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(Think Progress)   Not to be outdone by Pennsylvania, Mississippi institutes its own Voter ID Catch 22   (thinkprogress.org ) divider line
    More: Scary, Voter ID Catch 22, Pennsylvania, Mississippi, get out the vote, voter suppression, American Legislative Exchange Council, ballot initiatives  
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5384 clicks; posted to Politics » on 06 Jul 2012 at 6:26 PM (4 years ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



Voting Results (Smartest)
View Voting Results: Smartest and Funniest

2012-07-06 07:21:28 PM  
7 votes:
i159.photobucket.com

/works for all dumbass voter-ID states, not just Texass
2012-07-06 06:28:07 PM  
5 votes:
Haha. I went to high school with the spokeswoman mentioned.

She was a c*nt in high school and she sure seems like a c*nt now.
2012-07-06 06:48:18 PM  
4 votes:
Don't you love the consistency of the right?

GET GUBERMENT OUT OUR LIVES!!!!

OH, but you should have to get a government photo ID and use it for everything and be forced to show proof of citizenship on demand.
2012-07-06 06:30:49 PM  
4 votes:

cchris_39: Who are these people who manage to get through life without identification and how do they do it?

And what makes them all want to come out into the daylight on election day?


The times I needed a photo ID are very few and far between. A better question is what the hell are YOU doing that constantly requires you to identify yourself?
=Smidge=
2012-07-06 07:37:30 PM  
3 votes:

Sarsin: The_Six_Fingered_Man: Seriously, you think there is a widespread issue of these people being born at home that have never attended any public school, had even a part time job, or has needed medical care?

Probably about the same widespread issue voter fraud is, but here we are.


Most smart people live by the notion that "if it ain't broke, don't fix it"

Seems most of the voter ID laws being put into place are striving for the notion of "if it ain't broke, you're not trying"
2012-07-06 06:49:05 PM  
3 votes:
ALEC need to be added to an official list of hate groups and domestic terrorists.
2012-07-06 06:45:01 PM  
3 votes:

stewmadness: initiative requires voters to have photograph identification, which they can only obtain if they've got a birth certificate to present

If you don't have a copy of your birth certificate then you are a nobody anyways. Or the President, whichever.


BUT WAIT! THERE'S MORE!

You need a copy of your birth certificate to get a photo ID. So say your parents lost your birth certificate they got from the hospital 18 years ago. You waited until this time to try to get a driver's license. You need to get your birth certificate to apply for a driver's license, but you need a photo ID to get your certificate. The only way you can get the photo ID is to provide a birth certificate.
2012-07-06 06:38:56 PM  
3 votes:

cchris_39: Who are these people who manage to get through life without identification and how do they do it?


The elderly. They don't drive and no one cards them for alcohol or cigs. Or car-less inner city youths without cardable vices.

Cubansaltyballs: Who are all these people that need to show ID all the time?


Drunks.

Cubansaltyballs: And what makes them all want to force everyone else to show ID all the time?


They don't like the idea of someone being able to vote other than for a straight republican ticket.
2012-07-06 06:33:06 PM  
3 votes:

cchris_39: Who are these people who manage to get through life without identification and how do they do it?

And what makes them all want to come out into the daylight on election day?


Who are all these people that need to show ID all the time?

And what makes them all want to force everyone else to show ID all the time?
2012-07-06 09:13:48 PM  
2 votes:
Why would people be suspicious of Mississippi when it comes to voting rights?

longshotsblues.files.wordpress.com

Oh, right.
2012-07-06 07:41:32 PM  
2 votes:
I think it's also worth nothing that the Texas GOP has made the repeal of the Voting Rights Act a part of their party platform.
2012-07-06 07:24:53 PM  
2 votes:

Cataholic: Smidge204: cchris_39: Who are these people who manage to get through life without identification and how do they do it?

And what makes them all want to come out into the daylight on election day?

The times I needed a photo ID are very few and far between. A better question is what the hell are YOU doing that constantly requires you to identify yourself?
=Smidge=

Driving
Having a bank account
Having my signature notarized
Buying alcohol
Buying tobacco
Renting things
Flying
Filling out an I-9 to get a job


People without IDs are somehow not doing any of this stuff.


