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(Talking Points Memo)   Turns out, the states that are trying to battle Obamacare have the highest number of uninsured residents   (tpmdc.talkingpointsmemo.com) divider line 161
    More: Obvious, obamacare, United States, Kaiser Family Foundation, universal health care  
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2862 clicks; posted to Politics » on 05 Jul 2012 at 1:25 PM (2 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2012-07-05 09:40:45 AM
That's because they're the most bootstrappy.
 
2012-07-05 09:46:28 AM
I'm moving to Georgia with my cousin and starting a business where we use the trunk of a '69 Dodge Charge to smuggle free-market doctors across the county line.
 
2012-07-05 09:47:13 AM
Dodge only made six of the Charge, you know. The ChargeR was after they went all corporate.
 
2012-07-05 09:53:25 AM
Turns out that the states trying to battle Obamacare are at the bottom of the rankings for a lot of things.
 
2012-07-05 09:53:41 AM
Wait. Are you using the 3/5 compromise, subby?
 
2012-07-05 09:56:01 AM
My state has a measure that will appear on the ballot this fall that would forbid the setup of an insurance exchange by the state. I can pretty much guarantee it will pass.
 
2012-07-05 09:56:40 AM

Mr. Coffee Nerves: Dodge only made six of the Charge, you know. The ChargeR was after they went all corporate.


The R stands for "Racin"
 
2012-07-05 09:58:38 AM

Mr. Coffee Nerves: I'm moving to Georgia with my cousin and starting a business where we use the trunk of a '69 Dodge Charge to smuggle free-market doctors across the county line.


watch out when fleeing the sheriff not to jump too many ravines. you might injure the doctors.
 
2012-07-05 10:26:16 AM

Sybarite: My state has a measure that will appear on the ballot this fall that would forbid the setup of an insurance exchange by the state. I can pretty much guarantee it will pass.


An insurance exchange?

Insurance exchanges are the classic entryway to a fascist state. That way lies madness.
 
2012-07-05 10:35:09 AM
A 73 Dodge Duster passed me on the highway yesterday, heading south. He was probably part of this Doctors for Southerners smuggling already. He definitely looked like he was going places.
 
2012-07-05 10:37:16 AM

Generation_D: A 73 Dodge Duster passed me on the highway yesterday, heading south. He was probably part of this Doctors for Southerners smuggling already. He definitely looked like he was going places.


When you criminalize health insurance only criminals will have health insurance.
 
2012-07-05 10:40:47 AM
Why am I thinking so small with just a trunkful of doctors in a Charger?

I'm going to get a Trans Am to run interference so the Death Panel Enforcement Squad doesn't notice the tractor-trailer packed to the brim with doctors who'll only charge a few chickens to treat combine harvester injuries with Vitamin Jesus
 
2012-07-05 11:31:24 AM
We'll worry about the uninsured folks later...now get out of my shell.

media.reason.com
 
2012-07-05 11:55:19 AM

Mr. Coffee Nerves: Why am I thinking so small with just a trunkful of doctors in a Charger?

I'm going to get a Trans Am to run interference so the Death Panel Enforcement Squad doesn't notice the tractor-trailer packed to the brim with doctors who'll only charge a few chickens to treat combine harvester injuries with Vitamin Jesus


Just be careful, the ATF is investigating docwalking. Just last week one of them was accidentally treated by one of these docs.
 
2012-07-05 11:59:39 AM

bdub77: Mr. Coffee Nerves: Why am I thinking so small with just a trunkful of doctors in a Charger?

I'm going to get a Trans Am to run interference so the Death Panel Enforcement Squad doesn't notice the tractor-trailer packed to the brim with doctors who'll only charge a few chickens to treat combine harvester injuries with Vitamin Jesus

Just be careful, the ATF is investigating docwalking. Just last week one of them was accidentally treated by one of these docs.


Poor guy. Now his name is Mudd.
 
2012-07-05 12:00:30 PM
This is one of those times where I look to the state south of me and say "thank god I'm not them".

/I'm sure Michigan does the same thing
 
2012-07-05 12:10:31 PM

Aarontology: Turns out that the states trying to battle Obamacare are at the bottom of the rankings for a lot of things.


religions.pewforum.org
 
2012-07-05 12:14:24 PM

abb3w: [religions.pewforum.org image 406x356]


Arkansas won't be turning down Obamacare, luckily enough.
 
2012-07-05 12:23:28 PM
That's not the issue, Subby. Or so I've been told by the Minority Leader in the Senate.
 
2012-07-05 12:44:07 PM
Results from an interesting poll by the Kaiser Family Foundation are here.

Lessons:
1) People who do poorly on a quiz about what is in PPACA really dislike PPACA.
2) People who rely on Fox News as their primary news source do really poorly (worse than random guessing) on a quiz about what is in PPACA.
3) 40% of respondents thought "death panels" were a real thing.

Take the 10-question quiz here.
 
2012-07-05 12:44:41 PM
Of course. That just proves that they don't need Obamacare, they're doing just fine the way they are.

Sick people should just die the way they're supposed to. All this modern "medicine" and "treatments" and "doctors" just interfere with God's natural plans for people.

Unless they're rich, of course. Then God wants doctors to do whatever is necessary to keep them alive as long as possible.
 
2012-07-05 12:59:32 PM

chimp_ninja: Results from an interesting poll by the Kaiser Family Foundation are here.

Lessons:
1) People who do poorly on a quiz about what is in PPACA really dislike PPACA.
2) People who rely on Fox News as their primary news source do really poorly (worse than random guessing) on a quiz about what is in PPACA.
3) 40% of respondents thought "death panels" were a real thing.

Take the 10-question quiz here.


The key takeaway is that women and old people are dumb. And considering how many people on fark got 10/10...it's pretty amazing how dumb other people are. I mean in a survey with 10 questions and only two possible answers per question (if you don't count I don't know which is an automatic 0) farking monkeys have better probability outcomes...it's quite mind boggling.
 
2012-07-05 01:07:33 PM
turns out they have a lot of medicare patients too and the thought of having to do more without government reimbursement will bankrupt them
 
2012-07-05 01:12:14 PM

chimp_ninja: Results from an interesting poll by the Kaiser Family Foundation are here.

Lessons:
1) People who do poorly on a quiz about what is in PPACA really dislike PPACA.
2) People who rely on Fox News as their primary news source do really poorly (worse than random guessing) on a quiz about what is in PPACA.
3) 40% of respondents thought "death panels" were a real thing.

Take the 10-question quiz here.


I just got a 10 out of 10. Not a single one of those questions was difficult to answer, or misleading in any way. If you've been paying any attention you should be getting almost all of them correct.
 
2012-07-05 01:12:26 PM

chimp_ninja: Results from an interesting poll by the Kaiser Family Foundation are here.

Lessons:
1) People who do poorly on a quiz about what is in PPACA really dislike PPACA.
2) People who rely on Fox News as their primary news source do really poorly (worse than random guessing) on a quiz about what is in PPACA.
3) 40% of respondents thought "death panels" were a real thing.

Take the 10-question quiz here.


Yeah, this was a thread a few days ago. Farkers, it turned out, were pretty well versed in what is in the Act, a lot of us got "You answered 10 out of 10 questions correctly, better than 99.6% of Americans."
 
2012-07-05 01:13:01 PM

Sybarite: My state has a measure that will appear on the ballot this fall that would forbid the setup of an insurance exchange by the state. I can pretty much guarantee it will pass.


Oregon on the other hand just about has their's up. Link
 
2012-07-05 01:18:11 PM

chimp_ninja: Results from an interesting poll by the Kaiser Family Foundation are here.

Lessons:
1) People who do poorly on a quiz about what is in PPACA really dislike PPACA.
2) People who rely on Fox News as their primary news source do really poorly (worse than random guessing) on a quiz about what is in PPACA.
3) 40% of respondents thought "death panels" were a real thing.

Take the 10-question quiz here.


I highlighted the most interesting aspect to me. This means you can literally say Fox viewers are more ignorant than ("anything here") and the statement would be true.
 
2012-07-05 01:19:57 PM

chimp_ninja: 3) 40% of respondents thought "death panels" were a real thing.


I can't believe that there are questions on there that got 25% correct answer rates. Unbelievable.
 
2012-07-05 01:20:59 PM

chimp_ninja: Results from an interesting poll by the Kaiser Family Foundation are here.

Lessons:
1) People who do poorly on a quiz about what is in PPACA really dislike PPACA.
2) People who rely on Fox News as their primary news source do really poorly (worse than random guessing) on a quiz about what is in PPACA.
3) 40% of respondents thought "death panels" were a real thing.

