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(MSNBC)   California deliberately lets homes sit empty rather then let homeless veterans use them   (openchannel.msnbc.msn.com) divider line 261
    More: Sick, West Los Angeles, American Legion, you know  
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12613 clicks; posted to Main » on 07 Jul 2012 at 10:57 PM (2 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2012-07-08 01:16:01 AM

Weaver95: welfare and inexpensive health care for veterans is a difficult issue for Republicans. their taught to HATE the weak, and that all welfare and all inexpensive health care is 'socialisms'. But they're also taught that veterans are godz and that they should 'support the troops' at all costs. So when a vet needs welfare or access to decent medical care...the average GOP voter has a brain lock. I think most Republicans honestly do not know what to do when they see a veteran on welfare or taking food stamps. they want to hate them for being weak and socialist but at the same time they want to help.


Joe Walsh (R-etard IL) doesn't have that problem. Just ask Lt Col Tammy Duckworth
 
2012-07-08 01:17:02 AM

Quantum Apostrophe: "than", idiot.


AMEN!
 
2012-07-08 01:19:32 AM

farkin_Gary: Weaver95: Pincy: farkin_Gary: Again I say; The single thing holding this country back from complete anarchy and destruction, is the massive volume of conflicting agendas.

Unfortunately, the scales are beginning to tip as more of the little guys are slipping off the edge.

But they'll still vote Republican because the socialist Black guy is scary.

i'm not so sure. I think the GOP is starting to fragment. did you watch the slow cascade of derp that's been flowing through the right wing blogosphere since the SCOTUS decision on Obamacare? its been going some interesting places.

If there's any shred of sanity left on the right, it had damn well better fragment.


the problem for the GOP is that the leadership is trying to throw Justice Roberts under the bus and it's proving to be more difficult than expected. see - they HAVE to disavow him. Roberts betrayed the cause. he HAS to be punished...but they still need him. the conflict is making life difficult for the GOP. they literally do not know what to think about the recent SCOTUS ruling.
 
2012-07-08 01:21:49 AM
If Arnold were still governor, he would have already attended to this problem.
 
2012-07-08 01:24:46 AM
What? Use it like a toilet?
 
2012-07-08 01:29:44 AM
I think California should serve as a shining example to NOT letting the people vote on their own budgets. Liberal or conservative or doorknob f***er, people will vote against higher taxes to pay for things every time.
 
462
2012-07-08 01:41:58 AM
Good thing we are getting that 4 billion dollar bullet train from Medina to Bakersfield!
 
2012-07-08 01:43:02 AM

Snarcoleptic_Hoosier: I think California should serve as a shining example to NOT letting the people vote on their own budgets. Liberal or conservative or doorknob f***er, people will vote against higher taxes to pay for things every time.


We should come up with a new political party.
 
2012-07-08 01:44:41 AM
the financial elite (1%) would rather see us all starve to death than forgive our debts. we need to escape this cycle or that's exactly what will happen.
 
2012-07-08 01:45:24 AM

Snarcoleptic_Hoosier: I think California should serve as a shining example to NOT letting the people vote on their own budgets. Liberal or conservative or doorknob f***er, people will vote against higher taxes to pay for things every time.


And yet whiny f**kers keep demanding more than they deserve from other peoples pockets.....

Really if you read the article, its a phenomenal example of why Governments and bureaucracies and public funded programs suck. Apparently I house more veterans than those multi million dollar facilities.....

Of course if you dont read the article you think we must be talking about vacant housing that the state owns being donated to allow the homeless to live there....Which is just so stupid its painful.
 
2012-07-08 01:48:10 AM
I once got called a liberal because I wouldn't give a veteran an extra break on a $20 bar bill. It was surreal.
/3-for-1, like every buyback.
 
2012-07-08 01:48:15 AM

some_beer_drinker: the financial elite (1%) would rather see us all starve to death than forgive our debts. we need to escape this cycle or that's exactly what will happen.


historically speaking, once a society voids the social contract, that society tends to crumble. in our case, I think we're gonna be pretty messy about our break up into regional geo-political states.
 
