Flame on?

Fark Me To Tears: synthetic sofas

As opposed to organic sofas.

For those of you too young to remember, we used to grow sofas, but they took up so much space that they were squeezing out other crops, such as ottomans and loveseats.

The Chinese came up with a way of manufacturing synthetic sofas -- cheaper, of course -- so we started buying all of our sofas from China. And the ottomans... and the loveseats... and pretty much everything else.

My couch is organic. A real bunch of cows were slaughtered to make it. I bet they were great steak too.

Fark Me To Tears: synthetic sofas

As opposed to organic sofas.

For those of you too young to remember, we used to grow sofas, but they took up so much space that they were squeezing out other crops, such as ottomans and loveseats.

The Chinese came up with a way of manufacturing synthetic sofas -- cheaper, of course -- so we started buying all of our sofas from China. And the ottomans... and the loveseats... and pretty much everything else.

And I quote:

Mattress

Mattresses are friendly, dim-witted, docile creatures capable of speech. They are all called Zem and live in the swamps of Sqornshellous Zeta. Many of them are slaughtered, dried out, and shipped around the Galaxy to be slept on by grateful customers, though they do not appear to mind this, one noting that since they are all called Zem they never know which of them have been killed anyway. Many of the movements they make, such as gupping, willomying and flolloping, are so unique that etymologists have driven themselves half-insane tracking down new words for them.

Blah blah hippie horseshiat got tired of listening to my mother talk down about synthetics for furniture etc. Until I found out about the chemistry of flammable substances. Subby is right nylon is just spun gasoline.

Actually, wool won't sustain a flame, that's why firefighters used to wear it..

Fark Me To Tears: synthetic sofas

As opposed to organic sofas.

For those of you too young to remember, we used to grow sofas, but they took up so much space that they were squeezing out other crops, such as ottomans and loveseats.

The Chinese came up with a way of manufacturing synthetic sofas -- cheaper, of course -- so we started buying all of our sofas from China. And the ottomans... and the loveseats... and pretty much everything else.

I left a stool in China. They can keep it.

Not so CSB:
One of my best friend's dad was a raging alcoholic and set himself on fire from passing out with a lit cigarette not once, not twice, not even three times (you think he'd have learned his lesson after the third one because third time is a charm, right?), but four times. Seriously, dude self immolated four times from passing out drunk with a lit cigarette. In a weird coincidence, my cousin was the person who pulled him out of the fire the fourth time and we didn't know it until we read the names in the paper.

Irony: He had a will and it specified that he wanted to be cremated...

The real WTF in this article is the idea that venting a fire would be a smart idea. Don't these guys ever BBQ? Or play with fire? Air is good for a fire. You'd think firemen would know that?

In grandpa's day, a stogie left on the arm of his favorite chair would just smolder and self-extinguish.


Everything was safe in Archie's Bunker.

jimnutt: Actually, wool won't sustain a flame, that's why firefighters used to wear it..

It's also a good insulator. That sounds backwards when it's hot, but there's "110 degrees outside yuck" hot and then there's "OGOD OGOD 400 DEGREES SMOKE AND FIRE OGOD" hot.

for science!

I don't like this "microfiber" crap. It's a shiat texture and presents a massive surface area to support a fire. Then people go through it in a hurry because it absorbs oils off your skin and hair.

Wool and leather are great materials for furniture coverings. Made from renewable resources, fire resistant, and durable. It's just more expensive to get nice things. It's Vimes' "boots" theory of economic injustice.

Oh, and I thought we were supposed to have flammability regulations on household goods.

tungub: The real WTF in this article is the idea that venting a fire would be a smart idea. Don't these guys ever BBQ? Or play with fire? Air is good for a fire. You'd think firemen would know that?

It sounds like you RTFA, but. . . did you RTFA? The point is a house furnished with hardwood and wool (like grandpa's old place) won't burn nearly as quickly as the people inside will die of hypoxia. The strategy back then was to charge in, get some fresh air into the building, rescue anyone inside, THEN fight the fire.

Lately houses are filled with various materials that not only burn quickly, but very VERY hot. But they're still using the same strategy. So this is a very rational study to see if conditions have inverted, to the point where it makes more sense to cool the place down before rescuing anyone.

Don't smoke in bed

I remember my pajamas having some sort of label stating that they were fire resistant or some such thing. Thought that was cool as a kid.

fusillade762: Nice that the industry treats all new furniture with a fire retardant that's toxic and doesn't work.

Feel safer now?

Yeah, nice to know the NY Times is piggybacking on a Chicago Tribune series. (And hey, all the more attention for it). Totally worth reading.

In my day, our pajamas were fire retardant. Now with this PC frippery its all fire special needsadant

wildcardjack: I thought we were supposed to have flammability regulations on household goods.



No, seriously, I'm sure we have some on the books, but consumer regulations (not just product safety but also stuff like "USDA organic" and just about everything else) are no longer written for the public interest. They are there to raise the entry costs of business -- i.e., inhibit competition. If you decide to make and sell your own goods they'll go over it with a fine-toothed comb, but shiat getting imported from China get their loopholes and exemptions. They're basically glorified Bills of Attainder that shiat all over the concept of anti-trust. Sorry, I know you meant well, but. . .

It's not only modern furniture, it's the resins and plastics most homes are built with too.
It's also those wooden I beam floor joists that burn through much quicker than solid beams. The firemen I know hate those I beams and won't go inside if they know the house has them, unless they have to rescue someone.

"I smoke old stogies I have found
Short, but not too big around
I'm a man of means by no means
King of the road"

/RIP Roger
//Second time today
// Waiting for trifecta

wildcardjack: Oh, and I thought we were supposed to have flammability regulations on household goods.