Take the 10-question quiz here.


"You answered 10 out of 10 questions correctly, better than 99.6% of Americans."

/Canadian
 
2012-07-05 01:26:21 PM

SphericalTime: chimp_ninja: 3) 40% of respondents thought "death panels" were a real thing.

I can't believe that there are questions on there that got 25% correct answer rates. Unbelievable.


It doesn't surprise me. People like Bachman and other Conservatives have been continually saying the complete opposite to most of these points. If Conservatives are truly following the right-wing speaking points, they shouldn't be getting more than a quarter of them correct.
 
2012-07-05 01:26:45 PM
They also have high obesity rates, std rates, lowest IQs.

Basically Republicans.
 
2012-07-05 01:27:34 PM
Um, forgive me if I'm wrong here, but wouldn't it be kind of expected for a law to be opposed mainly by people who would (at least in their own perception) be affected by it?
 
2012-07-05 01:29:30 PM
Turns out, the states that are trying to battle Obamacare have the highest number of uninsured residents FREEDOM

FTFY, commiemitter.
 
2012-07-05 01:29:53 PM
Of course they are against it. They would finally have to pay a little into the system rather than freeload through the emergency room and have those of us that can afford to pay the doctor foot portions of their bills.
 
2012-07-05 01:30:25 PM
F*ck them, then. Voters in those states get what they vote for.

Like my parents b*tching about Obamacare just weeks after one of them was able to get surgery THANKS TO OBAMACARE.

Republican propaganda is effective.
 
2012-07-05 01:30:45 PM

chimp_ninja: Results from an interesting poll by the Kaiser Family Foundation are here.

Lessons:
1) People who do poorly on a quiz about what is in PPACA really dislike PPACA.
2) People who rely on Fox News as their primary news source do really poorly (worse than random guessing) on a quiz about what is in PPACA.
3) 40% of respondents thought "death panels" were a real thing.

Take the 10-question quiz here.


You answered 10 out of 10 questions correctly, better than 99.6% of Americans.

/American
//unhappily in Missouri
 
2012-07-05 01:31:06 PM
hotcareers.com
 
2012-07-05 01:31:26 PM
Great, emotional shot of Gov. Bat Boy. You can't help but notice the loneliness. Stare a little longer and you will see the desperate pleading for someone, anyone, to be his friend.
 
2012-07-05 01:32:01 PM
ct.fra.bz
 
2012-07-05 01:33:06 PM
I'm surprised no one took a big fat dump on this thread yet.
 
2012-07-05 01:33:44 PM
Won't that make it cheaper nationwide?

Southern states = poorer states = fatter states = more uninsured states

So they'd need more federal funds to combat a higher incidence of health problems over a larger un- (or under-) insured population anyway? How is is bad for the rest of us if they refuse to get less of our tax dollars?

// I mean, except for the morans fighting against their own interests and putting themselves at greater health risk
 
2012-07-05 01:34:03 PM

Arkanaut: Turns out, the states that are trying to battle Obamacare have the highest number of uninsured residents FREEDOM

FTFY, commiemitter.


"We shall wrap all wounds in the American flag, which will quickly regenerate all injured flesh and provide a sweet, slightly citrus-like smell to those in the immediate area. Bald eagles - which naturally gather around any incarnation of the American flag - will then gently carry to the patient to a bed, where they shall exercise their mandatory second amendment rights. "
 
2012-07-05 01:34:20 PM
It seems the health care debate has turned into a health insurance debate. What's the core issue is cost, not necessarily insurance.
 
2012-07-05 01:34:21 PM

mrshowrules: SphericalTime: chimp_ninja: 3) 40% of respondents thought "death panels" were a real thing.

I can't believe that there are questions on there that got 25% correct answer rates. Unbelievable.

It doesn't surprise me. People like Bachman and other Conservatives have been continually saying the complete opposite to most of these points. If Conservatives are truly following the right-wing speaking points, they shouldn't be getting more than a quarter of them correct.


The 25% was among Americans, not just conservatives. That means that half of the independents and liberals got those particular questions wrong as well.
 
2012-07-05 01:35:04 PM
I got 9 out of 10, haven't read the thing, and I'm not an American. So people failing this have to be really dumb

/got #5 wrong, for the record.
 
2012-07-05 01:35:56 PM

Mr. Coffee Nerves: Dodge only made six of the Charge, you know. The ChargeR was after they went all corporate.


Since you're smuggling doctors, it should be rebranded ChargeRx, for synergy and stuff, you know.
 
2012-07-05 01:36:05 PM

SphericalTime: chimp_ninja: 3) 40% of respondents thought "death panels" were a real thing.

I can't believe that there are questions on there that got 25% correct answer rates. Unbelievable.


And it probably plays out like this

10. Will the health reform law allow undocumented immigrants to receive financial help from the government to buy health insurance?
Republican Quiz Taker: "Yes"
Quiz: Incorrect
RQT: "It will too! This quiz is wrong! Run by liberals!"
Joe Wilson: You lie!
 
2012-07-05 01:36:59 PM

chimp_ninja: Results from an interesting poll by the Kaiser Family Foundation are here.

Lessons:
1) People who do poorly on a quiz about what is in PPACA really dislike PPACA.
2) People who rely on Fox News as their primary news source do really poorly (worse than random guessing) on a quiz about what is in PPACA.
3) 40% of respondents thought "death panels" were a real thing.

Take the 10-question quiz here.


9/10. Answered don't know on the expanding Medicaid part as I thought that was overturned by SCOTUS
 
2012-07-05 01:40:01 PM

Millennium: Um, forgive me if I'm wrong here, but wouldn't it be kind of expected for a law to be opposed mainly by people who would (at least in their own perception) be affected by it?


Well, there are two misapprehensions, one is that they'll be affected by it (and they might not be) but the second is that being affected by it will have a negative effect on their life.

Both need to be wrong to have a negative opinion of the law, and apparently most people have do in fact have a negative opinion of the law.

Dr Dreidel: Won't that make it cheaper nationwide?

Southern states = poorer states = fatter states = more uninsured states

So they'd need more federal funds to combat a higher incidence of health problems over a larger un- (or under-) insured population anyway? How is is bad for the rest of us if they refuse to get less of our tax dollars?

// I mean, except for the morans fighting against their own interests and putting themselves at greater health risk


As a liberal, it hurts me to see people getting screwed by their political beliefs. We have a moral obligation to do what is best for our society after seeing to our own needs because we would hope the same care and comfort would be given to us. As a realist, it hurts me even more that I have to pay for their idiocy as they fight higher levels of insurance coverage.
 
2012-07-05 01:40:14 PM
This is one of those things I just can't even begin to understand. How can a group of people as large as a state's voting bloc be so naive as to do something like this when their state is the beneficiary. The only thing I can even begin to think that could cause this type of behavior is the mistaken belief that if people less well off than you have their standard of living improved that it somehow detracts from your own.

I just don't get it. I don't get how or why these people are so insistent upon shooting themselves in the foot. We're willing to spend hundreds of billions of dollars to fight foreign wars that leave us with nothing but wounded veterans and deep debts but we're not willing to spend a little to improve the lives of American citizens within our own borders?

It's just mind boggling....
 
2012-07-05 01:41:27 PM
Obamacare was put into effect with blunt force trauma, like a doctor performing intricate brain surgery with a long handled shovel. The proceedure cracked the skull and killed the patient with the first big swing, as surely as a surgically placed bullet from the gun of a skilled assassin. In this case the assassin wore a black rope, and his gun was a black ink pen held behind a tall bench in the highest court of the land.
 
2012-07-05 01:41:49 PM

LucklessWonder: chimp_ninja: Results from an interesting poll by the Kaiser Family Foundation are here.

Lessons:
1) People who do poorly on a quiz about what is in PPACA really dislike PPACA.
2) People who rely on Fox News as their primary news source do really poorly (worse than random guessing) on a quiz about what is in PPACA.
3) 40% of respondents thought "death panels" were a real thing.

Take the 10-question quiz here.

9/10. Answered don't know on the expanding Medicaid part as I thought that was overturned by SCOTUS


If I understand it correctly, it wasn't exactly overturned. They made it optional instead of mandatory, but the general expansion is still there.
 
2012-07-05 01:41:55 PM

Vegan Meat Popsicle: The only thing I can even begin to think that could cause this type of behavior is the mistaken belief that if people less well off than you have their standard of living improved that it somehow detracts from your own.


That's exactly it. The same people are also the ones that see gay marriage as an affront to their own.
 
2012-07-05 01:42:59 PM

Vegan Meat Popsicle: I just don't get it. I don't get how or why these people are so insistent upon shooting themselves in the foot.