2012-07-08 01:56:24 AM
Is this the same California that banned "Meals on Wheels" after making it a crime to give any form of aid to the homeless, or is this the same California that is allegedly filled to the brim with "left-wing liberal pinkos?"
 
2012-07-08 02:03:07 AM

TuteTibiImperes: California has an immigration problem. California also has a budget problem. Why not kill two birds with one stone?

California: "Hey there, illegal immigrant, why don't you agree to work for minimum wage doing something we need like changing bedpans, supervising homeless people in a home to make sure they don't flip out, or helping to maintain our infrastructure? If you do a good job and keep your nose clean we'll even throw in citizenship after five years, and give you on the job training so you can have a legitimate career afterwards!"

Illegal Immigrant: "That sounds better than picking tomatoes for 50 cents a bushel, where do I sign up?"


Feds: "Hey, look! An employer employing illegals! RAID THEM!"

/...they do that in states that have declared pot is legal. Do you really think they wouldn't do it in a state that says it's okay for undocumented workers to actually keep their jobs?
 
2012-07-08 02:08:11 AM

Unshavenhelga: This government has proved time and again that it give no farks about vets. Shame on us.


I am a vet, retired military to be specific, and even I don't think we need to do every damn thing for them. There are literally thousands of benefits, programs and services that simply being a veteran make you eligible for.

Lets face it, you only have to serve 6 months and receive a general discharge or higher to qualify as a vet, that means someone could join, graduate basic training and a few months down the road be declared unfit for duty and now we have to support that person with veterans benefits for the rest of their lives?

I know its easy to think of all our veterans as war heroes but lets face it, most of these guys served a couple years and got out, and in the case of Guard and Reserve they only did it 1 weekend a month, never even leaving their home town, let alone serving in a war.

We had kids all the time who would come in for the benefits like the GI bill, serve their 4 years comfortably in the states, doing no more than they had to do, then get out. I know other guys who joined because their wife got pregnant and they had no medical insurance. They got what they needed, served their time and got out. Now years later they're going around calling themselves a vet like they actually did something worth bragging about. Do you really think all these guys should get a free meal ticket for the rest of their lives for that? I sure don't.

If they received an injury that was duty related, then yes I think we need to take care of that for them, but aside from that they should be responsible for their own health care like any other person. I also think most of these veteran programs should stipulate 8 years of service, or service in a time of war to qualify as well. There's just way to many people who qualify as a vet to be handing out benefits to all who comes asking.
 
2012-07-08 02:09:21 AM

malaktaus: MaudlinMutantMollusk: malaktaus: MaudlinMutantMollusk: Ok, I'll play Devil's advocate... why should homeless veterans get preference over other homeless people?

/and having been one of them, I can assure California has a lot of them
//discuss

Veterans are especially likely to be homeless. They make up about 10% of the general population, but about 1/3 of the homeless population. This disparity suggests that veterans are a group especially in need of help, and it would be appropriate to expend additional resources targeting them specifically.

Ok, I agree. But WHY are they homeless?

/we're going for something here...

They were probably poor to begin with- not all of them were, but compared to the general population they certainly tend to be less wealthy. Now they quite possibly have mental health problems, in some cases even brain damage, on top of poverty. On top of that, if you spend enough time in the military you get institutionalized, much like a guy who spends time in prison. When you get out it can be hard to readjust even if you aren't going crazy at the same time; it can be hard acting like a normal, sane human being through an entire job interview, and it can be hard figuring out what to do when you no longer have someone screaming it at you. If you have nothing to fall back on it's very easy to end up homeless.


Oh, ffs. The guys going into that facility would be guys like my father. Who is quite sane, not particularly poor, not homeless...BUT. He's an elderly man, getting ill (Parkinson's), not a lot of money for his retirement, and no family who can reasonably care for him.* He needs care in a nursing facility, or will someday soon. There are a lot of older men like him, quite able to function in society, but unable to live alone anymore. When my dad can't work anymore, he'll need a place like this.

*At present. If I get a good job before he needs help, he'll be on my dime. But a lot of older men like him don't have families that can take care of them.
 
