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(CNN)   We are... Penn State... We are... So screwed   (cnn.com) divider line 239
    More: Followup, Penn State, Mike McQueary, Graham Spanier, Joe Paterno, graduate assistant, event scheduling, athletic director, Jerry Sandusky  
•       •       •

6615 clicks; posted to Sports » on 02 Jul 2012 at 9:01 AM (2 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2012-07-02 08:59:37 AM  
If any of that turns out to be true, then Penn State has a very serious problem.
 
2012-07-02 09:05:21 AM  

Weaver95: If any of that turns out to be true, then Penn State has a very serious problem.


Time....
to.....
RIOT!
 
2012-07-02 09:05:46 AM  
If they don't shutter their football program for at least 5 years, I will.....continue not caring about college football, I guess.
 
2012-07-02 09:06:01 AM  
I am an alumnus and I say they can all burn in hell, throw the book at every single one of them.
 
2012-07-02 09:06:03 AM  
President of the college: "Hey guys, so we got this problem with a coach, and it's pretty bad. What should we do?"

Others: "This could look bad for us. Lets go ask Joe what we should do."

Joe: "Ummm....you guys realize I'm just the football coach and it's your job to take of things like this?"

President of the college: "Okay, lets just let this go and hope nothing comes of it."

Others: "Sounds like a plan."
 
2012-07-02 09:08:15 AM  
Oh...fark. He referred to the kids as "guests". That's just messed up.
 
2012-07-02 09:08:42 AM  
JoePa and Co. were making too much money with 2nd Mile side deals to destroy Sandusky. So they did the humane thing and told him to take it off campus.
 
2012-07-02 09:10:45 AM  
They need to shut down the entire football program indefinitely.

Give the guys already on the team who have athletic scholarships the option to continue their education at Penn State for free, or help them find another university to play for.
 
2012-07-02 09:11:48 AM  
I love how the Spanier is on record as saying this might make us look bad. If you look at a particular action and say ....if we do this, it might make us look bad....guaranteed at some point in the future IT WILL MAKE YOU LOOK BAD!
 
2012-07-02 09:13:14 AM  

WTF Indeed: Joe: "Ummm....you guys realize I'm just the football coach and it's your job to take of things like this?"


I can't buy this argument, because as recently as 2007 Paterno was actively making sure players weren't disciplined by campus police.

And this is not the only instance of this. In an Aug. 12, 2005, email to Pennsylvania State University President Graham Spanier and others, Vicky Triponey, the university's standards and conduct officer, complained that Mr. Paterno believed she should have "no interest, (or business) holding our football players accountable to our community standards. The Coach is insistent he knows best how to discipline his players...and their status as a student when they commit violations of our standards should NOT be our concern...and I think he was saying we should treat football players different from other students in this regard."

I have to believe Paterno knew exactly what he was doing.
 
2012-07-02 09:15:23 AM  
In an alleged e-mail dated February 26, 2001, Schultz writes to Curley that he assumes Curley's "got the ball" about a three-part plan to "talk with the subject asap regarding the future appropriate use of the University facility," ... "contacting the chair of the charitable organization" and "contacting the Department of Welfare," according to a source with knowledge of the case.
...
Curley indicates he no longer wants to contact child welfare authorities just yet. He refers to a conversation the day before with Paterno. It's not known what Paterno may have said to Curley.


Yeah. I think we can put to rest this whole "JoePa did what he was supposed to do" thing. Sorry Penn State fans, I think your god was just as dirty on this as anyone else.
 
2012-07-02 09:15:54 AM  
Nuke it from orbit.
 
2012-07-02 09:16:09 AM  
Oops, my second link got eaten. Apparently we can't link to WSJ at all anymore.

Google:

A Discipline Problem
Paterno Fought Penn State Official Over Punishment of Players

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB1000142405297020444340457705207367256 1 402.html
 
2012-07-02 09:21:18 AM  
When Penn State has paid out on all the lawsuits sure to follow, will they be reduced to merely a Ju-Co or all the way to a trade school?