It seems like they've turned "personal responsibility" into a denial of society.
 
2012-07-05 01:45:20 PM
Above all, I will not comply.

I will not purchase your shiny tokens that contribute to my own demise.

Obamacare may be the law of the land, but it's mandate will not become part of my individual landscape. I refuse to let it's pox visit my house. The responsibility and condition of my health, and my health care, belong to me, and to the people who truly care. It does not belong to the flashy carnival barkers or your rabid and slobbering junkyard dogs.
 
2012-07-05 01:45:38 PM
i.imgur.com
 
2012-07-05 01:45:40 PM

LucklessWonder: 9/10. Answered don't know on the expanding Medicaid part as I thought that was overturned by SCOTUS


The states still have the option to expand Medicaid, paid at first 100% by the feds, then reduced to 90%.

The SCOTUS ruled that the feds still have to offer the existing Medicaid program as well. Their reasoning was that the expanded Medicaid is actually an entire new program, and the feds can't try to get the states to participate in the new program by removing the old program.
 
2012-07-05 01:45:42 PM

SphericalTime: LucklessWonder: chimp_ninja: Results from an interesting poll by the Kaiser Family Foundation are here.

Lessons:
1) People who do poorly on a quiz about what is in PPACA really dislike PPACA.
2) People who rely on Fox News as their primary news source do really poorly (worse than random guessing) on a quiz about what is in PPACA.
3) 40% of respondents thought "death panels" were a real thing.

Take the 10-question quiz here.

9/10. Answered don't know on the expanding Medicaid part as I thought that was overturned by SCOTUS

If I understand it correctly, it wasn't exactly overturned. They made it optional instead of mandatory, but the general expansion is still there.


Ah, okay. I wasn't entirely sure, and it's been hard to filter facts out of the partisan caterwauling, which is why i went with an honest "don't know" there. Of course, I imagine my state won't take the option because it's a state that votes for festering boils such as Eric Cantor, Bob McDonnell and AG Cuccinelli
 
2012-07-05 01:46:07 PM
Oh. And I got 10/10 on the quiz. It deeply disturbs me that that majority of people are getting anything less. Those are all very basic and very obvious things in the law that everyone should know and if you get anything less you probably shouldn't have an opinion on it yet.

That anybody who can vote is getting less than say 7/10 is distressing. That the vast majority of people are getting less than that is outright terrifying.

That anybody thinks "death panels" are a real thing is just.... just mind-boggling.
 
2012-07-05 01:46:42 PM

SphericalTime: Vegan Meat Popsicle: I just don't get it. I don't get how or why these people are so insistent upon shooting themselves in the foot.

It seems like they've turned "personal responsibility" into a denial of society.


they are pro i can shoot myself in the foot if i want to, but you can't do that in the bedroom...
 
2012-07-05 01:47:19 PM

Aarontology: Turns out that the states trying to battle Obamacare are at the bottom of the rankings for a lot of things.


Overall, among farkers ACA turns out to be pretty popular.

www.myqwip.com
(click on image to vote in new window)

Now for the breakdown city by city, guess where the votes lie? Click Here.
 
2012-07-05 01:47:24 PM

Deftoons: It seems the health care debate has turned into a health insurance debate. What's the core issue is cost, not necessarily insurance.


Well, yeah, it has. There's nowhere near enough political will to, say, enforce strict price caps on what doctors can charge (what the inexplicably-libertarian-boner-producing microstate of Singapore does). Or do any of a hundred other things to fight costs per se.

So, we have to go for second- and third-order effects. Ugly. PPACA will eventually lead to a decent portion of the population in 'exchange' plans, where there's at least a tiny bit of market competition. Most Americans see zero competition, since they get their plans at work and don't choose their jobs based on the insurance provider. Massachusetts is the most competitive insurance market in the country.

The ideal, then, is that competing in price means that the insurers will fight for a good deal. Or threaten to break the network affiliation. The reality is that it's harder than that. Much medicine is hospital-based. In most places under 100,000, there's one hospital. No one will sign up for a plan that doesn't cover any hospital within 30 miles of them. So, that hospital continues to have near-monopoly pricing powers. Even in bigger areas people don't usually choose plans that limit them to, say, two of the five hospitals in a big city. And, with the medical-loss-ratio component of the law, the insurer has mixed incentives. Lower premiums might get more clients. But, 20% legal overhead on $5 Tylenols is better than 20% legal overhead on 20c Tylenols.

It's far from great. But, it really will help certain populations get into the system. And it lays the framework for some states to go single-payer/public option in time.
 
2012-07-05 01:47:46 PM
[W]e have to remember that this is an ideological and even a moral issue to conservatives, who view dependence on any form of public assistance as eroding the "moral fiber" of the poor (as Paul Ryan likes to put it), and as corrupting the country through empowerment of big government as a redistributor of wealth from virtuous taxpayers to parasites who will perpetually vote themselves more of other people's money. This line of "reasoning," of course, would justify the abolition of Medicaid, not just a failure to expand it, but conservatives are careful (and smart) to disguise that ultimate goal and simply suggest we have reached some sort of welfare-state tipping point beyond which we become Greece. Link
 
2012-07-05 01:48:52 PM
The one thing that Republicans continue to do really well is to constantly get just enough average people to vote against their own best interests. It never ceases to amaze me.

The rest of the world must be laughing their asses off at us. We can build a new nuclear SuperCarrier every few years, along with spacecraft, submarines, unbelievable aircraft and deploy & sustain huge military units in South Korea, Japan, Germany, Afghanistan, the Middle East, England, Italy and many other countries for decades at stretch.

We have more billionaires and millionaires than any other country and yet when it comes to getting basic healthcare to the common folks we look like a bunch of retards trying to hump a dooknob.

Seriouly America, EVERYBODY else has figured this out. Yet you still cower in fear of the boogey-men that Rush Limbaugh and Glenn Beck pullout of their asses. Get your act together America.
 
2012-07-05 01:51:58 PM
The US spends at least $600 every second on the so-called "War on Drugs"

How many people do drugs kill each year (the drugs themselves, not gang wars) and how many people does a crappy medical/health insurance system kill each year? I.E. which is the bigger threat to American lives?

The US could drastically lower medical/health costs by going to a universal system and implementing wide-spread preventative care, but I'm sure Republicans would find a way to claim that's being a nanny state or something of the sort.
 
2012-07-05 01:53:40 PM
And in a few years when more and more get sick and then go bankrupt with medical bills, they will pitch a biatch and the same state leaders who opt'ed out their state will tell them its all Obama's fault. AND THEY WILL BELIEVE IT!

/Live from Florida; my state sucks.
// If you do saw it off let me know.
 
2012-07-05 01:57:54 PM

Virulency: SphericalTime: Vegan Meat Popsicle: I just don't get it. I don't get how or why these people are so insistent upon shooting themselves in the foot.

It seems like they've turned "personal responsibility" into a denial of society.

they are pro i can shoot myself in the foot if i want to, but you can't do that in the bedroom...


"You can't tell me what to do, and that includes telling me to stop telling you what to do!"

Everyone usually likes the idea of being a dictator if they're the dictator.
 
2012-07-05 02:00:18 PM

timujin: Farkers, it turned out, were pretty well versed in what is in the Act


And I note once more, it's quite disturbing that Fark apparently tends to be more informative than News.

beerspill.fark.com
 
2012-07-05 02:01:11 PM

Vegan Meat Popsicle: This is one of those things I just can't even begin to understand. How can a group of people as large as a state's voting bloc be so naive as to do something like this when their state is the beneficiary. The only thing I can even begin to think that could cause this type of behavior is the mistaken belief that if people less well off than you have their standard of living improved that it somehow detracts from your own.

I just don't get it. I don't get how or why these people are so insistent upon shooting themselves in the foot. We're willing to spend hundreds of billions of dollars to fight foreign wars that leave us with nothing but wounded veterans and deep debts but we're not willing to spend a little to improve the lives of American citizens within our own borders?

It's just mind boggling....


Lack of education combined with a willingness to blindly follow authority*

*unless they're black
 
2012-07-05 02:02:52 PM
Hospital conglomerates make generous campaign contributions in Florida. One of the most generous is HCA, which Rick Scott used to run. They have been very generous to Republican candidates, especially ones that educated people might call "extreme."

The influence of their contributions can be seen in how Florida is now going to managed care for Medicaid.

But, HCA hospitals (and all others) lose a lot of money when someone is poor and uninsured.

They will almost certainly give their money, this time, to candidates that favor expansion of Medicaid. This will be true in state legislative races in 2012, and in the governor's race in 2014.