2012-07-08 02:09:23 AM

NewportBarGuy: It's usually just some stupid kid yelling about something they just learned about in class or on the interwebz.


Oh God, I had a supervisor at work like that once. Every week it was like "this is what they covered in Business 101 last week" from him.

Even more painful since I had a college degree with one major in Business Admin.
 
2012-07-08 02:11:04 AM

NephilimNexus: Is this the same California that banned "Meals on Wheels" after making it a crime to give any form of aid to the homeless, or is this the same California that is allegedly filled to the brim with "left-wing liberal pinkos?"


the hell?

/I'm afraid we're going to need a citation here, Ray
 
2012-07-08 02:16:31 AM
It's amusing how real 'Merican conservatives always understand the California state budget.
 
2012-07-08 02:16:50 AM

some_beer_drinker: the financial elite (1%) would rather see us all starve to death than forgive our debts. we need to escape this cycle or that's exactly what will happen.


The 1% has always been a problem. Every 100 years or so we fix the problem and then forget. US and French revolution got rid of the royalty and we were ok for awhile.
Anti-trust laws a 100 years later to try and control the robber barons. We did ok until about another 100 years had passed ....

Reagan (and his followers) came in and undid most of the controls on 1%. Death Tax, upper bracket tax rate (which no one really paid ...), capital gains tax tax. Toss in glass steagall repeal and TADA, we got our royalty back.

The question which remains is when does something happen to fix this?
The GOP "caused" this. But the dems are terrified of doing that is needed to fix these problems.

We have had 30 years of this experiment. I vote for putting everything back for 10 years and then reviewing how things have improved or not.

/LOL - utopia for the 99%

All
 
2012-07-08 02:23:11 AM

REO-Weedwagon: It's amusing how real 'Merican conservatives always understand the California state budget.


Nevermind "conservatives"--everyone is always lambasting California for something or other, then we find they don't live within 1000 miles of here.
 
2012-07-08 02:30:21 AM

crispyone: If these were homeless drug addicts and ex-convicts you farktard liberals would be all about helping them but since they are veterans it's, "Fark them! Why should they get help?"


Go to hell. I'm in favor of helping everyone, no matter what their job is or was. I know one liberal who is against veterans aide, and he's a widely known whack job jerk. This is out of the hundreds of liberals I hang out with. Hundreds. Most liberals are in favor of providing a social safety net to whomever needs it. Once again, go to hell.
 
2012-07-08 02:35:07 AM

Gyrfalcon: REO-Weedwagon: It's amusing how real 'Merican conservatives always understand the California state budget.

Nevermind "conservatives"--everyone is always lambasting California for something or other, then we find they don't live within 1000 miles of here.


Yeah... and they don't seem to understand it's all ya SoCals that cause all the problems

/us NorCals just want to keep our water
 
2012-07-08 02:35:08 AM

MaudlinMutantMollusk: Close, but what I was leaning towards was a general lack of job skills. Public schools certainly don't teach them anymore, and if you volunteer and wind up Infantry, you're not likely to get a whole lot of training in marketable skills.


Yeah, I was infantry myself, so I can definitely attest to the fact that you learn no useful job skills. Not that I "wound up" that way, I qualified for every enlisted job in the Army and actually chose it because I really am that stupid. I was in fact homeless for a while after I got out, more than a year and a half as a matter of fact. If it wasn't for two government programs I would probably still be homeless; specifically, the post-9/11 GI Bill and stop-loss back pay. I was stop-lossed for 15 months to serve an additional deployment in Iraq, and a while after I got out- a while after I became homeless as a matter of fact- Congress passed a bill granting $500 a month to each soldier who got stop-lossed, for each month they were stop-lossed, and I applied for and received a check for $7500. I used the money to get a motel room and buy a decent set of clothes and started applying for jobs, and eventually got a crappy job at Walmart, because that was really all I was qualified for; I was the best machinegunner in my battalion, but that doesn't count for much in the civilian world.