I work for the Department of Defense. I have a base access pass, clearance to view classified documents, and I don't have driver's license or any other form of picture ID other than my base pass. I had my wallet stolen 4 years ago and never replaced my non-driver's license (I have no depth perception so I don't drive). I don't drink or smoke, and I've never been asked for ID at any of the many places I've rented. I got approved for a car loan without an ID (the non-driver part was by far the most fun on the application, the ID part never even came up). My online bank account doesn't seem to be asking for one either.

I change states often enough that I don't want a State ID. I can go to work, come home and read fark and play games, and live my life without any ID. This will literally be the only thing I've needed an ID for in 5+ years. Maybe if I switch jobs, but I'm not really planning for that either.
2012-07-06 07:12:56 PM  
2 votes:

stewmadness: Sarsin: fuhfuhfuh: stewmadness: initiative requires voters to have photograph identification, which they can only obtain if they've got a birth certificate to present

If you don't have a copy of your birth certificate then you are a nobody anyways. Or the President, whichever.

BUT WAIT! THERE'S MORE!

You need a copy of your birth certificate to get a photo ID. So say your parents lost your birth certificate they got from the hospital 18 years ago. You waited until this time to try to get a driver's license. You need to get your birth certificate to apply for a driver's license, but you need a photo ID to get your certificate. The only way you can get the photo ID is to provide a birth certificate.

How does that get resolved normally? Ignoring the whole "Mississippi is a giant bag of dicks" voting thing, if you were in that situation and wanted a driver's license how the hell would you fix that? I'm going outside of the normal Fark snark, I'm just legitimately curious if someone here has navigated that maze in any state.

Probably through your SSN# i am guessing.


Most places require a SSN and possibly signing an affidavit as a minimum in order to get a copy of your birth certificate, no photo ID required. The law being introduced in Mississippi would require you to have a photo ID in order to get a copy of your birth certificate. The law is not just about presenting photo ID to vote, but also changes the requirements for obtaining a birth certificate.
2012-07-06 07:10:49 PM  
2 votes:
Sarsin:

How does that get resolved normally? Ignoring the whole "Mississippi is a giant bag of dicks" voting thing, if you were in that situation and wanted a driver's license how the hell would you fix that? I'm going outside of the normal Fark snark, I'm just legitimately curious if someone here has navigated that maze in any state.

It gets better. Every state has different rules. When we were pulling the birth certificate for my boyfriend so he could get a passport - all it required was his mother and fathers maiden names and the counties they were born in to get a certified copy of his certificate. Other states require you to show up in the fark'n office with the whole damn clan to get a certified copy and navigate a bureaucratic maze.

From Tennesse it appears you have alternatives:

Two items from the following list:
Current pay stub or W2
Vehicle registration with name and current address
Voter Registration card
Military Discharge (DD214)
Utility Bill, Bank Statement or deposit slip with name and current address
Health care coverage card
Medical record
Application page of an insurance policy
Signed Social Security Card
For those person who have had their I.D. stolen, a copy a police report or other official documents which support the theft.


/getting a birth certificate is 8 bucks in Tennessee. So poll tax!
2012-07-06 06:54:08 PM  
2 votes:

fuhfuhfuh: stewmadness: initiative requires voters to have photograph identification, which they can only obtain if they've got a birth certificate to present

If you don't have a copy of your birth certificate then you are a nobody anyways. Or the President, whichever.

BUT WAIT! THERE'S MORE!

You need a copy of your birth certificate to get a photo ID. So say your parents lost your birth certificate they got from the hospital 18 years ago. You waited until this time to try to get a driver's license. You need to get your birth certificate to apply for a driver's license, but you need a photo ID to get your certificate. The only way you can get the photo ID is to provide a birth certificate.


How does that get resolved normally? Ignoring the whole "Mississippi is a giant bag of dicks" voting thing, if you were in that situation and wanted a driver's license how the hell would you fix that? I'm going outside of the normal Fark snark, I'm just legitimately curious if someone here has navigated that maze in any state.
2012-07-06 06:45:20 PM  
2 votes:
Mississippi you stink. That is all.
2012-07-06 06:42:36 PM  
2 votes:
... all enemies, foreign and domestic.
2012-07-06 06:39:51 PM  
2 votes:
As long as it drives down voter turnout it's doing its job.
2012-07-06 06:38:27 PM  
2 votes:

cchris_39: Who are these people who manage to get through life without identification and how do they do it?