In other words, Rick and other governors of his ilk have a very small window of time before they start to lose their benefactors. Looking like a partisan hardass on TV may play well for votes, but it's not going to get you advertising time in October, not this time.
 
2012-07-05 02:03:16 PM
Aarontology: Turns out that the states trying to battle Obamacare are at the bottom of the rankings for a lot of things.

I'm guessing "gap between rich and poor" is not one of those things.
 
2012-07-05 02:03:17 PM

chimp_ninja: Results from an interesting poll by the Kaiser Family Foundation are here.

Lessons:
1) People who do poorly on a quiz about what is in PPACA really dislike PPACA.
2) People who rely on Fox News as their primary news source do really poorly (worse than random guessing) on a quiz about what is in PPACA.
3) 40% of respondents thought "death panels" were a real thing.

Take the 10-question quiz here.


100% what do I win?
 
2012-07-05 02:05:14 PM

pat34us: chimp_ninja: Results from an interesting poll by the Kaiser Family Foundation are here.

Lessons:
1) People who do poorly on a quiz about what is in PPACA really dislike PPACA.
2) People who rely on Fox News as their primary news source do really poorly (worse than random guessing) on a quiz about what is in PPACA.
3) 40% of respondents thought "death panels" were a real thing.

Take the 10-question quiz here.

100% what do I win?


Knowledge is its own reward.

/also a smug sense of superiority on the internet
 
2012-07-05 02:05:17 PM

bdub77: chimp_ninja: Results from an interesting poll by the Kaiser Family Foundation are here.

Lessons:
1) People who do poorly on a quiz about what is in PPACA really dislike PPACA.
2) People who rely on Fox News as their primary news source do really poorly (worse than random guessing) on a quiz about what is in PPACA.
3) 40% of respondents thought "death panels" were a real thing.

Take the 10-question quiz here.

The key takeaway is that women and old people are dumb. And considering how many people on fark got 10/10...it's pretty amazing how dumb other people are. I mean in a survey with 10 questions and only two possible answers per question (if you don't count I don't know which is an automatic 0) farking monkeys have better probability outcomes...it's quite mind boggling.


What the hell?? How does this prove women are dumb? I hope you're trolling.
 
2012-07-05 02:06:15 PM

Aarontology: Turns out that the states trying to battle Obamacare are at the bottom of the rankings for a lot of things.


Their worst nightmare is that the blue states actually start listening to them and finally cut them off the federal teat. The Republican party would collapse within a year.
 
2012-07-05 02:09:32 PM
Nothing says Teabagger/GOP by vehemently fighting something that is actually intended, and stands a least a halfway decent shot, at helping them.
 
2012-07-05 02:10:34 PM
With such blatant evidence that nothing that the GOP does is good for their constituents, is it any wonder that they use Jesus as a weapon for propaganda like Lindsay Lohan uses Lifetime for coke?
 
2012-07-05 02:11:54 PM

abb3w: timujin: Farkers, it turned out, were pretty well versed in what is in the Act

And I note once more, it's quite disturbing that Fark apparently tends to be more informative than News.

[beerspill.fark.com image 226x100]


It's not news, it's links.... to news.
 
2012-07-05 02:25:52 PM

Aarontology: Turns out that the states trying to battle Obamacare are at the bottom of the rankings for a lot of things.


Like the map?

Tip your waitress.
 
2012-07-05 02:28:24 PM

Rich Cream: Above all, I will not comply.

I will not purchase your shiny tokens that contribute to my own demise.

Obamacare may be the law of the land, but it's mandate will not become part of my individual landscape. I refuse to let it's pox visit my house. The responsibility and condition of my health, and my health care, belong to me, and to the people who truly care. It does not belong to the flashy carnival barkers or your rabid and slobbering junkyard dogs.


Here. I've given you what you want. Happy?
 
2012-07-05 02:35:31 PM

GentDirkly: Aarontology: Turns out that the states trying to battle Obamacare are at the bottom of the rankings for a lot of things.

Like the map?

Tip your waitress.


Wow, you really want us to pull up stats to prove that? Jesus, you are either a troll (most likely) or a glutton for punishment.
 
2012-07-05 02:36:22 PM

Edsel: Aarontology: Turns out that the states trying to battle Obamacare are at the bottom of the rankings for a lot of things.

Their worst nightmare is that the blue states actually start listening to them and finally cut them off the federal teat. The Republican party would collapse within a year.


This is going to sound very Confederacy-esque, but I've been wondering for a while if it would be possible for blue states to form some sort of association to protect their interests against the red states. Something that says, "Yes, we'll still send Reps and Senators to Congress and pay our federal taxes and all that jazz, but otherwise we're going to work together directly to see that Republican policies have as little impact as possible on our states."

They could do things like:

1) Offer state-funded tuition assistance to college students from other blue states, while taxing red-state students to help fund primary education.

2) Coordinate to vote for lower federal taxes while simultaneously raising state taxes (if necessary) to pay for things like state-wide universal healthcare.

. . . well, those are the only two ideas I have so far, and I'm not even sure if they are constitutional. All I know is that I'm sick of blue states having to go along with backwards Teabagger policies just because we're stuck in this unhappy marriage called the United States.
 
2012-07-05 02:37:58 PM

mrshowrules: you can literally say Fox viewers are more ignorant than ("anything here") and the statement would be true.


No, they're just more well infromed than you fancy book learners.
 
2012-07-05 02:38:43 PM
Well duh, the people in those states are obviously wealthy enough to pay their medical expenses out of pocket.
 
2012-07-05 02:39:39 PM

SphericalTime: mrshowrules: SphericalTime: chimp_ninja: 3) 40% of respondents thought "death panels" were a real thing.

I can't believe that there are questions on there that got 25% correct answer rates. Unbelievable.

It doesn't surprise me. People like Bachman and other Conservatives have been continually saying the complete opposite to most of these points. If Conservatives are truly following the right-wing speaking points, they shouldn't be getting more than a quarter of them correct.

The 25% was among Americans, not just conservatives. That means that half of the independents and liberals got those particular questions wrong as well.


Everytime I turn on CNN, Bachman is blabbering away. Conservatives are clearly winning the propaganda war on both sides politically. They old rule of making the lie as big as possible. Some people will believe the big lie, others will assume it just exaggerated

Bachman: Obamacare will destroy all small businesses.

What people believe:
1) Tea Party: Yes, this is true
2) Conservatives: it will be very bad for most small businesses
3) Independents/Moderates: it might hurt many small businesses
4) Liberals: the impact to small businesses will me minor
5) Truth: Obamacare does not apply to small businesses
 
2012-07-05 02:41:01 PM

The Name: Edsel: Aarontology: Turns out that the states trying to battle Obamacare are at the bottom of the rankings for a lot of things.

Their worst nightmare is that the blue states actually start listening to them and finally cut them off the federal teat. The Republican party would collapse within a year.

This is going to sound very Confederacy-esque, but I've been wondering for a while if it would be possible for blue states to form some sort of association to protect their interests against the red states. Something that says, "Yes, we'll still send Reps and Senators to Congress and pay our federal taxes and all that jazz, but otherwise we're going to work together directly to see that Republican policies have as little impact as possible on our states."

They could do things like:

1) Offer state-funded tuition assistance to college students from other blue states, while taxing red-state students to help fund primary education.

2) Coordinate to vote for lower federal taxes while simultaneously raising state taxes (if necessary) to pay for things like state-wide universal healthcare.

. . . well, those are the only two ideas I have so far, and I'm not even sure if they are constitutional. All I know is that I'm sick of blue states having to go along with backwards Teabagger policies just because we're stuck in this unhappy marriage called the United States.


We could do that by simply passing a law that states that the federal government cannot spend more money in any given state than that state provides in federal revenues.

Come to think of it, that would be a fantastic bill for a "fiscal conservative" to introduce. Imagine the mental gymnastics from the Tea Party Caucus.
 
2012-07-05 02:41:53 PM

highbrow45: Well duh, the people in those states are obviously wealthy enough to pay their medical expenses out of pocket.


True story. If you haven't had an appendectomy done with a Bowie knife in a deer stand... you've probably paid too much!
 
2012-07-05 02:42:22 PM

LucklessWonder: 9/10. Answered don't know on the expanding Medicaid part as I thought that was overturned by SCOTUS


Forcing States to take part but denying them other funding is what was overturned. Something along those lines.
 
2012-07-05 02:42:59 PM

mrshowrules: LucklessWonder: 9/10. Answered don't know on the expanding Medicaid part as I thought that was overturned by SCOTUS

Forcing States to take part by denying them other funding is what was overturned. Something along those lines.