I saved enough money to start going to a community college, and applied for the Post-9/11 GI Bill so that I get payed to go there. I also eventually registered for VA health care, was pretty much immediately diagnosed with PTSD and depression, and eventually filed for disability on these grounds and also for some problems with my leg, where I had received a gunshot wound, and got a fairly high raiting for that. I've about finished the core curriculum for the state university and am planning to transfer after about one more semester, I'll probably major in engineering. I would probably be homeless for the rest of my life without government aid, and I'm acutely aware of the fact. The government doesn't give nearly enough aid for the very poor, and the conservative rhetoric makes me farking sick. A lot of people just never get a chance, that's why they're so poor.
 
2012-07-08 02:38:29 AM
namatad:

Korean and Vietnam were a cake walk in comparison.
Toss in the insane expense of not having a draft and using contract labor instead???
Shudder
What a complete waste of life and money.



Korean War - US Casualties
36,940 dead
92,134 wounded

Vietnam War - US Casualties
58,220 dead
303,644 wounded

War in Afghanistan (As of July 1) - US Casualties
1580 Dead
16,854 Wounded

War in Iraq - US Military Casualties
4486 Dead
32,223 Wounded

War in Iraq - PMC Casualties
1554 Dead
43,880 Injured

So how about you shut the fark up.
 
2012-07-08 02:41:06 AM
This is the same state that used 9/11 victim funds to patch holes in their budget.

But yea let's get a tax increase! We can trust them with our money.
 
2012-07-08 02:41:49 AM

malaktaus: MaudlinMutantMollusk: malaktaus: MaudlinMutantMollusk: Ok, I'll play Devil's advocate... why should homeless veterans get preference over other homeless people?

/and having been one of them, I can assure California has a lot of them
//discuss

Veterans are especially likely to be homeless. They make up about 10% of the general population, but about 1/3 of the homeless population. This disparity suggests that veterans are a group especially in need of help, and it would be appropriate to expend additional resources targeting them specifically.

Ok, I agree. But WHY are they homeless?

/we're going for something here...

They were probably poor to begin with- not all of them were, but compared to the general population they certainly tend to be less wealthy. Now they quite possibly have mental health problems, in some cases even brain damage, on top of poverty. On top of that, if you spend enough time in the military you get institutionalized, much like a guy who spends time in prison. When you get out it can be hard to readjust even if you aren't going crazy at the same time; it can be hard acting like a normal, sane human being through an entire job interview, and it can be hard figuring out what to do when you no longer have someone screaming it at you. If you have nothing to fall back on it's very easy to end up homeless.


Are you just pulling that out of your ass? Do you have any military experience, a relative who served perhaps, or did you get your knowledge from Hollywood movies? Even in basic, where they get paid to yell at you 24/7, they don't yell THAT much, and after basic is over the yelling is done with. If you think all they do in the military is run around barking out orders and yelling at people to shine their boots you have a serious misconception of military life.

As far as them being crazy, I hope you're not implying the military does that to people. If they come out with mental disabilities chances are they went in that way. The military spends a great deal of time training people how to cope with stress and other mental health issues, they also have some of the best mental health facilities in the world so if there is an issue they can get the help they need.

There are some differences between civilian life and military that require a bit of adjustment when you get out, but institutionalized? Give me a farking break!
 
2012-07-08 02:45:45 AM

Novart: This is the same state that used 9/11 victim funds to patch holes in their budget.

But yea let's get a tax increase! We can trust them with our money.



Gotta love Republicans

Arnold Schwarzenegger, borrowed $3 million of memorial license plate money to help plug the state's budget deficit.
 
2012-07-08 02:52:59 AM

malaktaus: MaudlinMutantMollusk: Close, but what I was leaning towards was a general lack of job skills. Public schools certainly don't teach them anymore, and if you volunteer and wind up Infantry, you're not likely to get a whole lot of training in marketable skills.

