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(Think Progress)   The SCOTUS's decision not to deny millions of people of health care is just like that time an earlier SCOTUS denied citizenship for thousands of people because they were black, at least according to false equivalency scholar RAND PAUL   (thinkprogress.org ) divider line
    More: Dumbass, Sen. Rand Paul, U.S. Supreme Court, health cares, lunch counters, Dred Scott  
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1822 clicks; posted to Politics » on 06 Jul 2012 at 8:02 AM (4 years ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



195 Comments     (+0 »)
 
View Voting Results: Smartest and Funniest
 
2012-07-06 08:05:19 AM  
Derp
 
2012-07-06 08:09:14 AM  
Did he tie everything back to low flow toilets again?
 
2012-07-06 08:09:15 AM  
RON PAUL
 
2012-07-06 08:09:39 AM  
He's still confused that his Pocket Constitution somehow doesn't include a 700-page John Galt speech
 
2012-07-06 08:11:29 AM  
Tags: More: Dumbass

Uhh, no thanks, I've had more than enough dumbass lately.
 
2012-07-06 08:11:38 AM  
This inability to frame the issue really shows how much of an art information really is. Rand really doesn't know how to do it. He may understand the bare minimums for it, but he doesn't get how careful and delicate you have to be with this sort of thing. Coding shows he is capable of some of the finer points of it, but to go for the comparison is a risky move. It's usually best to let your bigoted base do the 'figuring' for themselves.

Nice try, though. Well, it's a lot better than what most Republicans are doing nowadays, which is acting like a Klan member for a minute before backpedaling.
 
2012-07-06 08:14:10 AM  
...I will prevent disease whenever I can, for prevention is preferable to cure.

I will remember that I remain a member of society with special obligations to all my fellow human beings, those sound of mind and body as well as the infirm...


Or, you know, fark 'em.
 
2012-07-06 08:16:32 AM  
Well, were they black, or not?
 
2012-07-06 08:18:36 AM  
Once again, this is not now nor has it ever been about denying or allowing people access to health care. Obama and his fellow Democrats are that benevolent and did not design this plan for any noble purpose. If they had it wouldn't be such a cluster fark, it would have bipartisan support, and the Democrats wouldn't have to lie hand over fist about its cost or what it actually is.

I realize that 'deny health care' bit is an excellent talking point a lot like the cherry picked aspects of ObamaCare you keep insisting we talk about instead of the whole bill, but you're not actually fooling anyone with either of those tactics.

How about you, as Obama said, accept that elections have consequences? But you can't do that, otherwise you're going to have to break the liberal cardinal rule of never admitting people understood and rejected your ideas. The 2010 election should have been enough of a wake up call for liberals, including Obama, to take that middle finger they've had stuck in the faces of the majority of America and step back for a minute.

But no, this power grab by liberal politicians must go forward apparently.

When 50.1% of the people turned against the Iraq war, it was time to shut it down and pull out completely but no matter how many people are against ObamaCare, it's never time to listen to the will of the people.
 
2012-07-06 08:19:19 AM  
This opportunistic douchebag doesn't even support the concepts of Brown v Board of Education, yet he's using the case to bolster his discontent with the recent ruling?

fark you in both eyes, Mr. Paul.
 
2012-07-06 08:19:56 AM  
Yes, it's just like that. *rolls eyes*

These farking people are pathetic. Whiny, petulant children who didn't get their way and now they're throwing a temper tantrum.
 
2012-07-06 08:22:56 AM  
"The SCOTUS's decision not to deny millions of people of health care.."

Yep. That frames the subject accurately. Good job staying above the fray.
 
2012-07-06 08:24:17 AM  

randomjsa: derp


tl;dr

I am sure you wrote the daily Republican talking points very well.

Good for you.
 
2012-07-06 08:25:28 AM  

randomjsa: If they had it wouldn't be such a cluster fark, it would have bipartisan support, and the Democrats wouldn't have to lie hand over fist about its cost or what it actually is.


If Obama wanted a resolution passed saying that puppies are cute he still wouldn't get bipartisan support.
 
2012-07-06 08:25:29 AM  

randomjsa: Once again, this is not now nor has it ever been about denying or allowing people access to health care. Obama and his fellow Democrats are that benevolent and did not design this plan for any noble purpose. If they had it wouldn't be such a cluster fark, it would have bipartisan support, and the Democrats wouldn't have to lie hand over fist about its cost or what it actually is.

I realize that 'deny health care' bit is an excellent talking point a lot like the cherry picked aspects of ObamaCare you keep insisting we talk about instead of the whole bill, but you're not actually fooling anyone with either of those tactics.

How about you, as Obama said, accept that elections have consequences? But you can't do that, otherwise you're going to have to break the liberal cardinal rule of never admitting people understood and rejected your ideas. The 2010 election should have been enough of a wake up call for liberals, including Obama, to take that middle finger they've had stuck in the faces of the majority of America and step back for a minute.

But no, this power grab by liberal politicians must go forward apparently.

When 50.1% of the people turned against the Iraq war, it was time to shut it down and pull out completely but no matter how many people are against ObamaCare, it's never time to listen to the will of the people.


Wow, these talkingpoints are so non-sensical now I don't even thing the tea-tards understand them.
 
2012-07-06 08:26:09 AM  

randomjsa: it would have bipartisan support, and the Democrats wouldn't have to lie hand over fist about its cost or what it actually is.


You mean like how the bill was altered and Republican ideas like the individual mandate added to address the concerns of the GOP?

Yeah, they did that... Guess what the Republicans did when it came to a vote? They voted in lock step against a plan that was basically theirs because they didn't want to "give the president a single victory".

In short, you're a willfully ignorant, partisan shiat heel, who wouldn't know the truth if it slapped you upside your misshapen head.
 
2012-07-06 08:29:25 AM  
i2.kym-cdn.com
 
2012-07-06 08:30:14 AM  

ManRay: "The SCOTUS's decision not to deny millions of people of health care.."

Yep. That frames the subject accurately. Good job staying above the fray.


You sound sarcastic. Why?
 
2012-07-06 08:30:35 AM  

randomjsa: Once again, this is not now nor has it ever been about denying or allowing people access to health care. Obama and his fellow Democrats are that benevolent and did not design this plan for any noble purpose. If they had it wouldn't be such a cluster fark, it would have bipartisan support, and the Democrats wouldn't have to lie hand over fist about its cost or what it actually is.

I realize that 'deny health care' bit is an excellent talking point a lot like the cherry picked aspects of ObamaCare you keep insisting we talk about instead of the whole bill, but you're not actually fooling anyone with either of those tactics.

How about you, as Obama said, accept that elections have consequences? But you can't do that, otherwise you're going to have to break the liberal cardinal rule of never admitting people understood and rejected your ideas. The 2010 election should have been enough of a wake up call for liberals, including Obama, to take that middle finger they've had stuck in the faces of the majority of America and step back for a minute.

But no, this power grab by liberal politicians must go forward apparently.

When 50.1% of the people turned against the Iraq war, it was time to shut it down and pull out completely but no matter how many people are against ObamaCare, it's never time to listen to the will of the people.


You seem to be pretty upset that people keep pointing out that you and your ilk want to deny people healthcare. How is that a "talking point?" This bill expands health care coverage for Americans who previously were unable to obtain it.

You must just really be embarassed that people are figuring out you lot are really just selfish, horrible people.
 
2012-07-06 08:31:23 AM  

randomjsa: Once again, this is not now nor has it ever been about denying or allowing people access to health care


Yes it is/was. Your party leader, Senator Turtle said so the other day. 30 million uninsured was never an issue for the GOP, and a common teabag talking point is that if the poors can go to the doctor, everyone's service will suffer.
 
2012-07-06 08:31:24 AM  

randomjsa: Once again, this is not now nor has it ever been about denying or allowing people access to health care.


Actually, it's completely 100% about that. But thanks for playing.
 
2012-07-06 08:31:28 AM  

randomjsa: Once again, this is not now nor has it ever been about denying or allowing people access to health care. Obama and his fellow Democrats are that benevolent and did not design this plan for any noble purpose. If they had it wouldn't be such a cluster fark, it would have bipartisan support, and the Democrats wouldn't have to lie hand over fist about its cost or what it actually is.

I realize that 'deny health care' bit is an excellent talking point a lot like the cherry picked aspects of ObamaCare you keep insisting we talk about instead of the whole bill, but you're not actually fooling anyone with either of those tactics.

How about you, as Obama said, accept that elections have consequences? But you can't do that, otherwise you're going to have to break the liberal cardinal rule of never admitting people understood and rejected your ideas. The 2010 election should have been enough of a wake up call for liberals, including Obama, to take that middle finger they've had stuck in the faces of the majority of America and step back for a minute.

But no, this power grab by liberal politicians must go forward apparently.

When 50.1% of the people turned against the Iraq war, it was time to shut it down and pull out completely but no matter how many people are against ObamaCare, it's never time to listen to the will of the people.


You truely do live in an alternate universe don't you.
 
2012-07-06 08:32:49 AM  
Shiat like this makes me want to sit down to talk with Senator Paul. I'd like to tell him that I'm an attorney working in the disability field. I work with doctors on a daily basis and make arguments based upon medical opinions and objective medical evidence. I have an advanced, professional degree and I am seeped in medical information... but when a top medical expert lays out a complex, well-thought out decision that is supported through medical standards I shut the fark up and move to the next topic, even if I don't like the result, because I'm just a amateur compared to that expert. I don't fark around with his treatment of patients - I (and I'm sure most of the bar) would appreciate him not farking around with our work.
 
2012-07-06 08:32:49 AM  
The way you guys attack Rand Paul for any little mis-spoken word is exactly like the Holocaust.
 
2012-07-06 08:33:08 AM  

randomjsa:
Derp.


You truely do live in an alternate universe don't you.
 
2012-07-06 08:34:14 AM  

Boatmech: You truely do live in an alternate universe don't you.


This sort of criticism is exactly like what Pol Pot did in Cambodia.
 
2012-07-06 08:36:06 AM  
"Think of how our country would look now had the Supreme Court not changed its view of what is constitutional. Think of 1857, when the court handed down the outrageous Dred Scott decision, which said African Americans were not citizens".

The Supreme Court didn't change it's mind about Dred Scott you farking dumbass. The Constitution was amended after a long and bloody farking civil war. Christ.
 
