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(Detroit Free Press)   Don't go downrange when your buddy's trying to clear his jammed AK-47, mmmkay?   (freep.com) divider line 178
    More: Dumbass, gun ranges, intelligent design, Livingston County  
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10984 clicks; posted to Main » on 02 Jul 2012 at 10:34 AM (2 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2012-07-02 04:42:38 PM  

dittybopper: Jument: way south: /It takes an odd kind of person to be in favor of having fewer privileges.

Most of the free world is "odd" by your definition.

I know you can't and won't ever understand it but before you jump in with "they're all wrong and we're right" you might just think about it for a minute. Your way is not the only right way to run a country.

That's true, of course. There are many ways to run a country. Some good, some bad, but few others have stood for 223 years.


This isn't an AR15 thread....
 
2012-07-02 04:50:53 PM  

malaktaus: CSB: During my second deployment to Iraq my company found numerous weapons caches, with a great many AK-47s and ammo, as well as a variety of other weapons. One day when not much was going on my platoon leader decided that we would take some of the captured weapons and ammo and go out and shoot it, because A) shooting guns is fun and B) knowing how to use the enemy's weapons could come in handy, you'll never know. Just about everyone in the platoon fhad already fired off a few magazines when an urgent message came through on the radio telling us to immediately desist. Apparently before our unit got there the 101st had also found numerous weapons caches in the area, but instead of merely confiscating them they would occasionally replace the regular ammunition with ammo provided by the CIA, in which the gunpowder had been replaced by C4 so that it would explode when fired. They didn't really keep any detalied records of these caches, so it was entirely possible that some of the ammunition we had found was of the doctored variety.


That practice might explain some hilarious Youtube Videos.
 
2012-07-02 05:26:55 PM  

wee: OldManDownDRoad: Obviously faked. Everyone knows that AKs never jam.

This is the part that got me. From the article, it sounds like it went off when he racked the slide. I know one sure way to make that happen, and it's when you use a metal file to convert a semi auto into a slamfire full auto. Or the sear is bad. That or he shot the guy. Either way, the article says that he had the gun worked on, it didn't say who did the working.


Or he had his finger on the trigger when he racked the slide. You tend to grip with the hand holding the gun when you pull on the slide with the other. If you're dumb enough to put your finger on the trigger, it will subconsciously squeeze too.

I've seen it happen to someone before handling a pistol, and AK's have a pistol grip. Also a good reason to keep it pointed in a clear direction.
 
2012-07-02 05:43:32 PM  

rockhound: wee: OldManDownDRoad: Obviously faked. Everyone knows that AKs never jam.

This is the part that got me. From the article, it sounds like it went off when he racked the slide. I know one sure way to make that happen, and it's when you use a metal file to convert a semi auto into a slamfire full auto. Or the sear is bad. That or he shot the guy. Either way, the article says that he had the gun worked on, it didn't say who did the working.

Or he had his finger on the trigger when he racked the slide. You tend to grip with the hand holding the gun when you pull on the slide with the other. If you're dumb enough to put your finger on the trigger, it will subconsciously squeeze too.

I've seen it happen to someone before handling a pistol, and AK's have a pistol grip. Also a good reason to keep it pointed in a clear direction.


As dumb as that is, it still shouldn't result in a shot if the disconnector is working.
 
wee
2012-07-02 05:55:58 PM  

Fish in a Barrel: As dumb as that is, it still shouldn't result in a shot if the disconnector is working.


That's the part that gave me pause. The bit about the gun being worked on was an odd twist I thought. Or it could be he just pulled the trigger after racking it.

I imagine the cops will have an armorer look over it.
 
2012-07-02 06:03:33 PM  

Jument: way south: /It takes an odd kind of person to be in favor of having fewer privileges.

Most of the free world is "odd" by your definition.

I know you can't and won't ever understand it but before you jump in with "they're all wrong and we're right" you might just think about it for a minute. Your way is not the only right way to run a country.


Most of the "free" world Is lead by a handful of oligarchs who only think about what is best for their rule rather than what is most fair for the individual. A man like Stalin would have you carry a rifle to defend him in war and surrender it for his own peace of mind when the threat is gone. He will tell you it's fair and logical.

