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(CNBC)   "With yet another month of weak employment growth, the second quarter marks the worst three-month period in two years." The lucky ones need to get used to saying, "Would you like fries with that?"   (cnbc.com) divider line 31
    More: Sad, The Hold Steady, employment growth, smart growth, economic growths  
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466 clicks; posted to Business » on 06 Jul 2012 at 10:40 AM (2 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2012-07-06 10:45:32 AM  
So how many straight months of private sector job growth in a row does this make after taking over an economy shedding 700 to 800k jobs?
 
2012-07-06 10:51:31 AM  
I should have said "an economy shedding 700 to 800k jobs a month?"

Also I love how steady job creation and falling unemployment is spun to be bad news.

media.cnbc.com
 
2012-07-06 11:15:08 AM  
static6.businessinsider.com
 
2012-07-06 11:15:34 AM  
And yet, myself and everyone I know professionally, which is probably about 100 people (thanks linkedin!) are all prospering fine, employed, have had raises or better career choices lately than we were having 5 years ago.

Why is that, well, golly, it might have something to do with winding down the wars, with putting money into the economy instead, with a return to sober competent economic leadership. We didn't get prosecution of banking leaders from the bubble burst, and we didn't really get reform, but over all I know of nobody, literally, who was better off under Bush than they are now.

Seattle is seeing construction cranes returning to downtown. During the bust, they were all gone. We're back up to 6 or 7. During the boom it was as many as 15, but some of that was fraud dollars based on the housing bubble. but consider 6 projects right now I can see being built all over the north end of downtown or surrounding neighborhoods. This looks like we're sort of thriving again, very welcome to see.
 
2012-07-06 11:38:28 AM  
From a local business magazine... "As has been the case for month after month, cuts to government at all level dragged on private sector growth"

This is just a taste: you ant to cut government it will have effects on the whole economy. Wait until Paul gets in and fires half the government.
 
2012-07-06 12:06:50 PM  
It's less than population growth, which means that calling this job growth is a half-truth at best.
 
2012-07-06 12:12:58 PM  

YixilTesiphon: It's less than population growth, which means that calling this job growth is a half-truth at best.


This. About 125,000 people entering the workforce each month. It's a substantial net loss.

Not to mention that in a week or two when this number has faded from the headlines, they will revise it downward as they have many times before.
 
2012-07-06 12:27:45 PM  

YixilTesiphon: It's less than population growth, which means that calling this job growth is a half-truth at best.


I don't remember the last time job growth was reported in jobs per capita.
 
2012-07-06 12:29:39 PM  

YixilTesiphon: It's less than population growth, which means that calling this job growth is a half-truth at best.


Which is why unemployment has stayed flat at 8.2% the past 2 months despite job growth.

You can't look at one number without looking at the other number.
 
2012-07-06 12:39:29 PM  

commieprogressive: YixilTesiphon: It's less than population growth, which means that calling this job growth is a half-truth at best.

I don't remember the last time job growth was reported in jobs per capita.


Right, and the US easily conquered Iraq in Gulf War II. But that doesn't tell the whole story.
 
2012-07-06 12:46:10 PM  

LawrencePerson: [static6.businessinsider.com image 640x415]


So it looks to me like the economy is growing at the same rate it did during Bush's first term except we're not creating an unsustainable housing boom in the process.
 
2012-07-06 01:31:22 PM  
We know what causes the anemic growth. The only remaining question is if we'll manage to overcome the absurdity of supply-side corporate theft economics in time to do anything about it.
 
2012-07-06 01:33:56 PM  

YixilTesiphon: commieprogressive: YixilTesiphon: It's less than population growth, which means that calling this job growth is a half-truth at best.

I don't remember the last time job growth was reported in jobs per capita.

Right, and the US easily conquered Iraq in Gulf War II. But that doesn't tell the whole story.


Due to the distortive way the "unemployment rate" is arrived at, the labor stat that gives a more useful picture is the Labor Force Participation Rate:

i49.tinypic.com

The trend is that we're getting fewer and fewer people participating as a percentage of the population, and not adding enough jobs to put back to work the people who were employed prior to the Great Recession. Anyone considering that a 'recovery' is delusional.
 
