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(Politico)   Remember the 13-year-old kid at CPAC 2009 who was going to be the conservative voice for a new generation? Well, he grew up and started thinking for himself. Then guess what happened   (politico.com) divider line 290
    More: Obvious, CPAC, democratic convention, pendulum, substantive, conservative talk, Newt Gingrich, blurbs, Jonathan Krohn  
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11771 clicks; posted to Politics » on 02 Jul 2012 at 6:22 PM (3 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2012-07-03 09:39:22 AM  

Debeo Summa Credo: Hilarious. Although it isn't surprising that this kid changed his mind from the time he was 13 to the time he is 16, it shouldn't be surprising if he changes his mind again when he's 19 and 25 and 38.

Serves the CPAC right for trotting out a 13 year old, anyway.

Also, FWIW - nietzsche, kant, etc. at 16? This kid sounds like he's probably a pretentious douche, regardless of being right wing or left wing.


We are all pretending to be something we are not.
 
2012-07-03 09:42:53 AM  

kid_icarus: Grand_Moff_Joseph: Maybe there is hope for the youngest among us after all.

Absolutely. As the kid pointed out...a 13 year old is basically just parroting what he has heard from his community. He isn't old enough to have really developed critical thinking skills and formed opinions of his own. Myself, and lots of other kids from very conservative backgrounds, manage to evolve beyond that as we get older.


Some of us never progress mentally past 13. Which is good for Rush Limbaugh, who relies on 13-year-olds.
 
2012-07-03 09:46:15 AM  

keylock71: Without Fail: o5iiawah: Wait until this kid has a job and works Monday and Tuesday just for Uncle Sam. The swing back around is inevitable.

I've been working 35 years and have yet to become a selfish fark.

Heh... I'm 41 and, if anything, I've gotten more "liberal" in my political views.

Hell, these days, thanks in part to the sheer unhinged lunacy coming from the GOP, I'm pretty much a Democratic Socialist.


I've never voted for a GOP candidate for president or senate, but I'm being pushed to the right by the idiocy of the far left I see on fark everyday.

I'm still planning to vote for Obama this November (I dont mind Romney but think Obama's done a pretty good job considering, and has avoided being too left wing), but it is refreshing to abandon the "party first" mentality that I admit I've been guilty of since about the GOP lewinsky witch trial
nonsense.
 
2012-07-03 09:50:29 AM  

BMulligan: By the way, in 1972 I was ringing doorbells for Richard Nixon. By 1976, I was one of the few liberals in the state of Idaho. This kid's evolution is very familiar to me. And for those of you who think age will inevitably bring him back to conservatism, I wouldn't be so sure. At the age of 51, I'm probably more liberal than ever. For me, having a career, owning property, and raising a child all served to reinforce my liberalism.


Speaking as someone who worked the polls for Reagan back in 1988 and manned a phone bank for Obama in 2008, I'm right there with you. Having to deal with complex problems where the answers don't seem to match up with dogma (from either side) forces you to actually think, or at least it should.

That said, it's only part that I've become more liberal, it's that the political landscape has shifted so far right that anything seems liberal these days. It's worth remembering that "Obamacare" was dreamed up by the conservative Heritage Foundation, supported by Newt Gingrich and first implemented by Mitt Romney. Now it's the leftiest left ELEVENTY!!!! socialisum that there ever has been. Obama's stimulus package was 40% tax cuts, but since they didn't go to the "job creators" they are worthless. Environmental conservation has long been a conservative goal (and it's IMHO the most obvious one)- it has a long history with presidents like Teddy Roosevelt and Richard Nixon, except today the EPA is the devil's work.
 
2012-07-03 09:50:57 AM  

Debeo Summa Credo: Also, FWIW - nietzsche, kant, etc. at 16? This kid sounds like he's probably a pretentious douche, regardless of being right wing or left wing.


Any half-bright 16-year old is likely to be reading some philosophy. Just because you and your friends were still reading Archie comics doesn't mean that the rest of us weren't a bit more intellectually curious.

Oh, and for the record - Ayn Rand doesn't count as philosophy.
 
2012-07-03 09:51:10 AM  
Ignorance is taught.
 
2012-07-03 09:51:42 AM  

intelligent comment below: I classify an entire generation based on many factors.

