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(US Supreme Court) NewsFlash Supreme Court rules that Obamacare is constitutional. The bland mask that is Mitt Romney's face twitches with something called "emotion"   (supremecourt.gov) divider line 3382
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14917 clicks; posted to Politics » on 28 Jun 2012 at 10:27 AM (2 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»


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2012-06-28 12:14:38 PM  

JAYoung: Get 'em while they're hot, TEA party:
IMPEACH ROBERTS bumper stickers, only $29.95.


I will laugh, and laugh, and laugh, if House Republicans impeach a Chief Justice appointed by a Republican president. Triple bonus if they do it while there's a Democrat in office.

On a side note, who presides in the Senate if the Chief Justice is impeached?
 
2012-06-28 12:14:41 PM  

Pincy: SandMann: So, any doctors thinking about moving their practices to another country? If so, which one? Early retirement? Career change?

Why would doctors be upset by this? It gives them access to more patients because more people will be able to go to the doctor now.


My wife is a dentist and pretty happy about this because pediatric dental is considered an essential benefit. That means all kids just became regular customers. Even if they government is only paying at cost, it's a benefit for her in terms of keeping the office busy. Also much better than the kids only coming in when the have a serious issue or as part of a charity thing.

/it's tough to get the lower income kids since their parents are resistant to the idea of taking charity to support the kids
//now though she'll tell the parents they're paying for it, so they might as well make use of it and that will get them through the door.
 
2012-06-28 12:14:46 PM  
Everyone needs it, everyone uses it eventually, everyone should pay for it.

/Single-payer is still smarter, but so is the metric system
 
2012-06-28 12:14:57 PM  

The My Little Pony Killer: Don't dodge the question. You said I have healthcare now. Through whom?


I guess you've never heard of Medicaid? Or are you not actually poor, just "poor"
 
2012-06-28 12:15:03 PM  
The healthcare thing doesn't even matter

What does matter, is now the US Government can force you to engage in commerce against your will with a 3rd party (with no limits), and cant take everything you own away from you, and throw you in jail forever, if you don't do it. There's also no legal recourse to contest it.

The US is now a Totalitarian State.
 
2012-06-28 12:15:07 PM  

ialdabaoth: El Hodor: ialdabaoth: Ok, look. This is simple.

If someone can't afford to stay competitive, why do they deserve to compete?

If someone can't afford to keep working, why do they deserve to work?

If someone can't afford to stay healthy, why do they deserve health?

If someone can't afford to stay alive, why do they deserve to live?

You get what you pay for. If you can't afford to pay, well... I suppose it's polite to pretend that it was nice knowing you, but you aren't much use anymore, are you?

And if you disagree with all of the above statements, great! Politics takes money. If someone can't afford a lobbyist or a campaign, why do they deserve to have an opinion?

Brilliant! 10/10! This, gentlemen, is how you troll!

Actually, I really *would* like an answer.


Stop lying.
 
2012-06-28 12:15:09 PM  

Mathematics of Wonton Burrito Meals: cameroncrazy1984: Some nutball congressman called it the largest tax increase on the poor and middle class in American history. Notwithstanding the fact that the poor already get healthcare and likely will not be taxed.

Wait, the poor already get healthcare? Then why did we need to pass Obamacare?


Because people get it irresponsibly by going to the ER and saying their name's Mister John Madeupname. Those charges get passed on to you, and (of course) there's all the paper shuffling that results in having millions of people do this. Which eventually helps this happen.

www.economicpopulist.org
 
2012-06-28 12:15:11 PM  
Am I a bad person because, in my opinion, the best part about this is the fact that I can use it to stir up the Right Wing nutjobs in the cubes near me? Today is going to be fun.
 
2012-06-28 12:15:14 PM  

The_Sponge: Gwendolyn: I never saw the difference between the federal government saying I must have health care and Maryland requiring me to have car insurance. I'm sure it is in some way but we get told we have to do things all the time.


Here's the difference:

You don't have to drive a car.


I do if i want to have a job
 
2012-06-28 12:15:19 PM  

fisker: IS THIS the equivalent of having to pay for car insurance simply because a majority of people own cars even if I don't have one?

Am I wrong in my understanding of what this Patient Protection Act is all about?


Let's go about setting up a system that bans people without insurance from going to the hospital.

That would also require repeal of federal law concerning that issue. But, let's get started.
 
