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(Engadget)   Cisco tries its hand at locking you out of your router   (engadget.com) divider line 122
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8200 clicks; posted to Geek » on 03 Jul 2012 at 2:07 PM (2 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2012-07-03 12:02:43 PM
Note to self: don't buy any more Linksys routers.
 
2012-07-03 12:10:07 PM
I bought a couple of the cisco/linksys routers after the merger. They were shiat. The wireless will randomly stop working, or the whole thing will simply hang. Never buying a cisco product again.

/the old linksys stuff was great.

//Cisco business class routers/firewall/switches are overpriced garbage too.
 
2012-07-03 12:17:35 PM

Dinki: I bought a couple of the cisco/linksys routers after the merger. They were shiat. The wireless will randomly stop working, or the whole thing will simply hang. Never buying a cisco product again.

/the old linksys stuff was great.

//Cisco business class routers/firewall/switches are overpriced garbage too.


I've had a Linksys WRT54GL running Tomato for 4 years now. Works great.

The OS that comes preloaded is crap.
 
2012-07-03 12:19:32 PM
the Connect Cloud service came with a supplemental privacy policy that explicitly allowed Cisco to peek at a user's "internet history," "traffic" and "other related information." If Cisco discovered you had used your router for "pornographic or offensive purposes" or to violate "intellectual property rights," it reserved the right to shut down your cloud account and effectively cut you off from your router.

If this is true, never buying Cisco for home or office again.
 
2012-07-03 12:23:07 PM

Dinki: I bought a couple of the cisco/linksys routers after the merger. They were shiat. The wireless will randomly stop working, or the whole thing will simply hang. Never buying a cisco product again.

/the old linksys stuff was great.

//Cisco business class routers/firewall/switches are overpriced garbage too.


Really?

Been managing Cisco devices for 15 years, also worked on HP, Linksys (pre and post Cisco), Juniper, and Avaya.

Cisco is the most reliable for LAN and enterprise I've ever seen, with the most features for administration, management and monitoring.

Overpriced? Agree.

Garbage? Do not agree.

Belkin is garbage. Never managed one that worked right.
 
2012-07-03 12:25:13 PM
This is my router. There are many like it, but this one is mine.


Cisco apparently never read Routergod. Or believes that a network at home is sort of like a privacy boundary.. a "demarcation" if you will .. and that crossing that is sort of like declaring war on users... to some.
 
2012-07-03 12:25:44 PM

Generation_D: the Connect Cloud service came with a supplemental privacy policy that explicitly allowed Cisco to peek at a user's "internet history," "traffic" and "other related information." If Cisco discovered you had used your router for "pornographic or offensive purposes" or to violate "intellectual property rights," it reserved the right to shut down your cloud account and effectively cut you off from your router.

If this is true, never buying Cisco for home or office again.


Cutting users off from porn? This does not bode well for Cisco.
 
2012-07-03 12:28:32 PM

Generation_D: Cisco apparently never read Routergod. Or believes that a network at home is sort of like a privacy boundary


I have a feeling that the article could be exaggerating. A router should be able to act as a standalone device, like hosting a private LAN. If Cisco decentralizes administrative access of the router onto the Internet, how would administrating a private network even be possible?
 
2012-07-03 12:35:39 PM

Lor M. Ipsum: Generation_D: Cisco apparently never read Routergod. Or believes that a network at home is sort of like a privacy boundary

I have a feeling that the article could be exaggerating. A router should be able to act as a standalone device, like hosting a private LAN. If Cisco decentralizes administrative access of the router onto the Internet, how would administrating a private network even be possible?


CIsco's official response:Link

Engadget article could be misleading. More to come I'm sure.

/slashies
 
2012-07-03 12:35:47 PM
I have an e3000. Generally, it works fine. The one problem I have, and it's a fairly big one, is that I can either log into the router directly, or use their desktop application to adjust the settings. Neither option gives you full control, though. You have to use the desktop app if you want to use their "guest" feature. It's a pretty nice feature; I could give people who visit my house an easy password, they log in as "guest", and all they have is internet access. However, using the desktop app drastically limits to control you have over the router, you have no ability to set up port forwarding, wifi blacklists or whitelists, etc.

If I log into the router directly, I cannot use the desktop app, and therefore not the "guest" feature. The "guest" SSID is still broadcast (with no way to turn it off), but I cannot set a password, because you'd have to use the desktop app to do that...and as soon as you open the app, it resets all the routers settings to default.
 
2012-07-03 12:45:19 PM

make me some tea: I've had a Linksys WRT54GL running Tomato for 4 years now. Works great.

The OS that comes preloaded is crap.


There's a few good alternatives if you have a Linksys WRT model. I haven't tried Tomato but I've been using DD-WRT.
 
2012-07-03 12:51:45 PM
This is why God made DD-WRT. I find it funny that companies like Cisco, with tons of money, total knowledge of the product, and expertise for this sort of thing, still crank out firmware that's absolute crap compared to what some guys put together in their spare time.

My WRT-320N has been running virtually flawlessly since I got it, and flashing it with DD-WRT was the first thing I did.
 
2012-07-03 01:58:02 PM

slayer199: There's a few good alternatives if you have a Linksys WRT model. I haven't tried Tomato but I've been using DD-WRT.


My only regret with DD-WRT is that I didn't flash it to my WRT router sooner. I freaking love DD-WRT.

(You mean I can finally do port forwarding and static IP based on MAC address from the router? yippee!)
 
2012-07-03 02:04:44 PM

nvmac: Been managing Cisco devices for 15 years, also worked on HP, Linksys (pre and post Cisco), Juniper, and Avaya.

Cisco is the most reliable for LAN and enterprise I've ever seen, with the most features for administration, management and monitoring.

Overpriced? Agree.

Garbage? Do not agree.

Belkin is garbage. Never managed one that worked right.


"Linksys by Cisco" ≠ "Cisco business-grade gear"

just like "iomega by EMC" ≠ "Symmetrix."
 
2012-07-03 02:10:43 PM
Well, now that I can't buy new Linksys routers, even though I used them for over a decade, any suggestions by the Fark community? Netgear?
 
2012-07-03 02:13:19 PM
Ahhhh it's Cisco not Crisco.
 
2012-07-03 02:16:40 PM

nvmac: Lor M. Ipsum: Generation_D: Cisco apparently never read Routergod. Or believes that a network at home is sort of like a privacy boundary

I have a feeling that the article could be exaggerating. A router should be able to act as a standalone device, like hosting a private LAN. If Cisco decentralizes administrative access of the router onto the Internet, how would administrating a private network even be possible?

CIsco's official response:Link

Engadget article could be misleading. More to come I'm sure.

/slashies


Or Cisco could be backpedaling fiercely.
 
2012-07-03 02:17:36 PM

make me some tea: Note to self: don't buy any more Linksys routers.



or better yet. do what i did and load Linux firmware into the Linksys instead of stock firmware. Tomato firmware (Linux) to be precise. have had zero issues and fast as hell. go ahead. google it. don't be afraid. ((:
 
2012-07-03 02:18:39 PM

make me some tea: Dinki: I bought a couple of the cisco/linksys routers after the merger. They were shiat. The wireless will randomly stop working, or the whole thing will simply hang. Never buying a cisco product again.

/the old linksys stuff was great.

//Cisco business class routers/firewall/switches are overpriced garbage too.

I've had a Linksys WRT54GL running Tomato for 4 years now. Works great.

The OS that comes preloaded is crap.



i second the Tomato Linux firmware. its sweet on my Linky.
 
2012-07-03 02:21:03 PM

nvmac: Dinki: I bought a couple of the cisco/linksys routers after the merger. They were shiat. The wireless will randomly stop working, or the whole thing will simply hang. Never buying a cisco product again.

/the old linksys stuff was great.

//Cisco business class routers/firewall/switches are overpriced garbage too.

Really?

Been managing Cisco devices for 15 years, also worked on HP, Linksys (pre and post Cisco), Juniper, and Avaya.

Cisco is the most reliable for LAN and enterprise I've ever seen, with the most features for administration, management and monitoring.

Overpriced? Agree.

Garbage? Do not agree.