2012-07-06 08:38:51 AM  

Philip Francis Queeg: "Think of how our country would look now had the Supreme Court not changed its view of what is constitutional. Think of 1857, when the court handed down the outrageous Dred Scott decision, which said African Americans were not citizens".

The Supreme Court didn't change it's mind about Dred Scott you farking dumbass. The Constitution was amended after a long and bloody farking civil war. Christ.


Which also led to the 14th Amendment, establishing a clear constitutional basis for the federal government having supremacy over the states in areas outside of Article I.
 
2012-07-06 08:38:54 AM  

Boatmech: randomjsa:
Derp.

You truely do live in an alternate universe don't you.


Republicans live in their own little bubble where John Roberts is the libbest lib to ever lib.

The June unemployment was actually 8.5%, but John Roberts lowered it 8.2%
 
2012-07-06 08:39:10 AM  

Fluorescent Testicle: [i2.kym-cdn.com image 296x170]


Nah, we're still at 3. We won't reach 2 until the GOP Convention, and 1 will be reached on the morning of November 7 when Fox News publishes the election map that shows Romney won more counties that Obama.
 
2012-07-06 08:39:14 AM  

Skleenar: Boatmech: You truely do live in an alternate universe don't you.

This sort of criticism is exactly like what Pol Pot did in Cambodia.


Oh, I thought it was Amos from Amos and Andy.
cdn.hotstockmarket.com
 
2012-07-06 08:39:20 AM  
You know, while I largely disagree with RON PAUL, you can tell he's at least pretty thoughtful and can articulate his points well.

Rand Paul......yeahhhh not so much. This man is not too bright.
 
2012-07-06 08:39:28 AM  
That Op-ed looks more like a blog post from your crazy Aunt, than a thoughtful opinion of a sitting US Senator. I really miss smart conservatives.
 
2012-07-06 08:40:30 AM  

Solon Isonomia: Philip Francis Queeg: "Think of how our country would look now had the Supreme Court not changed its view of what is constitutional. Think of 1857, when the court handed down the outrageous Dred Scott decision, which said African Americans were not citizens".

The Supreme Court didn't change it's mind about Dred Scott you farking dumbass. The Constitution was amended after a long and bloody farking civil war. Christ.

Which also led to the 14th Amendment, establishing a clear constitutional basis for the federal government having supremacy over the states in areas outside of Article I.


And also that whole "equal protection of the laws" thing that Paul and the Republicans find so very offensive.
 
2012-07-06 08:41:30 AM  
Corporations are people, my friend, and this decision has just made it impossible for these people to determine the quality of customers they want to deal with. It's a freedom of association issue, really, and unfairly groups these fine citizens into a special class of people who must now sit at the back of the economic bus for nothing more than the desire to practice their traditions free from unreasonable seizures of their property. Where's the due process for these people? This has been taken out of their hands and that's not what this country's about is it? Disempowerment of a minority? Special regulation of people simply by virtue of their industry? This is not America, my friends, not the America we should be building. We should be building an America where every person is free to congress with whom they please, to engage in commerce as they please and to be free of the impositions of false inclusion as mandated by this overbroad decision.
 
2012-07-06 08:42:20 AM  
I am now convinced that randomjsa is hired by the staff here to make us all feel smarter
 
2012-07-06 08:45:51 AM  
Obamacare is what is going to end up denying people healthcare.
 
2012-07-06 08:48:39 AM  

badhatharry: Obamacare is what is going to end up denying people healthcare.


So Vote Republican?
 
2012-07-06 08:49:30 AM  

Skleenar: Boatmech: You truely do live in an alternate universe don't you.

This sort of criticism is exactly like what Pol Pot did in Cambodia Nicaragua and the Bay of Pigs which is really a sheltered dig by Obama about people who see through the disguise and know he's a secrit muslim, so when 50.1% of the contras were against funding their operation with cocaine sales in the US it was time to pull the plug on the space program but when it comes to the Hague, it's never time to listen to the will of the wisp.


Fixed.
 
2012-07-06 08:51:27 AM  

Noam Chimpsky: DammitIForgotMyLogin: randomjsa: it would have bipartisan support,

Oh fark off, you disingenous pile of steaming horsecrap. Nothing that Obama could do about anything would have bipartisan support, because he's Obama.

Are we supposed to support him because he's black?



The GOP flipped out when Obama, like many other presidents before him, told kids to stay in school. Is your position that they opposed him because they believe kids should drop out of high school? If they support kids staying in school, why did they oppose him?
 
2012-07-06 08:51:50 AM  
Sick people have no rights that doctors, hospitals, and insurance carriers are bound to respect.
 
2012-07-06 08:52:41 AM  

badhatharry: Obamacare is what is going to end up denying people healthcare.


I'd ask you to elaborate, or offer a better plan to fix our hopelessly-broken health care system, but I've already heard the talking points. Lemme guess, you're gonna blather on about 'rationing' or 'death panels'?
 
2012-07-06 08:54:24 AM  

tirob: Sick people have no rights that doctors, hospitals, and insurance carriers are bound to respect.



Doctors, hospitals, and insurance carriers have no rights that dying people are bound to respect. What are you going to do to someone with a terminal illness, throw them in jail and give them health care as punishment?
 
2012-07-06 08:55:52 AM  
Dred Scott is like the Godwin of legal arguments.
 
2012-07-06 08:58:19 AM  
What is it?!!

It's a fine.

*SLAP*

I said I want the truth!!

It's a tax.

*SLAP*

It's a fine.

*SLAP*

It' a fine and a tax.

Give it up randomjsa. It's Obamatown.
 
2012-07-06 08:58:32 AM  

badhatharry: Obamacare is what is going to end up denying people healthcare.


How's that? Show your work.
 
2012-07-06 08:58:37 AM  

ArkPanda: Dred Scott is like the Godwin of legal arguments.


The fundies have been comparing Roe vs. Wade to it for a long time. Sick puppies.
 
2012-07-06 08:59:16 AM  

LordJiro: badhatharry: Obamacare is what is going to end up denying people healthcare.

I'd ask you to elaborate, or offer a better plan to fix our hopelessly-broken health care system, but I've already heard the talking points. Lemme guess, you're gonna blather on about 'rationing' or 'death panels'?


Oh, then you already know about rationing and death panels.
 
2012-07-06 09:00:32 AM  

randomjsa: Once again, this is not now nor has it ever been about denying or allowing people access to health care. Obama and his fellow Democrats are that benevolent and did not design this plan for any noble purpose. If they had it wouldn't be such a cluster fark, it would have bipartisan support, and the Democrats wouldn't have to lie hand over fist about its cost or what it actually is.

I realize that 'deny health care' bit is an excellent talking point a lot like the cherry picked aspects of ObamaCare you keep insisting we talk about instead of the whole bill, but you're not actually fooling anyone with either of those tactics.

How about you, as Obama said, accept that elections have consequences? But you can't do that, otherwise you're going to have to break the liberal cardinal rule of never admitting people understood and rejected your ideas. The 2010 election should have been enough of a wake up call for liberals, including Obama, to take that middle finger they've had stuck in the faces of the majority of America and step back for a minute.

But no, this power grab by liberal politicians must go forward apparently.

When 50.1% of the people turned against the Iraq war, it was time to shut it down and pull out completely but no matter how many people are against ObamaCare, it's never time to listen to the will of the people.


I live with my mom. I didn't read a single thing, but something this long has to be utter crap because historically from you, it has been.
 
2012-07-06 09:01:18 AM  
Randy Paul and his intentional naivety.

He's like a 8 year old child who was left to play with the adults.
 
2012-07-06 09:01:21 AM  

badhatharry: Obamacare is what is going to end up denying people healthcare.


Which element of the legislation will have that effect again?
Oh, have you taken 'the test' yet?
 
2012-07-06 09:01:34 AM  

badhatharry: Obamacare is what is going to end up denying people healthcare.


Indeed. Taxpayers are the Jews for Obamacare's ovens. Seeing Roberts turn against us in this decision, I know know exactly how Jesus felt when Judas betrayed him.
 
2012-07-06 09:03:17 AM  
fracto73

Noam Chimpsky: DammitIForgotMyLogin: randomjsa: it would have bipartisan support,

Oh fark off, you disingenous pile of steaming horsecrap. Nothing that Obama could do about anything would have bipartisan support, because he's Obama.

Are we supposed to support him because he's black?


The GOP flipped out when Obama, like many other presidents before him, told kids to stay in school. Is your position that they opposed him because they believe kids should drop out of high school? If they support kids staying in school, why did they oppose him?



Are you talking about Obama wanting to raise the drop out age to 18? I don't remember seeing anything about the GOP flipping out over this?
 
2012-07-06 09:04:45 AM  

NateGrey: Boatmech: randomjsa:
Derp.

You truely do live in an alternate universe don't you.

Republicans live in their own little bubble where John Roberts is the libbest lib to ever lib.


I think it goes deeper than that. I think they're so wrapped up in esoteric ideology that they can't see the real world harm their "values" cause. it's all academic to them, which is ironic considering their anti-intellectual bent. They bleat endlessly about the "beltway mentality" but are more interested in party purity and interpreting the intentions of long dead "founding fathers" than they are of actually looking at the world the way it is and doing something to make it better.
 
2012-07-06 09:05:22 AM  
This Supreme Court decision is just like the time the Christian crusaders invaded Jerusalem in the First Crusade and massacred all the tens of thousands of non-Christian women and children who lived there.
 
2012-07-06 09:06:28 AM  
RAND NEPOTISM!
 
2012-07-06 09:08:35 AM  
 
2012-07-06 09:09:01 AM  

L82DPRT:
Give it up randomjsa. It's Obamatown.


Like most Republicans, he brings no facts, citations, or interesting points to the discussion.

One idiot in this thread thinks there are death panels.

Can you be the one Republican that can actually have an intelligent conversation?
 
2012-07-06 09:09:42 AM  

karnal: fracto73

Noam Chimpsky: DammitIForgotMyLogin: randomjsa: it would have bipartisan support,

Oh fark off, you disingenous pile of steaming horsecrap. Nothing that Obama could do about anything would have bipartisan support, because he's Obama.

Are we supposed to support him because he's black?