2012-06-28 12:15:43 PM  
I'm curious to see how Obama deals with this now. Ruling this as a tax that intrudes into the lives of Americans this much is going to be a hard pill to swallow. He's also no longer going to be able to say tax cuts for the poor.
 
2012-06-28 12:15:47 PM  
www.macmeisters.com
 
2012-06-28 12:15:47 PM  

jlm0516: LordJiro: mediaho: AmazinTim: NowhereMon: Suck it cons, suck it long and hard

You must mean suck it everyone, now we'll never fix health care. We'll just keep patching scabby band-aids onto the issue, just like this bill.

At least someone bothered with the band-aid when the wound has been festering open for nearly a century.

This. A baby step forward is still a step forward. And as conservative Boomers die off, we might actually get to make more of those steps, until America catches up with the rest of the civilized world.

From what i'm reading, the rest of the civilized world isn't doing to hot right not.


Well perhaps this time they will learn not to buy the snake oil that Wall Street is selling. I doubt it though.
 
2012-06-28 12:15:51 PM  

Thunderpipes: Weird, Obama stated over and over this is not a tax. Now he argues it is.

At least they shot down the forced Medicaid expansion. That will throw a big wrench into his plans. 26 states can tell Obama and the Feds to suck it now, and they will.

Still scary. Means Congress can regulate your behavior via taxes. Vote Republican? Obama can impose a tax on you. Buy an American car? Obama can impose a tax on you. Christian? Obama can impose a tax on you.

Now liberals, if we get a Republican advantage, how about we implement a tax on the unemployed? No job? Fine, pay a tax. I know you think you just won, but you just screwed everyone equally with another erosion of individual rights.


Own a house? Pay a tax. Own a car? Pay a tax. Use a phone? Pay a tax. Buy something at a store? Pay a tax.
 
2012-06-28 12:16:00 PM  
Limbaugh: we're forced to pay a tax, insurance is now a tax, we're forced, we're forced. forcing is bad, bad, wrong, bad, wrong. tax tax tax. corporations taxing us...backing off that point, stealth tax. behavior modification, tax tax tax. government dictating what we do with private property, tax tax tax.
 
2012-06-28 12:16:01 PM  

Shrugging Atlas: I just can't help but think the "Fartbongo Raised Taxes" herpa derp spin we're hearing now isn't going to fly, or we'd been hearing it daily from Republicans since the moment Obama signed the bill into law.

I guess when it's all you got you still have to run with it, but I don't see that getting very far.


It won't fly, because most people already have insurance, and raising taxes on other people is always, always fine.

Hell, even Oregon raised taxes on the rich in 2009(or was it 2010?), by public vote even!
 
2012-06-28 12:16:06 PM  

Weaver95: muck4doo: Weaver95: mr lawson: LOL...... Premiums are going to go Through the roof!

/be careful what you wish for, ya might just get it

you mean that premiums weren't going to go up all on their own anyway?

As a fellow libertarian, I'm sure you must be cuming your shorts over news of more taxes. Isn't this an awesome day?

it's not like I could have done anything to stop it...and ACA is a valid step towards fixing what we laughingly call our health care system. is it perfect? nope. is it needed? yup.


You sound very Democraticy. When are going to admit you're a Democrat? There's nothing wrong with that. Yes, I'm libertarian/Conservative, but I see the important role Democrats serve. You had a change of heart, and are now a Democrat. There's nothing wrong with that, so just admit it. I used to be a democrat then changed to Conservative after I spent a few years in upstate NY. I'm just hoping you drop the "I'm a Libertarian" mantra, because you aren't a Libertarian at all.
 
2012-06-28 12:16:08 PM  

Tenga: Tune in to Rush Limbaugh today at noon.


Not even at gunpoint.
 
2012-06-28 12:16:08 PM  

Olympus Mons: Lets not forget that with more of us on, the cost should drop


ROFLMAO....no...your rates will INCREASE!
 
2012-06-28 12:16:10 PM  

Weaver95: Limbaugh: we all knew, taxes, taxes, forced to purchase, taxes. gloom/doom. Obama Obama, lies. Obamacare massive regressive tax on all americans, taxes taxes. lie. we were lied to, lies are bad. commerce clause, taxes, taxes.


That's the one that gets me. Aren't Republicans trying to abolish the income tax and force us to use sales taxes that are, by their very nature, regressive taxes?
 
2012-06-28 12:16:10 PM  

Grables'Daughter: lousyskater: I didn't really care which way this went, but man I need to get some popcorn for this one. DIS GONNA BE GOOD.