Percentage of young people who vote


Always dismaying, but to be quite frank, can you blame young people for thinking their vote is worthless? Look at the jokers who run for office.

School test scores

Haven't seen the figures here. Can you provide them, preferably in a metric that could compare easily to previous generations?

Declining viewership of all types of news media (except entertainment news like The Daily Show because, like I said earlier, obsessed with entertainment)

Please. The Daily Show is the hardest news on TV. That's not praise for The Daily Show, mind, but condemnation for the ongoing joke that is TV news.

Large twitter and facebook users

And...?

Large viewership of mindless entertainment on tv like Dancing with the Stars, American Idol, etc.

American Idol's largest demographic is 35-49 year olds. Dancing with the Stars skews even older. Hardly the damning condemnation of young people you think it is.
 
2012-07-03 09:52:42 AM  

insano: fusillade762: NURBS: Lorelle: *cries tears of joy*

There's still hope for the younger generation.

/ex-conservative

Still hope for the younger generation? You mean the generation that is accepting of all lifestyles, is in favor of healthcare for all, cares about the environment, wants to end the unproductive war on drugs, doesn't try to control women's bodies, and actually cares about other people? The generation that didn't spend all their children's money, didn't crash the economy by creating bubble after bubble and then refuse to accept any responsibility, and didn't demand more tax cuts for themselves and less money for education for their kids? That generation? Yeah, I think that generation is going to be just fine.

I wouldn't be so certain about that. Seems younger voters may be starting to skew right. Something about coming of age in a recession.

Pres. Obama's Weakening Grip on Young Voters Could Cost Him Election

So, reading this article, I found a bunch of anecdotal interviews and one cited poll which found that Obama is dominating among one group of youths slightly less than among the other groups of young voters. Oh and that group, which is apparently an 'opportunity for Romney,' is 18-24 year olds who don't vote anyways.


And furthermore, I don't think, even if there were ALL to vote, that voting for the conservative choice is the way to show your disdain for the democrat who isn't liberal enough. Wait til they learn to appreciate pragmatism a little more, and possibly develop a deeper understanding of US civics.

The GOP is *counting* on these pipe dreams. That if they stay their course, they'll pick up some voters. I ... am finding it increasingly difficult to believe that the major players in the party aren't deliberately sabotaging its future for some reason. Perhaps a sacrifice to thin the veil between reality and the Immaterium so they can call on the unholy powers of The Warp and subjugate humanity to the whims of Chaos? Hard to say.

/Lesson to 20 somethings: You cain't always git whatchu wa-ant.
 
2012-07-03 09:53:22 AM  

OgreMagi: I will repeat, the POVERTY rate has remained pretty much the same since the mid-60s. And yes, the war on poverty was intended to eliminate the problem. It hasn't. It is running in place. It's time to reassess things and figure out what can be done to eliminate poverty.


Cut taxes to the rich and eliminate minimal wage laws, medicaid, and welfare.
 
2012-07-03 09:54:56 AM  

Satanic_Hamster: OgreMagi: I will repeat, the POVERTY rate has remained pretty much the same since the mid-60s. And yes, the war on poverty was intended to eliminate the problem. It hasn't. It is running in place. It's time to reassess things and figure out what can be done to eliminate poverty.

Cut taxes to the rich and eliminate minimal wage laws, medicaid, and welfare.


After all, if we kill all the poor people, we don't have to worry about poor people any more!
 
2012-07-03 09:55:08 AM  
Well duh. Look at his effeminate features. He was bound to go liberal.
 
2012-07-03 09:56:47 AM  

BMulligan: Debeo Summa Credo: Also, FWIW - nietzsche, kant, etc. at 16? This kid sounds like he's probably a pretentious douche, regardless of being right wing or left wing.

Any half-bright 16-year old is likely to be reading some philosophy. Just because you and your friends were still reading Archie comics doesn't mean that the rest of us weren't a bit more intellectually curious.

Oh, and for the record - Ayn Rand doesn't count as philosophy.


You sound like a pretentious douche, too.

Who mentioned anything about Ayn Rand?
 
2012-07-03 10:10:47 AM  

The My Little Pony Killer: Wait, so he was 13 when he gave that speech, and he's 17 now and has gotten better, but the speech was given in 2010, so...?


He borrowed President Fart's time machine.