You deserve every farking thing you get Penn State for your 'humane approach' to handling a situation that left Tickle Monster in a position to rape four more kids using your school as part of the web that helped make it happen. No better than the catholic church.
 
2012-07-02 09:22:14 AM  
FTFA: "'This is a more humane and upfront way to handle this,' Gary Schultz, who was a university vice president at the time, allegedly wrote."

LOL, he actually used the word "humane." What a heaping bucket of fail.

I'm not sure exactly what needs to happen here, but it needs to be harsh. Is shuttering a football program even practical? How will the University shield itself and/or pay for all the civil suits?

What a gigantic goddamn mess.
 
2012-07-02 09:23:30 AM  

UNC_Samurai: I have to believe Paterno knew exactly what he was doing.


Nobody told Joe Pa what to do, that's for sure. Regardless of whether he knew more about Sandusky than he let on, the fact is that nobody f*cked with the football program, and corruption inevitably results from that kind of power.
 
2012-07-02 09:27:19 AM  

UNC_Samurai: I have to believe Paterno knew exactly what he was doing.


Paterno was used to giving the punishment to his players. Everywhere from cleaning the stadium after games, shoveling the stadium when it snowed. That kind of punishment.

What these emails show is that the executives of a major US college knew about child abuse, and when confronted with it they decided to ask a lower ranking employee. If your boss came in and asked you how you think he should do his job what are you going to tell him? More than likely it would end with the phrase, "Hey, but you're the boss. Do what you think is best.".
 
2012-07-02 09:28:01 AM  

WTF Indeed: President of the college: "Hey guys, so we got this problem with a coach, and it's pretty bad. What should we do?"

Others: "This could look bad for us. Lets go ask Joe what we should do."

Joe: "Ummm....you guys realize I'm just the football coach and it's your job to take of things like this?"

President of the college: "Okay, lets just let this go and hope nothing comes of it."

Others: "Sounds like a plan."


More like this...

Schultz to Curley: "So we have this three-step plan to talk to Sandusky, notify his charity and contact the Department of Welfare."

Curley: "Cool."

Next day...

Curley: "Hey, Schultz, I talked to Joe yesterday and how about we just do an internal investigation and politely ask Jerry not to do it again? Joe had a pretty shiatty season last year and people think he's too old to run the program. Plus if this ever got out, it could threaten our university's cashcow football program. Isn't it more humane to let Sandusky off instead of giving his victims the justice they deserve?"

Schultz: "Okay. Instead of following a good plan like the one we originally developed, let's do what Joe says because Joe is god around here. It's not like this will ever come back to bite us in the ass one day."

If they don't tear down that statute of Joe Paterno at Penn State, they need to follow the example set by out troops in Iraq and put a hood over it:

bezalel.secured.co.il

Your football god is dead. His legacy is in tatters. I only wish he had lived long enough to have to face Sandusky's victims and explain himself. Joe Paterno is a disgrace and a national embarrassment.
 
2012-07-02 09:28:57 AM  
Penn State's football team is about to become the newest member of the Alantic-10. That is if the school isn't sued into community college status.
 
2012-07-02 09:31:19 AM  
Wow... I didn't really believe Penn State should get the "death penalty" over this mess... but if these e-mails are true, then ABSOLUTELY. Kill that program, tear down the stadium and salt the earth.

Disgusting.

/When does MugzyBrown show up to defend Penn State, child rape, and Paterno?
 
2012-07-02 09:32:14 AM  

WTF Indeed: Joe: "Ummm....you guys realize I'm just the football coach and it's your job to take of things like this?"


There's a zero percent chance he said anything close to that.

WTF Indeed: What these emails show is that the executives of a major US college knew about child abuse, and when confronted with it they decided to ask a lower ranking employee. If your boss came in and asked you how you think he should do his job what are you going to tell him? More than likely it would end with the phrase, "Hey, but you're the boss. Do what you think is best.".