2012-07-06 01:56:23 PM  

LouDobbsAwaaaay: We know what causes the anemic growth. The only remaining question is if we'll manage to overcome the absurdity of supply-side corporate theft economics in time to do anything about it.


Well, how do you propose to do that?
 
2012-07-06 02:23:28 PM  
Sounds like a bigger tax cut is in order!
 
2012-07-06 02:31:33 PM  

YixilTesiphon: LouDobbsAwaaaay: We know what causes the anemic growth. The only remaining question is if we'll manage to overcome the absurdity of supply-side corporate theft economics in time to do anything about it.

Well, how do you propose to do that?


Re-enact all of the financial regulation put in place after the great depression that we got rid of in the 80s and 90s, most notably glass-stegall. Return the top marginal income tax rate to where it was before the bush tax cuts. Increase corporate taxes but increase corporate tax breaks for investment inside the USA (new buildings/factories, hiring). Use increased tax revenues to fund infrastructure, education, etc.

Basically, invest in the middle class and force the banks/corporations to do the same.
 
2012-07-06 02:53:38 PM  
I don't know how to prove it, but this is clearly Bush and Romney's fault. President Obama is doing the best he can, but these dang right-wing fools will not stop muddling in his business.
 
2012-07-06 03:47:40 PM  

Propain_az: I don't know how to prove it, but this is clearly Bush and Romney's fault. President Obama is doing the best he can, but these dang right-wing fools will not stop muddling in his business.


It's funny, I know you're being sarcastic, but I hear that excuse ALL THE TIME from Obama supporters. "He's doing his best, blah, blah blah...". Ok, fine. If he really is doing his "best", is he just not very good in the first place? Maybe his "Best" isn't good enough? It's kind of like the old Bush canard where he's either an idiot or an evil mastermind. Can't be both.
 
2012-07-06 04:57:57 PM  

Edward Rooney Dean of Students: Propain_az: I don't know how to prove it, but this is clearly Bush and Romney's fault. President Obama is doing the best he can, but these dang right-wing fools will not stop muddling in his business.

It's funny, I know you're being sarcastic, but I hear that excuse ALL THE TIME from Obama supporters. "He's doing his best, blah, blah blah...". Ok, fine. If he really is doing his "best", is he just not very good in the first place? Maybe his "Best" isn't good enough? It's kind of like the old Bush canard where he's either an idiot or an evil mastermind. Can't be both.


Bush was an idiot puppet of the evil mastermind that was "I'm my own branch of government, eat a bag dicks the Constitution." Dick Cheney. How hard is it understand that. However thinking critically isn't a conservatives strong point so I will forgive you. Obama did what anyone else would have done given the circumstances of expansion of power of the executive branch. There's not much he can do to a relieve a thirty plus year decline of the USA influence economically, militarily, and politically in a post cold war era. Not with the gridlock of congress and our inability to innovate our government and economy because we are afraid to change in a very complex world. Even the most conservative of progressive legislation Romney-Obama-care (which was the conservative legislation answer to hilary-care in the 90s) was meet the howls of the uninformed crying socialism like a 5 year old girl who dropped their ice cream cone. All this is do to large part the post WWII generation inherit selfishness that only thinks about the welfare of the individual and can't see past themselves to society as a whole.
 
2012-07-06 05:28:42 PM  

HMS_Blinkin: YixilTesiphon: LouDobbsAwaaaay: We know what causes the anemic growth. The only remaining question is if we'll manage to overcome the absurdity of supply-side corporate theft economics in time to do anything about it.

Well, how do you propose to do that?

Re-enact all of the financial regulation put in place after the great depression that we got rid of in the 80s and 90s, most notably glass-stegall. Return the top marginal income tax rate to where it was before the bush tax cuts. Increase corporate taxes but increase corporate tax breaks for investment inside the USA (new buildings/factories, hiring). Use increased tax revenues to fund infrastructure, education, etc.

Basically, invest in the middle class and force the banks/corporations to do the same.


Will any of that lead to a debt level that doesn't crowd out private investment?
 