And what makes them all want to come out into the daylight on election day?


1966 cchris_39:

Who are these people who manage to get through life without an extra $2 for the poll tax? And what makes the all want to come out into the daylight on election day?
2012-07-06 06:38:11 PM  
2 votes:
The only thing missing is a grandfather clause that lets white folks skip the pre-requisites.
2012-07-07 06:31:01 AM  
1 vote:
Fark. Just noticed the article says the voter ID needs a birth certificate. Yeah, that's a poll tax.
2012-07-07 06:27:22 AM  
1 vote:
Getting a birth certificate from Mississippi is already a pain in the ass. My dad was born in Mississippi, and about a year and a half ago, he had to get another birth certificate (the previous one being lost). To get a Mississippi birth certificate, you have three options, A: Fill out a form and mail the form in along with a fee and wait weeks for them to process the request and mail it back to you. B: Order it online through a private company that charges something around $50 but at least they get it to you in a few days. Or C: Drive to Jackson, MS and pay in person and you may (yes, MAY) get the copy the same trip you pay for it, otherwise, you have to wait 7 - 10 days. Note, the one office in Jackson is the only place you can get a birth certificate in person.

For comparison, when I had to get a copy of my birth certificate in Alabama, all I had to do was go to the local Dept. of Health office, pay a small fee, and I got the certificate within minutes.

Mississippi's system is already prohibitive as it is. Requiring photo ID on top of all that is just being dickish.

I haven't been able to find any information yet (with a cursory googling) on what Mississippi requires to get the free Voter ID (available should you lack the other forms of ID). I'm not going to be surprised if a birth certificate is required, though.
2012-07-07 02:28:29 AM  
1 vote:

vudutek: cchris_39: Who are these people who manage to get through life without identification and how do they do it?

And what makes them all want to come out into the daylight on election day?

And why the fark should it be impossible to exercise their CONSTITUTIONAL RIGHT without jumping through flaming GOP hoops?


GOPers have admitted they WANT to suppress voting.

Link

Link
2012-07-07 12:47:49 AM  
1 vote:
gingerjet:
Let's assume you're this theoretical guy:

From Tennesse it appears you have alternatives:

Two items from the following list:
Current pay stub or W2
No job
Vehicle registration with name and current address No car
Voter Registration card lost card
Military Discharge (DD214) Never joined military -or- lost papers
Utility Bill, Bank Statement or deposit slip with name and current address Homeless or utilities not in their name or no bank account
Health care coverage card no insurance
Medical record like anyone is going to carry that, least of all a homeless person
Application page of an insurance policy No. Try again.
Signed Social Security Card Nope, gone long ago
For those person who have had their I.D. stolen, a copy a police report or other official documents which support the theft like Joe Streetguy is going to stumble into a police station and ask them to invstigate some other homeless guy that stole their stuff.

/getting a birth certificate is 8 bucks in Tennessee. So poll tax!
Yes it is.

Yet the homeless guy is still a citizen over the age of 18 and therefore entitled to vote. Why are the republicans trying to stop him from doing so?
2012-07-06 09:53:33 PM  
1 vote:
I think the difference between conservatives and liberals really just boils down to a preference for avoiding type I errors vs. type II errors.

LIberals believe that the right to vote is important enough that we accept that a few people will game the system. Conservatives are willing to accept that a lot of people are disenfranchised in order to make sure no one gets something they don't deserve.
2012-07-06 09:52:46 PM  
1 vote:

zappaisfrank: This is pretty useless legislation because Barack Obama would lost in Mississippi even if he were running unopposed.


This isn't about defeating Obama! Where would you ever get an idea like that?

Oh yeah

"A gaffe is when a politician tells the truth - some obvious truth he isn't supposed to say."
~Michael Kinsley
2012-07-06 09:44:51 PM  
1 vote:

Cataholic: Smidge204: cchris_39: Who are these people who manage to get through life without identification and how do they do it?

And what makes them all want to come out into the daylight on election day?

