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(Business Insider)   Scientology sends out panicky email to members instructing them how to censor the internet from all this nasty talk about Tom Cruise and Katie Holmes   (businessinsider.com) divider line 349
    More: Amusing, Tom Cruise, Scientology, Marty Rathbun, Church of Scientology, subject lines  
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23944 clicks; posted to Main » on 07 Jul 2012 at 7:21 AM (2 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2012-07-07 12:14:46 PM

Julie Cochrane: The thing about Scientology...


I'm afraid your comment is firmly in tl;dr-territory and won't find much attention, which is unfortunate because it's quite thoughtful.
 
2012-07-07 12:14:47 PM

Abox: ExperianScaresCthulhu: Abox: Scientology is a cult! Real religions worship a hippie on a stick.

The hippie on a stick has shiatty followers, but he himself (no matter how many of 'him' there actually were at the same time) was a pretty cool dude, anybody would want to roll with. Dude was sincere, he wasn't trying to scam people out of money, out of sex, out of power. He just wanted people to love one another and live righteous, moral lives.


And if they don't do what he wants they get to burn in hell for eternity? Yeah he's real cool. If he wants to roll with me then he can make me omnipotent too, or give up his magic powers and we can roll as equals.


well actually if you are a follower of Christ you would not go to hell. So really following Jesus brings you no harm.
 
2012-07-07 12:19:02 PM

Sudo_Make_Me_A_Sandwich: Someone suggested that the grammar was a watermark


That's probably it. Or the author's trailing 's' key is malfunctioning:

If there are abuse of such Code of Conduct, those website
These is where things can be turn around!
One of the Code of Conduct that Microsoft impose
it show up on the bottom right
Once you got the hang of it it get pretty fast


Gah. What?
 
2012-07-07 12:22:59 PM

Waldo Pepper: So really following Jesus brings you no harm.


Unless you're a Protestant in Elizabethan England. Or a Catholic in Elizabethan England. Or a Huguenot in the 16th century. Or Peter being questioned by the Romans.
 
2012-07-07 12:24:04 PM

Waldo Pepper:
I still want to know what Xenu has on our government that allowed for their tax free status. After all these years shouldn't the freedom act have allowed some of this to be released..


This is a very vague answer, but here it is: I remember reading that at one point Scientology did lose their tax-exempt status but got it back after they'd applied some pressure, possibly as a result of Operation Snow White.

Hubbard's wife, along with others, went to jail for it, but they got enough leverage to sue/blackmail their way back to having tax-exempt status.

What I've read about Scientology the last few days leads me to believe that they're beyond a cult and into organized crime territory.
 
2012-07-07 12:26:29 PM
If you want to have a sci-fi belief system as your religion, just call yourself a Jedi and get it over with. It's a lot cheaper and a lot more socially acceptable to say you're a Jedi and you believe in the Force than to say you're a Scientologist and pay the CoS tens or hundreds of thousands of dollars to audit out your thetans.

Going all-out as a Jedi might cost you about $120 for a decent replica lightsaber, a few hundred dollars for a good costume, and you can buy DVD's of all the films for about $80. The closest thing to a Jedi bible is The Jedi Path: A Manual for Students of the Force, with the deluxe edition going for about $62 on Amazon, or about $12 for the paperback. For maybe $500 you can dress like a Jedi, read Jedi texts, and geek out on the movies.

OR

You can spend around $400,000 over many years to practice Scientology as you are "audited" up to OT VIII over years, probably have to "disconnect" from your family, and let the CoS build up a huge blackmail file on you (since "auditing" is essentially confession, except they are tape recording everything and you're using a crude lie detector, and they are actively interrogating you).
 
2012-07-07 12:26:36 PM

Gawdzila: I can't wait until this farking cult implodes. It has to happen one day, it is too ridiculously stupid not to.


I know they tussled with Anonymous. When the Striesand Effect hits, it's will be a billion gnats to swat.
 
