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(News 1130)   Hand sanitizer recalled due to bacterial contamination   (news1130.com) divider line 54
    More: Ironic, hand sanitizer, cystic fibrosis, Kimberly-Clark, Health Canada, contamination, Kleenex, sepsis, immunodeficiencies  
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4445 clicks; posted to Main » on 28 Jun 2012 at 5:14 PM (2 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2012-06-28 05:19:33 PM  
This is the most beautiful use of the Ironic tag I've ever seen. It brings a tear to my eye.
 
2012-06-28 05:20:24 PM  
You see that, Alanis, is what is known as irony........don't ya think?
 
2012-06-28 05:20:44 PM  
+1 for proper use of the Ironic tag
 
2012-06-28 05:21:25 PM  
I...

But...

We don't do that here. I demand the tag be changed.
 
2012-06-28 05:21:43 PM  
It's like 10,000 spoons when all you need is a knife.
 
2012-06-28 05:21:49 PM  
The rare and elusive ironicus correctus. A fleeting beauty, the likes of which we may never see again.
 
2012-06-28 05:21:54 PM  
Is it becoming ironic to use the ironic tab correctly?
 
2012-06-28 05:27:58 PM  
I saw a pig fly past my window and thought, "dear god!, it cannot be!"

so I came to check fark, and lo and behold, it has happened. JOY!!!
 
2012-06-28 05:28:08 PM  
VERY ironic!
 
2012-06-28 05:28:28 PM  
You had one job to do Hand Sanitizer...ONE JOB!
 
2012-06-28 05:35:03 PM  
For the record - I submitted this with 'FAIL' so that you could all have fun complaining about the lack of an Ironic tag, but a Modmin seems to have switched it.

Kind of ironic really...
 
2012-06-28 05:42:49 PM  

Ivo Shandor: For the record - I submitted this with 'FAIL' so that you could all have fun complaining about the lack of an Ironic tag, but a Modmin seems to have switched it.

Kind of ironic really...


Recursive irony ... is that like dividing by zero. If so, you've killed us all!
 
2012-06-28 05:43:26 PM  
The bacteria have evolved to use the had sanitizer as a vector of transmission
 
2012-06-28 05:45:58 PM  
I don't and won't use that sissy s*h*i*t anyway!
 
2012-06-28 05:46:41 PM  
Although it is contaminated with one specific type of bacteria, it still does the job and kills about 99.9% of the other types of bacteria on your hand.

It would be ironic only if the dispenser contained bacterial growth medium, so why the ironic tag?

/am I trying too hard?
 
2012-06-28 05:46:49 PM  
The clue isBurkholderia cepacia.

What is found in a Muslim family's hallway?
 
2012-06-28 05:50:21 PM  
Easy solution. Just use hand sanitizer after using the hand sanitizer.
 
2012-06-28 05:51:50 PM  
"The affected hand sanitizer comes in one-litre and 1.2-litre containers, and is used in large-volume dispensers, such as those found in public areas and workspaces"

And Hospitals don't forget they are in every hospital room where the nurse uses it before caring for very sick people.
 
2012-06-28 05:54:13 PM  

Fapinator: Ivo Shandor: For the record - I submitted this with 'FAIL' so that you could all have fun complaining about the lack of an Ironic tag, but a Modmin seems to have switched it.

Kind of ironic really...

Recursive irony ... is that like dividing by zero. If so, you've killed us all!


Could have used the "OBVIOUS" tag and gone all meta.

I just don't know what the world is coming to today.
 
2012-06-28 06:03:21 PM  
I wipe my hands on the carpet immediately after using hand sanitizer for this very reason.
 
2012-06-28 06:05:51 PM  
Hand sanitizer is one of the biggest scams going, Invented for helicopter parents and germaphobes. Anti-bacterial crap is counter-productive. Just makes people more susceptible to infections.

/personal opinion, with no useful scientific stuff to back it up.
// love the headline.
 
2012-06-28 06:10:09 PM  

SpocksEars


This is the most beautiful use of the Ironic tag I've ever seen. It brings a tear to my eye.


Very good points.


See, it's because you speak the truth AND because you're SpocksEars, which were are pointy.
 
2012-06-28 06:11:30 PM  
So far no Mitch Hedberg reference? You guys are failing!
 
2012-06-28 06:14:22 PM  
Stop using that shiat.
 
2012-06-28 06:23:22 PM  
Hand sanitizer is a complete scam. It is functionally worthless. Go be a faux neat-freak somewhere else, you dirty-ass moron.
 