The times I needed a photo ID are very few and far between. A better question is what the hell are YOU doing that constantly requires you to identify yourself?
=Smidge=

Driving
Having a bank account
Having my signature notarized
Buying alcohol
Buying tobacco
Renting things
Flying
Filling out an I-9 to get a job


People without IDs are somehow not doing any of this stuff.


You need to look beyond your own economic and age-based POV. The daily life of the upper class, middle class, and lower class have little in common, and the daily life of an 80-year old, a 35-year old, and an 18-year old have little in common.

Many (though certainly not all) of those without ID are economically lower class. They aren't flying anywhere (and if you cooperate with the TSAs identity verification process, they'll let you through without an ID anyway -- its just a bit of a pain). They likely don't own a car, and aren't going to bother getting a driver's license. If they live in the inner city, a driver's license could be completely pointless. Many don't have a bank account, and would never have reason for a notary public. Even if they did, there are ways around those issues, without a state issued ID. Tobacco and alcohol are purchased by minors every day, so it's not like places enforce those laws very carefully, especially in poorer neighborhoods. And if you have to get around on foot or by bus, chances are you go to the same places to shop all the time. They know you and aren't going to card you for anything. Even filling out an I-9 can be done with much more basic (photo or non-photo) ID, as can cashing their paycheck at the check-cashing places in their neighborhood.

Pretty much everything you think you NEED a state-issued photo ID for, you really don't. And for those things that do want an ID, they often show SNAP EBT cards, Medicaid or insurance cards, library cards, public transit cards, or workplace IDs.

If you are living in poverty on the fringe of society, moving from crisis to crisis, just trying to stay one step ahead, taking the time and money to get a state-issued photo ID isn't at the top of your priority list. And if that's your life, and you took the time to both register to vote and actually cast a ballot, you should get a trophy for carrying out your civic duty, not be disenfranchised by a system that already seems to beat you down at every turn.

The other major groups without state-issued photo IDs are older people and students. Students who don't drive may not have a need for anything other than their student ID, and many older people have no reason to go get a new photo ID once they stop driving. It's just not necessary for them.

Also, people simply misplace their license... or forget to renew it... or have it stolen. These things happen, and replacing your license takes a number of weeks in many states.

Once you start adding up the various groups, it becomes pretty easy to see how estimates like 10% of the electorate (and higher percentages of specific subgroups) could be disenfranchised by these laws. Having worked voter registration drives and GOTV efforts, it astounds me that in a country where such a low percentage of people typically vote, we have people actively fighting to keep those that do show up from actually casting a ballot.
2012-07-06 09:36:32 PM  
1 vote:

odinsposse: So because people are having a hard time understanding how people get by without ID we need an additional level of government bureaucracy between citizens and their voting rights. Yeah, that sounds like conservatives.


Hmm . . . An additional level of government bureaucracy between citizens and their voting rights. . . Why does that sound familiar? Oh wait, they tried that from 1956 to 1977.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mississippi_State_Sovereignty_Commission
2012-07-06 09:31:26 PM  
1 vote:
sphotos.xx.fbcdn.net

And it shows!
2012-07-06 09:29:22 PM  
1 vote:
So because people are having a hard time understanding how people get by without ID we need an additional level of government bureaucracy between citizens and their voting rights. Yeah, that sounds like conservatives.
2012-07-06 08:58:12 PM  
1 vote:
I simply don't understand why you would want so badly to keep people from voting. Where does all that hate come from?
2012-07-06 07:45:53 PM  
1 vote:

The_Six_Fingered_Man: TFerWannaBe: They have the right to vote

Let's not get into that, shall we?


I don't think it's reasonable to have a conversation about voter fraud and eligibility without considering who should and should not have the right to vote.
2012-07-06 07:42:54 PM  
1 vote:
When faced with the argument that a large percentage of eligible voters do not have photo IDs, people will tell you how easy one is to get instead of explaining why one is now necessary after countless decades of almost zero voter fraud.
2012-07-06 07:41:42 PM  
1 vote:

The_Six_Fingered_Man: TFerWannaBe: The_Six_Fingered_Man: TFerWannaBe: The_Six_Fingered_Man: Sarsin: forget to send away for your social security card, you're just farked. No drivers license for you.

And likely no school either.

Seriously, you think there is a widespread issue of these people being born at home that have never attended any public school, had even a part time job, or has needed medical care?