2012-07-07 12:30:06 PM
Here's a fun little video of one of their former intelligence/counterintelligence operatives (yes, they have those) talking about an operation where a couple of his colleagues poisoned the toothpaste of a man and his pregnant wife for the high crime of speaking at a convention of psychiatrists!

/The entire organization needs to be forcibly dismantled, and it needs to be done yesterday
 
2012-07-07 12:30:54 PM

OtherLittleGuy: Gawdzila: I can't wait until this farking cult implodes. It has to happen one day, it is too ridiculously stupid not to.

I know they tussled with Anonymous. When the Striesand Effect hits, it's will be a billion gnats to swat.


Scientology would have imploded when Hubbard died had Miscavige not wrested control from the "rightful" heirs to the cult.

//Additional fun fact: LRH was taking heavy levels of psych drugs at the end of his life and died with them in his system.

www.xenu.net
 
2012-07-07 12:34:42 PM

Hetfield: Waldo Pepper: So really following Jesus brings you no harm.

Unless you're a Protestant in Elizabethan England. Or a Catholic in Elizabethan England. Or a Huguenot in the 16th century. Or Peter being questioned by the Romans.


Romans: What's a 'huguenot'?
Peter: Beats me.
Peter: No pun intended.
 
2012-07-07 12:36:38 PM
Isn't it the rich and famous scientology covets? I ask because twice this month I've recieved invites in the mail to come and, "discover my inner self, spirituality, and find everlasting personal growth". Ummm, I'm so far from wealthy...just a normal hourly wage earner. Not that I'd want to spend one dime on those freaks if I had big bucks anyway...
Their attempt to invite me is a total FLUNK! on their part.
 
2012-07-07 12:40:11 PM

poodebunker: Isn't it the rich and famous scientology covets? I ask because twice this month I've recieved invites in the mail to come and, "discover my inner self, spirituality, and find everlasting personal growth". Ummm, I'm so far from wealthy...just a normal hourly wage earner. Not that I'd want to spend one dime on those freaks if I had big bucks anyway...
Their attempt to invite me is a total FLUNK! on their part.


Look, if you don't have the hundreds of thousands of dollars it takes to become clear and break through the Wall of Fire, that's fine. You can simply work for Scientology for free for a decade. But if you leave before that time is up, you owe them tens of thousands of dollars.

See? Scientology wants poor followers, too.
 
2012-07-07 12:43:46 PM

Hetfield: Walker: But this time they are trying to take on the whole internet community and delete every single comment that is negative about Scientology. When someone tries to take on the internet, always bet on the internet. I see Anonymous and /b/ having fun with this one.

Precisely, Scientology vs. The Internet has happened before. You yourself mentioned Anonymous, who did their best to give Scientology a hard time. I don't think it had a lasting effect on their operations, though. This is just my impression and I don't have much to back it up, but I don't have the feeling public controversy and outrage has done much to substantially weaken the cult.


My brother used to carry 'this is what scientologists actually believe' fliers in his car. We had a great time handing them out when they tabeled at a free Detroit festival thing. I think the guy there would've hit my brother if he could have. Eh if he stopped one person that's enough.
 
2012-07-07 12:48:01 PM

gimmegimme: OtherLittleGuy: Gawdzila: I can't wait until this farking cult implodes. It has to happen one day, it is too ridiculously stupid not to.

I know they tussled with Anonymous. When the Striesand Effect hits, it's will be a billion gnats to swat.

Scientology would have imploded when Hubbard died had Miscavige not wrested control from the "rightful" heirs to the cult.

//Additional fun fact: LRH was taking heavy levels of psych drugs at the end of his life and died with them in his system.

[www.xenu.net image 243x277]


It's widely presumed that Hubbard was murdered by Miscavige, the day following the "new will" being written.

There's also then a wonderfully Cersei Lannister moment, where Miscavige tears up the last orders of Hubbard to put the Broeker's in charge, and claims the throne himself.
 