Belkin is garbage. Never managed one that worked right.



Cisco is absolutely the best router in the world. sometimes, though, they could make better software decisions. the bought Linksys a few years ago. my linky running tomato linux firmware is rock solid and fast and full features for a 50 dollar router.
 
2012-07-03 02:21:10 PM

make me some tea: Note to self: don't buy any more Linksys routers.


Yeah, no kidding. Or Cisco hardware, where possible. Keep your snooping "morality" out of the hardware I purchased, kthx.
 
2012-07-03 02:21:31 PM

TwistedIvory: slayer199: There's a few good alternatives if you have a Linksys WRT model. I haven't tried Tomato but I've been using DD-WRT.

My only regret with DD-WRT is that I didn't flash it to my WRT router sooner. I freaking love DD-WRT.

(You mean I can finally do port forwarding and static IP based on MAC address from the router? yippee!)


I use DD-WRT to create a wireless bridge between my computer room -- where my cable modem is connected -- to my living room -- where I have three game consoles and a computer using "wired" network access. The router in the living room is a Linksys device.

The original Linksys firmware would drop an idle connection after ten minutes of inactivity. When using SSH for port forwarding, this caused lost connections. DD-WRT does not feature such "functionality".
 
2012-07-03 02:21:42 PM

Gig103: Well, now that I can't buy new Linksys routers, even though I used them for over a decade, any suggestions by the Fark community? Netgear?


Been years since I used one, but it was fine back in the day. Beware the netgear chipsets are not generally supported by the alternate router firmware like dd-wrt.
 
2012-07-03 02:22:47 PM

Gig103: Well, now that I can't buy new Linksys routers, even though I used them for over a decade, any suggestions by the Fark community? Netgear?


I use a D-Link DIR-615 in my computer room, but my wireless bridge (a Linksys router running DD-WRT) continually lost connection after approximately one hour of connectivity. This problem was resolved only by installing DD-WRT on the DIR-615 also.
 
2012-07-03 02:22:49 PM

Generation_D: This is my router. There are many like it, but this one is mine.


Cisco apparently never read Routergod. Or believes that a network at home is sort of like a privacy boundary.. a "demarcation" if you will .. and that crossing that is sort of like declaring war on users... to some.



without tomato linux, my linksys router is useless. without my router, i am useless. lol
 
2012-07-03 02:25:41 PM
this was on /. last week, there are workarounds to get back to older firmware but it's stupid, the entire situation is stupid. If Cisco is willing to do that stuff to already purchased goods, pray they don't alter the deal further.

/loves dd-wrt on my old wrt54g
 
2012-07-03 02:28:13 PM
Dimensio: I use DD-WRT to create a wireless bridge between my computer room -- where my cable modem is connected -- to my living room -- where I have three game consoles and a computer using "wired" network access. The router in the living room is a Linksys device.

I do the exact same thing, except with two consoles (down from three) and a tivo.

// Just got some directional antennas to make the connection even more stable (there are 15 other wifi networks in my area now and the directionals helps me blast through all of the noise by shooting most of the transmit power from one router to the other ... it's a straight shot down a hallway).
 
2012-07-03 02:30:51 PM

Dimensio: TwistedIvory: slayer199: There's a few good alternatives if you have a Linksys WRT model. I haven't tried Tomato but I've been using DD-WRT.

My only regret with DD-WRT is that I didn't flash it to my WRT router sooner. I freaking love DD-WRT.

(You mean I can finally do port forwarding and static IP based on MAC address from the router? yippee!)

I use DD-WRT to create a wireless bridge between my computer room -- where my cable modem is connected -- to my living room -- where I have three game consoles and a computer using "wired" network access. The router in the living room is a Linksys device.

The original Linksys firmware would drop an idle connection after ten minutes of inactivity. When using SSH for port forwarding, this caused lost connections. DD-WRT does not feature such "functionality".


Ooo, how's the wireless bridging work on DD-WRT? Fairly stable? Does it work with DHCP? I'm running Tomato with a wireless bridge from my living room (xbox/tv/media pc) to my FIOS router in the office. Works great, the only problem is it only seems to work with WEP, not WPA2. Not a huge deal, don't have many neighbors I'm worried about, but it would be nice to be a little bit more secure. I tried the same setup with DD-WRT a few years ago, and I could never get the wireless bridge to forward DHCP properly, so I'd have to manually set all my IP addresses. Not a big deal, but I just don't care that much to manually setup all my devices in the living room,
 
2012-07-03 02:31:15 PM
encrypted-tbn1.google.com

You BASTARD.

/thong tha tha tha thong.
 
2012-07-03 02:34:28 PM

Gig103: Well, now that I can't buy new Linksys routers, even though I used them for over a decade, any suggestions by the Fark community? Netgear?


I've been using various SMC stuff since the late '90s. They've been rock solid for me every time I've gotten one.
 
2012-07-03 02:36:06 PM
YodaBlues: Ooo, how's the wireless bridging work on DD-WRT? Fairly stable? Does it work with DHCP?

I'm running a pair of WRT54GLs (the ones with the full set of RAM/Flash), and it's stable enough (even more so after I slapped the directional antennas on them).

Works fine with DHCP (the bridge is just another DHCP client that forwards).

// you can boost the transmission power as needed, the default is quite low.
 
2012-07-03 02:38:05 PM

Gig103: Well, now that I can't buy new Linksys routers, even though I used them for over a decade, any suggestions by the Fark community? Netgear?


I use a Buffalo device (I'm not near it, so I don't know the model). Put DD-WRT on it. Very nice little unit.

Or you could go the whole-nine-yards and build a Free BSD box to act as a router.
 
2012-07-03 02:38:43 PM

YodaBlues: Dimensio: TwistedIvory: slayer199: There's a few good alternatives if you have a Linksys WRT model. I haven't tried Tomato but I've been using DD-WRT.

My only regret with DD-WRT is that I didn't flash it to my WRT router sooner. I freaking love DD-WRT.

(You mean I can finally do port forwarding and static IP based on MAC address from the router? yippee!)

I use DD-WRT to create a wireless bridge between my computer room -- where my cable modem is connected -- to my living room -- where I have three game consoles and a computer using "wired" network access. The router in the living room is a Linksys device.

The original Linksys firmware would drop an idle connection after ten minutes of inactivity. When using SSH for port forwarding, this caused lost connections. DD-WRT does not feature such "functionality".

Ooo, how's the wireless bridging work on DD-WRT? Fairly stable? Does it work with DHCP? I'm running Tomato with a wireless bridge from my living room (xbox/tv/media pc) to my FIOS router in the office. Works great, the only problem is it only seems to work with WEP, not WPA2. Not a huge deal, don't have many neighbors I'm worried about, but it would be nice to be a little bit more secure. I tried the same setup with DD-WRT a few years ago, and I could never get the wireless bridge to forward DHCP properly, so I'd have to manually set all my IP addresses. Not a big deal, but I just don't care that much to manually setup all my devices in the living room,


Using two routers that both run DD-WRT, wireless bridging is easy to set up and, thus far, has proven fast and stable. I am able to play online games without any router-based lag. I currently lack a wireless keyboard (though I do possess a wireless mouse), so I use a laptop (connected wirelessly) and a VNC connection to the television-connected computer for keyboard input; it has proven reliable and lag-free as an input device for games.

Connecting my Playstation 3 to the wireless bridge results in substantially faster transfer speeds than does connecting the Playstation 3 to the wireless network.
 
2012-07-03 02:39:27 PM

YodaBlues: Ooo, how's the wireless bridging work on DD-WRT? Fairly stable? Does it work with DHCP? I'm running Tomato with a wireless bridge from my living room (xbox/tv/media pc) to my FIOS router in the office. Works great, the only problem is it only seems to work with WEP, not WPA2. Not a huge deal, don't have many neighbors I'm worried about, but it would be nice to be a little bit more secure. I tried the same setup with DD-WRT a few years ago, and I could never get the wireless bridge to forward DHCP properly, so I'd have to manually set all my IP addresses. Not a big deal, but I just don't care that much to manually setup all my devices in the living room,


I've had it going for a few weeks between a linksys running dd-wrt and a morotola cable modem/wireless router combo running motorola firmware. WPA2/AES. No hitches, just works.