The GOP flipped out when Obama, like many other presidents before him, told kids to stay in school. Is your position that they opposed him because they believe kids should drop out of high school? If they support kids staying in school, why did they oppose him?


Are you talking about Obama wanting to raise the drop out age to 18? I don't remember seeing anything about the GOP flipping out over this?



Obama addressed school kids, like other presidents before him. Republicans urged parents to keep kids out of school for the day. They accused him of indoctrination.
 
2012-07-06 09:10:38 AM  
Seriously, Rand, get your talking points straight. You're supposed to reference the Dred Scott decision when talking about abortion.
 
2012-07-06 09:12:03 AM  
As a Kentuckian, I feel like I have to apologize in every Rand Paul/Mitch McConnell thread. I'm sorry. I voted for Conway. Not much better, but better nonetheless. There just wasn't enough of us.

So, there you go.
 
2012-07-06 09:12:22 AM  
The irony of a headline claiming false equivalency being in and of itself a false equivalency.
 
2012-07-06 09:12:35 AM  

john_frost: The 16K it is going to cost a Family of 4 to buy this expensive Insurance we call Obamcare

Thats the part where everyone takes their money and leaves the system.


There are families (parents with kids) that don't buy insurance for their children? So, what, they just take them to the ER everytime because "it's free"? I guess paying your own way is antithetical to the rugged individualists.
 
2012-07-06 09:12:49 AM  

john_frost: The 16K it is going to cost a Family of 4 to buy this expensive Insurance we call Obamcare

Thats the part where everyone takes their money and leaves the system.


When everyone goes Galt on Obamacare, it will be the sweetest victory since the rebel alliance destroyed the second Deathstar at Endor.
 
2012-07-06 09:12:53 AM  
I love when Conservatives use Dredd Scott. Conservatives loved the decision when it came out.
 
2012-07-06 09:14:02 AM  

badhatharry: LordJiro: badhatharry: Obamacare is what is going to end up denying people healthcare.

I'd ask you to elaborate, or offer a better plan to fix our hopelessly-broken health care system, but I've already heard the talking points. Lemme guess, you're gonna blather on about 'rationing' or 'death panels'?

Oh, then you already know about rationing and death panels.


You're a birther who believes in ghosts and alien visits. Color me shocked that you subscribe to conspiracy theories on health care, too.
 
2012-07-06 09:14:26 AM  

Skleenar: Boatmech: You truely do live in an alternate universe don't you.

This sort of criticism is exactly like what Pol Pot did in Cambodia.


Your hyperbolic responses are just like the Romans throwing Christians to the lions.
 
2012-07-06 09:14:51 AM  

Boatmech: When 50.1% of the people turned against the Iraq war, it was time to shut it down and pull out completely but no matter how many people are against ObamaCare, it's never time to listen to the will of the people.

You truely do live in an alternate universe don't you.


Especially as support for Obamacare has increased since the Supreme Court ruling.
 
2012-07-06 09:16:15 AM  

Cataholic: The irony of a headline claiming false equivalency being in and of itself a false equivalency.


Uhh...

o.O
 
2012-07-06 09:16:36 AM  

NateGrey: L82DPRT:
Give it up randomjsa. It's Obamatown.

Like most Republicans, he brings no facts, citations, or interesting points to the discussion.

One idiot in this thread thinks there are death panels.

Can you be the one Republican that can actually have an intelligent conversation?


I think Paul's point is that SCOTUS has made wrong decisions in the past and Paul disagrees with the rubber stamp pull some made up justification out of your ass Roberts decision.

/Fark Independent since 1985.
 
2012-07-06 09:16:56 AM  

john_frost: The 16K it is going to cost a Family of 4 to buy this expensive Insurance we call Obamcare

Thats the part where everyone takes their money and leaves the system.


You mean like what happened in Massachusetts with MAHealth?

Oh wait, the Commonwealth has got 98% coverage now and the plan my family has through the Health Connector is actually cheaper and covers more than was covered by a previous plan we had with an employer.

But, please, proceed with your fortune telling. It's amusing.
 
2012-07-06 09:17:23 AM  

amiable: Wow, these talkingpoints are so non-sensical now I don't even thing the tea-tards understand them.


They never understood them. They are just like a musical score, background accompaniment for their persistent rage.
 
2012-07-06 09:17:44 AM  

john_frost: The 16K...


Where's that value from? Your ass is not a reliable source, unless we're talking about stank.
What's the income of the family in question? Even using your assumed value, if it's a family pulling in 100k, they'll be fine.
Do they not already have health care? Most people 'do' already have health insurance, this is for those who do NOT. The poor/destitute are the ones who need it most and.... that leads nicely into...
Do you realize there's money to assist the 'po' folk out there to better be able to afford that coverage? There's assistance for people who cannot afford this. And if you don't WANT to get that coverage, you pay the penalty for being a schmuck. Easy peasy.
 
2012-07-06 09:17:52 AM  

john_frost: NateGrey: L82DPRT:
Give it up randomjsa. It's Obamatown.

Like most Democrat's, he brings no facts, citations, or interesting points to the discussion.

One idiot in this thread thinks there are death panels, because only the Gov can deny you Health Care, like they do in Canada

Can you be the one Democrat that can actually have an intelligent conversation?

/there, fixed it


Let me guess, Teabagger from Kentucky who knows all about Canada's healthcare system because Neil Cavuto told you.

/Vote Republican
 
2012-07-06 09:19:20 AM  
The deliberate misrepresentation of what Rand Paul was trying to say (that the Supreme Court sometimes revisits, and changes decisions) is exactly the same as the Death Panels.
 
2012-07-06 09:20:29 AM  

Great_Milenko: NateGrey: Boatmech: randomjsa:
Derp.

You truely do live in an alternate universe don't you.

Republicans live in their own little bubble where John Roberts is the libbest lib to ever lib.


I think it goes deeper than that. I think they're so wrapped up in esoteric ideology that they can't see the real world harm their "values" cause. it's all academic to them, which is ironic considering their anti-intellectual bent. They bleat endlessly about the "beltway mentality" but are more interested in party purity and interpreting the intentions of long dead "founding fathers" than they are of actually looking at the world the way it is and doing something to make it better.


Liberals can't see the harm in their values. Doing "good" is all they can see. They never see the down side of letting the government take care of peoples' needs.
 
2012-07-06 09:20:38 AM  

fracto73: Noam Chimpsky: DammitIForgotMyLogin: randomjsa: it would have bipartisan support,

Oh fark off, you disingenous pile of steaming horsecrap. Nothing that Obama could do about anything would have bipartisan support, because he's Obama.

Are we supposed to support him because he's black?


The GOP flipped out when Obama, like many other presidents before him, told kids to stay in school. Is your position that they opposed him because they believe kids should drop out of high school? If they support kids staying in school, why did they oppose him?


An obvious strawman is the best you can come up with? You think everyone should support him because he has some African blood. It's very strange.
 
2012-07-06 09:21:10 AM  

Pro Zack: The deliberate misrepresentation of what Rand Paul was trying to say (that the Supreme Court sometimes revisits, and changes decisions) is exactly the same as the Death Panels.


If that's what he was trying to say then he was illustrating his historical ignorance with his example. Dred Scott was not revisited by the Supreme Court.
 
2012-07-06 09:21:46 AM  

john_frost: You willing to have an Intelligent conversation? So far you Fail.


Account created: 2012-07-05 08:40:55

Not a fan of day old alts. Try someone else to troll.
 
2012-07-06 09:23:05 AM  

Noam Chimpsky: An obvious strawman is the best you can come up with? You think everyone should support him because he has some African blood. It's very strange.


Any more racist posts personally attacking posters to make? Stop giving mods work by cleaning up your Republican garbage.
 
2012-07-06 09:23:12 AM  

ManRay: "The SCOTUS's decision not to deny millions of people of health care.."

Yep. That frames the subject accurately. Good job staying above the fray.


i46.tinypic.com
 
2012-07-06 09:23:19 AM  

badhatharry: Liberals can't see the harm in their values. Doing "good" is all they can see. They never see the down side of letting the government take care of peoples' needs.


Oh do tell what the downside of not letting people starve or suffer for lack of access to healthcare is.
 
2012-07-06 09:23:23 AM  

Pro Zack: The deliberate misrepresentation of what Rand Paul was trying to say (that the Supreme Court sometimes revisits, and changes decisions) is exactly the same as the Death Panels.


If that is an accurate description of his opinion, it would be more akin to the "Obama promised not to raise taxes" lie.
 
2012-07-06 09:24:53 AM  

HotWingConspiracy: Did he tie everything back to low flow toilets again?


And CFL's. They have to be part of it somehow. Perhaps it was the .mesmerizing light cast by a CFL in Roberts' chambers that temporarily confused him and got him to vote for the wrong side?
 
2012-07-06 09:25:03 AM  

NateGrey: john_frost: You willing to have an Intelligent conversation? So far you Fail.

Account created: 2012-07-05 08:40:55

Not a fan of day old alts. Try someone else to troll.


It's always a little sad to Ignore such a young troll, but here we are.
 
2012-07-06 09:25:36 AM  

Dwight_Yeast: Boatmech: When 50.1% of the people turned against the Iraq war, it was time to shut it down and pull out completely but no matter how many people are against ObamaCare, it's never time to listen to the will of the people.

You truely do live in an alternate universe don't you.

Especially as support for Obamacare has increased since the Supreme Court ruling.


Because when reading the Bible or whatever your holy book is fails to instruct you that this is the right thing to do, trust 9 people in black clothes.

cache.gawker.com

//not trying to insinuate SCOTUS is wrong, I just think it's funny that tards can't decide anything for themselves any more.
 
2012-07-06 09:25:39 AM  

john_frost: Cinaed: john_frost: The 16K...

Where's that value from? Your ass is not a reliable source, unless we're talking about stank.
What's the income of the family in question? Even using your assumed value, if it's a family pulling in 100k, they'll be fine.
Do they not already have health care? Most people 'do' already have health insurance, this is for those who do NOT. The poor/destitute are the ones who need it most and.... that leads nicely into...
Do you realize there's money to assist the 'po' folk out there to better be able to afford that coverage? There's assistance for people who cannot afford this. And if you don't WANT to get that coverage, you pay the penalty for being a schmuck. Easy peasy.

Washington Post did the study? Do you realize most folks earn below $80K? And so can't afford Obamacare?