I had my own unfortunate period of infatuation with the writings of Ayn Rand. Luckily nobody let me speak at a national convention.
 
2012-07-03 10:19:55 AM  

intelligent comment below: COMALite J: skullkrusher: intelligent comment below: I classify an entire generation based on many factors.

first half of the first sentence. Dead giveaway that you were, once again, going to put the lie to your Fark handle

Now, now, his FARK handle is not a lie. It just refers to the comments below his own (generally those Replying to and refuting his). Note that it doesn't say how far "below" the intelligent comment is to be found.


I was wondering how long it would take for his support group to show up

Typical troll tactics: Don't debate person's posts, just insult them


yeah, it's the trolls against you, the brave, solitary light of truth in the wilderness. When someone calls you out on your asshattery, it is because he is trolling. If there are more than one, it's because they are alts. Sweet cocoon, brah.
 
2012-07-03 10:22:10 AM  

topcon: [images.politico.com image 605x328][wp.patheos.com.s3.amazonaws.com image 350x262]


Hey, nice catch. Smart. Good eye. Thanks for sharing. Just one thing, though.

It's already the VERY FIRST GODDAMN IMAGE AT THE TOP OF THE THREAD.
 
2012-07-03 10:41:45 AM  
i.imgur.com


media.celebremix.com
 
2012-07-03 10:49:16 AM  

Debeo Summa Credo: You sound like a pretentious douche, too.


Yeah, all that book-learnin' is pretty pretentious.
 
2012-07-03 11:05:07 AM  

Lunaville: Yes, personal experience is completely irrelevant when you are accusing an entire generation of being alliterate


lol
 
2012-07-03 11:16:37 AM  

Felgraf: GleeUnit: simsite9: What's funny is that almost every reason he gives for his shift is ultimately an insult to CPAC types.

"I've matured."
"I've given it more thought."
"The issues are so complex, you can't just go with some ideological mantra for each substantive issue."

The larger question is, why does about 25% of the population get stuck at 12 years old with a simplistic view of the world, and never move on?

Because thinking for yourself and questioning your surroundings is scary.

Lots of people really like their bubbles - a safe place where they can convince themselves that they've got it all figured out, and then tune their TV to a station that consistently reinforces that belief. Willful, blissful ignorance seems like it would probably be a very comfortable way to exist. Glad to see this kid was able to break out of that.

Aye. The thought that perhaps everything you knew was wrong, everything you'd been taught was incorrect.. that's goddamn TERRIFYING for a lot of people. So they refuse to acknowledge it as a possibility.



No..the problem is that people believe that there is a singular "right" answer. and that if the other side would "just listen" the right answer could be explained...There isn't one right answer there are several right answers.....or maybe there are no right answers.

android vs iphone
Vanilla vs. chocolate
Tupac vs. Biggy

There isn't a "correct choice" only a best fit for you...

/Do not try to bend the spoon - that's impossible. Instead, only try to realize the truth: there is no spoon.
 
2012-07-03 11:16:38 AM  

More_Like_A_Stain: Lunaville: Yes, personal experience is completely irrelevant when you are accusing an entire generation of being alliterate

lol


I misspelled it again didn't I? Yep, just checked. You'd think my yo-yo brain could retain the spelling of one simple word.

Senile Sally can't spell. Silly, senile Sally.
I wish I were clever enough to come up with something relevant using Luna.
 
2012-07-03 11:19:56 AM  

JerseyTim: Here's the earliest thread I could find about him.

Here's Jon Stewart at the time. (And a Fark thread on that, too.)


An Archivist is something I wish I could be. Good on you. Thanks for those links.
 
2012-07-03 11:55:25 AM  

More_Like_A_Stain: Lunaville: Yes, personal experience is completely irrelevant when you are accusing an entire generation of being alliterate

lol


Actually, that is a word (albeit misspelled). Illiterate means unable to read, aliterate means unwilling to read.
 
2012-07-03 12:07:25 PM  
Parents who make their kids parrot what they think piss me off. I almost voted for Scott Walker a few weeks back out of spite due to the number of protestors picketing with their kids holding signs saying "Vote for Barrett to save my education".
 
2012-07-03 12:12:32 PM  

OgreMagi: Gwyrddu: OgreMagi: But I also don't want my money thrown down the black hole of social programs that haven't fixed any problems. I'm not an evil bastard, so I don't want to cut off aid to single moms (or dads) who are struggling to feed their kids, but I also don't like those (rare) baby factories who see welfare as their career.