No, what they show is that in State College, PA, Joe Paterno wasn't a "lower ranking employee". Any suggestion to the contrary is naive and stupid. And bear in mind, Paterno already knew about Sandusky's proclivities in 1998, which is why he was told he'd never be the head coach at Penn State and fired as defensive coordinator. That was all Paterno.
 
2012-07-02 09:32:27 AM  
I have to start to wonder if Joe Pa was doing some underage raping himself. sounds like he basically talked them out of turning Sandusky in to the police.

May you burn in hell forever, Joe Pa..Jerry will join you soon.
 
2012-07-02 09:34:15 AM  

Aarontology: They need to shut down the entire football program indefinitely.

Give the guys already on the team who have athletic scholarships the option to continue their education at Penn State for free, or help them find another university to play for.


Two things.

First, if the NCAA didn't think it proper to shut down Miami's football program despite rogue boosters and hookers and spoiling their college athletes with favors, what makes you think they're gonna shut down Penn State with their coach having a boy service on the side unaffiliated with the football program?

Second, were you molested by football players in high school?
 
2012-07-02 09:34:28 AM  
Allow me to mash-up the arguments against prosecuting Penn State into one concise, if inane, post. These are actual sentiments put forth elsewhere...

'Puh-LEEZE! Look, there are some things we have to get straight here:

1) It is UNFAIR to punish the football players, Penn State students, and most of all the sweet, innocent fans by shuttering PSU football! When the games begin this Fall the HEALING will begin.

2) This just proves that it was NOT Joe Paterno's fault that Sandusky got away with this for so long. These guys with the emails were his superiors! What, do you think Paterno was some sort of omnipotent being on campus? It's not like they erected a statue of him to worship like a false idol!

3) Stop pushing this. It all should end with Sandusky's conviction. He was the sole person at fault here. It's just out and out MCCARTHYISM and a WITCH-HUNT! I love my BIG TIME COLLEGE FOOTBALL!!!'

*begins sobbing and slowly masturbating to the Big Ten schedule*
 
2012-07-02 09:34:36 AM  

WTF Indeed: What these emails show is that the executives of a major US college knew about child abuse, and when confronted with it they decided to ask a lower ranking employee. If your boss came in and asked you how you think he should do his job what are you going to tell him? More than likely it would end with the phrase, "Hey, but you're the boss. Do what you think is best.".


Seriously? You've gone completely off the rails. If my boss told me that kids were getting farked in our office, I'd put a stop to it. No, that's not me being an internet tough guy. I'd call the farking cops. You wouldn't do the same? Shame on you if not. Shame on JoePa and all of the culpable members of Penn State's administration.
 
2012-07-02 09:35:02 AM  

WTF Indeed: What these emails show is that the executives of a major US college knew about child abuse, and when confronted with it they decided to ask a lower ranking employee. If your boss came in and asked you how you think he should do his job what are you going to tell him? More than likely it would end with the phrase, "Hey, but you're the boss. Do what you think is best."


Oh, no they didn't. Sandusky was part of the football program. Nobody did anything with anyone associated in the football program without Paterno's OK. People who did got fired.
 
2012-07-02 09:35:06 AM  

WTF Indeed: President of the college: "Hey guys, so we got this problem with a coach, and it's pretty bad. What should we do?"

Others: "This could look bad for us. Lets go ask Joe what we should do."

Joe: "Ummm....you guys realize I'm just the football coach and it's your job to take of things like this?"

President of the college: "Okay, lets just let this go and hope nothing comes of it."

Others: "Sounds like a plan."


Here we go again...How long have people been saying Joe Pa runs that campus and is the most powerful man on campus. Everyone wants to skirt the blame from him and put it off on the higher ups...WTF? HE WAS THE HIGHER UP, especially in this case.
 
2012-07-02 09:35:37 AM  

WTF Indeed: If your boss came in and asked you how you think he should do his job what are you going to tell him? More than likely it would end with the phrase, "Hey, but you're the boss. Do what you think is best.".


Nobody was Paterno's boss.

LesserEvil: When does MugzyBrown show up to defend Penn State, child rape, and Paterno?