[i1089.photobucket.com image 640x423]

Here.

I made enough for everyone.

: )



Hot damn.
 
2012-06-28 12:16:13 PM  

cameroncrazy1984: The My Little Pony Killer: Don't dodge the question. You said I have healthcare now. Through whom?

I guess you've never heard of Medicaid? Or are you not actually poor, just "poor"


Oh honey, the fact that you think I qualify for that is just laughable. So you're just living up to the "crazy" portion of your moniker today.

Carry on with your crazy self.
 
2012-06-28 12:16:18 PM  
Republicans, when life gives you lemons...

make s3-ec.buzzfed.com!
 
2012-06-28 12:16:19 PM  

starsrift: As a Canadian, I'm very happy with this result. Tech companies were already preferring to start up in Canada because the health care is taxpayer-funded.

Nothing has changed. In fact, more companies may prefer to outsource studios to Que? Nada because of the pressure to enroll employees in company healthcare in USA and the embarrassment if that's not an option.


That's just something to think about. That said, this is baby steps, and for the good of everyone, I really do hope this is one step towards a single payer system. You guys are baby stepping to letting teh gays get married, baby stepping to this too. It's a good thing.


I've been arguing for years that single-payer is one of the best things the US could do to help small businesses.
 
2012-06-28 12:16:25 PM  

Vodka Zombie: Holy crap. Free Republic is starting to look like freakin' Alderan.

So many voices crying out... So... much... pain!


Ok, that was voted Smart and Funny
 
2012-06-28 12:16:38 PM  

Actor_au: I'm an Australian, my dad fell off his bicycle a few months ago and was in hospital for two months, ICU for a week and a brain injury recovery ward for six weeks.... The final bill for his time there would have been in the tens of thousands if we were in the US.


The final bill in the US would probably have been close to a half million dollars. And about 20% percent of that, or nearly a hundred thousand dollars, would have been spent on bookkeeping and paperwork to keep track of the bills.
 
2012-06-28 12:16:49 PM  

groininjury: The healthcare thing doesn't even matter

What does matter, is now the US Government can force you to engage in commerce against your will with a 3rd party (with no limits), and cant take everything you own away from you, and throw you in jail forever, if you don't do it. There's also no legal recourse to contest it.

The US is now a Totalitarian State.


/darthvadervoiceon

The derp is strong with this one.

/darthvadervoiceoff
 
2012-06-28 12:16:53 PM  

Serious Black: The individual market. You can also look at the experience of voluntary high-risk pools to see the same effect there; the PCIP's per-capita costs are about double what government actuaries expected.


jso2897: The one that has us paying a lot more to insure 65% of our population than the citizens of 35 nations with higher rated healthcare pay to insure their entire populations. That "free market".


Those weren't free markets, and they weren't free long before Obamacare. They were highly regulated, as to both the insurers and the providers.
 
2012-06-28 12:16:58 PM  

d3sertion: inner ted: d3sertion: inner ted:
there is so much fail there, all in just two sentences.

/hint for you sherlock: most middle class will refuse it cause the CAN'T AFFORD IT.
//the stupid, it hurts. too bad i can't afford insurance to get it looked at.

What the hell are you talking about? Most middle class people don't have health insurance now? You need to check your facts, clown.

even fewer will have it now when their employer drops their current coverage and they can't afford to buy it on their own.

that's what the hell i'm talking about, clown.

I was pointing out that most middle class americans do have health insurance, idiot. The most liberal estimates put the number at 40-50 million people who are uninsured, that is not "most" by any measure. And furthermore, have you not noticed health care insurance stocks going through the roof in the market right now? You're about the only one on the planet who thinks people are going to lose coverage because of this law. Certainly people with money and investment acumen disagree, probably a large number of conservatives I'd imagine.

You need to read the bill and get briefed on the current situation in a bad way. Just because Obama did it doesn't mean it's bad for business.


read your own stupid pal. you contradict yourself in the next sentence you write. you make my point for me, so thanks for that.

and you point out with such genius that the stocks of insurance companies are going up... geeeeez can't imagine why that may be. could it possibly be that the government just mandated everyone buy their product???

this isn't just bad for business, it's bad for everyone. he had the opportunity to push a true national health care / single payer system, but showed he's only interested in bowing to the special interests of insurance companies.

and anybody stupid enough to believe "oh now we care for teh pooorz" is as thick headed as you appear.
protip: the poor could always get health care, the hospital CANNOT refuse them. and since they have nothing of worth (like a house or income) then all the rest of us that do pay our way, get to pay for them too.