2012-07-07 12:49:44 PM

Silverstaff: OR

You can spend around $400,000 over many years to practice Scientology as you are "audited" up to OT VIII over years, probably have to "disconnect" from your family, and let the CoS build up a huge blackmail file on you (since "auditing" is essentially confession, except they are tape recording everything and you're using a crude lie detector, and they are actively interrogating you).


All in the vain hope that you might eventually "blow" and gain the power to control MEST (Matter, Energy, Space, and Time).

Silly fools. I'm not a Scientologist, have no OT level, yet I already have the power.
 
2012-07-07 12:53:11 PM

StreetlightInTheGhetto: Hetfield: Walker: But this time they are trying to take on the whole internet community and delete every single comment that is negative about Scientology. When someone tries to take on the internet, always bet on the internet. I see Anonymous and /b/ having fun with this one.

Precisely, Scientology vs. The Internet has happened before. You yourself mentioned Anonymous, who did their best to give Scientology a hard time. I don't think it had a lasting effect on their operations, though. This is just my impression and I don't have much to back it up, but I don't have the feeling public controversy and outrage has done much to substantially weaken the cult.

My brother used to carry 'this is what scientologists actually believe' fliers in his car. We had a great time handing them out when they tabeled at a free Detroit festival thing. I think the guy there would've hit my brother if he could have. Eh if he stopped one person that's enough.




"What they believe" isn't the problem. Most orthodox religions have ridiculous specific beliefs. Water into wine, giant arks, worlds on the back of turtles.... not of these things are more sensible than volcano space lords, it's just they're more familiar.


The problem is the fact that they're a sinister vampire squid, with a trail of murders and slaves and grand theft behind them.
 
2012-07-07 12:55:20 PM

Mugato: phenn: All organized religions are cults. Every last stinking one. I can't understand all the hate for Scientology when the Catholic church is still protecting baby farkers and pervs.

What is that?

No, cults have a very separate definition. And why can't one hate both kiddie diddling and Scientology's farked up practices at the same time?


One can, if one chooses to. I was thinking what you said...so....together, me and you make two. Let us hate them both!
 
2012-07-07 01:04:45 PM

Bungles: "What they believe" isn't the problem. Most orthodox religions have ridiculous specific beliefs. Water into wine, giant arks, worlds on the back of turtles.... not of these things are more sensible than volcano space lords, it's just they're more familiar.


With Scientology, they actively lie about their beliefs though.

They hide the Xenu and space opera stuff until you've been in for years and have paid hundreds of thousands of dollars.

At first they say they are just a philosophy that can be practiced alongside any other religion and you don't have to convert. Once you get in they gradually apply more pressure to renounce other faiths, and it's impossible to make it particulaly far into Scientology unless it's your only faith. Since OT III (the whole "Xenu" story) specifically says that other Earth religions are lies created by Xenu to mislead mankind.

They make patently absurd claims about what auditing can do. Over the years, Scientology has tried to claim that auditing can cure cancer, cure AIDS, cure virtually anything (since all those conditions are caused by thetans and engrams and thus could be cured by treating them). In fact, in the 1950's, that's why Scientology became a religion: the original non-religious "Dianetics Centers" got in legal trouble for practicing medicine without a license because they tried to treat real medical conditions with dianetics auditing. So, they latched on to their spiritual dogma and the past-life stuff that sometimes comes up and rebranded it as a religion so auditing went from medicine to faith healing essentially.

Yeah, other religions have wacky beliefs too, but they'll happily discuss them with you and not hide them or lie about them if you want to discuss it. The CoS is more like a Mystery Cult of antiquity, with secret doctrines and levels of initiation where most members don't even know the actual core beliefs of the religion.

The decades long crime spree that the CoS (Operation Freakout, Operation Snow White, ect) has undertaken didn't hurt either.
 
2012-07-07 01:11:09 PM
 
2012-07-07 01:11:44 PM
And just for the heck of it, I'm adding a link to Scientology in Canada. They never did gain a 'religion' foothold here and lost some court cases, which is awesome.