Do you really want them on the dole? I think yes.


Want them on the "dole"? No. Think having people on the "dole" is better then letting them suffer from lack of access to healthcare? Damn straight.
 
2012-07-06 09:25:49 AM  
fracto73

karnal: fracto73

Noam Chimpsky: DammitIForgotMyLogin: randomjsa: it would have bipartisan support,

Oh fark off, you disingenous pile of steaming horsecrap. Nothing that Obama could do about anything would have bipartisan support, because he's Obama.

Are we supposed to support him because he's black?


The GOP flipped out when Obama, like many other presidents before him, told kids to stay in school. Is your position that they opposed him because they believe kids should drop out of high school? If they support kids staying in school, why did they oppose him?


Are you talking about Obama wanting to raise the drop out age to 18? I don't remember seeing anything about the GOP flipping out over this?


Obama addressed school kids, like other presidents before him. Republicans urged parents to keep kids out of school for the day. They accused him of indoctrination.


Yes...I remember. Something similar happened when they were showing This Video at schools.
 
2012-07-06 09:26:40 AM  

john_frost: My neighbor just moved out of [Massachusetts] because the costs went up, and the Commonwealth chased his insurance company away.


No, he didn't.

What happened to your previous alt?
 
2012-07-06 09:26:52 AM  
The Republican messaging on this issue has been absolutely terrible (which is odd because that is usually their strong point). I still say it is a function of the fact that they honestly thought they were going to win the Supreme Court case and when it came down against them they really didn't know how to react. Over the past week there has been a variety of weak-sauce responses ranging from "this is really a win for Republican's because Robert's called it a tax" to "we will elect Mitt Romney, take the Senate and repeal the whole thing" to "this is the end of the Republic as we know it, AAAARGHGGGG."

I think a few things are going on here:

1. The dream of a conservative judiciary that would support all of their crazy agenda is dead. Roberts drove a stake right through the heart of that, and this is something that Republicans have been struggling for literally for 50 years. That's why you see all the attacks on Robert's, he really is their Judas as he crushed a half-century conservative dream.

2. The Republicans chose the absolute worst candidate for President to attack Obamacare. He is literally the only other human being ever to sign a health care bill with an individual mandate into law. You can see the messaging confusion over the past couple of days as Mitt tries to have it both ways, but he knows he can't. Either Obamacare is not a tax and the Republican's lose the talking point or it is a tax that their own candidate also instituted.

3. Conservatives hate losing. They REALLY hate losing to the Kenyan, Muslim, socialist usurper. That's why you see all the spinning to try to turn this into a win and all the doom saying crazy (like this Rand Paul) article. To accept their defeat graciously and move on (like the Democrats have basically done on 2nd amendment issues) is beyond their capabilities. So they will keep hammering on this point, even if it is a detriment to them politically because they literally cannot help themselves. Sure it may rile up the base but most of the non-crazy Conservative-leaning Independents are already sick of it.
 
2012-07-06 09:27:34 AM  

Noam Chimpsky: An obvious strawman is the best you can come up with? You think everyone should support him because he has some African blood. It's very strange.


I know. It seems that liberals are exactly as racist as the KKK. I'd probably be better at identifying this, if I could even see races at all. But when I look out my window, everyone pretty much looks the same to me, except for the wetbacks that water the greens.
 
2012-07-06 09:27:46 AM  

john_frost: Philip Francis Queeg: badhatharry: Liberals can't see the harm in their values. Doing "good" is all they can see. They never see the down side of letting the government take care of peoples' needs.

Oh do tell what the downside of not letting people starve or suffer for lack of access to healthcare is.

First Fact. Everyone in the USA has access to healthcare, so you Failed.

keep it up.


Yeah go to your local ER, tell them you can't pay and demand a colonoscopy. See how well that works out.
 
2012-07-06 09:28:02 AM  
RAND PAUL wants a Constitutional amendment to make Obamacare illegal.
 
2012-07-06 09:29:08 AM  

chimp_ninja: john_frost: My neighbor just moved out of [Massachusetts] because the costs went up, and the Commonwealth chased his insurance company away.

No, he didn't.

What happened to your previous alt?


Some what coherent, more so than "FOREVER". I am curious myself.
 
2012-07-06 09:30:15 AM  
Login: john_frost
Account created: 2012-07-05 08:40:55
Submitted links approved: None

Man, someone didn't get enough BBQ and beer on Independence Day.
 
2012-07-06 09:30:38 AM  

john_frost: Or do we become Greece?


Umm...someone else was obsessed with being like Greece.

Will we turn into Greece.....forever?
 
2012-07-06 09:31:27 AM  

john_frost: Philip Francis Queeg: badhatharry: Liberals can't see the harm in their values. Doing "good" is all they can see. They never see the down side of letting the government take care of peoples' needs.

Oh do tell what the downside of not letting people starve or suffer for lack of access to healthcare is.

First Fact. Everyone in the USA has access to healthcare, so you Failed.

keep it up.


Or, 45,000 Americans die each year because they don't have insurance and can't afford health care. That's more than those who die from homicide or drunk driving. If republicans think that we should be tough on crime in order to save people's lives, why don't they think we should do something about health care costs to save even more?
 
2012-07-06 09:31:27 AM  

NateGrey: john_frost: Or do we become Greece?

Umm...someone else was obsessed with being like Greece.

Will we turn into Greece.....forever?


Only if we stop offering.... 3 million.... knee replacements for grandmothers.... best part.... forever....
 
2012-07-06 09:31:28 AM  

NateGrey: Some what coherent, more so than "FOREVER". I am curious myself.


His style reminds me of a certain internet dentist, who's been burning through alts here since his main ID got banned.
 
2012-07-06 09:31:29 AM  

john_frost: Cinaed: john_frost: The 16K...

Where's that value from? Your ass is not a reliable source, unless we're talking about stank.
What's the income of the family in question? Even using your assumed value, if it's a family pulling in 100k, they'll be fine.
Do they not already have health care? Most people 'do' already have health insurance, this is for those who do NOT. The poor/destitute are the ones who need it most and.... that leads nicely into...
Do you realize there's money to assist the 'po' folk out there to better be able to afford that coverage? There's assistance for people who cannot afford this. And if you don't WANT to get that coverage, you pay the penalty for being a schmuck. Easy peasy.

Washington Post did the study? Do you realize most folks earn below $80K? And so can't afford Obamacare?

Do you really want them on the dole? I think yes.


You know how I know that you haven't the faintest idea what "Obamacare" actually does?

Come back when you can score 10/10: Health Care Reform Quiz. Until then, shut the fark up while the adults are talking.
 
2012-07-06 09:31:37 AM  

john_frost: My neighbor just moved out of there because the costs went up, and the Commonwealth chased his insurance company away.

Same thing happened in Washington State.


Lol... You're so full of shiat. Which Insurance Co. was "chased out"?

Explain the 98% coverage. Explain the success of the Health Connector in helping families find affordable plans.

Oh, and explain how the MA Insurance Companies are about to rebate $12 million to the Commonwealth as they did not meet the required percentages for money spent on care vs "administrative costs".


98%... In case you missed it.
 
2012-07-06 09:31:40 AM  
Wait, does that mean he likes the Obamacare ruling?
 
2012-07-06 09:32:56 AM  

EyeballKid: Wait, does that mean he likes the Obamacare ruling?


Only in that he gets to flex his impotent rage muscles.
 
2012-07-06 09:33:06 AM  

Philip Francis Queeg: badhatharry: Liberals can't see the harm in their values. Doing "good" is all they can see. They never see the down side of letting the government take care of peoples' needs.

Oh do tell what the downside of not letting people starve or suffer for lack of access to healthcare is.


First, nobody is starving for lack of access to health care. Poor people have medicaid. Which, not suprisingly, sucks.

Middleclass people with pre-existing conditions or without health insurance are suffering. But they don't lack access to health care. They lack access to enough money to pay for health care.
 
2012-07-06 09:33:22 AM  

john_frost: Philip Francis Queeg: john_frost: Cinaed: john_frost: The 16K...

Where's that value from? Your ass is not a reliable source, unless we're talking about stank.
What's the income of the family in question? Even using your assumed value, if it's a family pulling in 100k, they'll be fine.
Do they not already have health care? Most people 'do' already have health insurance, this is for those who do NOT. The poor/destitute are the ones who need it most and.... that leads nicely into...
Do you realize there's money to assist the 'po' folk out there to better be able to afford that coverage? There's assistance for people who cannot afford this. And if you don't WANT to get that coverage, you pay the penalty for being a schmuck. Easy peasy.

Washington Post did the study? Do you realize most folks earn below $80K? And so can't afford Obamacare?

Do you really want them on the dole? I think yes.

Want them on the "dole"? No. Think having people on the "dole" is better then letting them suffer from lack of access to healthcare? Damn straight.

So, if the end result is most americans taking a handout, you are OK. What will the other 1/2 do? Do you really think they will just pay up? Or do we become Greece?


So if the end result is Americans suffering needlessly from preventable and curable illness, you are OK? Tell us, exactly how many of your fellow citizens you are willing to watch suffer to save a few dollars on your taxes?
 
2012-07-06 09:33:54 AM  

john_frost: Washington Post did the study? Do you realize most folks earn below $80K? And so can't afford Obamacare?


Obamacare isn't something you buy.
Unless you're pissed at the high price, in which case... blame the private sector.

Do you really want them on the dole? I think yes.

That word you're using, it doesn't mean what you think it means.
 
2012-07-06 09:34:04 AM  

john_frost: keylock71: john_frost: The 16K it is going to cost a Family of 4 to buy this expensive Insurance we call Obamcare

Thats the part where everyone takes their money and leaves the system.

You mean like what happened in Massachusetts with MAHealth?

Oh wait, the Commonwealth has got 98% coverage now and the plan my family has through the Health Connector is actually cheaper and covers more than was covered by a previous plan we had with an employer.

But, please, proceed with your fortune telling. It's amusing.

My neighbor just moved out of there because the costs went up, and the Commonwealth chased his insurance company away.

Same thing happened in Washington State.


As an outraged conservative living in Washington State, I am intrigued by your statement. Perhaps you could fill me in more on this outrageous circumstance that I should be more outraged by.