What's your solution then that doesn't involve spending more money? If you cut welfare programs then they these programs will become worse at getting help to the people who need.

Welfare isn't designed to solve poverty or unemployment, that is well beyond the reach the program (and in most states cash assistance has been capped at least since Bill Clinton reformed the program). The different welfare programs are meant to keep people are meant to give people who have fallen through the cracks the basic necessities of survival while being uncomfortable enough that nobody with other options chooses to be on it, and which they do.

/I made a whole post about working a volunteer science GED teacher and seeing all the people with larger problems falling through the cracks that were beyond my help, but my computer ate my post and I don't feel like typing it all out again.

Part of the problem is lack of education. I don't mean shiatty public schools. I mean an education designed to train you for real work. It was a mistake for our society to put all the emphasis on getting a college education and pretty much ignoring trade and technical schools. I would not have a problem with tax money being spent on a real program to give people a free ride in a trade school that has potential (not those rip-off online courses). For this to work well, the money would have to be enough for the person to go to school full time and not have to worry about buying food and paying rent. A two year trade school program of this nature would be expensive, but in the long run it would pay off dividends in reducing poverty, crime, and despair.

Another problem, esp ...


No, the "idiot left" know that those people simply won't starve quietly, they'll steal things, requiring more police, more public defenders, and more prisons, costing 10X the pittance they were living off of before. Much like changing your oil, its an upfront cost to prevent an even larger more expensive problem.
 
2012-07-03 12:14:51 PM  

Robespierre: No, the "idiot left" know that those people simply won't starve quietly, they'll steal things, requiring more police, more public defenders, and more prisons, costing 10X the pittance they were living off of before. Much like changing your oil, its an upfront cost to prevent an even larger more expensive problem.


Now he's going to accuse you of "threatening" him by pointing out human nature. Just watch.
 
2012-07-03 01:06:05 PM  
aaahhhhh yes, 17, the age of wisdom.

seriously? people are twice as retarded at 17 than they are at 13.

let me know what he thinks when hes 30.
 
2012-07-03 03:07:39 PM  

HeartBurnKid: More_Like_A_Stain: Lunaville: Yes, personal experience is completely irrelevant when you are accusing an entire generation of being alliterate

lol

Actually, that is a word (albeit misspelled). Illiterate means unable to read, aliterate means unwilling to read.


I thought he was implying that every member of the generation had names which began with the same letter.
 
2012-07-03 03:24:06 PM  

o5iiawah: Wait until this kid has a job and works Monday and Tuesday just for Uncle Sam.


How cute. Another libertarian who thinks all the services around him should just be handed to him for free because he's an entitled douche
 
2012-07-03 03:28:20 PM  

HeartBurnKid: American Idol's largest demographic is 35-49 year olds. Dancing with the Stars skews even older. Hardly the damning condemnation of young people you think it is.



Did you even read the ratings?

Men 18-34 - 2nd and 5th

Men 18-49 - 1st and 2nd

Persons 12-34 - 1 and 2

Kids 2-11 - 4th
 
2012-07-03 03:54:36 PM  

intelligent comment below: HeartBurnKid: American Idol's largest demographic is 35-49 year olds. Dancing with the Stars skews even older. Hardly the damning condemnation of young people you think it is.


Did you even read the ratings?

Men 18-34 - 2nd and 5th

Men 18-49 - 1st and 2nd

Persons 12-34 - 1 and 2

Kids 2-11 - 4th


Are you still prattling on about those shows no one watches? We have moved on to my complete inability to spell. Try to keep up.
 
2012-07-03 04:58:29 PM  

BMulligan: Oh, and for the record - Ayn Rand doesn't count as philosophy.


Maybe not the novels. However, I'd say "Capitalism: The Unknown Ideal" and "The Virtue of Selfishness" would definitely qualify as philosophy -- albeit really incompetent philosophy.

HeartBurnKid: Illiterate means unable to read, aliterate means unwilling to read.


What a useful word.
 
2012-07-03 05:11:38 PM  

abb3w: BMulligan: Oh, and for the record - Ayn Rand doesn't count as philosophy.