Scientology in Canada

They're still thugs with a lot of money, but screw them.
 
2012-07-07 01:12:39 PM

Silverstaff: Bungles: "What they believe" isn't the problem. Most orthodox religions have ridiculous specific beliefs. Water into wine, giant arks, worlds on the back of turtles.... not of these things are more sensible than volcano space lords, it's just they're more familiar.

With Scientology, they actively lie about their beliefs though.

They hide the Xenu and space opera stuff until you've been in for years and have paid hundreds of thousands of dollars.

At first they say they are just a philosophy that can be practiced alongside any other religion and you don't have to convert. Once you get in they gradually apply more pressure to renounce other faiths, and it's impossible to make it particulaly far into Scientology unless it's your only faith. Since OT III (the whole "Xenu" story) specifically says that other Earth religions are lies created by Xenu to mislead mankind.

They make patently absurd claims about what auditing can do. Over the years, Scientology has tried to claim that auditing can cure cancer, cure AIDS, cure virtually anything (since all those conditions are caused by thetans and engrams and thus could be cured by treating them). In fact, in the 1950's, that's why Scientology became a religion: the original non-religious "Dianetics Centers" got in legal trouble for practicing medicine without a license because they tried to treat real medical conditions with dianetics auditing. So, they latched on to their spiritual dogma and the past-life stuff that sometimes comes up and rebranded it as a religion so auditing went from medicine to faith healing essentially.

Yeah, other religions have wacky beliefs too, but they'll happily discuss them with you and not hide them or lie about them if you want to discuss it. The CoS is more like a Mystery Cult of antiquity, with secret doctrines and levels of initiation where most members don't even know the actual core beliefs of the religion.

The decades long crime spree that the CoS (Operation Freakout, Operation ...




There are branches of every major world religion who believe some from of pray can result in actual healing. Also, revelatory religions aren't particularly rare either, nor is the demand for money. Christianity was a revelatory religion for the main chunk of its existence prior to vernacular bible translations, and Catholicism still has "higher mysteries".

I'm not suggesting they aren't a criminal organisation (they obviously are), but the actual beliefs are no more peculiar than any major faith.
 
2012-07-07 01:16:27 PM
We really need some sort of FAQ to point to whenever someone just says, b-b-b-but other religions! One gets tired of repeating himself.
 
2012-07-07 01:18:29 PM
Scientology can send out an email? I need to email this Scientology. And maybe Christianity while I'm at it.
 
2012-07-07 01:20:49 PM
upload.wikimedia.org

The TRUE founder of the Church of Scientology.
 
2012-07-07 01:21:34 PM

jaytkay: badhatharry: Just to let all you SP's know. This letter is not their secret plan. Reporting TOS violations is not the extent of their endeavors. Scientologists are not a joke.

what is an "SP"?


Suppressive Person.
 
2012-07-07 01:21:48 PM

vossiewulf: Apparently Scientology doesn't cover grammar in that whole very expensive years-long training thing.


That makes it all the more delicious to pretend it's legit.
 
2012-07-07 01:21:56 PM

Mugato: We really need some sort of FAQ to point to whenever someone just says, b-b-b-but other religions! One gets tired of repeating himself.



Well, it's because it's wrong. Their beliefs are little different from "other religions".

The problem with Scientology is not its beliefs, the problem with Scientology is that it's a cult built on slavery, kidnap, murder, and extortion.
 
2012-07-07 01:27:37 PM

Walker: Hetfield: Gawdzila: I can't wait until this farking cult implodes. It has to happen one day, it is too ridiculously stupid not to.

I have little hope of this happening anytime soon.

Walker: Scientology is about to meet the Streisand effect. Somehow they didn't think their cunning plan all the way thru.

They have experienced the Streisand effect several times now. It doesn't appear to have made them any weaker.

But this time they are trying to take on the whole internet community and delete every single comment that is negative about Scientology. When someone tries to take on the internet, always bet on the internet. I see Anonymous and /b/ having fun with this one.