Can't do that. Socialism.

tungub: The real WTF in this article is the idea that venting a fire would be a smart idea. Don't these guys ever BBQ? Or play with fire? Air is good for a fire. You'd think firemen would know that?


Fire deaths are usually caused by lack of breathable air. Most people don't actually burn to death - they're dead before then. So standard procedure has been to ventilate the house, rescue the occupants and then attempt to fight the fire if it's safe to do so.

But now if the materials that cause a fire consume the o2 quickly and begin smoldering, introducing air can cause a sudden deadly flash of fire. So the question is, should tactics change and they blast water into a room before entering? This has been avoided previously because the water would push toxic gas to the floor, which is where occupants are sometimes found.

Fark Me To Tears: synthetic sofas

As opposed to organic sofas.

For those of you too young to remember, we used to grow sofas, but they took up so much space that they were squeezing out other crops, such as ottomans and loveseats.

The Chinese came up with a way of manufacturing synthetic sofas -- cheaper, of course -- so we started buying all of our sofas from China. And the ottomans... and the loveseats... and pretty much everything else.

I get my Ottomans from Istanbul.

Not Constantinople.

Cyno01: Fark Me To Tears: synthetic sofas

As opposed to organic sofas.

For those of you too young to remember, we used to grow sofas, but they took up so much space that they were squeezing out other crops, such as ottomans and loveseats.

The Chinese came up with a way of manufacturing synthetic sofas -- cheaper, of course -- so we started buying all of our sofas from China. And the ottomans... and the loveseats... and pretty much everything else.

We still import most of our Ottomans from the middle east IIRC. You thought the Iraq War was about oil? Pfft...

Nice deflection, but oil is still yer insurrection...

;)

LeroyBourne: Stonerbloopers: Not so CSB:
One of my best friend's dad was a raging alcoholic and set himself on fire from passing out with a lit cigarette not once, not twice, not even three times (you think he'd have learned his lesson after the third one because third time is a charm, right?), but four times. Seriously, dude self immolated four times from passing out drunk with a lit cigarette. In a weird coincidence, my cousin was the person who pulled him out of the fire the fourth time and we didn't know it until we read the names in the paper.

Irony: He had a will and it specified that he wanted to be cremated...

You say 'was' like he is no longer a raging alcoholic, so he's just a regular alcoholic? Film that, then que the yakkity sax.
/i keed, i hope he got the help he needed

I guess I should have been less vague... he's in an urn in a coffee can on my friends mantle now (Big Big Labowski fans)... We like to think he's in a better place. He was a genuinely cool dude when he was sober.

FirstNationalBastard: Yeah, and in Grandpa's day, you needed a machete and a pith helmet to go down on a broad.

Things change.

Going down was the easy part. Getting out, on the other hand....

This is GOOD SCIENCE. The firefighting environment has changed, so they're doing a systematic and methodical review of their current best practices to see if they are still the best practices. If every government agency did this sort of thing every 20 years with their procedures... oh the utopia...

Stonerbloopers: Not so CSB:
One of my best friend's dad was a raging alcoholic and set himself on fire from passing out with a lit cigarette not once, not twice, not even three times (you think he'd have learned his lesson after the third one because third time is a charm, right?), but four times.

Is it wrong that I heard that in Lebron James' voice?

dragonchild: tungub: The real WTF in this article is the idea that venting a fire would be a smart idea. Don't these guys ever BBQ? Or play with fire? Air is good for a fire. You'd think firemen would know that?

It sounds like you RTFA, but. . . did you RTFA? The point is a house furnished with hardwood and wool (like grandpa's old place) won't burn nearly as quickly as the people inside will die of hypoxia. The strategy back then was to charge in, get some fresh air into the building, rescue anyone inside, THEN fight the fire.

Lately houses are filled with various materials that not only burn quickly, but very VERY hot. But they're still using the same strategy. So this is a very rational study to see if conditions have inverted, to the point where it makes more sense to cool the place down before rescuing anyone.

When I'm inside, with the smoke so dark I can't see the hand in front of my face and the heat is pushing me right down to the floor, there is nothing in the world that sounds sweeter than the saw at full throttle on the roof biting into the wood. Because I know in a matter of seconds the heat will drop to a tolerable level, and visibility will improve ever so slightly. If it causes the fire to light up a bit, that's okay because now I can find it easier and put it out.

New home furnishings are putting off terribly toxic smoke. They're burning hotter and longer than older, natural fiber materials. If Mrs. Jones goes down in a burning house, more than likely she's lying face-down on the floor. Assuming she's breathing at all, rapid ventilation allows the smoke and heat to lift just enough that maybe she lives a bit longer, maybe I have the time to grab her before she dies.

Fires have changed, even in the relatively short time
I've been in the fire service. And things have changed a lot in the last 30 years. But no changes I've seen will convince me that ventilation in general is a bad thing, or that rapid interior firefighting isn't the best way to safeguard lives and property.

Fascinating.

My beloved IKEA Ektorp sofa has feather-topped cushions and a cotton cover on a wooden frame - will I die?

And kudos to the FDNY - in general, but also for taking the initiative.

lizyrd: I've been in the fire service. And things have changed a lot in the last 30 years. But no changes I've seen will convince me that ventilation in general is a bad thing, or that rapid interior firefighting isn't the best way to safeguard lives and property.

You may well be right. By the sound of it you probably are. But verification, especially in changing conditions, is a fundamental part of rigor. This experiment's purpose isn't to re-write the truth, but to verify it. If it turns out their assumptions were way off it's back to the status quo. If ever a day comes when you're wrong, though, you don't want comrades to die because we were too slow to change things.

Frankly I'm amazed anyone still practices rigor anymore. I thought MBAs convinced the world it's a waste of money as early as twenty years ago.