminists of misandry for longer than they were familiar with either word, but it wasn't tr ...

I had actually posted the comment on her site and not on the kickstarter page well before the outpouring of funds that came in. I'm not 100% sure, but we can probably figure out when exactly. I'm thinking I made my suggestion around the 25000 mark.

Regardless of kickstarter or anything else, I personally feel that any person that sensors anything that is not hate and rather impartial commentary shouldn't be validated as genuine nor impartial themselves.

I'm very bad at expressing myself with text (or even verbally for that matter). But in my mind she's essentially gathered a bunch of money to bash games because they don't meet her own criteria on how they portray women. Plain and simple, down to brass tacks and all that, she's going in a round about way to do what all these trolls are doing to her, but in a very civilized and thought out manner.

I'll have to dig up the exact comments I posted on her site, but I truly stated that instead of do that, she create! CREATE! Why break down what is already there for better or worse? Make something new. Show people what CAN be. Not break down and crap on peoples misconceptions, stupidity or what have you.

MAKE SOMETHING NEW! SHOW US WHAT *CAN* BE!


Isn't that the whole idea of critiquing in the first place?
 
2012-07-10 08:37:43 AM

MBK: This guy is a dildo.

Listen, if you want to make a video game about women being hurt, you can. There are plenty of games out there that let you do what you want to anyone you want, women included. Games like Fallout, Skyrim, etc give you free reign over your character, and let you be violent and an asshole and things like that.

But...they aren't directed at one particular woman. They are treated to be the same as the male characters.

This guy created a game to attack one particular woman over one particular issue "just because she wouldn't listen to me".

This guy has pretty farked up issues if he can take the time to create a game just to attack one person because he doesn't agree with her view points.


If someone made a game where you beat up Ann Coulter or her Canadian equivalent Sue Ann Levy, I'd play it.
 
2012-07-10 08:46:06 AM

HotWingConspiracy: This is a massive feminist wank that will be of little value to anyone outside of feminist circles.


And yet, feminist circles are of such value to society that they are the circles mainly responsible for getting women the right to vote (as a parallel, a lot of the hyperbole about socialized medicine destroying democracy we're hearing in light of the recent Supreme Court ruling is pretty damn close to reaction when it was announced women could vote), changing laws making it an actual crime for a husband to rape his wife, for women to be able to file for divorce, for women to enter the workforce, for women to own property, etc. etc. etc. Again, since gender inequality, like all forms of discrimination, hurt everyone, if she's of value to feminist circles then I'm happy she's doing what she's doing. And, frankly, the rest of us should be too.

Also, jealousy is the main motivation behind all the nay saying. How many times has "why does she deserve 160k blah blah" been put out there? Just because your kickstarter only got 1% funded and you aren't as motivated as this woman is no reason to get all buttgriefed.

I would argue that the massive amount of hatred that's been thrown in her direction, even before her Kickstarter earned a single donation, is evidence to the contrary. It isn't jealousy that she was able to get better funded for her project, it's that she said very explicitly she's going to do a video series of the role women play in video games and a bunch of men who had never heard of her, never listened to her, and apparently don't have anything better to do with their lives went all apesh*t and threatened to rape her, DDOS'd her page, and engaged in a degree of bullying that would make a Scientologist blush.

That another large part of the community responded to that kind of bullsh*t response with donations and outpourings of support for continuing to go through with her idea is pretty goddamn cool. But the outpouring of donations and support came AFTER she was so bitterly attacked for merely proposing to examine the roles of women as video game characters. So I'm going to suggest that jealousy is not the main motivation here. Entitlement, stupidity, hatred, immaturity... those are better candidates for the main motivation, though I'd suggest all are at least partially motivating.
 
2012-07-10 09:00:31 AM
So according to Fark... fake raping a woman is justifiable if she's a douche.

Right?
 
2012-07-10 09:09:48 AM

Kome: HotWingConspiracy: This is a massive feminist wank that will be of little value to anyone outside of feminist circles.

And yet, feminist circles are of such value to society that they are the circles mainly responsible for getting women the right to vote (as a parallel, a lot of the hyperbole about socialized medicine destroying democracy we're hearing in light of the recent Supreme Court ruling is pretty damn close to reaction when it was announced women could vote), changing laws making it an actual crime for a husband to rape his wife, for women to be able to file for divorce, for women to enter the workforce, for women to own property, etc. etc. etc. Again, since gender inequality, like all forms of discrimination, hurt everyone, if she's of value to feminist circles then I'm happy she's doing what she's doing. And, frankly, the rest of us should be too.