/but keep farking that Obama chicken - cause we get it HE'S BLACK
 
2012-06-28 12:17:03 PM  

Actor_au: I'm an Australian, my dad fell off his bicycle a few months ago and was in hospital for two months, ICU for a week and a brain injury recovery ward for six weeks. He had about four surgeries on his brain over that time, multiple scans and several operations on his broken bones as well as a dedicated nurse on hand while we was in ICU.
Total cost to my family? $400 in parking costs at the hospital carpark(my mum drove herself to the hospital daily, I took a bus) and probably $80 in total from the Subway they had downstairs.

My dad is home now, has a scan once a month so far and is going well. The scans are free.
The airfares of family members coming to check up on him was more expensive than the cost of actually being in hospital to us. The final bill for his time there would have been in the tens of thousands if we were in the US.

Socialised medicine farking rocks.


Farking Commie.

/just kidding
//great story
//made even greater that dad is alright
 
2012-06-28 12:17:08 PM  

fisker: Let me get this straight.

It's understandable that if I am driving my car without insurance I may be pulled over and penalized for it because I am using my car and reaping privileges that I am essentially not fully covered for by law. It makes sense.

My question is this- If I am NOT getting regular medical care, hence never going to the doctor at all for anything, am I going to be essentially 'pulled over and penalized' for something I am not even doing?

I can see that if I WAS going to the doctor and receiving treatment but not paying for the overall insurance or just the basic cost of medicine, THEN I would be penalized for it, but a lot of people have never been to the doctor. Some people NEVER go. They just die. It happens.

IS THIS the equivalent of having to pay for car insurance simply because a majority of people own cars even if I don't have one?

Am I wrong in my understanding of what this Patient Protection Act is all about?




There is an excise on being uninsured.
 
2012-06-28 12:17:10 PM  

Olympus Mons: I fear tough that they will just go on a say NO to everything orgy from this point on.


Hasn't it been this way for 3 years now?
 
2012-06-28 12:17:15 PM  
The Romney campaign has vastly overestimated the number of Americans who consider having health care insurance to be an attack on their freedom. They're about to find this out.
 
2012-06-28 12:17:52 PM  

groininjury: The healthcare thing doesn't even matter

What does matter, is now the US Government can force you to engage in commerce against your will with a 3rd party (with no limits), and cant take everything you own away from you, and throw you in jail forever, if you don't do it. There's also no legal recourse to contest it.

The US is now a Totalitarian State.


If they can't take everything you own away from you, and throw you in jail forever, if you don't do it, where is the problem?
 
2012-06-28 12:17:57 PM  

ignatius_crumbcake: Tomorrow's headline: "Mitt Romney says Obamacare was his idea from the beginning."


I am not sure if you are trolling or not since Romney did implement a similar healthcare plan when he was governor.
 
2012-06-28 12:18:04 PM  
And all Obama has to do is read through the bullet points of the PPACA.

Good luck screaming about tax increases.
 
2012-06-28 12:18:11 PM  

rigmort: My wife...


Right here's where I knew you were full of shiat.
 
2012-06-28 12:18:17 PM  

MasterThief: From SCOTUSBlog: "The rejection of the Commerce Clause and Nec. and Proper Clause [arguments in favor of the ACA] should be understood as a major blow to Congress's authority to pass social welfare laws. Using the tax code -- especially in the current political environment -- to promote social welfare is going to be a very chancy proposition."


Big problem for conservatives on this point: since the mandate was upheld as an exercise of the tax power, that means any language to the effect that it was unconstitutional under the commerce power is non-binding dicta.

Granted, that doesn't mean this Court will permit much in the way of new legislation under the commerce power. But it does mean there's no stare decisis argument to uphold that part of Roberts' opinion in future courts. I.e., the claim that PPACA was unconstitutional as an exercise of the commerce power is no Roe v. Wade.
 
2012-06-28 12:18:22 PM  

The My Little Pony Killer: cameroncrazy1984: The My Little Pony Killer: Don't dodge the question. You said I have healthcare now. Through whom?

I guess you've never heard of Medicaid? Or are you not actually poor, just "poor"

Oh honey, the fact that you think I qualify for that is just laughable. So you're just living up to the "crazy" portion of your moniker today.