I think the fact I am not aware of this is probably due to some sort of liberal propaganda campaign exactly like those they used to use in the USSR.
 
2012-07-06 09:34:57 AM  

randomjsa: Once again, this is not now nor has it ever been about denying or allowing people access to health care. Obama and his fellow Democrats are that benevolent and did not design this plan for any noble purpose. If they had it wouldn't be such a cluster fark, it would have bipartisan support, and the Democrats wouldn't have to lie hand over fist about its cost or what it actually is.

I realize that 'deny health care' bit is an excellent talking point a lot like the cherry picked aspects of ObamaCare you keep insisting we talk about instead of the whole bill, but you're not actually fooling anyone with either of those tactics.

How about you, as Obama said, accept that elections have consequences? But you can't do that, otherwise you're going to have to break the liberal cardinal rule of never admitting people understood and rejected your ideas. The 2010 election should have been enough of a wake up call for liberals, including Obama, to take that middle finger they've had stuck in the faces of the majority of America and step back for a minute.

But no, this power grab by liberal politicians must go forward apparently.

When 50.1% of the people turned against the Iraq war, it was time to shut it down and pull out completely but no matter how many people are against ObamaCare, it's never time to listen to the will of the people.


You got that completely wrong in the first sentence, so I didn't even bother reading the rest of it, which is I am sure just a bunch of right-wing drivel.
 
2012-07-06 09:36:32 AM  

Guntram Shatterhand: Coding shows he is capable of some of the finer points of it, but to go for the comparison is a risky move. It's usually best to let your bigoted base do the 'figuring' for themselves.


Indeed. I mean, you're supposed to rely on the dogwhistle to do your speaking for you. They way it stands, he might as well have just come out and told his constituents the SCOTUS thinks they are all attractive and successful African Americans.
 
2012-07-06 09:36:48 AM  

badhatharry: Philip Francis Queeg: badhatharry: Liberals can't see the harm in their values. Doing "good" is all they can see. They never see the down side of letting the government take care of peoples' needs.

Oh do tell what the downside of not letting people starve or suffer for lack of access to healthcare is.

First, nobody is starving for lack of access to health care. Poor people have medicaid. Which, not suprisingly, sucks.

Middleclass people with pre-existing conditions or without health insurance are suffering. But they don't lack access to health care. They lack access to enough money to pay for health care.


Ahh yes, yet another conservative showing their ignorance on the issue. You clearly know nothing about the eligibility requirements for Medicaid.
 
2012-07-06 09:38:28 AM  

john_frost: explain how Washington State and MA are the most expensive in the country?


Because MA has one of the highest cost of living in the Country since well before MaHealth was implemented?

We also have the best hospitals, best quality of health care, regularly rank as one of the fittest, healthiest, most educated states, and have some of the highest income levels in the country.

Where do you live and how does your state rank in those departments?
 
2012-07-06 09:39:27 AM  
Login: john_frost
Account created: 2012-07-05 08:40:55

I guess john_galt was taken. It's nice to have some more fresh-faced, motivated Young Republicans here on Fark. Here's a tip: LURK MOAR. But, anyway, congratulations on your new job!
 
2012-07-06 09:39:55 AM  

john_frost: explain how Washington State and MA are the most expensive in the country?


Oh, and you still haven't explained or provided any evidence for your nonsense.

But, please, continue...
 
2012-07-06 09:40:53 AM  
It's not true libertardian derp until it gets tied back to CFL bulbs.
 
2012-07-06 09:41:37 AM  

Philip Francis Queeg: badhatharry: Philip Francis Queeg: badhatharry: Liberals can't see the harm in their values. Doing "good" is all they can see. They never see the down side of letting the government take care of peoples' needs.

Oh do tell what the downside of not letting people starve or suffer for lack of access to healthcare is.

First, nobody is starving for lack of access to health care. Poor people have medicaid. Which, not suprisingly, sucks.

Middleclass people with pre-existing conditions or without health insurance are suffering. But they don't lack access to health care. They lack access to enough money to pay for health care.

Ahh yes, yet another conservative showing their ignorance on the issue. You clearly know nothing about the eligibility requirements for Medicaid.


Ayup. Medicare/Medicaid has had some mighty strong restrictions as to who could access it.

Had. When 2014 gets here, anyone within 133% of the poverty level will be able to enroll into Medicare, but that's strictly and solely because of the ACA/Obamacare.
 
2012-07-06 09:42:24 AM  

john_frost: None, I just don't want a system that Taxes one side of the table, and hands it to the other.


It doesn't.

Obamacare was sold as a new system that lowers costs.

It isn't. Methinks you have absolutely no idea what is actually in the HCR bills.
 
2012-07-06 09:43:35 AM  

john_frost: So, if the end result is most americans taking a handout, you are OK. What will the other 1/2 do? Do you really think they will just pay up? Or do we become Greece?


gfx.glittergraphicsnow.com
a2zscraplets.com.au

 
2012-07-06 09:43:53 AM  
Did you people even READ what he said? He wasn't comparing the decision to Dred Scott. He was saying that the Court does change its views of what its constitutional over a period of time. It changed quite a bit since the Dred Scott decision, and he is saying that the Court's view of what is constitutional will change again! Christ ON A HOVERBOARD IN DRAG! Do you drooling monkeys always take whatever is written at ThinkRegress as gospel?
 
2012-07-06 09:44:49 AM  

john_frost: I do stand corrected.


I'm sure you stand that way quite often...

You should read more and post less. You'll look like less of a simpleton that way.
 
2012-07-06 09:44:53 AM  

Alphax: ManRay: "The SCOTUS's decision not to deny millions of people of health care.."

Yep. That frames the subject accurately. Good job staying above the fray.

You sound sarcastic. Why?



Probably because the SCOTUS did not rule on denying millions of people healthcare.
 
2012-07-06 09:45:56 AM  

john_frost: Philip Francis Queeg: john_frost: Philip Francis Queeg: john_frost: Cinaed: john_frost: The 16K...

Where's that value from? Your ass is not a reliable source, unless we're talking about stank.
What's the income of the family in question? Even using your assumed value, if it's a family pulling in 100k, they'll be fine.
Do they not already have health care? Most people 'do' already have health insurance, this is for those who do NOT. The poor/destitute are the ones who need it most and.... that leads nicely into...
Do you realize there's money to assist the 'po' folk out there to better be able to afford that coverage? There's assistance for people who cannot afford this. And if you don't WANT to get that coverage, you pay the penalty for being a schmuck. Easy peasy.

Washington Post did the study? Do you realize most folks earn below $80K? And so can't afford Obamacare?

Do you really want them on the dole? I think yes.

Want them on the "dole"? No. Think having people on the "dole" is better then letting them suffer from lack of access to healthcare? Damn straight.

So, if the end result is most americans taking a handout, you are OK. What will the other 1/2 do? Do you really think they will just pay up? Or do we become Greece?

So if the end result is Americans suffering needlessly from preventable and curable illness, you are OK? Tell us, exactly how many of your fellow citizens you are willing to watch suffer to save a few dollars on your taxes?

None, I just don't want a system that Taxes one side of the table, and hands it to the other.

Obamacare was sold as a new system that lowers costs.

It does not.


Obamacare was sold as a way to cover 30 million people who couldn't get coverage due to cost and/or preexisting conditions.

You trying to retro-package it as a 'cost cutting' thing is silly since anyone with youtube can go back and see the ads and speeches for themselves. It was always themed as a way to cover that uninsured 10% who, ironically enough, were the ones in the most need of coverage.

But, just as an fyi, once we're all covered, you're going to see a big push by the insurance companies to get preventative care as a priority since it's ridiculously cost-effective as opposed to ER-style emergency care. And since they're now required to pay that ER bill instead of making the government pick up the tab, they're not so thrilled with the expensive stuff anymore.
 
2012-07-06 09:46:09 AM  

john_frost: something like, if you like your insurance company, you get to keep it?

How is that working out?


In MA, it's working out pretty good. 98% coverage.
 
2012-07-06 09:47:51 AM  
Login: john_frost
Account created: 2012-07-05 08:40:55

He's a hand-puppet, you douchebags.
 
2012-07-06 09:49:10 AM  

LouDobbsAwaaaay: Login: john_frost
Account created: 2012-07-05 08:40:55

He's a hand-puppet, you douchebags.


Yes, but it's early and I'm bored and I need entertainment.
 
2012-07-06 09:49:16 AM  

Independentandproud: Did you people even READ what he said? He wasn't comparing the decision to Dred Scott. He was saying that the Court does change its views of what its constitutional over a period of time. It changed quite a bit since the Dred Scott decision, and he is saying that the Court's view of what is constitutional will change again! Christ ON A HOVERBOARD IN DRAG! Do you drooling monkeys always take whatever is written at ThinkRegress as gospel?


You sound tired.
 
2012-07-06 09:49:48 AM  
Rand is still pissed about the Civil Rights Act of 1964. He'd still be for slavery so long as it was approved at the state level.
 
2012-07-06 09:50:46 AM  

LouDobbsAwaaaay: Login: john_frost
Account created: 2012-07-05 08:40:55

He's a hand-puppet, you douchebags.


You are free to ignore him and any posts replying to him, you know...
 
2012-07-06 09:53:19 AM  

Independentandproud: Did you people even READ what he said? He wasn't comparing the decision to Dred Scott. He was saying that the Court does change its views of what its constitutional over a period of time. It changed quite a bit since the Dred Scott decision, and he is saying that the Court's view of what is constitutional will change again! Christ ON A HOVERBOARD IN DRAG! Do you drooling monkeys always take whatever is written at ThinkRegress as gospel?


But that's a stupid thing to say. The court didn't change it's mind about Dred Scott. There was a war and a constitutional amendment that invalidated it. The court had little to do with it. Paul could have chosen a number of court cases but he decided on the one that was both inflammatory and made him look stupid. Which is pretty much what we expect from Paul.
 
2012-07-06 09:53:37 AM  

john_frost: How is that working out?


sg.wsj.net
 
2012-07-06 09:53:42 AM  

john_frost: Derp?


http://healthreform.kff.org/quizzes/health-reform-quiz.aspx

Take the quiz. Educate thy self.
 