You're right about the history, but I will say I can't see a video series critique of video games becoming as important or having as much impact as any of that. I mean, this has been a common point of gripe about the movie industry for how many decades now? Not much has changed. If anything it's much worse. It's still an industry that chases profit, and flesh sells. But men are exploited and misrepresented as well in those terms.

That said, I support her (not with cash), because she's doing her own thing and raising her own money. I just don't think the project will really break any ground or shed light on anything. At least people are here talking about it I suppose.
 
2012-07-10 09:18:50 AM
1. The guy in this article is an ass. As someone with male genitalia, I disown any association with him.

2. That being said, I'm also a little sick of "I'm a Girl Gamer! I'm a GIRL Gamer! I'm A GIRL GAMER!!!!" being shouted from the hilltops. We get it. You're a girl and you're playing a game that predominantly enjoyed by adolescent males. Fine. Whatever. Shut up and play the game, then.

I find the whole "gamer" title to be stupid. EVERYONE PLAYS VIDEOGAMES NOW. Everyone. My 77-year-old mother. My 79-year-old father. My sister who is pushing 50. My nephews, my boss, my coworkers, and pretty much everyone I meet plays videogames. They're ubiquitous, and saying "I'm a gamer" these days is kind of like saying "I'm a TV watcher" or "I'm a driver" or "I'm a telephone owner".

Videogames were mass-appeal popular in the 1980s, and they've remained so ever since. What the hell do you think "Pac-Man Fever" was all about, anyway? How do you think Atari sold 20 million 2600 consoles over the past three decades? There's a Wii, PS3, or Xbox in most homes today, and if not those, then an older generation console is owned. People have games on their phones, on their computer, and even on their set-top boxes designed for playing movies.

Being a "gamer" is no unique thing. It's no prime title. Claiming you're a "gamer" is like claiming there's something unique about eating breakfast cereal. I'm sorry, but everyone is doing it and you're not the original, rebellious figure you think you are.

This especially applies to "Girl Gamers" who seem to think they're the only females who play games, and that they're this entirely new phenomena. News Flash, ladies: There were plenty of girls in the arcades in the 80s. There were plenty of girls playing Atari 2600, NES, Genesis, Playstation, and Gameboy in the 70s, 80s, and 90s. Videogames are everywhere now, and it would be tough to find a female who doesn't play the occasional videogame.

So what you mean is "I'm a multiplayer First Person Shooter fanatic" most likely, and to that I say "good luck" because I tend to avoid those things for all the reasons you "girl gamers" cite as being oppressive to you. Specifically, I refer to the fact that some of the adolescent jizzbags playing FPS games on multiplayer are immature, stupid, obnoxious, and insulting. They target EVERYONE and pick on them for whatever they can. For some people, it's because they're Black/White/Asian/whatever. For some it's because they "sound gay". For some it's because they sound "old". And for you, it's because you sound like a chick, and sometimes feel the need to broadcast that you are a chick by picking a name like "HotSexxxxyGamerQueen" or "PrincessL33T" when you play.

And guess what? The immature dipshiats will pick on you just as much as they pick on everyone else. Running behind the shelter of being a girl doesn't endear you to them, or to the rest of us.

Those of us who aren't douchebags just want to play the game without having to listen (for the umpteenth time) to you complaining that you're being picked on because you're a girl.

As Tom Hanks put it: There's no crying in baseball.

In other words, JUST PLAY. Don't pick a name that shouts LOOK AT ME I HAVE TITS. Don't keep reminding people that you're this "unique" creature because you're a female and you're GASP! playing a video game. If you don't like the other players, then report them or find another game with more mature players like the rest of us do when our game is overrun with idiots.

Just stop whining about it. We get it. You play games. You have breasts. We're all impressed. Now shut up and contribute to the fun.

And if it's not fun, then why the f♥ck are you doing it? What point are you trying to prove?

Most of us will treat you like anyone else. If you're upset over 13-year-olds calling you names and freaking out over something, then JOIN THE F'ING CLUB. That's life. There will always be assholes. Get over it.
 
2012-07-10 09:42:54 AM

ZeroCorpse: ...rant...


do you need a cookie?
 