Yeah, I was infantry myself, so I can definitely attest to the fact that you learn no useful job skills. Not that I "wound up" that way, I qualified for every enlisted job in the Army and actually chose it because I really am that stupid. I was in fact homeless for a while after I got out, more than a year and a half as a matter of fact. If it wasn't for two government programs I would probably still be homeless; specifically, the post-9/11 GI Bill and stop-loss back pay. I was stop-lossed for 15 months to serve an additional deployment in Iraq, and a while after I got out- a while after I became homeless as a matter of fact- Congress passed a bill granting $500 a month to each soldier who got stop-lossed, for each month they were stop-lossed, and I applied for and received a check for $7500. I used the money to get a motel room and buy a decent set of clothes and started applying for jobs, and eventually got a crappy job at Walmart, because that was really all I was qualified for; I was the best machinegunner in my battalion, but that doesn't count for much in the civilian world.

I saved enough money to start going to a community college, and applied for the Post-9/11 GI Bill so that I get payed to go there. I also eventually registered for VA health care, was pretty much immediately diagnosed with PTSD and depression, and eventually filed for disability on these grounds and also for some problems with my leg, where I had received a gunshot wound, and got a fairly high raiting for that. I've about finished the core curriculum for the state university and am planning to transfer after about one more semester, I'll probably major in engineering. I would probably be homeless for the rest of my life without gover ...


Ya know... every day here is Halloween; everyone wears a mask, and you never know for certain who or what is real. But if your story is true, you are a true hero and a patriot, and you have my undying respect

/or you could just be yanking my crank...
 
2012-07-08 02:54:27 AM

Clemkadidlefark: California

No budget for operating new Homeless Veterans facility
$4.2 million to staff a facility they can't allow anyone to stay in
$3.5 million to pay maintenance to care for the place no one can stay in

But ...

California Assembly of Baboons votes to spend $48 billion to build high speed rail connecting L.A. and San Francisco. Which are already connected by air travel.

California asks, Why we so broke?


Yea really, why should we even try to build up our infrastructure.
 
2012-07-08 02:57:37 AM

Weaver95: 1. i'm not a 'progressive lib'.


LOL! Good one!
 
2012-07-08 02:59:21 AM

Weaver95: Pincy: farkin_Gary: Again I say; The single thing holding this country back from complete anarchy and destruction, is the massive volume of conflicting agendas.

Unfortunately, the scales are beginning to tip as more of the little guys are slipping off the edge.

But they'll still vote Republican because the socialist Black guy is scary.

i'm not so sure. I think the GOP is starting to fragment. did you watch the slow cascade of derp that's been flowing through the right wing blogosphere since the SCOTUS decision on Obamacare? its been going some interesting places.


go on. . .
 
2012-07-08 03:01:00 AM
It has been noted by several objectively minded people that, when you give somebody money, they keep it. And they spend it on whatever they damn well please or can get away with.
 
2012-07-08 03:01:02 AM
Are they 'voting' Veterans? If not, the powers that be, do not care.
 
2012-07-08 03:01:17 AM

MaudlinMutantMollusk: Ya know... every day here is Halloween; everyone wears a mask, and you never know for certain who or what is real. But if your story is true, you are a true hero and a patriot, and you have my undying respect

/or you could just be yanking my crank...


Yeah, I know, I don't usually talk about it because it's the internet, but I'm high and a little drunk so fark it.
 
2012-07-08 03:03:11 AM
I say we eat the veterans. We will absorb their warrior spirits and become powerful.
 
2012-07-08 03:03:25 AM
This isn't meant to be directed at anything besides the "states shouldn't pay, the VA should" thing...

Has no one ever heard of the national guard? As an admittedly young four year active duty guy who's only orders to deploy we're subsequently cancelled, I'd invite you to take a look at national guard deployment tempos. This is very much not a strictly federal affair.
 
2012-07-08 03:05:26 AM

ReapTheChaos: malaktaus: MaudlinMutantMollusk: malaktaus: MaudlinMutantMollusk: Ok, I'll play Devil's advocate... why should homeless veterans get preference over other homeless people?

/and having been one of them, I can assure California has a lot of them
//discuss

Veterans are especially likely to be homeless. They make up about 10% of the general population, but about 1/3 of the homeless population. This disparity suggests that veterans are a group especially in need of help, and it would be appropriate to expend additional resources targeting them specifically.

Ok, I agree. But WHY are they homeless?

/we're going for something here...