I've shown up, but I've never defended PSU or Paterno or Sandusky.
 
2012-07-02 09:37:05 AM  

rjakobi: First, if the NCAA didn't think it proper to shut down Miami's football program despite rogue boosters and hookers and spoiling their college athletes with favors, what makes you think they're gonna shut down Penn State with their coach having a boy service on the side unaffiliated with the football program?


So paying athletes is worse than child rape. Got it.
 
2012-07-02 09:37:21 AM  
Apparently the price of ones soul is a winning football team.

If there is a hell, I hope Joe Pa went to the special one, and Sandusky and every other enabler who covered for Sandusky joins him there soon.

I'm all for love and tolerance, but seriously, fark these people.
 
2012-07-02 09:37:23 AM  

LesserEvil: Wow... I didn't really believe Penn State should get the "death penalty" over this mess... but if these e-mails are true, then ABSOLUTELY. Kill that program, tear down the stadium and salt the earth.

Disgusting.

/When does MugzyBrown show up to defend Penn State, child rape, and Paterno?


Around the same time he shows up in the Politics tab to defend voting for racists (Which he's on record for saying he'd do).

Anyway, Curley and Spanier, as I recall, have been brought up on charges. I think Penn State's football program will go on, but years from now some idiot on ESPN will talk about 2012-2017 or so as "rebuilding years" so they don't have to address what really happened.
 
2012-07-02 09:38:11 AM  
Why are we talking about shutting down the football program? Since the President of the University was in on this cover up, maybe it is the school that should be shut down for a while, which would automatically shut down the football team as well..
 
2012-07-02 09:40:20 AM  
I'm still amazed that they rioted in support of a child rape cover up.
 
2012-07-02 09:40:44 AM  

verbaltoxin: Around the same time he shows up in the Politics tab to defend voting for racists (Which he's on record for saying he'd do).


Ohh it's MugzyBrown out of context day. Odd that.
 
2012-07-02 09:41:19 AM  

srhp29: I have to start to wonder if Joe Pa was doing some underage raping himself. sounds like he basically talked them out of turning Sandusky in to the police.

May you burn in hell forever, Joe Pa..Jerry will join you soon.


I doubt that. He and the others decided to sweep this under the rug because they were afraid that it would destroy Paterno's reputation and the school's reputation. And the thing is in reality, yes if they would have gone to the police and did what they were supposed to do at first their would have been a shiat storm, some heads may have rolled, but if they handled it correctly the damage could have been limited and it would have left a footnote in school history, but not the shiat storm they are facing now.
 
2012-07-02 09:41:21 AM  

rjakobi: Aarontology: They need to shut down the entire football program indefinitely.

Give the guys already on the team who have athletic scholarships the option to continue their education at Penn State for free, or help them find another university to play for.

Two things.

First, if the NCAA didn't think it proper to shut down Miami's football program despite rogue boosters and hookers and spoiling their college athletes with favors, what makes you think they're gonna shut down Penn State with their coach having a boy service on the side unaffiliated with the football program?

Second, were you molested by football players in high school?


One big reason: outside of college football no one gave a damn about Miami's problems. How many people do you know that don't care about college football that have an opinion on this? Everyone does. And that pressure from outside, be it public, legal or political is why the program will (and should rightfully) be shut down.
 
2012-07-02 09:41:52 AM  

BronyMedic: Apparently the price of ones soul is a winning profitable football team.


FTFY
 
2012-07-02 09:43:30 AM  

cettin: I am an alumnus and I say they can all burn in hell, throw the book at every single one of them.


You're in the minority. Most Penn State fans are in denial, claiming CNN is making everything up and that Paterno is completely innocent.
 
2012-07-02 09:44:08 AM  

srhp29: Why are we talking about shutting down the football program? Since the President of the University was in on this cover up, maybe it is the school that should be shut down for a while, which would automatically shut down the football team as well..


Oh, come on, that's just...

HotWingConspiracy: I'm still amazed that they rioted in support of a child rape cover up.


Actually, maybe that's not a bad idea.
 