2012-07-10 09:53:09 AM

ZeroCorpse: In other words, JUST PLAY. Don't pick a name that shouts LOOK AT ME I HAVE TITS.


This looks suspiciously analogous to "don't dress like a slut if you don't want to get raped".
 
2012-07-10 09:53:24 AM
Electrify
If someone made a game where you beat up Ann Coulter or her Canadian equivalent Sue Ann Levy, I'd play it.


The key to success for a game like that is to make it customizable, i.e. you include a victim database and let people add whatever entries they like.
That's how "Teacher Busters" (German C64 game) became an underground success 25 years ago despite being a rather lame game.
 
2012-07-10 09:54:06 AM

Arami76: Kome: Arami76: I only wish that these talks/deliberations could be opened up to ALL that see and have an opinion on the matter.

There's nothing that's preventing you from making your own videos or starting your own Kickstarter project. Well, nothing, of course, except yourself.

That's how you participate in these kinds of discussions. You make a claim, or reject a claim, and you go and do some leg work to find or discover evidence to support your position, paying particular attention to ambiguous and contradictory evidence, and then enter the arena like an adult and engage in civil conversation.

Beyond that, having an opinion by itself doesn't warrant it deserving being listened to. Having an informed opinion, backed up with data or evidence or proof (depending on the conversation), does.

The things is, I tried to express my opinion directly and was shunned. To me, that is censorship. She wants you to see what she wants you to see.


You clearly do not understand what censorship is. Censorship is repression of speech by someone in authority. This chick is not in a position of authority, and she is certainly not prohibiting you from stating your opinion. Period.

Here's an analogy for you: If you mail me a sign that says "Arami76 Hates Broccoli", and I refuse to put the sign up on my lawn, I'm not censoring you. I just don't give a fark, and there's no good reason why I need to provide a forum for your opinions.

Your argument is essentially the same as the farktard who made the "punch her in the face" videogame. You both seem to think she should listen to you. Granted you're much less of an asshole about it, but you're both wrong, for the same reason.
 
2012-07-10 09:57:46 AM

Tickle Mittens: doglover: galactus5000: t3knomanser: doglover: How is there outcry?

It's the outcry that's offensive. I basically ignored the project the first time I saw it- not my bag. But then a dishe of douches came out to play, and I found myself contributing just to spite them.

//Dishe is the collective noun for douchebags. It's like a murder of crows, or a pride of lions, except you want to punch them.

Exactly the same reason why she got 20 of my human moneys.

You should have kept reading this thread. Appears that she's a man hating twuntwaffle with no conception of how to interpret a show as simple as the Powerpuff Girls, let alone all of video gamedom.

Sorry you've wasted twenty moneys. Moral of the story: don't support researchers who use words like "trope"

They didn't "waste" $20, they're buying a sense of social responsability. Sure the cause is probably dubious, but if they don't look closely, they'll never know, and they're not going to take the strident critics' word for it. So they still get the feeling. The net effect could be that the world will be a slightly stupider place, but on balance, it's effect is cancled out by a republican somewhere. This is something of the basis for wisdom of crowds. The idiots get together and go nowhere pushing against each other, the people possessing specific insights get together and make progress which is enjoyed by everyone.


Twenty of my finest human moneys to keep the trolling alive? It's worth it. And, if my choice comes down to man-hating uberfeminist or over-entitled douchewit gamerbro...I choose the one who will cut my dick off, not the one who makes me want to cut my own dick off.
 
2012-07-10 10:03:00 AM

ProfessorOhki: If you're going to allow comments, allow comments and remove the offensive ones where needed. If the conversation is so out of control that you need to go to individual approval, it's time to give up and just disable them. It's disingenuous to even have a comments section if you're cherry picking comments that agree with your views. It completely undermines the potential for discussion and you might as well re-title the section "accolades."


Why? If the comments are not germane, why keep them? Say, for example, I write a cooking blog, and post a recipe for apple crisp. If someone posts a comment saying "try adding some cranberries", that's relevant, and will get posted. If someone writes a comment saying "I don't like apple crisp - why didn't you make a chocolate cake?", that's irrelevant, and will be discarded.
 
2012-07-10 10:17:31 AM

CheekyMonkey: Why? If the comments are not germane, why keep them?


The Germans ain't got NOTHING to do with this, boy!
 
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