2012-07-06 09:57:31 AM  

odinsposse: Independentandproud: Did you people even READ what he said? He wasn't comparing the decision to Dred Scott. He was saying that the Court does change its views of what its constitutional over a period of time. It changed quite a bit since the Dred Scott decision, and he is saying that the Court's view of what is constitutional will change again! Christ ON A HOVERBOARD IN DRAG! Do you drooling monkeys always take whatever is written at ThinkRegress as gospel?

But that's a stupid thing to say. The court didn't change it's mind about Dred Scott. There was a war and a constitutional amendment that invalidated it. The court had little to do with it. Paul could have chosen a number of court cases but he decided on the one that was both inflammatory and made him look stupid. Which is pretty much what we expect from Paul.


Just when you thought it was impossible for a Congressman to be more of a pointless retarded immoral angry racist batshiat old coot than Ron Paul...
 
2012-07-06 09:58:38 AM  

Cinaed: john_frost: Derp?

http://healthreform.kff.org/quizzes/health-reform-quiz.aspx

Take the quiz. Educate thy self.


I am going to take a wild guess and say that he's going to be a 99.6%er, and not the kind who is a question or two from having a perfect score. He's the kind who gets the death panel question wrong.
 
2012-07-06 09:59:15 AM  
I think he meant to compare it to Stallone's "Judge Dredd",
 
2012-07-06 10:00:55 AM  

keylock71: LouDobbsAwaaaay: Login: john_frost
Account created: 2012-07-05 08:40:55

He's a hand-puppet, you douchebags.

You are free to ignore him and any posts replying to him, you know...


I'm also free to know that pro wrestling is fake, but I'll still call you a douchebag if you act like it's real. This site is polluted with co-dependent shiat stains who either need to troll grief out of people or need to supply it. It's never been free of that relationship, but it wasn't always the central focus.
 
2012-07-06 10:04:31 AM  

LouDobbsAwaaaay: I'm also free to know that pro wrestling is fake, but I'll still call you a douchebag if you act like it's real. This site is polluted with co-dependent shiat stains who either need to troll grief out of people or need to supply it. It's never been free of that relationship, but it wasn't always the central focus.


You're also free to be an asshole to people who haven't said or done anything to you.
 
2012-07-06 10:05:52 AM  

LouDobbsAwaaaay: keylock71: LouDobbsAwaaaay: Login: john_frost
Account created: 2012-07-05 08:40:55

He's a hand-puppet, you douchebags.

You are free to ignore him and any posts replying to him, you know...

I'm also free to know that pro wrestling is fake, but I'll still call you a douchebag if you act like it's real. This site is polluted with co-dependent shiat stains who either need to troll grief out of people or need to supply it. It's never been free of that relationship, but it wasn't always the central focus.


I'm more saddened by the gradual evolution of definition of 'troll'.

It was originally defined as a poster who throws up inflammatory stuff in order to get people riled up and make them make rage-posts.

These days, if you rationally and logically destroy a Troll post, people still try and lol and say you got trolled.
 
2012-07-06 10:06:06 AM  

ManRay: Alphax: ManRay: "The SCOTUS's decision not to deny millions of people of health care.."

Yep. That frames the subject accurately. Good job staying above the fray.

You sound sarcastic. Why?


Probably because the SCOTUS did not rule on denying millions of people healthcare.


Well, Roberts decided not to do so, anyway.
 
2012-07-06 10:07:45 AM  

NateGrey: badhatharry: Obamacare is what is going to end up denying people healthcare.

So Vote Republican?


Yes. If you are really going to be spiteful and mean, do it properly.
 
2012-07-06 10:15:12 AM  

Infernalist: I'm more saddened by the gradual evolution of definition of 'troll'.

It was originally defined as a poster who throws up inflammatory stuff in order to get people riled up and make them make rage-posts.

These days, if you rationally and logically destroy a Troll post, people still try and lol and say you got trolled.


Well, the goal is to draw attention to themselves, so they probably consider it a "win" no matter what form that attention takes. I kind of have to agree that anything more than "fark off tard" and throwing them on ignore is giving into what they want. What really sucks is that they don't even have to put any effort into it to get a giant list of responses, because 75% of the people here are so keyed-up they're just waiting for the chance to feed the trolls. There really isn't even a point to the article links or headlines at this point; why not just have threads designated "troll thread 01, troll thread 02, troll ..." and cut out the middle-man?
 
2012-07-06 10:24:55 AM  

LouDobbsAwaaaay: Infernalist: I'm more saddened by the gradual evolution of definition of 'troll'.

It was originally defined as a poster who throws up inflammatory stuff in order to get people riled up and make them make rage-posts.

These days, if you rationally and logically destroy a Troll post, people still try and lol and say you got trolled.

Well, the goal is to draw attention to themselves, so they probably consider it a "win" no matter what form that attention takes. I kind of have to agree that anything more than "fark off tard" and throwing them on ignore is giving into what they want. What really sucks is that they don't even have to put any effort into it to get a giant list of responses, because 75% of the people here are so keyed-up they're just waiting for the chance to feed the trolls. There really isn't even a point to the article links or headlines at this point; why not just have threads designated "troll thread 01, troll thread 02, troll ..." and cut out the middle-man?


Or Attention Whores And the Posters Who Love Them.

I consider a 'troll' to be someone who manages to invoke a passionate response with faux ignorance.

Someone just wanting attention is an attention whore.
 
2012-07-06 10:37:34 AM  
Man, that troll didn't even last 24 hours. They just don't build them like they used to.
 
2012-07-06 10:40:53 AM  

LazarusLong42: Man, that troll didn't even last 24 hours. They just don't build them like they used to.


www.yourfunnystuff.com
 
2012-07-06 10:43:49 AM  
Sounded more like Broken Bonehead to me.
 
2012-07-06 10:51:09 AM  

john_frost: None, I just don't want a system that Taxes one side of the table, and hands it to the other.


Then you're against welfare? Social security? Every single social program that we pay taxes for?
 
2012-07-06 10:52:17 AM  

LouDobbsAwaaaay: I'm also free to know that pro wrestling is fake, but I'll still call you a douchebag if you act like it's real. This site is polluted with co-dependent shiat stains who either need to troll grief out of people or need to supply it. It's never been free of that relationship, but it wasn't always the central focus.


Post of the week.

keylock71: You're also free to be an asshole to people who haven't said or done anything to you.


Troll enablers are worse than the trolls themselves.
 
2012-07-06 10:53:35 AM  
All these 'conservatives' predicting doom and gloom with Obamacare; insurance companies going out of business, lines for healthcare, and it just being a general clusterfark....

Is this stuff happening in Mass. and I haven't heard of it or are you guys just pulling this stuff out of your arse?

We pretty much know what is going to happen with Obamacare, we have the model in Mass. with the virtually identical Romneycare.
 
2012-07-06 10:54:24 AM  

PC LOAD LETTER: I love when Conservatives use Dredd Scott. Conservatives loved the decision when it came out.


Yet it was Republicans that were anti-slavery...
 
2012-07-06 10:56:30 AM  

iawai: PC LOAD LETTER: I love when Conservatives use Dredd Scott. Conservatives loved the decision when it came out.

Yet it was Republicans that were anti-slavery...


In the land of 1857, Conservatives != Republicans
 
2012-07-06 10:58:08 AM  

iawai: PC LOAD LETTER: I love when Conservatives use Dredd Scott. Conservatives loved the decision when it came out.

Yet it was Republicans that were anti-slavery...


So? It is Republicans of today that are bigots and ass hats.
 
2012-07-06 10:58:15 AM  

AngryPanda: john_frost: None, I just don't want a system that Taxes one side of the table, and hands it to the other.

Then you're against welfare? Social security? Every single social program that we pay taxes for?


I'm for helping the poor, the aged, and social programs generally.

Are you for massive monopoly bureaucracies wasting the money that was supposed to go to help the needy? Are you for a system of unaccountable extortion to provide these monies in the first place, causing people to resent helping the needy instead of finding value in charity?
 
2012-07-06 10:59:41 AM  

iawai: PC LOAD LETTER: I love when Conservatives use Dredd Scott. Conservatives loved the decision when it came out.

Yet it was Republicans that were anti-slavery...


Yep. Back before the Republicans courted the Dixiecrats, THEY were the more liberal party. But then they assimilated the crazy that left the Democrats, and became the modern mix of racists, sociopaths and/or fundamentalists they are today.
 
2012-07-06 11:02:41 AM  

Slaves2Darkness: iawai: PC LOAD LETTER: I love when Conservatives use Dredd Scott. Conservatives loved the decision when it came out.

Yet it was Republicans that were anti-slavery...

So? It is Republicans of today that are bigots and ass hats.


Agreed. And Democrats are opportunistic bigots and ass hats.
 
2012-07-06 11:05:54 AM  
What most of you don't understand is if this healthcare TAX is implemented, it will of necessity cause health care shortages, less doctors, and healthcare rationing, just like in other socialist countries. Our healthcare "crisis" (there was no crisis to begin with) will be worse than before. Read the law and find out for yourselves.
 
2012-07-06 11:07:48 AM  

Aldon: All these 'conservatives' predicting doom and gloom with Obamacare; insurance companies going out of business, lines for healthcare, and it just being a general clusterfark....

Is this stuff happening in Mass. and I haven't heard of it or are you guys just pulling this stuff out of your arse?

We pretty much know what is going to happen with Obamacare, we have the model in Mass. with the virtually identical Romneycare.


Longer wait times with the highest average HC premiums in the country.
 
2012-07-06 11:09:50 AM  

tony41454: What most of you don't understand is if this healthcare TAX is implemented, it will of necessity cause health care shortages, less doctors, and healthcare rationing, just like in other socialist countries. Our healthcare "crisis" (there was no crisis to begin with) will be worse than before. Read the law and find out for yourselves.


Non of that is happening in Massachusetts...

You should take your own advice.
 
2012-07-06 11:12:38 AM  

L82DPRT: Longer wait times with the highest average HC premiums in the country.


Hi there!

My family's insurance was purchased through the MA Health Connector. We actually have more coverage for less cost than a previous plan we had through my wife's former employer.

I've never waited to see a doctor and didn't have to change any of my doctor's or specialists with the plan through the Commonwealth.

My premiums are actually less than they were with the last plan, as well.
 
2012-07-06 11:13:05 AM  

iawai: Are you for a system of unaccountable extortion to provide these monies in the first place, causing people to resent helping the needy instead of finding value in charity?