2012-07-06 05:43:41 PM  
If you couldn't see that non-skilled labor was going the way of the Dodo in the past 15 years, well...
 
2012-07-06 05:52:09 PM  
Hey, looking at the labor force participation rate, the rate is actually headed in the right direction to a pre-WWII economy. Pretty soon we will be back to a one income household if nothing else changes.
 
2012-07-06 06:02:06 PM  

Franco: Edward Rooney Dean of Students: Propain_az: I don't know how to prove it, but this is clearly Bush and Romney's fault. President Obama is doing the best he can, but these dang right-wing fools will not stop muddling in his business.

It's funny, I know you're being sarcastic, but I hear that excuse ALL THE TIME from Obama supporters. "He's doing his best, blah, blah blah...". Ok, fine. If he really is doing his "best", is he just not very good in the first place? Maybe his "Best" isn't good enough? It's kind of like the old Bush canard where he's either an idiot or an evil mastermind. Can't be both.

Bush was an idiot puppet of the evil mastermind that was "I'm my own branch of government, eat a bag dicks the Constitution." Dick Cheney. How hard is it understand that. However thinking critically isn't a conservatives strong point so I will forgive you. Obama did what anyone else would have done given the circumstances of expansion of power of the executive branch. There's not much he can do to a relieve a thirty plus year decline of the USA influence economically, militarily, and politically in a post cold war era. Not with the gridlock of congress and our inability to innovate our government and economy because we are afraid to change in a very complex world. Even the most conservative of progressive legislation Romney-Obama-care (which was the conservative legislation answer to hilary-care in the 90s) was meet the howls of the uninformed crying socialism like a 5 year old girl who dropped their ice cream cone. All this is do to large part the post WWII generation inherit selfishness that only thinks about the welfare of the individual and can't see past themselves to society as a whole.


HERPA DERPA DOO! HERPA DERPA DOO!

//so sorry....cannot resist...
 
2012-07-06 07:21:23 PM  

Scipio: Hey, looking at the labor force participation rate, the rate is actually headed in the right direction to a pre-WWII economy. Pretty soon we will be back to a one income household if nothing else changes.


Except that you need three incomes to raise a family and care for a house.
 
2012-07-06 07:56:04 PM  

YixilTesiphon: HMS_Blinkin: YixilTesiphon: LouDobbsAwaaaay: We know what causes the anemic growth. The only remaining question is if we'll manage to overcome the absurdity of supply-side corporate theft economics in time to do anything about it.

Well, how do you propose to do that?

Re-enact all of the financial regulation put in place after the great depression that we got rid of in the 80s and 90s, most notably glass-stegall. Return the top marginal income tax rate to where it was before the bush tax cuts. Increase corporate taxes but increase corporate tax breaks for investment inside the USA (new buildings/factories, hiring). Use increased tax revenues to fund infrastructure, education, etc.

Basically, invest in the middle class and force the banks/corporations to do the same.

Will any of that lead to a debt level that doesn't crowd out private investment?


They don't need the American middle class anymore. They got China and India now. Hell even Brazil has a growing middle class now. America is nothing more then middle managers of the world. Middle managers are always the next to go after workers.
 
2012-07-06 09:51:51 PM  
I am NO political nor economic genius. But here are my observations and I want you more learned folks to share your opinions.

Am I the only one who thinks a lot of our country's employment woes could be easily mitigated if we stopped sending all those tech support and customer service jobs overseas and started bringing back actual manufacturing jobs to this country? Ya know, for all that stuff we buy like clothes, gadgets, furniture, and food?

There will always be a need for skilled workers in any economy and with the vary varied economy as the US has, why not have every kind of industry at every kind of stage in our own country? I understand raw materials and their imports have an impact on such decisions, but we over-consume enough already and this economy will never stabilize back to where it once was.

All we're doing is creating a domino effect for developing countries who want to consume the world's resources like we do and all it'll end up doing is turning the planet into chaos when the supplies start drying up and wars breakout over water rights and land use and the like. Ya know, kinda like they already are in corners of the world.