2012-06-28 06:24:34 PM  
They didn't say it was anti-bacterial.
 
2012-06-28 06:29:12 PM  

Biner: I wipe my hands on the carpet immediately after using hand sanitizer for this very reason.


Meh, I just wipe my hands on toilet seats to shortcut the whole mess.
 
2012-06-28 06:31:32 PM  
This guy explains what happens

Poorly Made In China

Worked as an agent for American company trying to manufacture body wash etc in China.

Concept of 'Quality fade" - they start off making stuff to your specifications, then gradually substitute cheaper (nastier) components until you notice, and when you complain, shrug.
 
2012-06-28 06:59:06 PM  

houndoggie: I saw a pig fly past my window and thought, "dear god!, it cannot be!"

so I came to check fark, and lo and behold, it has happened. JOY!!!


I read that in Stimpy's voice, and am now giggling like an idiot.
 
2012-06-28 07:03:24 PM  

Sass-O-Rev: Hand sanitizer is one of the biggest scams going, Invented for helicopter parents and germaphobes. Anti-bacterial crap is counter-productive. Just makes people more susceptible to infections.



The CDC, the U.N. World Health Organization, and just about every medical doctor on the planet disagree with you.

/do you believe that having sex with an underage virgin cures AIDS?
 
2012-06-28 07:17:24 PM  

ThrobblefootSpectre: Sass-O-Rev: Hand sanitizer is one of the biggest scams going, Invented for helicopter parents and germaphobes. Anti-bacterial crap is counter-productive. Just makes people more susceptible to infections.


The CDC, the U.N. World Health Organization, and just about every medical doctor on the planet disagree with you.

/do you believe that having sex with an underage virgin cures AIDS?


However, it does cause drug- and chemical-resistant strains to evolve.

Yes, anti-bacterial products are counter-productive. Both because it reduces exposure so that your immune system doesn't have a chance to develop proper resistance, and because it aids in the evolution of harmful bacteria.

I'll take the random sniffles and mild infections. Keeps my immune system strong. Granted, it ain't savin' me from the Plague or anything so vile, but as someone who is regularly exposed to some of the nastier pathogens out there, I'm fine with keepin' my natural defenses strong.

/god, do I hate working in hospitals
 
2012-06-28 07:23:07 PM  
There's a time and a place for anti-bacterial sanitization, and it is not on your hands, all the farking time.
 
2012-06-28 07:35:54 PM  
It's super germ.
 
2012-06-28 07:39:25 PM  

Kuroshin: I'll take the random sniffles and mild infections. Keeps my immune system strong. Granted, it ain't savin' me from the Plague or anything so vile, but as someone who is regularly exposed to some of the nastier pathogens out there, I'm fine with keepin' my natural defenses strong.

/god, do I hate working in hospitals



Um, I think it's the patients you are supposed to be worrying about, not yourself. Lol.

The patients are the ones with the weakened immune systems, open surgical wounds, etc. Whether or not you get the sniffles isn't the point.

I strongly agree, it sounds like you shouldn't be working in hospitals.
 
2012-06-28 08:04:12 PM  

Broktun: The clue isBurkholderia cepacia.

What is found in a Muslim family's hallway?


Dusty shoes?
 
2012-06-28 08:30:03 PM  
Isopropyl alcohol takes 10-30 minutes to kill "germs". It evaporates too quickly to when spread out thinly.

/so send your money to me instead of those nasty slaver corporations.
Rich Cream
c/o Fark
Farktown, Farkota USA
 
2012-06-28 08:30:52 PM  

Rich Cream: Isopropyl alcohol takes 10-30 minutes to kill "germs". It evaporates too quickly to when spread out thinly.

/so send your money to me instead of those nasty slaver corporations.
Rich Cream
c/o Fark
Farktown, Farkota USA



And I'll spend the money on grammer lessons. :)
 
2012-06-28 08:38:40 PM  
Hand Sanitizers (at least those that work, such as the alcohol based,) does not breed resistant germs. That's a side effect of over use of anti-biotics (the kind you ingest or inject.) Frequent use of sanitizer, by comparison is proven to reduce the spread of resistant bacteria in hospitals.
 
2012-06-28 08:38:57 PM  
You know... Allanis never said those things were Ironic. She merely asked. Taking that into consideration along with the fact that NONE of them are ironic... well, it's sort of ironic.