Whats fair to me is to keep My Mosin nagant is for my own purposes. Not his or anyone else's.

I won't pretend to know what every other individual wants. But I do know that the more restrictions we place on a society, the less likely people are to find happiness.
 
2012-07-02 06:12:47 PM  

dittybopper: aninconvenienterection: .I am just as likely to run into a IT professional or an accountant at the range shooting an AK as I am camo-wearing redneck.

As an IT professional and camo-wearing redneck, allow me to point out that those two things aren't necessarily mutually exclusive.


It seems like there are a lot of us that fir both those categories.
 
2012-07-02 06:20:45 PM  

glassbottomboatcaptain: Luckily, there is no plausible scenario in my foreseeable future that involves me being friends with someone who owns an AK-47.

That's not because I'm that adverse to guns. It's just because there is a very specific type of person who buys a recreational AK-47, generally (but not always, I'm not stereotyping here):
- is American
- speaks with a southern drawl
- owns and happily wears camouflage clothing despite having no actual need for it
- owns at least one pair of 'American flag' clothing
- thinks those songs country singers write when you go to war with other countries are cool
- pronounces 'arab' 'A-rab'
- brings up Obama more often in conversation than a freshly dumped guy brings up his ex-girlfriend


Ok, maybe I'm stereotyping. But those guys are farking retards of the highest order. An after-party for the special olympics track team at Pizza Hut would involve more interesting, and intelligent conversation than a room full of those mutants.

So yeah, I'm pretty safe on the 'friend shoots me with his AK-47' front...


Yes, you are stereotyping. You're probably also the type of person who talks about what asshats people who stereotype are, as long as they aren't stereotyping the way you are. I own two.
- I AM an American
- My family is from Massachusetts, so I don't have a drawl, sorry
- Stopped wearing cammies the day my discharge went through
- The only "American Flag" clothing I own are from some races I ran (I'm not even the slow and couch potato American)
- I hate country music
- I pronounce arab properly
- I avoid politics for the most part.

The only other guy I know who owns an AK is my cousin's husband. He's a 6'4" gay black man from Connecticut. I'm pretty sure he'd kick your ass.
 
2012-07-02 06:44:48 PM  

JesseL: dittybopper: aninconvenienterection: .I am just as likely to run into a IT professional or an accountant at the range shooting an AK as I am camo-wearing redneck.

As an IT professional and camo-wearing redneck, allow me to point out that those two things aren't necessarily mutually exclusive.

It seems like there are a lot of us that fir both those categories.


Well, with some sprucing up I can opine on many subjects. I think we're just aspen for a little respect, and for people to recognize that our bark is worse unless they don't leave us alone, those sons'a'birches.
 
2012-07-02 06:45:32 PM  

devildog123: He's a 6'4" gay black man from Connecticut. I'm pretty sure he'd kick your ass.


Are you sure "kick" is the right verb there?

/Just sayin'.
 
2012-07-02 06:49:07 PM  

aninconvenienterection: dittybopper: stevarooni: dittybopper: aninconvenienterection: .I am just as likely to run into a IT professional or an accountant at the range shooting an AK as I am camo-wearing redneck.

As an IT professional and camo-wearing redneck, allow me to point out that those two things aren't necessarily mutually exclusive.

Statistically speaking, though, he's 100% accurate in your case; you provide the 1:1 ratio of IT Professional:camo-wearing redneck he suggests. ;-)

Even better, while I'm not an accountant per se, I've written custom accounting software.

Good god man, you are the perfect storm of AK ownership!


Oddly enough, I don't own one. I used to own one, before it was cool. Now I just carry a flintlock, because I'm the ultimate in hipsterism.

Well, except for the guy who brings a matchlock to the primitive biathlons, but that's going too far. Might as well just build a Kirk Cannon out of bamboo if you are gonna shoot one of those.
 
2012-07-02 06:57:45 PM  

glassbottomboatcaptain: Luckily, there is no plausible scenario in my foreseeable future that involves me being friends with someone who owns an AK-47.