FTFM
 
2012-07-05 02:43:34 PM

chimp_ninja: Results from an interesting poll by the Kaiser Family Foundation are here.

Lessons:
1) People who do poorly on a quiz about what is in PPACA really dislike PPACA.
2) People who rely on Fox News as their primary news source do really poorly (worse than random guessing) on a quiz about what is in PPACA.
3) 40% of respondents thought "death panels" were a real thing.

Take the 10-question quiz here.


10 out of 10! oh and I support PPACA and don't watch Fox for news purposes ever. Wouldn'tcha know it.
 
2012-07-05 02:45:25 PM

coeyagi: GentDirkly: Aarontology: Turns out that the states trying to battle Obamacare are at the bottom of the rankings for a lot of things.

Like the map?

Tip your waitress.

Wow, you really want us to pull up stats to prove that? Jesus, you are either a troll (most likely) or a glutton for punishment.


I interpreted it as a joke about how the states trying to battle Obamacare were at the actual bottom of the map. You know, the South.
 
2012-07-05 02:50:00 PM

qorkfiend: coeyagi: GentDirkly: Aarontology: Turns out that the states trying to battle Obamacare are at the bottom of the rankings for a lot of things.

Like the map?

Tip your waitress.

Wow, you really want us to pull up stats to prove that? Jesus, you are either a troll (most likely) or a glutton for punishment.

I interpreted it as a joke about how the states trying to battle Obamacare were at the actual bottom of the map. You know, the South.


I did too, but he was trolling around in another thread last week or earlier this week.
 
2012-07-05 02:54:20 PM

Duke Phillips' Singing Bears:
Here. I've given you what you want. Happy?


I laughed, so, yeah, I guess so.
 
2012-07-05 02:55:04 PM

doyner: The Name: Edsel: Aarontology: Turns out that the states trying to battle Obamacare are at the bottom of the rankings for a lot of things.

Their worst nightmare is that the blue states actually start listening to them and finally cut them off the federal teat. The Republican party would collapse within a year.

This is going to sound very Confederacy-esque, but I've been wondering for a while if it would be possible for blue states to form some sort of association to protect their interests against the red states. Something that says, "Yes, we'll still send Reps and Senators to Congress and pay our federal taxes and all that jazz, but otherwise we're going to work together directly to see that Republican policies have as little impact as possible on our states."

They could do things like:

1) Offer state-funded tuition assistance to college students from other blue states, while taxing red-state students to help fund primary education.

2) Coordinate to vote for lower federal taxes while simultaneously raising state taxes (if necessary) to pay for things like state-wide universal healthcare.

. . . well, those are the only two ideas I have so far, and I'm not even sure if they are constitutional. All I know is that I'm sick of blue states having to go along with backwards Teabagger policies just because we're stuck in this unhappy marriage called the United States.

We could do that by simply passing a law that states that the federal government cannot spend more money in any given state than that state provides in federal revenues.

Come to think of it, that would be a fantastic bill for a "fiscal conservative" to introduce. Imagine the mental gymnastics from the Tea Party Caucus.


Not enough popcorn in this world...

It would redefine what epic is
 
2012-07-05 02:57:50 PM

coeyagi: qorkfiend: coeyagi: GentDirkly: Aarontology: Turns out that the states trying to battle Obamacare are at the bottom of the rankings for a lot of things.

Like the map?

Tip your waitress.

Wow, you really want us to pull up stats to prove that? Jesus, you are either a troll (most likely) or a glutton for punishment.

I interpreted it as a joke about how the states trying to battle Obamacare were at the actual bottom of the map. You know, the South.

I did too, but he was trolling around in another thread last week or earlier this week.


I don't troll dude. I just happen to have strident views that infuriate many on certain topics. This topic isn't one of them :).
 
2012-07-05 02:59:15 PM
9/10 on the quiz...

...thought too in-depth for the first one, was wondering if they used fine as a synonym or antonym for tax/credit.

/at least that's my excuse
//and I'm sticking to it
///death panels be damned
 
2012-07-05 03:01:09 PM

GentDirkly: coeyagi: qorkfiend: coeyagi: GentDirkly: Aarontology: Turns out that the states trying to battle Obamacare are at the bottom of the rankings for a lot of things.

Like the map?

Tip your waitress.

Wow, you really want us to pull up stats to prove that? Jesus, you are either a troll (most likely) or a glutton for punishment.

I interpreted it as a joke about how the states trying to battle Obamacare were at the actual bottom of the map. You know, the South.

I did too, but he was trolling around in another thread last week or earlier this week.

I don't troll dude. I just happen to have strident views that infuriate many on certain topics. This topic isn't one of them :).


Fair enough. My apologies.
 
2012-07-05 03:05:10 PM

chimp_ninja: Results from an interesting poll by the Kaiser Family Foundation are here.

Lessons:
1) People who do poorly on a quiz about what is in PPACA really dislike PPACA.
2) People who rely on Fox News as their primary news source do really poorly (worse than random guessing) on a quiz about what is in PPACA.
3) 40% of respondents thought "death panels" were a real thing.

Take the 10-question quiz here.


I explained that poll to my mother-in-law last night. She insisted that the Kaiser Foundation was paid off in order to make Fox News look bad.

/I really didn't know what to say to that.
 
2012-07-05 03:07:06 PM

SphericalTime: I just got a 10 out of 10. Not a single one of those questions was difficult to answer, or misleading in any way. If you've been paying any attention you should be getting almost all of them correct.


I thought that the first question was misleading using the word FINE instead of penalty or tax.
 
2012-07-05 03:09:27 PM

Testiclaw: 9/10 on the quiz...

...thought too in-depth for the first one, was wondering if they used fine as a synonym or antonym for tax/credit.

/at least that's my excuse
//and I'm sticking to it
///death panels be damned


LOL
I had the same problem.
 
2012-07-05 03:09:38 PM

doyner: Come to think of it, that would be a fantastic bill for a "fiscal conservative" to introduce. Imagine the mental gymnastics from the Tea Party Caucus.


If only Democrats knew how to troll . . .
 
2012-07-05 03:10:41 PM

mgshamster: chimp_ninja: Results from an interesting poll by the Kaiser Family Foundation are here.

Lessons:
1) People who do poorly on a quiz about what is in PPACA really dislike PPACA.
2) People who rely on Fox News as their primary news source do really poorly (worse than random guessing) on a quiz about what is in PPACA.
3) 40% of respondents thought "death panels" were a real thing.

Take the 10-question quiz here.

I explained that poll to my mother-in-law last night. She insisted that the Kaiser Foundation was paid off in order to make Fox News look bad.

/I really didn't know what to say to that.


Well, look, I think we can all admit that the quiz was biased. One or two questions were a bit fishy. And it did leave out anything that would make the law look bad. The big difference is that, Fox News looks bad on their own because anyone with any ounce of intelligence can see them lying on a daily basis. KFF's test didn't outright lie but it was selectively favorable to the law. Fox News lies outright about the law and anything else they dislike.
 
2012-07-05 03:12:18 PM
The funniest thing to me is the states banning the creation of a state run exchange...

ok then the federal government runs the exchange in your state....LOL.
 
2012-07-05 03:12:22 PM
Makes sense. Dead people usually vote republican. Or at least almost-dead people do.
 
2012-07-05 03:13:31 PM

Sybarite: My state has a measure that will appear on the ballot this fall that would forbid the setup of an insurance exchange by the state. I can pretty much guarantee it will pass.


that's okay the feds will just set one up for them and the gov and all his buddies won't be able to proffer from it.
 
2012-07-05 03:13:37 PM
Not accepting the Medicaid expansion money is absolutely incredible. It comes with no strings and is paid for by the federal government. Denying millions of people health insurance so that you can score points with the tea party is just disgusting.
 
2012-07-05 03:17:33 PM

thornhill: Not accepting the Medicaid expansion money is absolutely incredible. It comes with no strings and is paid for by the federal government. Denying millions of people health insurance so that you can score points with the tea party is just disgusting.


Not entirely true. A contribution from the state is required. It's 5% at first, then ramps up to 10%, IIRC.
 
2012-07-05 03:17:59 PM

thornhill: Not accepting the Medicaid expansion money is absolutely incredible. It comes with no strings and is paid for by the federal government. Denying millions of people health insurance so that you can score points with the tea party is just disgusting.


they're afraid of Fox Noise and the right wing radio nuts.
 
2012-07-05 03:21:24 PM

thornhill: Not accepting the Medicaid expansion money is absolutely incredible. It comes with no strings and is paid for by the federal government. Denying millions of people health insurance so that you can score points with the tea party is just disgusting.


Yes and no, already states are struggling with Medicare and Medicaid obligations they already have.