They're pissed because Wikipedia banned them.

lulz
 
2012-07-07 01:29:14 PM

Bungles: Mugato: We really need some sort of FAQ to point to whenever someone just says, b-b-b-but other religions! One gets tired of repeating himself.


Well, it's because it's wrong. Their beliefs are little different from "other religions".

The problem with Scientology is not its beliefs, the problem with Scientology is that it's a cult built on slavery, kidnap, murder, and extortion.


So in a few hundred years Scientology will catch up with the mainstream religions?
 
2012-07-07 01:29:27 PM

Six_By_Nine: Bloody William: Six_By_Nine: So, she decided that she was going to get more publicity by taking down a cult.

Assuming I granted your premise, that's bad how exactly?

I didn't say it was a bad thing. I don't think she's a particular mastermind, and the long-term effects aren't necessarily bad ones. But it doesn't make this not-a-PR-play, either. She gets to use this opportunity to say that she's this good person that got caught up in something bad. Maybe her conscience about her kid nudged her in the right direction, but the kid is already a few years old, so it's not like she hasn't had time to consider what would happen when the kid got older.

Though in all fairness, it's probably really a good thing this is as public as it is. Scientology wouldn't try any funny business around someone that public. That's why Parker and Stone were relatively safe after the Scientology episodes of South Park.


In all fairness to the Sisterhood, women are as vulnerable to having the man in the boat do our thinking for us as men are vulnerable to thinking with the little head.

It may not always seem that way to guys, but players know how to play, and Cruise is definitely a player.

You can see how creepy a player is a mile off if you're not a fairly young woman who is the focus of the player's active attention as prey. If you're young and inexperienced, and the player is focused on you, not your friend, then he is not going to let his mask slip when you are watching. You are the primary audience and you will only see what he wants you to see.

So everybody else can tell you all day long what a creep the player is and all most young women are going to be able to say--especially when that player is a handsome, wealthy, skilled actor-- is, "Uh-huh...." with a stupidly charmed expression on her face. Because, well, she's charmed stupid.

You know how I know Katie Holmes was a naive buyer of Cruise's bullshiat? Because narcissistic players like Cruise will date women who do not buy their bullshiat, but they do not marry them. The women they marry are unequals--beneath them--who buy the full line of charm, and who have stars in their eyes, and who fully believe that they have "won the prize" by being "chosen" by a wonderful, exalted guy like Cruise.

I have never, ever, ever seen a narcissist marry a gal, or take her for the long-term "it" girlfriend, who had the tiniest cynical inkling of what was really behind his eyes.

It's not a moral defense of Katie Holmes to say she was genuinely romanced and charmed by Cruise.

It probably sounds like I'm criticizing Cruise for being a narcissist. I'm not, really. That ability to charm and project a false persona--those are necessary attributes for his career. Keeping his appearance up is a necessary attribute for his career. Presenting himself with extraordinary confidence in the face of a media environment that's like a constant pack of piranhas is a necessary attribute for his career.

His job demands the skills and attributes of a narcissist, and a lot of the barriers against attachments a narcissist has are positive survival traits in the Hollywood fishbowl. I deeply admire people who can take what could otherwise be a crippling mental health challenge and turn it into a priceless advantage. He's made lemonade from the lemons he didn't choose to have---good for him!

Katie Holmes isn't a saint. She certainly should have let her better judgment lead her to investigate Scientology more closely before marrying Tom, and it was a reason not to marry him. His loony paranoia about psychologists and psychiatrists was/is reason enough not to marry him.

Older men pick younger women for more reasons than looks. Cruise was able to manipulate Holmes until she grew up enough to see through his bullshiat and decide for herself what she did or didn't want to do--and that's when the marriage fell apart.

When one partner can manipulate the other one, a marriage seems happy because it has an artificial, manufactured "agreement." This happened in both my former marriages, and was at least half my fault--but I had to get out of the second marriage to get help and learn how to stop doing my half of it and stop picking guys who do the other half of it.