TAXATION IS THEFT!
 
2012-07-06 11:14:56 AM  
PSA: Get your GP NOW

Adding ~30M patients to primary care rolls w/o adding any new primary care providers will absolutely cause longer wait times.
 
2012-07-06 11:15:04 AM  

iawai: Are you for a system of unaccountable extortion to provide these monies in the first place, causing people to resent helping the needy instead of finding value in charity?


It's extortion to make people pay a tax penalty for not having health insurance that they can afford? Does that mean I can claim extortion for withdrawing from my 401k early?
 
2012-07-06 11:19:09 AM  

L82DPRT: PSA: Get your GP NOW

Adding ~30M patients to primary care rolls w/o adding any new primary care providers will absolutely cause longer wait times.


So you are arguing that we must ensure that 30,000,000 MUST be left without the means to see a GP so that your wait times are shorter?

Ho about If we prevent you and your entire family from seeing a doctor, wait times will be even shorter. I bet you'd be 100% supportive of that, right?
 
2012-07-06 11:21:39 AM  
The ironic thing is that under the constitution at the time the Dredd Scott decision was the legally correct one.
 
2012-07-06 11:22:45 AM  

keylock71: L82DPRT: Longer wait times with the highest average HC premiums in the country.

Hi there!

My family's insurance was purchased through the MA Health Connector. We actually have more coverage for less cost than a previous plan we had through my wife's former employer.

I've never waited to see a doctor and didn't have to change any of my doctor's or specialists with the plan through the Commonwealth.

My premiums are actually less than they were with the last plan, as well.


Let me respond for tony.

But FartbamaCare!!!! DeathPanels!!11 Are you a zombie?
 
2012-07-06 11:23:10 AM  

randomjsa: Once again, this is not now nor has it ever been about denying or allowing people access to health care. Obama and his fellow Democrats are that benevolent and did not design this plan for any noble purpose. If they had it wouldn't be such a cluster fark, it would have bipartisan support,


Oh, I'll bite. If Obama had proposed full-on socialized medicine the GOP would have pointed to Romney's plan (a.k.a. Obamacare) and said THIS IS HOW IT SHOULD BE DONE! The GOP is to bipartisanship as icebergs are to leisurely turn-of-the-century cruise ships. Enough already.
 
2012-07-06 11:24:58 AM  
 
2012-07-06 11:28:21 AM  

tony41454: What most of you don't understand is if this healthcare TAX is implemented, it will of necessity cause health care shortages, less doctors, and healthcare rationing, just like in other socialist countries. Our healthcare "crisis" (there was no crisis to begin with) will be worse than before. Read the law and find out for yourselves.


Mitt Romney raised taxes in Massachusetts?
 
2012-07-06 11:32:18 AM  

keylock71: At the same time, since the law was approved in 2006, Massachusetts residents are more likely to have a place they usually go when they are sick or need advice (up 4.7 percent), more likely to have had a preventive care visit (up 5.9 percent), more likely to have had multiple doctor visits (up 5 percent) and more likely to have had a dental visit (up 5 percent), the Blue Cross Blue Shield report found.


You convinced me. Romney was a great governor and gets my vote! Romneycare for everyone!
 
2012-07-06 11:34:52 AM  

tony41454: What most of you don't understand is if this healthcare TAX is implemented, it will of necessity cause health care shortages, less doctors, and healthcare rationing, just like in other socialist countries. Our healthcare "crisis" (there was no crisis to begin with) will be worse than before. Read the law and find out for yourselves.


So...more people with coverage who can now make office visits won't lead to primary care doctors hiring more nursing staff, or expanding their offices and practices to deal with having more patients?
 
2012-07-06 11:35:53 AM  

Carth: keylock71: At the same time, since the law was approved in 2006, Massachusetts residents are more likely to have a place they usually go when they are sick or need advice (up 4.7 percent), more likely to have had a preventive care visit (up 5.9 percent), more likely to have had multiple doctor visits (up 5 percent) and more likely to have had a dental visit (up 5 percent), the Blue Cross Blue Shield report found.

You convinced me. Romney was a great governor and gets my vote! Romneycare for everyone!



Might want to rethink that vote for Romney, then...

"I will act to repeal Obamacare." -Mitt Romney, June 28, 2012
 
2012-07-06 11:38:56 AM  

keylock71: Carth: keylock71: At the same time, since the law was approved in 2006, Massachusetts residents are more likely to have a place they usually go when they are sick or need advice (up 4.7 percent), more likely to have had a preventive care visit (up 5.9 percent), more likely to have had multiple doctor visits (up 5 percent) and more likely to have had a dental visit (up 5 percent), the Blue Cross Blue Shield report found.

You convinced me. Romney was a great governor and gets my vote! Romneycare for everyone!


Might want to rethink that vote for Romney, then...

"I will act to repeal Obamacare." -Mitt Romney, June 28, 2012


More good news! Obamacare would cripple our nation and is a massive over reach of the federal government.
Romneycare on the other hand is an effective state run program that provides healthcare in an cost efficient manner.

Romney/Bachmann 2012!
 
2012-07-06 11:39:02 AM  
The uninsured are victims of the distorted marketplace resulting from HC providers, insurers, Big Pharma and Big Gubmint colluding for their mutual benefit not yours and mine.

Obamacare supposedly will reduce costs with preventive care and insurance exchanges. The first supposition gives 'Mericans too much credit for doing what's good for them and the second cost lowering mechanism is a free market related benefit.
 
2012-07-06 11:43:00 AM  

Carth:
Romney/Bachmann 2012!


Next time, just post, "I'm an idiot"... It'll save us both some time.
 
2012-07-06 11:45:12 AM  

Carth: Romney/Bachmann 2012!


I didn't read the "female VP" thread from yesterday, but I'm assuming there was much snark on this possible outcome.
 
2012-07-06 11:48:47 AM  

randomjsa: Obama and his fellow Democrats are that benevolent and did not design this plan


You're right for once, actually. Obama and Democrats did not design this plan. Republicans did, Republicans such as John Chaffee in 1993 and Don Nickles in 1994. In a deft political move, Obama can use the fact that this plan is the Republican alternative to Obama's original single-payer vision to justly brutalize Republicans as the do-nothing gimmick Party of No.

(Remember the Republican Study Committee budget vote, when Republicans began voting against the budget they ostensibly supported when Democrats began changing their vote to present? Same thing.)
 
2012-07-06 12:00:24 PM  

quizzical: tony41454: What most of you don't understand is if this healthcare TAX is implemented, it will of necessity cause health care shortages, less doctors, and healthcare rationing, just like in other socialist countries. Our healthcare "crisis" (there was no crisis to begin with) will be worse than before. Read the law and find out for yourselves.

So...more people with coverage who can now make office visits won't lead to primary care doctors hiring more nursing staff, or expanding their offices and practices to deal with having more patients?


Wouldn't that be... job creation?
 
2012-07-06 12:05:54 PM  
While reading this thread, I have not had a laugh like this in a long time.

And the thing is, it brings it right home. A couple of days ago, I got into a discussion with a fellow military member who the entire shop knows is a hardcore Fox News acolyte, and someone brought up the ACA. He said (I'm not making this up) that the health care law will FORCE HEALTH INSURANCE COMPANIES OUT OF BUSINESS, because people will rather PAY A TAX THAN PAY FOR HEALTH INSURANCE. So America will have a health system just like EUROPE, and no private health companies will exist.

I was like, "Hold on a second. I cannot let you get away with that! No health insurance company will go out of business because of the ACA. No way. You cannot really believe that"

He seriously believes this. We had someone even tell him that in the UK, you have the NHS, and you still have a private health company making money hand over fist because people want to use its services.

He said this "I don't believe you. That's not factual."

Some people will just shut down critical thinking when it comes to this President or if it means the "other side" wins. Amazing.
 
2012-07-06 12:14:12 PM  

Dr. Mojo PhD: Republicans did


Tired talking point is tired. The fact that a minority of left leaning Republicans supported an idea that was seen as fall back plan if all else FAILed and was never voted out of committee doesn't mean shiat.

chimp_ninja: job creation?


Yep. While job creation and adding HC professionals is a good thing expanding the bloated top heavy bureaucratic part of HC like Obamacare does is not.
 
2012-07-06 12:22:19 PM  

L82DPRT: Yep. While job creation and adding HC professionals is a good thing expanding the bloated top heavy bureaucratic part of HC like Obamacare does is not.


Good thing we have a health care system right now where the free market has absolutely avoided creating bloated, top-heavy bureaucracies who administer what an acceptable treatment is or isn't.

Oh wait, we do. And thanks to PPACA, they can no longer arbitrarily drop customers when they get sick.
 
2012-07-06 12:24:39 PM  

fracto73: tirob: Sick people have no rights that doctors, hospitals, and insurance carriers are bound to respect.


Doctors, hospitals, and insurance carriers have no rights that dying people are bound to respect. What are you going to do to someone with a terminal illness, throw them in jail and give them health care as punishment?


The reference was to Chief Justice Roger Taney's now-infamous dictum in the Dred Scott case to the effect that blacks have no rights that whites are "bound to respect."

Nobody goes in for American history or irony anymore. *sigh.*
 
2012-07-06 12:26:36 PM  

L82DPRT: Dr. Mojo PhD: Republicans did

Tired talking point is tired. The fact that a minority of left leaning Republicans supported an idea that was seen as fall back plan if all else FAILed and was never voted out of committee doesn't mean shiat.


Still, you have to admit that Republicans designed the plan.
 
2012-07-06 12:37:46 PM  

AngryPanda: iawai: Are you for a system of unaccountable extortion to provide these monies in the first place, causing people to resent helping the needy instead of finding value in charity?

It's extortion to make people pay a tax penalty for not having health insurance that they can afford? Does that mean I can claim extortion for withdrawing from my 401k early?


???

You are threatened with jail if you avoid paying your "healthcare penalty/tax". That's extortion. A threat made to appropriate money.

If you threatened your 401(k) holding company that you'd blow up their headquarters if they didn't give you other people's accounts, that'd be extortion. Demanding your money by the terms of the contract is just that, nothing wrong there.

Do you honestly believe that the money you make is really the govt's money, loaned to you via a consensual contract, subject to govt demand at any time?
 