Its a tough deal. Now as for the extra money it goes to extra items to help cover individuals and such.

it is what it is. but it will be interesting to see how it goes.
 
2012-07-05 03:22:45 PM

GentDirkly: thornhill: Not accepting the Medicaid expansion money is absolutely incredible. It comes with no strings and is paid for by the federal government. Denying millions of people health insurance so that you can score points with the tea party is just disgusting.

Not entirely true. A contribution from the state is required. It's 5% at first, then ramps up to 10%, IIRC.


I'd say it will be a push because of the money saved on indigent ER care they have to pay for now.
 
2012-07-05 03:28:10 PM

coeyagi: mgshamster: chimp_ninja: Results from an interesting poll by the Kaiser Family Foundation are here.

Lessons:
1) People who do poorly on a quiz about what is in PPACA really dislike PPACA.
2) People who rely on Fox News as their primary news source do really poorly (worse than random guessing) on a quiz about what is in PPACA.
3) 40% of respondents thought "death panels" were a real thing.

Take the 10-question quiz here.

I explained that poll to my mother-in-law last night. She insisted that the Kaiser Foundation was paid off in order to make Fox News look bad.

/I really didn't know what to say to that.

Well, look, I think we can all admit that the quiz was biased. One or two questions were a bit fishy. And it did leave out anything that would make the law look bad. The big difference is that, Fox News looks bad on their own because anyone with any ounce of intelligence can see them lying on a daily basis. KFF's test didn't outright lie but it was selectively favorable to the law. Fox News lies outright about the law and anything else they dislike.


I also told her (incorrectly, it turns out) that Gallup was one of the polling groups that found out that Fox News misinforms their viewers, and my mother-in-law said they were being paid off as well, just to slander Fox News.
 
2012-07-05 03:31:49 PM

Deftoons: It seems the health care debate has turned into a health insurance debate. What's the core issue is cost, not necessarily insurance.


Which it should be. Insurance is the only thing wrong with American healthcare.
 
2012-07-05 03:36:50 PM

GentDirkly: thornhill: Not accepting the Medicaid expansion money is absolutely incredible. It comes with no strings and is paid for by the federal government. Denying millions of people health insurance so that you can score points with the tea party is just disgusting.

Not entirely true. A contribution from the state is required. It's 5% at first, then ramps up to 10%, IIRC.


A very small price to pay for what will help provide health insurance to literally millions of people in some of these states (in Texas, for instance, it will cover 1.5 million people). Putting aside the whole moral issue, it makes good economic sense.
 
2012-07-05 03:37:20 PM

mgshamster: chimp_ninja: Results from an interesting poll by the Kaiser Family Foundation are here.

Lessons:
1) People who do poorly on a quiz about what is in PPACA really dislike PPACA.
2) People who rely on Fox News as their primary news source do really poorly (worse than random guessing) on a quiz about what is in PPACA.
3) 40% of respondents thought "death panels" were a real thing.

Take the 10-question quiz here.

I explained that poll to my mother-in-law last night. She insisted that the Kaiser Foundation was paid off in order to make Fox News look bad.

/I really didn't know what to say to that.


If the kaiser foundation was paid off due to greed, y not fox news? They are human as well.

If u can find it, the court filing where fix news sued to ensure they had the right to run misinformation as news, even knowingly.

Ask her why she trusts fox news more than her own son. Family valuez!
 
2012-07-05 03:41:18 PM

meat0918: Sybarite: My state has a measure that will appear on the ballot this fall that would forbid the setup of an insurance exchange by the state. I can pretty much guarantee it will pass.

Oregon on the other hand just about has their's up. Link


It seems every few months I find a new reason to be damn proud to live in Oregon.
After reading the article and looking at the map, I had 2 thoughts:
1) Wow, Oregon has a higher uninsured rate than I thought it would (but obviously doing things to rectify it)
2) People in states with conservative leaders who are going to pass up on medicaid expansion and insurance exchanges deserve what they get. They voted them in, they can suffer the consequences. Besides, hopefully this is a case of "survival of the fittest" and those who shoot themselves in the foot fade away.
 
2012-07-05 03:41:40 PM

chimp_ninja: Results from an interesting poll by the Kaiser Family Foundation are here.

Lessons:
1) People who do poorly on a quiz about what is in PPACA really dislike PPACA.
2) People who rely on Fox News as their primary news source do really poorly (worse than random guessing) on a quiz about what is in PPACA.
3) 40% of respondents thought "death panels" were a real thing.

Take the 10-question quiz here.


I got 10 of 10 correct, and I'm just some slacker weirdo. I guess other people don't have time to learn stuff because they have things to do.
 
2012-07-05 03:44:01 PM

chimp_ninja: Results from an interesting poll by the Kaiser Family Foundation are here.

Lessons:
1) People who do poorly on a quiz about what is in PPACA really dislike PPACA.
2) People who rely on Fox News as their primary news source do really poorly (worse than random guessing) on a quiz about what is in PPACA.
3) 40% of respondents thought "death panels" were a real thing.

Take the 10-question quiz here.


I just smoked a bowl and I barely slept last night because I took a heavy dose of some pretty good shrooms and I can never sleep until the trip is over. Furthermore, I'm not particularly well informed on this issue because even though I basically support the idea of healthcare reform, I'm covered by VA healthcare and am therefore largely unaffected. Still got a 10/10.
 
2012-07-05 03:56:26 PM
www.mockpaperscissors.com

We think it's stupid... we don't need no gubbamint doctors tellin us how to be healthy!
 
2012-07-05 03:58:15 PM
Well of course the states with the most uninsured want to fight universal insurance. They are run by insurance company lackeys who want to use that uninsured status against people. Then they can dictate to the serfs who is and isn't privileged enough to be allowed affordable health care.
 
2012-07-05 03:58:54 PM

GentDirkly: thornhill: Not accepting the Medicaid expansion money is absolutely incredible. It comes with no strings and is paid for by the federal government. Denying millions of people health insurance so that you can score points with the tea party is just disgusting.

Not entirely true. A contribution from the state is required. It's 5% at first, then ramps up to 10%, IIRC.


0% the first two years, but ya, it does ramp up to 10% eventually... money well spent, in my opinion.
 
2012-07-05 04:02:27 PM
Some people actually realize that they dont want to see the day where their kids owe $100k on the national debt as soon as they get out of the womb, yet they are chided by FarkLibs as 'voting against their best interests'
 
2012-07-05 04:03:06 PM
So, I think it will all work out fine anyways... Some of these states that are rabidly anti-anything Obama will, no doubt, not expand medicaid... some of them will end up in the program where the federal government sets up the exchange because a state failed to do so... but they'll still have hordes of low-wage labor uninsured because of the lack of medicaid expansion (don't worry, if you can't get healthcare through your employer that costs less than 8% of your paycheck, or if you're below the poverty limits, you are exempt from the penalty)... so low wage workers will have a choice... do they want to live in states with crumbling service sectors where their family has no healthcare, or will they go to states that treat them decently even though they are poor... I have a feeling this will be a rehash of some of the anti-immigrant bills, and you'll see some states entirely drain their own supply of low-wage labor for things like farming, retail, and food service, all just to show how bootstrappy they are.
 
2012-07-05 04:06:28 PM

o5iiawah: Some people actually realize that they dont want to see the day where their kids owe $100k on the national debt as soon as they get out of the womb, yet they are chided by FarkLibs as 'voting against their best interests'


But...but...we got to spend billions on all the new shiny toys for the Defense department!

Mitt Romney and the GOP told me so!
 
2012-07-05 04:07:01 PM

o5iiawah: Some people actually realize that they dont want to see the day where their kids owe $100k on the national debt as soon as they get out of the womb, yet they are chided by FarkLibs as 'voting against their best interests'


Rather have your kid go bankrupt from an out of control hospital bill? I mean, it's one thing to talk about the national economy, it's another thing to say you support fixing it, but without addressing the number one cause of personal bankruptcies. One party is trying to get costs under control by moving care from ER to clinic settings and paying a penny for prevention instead of a pound for cure, the other is rushing to go back to the status quo and says that 30 million uninsured Americans, and the biggest sector inflation of any "isn't an issue" (thanks, McConnell). If you want to get serious about the national debt, then why are you against the first restructuring of Medicare that makes it more cost-effective? Aside from that, if the debt is the number one issue, do we really want to vote for a guy who says he'll cut taxes and increase the military size by another 100k men? Is that our solution to everything, more big government, but we just don't want the kind that might accidentally help someone?
 
2012-07-05 04:07:22 PM
Remember: you ain't no God-fearin' christian 'murkan if'n you want that Federal Gubmint help!