\truly she was a master troll.
 
2012-06-28 08:58:17 PM  
The average American is exposed to triclosan et al. every day.
 
2012-06-28 10:42:50 PM  

rashkae: Hand Sanitizers (at least those that work, such as the alcohol based,) does not breed resistant germs. That's a side effect of over use of anti-biotics (the kind you ingest or inject.) Frequent use of sanitizer, by comparison is proven to reduce the spread of resistant bacteria in hospitals.


Citation for that? I'd assumed all antibiotics that don't kill 100% of the treated population allows for more discrete mutation.
 
2012-06-28 11:10:24 PM  
Classic.

My dad worked in a lab where he kept getting contamination. He swapped out every reasonable reagent that could be the source but it kept cropping up. Finally, he plated some ethanol he had been using. Turned out it had viable spores in it.

Microbes are crazy. I had a fungus growing in 1 M sodium hydroxide once.
 
2012-06-28 11:17:25 PM  

iivel: rashkae: Hand Sanitizers (at least those that work, such as the alcohol based,) does not breed resistant germs. That's a side effect of over use of anti-biotics (the kind you ingest or inject.) Frequent use of sanitizer, by comparison is proven to reduce the spread of resistant bacteria in hospitals.

Citation for that? I'd assumed all antibiotics that don't kill 100% of the treated population allows for more discrete mutation.


That's true for antibiotics but not necessarily true for alcohol. Alcohol resistance would require large, fundamental changes to the membrane or cell wall. It's just too big a change to be able to fully adapt to sterilizing concentrations of alcohol (usually 70%). It's possible for organisms to adapt to lower concentrations though.

Also, some spores can survive in 100% ethanol (but usually not 70%...at some point having a bit of water makes it MORE effective because it penetrates better).
 
2012-06-28 11:26:39 PM  

cs30109: iivel: rashkae: Hand Sanitizers (at least those that work, such as the alcohol based,) does not breed resistant germs. That's a side effect of over use of anti-biotics (the kind you ingest or inject.) Frequent use of sanitizer, by comparison is proven to reduce the spread of resistant bacteria in hospitals.

Citation for that? I'd assumed all antibiotics that don't kill 100% of the treated population allows for more discrete mutation.

That's true for antibiotics but not necessarily true for alcohol. Alcohol resistance would require large, fundamental changes to the membrane or cell wall. It's just too big a change to be able to fully adapt to sterilizing concentrations of alcohol (usually 70%). It's possible for organisms to adapt to lower concentrations though.

Also, some spores can survive in 100% ethanol (but usually not 70%...at some point having a bit of water makes it MORE effective because it penetrates better).


For alcohol based sanitizers, it isn't the alcohol killing things, so much as removing oils and leaving behind an anitimicrobial coating though, correct? I've got a dozen google scholar and lexis nexus tabs open on this subject ... I'll admit my cellular biology is weak, but I know I don't worry about things growing in my wine post fermentation. It seems, as a layman, that the sanitizers replicate the hydrophobic effects of soap to get you clean, rather than kill though. Interesting stuff.
 
2012-06-29 12:03:06 AM  

iivel: For alcohol based sanitizers, it isn't the alcohol killing things, so much as removing oils and leaving behind an anitimicrobial coating though, correct?


No, soap is for removing oils. It is a lipophilic (oil/fat attaching) substance.

Alcohol causes direct lysis of cell walls. It directly kills bacteria, and many viruses. It does not leave behind any coating.

Emergent bacterial resistance to alcohol is not likely in the same sense that bacteria develop resistance to antibiotics. Antibiotics generally attach to or disrupt one specific point/process in cellular activity. A mutation in an organism may change the molecular structure of the single receptor or molecule disrupted by the antibiotic. Thus no longer being affected by the antibiotic. Alcohol on the other hand attacks the entire cellular structure. Like being attacked at a million points at once. A mutation that changes a molecule or two is probably never going to defend against that.
 
2012-06-29 12:46:06 AM  

ThrobblefootSpectre: iivel: For alcohol based sanitizers, it isn't the alcohol killing things, so much as removing oils and leaving behind an anitimicrobial coating though, correct?

No, soap is for removing oils. It is a lipophilic (oil/fat attaching) substance.

Alcohol causes direct lysis of cell walls. It directly kills bacteria, and many viruses. It does not leave behind any coating.