When the manipulated partner starts insisting on holding on to their own, real opinions and not arguing until they both "agree" on their spouse's opinion, the "happy" of the marriage falls apart at lightspeed.

"I can't stop you from continuing to do this, and we need to quit arguing about it and do other things, but quitting arguing is not me agreeing with you. I'm unhappy about it. I will be unhappy about it tomorrow. I will be unhappy that you're doing it tomorrow. I will be unhappy that you do it next week. Ten years from now when you continue to do this, I will still be unhappy that you do this. I can't stop you, and we need to move on to other things, but understand that we have not reached agreement on your opinion here. Everybody has things they do that people don't like, but this is one of those things that I am going to continue to not like and to disagree with, perpetually. I'm not going to pout and throw tantrums, but I need to be clear with you here that my not agreeing with this is not something I'm going to get over. This is a behavior I'm always going to find objectionable. Ten years, twenty years, still not gonna be happy about it. We are at a real impasse here. I can't stop you, not going to throw a tantrum, need to move on and do other stuff, but don't mistake that for us agreeing on your opinion. I don't."

Yeah. For a (now) ex that was used to 14 years of me rolling over and caving, that was a pretty gob-smacking moment.

Tom wanted Suri to go to Sea Org. Katie didn't. They were at a real impasse. Katie didn't roll over and cave. The marriage is breaking up now because Katie Holmes has gotten old enough, and grown up enough, and lived with Tom enough, that whatever influence of charm and experience he's had to persuade her to do what he wants has waned somewhat.

Katie Holmes has grown up enough that for once, Tom Cruise has said, "I want this to be this way," and she's said, "I don't," and it's an impasse over their child's future, and she's standing firm.

Irreconcilable differences.

The reason I'm inclined to favor her in this matter is that it's clear that with a secular upbringing she can be raised without Katie or her friends and school peers acting to poison her mind against Tom or Scientology, and then when she's grown, she can choose for herself whether she wants to investigate Scientology as a religious option.

If she's raised with Tom in Scientology, I'm not sure the converse is true about an open mind towards Katie and the rest of the world. All the evidence indicates that there would be a lot of risk there, particularly with the coerced self-disclosure inherent in the auditing process.

Scientology in its current form, under its current leadership, is an abusive cult. I'm not prepared to categorically damn all potential future spin-off sects that may emerge after Miscavige dies, gets kicked out, goes to jail, or retires from senility.
 
2012-07-07 01:31:45 PM

Benjamin Orr: Bungles: Mugato: We really need some sort of FAQ to point to whenever someone just says, b-b-b-but other religions! One gets tired of repeating himself.


Well, it's because it's wrong. Their beliefs are little different from "other religions".

The problem with Scientology is not its beliefs, the problem with Scientology is that it's a cult built on slavery, kidnap, murder, and extortion.

So in a few hundred years Scientology will catch up with the mainstream religions?




It wouldn't surprise me if it implodes, and produces many splinter denominations, the way most religions tend to after a while. There are already "independent Scientologist" who exist outside the Miscavige sect.
 
2012-07-07 01:33:30 PM

jodaveki: Sounds like it was written by someone who speaks English as a second language.


MeowSaidTheDog is trolling the cult and writing their press releases.
 
2012-07-07 01:35:02 PM

Julie Cochrane: I have never, ever, ever seen a narcissist marry a gal, or take her for the long-term "it" girlfriend, who had the tiniest cynical inkling of what was really behind his eyes.


So you're basically saying that Cruise would marry Joey Potter, but he'd never marry Jen Lindley?
 
2012-07-07 01:37:44 PM

Bungles: I'm not suggesting they aren't a criminal organisation (they obviously are), but the actual beliefs are no more peculiar than any major faith.


This may be true, but for the purposes of undermining Scientology in its attempts to spread its criminal influence and reprehensible behaviors it is far easier to let potential recruits know up front about the whole of its belief system than to explain just how many criminal atrocities they have been tied to.