/except during disasters
//or riots
///or droughts
////or drug enforcement
//or censorship
//or highways
//or farm subsidies
//or fires
//or disease
 
2012-07-05 04:07:58 PM
mrshowrules: "You answered 10 out of 10 questions correctly, better than 99.6% of Americans." /Canadian

Imagine how much better you would have done if you'd had the common decency to be an American, like Jesus.
 
2012-07-05 04:15:06 PM
That's because their constituents want to continue not to have to pay for health care and to be able to continue to use the ER for their free medical care.
 
2012-07-05 04:59:37 PM
It can't be stressed hard enough that progressives living in these states should be volunteering with local and state campaigns to produce candidates to VOTE OUT the selfish and short-sighted people in office that oppose this.

I know, I know, none of you have 'time' for politics. Really? Even hardcore FPT junkies like yourselves?
 
2012-07-05 05:04:36 PM

namatad: Testiclaw: 9/10 on the quiz...

...thought too in-depth for the first one, was wondering if they used fine as a synonym or antonym for tax/credit.

/at least that's my excuse
//and I'm sticking to it
///death panels be damned

LOL
I had the same problem.


I hope they have comfy chairs at the Death Panel hearings :(
 
2012-07-05 05:19:59 PM

chimp_ninja: Results from an interesting poll by the Kaiser Family Foundation are here.

Lessons:
1) People who do poorly on a quiz about what is in PPACA really dislike PPACA.
2) People who rely on Fox News as their primary news source do really poorly (worse than random guessing) on a quiz about what is in PPACA.
3) 40% of respondents thought "death panels" were a real thing.

Take the 10-question quiz here.


I got a 10 out of 10 by answering what I'd want. (minus the single payer option, heh)
 
2012-07-05 05:24:43 PM

zimbach: I got 10 of 10 correct, and I'm just some slacker weirdo. I guess other people don't have time to learn stuff because they have things to do.


The people who score low on this quiz, and who actually believe that a bureaucratic panel is going to decide to put down Grandma, do not suffer from a lack of free time. They have plenty, and spend it in the wrong places.
 
2012-07-05 05:42:02 PM
STATES SUING OVER OBAMACARE

Virginia
Florida
South Carolina
Nebraska
Texas
Utah
Louisiana
Alabama
Michigan
Colorado
Pennsylvania
Washington
Idaho
South Dakota
North Dakota
Arizona
Georgia
Alaska
Nevada
Indiana
Mississippi
Wisconsin
Oklahoma
Wyoming
Ohio
Kansas
Maine
 
2012-07-05 05:44:43 PM
In Oklahoma there are two political ads that stick out to me:

1) The Democrat saying stuff that I can't remember, but proving his good 'ol boy-ism by taking out a rifle and shooting a target at the end of the ad.

2) The Republican was notable for saying "the first thing I'm going to do when elected is go to Washington and appeal Obamacare"

We deserve everything we get.
 
2012-07-05 06:03:23 PM

God-is-a-Taco: 2) The Republican was notable for saying "the first thing I'm going to do when elected is go to Washington and appeal Obamacare"


Haha, what? Appeal Obamacare? To whom?

Maybe he meant repeal but then again spelling and stuff is such elitist liberal hogwash.
 
2012-07-05 06:13:35 PM

o5iiawah: Some people actually realize that they dont want to see the day where their kids owe $100k on the national debt as soon as they get out of the womb, yet they are chided by FarkLibs as 'voting against their best interests'


The PPACA lowers debt projections compared to the Republican plan of doing nothing. Even when they think they aren't, the FarkCons are still voting against their best interests.
 
2012-07-05 06:28:41 PM

Pfft!: meat0918: Sybarite: My state has a measure that will appear on the ballot this fall that would forbid the setup of an insurance exchange by the state. I can pretty much guarantee it will pass.

Oregon on the other hand just about has their's up. Link

It seems every few months I find a new reason to be damn proud to live in Oregon.
After reading the article and looking at the map, I had 2 thoughts:
1) Wow, Oregon has a higher uninsured rate than I thought it would (but obviously doing things to rectify it)
2) People in states with conservative leaders who are going to pass up on medicaid expansion and insurance exchanges deserve what they get. They voted them in, they can suffer the consequences. Besides, hopefully this is a case of "survival of the fittest" and those who shoot themselves in the foot fade away.


Oregon does okay, but the state health insurance system is so overwhelmed that they have to resort to a lottery system to allot care. Having the ability for every needing insurance to get it will be a boon.
 
2012-07-05 06:29:16 PM
"everybody"
 
2012-07-05 06:42:11 PM

chimp_ninja: Results from an interesting poll by the Kaiser Family Foundation are here.

Lessons:
1) People who do poorly on a quiz about what is in PPACA really dislike PPACA.
2) People who rely on Fox News as their primary news source do really poorly (worse than random guessing) on a quiz about what is in PPACA.
3) 40% of respondents thought "death panels" were a real thing.

Take the 10-question quiz here.


10/10 easy peasy
 
2012-07-05 07:04:46 PM

Sybarite: My state has a measure that will appear on the ballot this fall that would forbid the setup of an insurance exchange by the state. I can pretty much guarantee it will pass.


Which means they will go into the federal program. Great so see that this people love the federal government so much and don't trust the state government.
 
2012-07-05 07:07:59 PM

EnviroDude: turns out they have a lot of medicare patients too and the thought of having to do more without government reimbursement will bankrupt them


You know, you are lying again. Almost all of the expanded medicare for the poor is paid for by the federal government for the expansion.
 
2012-07-05 07:46:35 PM

Doc Lee: o5iiawah: Some people actually realize that they dont want to see the day where their kids owe $100k on the national debt as soon as they get out of the womb, yet they are chided by FarkLibs as 'voting against their best interests'

The PPACA lowers debt projections compared to the Republican plan of doing nothing. Even when they think they aren't, the FarkCons are still voting against their best interests.


From a president who said the stimulus would take unemployment to 5.4%, that the annual deficit would be cut in half and we would create 500,000 jobs last summer, i am sure his budget advisers are spot on with their projections.
 
2012-07-05 07:47:50 PM
Well, duh, subby! In Florida, our governor has pledged to do everything he can to prevent Florida's uninsured from getting health insurance. And the people down here think he's great!

(* shakes head *)
(* weeps for the future *)
 
2012-07-05 08:06:03 PM

o5iiawah: From a president who said the stimulus would take unemployment to 5.4%, that the annual deficit would be cut in half and we would create 500,000 jobs last summer, i am sure his budget advisers are spot on with their projections.


Honestly man, you barely got into that talking point before you pulled a massive lie.
 
2012-07-05 08:12:07 PM

o5iiawah: Doc Lee: o5iiawah: Some people actually realize that they dont want to see the day where their kids owe $100k on the national debt as soon as they get out of the womb, yet they are chided by FarkLibs as 'voting against their best interests'

The PPACA lowers debt projections compared to the Republican plan of doing nothing. Even when they think they aren't, the FarkCons are still voting against their best interests.

From a president who said the stimulus would take unemployment to 5.4%, that the annual deficit would be cut in half and we would create 500,000 jobs last summer, i am sure his budget advisers are spot on with their projections.


First off, that's a CBO projection. Second off, you do of course realize that it's the G0P economic plan to keep unemployment high to create a surplus of skilled labor in order to lower wages, right? FarkCons, always voting against their own best interests.
 
2012-07-05 09:22:16 PM
Turns out, getting people to vote against their best interests is not actually all that difficult, providing that you have money.
 
2012-07-05 09:35:10 PM

KarmicDisaster: Turns out, getting people to vote against their best interests is not actually all that difficult, providing that you have money.


Or wrap yourself in a flag and carry a cross.
 
2012-07-05 09:38:51 PM

Epoch_Zero: Arkanaut: Turns out, the states that are trying to battle Obamacare have the highest number of uninsured residents FREEDOM

FTFY, commiemitter.

"We shall wrap all wounds in the American flag, which will quickly regenerate all injured flesh and provide a sweet, slightly citrus-like smell to those in the immediate area. Bald eagles - which naturally gather around any incarnation of the American flag - will then gently carry to the patient to a bed, where they shall exercise their mandatory second amendment rights. "


ilovethispostsomuch.jpeg
 
2012-07-05 09:52:39 PM

Millennium: Um, forgive me if I'm wrong here, but wouldn't it be kind of expected for a law to be opposed mainly by people who would (at least in their own perception) be affected by it?


But most of these people will be affected in a positive way. And even if a new policy did affect an individual (let's call him Dick Darlington) negatively but affects many of the most impoverished in the society in a positive way what sort of selfish asshole would Dick need to be to oppose it?
 