That's not because I'm that adverse to guns. It's just because there is a very specific type of person who buys a recreational AK-47, generally (but not always, I'm not stereotyping here):
- is American

check
- speaks with a southern drawl
no
- owns and happily wears camouflage clothing despite having no actual need for it
own some camo, only wear it when hunting
- owns at least one pair of 'American flag' clothing
no Scratch that, I just realized the free shirt I won from Springfield Armory has a bit of a flag motiff on the back.
- thinks those songs country singers write when you go to war with other countries are cool
no
- pronounces 'arab' 'A-rab'
no
- brings up Obama more often in conversation than a freshly dumped guy brings up his ex-girlfriend
I'm really more the RON PAUL type

I got the perfect pic for this:
sphotos.xx.fbcdn.net
 
2012-07-02 07:01:39 PM  

dittybopper: False. The Southern states started the war by firing on Fort Sumter.


True, and furthermore they did attempt to invade the North when they were in a strategic position to do so. They primarily fought a defensive war because they were at a huge disadvantage in men and materiel, and therefore generally had no real choice in the matter.
 
2012-07-02 07:52:17 PM  
If this thread didn't get a laugh out of you, you're dead inside.
 
2012-07-02 07:55:21 PM  

glassbottomboatcaptain: Luckily, there is no plausible scenario in my foreseeable future that involves me being friends with someone who owns an AK-47.

That's not because I'm that adverse to guns. It's just because there is a very specific type of person who buys a recreational AK-47, generally (but not always, I'm not stereotyping here):
- is American
- speaks with a southern drawl
- owns and happily wears camouflage clothing despite having no actual need for it
- owns at least one pair of 'American flag' clothing
- thinks those songs country singers write when you go to war with other countries are cool
- pronounces 'arab' 'A-rab'
- brings up Obama more often in conversation than a freshly dumped guy brings up his ex-girlfriend


Ok, maybe I'm stereotyping. But those guys are farking retards of the highest order. An after-party for the special olympics track team at Pizza Hut would involve more interesting, and intelligent conversation than a room full of those mutants.

So yeah, I'm pretty safe on the 'friend shoots me with his AK-47' front...


Let's see...
-Yes
-No
-No
-No
-No
-No
-No

Me and my WASR-10 AK say that's below the Mendoza Line buddy. On top of that, I'm a graduate student in a Liberal Arts field, a certified teacher, own more than one gun, have a CCW permit, carry often, and could probably provide you with plenty of intelligent conversation.

Just goes to show, you never know who might be a shooter.
 
2012-07-02 08:07:23 PM  

glassbottomboatcaptain: Luckily, there is no plausible scenario in my foreseeable future that involves me being friends with someone who owns an AK-47.

That's not because I'm that adverse to guns. It's just because there is a very specific type of person who buys a recreational AK-47, generally (but not always, I'm not stereotyping here):
- is American Red-blooded.
- speaks with a southern drawl Nope. I'm a Barkeater.
- owns and happily wears camouflage clothing despite having no actual need for it Yes, but mostly just my old Army uniforms, and some hunting clothes. Oh, and a couple t-shirts.
- owns at least one pair of 'American flag' clothing Actually, apart from the uniforms, I don't think I have anything like that. I generally wear muted earth tones, or grey.
- thinks those songs country singers write when you go to war with other countries are cool Actually, for that kind of stuff I prefer Celtic music, especially bagpipes.
- pronounces 'arab' 'A-rab' I do this occasionally, but more for ironic hipsterish reasons*.
- brings up Obama more often in conversation than a freshly dumped guy brings up his ex-girlfriend Meh. I don't like the guy, but unless someone else brings him up, I'm not that interested in talking about it.

Ok, maybe I'm stereotyping. But those guys are farking retards of the highest order. An after-party for the special olympics track team at Pizza Hut would involve more interesting, and intelligent conversation than a room full of those mutants.

So yeah, I'm pretty safe on the 'friend shoots me with his AK-47' front...


Except that they just might be able to make you look like a fool rhetorically. You might make certain assumptions when you meet me, that will turn out to be incredibly wrong. Yes, I have certain verbal affectations that I tend to use, mainly so that I sound like "plain folk", and yes, I don't walk around in a suit or tie. I know my way in the woods. Then again, I've written software to decode telemetry from ham radio satellites. I carry a slide rule because calculators make math too easy. Hell, I designed and built a working analog calculator out of LEGOs in order to show my son how addition and subtraction work. Shakespeare and Dostoyevskiy share my bookshelf with Foxworthy and Python.
 