They were probably poor to begin with- not all of them were, but compared to the general population they certainly tend to be less wealthy. Now they quite possibly have mental health problems, in some cases even brain damage, on top of poverty. On top of that, if you spend enough time in the military you get institutionalized, much like a guy who spends time in prison. When you get out it can be hard to readjust even if you aren't going crazy at the same time; it can be hard acting like a normal, sane human being through an entire job interview, and it can be hard figuring out what to do when you no longer have someone screaming it at you. If you have nothing to fall back on it's very easy to end up homeless.

Are you just pulling that out of your ass? Do you have any military experience, a relative who served perhaps, or did you get your knowledge from Hollywood movies? Even in basic, where they get paid to yell at you 24/7, they don't yell THAT much, and after basic is over the yelling is done with. If you think all they do in the military is run around barking out orders and yelling at people to shine their boots you have a serious misconception of military life.

As far as them being crazy, I hope you're not implying the military does that to people. If they come out with mental disabilities chances are they went in that way. The military spends a great deal of time training people how to cope with stress and other mental health issues, they also have some of the best mental health facilities in the world so if there is an issue they can get the help they need.

There are some differences between civilian life and military that require a bit of adjustment when you get out, but institutionalized? Give me a farking break!


Also, this.
 
2012-07-08 03:11:44 AM

ReapTheChaos: There are some differences between civilian life and military that require a bit of adjustment when you get out, but institutionalized? Give me a farking break!


I speak mostly from personal exprience, and admittedly YMMV. Part of the problem may be that I got out of the military just in time for the worst economic recession since the 1930s, and that may have colored my opinion.
 
2012-07-08 03:13:13 AM

malaktaus: Yeah, I know, I don't usually talk about it because it's the internet, but I'm high and a little drunk so fark it.


Welcome to my favorites list

/respect, my friend
 
2012-07-08 03:33:16 AM
"The California Department of Veterans Affairs" When did CA get its own Army?
 
2012-07-08 03:53:00 AM

MaudlinMutantMollusk: Ok, I'll play Devil's advocate... why should homeless veterans get preference over other homeless people?

/and having been one of them, I can assure California has a lot of them
//discuss


In my mind, anyone who risks their life (I could never do it) to support our country is deserving of a little extra respect, be they firemen, policemen, emergency rescue workers, intelligence operatives, or yes, soldiers, no matter how evil and corrupt the political scum giving them orders may be.

Not extra or special rights, like some people seem to think they should get, but certainly a little extra respect.

None of which is relevant here, of course. The answer to your question is that these are nursing homes for veterans, run and paid for through the Office of Veterans' Affairs. Of course they're going to homeless veterans. What's next, are you going to say it's unfair that veterans get special treatment at VA hospitals?
 
2012-07-08 04:05:49 AM
Keizer_Ghidorah

good one!
 
2012-07-08 04:11:03 AM

Emposter: MaudlinMutantMollusk: Ok, I'll play Devil's advocate... why should homeless veterans get preference over other homeless people?

/and having been one of them, I can assure California has a lot of them
//discuss

In my mind, anyone who risks their life (I could never do it) to support our country is deserving of a little extra respect, be they firemen, policemen, emergency rescue workers, intelligence operatives, or yes, soldiers, no matter how evil and corrupt the political scum giving them orders may be.

Not extra or special rights, like some people seem to think they should get, but certainly a little extra respect.

None of which is relevant here, of course. The answer to your question is that these are nursing homes for veterans, run and paid for through the Office of Veterans' Affairs. Of course they're going to homeless veterans. What's next, are you going to say it's unfair that veterans get special treatment at VA hospitals?


First, note the term "Devil's advocate": this indicates I'm posing a rhetorical question, not necessarily indicative of my own opinions: I threw that out there to stimulate debate, to the extent that debate exists here on Fark. Yeah, I know (now that the frikkin link works for me) that this is about a old vets home...
But I am going to stand by my later post: why should the individual states be responsible for rewarding federal service? As close as I can determine through cursory research, this whole state veterans home thing, in California at least, was the result of intensive lobbying by veterans groups from the freakin civil war. Shouldn't the VA be taking responsibility here?
 