FWIW, the Motorola has been as solid as any consumer network device I've had with the default firmware. Pretty configurable (port forwarding, guest network, etc). interface is ugly as sin, but I log in like 3 times a year, and it's clear enough where to go. It's almost like motorola's focusing their development on things that matter.
 
2012-07-03 02:39:31 PM
Gig103: Well, now that I can't buy new Linksys routers, even though I used them for over a decade, any suggestions by the Fark community?

You can still buy WRT54GLs and flash them.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=33-124-190

The price keeps creeping up though. Wait until they're on sale (I bought three over the years for between $50-$65). My oldest one is about 7 years old I think.
 
2012-07-03 02:39:32 PM

make me some tea: Note to self: don't buy any more Linksys routers.


.
 
2012-07-03 02:42:22 PM

Dimensio: TwistedIvory: slayer199: There's a few good alternatives if you have a Linksys WRT model. I haven't tried Tomato but I've been using DD-WRT.

My only regret with DD-WRT is that I didn't flash it to my WRT router sooner. I freaking love DD-WRT.

(You mean I can finally do port forwarding and static IP based on MAC address from the router? yippee!)

I use DD-WRT to create a wireless bridge between my computer room -- where my cable modem is connected -- to my living room -- where I have three game consoles and a computer using "wired" network access. The router in the living room is a Linksys device.

The original Linksys firmware would drop an idle connection after ten minutes of inactivity. When using SSH for port forwarding, this caused lost connections. DD-WRT does not feature such "functionality".


Have you tried setting a ServerAliveInterval? That will tell SSH to ping the server every N seconds, which should prevent a lousy router from thinking the connection is idle, and will let you find out sooner if a connection fails.

I use it at work because I often need to maintain several SSH tunnels, many of which run over unreliable networks that could go down without warning.
 
2012-07-03 02:43:09 PM
Ok, try not to be too judgemental, but I bought an Apple Airport Extreme and I absolutely love it. It's got 2 USB ports, one I've plugged a 2 TB hard drive into that I can access from any machine on my network and the other has a printer that is automatically networked. Setting up port forwarding is nice and easy.

That being said, I'm never buying an Apple product again, as I've had 2 of their laptops die within months of the 3 year Applecare Extended plan ending. Probably going Alienware next time out.
 
2012-07-03 02:43:51 PM
I'll second the third party firmwares.Flashed my Netgear WNR3500L with Toastman's Tomato and it gives me complete control over my network. PPTP server, QoS, traffic monitoring, and way more control of the wireless. One thing that seems common, however, is a lack of IPSEC VPN functionality. Though it may be due to licensing issues.

And for an anecdote, there is nothing quite as frustrating as putting a Cisco/Linksys RV042 "business" class router on your network at the insistance of one of your clients for VPN functionality only to have it cause a packet storm and knock your shiny new Exchange 2010 server (and several printers) off the network.
 
2012-07-03 02:44:21 PM

anfrind: Dimensio: TwistedIvory: slayer199: There's a few good alternatives if you have a Linksys WRT model. I haven't tried Tomato but I've been using DD-WRT.

My only regret with DD-WRT is that I didn't flash it to my WRT router sooner. I freaking love DD-WRT.

(You mean I can finally do port forwarding and static IP based on MAC address from the router? yippee!)

I use DD-WRT to create a wireless bridge between my computer room -- where my cable modem is connected -- to my living room -- where I have three game consoles and a computer using "wired" network access. The router in the living room is a Linksys device.

The original Linksys firmware would drop an idle connection after ten minutes of inactivity. When using SSH for port forwarding, this caused lost connections. DD-WRT does not feature such "functionality".

Have you tried setting a ServerAliveInterval? That will tell SSH to ping the server every N seconds, which should prevent a lousy router from thinking the connection is idle, and will let you find out sooner if a connection fails.

I use it at work because I often need to maintain several SSH tunnels, many of which run over unreliable networks that could go down without warning.


As installing replacement firmware has solved the problem, no further adjustment to compensate for poorly designed firmware is needed.
 
2012-07-03 02:45:18 PM

Durendal: This is why God made DD-WRT. I find it funny that companies like Cisco, with tons of money, total knowledge of the product, and expertise for this sort of thing, still crank out firmware that's absolute crap compared to what some guys put together in their spare time.


DD-WRT is completely shiat. The third time it crashed, it reset its settings back to its default which created an open wireless access point. I threw the whole thing out.

/using a netgear n600 now - not a single problem
//generally like cisco for anything but security
///juniper certified
 
2012-07-03 02:46:11 PM

make me some tea: Dinki: I bought a couple of the cisco/linksys routers after the merger. They were shiat. The wireless will randomly stop working, or the whole thing will simply hang. Never buying a cisco product again.

/the old linksys stuff was great.

//Cisco business class routers/firewall/switches are overpriced garbage too.

I've had a Linksys WRT54GL running Tomato for 4 years now. Works great.

The OS that comes preloaded is crap.


OpenWRT on the 54GL here. Nice to have a router that you can configure, add/remove software, etc pretty much like a "real" computer.
 
2012-07-03 02:47:09 PM
Thanks guys, I"ll give DD-WRT another shot. Used to run it years ago on my WRT54GL when it was plugged directly into the my cable modem. A few moves and different routers later, it stopped DHCP packets to any device, so I switched to Tomato and have been running it since. You really can't go wrong with either, but I do notice my signal isn't as strong with Tomato, might worth a shot.
 
2012-07-03 02:47:14 PM
I got sick of crappy routers a few years ago. I had various kinds, all seemed to drop connections or plain stop working periodically.

Then, about 6 years ago, I picked up a TRENDnet TEW-631BRP. Ugly as sin, but works like a champ.

techgage.com

NEVER had to restart it other than to unplug it when I moved.
 
2012-07-03 02:47:53 PM
I've had several over the years, and they've been unreliable pieces of carp. I switched to DLink (825 and a DAP 1522) and it works flawlessly. F*ck Cisco and their nanny state attitudes.
 
2012-07-03 02:47:53 PM

zarberg: Ok, try not to be too judgemental, but I bought an Apple Airport Extreme and I absolutely love it. It's got 2 USB ports, one I've plugged a 2 TB hard drive into that I can access from any machine on my network and the other has a printer that is automatically networked. Setting up port forwarding is nice and easy.


Airport Exterme's are consistently praised for being excellent home routers. They are spendy, but crazy reliable. I gave one to a friend of mine after I volunteered for the SamKnows broadband testing project (free Netgear WNR3500L) after he was struggling with Netgear,Llinksys, and D-Link home routers constantly needing to be power cycled or dropping wifi connections. He hasn't had an issue since.
 
2012-07-03 02:48:05 PM

gingerjet: Durendal: This is why God made DD-WRT. I find it funny that companies like Cisco, with tons of money, total knowledge of the product, and expertise for this sort of thing, still crank out firmware that's absolute crap compared to what some guys put together in their spare time.

DD-WRT is completely shiat. The third time it crashed, it reset its settings back to its default which created an open wireless access point. I threw the whole thing out.

/using a netgear n600 now - not a single problem
//generally like cisco for anything but security
///juniper certified


How difficult is configuring wireless bridge setup on a Netgear N600?
 
2012-07-03 02:48:12 PM

zarberg: Ok, try not to be too judgemental, but I bought an Apple Airport Extreme and I absolutely love it. It's got 2 USB ports, one I've plugged a 2 TB hard drive into that I can access from any machine on my network and the other has a printer that is automatically networked. Setting up port forwarding is nice and easy.

That being said, I'm never buying an Apple product again, as I've had 2 of their laptops die within months of the 3 year Applecare Extended plan ending. Probably going Alienware next time out.


I used to buy Airport Expresses. I have one for travel purposes for the odd hotel without Wireless service. But I don't really like them. They overheat like a biatch and you can't configure them with a web browser. I tried running two Expresses in bridge mode and I've come to the conclusion that I'd rather punch myself in the dick than do that again.
 