2012-07-02 09:45:32 AM  

rjakobi: Two things.

First, if the NCAA didn't think it proper to shut down Miami's football program despite rogue boosters and hookers and spoiling their college athletes with favors, what makes you think they're gonna shut down Penn State with their coach having a boy service on the side unaffiliated with the football program?

Second, were you molested by football players in high school?


Situation 1 didn't involve any felonies and coverups of those felonies. Situation 2 did. You don't need to be molested by football players in order to advocate shutting down a program involved in the coverup of particularly despicable criminal activity.

If you let the players move on to another program or stay on their scholarships, they're inconvenienced, but OK.

Do you really think that the NCAA should do nothing to the program so they can avoid hurting the players? Can you imagine backlash that would occur as a result? It would be far more damaging to players who were locked into playing for Penn State.
 
2012-07-02 09:46:42 AM  

Yanks_RSJ: That was all Paterno.


Let's look at this logically. If you've been with a company for 60 years and are beloved by everyone, and the President of the company comes to you one day and says. "One of the employees that reports to you has been stealing money from the company for years and it will hurt us publicly when this comes out. What do you think we should do?" Now you know that this looks terrible for you, since it's your section and this person has been working with you for years and you have personal relationship with this person. So you say, "Yes, something should be done, but please be as kind as you can to him." So the President of the company, after listening to you decides he'll just fire the guy rather than press charges and hurt the company."

Now ten years later, the books are wrong and the company is in trouble. The President says that you are to blame for this because everyone liked you and they didn't want to damage your image. So are the company's problems your fault for being beloved, or the President's fault for not doing his job and reporting the crime?
 
2012-07-02 09:48:49 AM  

Babwa Wawa: Situation 1 didn't involve any felonies and coverups of those felonies. Situation 2 did. You don't need to be molested by football players in order to advocate shutting down a program involved in the coverup of particularly despicable criminal activity.


There is no need to shut down the football program since pretty much everybody involved is fired, resigned, in jail, or dead.

If the NCAA decided to take away scholarships for 5 years, it'd be odd since the scandal had nothing to do with the football team or its players, but I wouldn't think it was an outrageous idea.
 
2012-07-02 09:50:50 AM  
I'd always liked Paterno. From a dumb little kid to a guy approaching middle age who doesn't give a damn about football any more. When this first broke, I was disappointed, to say the least. What a way to throw away a legacy. What we knew then was bad enough. But now.... f*ck you, Joe Paterno.

Penn State needs to take down every reference to that guy on campus. And Penn State students, alumni and fans need to understand that this is about a lot more than football. It sucks, I know, but that's how it is and how it always will be from now on. He crapped all over whatever he'd built and deserves no honors.
 
2012-07-02 09:54:02 AM  

WTF Indeed: Let's look at this logically. If you've been with a company for 60 years and are beloved by everyone, and the President of the company comes to you one day and says. "One of the employees that reports to you has been stealing money from the company for years and it will hurt us publicly when this comes out. What do you think we should do?" Now you know that this looks terrible for you, since it's your section and this person has been working with you for years and you have personal relationship with this person. So you say, "Yes, something should be done, but please be as kind as you can to him." So the President of the company, after listening to you decides he'll just fire the guy rather than press charges and hurt the company."

Now ten years later, the books are wrong and the company is in trouble. The President says that you are to blame for this because everyone liked you and they didn't want to damage your image. So are the company's problems your fault for being beloved, or the President's fault for not doing his job and reporting the crime?


That's an awful analogy.

1) Paterno is not just an old employee, he is the head of the football program, the most powerful person on campus and one of the most powerful people in the state.

2) The vicim of the crime in your analogy is the company, the victim of this crime is a child and child predators are well known to have more than one victim.