2012-07-08 05:08:50 AM
Veterans have been getting shafted since the Vietnam war.

The government starts a fight, sends over millions of troops and trillions of dollars of ordinance and the ones who come home all shot to hell and back find themselves eligible for sub par care.

Vietnam vets had to fight like heck to get war benefits -- because congress never declared Vietnam to be a 'war' but a police action. So when thousands of Vets returned with vital chunks shot off, congress refused to take care of them properly since they had not been in a 'real' war.

Back as long as 40 years ago I was reading about the horrors that were veterans hospitals, under funded, under staffed, bug and rodent infested, with whole sections falling down because there was no funding for repair. I recall several investigations to 'set things right for those willing to die for us' but eventually, it all drifted back to shiat.

In the meantime, billions were being spent on new parks, baseball and football stadiums, beautification programs for cities and highways and major tax incentives were handed out to draw in businesses.

I also recall the 'Big Switch' to a 'Peace Time' military, where seasoned military leaders could be sued and thrown out if they 'offended' a recruit while trying to teach them to stay alive when enemy soldiers -- whose instructors offended them a lot -- were determined to poke holes in them with hot bits of metal.

On a similar front, I just had my elderly Mother stay in the local hospital for a time and it took her 10 hours after arriving in the ER to get taken to a room. I assumed the place was busy and backed up. Once in her room, for the next several days, she received what I'd consider a bit sub rate care.

I noticed the construction of an impressive new Intensive Care Facility on the grounds. Elsewhere, something else impressive was in the process of being built.

I was impressed.

Then I found out that the 10 hours she waited was not because the place was packed, but because they didn't have enough staff working the floors. In subsequent days, I saw many an empty room and staff running about like mad trying to get work done.

The hospital had cut it's budgets and laid off around 1/3 of it's employees. The administrator/CEO though lived in a new home, built by the hospital, worth a few mill, drove top of the line cars, bought by the hospital and his kids all went to private schools, paid for by the hospital. He and his family had full coverage health insurance -- paid by the hospital and full coverage auto insurance, paid for by the hospital. His salary started at nearly a million a year and no matter what, if he gets fired or quits, he gets two million in severance pay, stock options in the hospital, takes his medical coverage with him and gets a fat bonus.

At the same time, I noticed highway construction along the 'rich' area. What really caught my attention was the median strip, planted with over 500 medium growth Palm Trees, which run an average of $250 each. In-between them were more flowering plants.

I calculated that over four million was spent on 'beautification' on that short stretch of road.

Between the over paid CEO and the highway, there were more than enough funds to not only fully staff the hospital, but to keep them working for years.

It all comes down to priorities. Health care and homes verses the rich and their images.

I figure the same thing is happening in California.
 
2012-07-08 05:47:56 AM
Quick recipe for fake outrage:

Step 1: Build multi-unit housing facilities for veterans.

Step 2: Hold off on opening said facilities until you have the money available to hire the needed staff to maintain these facilities.

Step 3: Submit a Fark headline making it sound like homes are sitting vacant in the desert just waiting for single families to move into them

Step 4: Blame it on the Democrats/Federal government/Obama/Socialists/Obamacare, etc...
 
2012-07-08 05:53:57 AM

MaudlinMutantMollusk: Emposter: MaudlinMutantMollusk: Ok, I'll play Devil's advocate... why should homeless veterans get preference over other homeless people?

/and having been one of them, I can assure California has a lot of them
//discuss

In my mind, anyone who risks their life (I could never do it) to support our country is deserving of a little extra respect, be they firemen, policemen, emergency rescue workers, intelligence operatives, or yes, soldiers, no matter how evil and corrupt the political scum giving them orders may be.

Not extra or special rights, like some people seem to think they should get, but certainly a little extra respect.

None of which is relevant here, of course. The answer to your question is that these are nursing homes for veterans, run and paid for through the Office of Veterans' Affairs. Of course they're going to homeless veterans. What's next, are you going to say it's unfair that veterans get special treatment at VA hospitals?