If you make it to 18 years old without a Social Security Card, slap your parents in their collective mouths for being complete retards.

It doesn't matter if it's widespread. If it prevents one person from being able to vote who would otherwise be eligible, then it's disenfranchisement.

And yet you can go down to the SS office and apply for one yourself. Your parents need not have done it for you.

But seriously, I doubt there is even one that fits those criteria that also has a mad hankering to vote.

It's OK to make it more difficult to vote if the person wouldn't have voted anyway?

Does it really matter how difficult it is for a single person to vote if they are not going to vote anyway? If making it easier will not get them to vote, then why make it easier for fraud to potentially occur?


You could use the same argument to take away voting rights entirely from people who do not traditionally vote. They have the right to vote even if they choose not to exercise it.
2012-07-06 07:37:56 PM  
1 vote:

The_Six_Fingered_Man: Raistlin212: This will literally be the only thing I've needed an ID for in 5+ years.

Except your access pass, or Common Access Card, is a government issued photo ID that you likely use regularly. You know, to access the base.

The cool thing is that it will also work for voting!


Except it's not a CAC card, it's simply a base access pass. I don't know why I don't have a civilian CAC card, I could probably get one if I asked. I only have a standard consultants base access pass for my current posting. It also does not have my SS# or birthday on it, so I couldn't use it for anything.
2012-07-06 07:32:07 PM  
1 vote:

The_Six_Fingered_Man: Lunaville: If you're young enough to be carded when you buy tobacco, first that explains a lot, second, you're not old enough to participate in this discussion.

When did the voting age get raised from 18, in contravention of the US Constitution?

Oh wait, I see. You just wanted to feel superior.

/Still gets carded for smokes
//Is 32


Is your name Cataholic? Do you want to be sent to bed also?
2012-07-06 07:30:43 PM  
1 vote:

The_Six_Fingered_Man: Seriously, you think there is a widespread issue of these people being born at home that have never attended any public school, had even a part time job, or has needed medical care?


Probably about the same widespread issue voter fraud is, but here we are.
2012-07-06 07:30:34 PM  
1 vote:

TFerWannaBe: The_Six_Fingered_Man: Sarsin: forget to send away for your social security card, you're just farked. No drivers license for you.

And likely no school either.

Seriously, you think there is a widespread issue of these people being born at home that have never attended any public school, had even a part time job, or has needed medical care?

If you make it to 18 years old without a Social Security Card, slap your parents in their collective mouths for being complete retards.

It doesn't matter if it's widespread. If it prevents one person from being able to vote who would otherwise be eligible, then it's disenfranchisement.


And yet you can go down to the SS office and apply for one yourself. Your parents need not have done it for you.

But seriously, I doubt there is even one that fits those criteria that also has a mad hankering to vote.
2012-07-06 07:30:00 PM  
1 vote:

gingerjet: Sarsin:

How does that get resolved normally? Ignoring the whole "Mississippi is a giant bag of dicks" voting thing, if you were in that situation and wanted a driver's license how the hell would you fix that? I'm going outside of the normal Fark snark, I'm just legitimately curious if someone here has navigated that maze in any state.

It gets better. Every state has different rules. When we were pulling the birth certificate for my boyfriend so he could get a passport - all it required was his mother and fathers maiden names and the counties they were born in to get a certified copy of his certificate. Other states require you to show up in the fark'n office with the whole damn clan to get a certified copy and navigate a bureaucratic maze.

From Tennesse it appears you have alternatives:

Two items from the following list:
Current pay stub or W2
Vehicle registration with name and current address
Voter Registration card
Military Discharge (DD214)
Utility Bill, Bank Statement or deposit slip with name and current address
Health care coverage card
Medical record
Application page of an insurance policy
Signed Social Security Card
For those person who have had their I.D. stolen, a copy a police report or other official documents which support the theft.

/getting a birth certificate is 8 bucks in Tennessee. So poll tax!


If two of those things are good enough to get a birth certificate and a birth certificate is good enough to get a photo ID and the photo ID is good enough to vote, why can't you just show up with two of those items to vote?