Carry on with your crazy self.


Oh, gotcha, so you're not actually poor.
 
2012-06-28 12:18:24 PM  

groininjury: The healthcare thing doesn't even matter

What does matter, is now the US Government can force you to engage in commerce against your will with a 3rd party (with no limits), and cant take everything you own away from you, and throw you in jail forever, if you don't do it. There's also no legal recourse to contest it.

The US is now a Totalitarian State.


There is no jail time associated with this. I think it's explicitly not allowed. They'll adjust your refund instead.
 
2012-06-28 12:18:25 PM  

Pincy: SandMann: So, any doctors thinking about moving their practices to another country? If so, which one? Early retirement? Career change?

Why would doctors be upset by this? It gives them access to more patients because more people will be able to go to the doctor now.


Loss of practice autonomy. Policy manipulations forcing doctors to join accountable care organizations. Mandated practice
investment in electronic record systems with changing rules and frequent expenses to maintain compliance. penalties on medical device innovation.
 
2012-06-28 12:18:27 PM  

someonelse: The Romney campaign has vastly overestimated the number of Americans who consider having health care insurance to be an attack on their freedom. They're about to find this out.


Wasn't Romneycare one the more popular pieces of Romney's legacy in Mass? Now they're basically attacking it on a national scale. All that seems to do is make the red states more red, and the swings go "Oh fark no".
 
2012-06-28 12:18:28 PM  

groininjury: What does matter, is now the US Government can force you to engage in commerce against your will with a 3rd party (with no limits)


No, they can't. Did you skip the part where you can go without health insurance if you are fine with paying a bit more in taxes, much like you pay more in taxes if you don't have a mortgage?
 
2012-06-28 12:18:30 PM  

fisker: Let me get this straight.

It's understandable that if I am driving my car without insurance I may be pulled over and penalized for it because I am using my car and reaping privileges that I am essentially not fully covered for by law. It makes sense.

My question is this- If I am NOT getting regular medical care, hence never going to the doctor at all for anything, am I going to be essentially 'pulled over and penalized' for something I am not even doing?

I can see that if I WAS going to the doctor and receiving treatment but not paying for the overall insurance or just the basic cost of medicine, THEN I would be penalized for it, but a lot of people have never been to the doctor. Some people NEVER go. They just die. It happens.

IS THIS the equivalent of having to pay for car insurance simply because a majority of people own cars even if I don't have one?

Am I wrong in my understanding of what this Patient Protection Act is all about?


An important difference is that if you don't own a car, there's a 0% chance your car will cause an issue. Your body, however, WILL get sick or injured at some point. So while it's otherwise very similar - everyone who might benefit has to have it, because, frankly, its better than the results if you don't. Over the run of a human life, it's more efficient to have them have the insurance now than to publicly foot the bill for issues later.

Everyone will need medical care. Even those people who you say never went, then died. They probably needed to go, but just didn't.
 
2012-06-28 12:18:38 PM  

fisker: IS THIS the equivalent of having to pay for car insurance simply because a majority of people own cars even if I don't have one?


No. You still have a car. You're just not wrecking it.

Lot's of people pay car insurance without ever making a claim.
 
2012-06-28 12:18:46 PM  

unlikely: This is a surprise. I honestly expected the 6-3 conservative court to rule more in favor of "fark the poors because they smell"


what do you think this ruling is then when you really apply in IRL scenerios? it is exactly that... fark the poor and 'tax' them more for not having health insurance.
 
2012-06-28 12:18:52 PM  
You know who wins with this decision?

Illegal aliens who don't pay taxes.
 
2012-06-28 12:18:58 PM  
Where to I go to sign up to be on a death panel? I really want to start killing people immediately. Especially old ones who love America and work hard for a living.
 
2012-06-28 12:19:20 PM  
Limbaugh: repeal Obamacare, government seizing private property, tax tax, libruls don't understand, we've been betrayed, deception, taxes taxes taxes. tax increases bad, congress lied, SCOTUS lied. deficit hell, constitution under assault, everyone under assault,

...and break for a test of the emergency broadcast system at three mile island.....thanks Pennsylvania!
 
2012-06-28 12:19:21 PM  

Anti_illuminati: Still spewing horsesh:t, huh? How about addressing some issues others have pointed out with your ridiculous logic first?



Really? It's horseshiat to point out that Obama promised not to raise your taxes if you made under $250K per year?
 
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