First, note the term "Devil's advocate": this indicates I'm posing a rhetorical question, not necessarily indicative of my own opinions: I threw that out there to stimulate debate, to the extent that debate exists here on Fark. Yeah, I know (now that the frikkin link works for me) that this is about a old vets home...
But I am going to stand by my later post: why should the individual states be responsible for rewarding federal service? As close as I can determine through cursory research, this whole state veterans home thing, in California at least, was the result of intensive lobbying by veterans groups from the freakin civil war. Shouldn't the VA be taking responsibility here?


Since we're playing devil's advocate, you DO realize that California, like nearly half the US, has a state militia (two state militias, in fact, in addition to the National Guard, which is Federalized militia), the California State Military Reserve, which is organized and maintained solely by the State of California and in fact protected from federal control by US law? In other words, they have state veterans.

Also, cursory research of my own quickly turned up that most of the California Office of Veterans' Affairs homeless veterans programs are largely funded by *drumroll please* the federal government.
 
2012-07-08 06:06:36 AM
namatad: MaudlinMutantMollusk: never an envisioning of having a continuous supply of wounded veterans, and states felt obliged to their residents who volunteered.

WHAT THE FARK
The only reason that we currently have such a large supply of wounded soldiers is because of two incredibly farked up wars started by W.

Korean and Vietnam were a cake walk in comparison.
Toss in the insane expense of not having a draft and using contract labor instead???
Shudder
What a complete waste of life and money.

/We need a new amendment. Any time an american is deployed overseas (war, peacekeeping, whatever) it is required that there be a draft and that all children/grandchildren/aunts/uncles/cousins of congress (of proper age) be deployed first.
/no deferments - period. they can peel potatoes


What the fark are you talking about? Iraq War II and the Afghanistan campaigns are the least bloody major wars that the United States has participated in in history. Modern medical and battlefield trauma care, combined with rapid evacuation of casualties to Level 1 Equivilant surgical intervention centers and, once stabilized, transfer to definitive care in friendly territories have reduced the mortality rate of injured American and NATO soldiers to around 2-3%. You have a better chance of living in that combat zone after a major, life threatening traumatic injury, then you do in the United States.

Vientam had 59,000 Killed in Action over 8 years of combat. In 10 years of operations, only 4,400 people have been killed in Afganistan.
 
2012-07-08 06:08:22 AM

Securitywyrm: MATH TIME!
$280,000 a month for two buildings, capable of housing 450 people total, to sit vacant.
That's $9333 a DAY.
Just what the hell is in these buildings that is costing over nine thousand dollars a day to maintain? Maintenance/security personnel makes $20 an hour(generously), times eight hours a day, $160. Let's say there's... a dozen staff for EMPTY BUILDINGS, 8 at one location and 4 at the other. $1920 per day on maintenance. Where is the other six thousand dollars going?

This is why we can't have nice things, because nobody in the government has ANY incentive to cut spending. You spend all the money you can get your hands on, and then just blame the budget when money runs out. It's like in the military: You have to use every single consumable resource you're authorized to use, even if you're just wasting it. If you're authorized 10,000 rounds of ammunition, and you use 9,000, then next year you're only authorized 9,000. Better go down to the range and just blow through the ammo for no purpose.

This kind of waste makes me angry. You look at how much money they spend to build these things, that would have paid RENT MONEY for every one of the people it could have possibly housed, for as long as the facility would have been open.


Its actually even worse than that according to TFA.

In addition to $280K a month they want over 4 million to STAFF
a place with NO residents.
 
2012-07-08 06:15:37 AM

MaudlinMutantMollusk: Gyrfalcon: REO-Weedwagon: It's amusing how real 'Merican conservatives always understand the California state budget.

Nevermind "conservatives"--everyone is always lambasting California for something or other, then we find they don't live within 1000 miles of here.

Yeah... and they don't seem to understand it's all ya SoCals that cause all the problems

/us NorCals just want to keep our water


I've lived in both halves.

I would dance for joy if So Cal had to undergo the water rationing we went through on the coast during the prolonged drought of the 70's. It might force these So Cal douchebags at least into not watering their lawns 365 a year.
 
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