2012-07-06 12:40:52 PM  

L82DPRT: Dr. Mojo PhD: Republicans did

Tired talking point is tired.


2+2=4 has been talked about since before 1993. Perhaps you'd like to whine how that absolute, incontrovertible fact is also "old" when you next feel victimized.

L82DPRT: The fact that a minority of left leaning Republicans supported an idea that was seen as fall back plan if all else FAILed and was never voted out of committee doesn't mean shiat.


Ah yes, such as famed left-leaning Republican majority leader Boehner's plan to tax individuals without coverage.

You fell into that obvious and predictable trap nicely; all the funnier for your attempt to deflect from the fact that your pants-pissing retort in no way alters the fact that the truth value of the statement that it was a Republican designed plan is absolute and true. Kudos to (predictably) attempting to deflect from this, though:

randomjsa: It was not a Democrat-designed plan...
Me: You're right. It was Republican-designed.
You: *whine* unNnunnuNUnnnn it's a tired talking point that doesn't matter (actually it does matter, it speaks directly to who designed it, which is the matter up for debate) *whine*

Conservatives: Predictable, pathetic, easily baited, not tuned in to reality. This series of posts is definitive and undeniable proof, ladies and gentlemen. What do you think the odds are L82DPRT will grow a pair and immediately offer to commit suicide because the disease is obviously inside of him?
 
2012-07-06 12:43:38 PM  

theorellior: iawai: Are you for a system of unaccountable extortion to provide these monies in the first place, causing people to resent helping the needy instead of finding value in charity?

TAXATION IS THEFT!


Isn't it?
 
2012-07-06 12:46:38 PM  

iawai: theorellior: iawai: Are you for a system of unaccountable extortion to provide these monies in the first place, causing people to resent helping the needy instead of finding value in charity?

TAXATION IS THEFT!

Isn't it?


No, it isn't.

Are you an anarchist?
 
2012-07-06 12:54:49 PM  

L82DPRT: The uninsured are victims of the distorted marketplace resulting from HC providers, insurers, Big Pharma and Big Gubmint colluding for their mutual benefit not yours and mine.


The "distorted marketplace" is an inherent feature of health care. Any time you have such a stark asymmetry of access to information, an inequity of bargaining position, and no practical option to walk away from the transaction if you find the terms of the exchange onerous, you have a distorted market. Add to this the peculiar fact that many of the costs associated with medical care are non-monetary (pain, inconvenience, anxiety), and you have a textbook example of an economic exchange in which absolutely nothing you learned in Econ 101 is applicable.
 
2012-07-06 01:14:41 PM  
The fun part is all the morans that think they are going to get free doctors, free meds, free everything.

Just wait until the reality hits. Good times.
 
2012-07-06 01:21:57 PM  

HighOnCraic: L82DPRT: Dr. Mojo PhD: Republicans did

Tired talking point is tired. The fact that a minority of left leaning Republicans supported an idea that was seen as fall back plan if all else FAILed and was never voted out of committee doesn't mean shiat.

Still, you have to admit that Republicans designed the plan.


Correct. I said it didn't mean shiat. So what. Big deal. The idea went nowhere.



Dr. Mojo PhD
:
What do you think the odds are


0% right now though beginning to feel 100% at some point of my choice in the future unless of course medical science cures old.
 
2012-07-06 01:22:19 PM  

iawai: AngryPanda: iawai: Are you for a system of unaccountable extortion to provide these monies in the first place, causing people to resent helping the needy instead of finding value in charity?

It's extortion to make people pay a tax penalty for not having health insurance that they can afford? Does that mean I can claim extortion for withdrawing from my 401k early?

???

You are threatened with jail if you avoid paying your "healthcare penalty/tax". That's extortion. A threat made to appropriate money.

If you threatened your 401(k) holding company that you'd blow up their headquarters if they didn't give you other people's accounts, that'd be extortion. Demanding your money by the terms of the contract is just that, nothing wrong there.

Do you honestly believe that the money you make is really the govt's money, loaned to you via a consensual contract, subject to govt demand at any time?


No, I believe that I possess health insurance, like any normal person with good sense and the proper financial resources does. What's the difference? You know if you don't pay your normal income taxes, you can go to jail too, right? Tax evasion? Al Capone found that out the hard way.

If you can afford it, get yourself health insurance (which you should have anyway) or pay a fine, which is then used to help others who are unable to get gainful employment to get the care they need.
 
2012-07-06 01:52:27 PM  

Dwight_Yeast: NateGrey: john_frost: You willing to have an Intelligent conversation? So far you Fail.

Account created: 2012-07-05 08:40:55

Not a fan of day old alts. Try someone else to troll.

It's always a little sad to Ignore such a young troll, but here we are.


I think that's EWreckedSean again. No evidence. And this post, and all previous posts made by me in this thread now have a shelf-life of about 5 minutes because I said this. But there ya go.
 
2012-07-06 02:19:44 PM  

L82DPRT: HighOnCraic: L82DPRT: Dr. Mojo PhD: Republicans did

Tired talking point is tired. The fact that a minority of left leaning Republicans supported an idea that was seen as fall back plan if all else FAILed and was never voted out of committee doesn't mean shiat.

Still, you have to admit that Republicans designed the plan.

Correct. I said it didn't mean shiat. So what. Big deal. The idea went nowhere.


Actually it definitively, 100% means that when randomjsa says this:

randomjsa: Obama and his fellow Democrats are that benevolent and did not design this plan for any noble purpose. If they had it wouldn't be such a cluster fark, it would have bipartisan support


And attempts to blame the perceived negative qualities of Obamacare on Obama and Democrats, they are speaking falsely.

I know it enrages you that randomjsa is a pure, dyed-in-the-wool, black-hating, gay-murdering conservative like you and that if randomjsa speaks falsely it's a detriment to crucifying Matthew Shepard on a chainlink fence or executing Trayvon Martin for the crime of being caught on tape purchasing his Skittles instead of stealing them like a good little negro stereotype should, but that's simply the facts:

1. Your little pet biatch spoke falsely.
2. Your little pet biatch was caught in their lie.

No matter how much you mewl and piss your pants, your "hnnNHhUUguhg it doesn't count" nonsense means nothing.

This plan is based on the plans of no less than three Republicans. The idea that it would have bipartisan support if not for Democrats is provably false. The end.
 
2012-07-06 02:38:35 PM  

iawai: You are threatened with jail if you avoid paying your "healthcare penalty/tax".


No, you're not.

You might have some problems if you start lying to the IRS on your tax returns, but that's nothing new.
 
2012-07-06 03:23:17 PM  

Dr. Mojo PhD: randomjsa: Obama and his fellow Democrats are that benevolent and did not design this plan for any noble purpose.


Does that sentence make sense to you Moj?

Dr. Mojo PhD: a pure, dyed-in-the-wool, black-hating, gay-murdering conservative like you


FARK YOU, Moj.

If the mandate is so great why don't Dems and our Constitutionally Challenged Constitutional Scholar own it? It's 100% Dem passed. It's theirs. Completely. They should have let this piece of crap fade away and it would have had not Dems wanted to and rightly assumed they could pass any piece of shiat they wanted and have it rubber stamped by a SCOTHUS that hadn't found anything unconstitutional from 1937 until 1995.
 
2012-07-06 04:14:11 PM  

randomjsa: When 50.1% of the people turned against the Iraq war, it was time to shut it down and pull out completely but no matter how many people are against ObamaCare, it's never time to listen to the will of the people.


Kaiser Family Foundation (via Daily Kos, July 2): 56% say opponents of the law should "stop their efforts to block the law and move on to other national problems," whereas 38% say opponents should "continue trying to block the law from being implemented."
 
2012-07-06 04:22:02 PM  

L82DPRT: Aldon: All these 'conservatives' predicting doom and gloom with Obamacare; insurance companies going out of business, lines for healthcare, and it just being a general clusterfark....

Is this stuff happening in Mass. and I haven't heard of it or are you guys just pulling this stuff out of your arse?

We pretty much know what is going to happen with Obamacare, we have the model in Mass. with the virtually identical Romneycare.

Longer wait times with the highest average HC premiums in the country.


Really?
 
2012-07-06 05:57:23 PM  

Aldon: L82DPRT: Aldon: All these 'conservatives' predicting doom and gloom with Obamacare; insurance companies going out of business, lines for healthcare, and it just being a general clusterfark....

Is this stuff happening in Mass. and I haven't heard of it or are you guys just pulling this stuff out of your arse?

We pretty much know what is going to happen with Obamacare, we have the model in Mass. with the virtually identical Romneycare.

Longer wait times with the highest average HC premiums in the country.

Really?


So lower premiums for the subsidized beneficiaries of Romneycare, not so much for everyone else and "48th lowest state in the nation in healthcare expenditures" not 50th. What a deceptive way to say 3rd highest.

Longer wait times for primary care but Medicaid is going to quit grossly underpaying for primary care services to encourage more to get into primary care but surely that is not a cost cutting measure.

Quit screwing GPs who treat the poor. Great. No mention of how much said screwing by the State in Medicaid reimbursements relative to Medicare reimbursements DISCOURAGES GPs from providing said care.

Got it.
 
2012-07-06 08:57:41 PM  

L82DPRT: Dr. Mojo PhD: randomjsa: Obama and his fellow Democrats are that benevolent and did not design this plan for any noble purpose.

Does that sentence make sense to you Moj?

Dr. Mojo PhD: a pure, dyed-in-the-wool, black-hating, gay-murdering conservative like you

FARK YOU, Moj.

If the mandate is so great why don't Dems and our Constitutionally Challenged Constitutional Scholar own it? It's 100% Dem passed. It's theirs. Completely. They should have let this piece of crap fade away and it would have had not Dems wanted to and rightly assumed they could pass any piece of shiat they wanted and have it rubber stamped by a SCOTHUS that hadn't found anything unconstitutional from 1937 until 1995.


The fact is, the Democrats said to the Republicans, "Hey, let's try it your way! Surely you would agree to using the plan you came up with, right?" And the Republicans said, "That's socialism! Death panels! Why are you shoving this down our throats?!"
 
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  1. Links are submitted by members of the Fark community.

  2. When community members submit a link, they also write a custom headline for the story.

  3. Other Farkers comment on the links. This is the number of comments. Click here to read them.

  4. Click here to submit a link.

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