I say we employ the thousands to millions with living wages in America that can do all the work that's done in sweat shops and farms across the globe and give jobs to those HERE who lack the intelligence to do anything above their means. And help get people off their "entitlement" high horses and just farking WORK for a living!

Maybe capitalism's downfall is the blurring of lines between the classes? India's Caste system may not be ideal, and yes I know people suffer, but it has worked for them more or less for centuries. Seems we could learn a little something from that.

And also, Socialism has it's merits, as well as it's pitfalls as well as any model. If an economic or political decision is generally for the good of those who may be unable to provide for themselves because of free market ridiculousness, then why not? Obamacare is a god-send to those with "pre-existing conditions." Can't we apply more equality measures to the rest of civilian life? Or does Capitalism interfere too much with such ideals, especially when it comes to the very Conservative?

Is this all nonsense? Am I some crazy "libtard"?

Seriously! I'm genuinely curious here.
 
2012-07-06 10:51:26 PM  

PurpleAlienGiraffe: I am NO political nor economic genius. But here are my observations and I want you more learned folks to share your opinions.
...

And also, Socialism has it's merits, as well as it's pitfalls as well as any model. If an economic or political decision is generally for the good of those who may be unable to provide for themselves because of free market ridiculousness, then why not? Obam ...



[note that OP's point on socialism was one of many and I'm not trying to paint him as a socialist]

At some point socialism will need to become the norm as there are no jobs left for people to do. Once everything is automated or outsourced, not everyone can be a manager or an engineer or whatnot. Either these people are left to die in the gutter or they're taken care of by managers and engineers.
 
2012-07-07 01:48:28 AM  
All systems of governance we humans have devised invariable fall corruption that allows a tiny minority to control the majority of capital at the expense of the majority.

cache.ohinternet.com
 
2012-07-07 11:26:42 AM  

PurpleAlienGiraffe: There will always be a need for skilled workers in any economy and with the vary varied economy as the US has, why not have every kind of industry at every kind of stage in our own country?


Because that would be disastrous for short term profits. Long term it erodes our industrial base and surrounding skillsets in whatever industry is being outsourced, but by the time those chickens come home to roost the Job Creator (TM) Caste will have upped and left.
 
2012-07-08 12:54:18 AM  

HMS_Blinkin: but increase corporate tax breaks for investment inside the USA (new buildings/factories, hiring)


Those are already %100 tax-deductable, plus you get to throw in accelerated depreciation for the next few years after you've bought capital investments. (Effectively capital is more than %100 deductable.) Hiking the corporate tax rates would give companies disincentive to hold on to profits and instead dump them back into company investments like capital and labor. No need to make government revenues that much worse by making tax write-offs profitable unless you are going to see more revenues come in by that additional spending getting put elsewhere in the economy, which isn't going to happen in this economic climate where demand is so hamstrung as it is.

Letting companies hold on to even more profit is a problem, not a solution, especially now with interest rates so low. If a company is going to invest, now is the prime time to do it. Companies are holding off because without someone to buy their products there is way too much risk to buy something you will have to finance. Get more money into the hands of consumers, let the momentum grow, and then work on ways to get companies to spend more.

PurpleAlienGiraffe: Maybe capitalism's downfall is the blurring of lines between the classes? India's Caste system may not be ideal, and yes I know people suffer, but it has worked for them more or less for centuries. Seems we could learn a little something from that.


Don't we already have that given the ridiculously poor upward mobility and god-like reverence of the extreme upper class?

And a socialist model isn't as bad as most people like to think, it's just not easy to manage on a national level. Look at how well it turned Russia around during Lenin's time and how bad everything got after things started getting bureaucratized and top-heavy. (Of course there was also internal revolution from Stalin and American disruption that really didn't help.)

True socialism is a relatively new economic paradigm with few examples of implementation, both good and bad. There are going to be a lot of fark-ups in a socialist system because of it's inherent difficulty in management as opposed to the highly deductive and decentralized nature of capitalism. Interestingly, the two aren't even mutually exclusive; the right to private enterprise was protected under early Soviet constitutions with the caveat that there was no worker exploitation.
 
2012-07-08 02:11:44 AM  
No matter how fast the recovery went, people would say its too slow.
 
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