2012-07-03 02:49:04 PM

nvmac: Lor M. Ipsum: Generation_D: Cisco apparently never read Routergod. Or believes that a network at home is sort of like a privacy boundary

I have a feeling that the article could be exaggerating. A router should be able to act as a standalone device, like hosting a private LAN. If Cisco decentralizes administrative access of the router onto the Internet, how would administrating a private network even be possible?

CIsco's official response:Link

Engadget article could be misleading. More to come I'm sure.

/slashies


I have not read Engadget's article but this has been on Slashdot for a while. Taking away local access to a router is never a good move.
 
2012-07-03 02:49:30 PM
I would check the uptime on my current routers, but one was reset relatively recently due to cleaning and the other is currently offline as it has no use after the television used as a monitor for all connected devices exploded.
 
2012-07-03 02:50:07 PM
Roll your own. m0n0wall or smoothwall just needs an old PC with 2 nics. Faster, more stable and more features. Past that, you just need a switch. Super easy to admin and very very stable.
 
2012-07-03 02:51:36 PM

lordargent: Gig103: Well, now that I can't buy new Linksys routers, even though I used them for over a decade, any suggestions by the Fark community?

You can still buy WRT54GLs and flash them.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=33-124-190

The price keeps creeping up though. Wait until they're on sale (I bought three over the years for between $50-$65). My oldest one is about 7 years old I think.


I got a refurb one from newegg recently for $30. Works great.
 
2012-07-03 02:52:13 PM

lappyx86: Roll your own. m0n0wall or smoothwall just needs an old PC with 2 nics. Faster, more stable and more features. Past that, you just need a switch. Super easy to admin and very very stable.


I may be doing this tonight. A friend of mine has a nettop he doesn't use and it may be perfect as a low power linux router.
 
2012-07-03 02:59:22 PM

Slam Dunkz: Gig103: Well, now that I can't buy new Linksys routers, even though I used them for over a decade, any suggestions by the Fark community? Netgear?

I've been using various SMC stuff since the late '90s. They've been rock solid for me every time I've gotten one.


I had an SMC 8012 (or 8013, I forget) on my Comcast business circuit. Talk about a festering pile of dog shiat. If you were using it as a NAT gateway, any heavy traffic loads would tank it requiring a power-cycle. Put it into bridge mode & used my 1811 as the NAT edge router and never looked back.

Also made life easier when I kicked Comcast to the curb and got Centurylink, I didn't have to do any BS renumbering.
 
2012-07-03 03:02:11 PM
zarberg: Ok, try not to be too judgemental, but I bought an Apple Airport Extreme

Aren't those things like $120?

I suppose the USB ports are nice, but I already have a computer to hook an external drive up to.

// And people have modded USB ports onto the GS (which makes you wonder why they didn't slap them on there in the first place).
 
2012-07-03 03:03:29 PM
Another thing that I always found curious is how they try to sell their single antenna, single port bridge for more than their router.

When you can buy the router, flash it, and have a dual antenna bridge with five ports.
 
2012-07-03 03:04:32 PM
At the risk of flamage, Apple's AirPort Extremes are very, very good. Easy as all get out to set up quickly, but has plenty of advanced options if you look for them.

http://www.apple.com/airportextreme/
 
2012-07-03 03:09:57 PM
www.blogcdn.com
This. This made my day. No need to read the rest of the article, someone at engadget is awesome.
 
2012-07-03 03:11:48 PM

Gig103: Well, now that I can't buy new Linksys routers, even though I used them for over a decade, any suggestions by the Fark community? Netgear?


Asus N56ULink A midrange router I bought for 170, but it's priced at 130 now.

The UI is sweet, the UPnP is simple, so are the dual band settings. Plugged in a Synology NAS to it, and it streams my own personal cloud network just great. (I refuse to go actual cloud)
 
2012-07-03 03:16:01 PM

Linux_Yes: Cisco is the most reliable for LAN and enterprise I've ever seen, with the most features for administration, management and monitoring.


Maybe the best you've seen

Cisco is absolutely the best router in the world.

Wrong.

Foundry, biatches. Foundry.
 
2012-07-03 03:20:10 PM
I swear this is not a placeholder for later when I get home and pull out 3-4 WRT's which are gathering dust in a hall closet to test out DD-WRT. Nope. Not. A. Placeholder.
 
2012-07-03 03:25:02 PM

FinFangFark: Gig103: Well, now that I can't buy new Linksys routers, even though I used them for over a decade, any suggestions by the Fark community? Netgear?

Asus N56ULink A midrange router I bought for 170, but it's priced at 130 now.

The UI is sweet, the UPnP is simple, so are the dual band settings. Plugged in a Synology NAS to it, and it streams my own personal cloud network just great. (I refuse to go actual cloud)


Looks nice. I may get one. Does it support multiple WAN ip addresses? I have four statics and my disposal.
 
2012-07-03 03:25:28 PM
Also


Cant you hear me lockin, down your router
Cant you hear me lockin, down your ports
Cant you hear me lockin, down your dirty tcp, yeah
 
2012-07-03 03:28:03 PM
Anyone want to hazard that Cisco is just acting on order from DHS? Or is my tinfoil hat on too tight?
 
2012-07-03 03:31:09 PM

HempHead: Anyone want to hazard that Cisco is just acting on order from DHS? Or is my tinfoil hat on too tight?


I would think they'd be doing it without any notification if that were the case.
 
2012-07-03 03:33:13 PM

lordargent: zarberg: Ok, try not to be too judgemental, but I bought an Apple Airport Extreme

Aren't those things like $120?


I don't have an airport, but it's not just a router. It's a router, NAS, print server, and airplay server. If you use even two of those things that stuff, it's worth the money. If you use it for three of those things, it's a bargain. If all you use it for is routing, it's a rip-off.

If you keep a computer powered on 24/7 to act as a NAS, then you'd easily save enough on power to pay for the device.
 
2012-07-03 03:33:57 PM

zarberg: HempHead: Anyone want to hazard that Cisco is just acting on order from DHS? Or is my tinfoil hat on too tight?

I would think they'd be doing it without any notification if that were the case.


They did do it without any notification. That was a large part of the problem.
 
2012-07-03 03:39:15 PM

Honest Bender: Linux_Yes: Cisco is the most reliable for LAN and enterprise I've ever seen, with the most features for administration, management and monitoring.

Maybe the best you've seen

Cisco is absolutely the best router in the world.

Wrong.

Foundry, biatches. Foundry.


Foundry was absorbed by Brocade, but yeah, so far they're still good. I'm not completely pleased with their multicast routing, but I'm not in a position to compare it to Cisco.
 
2012-07-03 03:43:36 PM

Honest Bender: They did do it without any notification. That was a large part of the problem.


I guess I was a bit confusing, I didn't mean prior warning - they did what they did without that. But they did technically notify;

FTA:

To make matters worse, the Connect Cloud service came with a supplemental privacy policy that explicitly allowed Cisco to peek at a user's "internet history," "traffic" and "other related information.

If it was some shady cloak-and-dagger scheme, they wouldn't even have put in that privacy policy. Jeeze, I'd like to think that if the government wanted to do something like that they'd send back occasional packets with info on where you're surfing and disguise them as the router looking for updates.
 
2012-07-03 03:45:29 PM
Read about this last week, and had the same disconnect issues on my old Linksys router mentioned earlier in the thread. Just got my new Asus RT-N16 router and flashed with Toastman firmware last night. Holy crap, I never knew what I was missing out on.
 
2012-07-03 03:46:30 PM

RatOmeter: Foundry was absorbed by Brocade, but yeah, so far they're still good. I'm not completely pleased with their multicast routing, but I'm not in a position to compare it to Cisco.


I work for a tier 1 global provider. Long ago, we dumped all our networking gear for Foundry/Brocade equipment. Partially due to quality, but also in large part due to dual stack support.
 
2012-07-03 03:47:21 PM

nvmac: Dinki: I bought a couple of the cisco/linksys routers after the merger. They were shiat. The wireless will randomly stop working, or the whole thing will simply hang. Never buying a cisco product again.

/the old linksys stuff was great.

//Cisco business class routers/firewall/switches are overpriced garbage too.

Really?