3) The issue isn't covering up a past, embarassing mistake, but not acting and not preemptively stopping future crimes. If there weren't victims after this 'shower incident' it would have been just a black mark on his reputation. Since there were victims afterwards, it puts a big stain on everything about Joe Pa
 
2012-07-02 09:55:07 AM  

WTF Indeed: Let's look at this logically. If you've been with a company for 60 years and are beloved by everyone, and the President of the company comes to you one day and says. "One of the employees that reports to you has been stealing money from the company for years and it will hurt us publicly when this comes out. What do you think we should do?" Now you know that this looks terrible for you, since it's your section and this person has been working with you for years and you have personal relationship with this person. So you say, "Yes, something should be done, but please be as kind as you can to him." So the President of the company, after listening to you decides he'll just fire the guy rather than press charges and hurt the company."

Now ten years later, the books are wrong and the company is in trouble. The President says that you are to blame for this because everyone liked you and they didn't want to damage your image. So are the company's problems your fault for being beloved, or the President's fault for not doing his job and reporting the crime?


All of that is only logical if the "President" of the company doesn't have to walk past a statue of his "beloved" 60-year employee every morning. Beyond that, it's not even worth addressing you until you understand the power dynamic at Penn State. You want to make it seem like Paterno was just some lovable old guy who punched a clock for sixty years and was admired by everyone, when in reality he built that football program from the ground up and was treated like a god on that campus and in the entire central Pennsylvania region.

There was no higher authority than Joe Paterno. None. Zero.
 
2012-07-02 09:55:50 AM  

MugzyBrown: Nobody was Paterno's boss.


What people think Paterno was at PSU:

"He ran the day-to-day operations of the college. He had no equal, and was less a coach and more a middle eastern dictator."

What Paterno actually was at PSU:

"An old guy who made speeches at pep rallies, stood on the sidelines, and traveled around Pennsylvania recruiting players."
 
2012-07-02 09:56:27 AM  
Time to go to the nearest manure pit and throw my Penn State diploma in.

/Might be an insult to the manure
 
2012-07-02 09:58:13 AM  

WTF Indeed: What Paterno actually was at PSU:

"An old guy who made speeches at pep rallies, stood on the sidelines, and traveled around Pennsylvania recruiting players."


Nobody thinks Joe Pa ran the day to day operations of the school or even the football team, but Joe Pa had enough power in the university to get Graham Spanier or Curley fired if he ever wanted to.
 
2012-07-02 10:00:06 AM  

Owangotang: Allow me to mash-up the arguments against prosecuting Penn State into one concise, if inane, post. These are actual sentiments put forth elsewhere...

'Puh-LEEZE! Look, there are some things we have to get straight here:

1) It is UNFAIR to punish the football players, Penn State students, and most of all the sweet, innocent fans by shuttering PSU football! When the games begin this Fall the HEALING will begin.

2) This just proves that it was NOT Joe Paterno's fault that Sandusky got away with this for so long. These guys with the emails were his superiors! What, do you think Paterno was some sort of omnipotent being on campus? It's not like they erected a statue of him to worship like a false idol!

3) Stop pushing this. It all should end with Sandusky's conviction. He was the sole person at fault here. It's just out and out MCCARTHYISM and a WITCH-HUNT! I love my BIG TIME COLLEGE FOOTBALL!!!'

*begins sobbing and slowly masturbating to the Big Ten schedule*


You left out my favorite, which I have actually read more than once on PSU boards this weekend:

"How do we know the Joe mentioned in the emails is even JoePa? It could be anyone. Joe is a very common name!"
 
2012-07-02 10:02:21 AM  

MugzyBrown: There is no need to shut down the football program since pretty much everybody involved is fired, resigned, in jail, or dead.


If a corporation (or any organization) does something illegal, it's not enough to just prosecute the people who did the illegal acts. You also need to penalize the corporation for creating the situation and allowing it to happen. The stockholders suffer even though they had no knowledge of the malfeasance, but that's the way the cookie crumbles. It's important to have real deterrence, otherwise the behavior patterns can continue as long as you have a scapegoat.

Allowing the current players to move on is probably the most equitable outcome for them. Most of them would welcome the opportunity to seek a scholarship with another college without penalty. Lord knows this isn't the program they signed up for.
 
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