KnightWhoFormerlySaidNi: Smeggy Smurf: 3 of the 4 boxes have failed. Time to break out the 4th box. Good thing I've been teaching the boys how to do it as well.I'm not fluent in crazy. Someone mind explaining this to me?
jigger: That was a lot of words just to say that you're not very bright. Keep it up. One day you'll be somebody.
Corvus: Each country is different. In Germany the system is a lot like what this system is under the Affordable Care Act.
meat0918: heap: so i took the obligatory stroll thru freeperville (it's kinda like visiting a zoo, except the animals are insane) - holy balls christmas. they are calling for armed revolt. proclaiming in 1990s geocities web template style that 5 justices are guilty of treason. random proclamations that the Scalia opinion was written as a majority opinion, and some last minute shenanigans (a la 'obama has your daughter, john roberts - wouldn't want anything to happen to her, would you?) altered what was right and patriotic.for real, i wouldn't ordinarily be one to suggest strolling thru the loony bin, but be frigged if this flavor of insanity isn't worth viewing.Damn, the Secret Service is going to be busy.I wonder when the owner of Free Republic will post a statement asking people to tone it down, and stop the seditious talk?
meat0918: Damn, the Secret Service is going to be busy.I wonder when the owner of Free Republic will post a statement asking people to tone it down, and stop the seditious talk?
ModernPrimitive01: Let me tell a story about why this is a good thing: 15 years ago my mother got cancer. She fought hard and won. Complete remission/surgery to remove lumps. Immediately after her surgery she was dropped from her insurance. Following her cancer, she continued to work (ran her own restaurant) but was not able to purchase health insurance. She tried everywhere, was willing to pay huge sums of money, but not a single insurer would give her a plan due to "preexisting conditions." 3 years ago she started to recognize the signs that something was wrong. She went for a blood test and boom, she had cancer again, but couldn't get it treated. Her only option was disability, something she had avoided last time because she wanted to continue to work. It took 2 years for her to get disability by that time her previously treatable cancer had become stage 4 terminal cancer. She is continuing to fight, about to start her 4th round of chemo/radiation. If she was able to get insurance before this happened not only would there be a good chance they could have cured it, but it would have been less expensive for the entire health care system. I'm telling that story to every idiot that says something stupid about the ruling today.
abb3w: Essentially... the mandate is functionally a tax (or pedantaically, an exercise of the taxing power) from the stance of constitutional law, but it's not a tax from the standpoint of statutory law.If you call a tail a leg, how many legs has a dog? Five? No, calling a tail a leg don't make it a leg. - attributed to Abraham Lincolnlh6.googleusercontent.com
PainfulItching: Explain to me how this is supposed to help me?
Weaver95: Moderator: Weaver95: xanadian: Ya know, kind of off-topic, but...I'll bet Moderator must be busier in this thread than a three-legged man in an ass-kicking contest.I kinda feel sorry for the mods today.For the most part people are being good.still...this has GOT to be nuts to monitor. I don't envy you at all!
The_Sponge: Gwendolyn: I never saw the difference between the federal government saying I must have health care and Maryland requiring me to have car insurance. I'm sure it is in some way but we get told we have to do things all the time.Here's the difference:You don't have to drive a car.
Big Man On Campus: Roberts surprised me. He surprised me in that he didn't read his own opinion. His opinion basically says that congress not only has the power to tax, but the power to tax individuals arbitrarily.His decision seems to say that Congress decides what lifestyles are and are not fair to tax. Where does this line of reasoning end? "Oh, you haven't voted in the last election, that's another 1% on your tax bill."... "Oh, you didn't exercise regularly this year, that's another 1% effective tax rate."... "Oh you didn't purchase anything on Amazon this year, that's another 1%"You might look at my hyperbole and be dismissive, but that's essentially the door that Roberts opened. He opened the door to most any individual lifestyle and/or individual financial decision to be taxable.Very bad decision. I don't mind health care, I don't even mind government-run health care. Just for farks sake, let the individual opt-out of it, let individual freedom rule over this stupid legislation that wasn't even read.
jayhawk88: Man I can't wait until my nutjob extended family members get home tonight and start tearing up Facebook.
ontariolightning: Then I don't see this as some big victory.
HeartBurnKid: xltech: Well, I will be out of a job in the medical field within 2 years... thanks a lot libs. Small rural clinics like mine will be shut down because of the high cost of compliance. We were already worried about the mandidtory Electronic Records implementation to get reimbursement with Medicare/Medicaid. That alone was going to cost us over $50k. We will be closed within 2 years now.What new regulations are imposed on clinics by the PPACA? AFAIK, pretty much everything in it deals with insurers, not medical practitioners. Including the mandate that was at issue.
rufus-t-firefly: Let me get the right-wing's reasoning straight.The Supreme Court upheld the ACA on the basis that the mandate is a tax, and therefore Constitutional. That was wrong.Obama said that he wouldn't increase taxes on the bottom 95%, so, since the SC says the mandate is a tax, that makes him a liar.So, for their "logic" to be correct, the Supreme Court has to be right in calling the mandate is a tax, but wrong in saying that a tax is constitutional. There's no other combination that would allow them to be pissed off at the decision AND happy that Obama somehow looks bad.Right?They're eating a hunk of shiat and are trying to convince us that it tastes like steak.