2012-07-05 10:01:52 PM

abb3w: Aarontology: Turns out that the states trying to battle Obamacare are at the bottom of the rankings for a lot of things.


It's like a Cone of Derp.
 
2012-07-05 10:52:46 PM

wippit: I got 9 out of 10, haven't read the thing, and I'm not an American. So people failing this have to be really dumb

/got #5 wrong, for the record.


You have seen the average Murikan, right? We's dum as hel nn thas hau we likes it.
 
2012-07-06 12:06:15 AM

mrshowrules: SphericalTime: mrshowrules: SphericalTime: chimp_ninja: 3) 40% of respondents thought "death panels" were a real thing.

I can't believe that there are questions on there that got 25% correct answer rates. Unbelievable.

It doesn't surprise me. People like Bachman and other Conservatives have been continually saying the complete opposite to most of these points. If Conservatives are truly following the right-wing speaking points, they shouldn't be getting more than a quarter of them correct.

The 25% was among Americans, not just conservatives. That means that half of the independents and liberals got those particular questions wrong as well.

Everytime I turn on CNN, Bachman is blabbering away. Conservatives are clearly winning the propaganda war on both sides politically. They old rule of making the lie as big as possible. Some people will believe the big lie, others will assume it just exaggerated

Bachman: Obamacare will destroy all small businesses.

What people believe:
1) Tea Party: Yes, this is true
2) Conservatives: it will be very bad for most small businesses
3) Independents/Moderates: it might hurt many small businesses
4) Liberals: the impact to small businesses will me minor
5) Truth: Obamacare does not apply to small businesses


6) Even truth-ier: Though businesses with less than 50 FTE (full time equivalent) employees are exempted completely from lack-of-coverage penalties, those businesses that choose to cover their employees will be eligible for for new tax credits to assist them in paying for coverage.

They also won't have to deal with medical underwriting preventing them from getting coverage or raising their premiums to insane levels.

And, of course, the knowledge that you can obtain individual health insurance should you decide to leave your corporate gig and become an entrepreneur will eliminate the single biggest barrier to new business startups in this country.

/ Of course that doesn't fit on a bumper sticker or within a five-second sound byte, so fark it.
 
2012-07-06 12:52:59 AM

EnviroDude: turns out they have a lot of medicare patients too and the thought of having to do more without government reimbursement will bankrupt them


Say what now?

Medicare is a completely federal program, for Seniors and the disabled. The states collectively have 0 people enrolled through them, as they have exactly nothing to do with the whole program. And the only change that Medicare beneficiaries will have with Obamacare is that the government will no longer be paying up to a 16% premium to private insurers who participate in the Medicare Advantage program.

Assuming you meant Medicaid, every state participates in the existing program, and receives only 57-63% of the cost from the Feds. If they agree to the expansion, they will get 100% of the additional costs paid for 2 years, and 90% paid beyond that.

If they choose not to participate, then their citizens and companies that pay the penalties for not having/offering coverage will just be paying into the federal till and the state will get nothing in return.

/ The governors can say what they want now. They'll all come on board at some point. Hospitals, insurers, and pharmaceutical companies will demand it.
 
2012-07-06 01:36:52 AM
ignorance is bliss??
 
2012-07-06 02:40:26 AM

JadedRaverLA: mrshowrules: SphericalTime: mrshowrules: SphericalTime: chimp_ninja: 3) 40% of respondents thought "death panels" were a real thing.

I can't believe that there are questions on there that got 25% correct answer rates. Unbelievable.

It doesn't surprise me. People like Bachman and other Conservatives have been continually saying the complete opposite to most of these points. If Conservatives are truly following the right-wing speaking points, they shouldn't be getting more than a quarter of them correct.

The 25% was among Americans, not just conservatives. That means that half of the independents and liberals got those particular questions wrong as well.

Everytime I turn on CNN, Bachman is blabbering away. Conservatives are clearly winning the propaganda war on both sides politically. They old rule of making the lie as big as possible. Some people will believe the big lie, others will assume it just exaggerated

Bachman: Obamacare will destroy all small businesses.

What people believe:
1) Tea Party: Yes, this is true
2) Conservatives: it will be very bad for most small businesses
3) Independents/Moderates: it might hurt many small businesses
4) Liberals: the impact to small businesses will me minor
5) Truth: Obamacare does not apply to small businesses

6) Even truth-ier: Though businesses with less than 50 FTE (full time equivalent) employees are exempted completely from lack-of-coverage penalties, those businesses that choose to cover their employees will be eligible for for new tax credits to assist them in paying for coverage.

They also won't have to deal with medical underwriting preventing them from getting coverage or raising their premiums to insane levels.

And, of course, the knowledge that you can obtain individual health insurance should you decide to leave your corporate gig and become an entrepreneur will eliminate the single biggest barrier to new business startups in this country.

/ Of course that doesn't fit on a bumper sticker or with ...


It is even better than that for the extra small businesses (under 12 people), we can get insurance through the exchange for employees, get the tax credit, and get a better group rate... and our employees would be able to take it with them whenever they leave for other jobs.
 
2012-07-06 06:57:26 AM

o5iiawah: Some people actually realize that they dont want to see the day where their kids owe $100k on the national debt as soon as they get out of the womb, yet they are chided by FarkLibs as 'voting against their best interests'


So better to be stuck with a 100k bill from the hospital for facilitating your child's exit from the womb?
 
2012-07-06 06:59:50 AM

chimp_ninja: Results from an interesting poll by the Kaiser Family Foundation are here.

Lessons:
1) People who do poorly on a quiz about what is in PPACA really dislike PPACA.
2) People who rely on Fox News as their primary news source do really poorly (worse than random guessing) on a quiz about what is in PPACA.
3) 40% of respondents thought "death panels" were a real thing.

Take the 10-question quiz here.


"You answered 10 out of 10 questions correctly, better than 99.6% of Americans."

[snark] No shiat. I'm Canadian. [/snark]
 
2012-07-06 07:06:56 AM

MooseUpNorth: chimp_ninja: Results from an interesting poll by the Kaiser Family Foundation are here.

Lessons:
1) People who do poorly on a quiz about what is in PPACA really dislike PPACA.
2) People who rely on Fox News as their primary news source do really poorly (worse than random guessing) on a quiz about what is in PPACA.
3) 40% of respondents thought "death panels" were a real thing.

Take the 10-question quiz here.

"You answered 10 out of 10 questions correctly, better than 99.6% of Americans."

[snark] No shiat. I'm Canadian. [/snark]


To be fair, Canada has it's share of morons too. You just can't understand them because they are speaking French.
 
2012-07-06 09:21:44 AM

Evil Twin Skippy: To be fair, Canada has it's share of morons too. You just can't understand them because they are speaking French.


I said 10/10.
 
2012-07-06 10:07:07 AM
I got a 9 out of 10. The "businesses required to provide health insurance" tripped me up. Oh well, I'll take it.
 
2012-07-06 10:15:48 AM

chimp_ninja: Results from an interesting poll by the Kaiser Family Foundation are here.

Lessons:
1) People who do poorly on a quiz about what is in PPACA really dislike PPACA.
2) People who rely on Fox News as their primary news source do really poorly (worse than random guessing) on a quiz about what is in PPACA.
3) 40% of respondents thought "death panels" were a real thing.

Take the 10-question quiz here.


Propoganda quiz is full of propoganda. We've covered this already, listing the benefits of the used car you want to buy without telling you the price or that the engine is blown is not proof that it is a good car or that the buyer is stupid for not being interested in the nicer aspects.

I got 10/10 on the quiz, doesnt mean Im stupid enough to believe that giving millions of uninsured people free government paid insurance is going to make things cheaper.
 
2012-07-06 10:16:28 AM

archichris: chimp_ninja: Results from an interesting poll by the Kaiser Family Foundation are here.

Lessons:
1) People who do poorly on a quiz about what is in PPACA really dislike PPACA.
2) People who rely on Fox News as their primary news source do really poorly (worse than random guessing) on a quiz about what is in PPACA.
3) 40% of respondents thought "death panels" were a real thing.

Take the 10-question quiz here.

Propoganda quiz is full of propoganda. We've covered this already, listing the benefits of the used car you want to buy without telling you the price or that the engine is blown is not proof that it is a good car or that the buyer is stupid for not being interested in the nicer aspects.

I got 10/10 on the quiz, doesnt mean Im stupid enough to believe that giving millions of uninsured people free government paid insurance is going to make things cheaper.


Oh crap I just realized what the quiz is actually measuring.....nevermind, Im going back to retake it and get 0/10
 
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