2012-07-02 08:07:51 PM  

dittybopper: Might as well just build a Kirk Cannon out of bamboo if you are gonna shoot one of those.


I am trying to decide if this is a great reference, or the greatest reference. I could go either way.
 
2012-07-02 08:29:28 PM  

aninconvenienterection: dittybopper: Might as well just build a Kirk Cannon out of bamboo if you are gonna shoot one of those.

I am trying to decide if this is a great reference, or the greatest reference. I could go either way.


This is the person that I call "Matchlock Guy". He's tougher than Kirk, but probably gets less strange.

farm3.staticflickr.com
 
2012-07-02 08:31:16 PM  

dittybopper: Shakespeare and Dostoyevskiy share my bookshelf with Foxworthy and Python.


Just remembered, I have an entire bookshelf of things like the Federalist Papers, the Anti-Federalist Papers, Democracy in America, Common Sense, etc., and yes, I've read them all.
 
2012-07-02 08:52:44 PM  

dittybopper: aninconvenienterection: dittybopper: Might as well just build a Kirk Cannon out of bamboo if you are gonna shoot one of those.

I am trying to decide if this is a great reference, or the greatest reference. I could go either way.

This is the person that I call "Matchlock Guy". He's tougher than Kirk, but probably gets less strange.

[farm3.staticflickr.com image 375x500]


Matchlock Guy does indeed look plenty tough, and sure, he has some sweet duds and a winning smile but I am not so sure he could stand up to that 2-handed chop/hammer/thingy that Kirk employs so effectively.

I trust your judgement though. You clearly have your finger on the pulse of the matter.
 
2012-07-02 08:53:20 PM  

aninconvenienterection: The problem is, if you arent in the habit of actively focusing on gun safety each and every time you touch a firearm, be it at home, in the woods, at the range, etc, you are less likely to notice when you are being unintentionally unsafe.


The truth. This man speaks it.

The solution to bad accidents is good habits. Habits aren't developed by only doing things rarely.
 
2012-07-02 08:58:01 PM  

glassbottomboatcaptain: Luckily, there is no plausible scenario in my foreseeable future that involves me being friends with someone who owns an AK-47.

That's not because I'm that adverse to guns. It's just because there is a very specific type of person who buys a recreational AK-47, generally (but not always, I'm not stereotyping here):
- is American
- speaks with a southern drawl
- owns and happily wears camouflage clothing despite having no actual need for it
- owns at least one pair of 'American flag' clothing
- thinks those songs country singers write when you go to war with other countries are cool
- pronounces 'arab' 'A-rab'
- brings up Obama more often in conversation than a freshly dumped guy brings up his ex-girlfriend


Ok, maybe I'm stereotyping. But those guys are farking retards of the highest order. An after-party for the special olympics track team at Pizza Hut would involve more interesting, and intelligent conversation than a room full of those mutants.

So yeah, I'm pretty safe on the 'friend shoots me with his AK-47' front...


Sure, I'll feed the troll... why not:

- is American - Yep
- speaks with a southern drawl - From the Bay Area, but no strong lisp.
- owns and happily wears camouflage clothing despite having no actual need for it - Nope
- owns at least one pair of 'American flag' clothing - Nope (I thought that was against the flag rules)
- thinks those songs country singers write when you go to war with other countries are cool - Can't stand country music
- pronounces 'arab' 'A-rab' - I'm not a retard
- brings up Obama more often in conversation than a freshly dumped guy brings up his ex-girlfriend - I hate politics, both sides are f'ing morons.
 
2012-07-02 09:02:13 PM  

glassbottomboatcaptain: Luckily, there is no plausible scenario in my foreseeable future that involves me being friends with someone who owns an AK-47.