The Larch: // on the internet, nobody can tell that I'm a dog!
bwilson27: jigger: robbrie: ACA is a tax, only if you CHOOSE to opt out of "mandatory" health insurance.Using the tax code to influence the behavior of the electorate is neither new nor newsworthy.Why do you think we have a home mortgage interest primary residence tax deduction? So more people will become homeowners.Why do you think we lowered the long term capital gains tax rate to 15%? To stimulate individual investment.So the Dems and Obama raised tax rates on ALL of the middle class. Well, no on everyone. So the Dems and Obama raised tax rates on EVERYONE, and then added a tax deduction for having health insurance. Is that what you're saying?Whatever they're paying you, they should lower it.
ontariolightning: raise taxes on everything, cut way back on military expenditures and spend the money on universal healthcare for all Americansproblem solved
The Larch: jigger: That was a lot of words just to say that you're not very bright. Keep it up. One day you'll be somebody.I get so excited when people respond to me, I pee on the floor a little bit! I hope we can continue to have this stimulating and intellectual conversation! It makes me so happy my tail wiggles.// on the internet, nobody can tell that I'm a dog!
xanadian: abb3w: Essentially... the mandate is functionally a tax (or pedantaically, an exercise of the taxing power) from the stance of constitutional law, but it's not a tax from the standpoint of statutory law.If you call a tail a leg, how many legs has a dog? Five? No, calling a tail a leg don't make it a leg. - attributed to Abraham Lincolnlh6.googleusercontent.comSo, what you're telling me is, the ruling was so ambiguously worded as to allow people like Faux News to scream "TAX TAX TAX TAX TAX"?
muck4doo: Don't worry about it. Moderator deleted any offending opinions for you.
mrshowrules: Lucky LaRue: PanicMan: My coworker just said "they can't do that because the founding fathers wrote the constitution based on the old testimate". Also, this is the end of the country.My coworker's reaction:Me - Did you hear?Her - Hear what?Me - The Supreme Court upheld the entire law.Her - Oh... What law was that?Me - Um.. Obamacare.Her - Oh - I thought the already decided that.Is she hot? Because that type of dumb is just a bonus when they are hot.
brobdiggy: It amazes me that so many of you think this is a great thing. It's just the government getting its foot in the door to have even greater power.
relcec: Fail in Human Form: mr lawson: Fail in Human Form: The bill limits the amount of overhead so if they raise the rates, or requires a rebate cheque to be sent to the policy holders, it'll be to cover the cost not to line their pockets.Hey yoohoo. THAT is the problem. Just think for a second about this. .....What is stopping the hospitals and doctors from RAISING their prices? They know they are now gonna get paid, right? What is stopping them? Nothing is!Well now Mr. Insurance Comp will just raise your premiums to cover this increase because, guess what? Ya' gotta have it by law. Let's say your premium was $1,000. well 80% has to be spent on care which leaves $200 for the insurance comp profit. Now your rate increase to $2,000 to cover the increased hospitals fees, 80% still has to go to care, but now the insurance comp profits are $400!Think!Prices don't just arbitrarily rise, as fewer people rely on expensive emergency services the cost should go down. Hospitals will still have to compete for coverage from various insurance companies since this bill keeps health coverage in private hands. That's part of what the exchanges that go into effect in 2014 will help avoid.do you really honestly think there is any business (for-profit or not-for-profit) in America that wouldn't arbitrarily raise prices in a given year without regard to how much if at all cost had risen during that period if they could?listen, I contract commercial rates for hospital groups for a living.all providers do arbitrarily raise all prices every year, and I have never seen any regard paid to how much more expensive a service has become in the preceding year. we don't even bother to look up cost increase information even though we know it because we report it to medicare,; we just increase prices as much as we possibly can (and the amount we can raise prices is usually just a function of market share we have with an individual commercial payer in the locality in question).costs will nev ...
dandude23: This sucks for poor people,now you get to choose between insurance and food,now everyone in this country is born into the system by default ,GG.
Voiceofreason01: no he didn't/he explicitly mentions that those types of taxes would be unconstitutional
cman: And I bet ya Kos is having the biggest orgasm
I believe the Daily KOS staff were watching it live and it looked something like this;
xltech: Medicaid in our state is going to require us to prior authorize every procedure....With reimbursements going down, costs going up and no big hospital sponsoring us... we will be closing
Smiths: SharkTrager: I never did get my answer regarding the status of fungal infused multi-handled gerdunzas of a familial nature.btw.. this was an awesome title defense.
andrewskdr: ontariolightning: raise taxes on everything, cut way back on military expenditures and spend the money on universal healthcare for all Americansproblem solvedLet me guess, you're one of the people who gift extra money to the treasury each year for fun? No, you don't do that? Shocker..
Kibbler: Imagine tomorrow night's Right Wing Supreme Court Justice Poker Night.*flushing sound**gurgling**gasping*Scalia: Give him another.Alito: I dunno, he's starting to turn blue, I...Scalia: ANOTHER! I SAID ANOTHER!*flushing sound*Scalia: OK hold on for a minute, let me drop a deuce before the next one.
Rindred: Since there's no way I'll ever reach the end of this thread from my mobile device, I'd like to say a couple of things before I give up and actually do some work here at the office...[...]In conclusion, I just want to say thank-you in clearest terms. So, thank you. More decisions like this, please.
HeartBurnKid: The government has an explicit power to levy taxes. This is a tax. End of story.
The Reverend Smith: So much for that promise to not raise taxes on the middle class.
Big Man On Campus: Voiceofreason01: no he didn't/he explicitly mentions that those types of taxes would be unconstitutionalI'm reading up, but I don't see what you're talking about. Do you at least have a page/paragraph number to back up your claim? On reading this, it does indeed sound like he's saying Congress has the power to enact taxes for anything it wants.
NateGrey: Real conservatives need to stop listening to psychobabble from PhonyCon pubs like Weakly StandardAmerica was pretty much neutered today, led by a Chief Justice who was appointed by a FraudCon Bush II and pushed by a FraudCon GOP senate.No more whiny psychobable...time to pee or get off the pot. There needs to be some serious action from Real Conservatives to start fixing this nation
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