I farking hate every single human being that supports this shiat. You are complete farking worthless excuses for Americans. EABODaFUAD
2012-07-06 07:29:32 PM  
1 vote:

The_Six_Fingered_Man: Sarsin: forget to send away for your social security card, you're just farked. No drivers license for you.

And likely no school either.

Seriously, you think there is a widespread issue of these people being born at home that have never attended any public school, had even a part time job, or has needed medical care?

If you make it to 18 years old without a Social Security Card, slap your parents in their collective mouths for being complete retards.


I will concede that my children each have a social security number. When I went to pre-register them for school, however, I refused to provide their social security numbers. If I had known it advance the hell I would catch trying to pre-register one of my children, due to the location listed on the birth certificate, I would have refused to show their birth certificates as well. I gave the school my ID, proof that I lived in the district, and proof that my children were immunized. They really didn't need access to further personal information about my children.
2012-07-06 07:22:06 PM  
1 vote:

Cataholic: Smidge204: cchris_39: Who are these people who manage to get through life without identification and how do they do it?

And what makes them all want to come out into the daylight on election day?

The times I needed a photo ID are very few and far between. A better question is what the hell are YOU doing that constantly requires you to identify yourself?
=Smidge=

Driving
Having a bank account
Having my signature notarized
Buying alcohol
Buying tobacco
Renting things
Flying
Filling out an I-9 to get a job


People without IDs are somehow not doing any of this stuff.


If you're young enough to be carded when you buy tobacco, first that explains a lot, second, you're not old enough to participate in this discussion. Go take your bath and get ready for bed. No, you cant' have a glass of water. Don't give me that look. I heard that.
2012-07-06 07:04:28 PM  
1 vote:

cchris_39: Who are these people who manage to get through life without identification and how do they do it?


I haven't been asked for my id in over a month and that was for a liquor store that cards every living soul who walks in the door because the local DA is running for mayor.

/asking for an ID is rarely about protecting you or the system - its to protect whomever is asking for it
2012-07-06 07:00:59 PM  
1 vote:
And where the hell is Mr. Ippi during all of this?
2012-07-06 06:55:53 PM  
1 vote:

fuhfuhfuh: stewmadness: initiative requires voters to have photograph identification, which they can only obtain if they've got a birth certificate to present

If you don't have a copy of your birth certificate then you are a nobody anyways. Or the President, whichever.

BUT WAIT! THERE'S MORE!

You need a copy of your birth certificate to get a photo ID. So say your parents lost your birth certificate they got from the hospital 18 years ago. You waited until this time to try to get a driver's license. You need to get your birth certificate to apply for a driver's license, but you need a photo ID to get your certificate. The only way you can get the photo ID is to provide a birth certificate.


The Republican Voting Dream Act:
Any and all non white, non Christian, non conservative "citizens" of the United States of America must present federally certified ancestry records of no less than sixty years, a certified state birth certificate, a certified state birth certificate of each said ancestor and $4500.00 administrative fee to the RNC. Please allow 10-14 years for processing.
2012-07-06 06:55:02 PM  
1 vote:
Wow, I thought the headline was exaggerating about the catch-22 bit. Then I clicked.

Stupid farking hicks.
2012-07-06 06:53:31 PM  
1 vote:

Corvus: Don't you love the consistency of the right?

GET GUBERMENT OUT OUR LIVES!!!!

OH, but you should have to get a government photo ID and use it for everything and be forced to show proof of citizenship on demand.


And not one of them federal national ID's either. Those things would only be good for having a consistent way for police to determine national citizenship or letting The Man track you by your wallet. Only state's rights' approved ID are acceptable.
2012-07-06 06:41:55 PM  
1 vote:
Republicans love freedom so much, that they don't want anyone else to have it.
2012-07-06 06:40:54 PM  
1 vote:

Cubansaltyballs: cchris_39: Who are these people who manage to get through life without identification and how do they do it?

And what makes them all want to come out into the daylight on election day?

Who are all these people that need to show ID all the time?

And what makes them all want to force everyone else to show ID all the time?


It is a systematic way to disenfranchise voters (elderly, the youth and minorities) who statistically vote Democrat. Nothing more, nothing less.
2012-07-06 06:28:41 PM  
1 vote:
Who are these people who manage to get through life without identification and how do they do it?

And what makes them all want to come out into the daylight on election day?
 
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