That's not because I'm that adverse to guns. It's just because there is a very specific type of person who buys a recreational AK-47, generally (but not always, I'm not stereotyping here):
- is American
- speaks with a southern drawl
- owns and happily wears camouflage clothing despite having no actual need for it
- owns at least one pair of 'American flag' clothing
- thinks those songs country singers write when you go to war with other countries are cool
- pronounces 'arab' 'A-rab'
- brings up Obama more often in conversation than a freshly dumped guy brings up his ex-girlfriend


Ok, maybe I'm stereotyping. But those guys are farking retards of the highest order. An after-party for the special olympics track team at Pizza Hut would involve more interesting, and intelligent conversation than a room full of those mutants.

So yeah, I'm pretty safe on the 'friend shoots me with his AK-47' front...


Also... you didn't specify from your list if all or just one of those horrible horrible horrible traits would keep you from making friends with AK47 owners. Does someone need to match your entire list or just one aspect? For example, how about a european that pronounces it "a-rab"?
 
2012-07-02 10:00:45 PM  

akula: Famous Thamas: It sounds like they headed out to an outdoor range after hours for some gun shootin/drinkin/foolin around time.

If the range was in operation, then yes the range master should have been all over that idiot for going down range.

Yup.

Whenever I read about people griping about "Range Nazis" who are coming down on shooters for unsafe practices, this is the kind of crap that results when nobody gives a damn about safety. People going downrange on hot ranges, others dicking with weapons during a cold range, other morons who don't have the first clue how to handle their guns safely at any time, etc.

If you're shooting at an unmanned range (not just one where you're trespassing after hours), one person needs to be appointed rangemaster and everybody MUST obey the commands.

Really, this is why I don't use unstaffed ranges... as much as I love guns and the majority of shooters are decent people, there's a significant minority of shooters who are just cast iron assholes with a "you're not the boss of me complex."


I must run with a different crowd. Been shooting many times at gravel pits/hunting camp. No one person was in charge, everyone knew gun safety and common sense, and no one got hurt/no ADs.
 
2012-07-03 03:48:23 AM  
How farked up DOES an AK47 have to be that it starts jamming after being serviced?

wait

How farked up does an AK47 have to be that it NEEDS SERVICED?!?!

/live gun is like your mom drunk, never know when she's gonna go off.
 
2012-07-03 05:29:04 AM  

prjindigo: How farked up DOES an AK47 have to be that it starts jamming after being serviced?

wait

How farked up does an AK47 have to be that it NEEDS SERVICED?!?!

/live gun is like your mom drunk, never know when she's gonna go off.


I think this misconception is why alot of people get in trouble with the damn things.
All guns need servicing. All guns should be inspected regularly.

The longer you put it off, the more dangerous your potential malfunctions can become.
 
2012-07-03 07:47:23 AM  

ongbok: KierzanDax: malaktaus: Apparently before our unit got there the 101st had also found numerous weapons caches in the area, but instead of merely confiscating them they would occasionally replace the regular ammunition with ammo provided by the CIA, in which the gunpowder had been replaced by C4 so that it would explode when fired.

I call bullshiat.

The "CIA spiking ammo" urban myth has been around since Vietnam. A rifle primer doesn't have the energy needed to detonate the C4.

Someone just didn't want you guys having fun!

Read Akula's post about "Operation Eldest Son". Apparently it isn't an urban myth.


the SOG also did this trick with motor shells. The goal was to make the VC troops scared of their equipment.
 
2012-07-03 07:10:24 PM  

skinink: OldManDownDRoad: Obviously faked. Everyone knows that AKs never jam.

Of all the weapons in the vast soviet arsenal, nothing was more profitable than Avtomat Kalashnikova model of 1947. More commonly known as the AK-47, or Kalashnikov. It's the world's most popular assault rifle. A weapon all fighters love. An elegantly simple 9 pound amalgamation of forged steel and plywood. It doesn't break, jam, or overheat. It'll shoot whether it's covered in mud or filled with sand. It's so easy, even a child can use it; and they do. The Soviets put the gun on a coin. Mozambique put it on their flag. Since the end of the Cold War, the Kalashnikov has become the Russian people's greatest export. After that comes vodka, caviar, and suicidal novelists. One thing is for sure, no one was lining up to buy their cars.


To be fair to the AK, it DID fire, even when "jammed!"

Shooter was an incredible idiot.
 
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