Been managing Cisco devices for 15 years, also worked on HP, Linksys (pre and post Cisco), Juniper, and Avaya.

Cisco is the most reliable for LAN and enterprise I've ever seen, with the most features for administration, management and monitoring.

Overpriced? Agree.

Garbage? Do not agree.

Belkin is garbage. Never managed one that worked right.


Airlink is another shiat one. We had an Airlink wireless router that somehow made all our printers take 15 minutes to print out a page. That was a lot of fun.
 
2012-07-03 03:51:07 PM

Jormungandr: nvmac: Dinki: I bought a couple of the cisco/linksys routers after the merger. They were shiat. The wireless will randomly stop working, or the whole thing will simply hang. Never buying a cisco product again.

/the old linksys stuff was great.

//Cisco business class routers/firewall/switches are overpriced garbage too.

Really?

Been managing Cisco devices for 15 years, also worked on HP, Linksys (pre and post Cisco), Juniper, and Avaya.

Cisco is the most reliable for LAN and enterprise I've ever seen, with the most features for administration, management and monitoring.

Overpriced? Agree.

Garbage? Do not agree.

Belkin is garbage. Never managed one that worked right.

Airlink is another shiat one. We had an Airlink wireless router that somehow made all our printers take 15 minutes to print out a page. That was a lot of fun.


I remember airlinks when I used to shop at Frys. My brother bought their USB adapters...talk about utter crap. I was skeptical about the Asus networking equipment, but it's all been great to me so far.

I also bought a Motorola surfboard DOCSIS 3 modem so I don't have to lease from Comcast, and all that combined, my home network streams great to all my devices...though I had to adjust the download master settings on the router b/c it was saving directly to the USB drive and NAS, and that was causing buffering issues while people were streaming the home media. I save my torrents locally, then move over at a later time the NAS is not in use.
 
2012-07-03 04:00:18 PM

Lor M. Ipsum: Generation_D: the Connect Cloud service came with a supplemental privacy policy that explicitly allowed Cisco to peek at a user's "internet history," "traffic" and "other related information." If Cisco discovered you had used your router for "pornographic or offensive purposes" or to violate "intellectual property rights," it reserved the right to shut down your cloud account and effectively cut you off from your router.

If this is true, never buying Cisco for home or office again.

Cutting users off from porn? This does not bode well for Cisco.


I wonder if its possible that the MPAA/RIAA goons are going a new route (har har) here. Get to the hardware manufacturers and rope them into their nefarious schemes.
 
2012-07-03 04:04:21 PM

zarberg: Ok, try not to be too judgemental, but I bought an Apple Airport Extreme and I absolutely love it. It's got 2 USB ports, one I've plugged a 2 TB hard drive into that I can access from any machine on my network and the other has a printer that is automatically networked. Setting up port forwarding is nice and easy.


I got one two years ago after getting fed up with the Belkin router randomly freezing up. Outstanding piece of equipment. Been running great since.
 
2012-07-03 04:07:04 PM

nvmac: Lor M. Ipsum: Generation_D: Cisco apparently never read Routergod. Or believes that a network at home is sort of like a privacy boundary

I have a feeling that the article could be exaggerating. A router should be able to act as a standalone device, like hosting a private LAN. If Cisco decentralizes administrative access of the router onto the Internet, how would administrating a private network even be possible?

CIsco's official response:Link

Engadget article could be misleading. More to come I'm sure.

/slashies


Cisco's response is utter bullshiat. It doesn't respond to the actual complaint.

From their TOS:

As a condition of your use of the Service, you agree that your use of the Service in accordance with the terms and conditions of this Agreement is permitted under and will comply with the applicable laws of the country where you use the Service. You agree not to use or permit the use of the Service: (i) to invade another's privacy; (ii) for obscene, pornographic, or offensive purposes; (iii) to infringe another's rights, including but not limited to any intellectual property rights; (iv) to upload, email or otherwise transmit or make available any unsolicited or unauthorized advertising, promotional materials, spam, junk mail or any other form of solicitation; (v) to transmit or otherwise make available any code or virus, or perform any activity, that could harm or interfere with any device, software, network or service (including this Service); or (vi) to violate, or encourage any conduct that would violate any applicable law or regulation or give rise to civil or criminal liability.

While we are not responsible for any content or data that you choose to access or otherwise use in connection with the Service, we reserve the right to take such action as we (i) deem necessary or (ii) are otherwise required to take by a third party or court of competent jurisdiction, in each case in relation to your access or use or misuse of such content or data. Such action may include, without limitation, discontinuing your use of the Service immediately without prior notice to you, and without refund or compensation to you.

You will indemnify and hold us and Cisco Systems Inc. and its affiliates harmless against any claims, losses or damages arising from any threatened, repudiatory or actual breach by you of the covenants set out in this Section.


Link

So, if you like to view porn, like to steal your porn, or try to set up your own porn, Cisco, at their own discretion, will essentially brick your router. And fark you on getting a refund you porn loving hippy.
 
2012-07-03 04:11:28 PM

KierzanDax: nvmac: Lor M. Ipsum: Generation_D:
Cisco's response is utter bullshiat. It doesn't respond to the actual complaint.

From their TOS:

As a condition of your use of the Service, you agree that your use of the Service in accordance with the terms and conditions of this Agreement is permitted under and will comply with the applicable laws of the country where you use the Service. You agree not to use or permit the use of the Service: (i) to invade another's privacy; (ii) for obscene, pornographic, or offensive purposes; (iii) to infringe another's rights, including but not limited to any intellectual property rights; (iv) to upload, email or otherwise transmit or make available any unsolicited or unauthorized advertising, promotional materials, spam, junk mail or any other form of solicitation; (v) to transmit or otherwise make available any code or virus, or perform any activity, that could harm or interfere with any device, software, network or service (including this Service); or (vi) to violate, or encourage any conduct that would violate any applicable law or regulation or give rise to civil or criminal liability.

While we are not responsible for any content or data that you choose to access or otherwise use in connection with the Service, we reserve the right to take such action as we (i) deem necessary or (ii) are otherwise required to take by a third party or court of competent jurisdiction, in each case in relation to your access or use or misuse of such content or data ...


This looks like some drone took some boilerplate terms of service legalese and slapped it on their connect cloud service.
 
2012-07-03 04:11:50 PM

zarberg: f it was some shady cloak-and-dagger scheme, they wouldn't even have put in that privacy policy. Jeeze, I'd like to think that if the government wanted to do something like that they'd send back occasional packets with info on where you're surfing and disguise them as the router looking for updates.


I wouldn't be surprised if it was not the DHS, but rather Cisco's legal team put the clause in to cover their butts.

With the new NAS data center going online in Utah, the government no longer want to get the occasional packet, they want all of them.
 
2012-07-03 04:22:08 PM
Oh Cisco!

www.westernclippings.com
 
2012-07-03 04:24:46 PM

KierzanDax: From their TOS:

As a condition of your use of the Service, you agree that your use of the Service in accordance with the terms and conditions of this Agreement is permitted under and will comply with the applicable laws of the country where you use the Service. You agree not to use or permit the use of the Service: (i) to invade another's privacy; (ii) for obscene, pornographic, or offensive purposes; (iii) to infringe another's rights, including but not limited to any intellectual property rights; (iv) to upload, email or otherwise transmit or make available any unsolicited or unauthorized advertising, promotional materials, spam, junk mail or any other form of solicitation; (v) to transmit or otherwise make available any code or virus, or perform any activity, that could harm or interfere with any device, software, network or service (including this Service); or (vi) to violate, or encourage any conduct that would violate any applicable law or regulation or give rise to civil or criminal liability.

While we are not responsible for any content or data that you choose to access or otherwise use in connection with the Service, we reserve the right to take such action as we (i) deem necessary or (ii) are otherwise required to take by a third party or court of competent jurisdiction, in each case in relation to your access or use or misuse of such content or data. Such action may include, without limitation, discontinuing your use of the Service immediately without prior notice to you, and without refund or compensation to you.

You will indemnify and hold us and Cisco Systems Inc. and its affiliates harmless against any claims, losses or damages arising from any threatened, repudiatory or actual breach by you of the covenants set out in this Section.