If you told somebody about Operation Freakout and Operation Snow White, they would be amazed this group still existed, much less was expanding at that point. Not to mention Lisa McPherson.

Our society has respect for religious beliefs and religious organizations as a pretty central tenet. It's considered bad form in a lot of eyes to accuse a religion of crimes. Note how many decades the Catholic Church was able to sweep child molestation under the rug, because nobody wanted to accuse a Priest.

However, just revealing the wacky space opera doctrines of Scientology can instantly inoculate somebody against converting to Scientology, thus depriving the CoS of future funding without mentioning criminal behavior or lying in any way.
 
2012-07-07 01:39:39 PM
I wonder if $cientology also has wordfilters for "clam", "Lisa McPherson", and "freedom"?
 
2012-07-07 01:42:04 PM

BronyMedic: Hetfield: I hear Tom Cruise is gay.

Confirm/deny?

Confirm. All over his face confirm.


His farts have been inaudible since Top Gun dropped, is my understanding.

/goose, goose, fark.
 
2012-07-07 01:43:22 PM

TV's Vinnie: I wonder if $cientology also has wordfilters for "clam", "Lisa McPherson", and "freedom"?


No, yes and no.
 
2012-07-07 01:46:24 PM
Scientology is so desperate for new blood that they're spamming craigslist. Note that there is no actual mention of Scientology, but the address given is indeed the address of the Albuquerque Scientology Center.
 
2012-07-07 01:48:18 PM

gimmegimme: poodebunker: Isn't it the rich and famous scientology covets? I ask because twice this month I've recieved invites in the mail to come and, "discover my inner self, spirituality, and find everlasting personal growth". Ummm, I'm so far from wealthy...just a normal hourly wage earner. Not that I'd want to spend one dime on those freaks if I had big bucks anyway...
Their attempt to invite me is a total FLUNK! on their part.

Look, if you don't have the hundreds of thousands of dollars it takes to become clear and break through the Wall of Fire, that's fine. You can simply work for Scientology for free for a decade. But if you leave before that time is up, you owe them tens of thousands of dollars.

See? Scientology wants poor followers, too.


Heehee, they're too late. I already work for a slave driver company! Jk...
 
2012-07-07 01:56:20 PM
Bungles: There are branches of every major world religion who believe some from of pray can result in actual healing. Also, revelatory religions aren't particularly rare either, nor is the demand for money. Christianity was a revelatory religion for the main chunk of its existence prior to vernacular bible translations, and Catholicism still has "higher mysteries".

I'm not suggesting they aren't a criminal organisation (they obviously are), but the actual beliefs are no more peculiar than any major faith
.

As a person who has no religion but knows some about basic religion (Catholicism) I can say that there are differences.

Yes, if you go to church, the collection plate will be passed but you don't have to give and you don't have to write a cheque. You don't get thrown out if you don't give. Even if you do get thrown out, you don't get 'disappeared' and you don't have Squirrel Busters showing up at your door.

I have no love for organized religion but comparing the two, and comparing the church's practices in medieval times to modern times is disingenuous at best.

Scientology can only gain from this kind of hair splitting.
 
2012-07-07 01:58:10 PM

PenguinCam: Bungles: There are branches of every major world religion who believe some from of pray can result in actual healing. Also, revelatory religions aren't particularly rare either, nor is the demand for money. Christianity was a revelatory religion for the main chunk of its existence prior to vernacular bible translations, and Catholicism still has "higher mysteries".

I'm not suggesting they aren't a criminal organisation (they obviously are), but the actual beliefs are no more peculiar than any major faith.

As a person who has no religion but knows some about basic religion (Catholicism) I can say that there are differences.

Yes, if you go to church, the collection plate will be passed but you don't have to give and you don't have to write a cheque. You don't get thrown out if you don't give. Even if you do get thrown out, you don't get 'disappeared' and you don't have Squirrel Busters showing up at your door.

I have no love for organized religion but comparing the two, and comparing the church's practices in medieval times to modern times is disingenuous at best.