Maybe not the novels. However, I'd say "Capitalism: The Unknown Ideal" and "The Virtue of Selfishness" would definitely qualify as philosophy -- albeit really incompetent philosophy.



Gives me yet another opportunity to requote this gem:
"St. Petersburg in revolt gave us Vladimir Nabokov, Isaiah Berlin and Ayn Rand. The first was a novelist, the second a philosopher. The third was neither but thought she was both. Many other people have thought so too." - from "Garbage and Gravitas," by Corey Robin (The Nation, 7 June 2010)

And that's just the beginning. Article is worth reading.
 
2012-07-03 06:04:04 PM  

Lunaville: Are you still prattling on about those shows no one watches?



No one watches those shows? The viewership says otherwise, but okay.
 
2012-07-03 06:51:25 PM  
"Krohn is bucking the received wisdom that people become more conservative as they get older..."

I'd really like to know the source of this "received wisdom".
(And who funded the "wisdom" studies.)
Seriously.
 
2012-07-03 10:17:50 PM  

intelligent comment below: HeartBurnKid: American Idol's largest demographic is 35-49 year olds. Dancing with the Stars skews even older. Hardly the damning condemnation of young people you think it is.


Did you even read the ratings?

Men 18-34 - 2nd and 5th

Men 18-49 - 1st and 2nd

Persons 12-34 - 1 and 2

Kids 2-11 - 4th


Did you?

People age 35-49 watched American Idol Season 7 the most, making up almost 29% of the total audience.

The five most popular shows among adults ages 50 and over: Dancing With the Stars (ABC, 13.8 million), followed by...
 
2012-07-03 10:41:47 PM  

cameroncrazy1984: Conservatism isn't just something you pick up when you start to pay taxes. It's something you revert back to when you don't want to grow up and be a responsible and productive member of society.


Liberalism is predicated on the fallacy that regardless of how much time and money an individual contributes to his family, church, community, county, or state, he isn't a productive member of society if he's paying less than 40% of his income in taxes to the federal government.

intelligent comment below: How cute. Another libertarian who thinks all the services around him should just be handed to him for free because he's an entitled douche


I never said anything of the sort, asshole.
 
2012-07-04 12:47:13 AM  

runcible spork: And that's just the beginning. Article is worth reading.


Seems to give Ayn Rand less credit as a philosopher than she deserves. A sociopathic philosopher of a sociopathic philosophy seems a philosopher, still.

Being "wrong" doesn't make her not a philosopher.
 
2012-07-04 01:11:54 AM  

o5iiawah: Liberalism is predicated on the fallacy that regardless of how much time and money an individual contributes to his family, church, community, county, or state, he isn't a productive member of society if he's paying less than 40% of his income in taxes to the federal government.


You forgot the UN.

o5iiawah: I never said anything of the sort, asshole.


True; it's the benefits that aren't immediately proximate to you (in space, time, or recognizability) that you seem to have objected to.
 
2012-07-04 01:23:40 AM  

o5iiawah: cameroncrazy1984: Conservatism isn't just something you pick up when you start to pay taxes. It's something you revert back to when you don't want to grow up and be a responsible and productive member of society.

Liberalism is predicated on the fallacy that regardless of how much time and money an individual contributes to his family, church, community, county, or state, he isn't a productive member of society if he's paying less than 40% of his income in taxes to the federal government.

intelligent comment below: How cute. Another libertarian who thinks all the services around him should just be handed to him for free because he's an entitled douche

I never said anything of the sort, asshole.


If you didn't say "anything of the sort," it's a safe bet you said something else at least as inane. Pretty sure the TOP rate is well below 40%, isn't it? So what are you blathering about now? Everything you type smells like ass, so it's no wonder that people point and laugh at you. Coming from you, "asshole" has to be a compliment or some sort of endearment.

But by all means, keep telling yourself it's because you're not a liberal that people here mock you.
 
2012-07-04 04:53:11 PM  

o5iiawah: I never said anything of the sort, asshole.



Yes you did, you complained and lied about how much of a percentage in taxes you paid.

If you are paying 50% of your income then that means you make hundreds of thousands a year.

If you make that much, you are using a lot of government services and the cost is in line with that.

Most people pay around 30% of their income, and that goes to the cost of all the services available to make your life easy. Clean streets, water, power, police and fire, health inspectors, etc etc etc
 
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