Link

So, if you like to view porn, like to steal your porn, or try to set up your own porn, Cisco, at their own discretion, will essentially brick your router. And fark you on getting a refund you porn loving hippy.


Not exactly. That paragraph says if you use their cloud connect service to access your home network and THEN do the pr0n stuff, they'll cut off your cloud connect access.

Having said that, the policy is still bullshiat.
 
2012-07-03 04:31:20 PM

KierzanDax: nvmac: Lor M. Ipsum: Generation_D: Cisco apparently never read Routergod. Or believes that a network at home is sort of like a privacy boundary

I have a feeling that the article could be exaggerating. A router should be able to act as a standalone device, like hosting a private LAN. If Cisco decentralizes administrative access of the router onto the Internet, how would administrating a private network even be possible?

CIsco's official response:Link

Engadget article could be misleading. More to come I'm sure.

/slashies

Cisco's response is utter bullshiat. It doesn't respond to the actual complaint.

From their TOS:

As a condition of your use of the Service, you agree that your use of the Service in accordance with the terms and conditions of this Agreement is permitted under and will comply with the applicable laws of the country where you use the Service. You agree not to use or permit the use of the Service: (i) to invade another's privacy; (ii) for obscene, pornographic, or offensive purposes; (iii) to infringe another's rights, including but not limited to any intellectual property rights; (iv) to upload, email or otherwise transmit or make available any unsolicited or unauthorized advertising, promotional materials, spam, junk mail or any other form of solicitation; (v) to transmit or otherwise make available any code or virus, or perform any activity, that could harm or interfere with any device, software, network or service (including this Service); or (vi) to violate, or encourage any conduct that would violate any applicable law or regulation or give rise to civil or criminal liability.

While we are not responsible for any content or data that you choose to access or otherwise use in connection with the Service, we reserve the right to take such action as we (i) deem necessary or (ii) are otherwise required to take by a third party or court of competent jurisdiction, in each case in relation to your access or use or misuse of such content or data ...


That's referencing their cloud management service, not the router itself. It's most likely a template privacy policy, as Babwa Wawa suggested, as I'm not sure how you'd use a cloud router management service for porn...
 
2012-07-03 04:32:29 PM
*shakes fist at cmunic8r99*
 
2012-07-03 04:33:37 PM
Tales of Cisco-induced semi-psychotic fits are common. Often, people on a Cisco binge end up curled into a fetal ball, shuddering and muttering paranoid rants. Nudity and violence may well be involved too.

Yeah, I know, different Cisco.

Anyway, after years of my WRT54Gv2 working ultra-reliably with DD-WRT, I decided I wanted 802.11n and got a couple of refurbed Netgear WNDR3300 units (which I also flashed with DD-WRT). I'm hanging on to the old WRT, though, as there's nothing wrong with it. What's nice about a lot of the newer units (WNDR3300 included) is that they have two radios, so you can isolate traffic or provide a guest network. I have one WNDR3300 running in bridge mode upstairs and connected to my MythTV setup via the N link, and the downstairs unit hooked to the cable modem. The downstairs G link handles general-purpose wireless through the house.

I'm glad I didn't get suckered into this Cloud Connect Crap. Indeed, anytime I see the word "cloud" with some whizbang new service I take it as a sign to run like hell from it.
 
2012-07-03 04:58:29 PM
I think the issue was forcing people to use the Cloud service if they wanted firmware updates for their routers. So if you didn't want to agree to the Cloud service or its terms, you were SOL b/c you couldn't get upgrades or support for a wonky router/firmware otherwise.
 
2012-07-03 05:06:43 PM
Babwa Wawa: I don't have an airport, but it's not just a router. It's a router, NAS, print server, and airplay server. If you use even two of those things that stuff, it's worth the money. If you use it for three of those things, it's a bargain. If all you use it for is routing, it's a rip-off.


Is the storage built into it? If not, then I think DD-WRT has modules for all of that stuff (except for airplay).

// I just wanted a router :D

// I think even with all of those features, it should be cheaper. Like $100 or so. Adding those additional features is mostly a software thing so shouldn't double the price of a device IMO (even though it is a better deal than buying those devices individually).

// Still ticked off that I bought 2 WET11s at $70 a pop about 12 years ago (before I knew about DD-WRT). So I look very carefully at the true value of hardware/software these days.
 
2012-07-03 05:13:36 PM
Cisco has had to eat crow on a lot of what they brought under their umbrella in the buying spree. They tried mightily to access the consumer market and failed repeatedly. They just don't get it that they can't do to consumers what they can do to enterprise customers and their VARs. They are awesome but still overpriced in the enterprise market. Tthat's their core business and where they should stay.

Methinks that their war with HP isn't going as well as they like and they're getting more competition in the switching market than they're comfortable with. Let's face it, Adtran has switches, routers, and wireless that will do what most people in the small business market need for half the price.

When you're getting your lunch eaten in your core business, you panic. I think that's what this is, superimposing a top-down post-sale support model in an arena where it just doesn't work. You can push people with a million dollars worth of your equipment running their business. You can't when it costs roughly 80 bucks to replace your product entirely.
 
2012-07-03 05:19:35 PM
All the talk of OpenWRT and DD-WRT (excellent distros) makes me want to chime in, no matter how late to the party I might be.

I cast my vote in favour of pfSense on mini-ITX rigs. Enterprise class firewall / router Free-BSD distro. I have acted as a cheerleader for this for the last couple of years and have brought several of my Network Engineer colleagues into the light. I am proud to report that I have costed Cisco a ton of business by having pfSense deployed on HP ProLiant hardware where big ASA / PIX, and router deployments would normally have happened. The fact that you can perform CARP failover, redundant WAN connections, and can acquire enterprise support for peanuts (often a requirement of company policies) makes pfSense a no-brainer.
 
2012-07-03 05:34:33 PM

lordargent: Is the storage built into it? If not, then I think DD-WRT has modules for all of that stuff (except for airplay).


You know, the cheapest linksys I could find that has USB is the EA3500, which lists for $130. Netgear has them cheaper, but I've had difficulty finding alternate firmware for those devices.

the specs for the EA3500 are more in line with the airport extreme, which can be had for $172.

I'm no apple fanboi - I don't have a lick of gear from them, but I don't think the airports are that overpriced.
 
2012-07-03 05:34:42 PM
Well, now I'm ashamed to have recently recommended their gear to a friend of mine looking for a wireless home router.

I won't be doing that again.
 
2012-07-03 05:39:43 PM

nvmac: Dinki: I bought a couple of the cisco/linksys routers after the merger. They were shiat. The wireless will randomly stop working, or the whole thing will simply hang. Never buying a cisco product again.

/the old linksys stuff was great.

//Cisco business class routers/firewall/switches are overpriced garbage too.

Really?

Been managing Cisco devices for 15 years, also worked on HP, Linksys (pre and post Cisco), Juniper, and Avaya.

Cisco is the most reliable for LAN and enterprise I've ever seen, with the most features for administration, management and monitoring.

Overpriced? Agree.

Garbage? Do not agree.

Belkin is garbage. Never managed one that worked right.


I've never had a Linksys router work properly for me. I returned one three times under warranty because the damn thing would randomly drop signal, even when I was in the same room as it. The response I got? It was operating under normal parameters.

Belkin, on the other hand, has never dropped signal or had any issues, even after running constantly for five years. The Linksys couldn't go five hours without needing to be reset.

I wouldn't waste money on Linksys. Sure, they used to be good, but that was a long, long time ago back when Leading Edge made computers and Civ1 was the best game on the market.

/Linksys also overheats like no tomorrow
//in a 40F environment
/can't believe they're still charging the prices they are for their crap
 
2012-07-03 05:52:10 PM
My first ever router was an old PII box I tossed a copy of FreeBSD on and slapped an extra NIC in. It's really as simple as enabling IP forwarding and creating two routes. It eventually grew to include a relatively complex set of firewall rules, a copy of djbdns operating as a cache (at the time, Adelphia had absolutely shiat DNS servers so it was nice to not have to worry about them or use somebody else's) and sshd so I could manage it all with PuTTY. I credit a lot of my early learning about networks and system management to that "router".