Scientology can only gain from this kind of hair splitting.



The important fact here is the kidnap, not the volcano demons, which is my point.
 
2012-07-07 02:00:36 PM
Scientology takes all the worst aspects of religion, cults and confidence scams and mixes them together into an abusive criminal organization that is truly scary and reprehensible.

Nice to see that KH is finally taking a stand and getting out in order to keep her kid safe from the cult.

I wish them well.
 
2012-07-07 02:01:34 PM

Rann Xerox: Are there any Scientologists that are poor?


Yup. They get locked up in double-wides in Clearwater, FL, and if they don't win musical chairs, they get kicked out of the church. Seriously.

http://www.newyorker.com/reporting/2011/02/14/110214fa_fact_wright
 
2012-07-07 02:07:14 PM
For most of us we have heard that the"anti-christ" will become president, and we will all be under "his" control. Armageddon and all. I never believed that, and never cared for that kind of fear mongoring.
What I do care about, and it actually is possible, is that end up with a president who is a scientologist....now that would suck!
We've had enough poop in government.
 
2012-07-07 02:08:28 PM

Bungles: The important fact here is the kidnap, not the volcano demons, which is my point.


Okay, this would be the difference. Sigh.

Most of the faiths in Judeo/Christian theology believe that the angels and demons and Noah's Ark and the talking snakes are metaphors. The Catholic Church believes in evolution. Of course there's the lunatic fringe who takes everything in the Bible literally but you can choose not to and still believe the core tenants. In Scientology, you HAVE to believe in the B-52s dropping aliens into volcanoes and it will cost you mostly everything you have to get this "information".

Are you getting this now, at all?
 
2012-07-07 02:17:09 PM

starsrift: ur14me: WTF is "hatting"?!?

It's "explanation for how to". Think military terminology, eg "Wearing more than one hat". To do this job = to wear this hat.


Thanks.

I consider myself a reasonably intelligent person with a reasonably rich vocabulary: I have never heard of this term until now.

/the stupid - it burns
 
2012-07-07 02:22:15 PM

Mugato: Bungles: The important fact here is the kidnap, not the volcano demons, which is my point.

Okay, this would be the difference. Sigh.

Most of the faiths in Judeo/Christian theology believe that the angels and demons and Noah's Ark and the talking snakes are metaphors. The Catholic Church believes in evolution. Of course there's the lunatic fringe who takes everything in the Bible literally but you can choose not to and still believe the core tenants. In Scientology, you HAVE to believe in the B-52s dropping aliens into volcanoes and it will cost you mostly everything you have to get this "information".

Are you getting this now, at all?




That isn't true at all. "But it's all metaphors!" is more of the fringe theology, and has only even become anything like mainstream (in the West) in the last 40 years. There's still a massive bulk of Christians, Hindus, Muslims, and Jews who do not view things like their creation myths as "metaphors" but as factual histories, especially in the only continents where those faiths are growing.

I'd bet the number of Christians who view Jesus returning from the dead as a "metaphor" at under 1%, and they'd probably be Quakers who the rest of the Church doesn't even consider Christian.


I'm not sure where you get the impression that Scientologists *must* believe the stories about Xenu as literal fact. I think you're just making it up.
 
2012-07-07 02:22:21 PM
Why do people say the $cientology cult and "mainstream" religions are the same? Is it because of the medieval treatment religions subjected their adherents to when they were just starting out?
 
2012-07-07 02:25:44 PM

Bungles: I'm not sure where you get the impression that Scientologists *must* believe the stories about Xenu as literal fact. I think you're just making it up.


Well, no I'm not. They get "audited" regularly.
 
2012-07-07 02:26:43 PM

GreatGlavinsGhost: Why do people say the $cientology cult and "mainstream" religions are the same? Is it because of the medieval treatment religions subjected their adherents to when they were just starting out?


Sigh. No, that's not it.

I usually lose interest when a thread goes into reruns.
 
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