Emergent bacterial resistance to alcohol is not likely in the same sense that bacteria develop resistance to antibiotics. Antibiotics generally attach to or disrupt one specific point/process in cellular activity. A mutation in an organism may change the molecular structure of the single receptor or molecule disrupted by the antibiotic. Thus no longer being affected by the antibiotic. Alcohol on the other hand attacks the entire cellular structure. Like being attacked at a million points at once. A mutation that changes a molecule or two is probably never going to defend against that.


That makes sense thanks. As a semi related question, why then don't we use alcohol and healthy blood as part of a plasmapheresis styled treatment for people with otherwise untreatable infectious diseases? I'd think that a given amount of time would eliminate everything from blood plasma.
 
2012-06-29 12:50:31 AM  

ThrobblefootSpectre: iivel: For alcohol based sanitizers, it isn't the alcohol killing things, so much as removing oils and leaving behind an anitimicrobial coating though, correct?

No, soap is for removing oils. It is a lipophilic (oil/fat attaching) substance.

Alcohol causes direct lysis of cell walls. It directly kills bacteria, and many viruses. It does not leave behind any coating.

Emergent bacterial resistance to alcohol is not likely in the same sense that bacteria develop resistance to antibiotics. Antibiotics generally attach to or disrupt one specific point/process in cellular activity. A mutation in an organism may change the molecular structure of the single receptor or molecule disrupted by the antibiotic. Thus no longer being affected by the antibiotic. Alcohol on the other hand attacks the entire cellular structure. Like being attacked at a million points at once. A mutation that changes a molecule or two is probably never going to defend against that.


I should note that I wasn't implying that the alcohol left behind much of anything, but the other ingredients in the solution are designed to create an anti microbial coat post cleansing.
 
2012-06-29 05:38:56 AM  

iivel: That makes sense thanks. As a semi related question, why then don't we use alcohol and healthy blood as part of a plasmapheresis styled treatment for people with otherwise untreatable infectious diseases? I'd think that a given amount of time would eliminate everything from blood plasma.



I'm not a biochemist, but I assume because alcohol, in a concentration high enough to effectively kill bacteria, also attacks the healthy human blood cells.

Your body's healthy cells aren't immune to destructive effects of alcohol, so they get disintegrated just like bacterial cells do. That's why alcohol stings when you put it on a cut, and why Listerine mouthwash burns in the mouth.

Normally, when used as an external antiseptic (as in hand sanitizer), this isn't a problem, because the alcohol is only coming into contact with your dead epidermal cells anyway. Hence no sting, no damage.

It is well known, though, that when alcohol is used in the mouth as mouthwash, the damage to the cells lining the mouth can allow foreign substances, such as carcinogens, to enter the body. That's why smokers who use alcohol mouth wash have a much increased risk of oral cancers.

That's where the trickiness of antibiotics come in. Antibiotics are designed so as to disrupt some highly specific part of bacterial cell function without disrupting healthy human cell function. That's why they can be taken internally. As opposed to highly effective antiseptic agents, which unfortunately are also toxic to our own cells, such as alcohol or bleach.

But the very narrow and specific nature of an antibiotic's method of action, is exactly why bacteria are able to mutate enough to resist them. Pennicillin for example disrupts a single highly specific enzyme that some bacteria use to make and repair their cell walls. Unable to maintain a cell wall, the bacterium dies. The benefit of this, of course, is that since humans don't need this enzyme, we can take penicillin internally. The drawback is that any mutation to that one particular bacterial enzyme may make penicillin no longer effective against bacteria with that mutation (resistance). Alcohol on the other hand is like setting off a nuke on the entire cell. Mutations to a few molecules won't help.

Anyway, to get back to your plasmapheresis question, it's probably because a high concentration of alcohol would be doing more harm to the filtered blood cells than good.
 
2012-06-29 05:50:11 AM  

iivel: I should note that I wasn't implying that the alcohol left behind much of anything, but the other ingredients in the solution are designed to create an anti microbial coat post cleansing.


That sounds more like triclosan. Which is also commonly used in some antibacterial soaps and such. It does stick to the skin after washing, and has a lasting antibacterial effect for hours.

Unlike alcohol however, there is some question (though no proof yet) that it can cause emergent resistance in bacteria. It may also be an endocrine disruptor that harms human biology in some way. There's no denying it is an effective antibacterial though.

So, yes, triclosan based sanitizers may yet be proven to cause resistance/health/enviromental problems for us, unlike alcohol.
 
2012-06-29 06:03:55 AM  
wwwdelivery.superstock.com
 
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