By far the most reliable router I ever owned.

Meanwhile, I now have a $40 WNR2000v3 and it's an absolute piece of shiat and I hope everybody employed at Netgear burns in hell for it. The wireless radio just shuts off for no apparent reason at random times. Sometimes heavy use, sometimes light, sometimes at two in the motherfarking morning when nobody is using it.

Piece of crap. SOHO routers aren't really that complex of devices, why can't these companies release one that works?
 
2012-07-03 06:00:19 PM
Ubiquiti makes really nice, modestly priced routers and access points...
 
2012-07-03 06:01:57 PM

FinFangFark: Jormungandr: nvmac: Dinki: I bought a couple of the cisco/linksys routers after the merger. They were shiat. The wireless will randomly stop working, or the whole thing will simply hang. Never buying a cisco product again.

/the old linksys stuff was great.

//Cisco business class routers/firewall/switches are overpriced garbage too.

Really?

Been managing Cisco devices for 15 years, also worked on HP, Linksys (pre and post Cisco), Juniper, and Avaya.

Cisco is the most reliable for LAN and enterprise I've ever seen, with the most features for administration, management and monitoring.

Overpriced? Agree.

Garbage? Do not agree.

Belkin is garbage. Never managed one that worked right.

Airlink is another shiat one. We had an Airlink wireless router that somehow made all our printers take 15 minutes to print out a page. That was a lot of fun.

I remember airlinks when I used to shop at Frys. My brother bought their USB adapters...talk about utter crap. I was skeptical about the Asus networking equipment, but it's all been great to me so far.

I also bought a Motorola surfboard DOCSIS 3 modem so I don't have to lease from Comcast, and all that combined, my home network streams great to all my devices...though I had to adjust the download master settings on the router b/c it was saving directly to the USB drive and NAS, and that was causing buffering issues while people were streaming the home media. I save my torrents locally, then move over at a later time the NAS is not in use.


Motorola Surfboards are pretty decent over all. I hated the " turn off the internet" standby button they had on top for awhile. I was working internet tech support and many times people had just bumped the admittedly reeally sensitive button. But yeah, fark Airlink right in their ears.
 
2012-07-03 06:08:09 PM
Dalek Caan's doomed mistress:
Belkin is garbage. Never managed one that worked right.

I've never had a Linksys router work properly for me. I returned one three times under warranty because the damn thing would randomly drop signal, even when I was in the same room as it. The response I got? It was operating under normal parameters.

Belkin, on the other hand, has never dropped signal or had any issues, even after running constantly for five years. The Linksys couldn't go five hours without needing to be reset.

I wouldn't waste money on Linksys. Sure, they used to be good, but that was a long, long time ago back when Leading Edge made computers and Civ1 was the best game on the market.

/Linksys also overheats like no tomorrow
//in a 40F environment
/can't believe they're still charging the prices they are for their crap

Belkin is not immune to this crap either. A while back, every 8 hours, their routers redirected users to a page offering content filter software. Story.
 
2012-07-03 06:23:07 PM
ill be back
 
2012-07-03 06:39:03 PM
Another +1 here for DD-WRT. You don't even have to be a hardware geek to install/manage it. There are dumbed-down steps online in many places.
 
2012-07-03 07:08:29 PM
HP Pro Curve. I don't have a huge amount of experience with them, but they've been dead reliable and they run cool.
 
2012-07-03 07:50:56 PM

ChubbyTiger: HP Pro Curve. I don't have a huge amount of experience with them, but they've been dead reliable and they run cool.


Procurve is great for businesses, absolutely. Lifetime next day advance-replacement warranty on the bulk of their products. But probably overkill for home user.
 
2012-07-03 08:05:00 PM

alphalemming: Cisco has had to eat crow on a lot of what they brought under their umbrella in the buying spree. They tried mightily to access the consumer market and failed repeatedly. They just don't get it that they can't do to consumers what they can do to enterprise customers and their VARs. They are awesome but still overpriced in the enterprise market. Tthat's their core business and where they should stay.

Methinks that their war with HP isn't going as well as they like and they're getting more competition in the switching market than they're comfortable with. Let's face it, Adtran has switches, routers, and wireless that will do what most people in the small business market need for half the price.

When you're getting your lunch eaten in your core business, you panic. I think that's what this is, superimposing a top-down post-sale support model in an arena where it just doesn't work. You can push people with a million dollars worth of your equipment running their business. You can't when it costs roughly 80 bucks to replace your product entirely.


They should stay in enterprise...and yes they are overpriced in their routers/switches...but where they're gaining is in IP Telephony and blade/server. A lot of companies I know of are switching from Avaya to Cisco and their UCS Blade packages kill HP and Dell on price. While I'm sure that won't last as they're just trying to make inroads, the UCS platform is a sound entry for virtualization.
 
2012-07-03 08:07:41 PM

Splinshints: My first ever router was an old PII box I tossed a copy of FreeBSD on and slapped an extra NIC in. It's really as simple as enabling IP forwarding and creating two routes. It eventually grew to include a relatively complex set of firewall rules, a copy of djbdns operating as a cache (at the time, Adelphia had absolutely shiat DNS servers so it was nice to not have to worry about them or use somebody else's) and sshd so I could manage it all with PuTTY. I credit a lot of my early learning about networks and system management to that "router".

By far the most reliable router I ever owned.

Meanwhile, I now have a $40 WNR2000v3 and it's an absolute piece of shiat and I hope everybody employed at Netgear burns in hell for it. The wireless radio just shuts off for no apparent reason at random times. Sometimes heavy use, sometimes light, sometimes at two in the motherfarking morning when nobody is using it.

Piece of crap. SOHO routers aren't really that complex of devices, why can't these companies release one that works?


My first router was an old Pentium 90 with 2 NICs running on a bootable 3.5" floppy using the Linux Router Project. Fun stuff. Worked well at the time.
 
2012-07-03 08:12:44 PM
I work for an ISP that uses PPPoE for the wireless and DSL connections. Therefore I cannot stand the e-series Cisco routers, and their habit of disconnecting and reconnecting every 30 seconds no matter what you set the connect mode to, and regardless of whether or not the connection is in use.

Also, here is a list of how my customers have pronounced Linksys:

Linski (by far the most popular)
Linkski
Linksystems
Link Eye
Link 5 Y 5
Lynx
Ling-bees (seriously!)
Link
Linkies
 
2012-07-03 08:35:42 PM
It's bad enough the cable company here locks you out of tweaking the modem/router because too many people didn't know how to work the farking web interface -- and you cannot log into the modem to make it a bridge with your own router until you give them a call for the username/password to get inside it. Stuck with their SSID and weak ass encryption too.

/at least its 40mbps
 
2012-07-03 09:19:30 PM

DanZero: It's bad enough the cable company here locks you out of tweaking the modem/router because too many people didn't know how to work the farking web interface -- and you cannot log into the modem to make it a bridge with your own router until you give them a call for the username/password to get inside it. Stuck with their SSID and weak ass encryption too.

/at least its 40mbps


Telus, here in Canada, imposes upon its users an all-in-one Wireless router / ADSL modem. That's all fine and good until you find that the firmware has been replaced with a Telus special. Even if you disable WiFi, it broadcasts a "TELUSXXXX" (where X is an arbitrary number) SSID so they can sell the bandwidth they already sold to you, to subscribers of their WiFi anywhere product. Since every other household uses Telus, you're almost always near a Telus hotspot. There is a direct-to-WAN port so your own devices can get a public IP, but Telus has disabled that port in their firmware so that the only device that can get an IP is the one router they provide. Then they have disabled all of the advanced features of the device and require you to call them to make any changes.

Confront them on the phone and they offer to let you change to a simple featureless ADSL modem for an additional fee.
 
2012-07-03 11:00:20 PM
Gone through 7 Linksys PCI wireless cards. Not a single one worked properly or consistently.

$5 cheap pieces of crap from Dealextreme have yet to fail me, however.
 
2012-07-03 11:35:21 PM
So what if they loose all their owners that watch porn and/or illegally download things. That couldn't be more than a couple of hundred people. Right?

Moral high ground? I guess if your into that sorta thing. Thinking 100% of your customers aren't watching porn and/or downloading something they shouldn't once in a whole is just stupid.
 
2012-07-03 11:58:23 PM

NBSV: So what if they loose all their owners that watch porn and/or illegally download things. That couldn't be more than a couple of hundred people. Right?

Moral high ground? I guess if your into that sorta thing. Thinking 100% of your customers aren't watching porn and/or downloading something they shouldn't once in a whole is just stupid.


-- sent from my iPhone
 
2012-07-04 12:24:58 AM
Stupid idiots at Cisco:
.............../´¯/)............ (\¯`\
............/....//..............\\....\
.........../....//............ ....\\....\
...../´¯/..../´¯\.............../¯ `\....\¯`\
../.../..../..../.|_......._| .\....\....\...\.\..
(.(....(....(..../.)..). .. .(..(. \....)....)....).)
.\................\/.../.... .\. ..\/................/
..\................. /.........\..................../
....\..............(.......... ..)................/
 
2012-07-04 02:11:06 AM
Babwa Wawa: the specs for the EA3500 are more in line with the airport extreme, which can be had for $172.
I'm no apple fanboi - I don't have a lick of gear from them, but I don't think the airports are that overpriced.


I think both of them are overpriced :D

I've read instructables where someone takes a ~$60 router, solders a pair of USB connection on it, and loads the proper firmware image. Boom, network storage and print server.

At its core, the firmware is Linux based (which is why they had to release the original WRT firmware, it was under the GNU license IIRC). From there, it was easy enough to add services for it to act as a print server (it's linux, so you can use CUPS) or networked storage (free NAS, open NAS, etc). DD-WRT already supports this functionality.

So if most of the onus of supporting this stuff is on the software side (and that's already a done deal), then hardware wise, there's not a huge difference between a $50 router and a $150+ router. (if the $150 one doesn't have onboard storage). Maybe one has more flash ram or a slightly faster CPU, and it has some USB ports that really cost the manufacturer a few cents in components and a few bucks worth of design time.

So I see no reason for the damn things to be 2-3x the price of a standard router.

// I already have a desktop, that $100 price difference is another 500GB drive for my RAID :D
 
2012-07-04 02:29:10 AM
Babwa Wawa: the specs for the EA3500 are more in line with the airport extreme, which can be had for $172.
I'm no apple fanboi - I don't have a lick of gear from them, but I don't think the airports are that overpriced.


A little bit of FAQ searching.

http://www.dd-wrt.com/wiki/index.php/USB

"The cost of USB-capable network routers starts at $45 for the Asus WL-520gU (as of September 23, 2009), depending on capability, but the ability to add external hardware easily makes these far more powerful units. "

(I just checked on newegg, they're available for $42.99 right now after rebate, four eggs with 590 ratings ... it only has one port though so you would have to throw in $5-10 for a USB hub :P)

// The cheapest linksys I could find with a built in USB port was an E2100L for $105

/// For folks that don't need USB, I just noticed that the WRT54GLs are currently on sale at newegg for $50 (they were $65 when I looked the other day),
 
2012-07-04 03:52:03 AM
I retired my WRT54GL in favour of an E4200 mostly so that I could get wireless N. At first I was bummed to see the EA4500 come out soon after but at least the E4200 is disrespect cloud free.

This is dumbest idea I've ever heard, I'll be looking elsewhere for my next (probably 802.11ac) purchase.
 
2012-07-04 05:32:00 AM
Using a dlink dir-615 sold directly by Videotron. Stock software, works wonders. Modem is separate and you cant modify anything on it.
 
2012-07-04 10:41:17 AM
I recall hearing that there is already a law that any time you look at a porn pic, a message is sent to the administration (or something like that). This sounds like an expanded result of that.
 
2012-07-04 10:42:52 AM

lordargent: // The cheapest linksys I could find with a built in USB port was an E2100L for $105


I've been waiting for them to go to USB3, in order to be more compatible with the current external drives.
 
2012-07-04 10:43:31 AM
Rather, download a porn pic...
 
2012-07-04 08:26:11 PM
Lord, God, I wish I could comment on this, but I don't work for the Linksys side. This actually, really, surprises me. Consumer suuuuuure works a hell of a lot differently than Enterprise!!!!
 
2012-07-04 09:52:32 PM
OpenBSD and pf ftw.
 
2012-07-05 12:25:10 AM
IronTom: I've been waiting for them to go to USB3, in order to be more compatible with the current external drives.

I don't know why companies don't take a good design that they have and make minor modifications and improvements over the years, vs redesigning the entire thing every X number of years.

It seems to me that once you've made a badass design like the WRT, maybe add some USB ports down the road, an SD card slot. Release an N version, etc.

Let economies of scale and the methodical drop in the price of tech continually add to the profit you make per device.

EX, these are the newegg rating stats for the WRT54GL.

5 stars 82% (3,024)
4 stars 9% (339)
3 stars 3% (97)
2 stars 2% (80)
1 stars 4% (133)

// and I'm willing to bet that a lot of those 1 & 2 star reviews are using the crappy stock firmware :D

So what's it missing? USB ports and 802.11n capability.

So what did the hardware hackers do? Figured out a way to solder USB ports onto it.

// should have re-released a version with USB ports for a reasonable increase in price ($10 more?) and it would have sold like hotcakes. Instead, they released 1) A version with fixed antennae (so that it was no longer easy to replace stock antennae with high gain or directional ones) and 2) A version with internal antennae.
 
2012-07-05 12:55:45 AM

IronTom: I've been waiting for them to go to USB3, in order to be more compatible with the current external drives.


If by compatible you mean getting faster speeds, you're wasting your time with routers. Most go about 5-10 MB/s with the fastest the E4200 v2 barely cracking 20 MB/s, compared to about 30 MB/s that USB 2.0 is capable of. They would have to vastly improve the router performance in this area to make putting USB3 on them at all worth it.

NAS units with USB ports can do a bit better. Good ones can get 25-30 MB/s on USB2 but often the USB3 is still disappointing. Really you're best off the just plugging the drive into a computer and sharing it over the network.
 
2012-07-05 11:18:28 AM

IronTom: I recall hearing that there is already a law that any time you look at a porn pic, a message is sent to the administration (or something like that). This sounds like an expanded result of that.


There might be something on the books if you are visiting a known child porn site or something. But nobody is getting a note everytime you load up redtube or anything like that.
 
2012-07-05 04:58:16 PM

babtras: All the talk of OpenWRT and DD-WRT (excellent distros) makes me want to chime in, no matter how late to the party I might be.

I cast my vote in favour of pfSense on mini-ITX rigs. Enterprise class firewall / router Free-BSD distro. I have acted as a cheerleader for this for the last couple of years and have brought several of my Network Engineer colleagues into the light. I am proud to report that I have costed Cisco a ton of business by having pfSense deployed on HP ProLiant hardware where big ASA / PIX, and router deployments would normally have happened. The fact that you can perform CARP failover, redundant WAN connections, and can acquire enterprise support for peanuts (often a requirement of company policies) makes pfSense a no-brainer.


After reading your comment, I threw pfSense on an old P4 to see what it could do.

Very impressive. I really like the broad features. I just wish I had a lower power device to run it on. I had running a full PC for a router.

Just gotta get QoS working properly now...
 
2012-07-05 11:19:30 PM
Scientology has been infiltrating Cisco for quite a while now. This smells like them.
 
2012-07-06 03:11:04 PM

gingerjet: Durendal: This is why God made DD-WRT. I find it funny that companies like Cisco, with tons of money, total knowledge of the product, and expertise for this sort of thing, still crank out firmware that's absolute crap compared to what some guys put together in their spare time.

DD-WRT is completely shiat. The third time it crashed, it reset its settings back to its default which created an open wireless access point. I threw the whole thing out.

/using a netgear n600 now - not a single problem
//generally like cisco for anything but security
///juniper certified


That's the exact opposite of my experience. Never had a problem with DD-WRT, but I've had nothing but problems with the horrid dogshiat that Netgear makes. I've even seen unmanaged switches from them blast a network with piss when you hook up a different brand, I shiat you not.
 
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