CapnBlues: so this is actually good for romney, isn't it? It puts fuel back on the fire of that debate, which gained a lot of traction for the GOP in 2010.
WombatControl: Here's a clue: health insurance is not health care. All "universal" or "single-payer" systems work by rationing care. You want treatment for your rare cancer? Some government bureaucrat will determine that the treatment isn't cost effective, and you will either die waiting for it, or you'll never be given the chance. Not only do you end up dead in that scenario, but new and innovative treatments never get developed because said bureaucrat won't pay for them. Oh, but you have "free" health insurance - just not free health care.
randomjsa: So all the people who thought that it being struck down would be the best thing ever for Obama are now going "holy crap now we're in trouble"?
Thunderpipes: Weird, Obama stated over and over this is not a tax. Now he argues it is.At least they shot down the forced Medicaid expansion. That will throw a big wrench into his plans. 26 states can tell Obama and the Feds to suck it now, and they will.Still scary. Means Congress can regulate your behavior via taxes. Vote Republican? Obama can impose a tax on you. Buy an American car? Obama can impose a tax on you. Christian? Obama can impose a tax on you.Now liberals, if we get a Republican advantage, how about we implement a tax on the unemployed? No job? Fine, pay a tax. I know you think you just won, but you just screwed everyone equally with another erosion of individual rights.
Phinn: The government can't force me to buy insurance, but they will try to tax me if I don't.Eh.For one, the Left has tried to get away from its Tax-and-Spend label ever since Clinton, but now it will have to own it. That's sorta nice.But more importantly, the federal government is so inept at collecting taxes from people like me, I will NEVER have to actually pay it.Really, anyone with two brain cells to rub together can avoid all federal taxes. It's really not that hard.
MediaAreAllHacks: I'm still always shocked by how ridiculously stupid and uninformed most Americans are about their own health care.A question: Would you tell the hospital to turn away someone dying because they couldn't pay?If you answered yes, you're a sociopath. Seek help.If you answered no, you believe in socialized medicine. Now we're just talking degrees of it. The American government spends more on health care than any other country in the world (per capita). Then of course you all have to pay for health insurance too. So fully socialized medicine would allow lowering taxes.
Kuroshin: WombatControl: 3.) Obama is now responsible for a major middle-class tax increase. After saying that he wouldn't raise taxes. Repeatedly. This will be in every Romney attack ad through this election season. It should be in them now.From now on, it's not "ObamaCare." It's the "Obama Health Care Tax". Let's have the President own his massive tax hike right through to November.My taxes have not been affected. There has been no tax increase.There has been a new, punitive tax created, but no tax increases for anybody.
Thunderpipes: TwistedFark: bdub77: WombatControl: Legally, this was a piss-poor decision. Yes, the Commerce Clause end of things was upheld, but the SCOTUS basically saved Congress by doing something that Congress never intended to do. That's judicial activism. If Congress had intended the mandate to be a tax, they could have done so directly. SCOTUS inferred that's what they did, which is not the proper role of a judge.Politically, anyone who wants to argue this is good for Obama is kidding themselves. This is the worst outcome for Obama. (The best being the bill being upheld under the Commerce Clause, the second best being the bill being totally struck down.) Why is this the worst outcome?1.) This just energized the living fark out of the GOP base. It was ObamaCare that motivated the Tea Party in 2010. Now it's going to do the same in 2012.2.) It just took away their "RomneyCare" attacks. (Yes, the whole "RomneyCare" bit was incoherent to begin with, but it's less coherent now.)3.) Obama is now responsible for a major middle-class tax increase. After saying that he wouldn't raise taxes. Repeatedly. This will be in every Romney attack ad through this election season. It should be in them now.From now on, it's not "ObamaCare." It's the "Obama Health Care Tax". Let's have the President own his massive tax hike right through to November.Doesn't matter. Americans got health care. This is a win for the American people, not just Obama. Obama will now go down as the first president who got Americans health care. His legacy in that regard, not to mention countless other things he's done as president, will solidify him as one of the greats.And yes I expect him to fully whip Romney's ass in November.I'm not much of a political fan boy, but I have to agree in regards to Obama's legacy. He's managed to accomplish quite a bit in this term - and a fair bit more than I can recall any of the last 4 President's doing.He sure has. No President in history has run up the deficit l ...
Jon Snow: YoungSwedishBlonde: Holy farking shiat, Roberts upholds Obamacare? My mind is full of billions and billions and billions upon billions of f*ck.It was originally a conservative alternative to more liberal policies.[i.imgur.com image 477x158]The fact that people are in disbelief just shows how absurdly partisan the Roberts court has been acting of late.
Adolf Oliver Nipples: Three things:1) Can we finally put to rest the notion that the Supreme Court was rigged for Republican initiatives? It's tiresome, and in reality the butthurt that usually comes from SCOTUS decisions is because it's your particular ox that's being gored, not because they're ideologically fixed and conspiring to fark Democratic initiatives.2) The Congress could have saved themselves a lot of trouble by simply calling it what it is, a tax. It was always a tax, and calling it something else was always a big charade. We need to get over this tax-averse attitude we have in this country if we wish to maintain any semblance of the standard of living we currently have. We can't continue to live off of other peoples' largesse for much longer.3) Congratulations to Barack Obama on his reelection. This essentially sealed the deal, the rest is just pro forma screaming.
Waldo Pepper: so what if you are healthy and simply pay for whatever doctor visits you need at the time you are penalized by the government for not buy a product/service?
CommieTaoist: Cons: But all those uninsured are driving up healthcare costs and straining our hospitals!Libs: Fine, everyone must have insurance.Cons: BUT THAT'S NOT FAIR!Libs: What are you talking about? Insurance is primarily bought from private corporations, you guys should have wrote this stuff.Cons: La-la-la, we can't hear you, la-la-la.Libs: Come on, grow up.Cons: Wait, we know, this is a new tax!!!Libs: It's not a tax on the rich, you should be happy. Plus there is no "tax" or fine if you have health insurance, something that is good for everyone.Cons: Durr, socialism! Impeach Roberts!
LordJiro: retarded: Good Lord, the freepers are having aneurysms:"John Robert's poison legacy: Mexican takeover of America, and Socialist dictatorship. IMPEACH this traitorous bastard."Oh lord, I would love love LOVE to see the Republicans impeach Roberts. Talk about not thinking their cunning plan all the way through.
optimistic_cynic: How is this different from the insurance provider making those same decisions?
Kuroshin: MasterThief: Silver lining based on SCOTUSBlog: The mandate was not a legit use of the commerce clause, but it was OK as a tax.So yes, Obama and the Democrats did, in fact, raise taxes on the middle class. After repeatedly promising not to.Not mine. I have health insurance.So yeah, not really./a really weird way of doing things - punitive taxation...
MurphyMurphy: Benjimin_Dover: His campaign promise that he would not raise taxes on anybody earning over (what was it?) $250,000 has now just been verified by SCOTUS as a lie. He just raised taxes on the poorest of the poor. I wonder if Roberts intentionally gave the Repubes a campaign issue to hammer on Obama with.awww did the politician do something seemingly deceptive to advance his agenda?That stinks. And the agenda was helping ppl to boot! I mean, lying to start wars that kill hundreds of thousands of people, sure, we all understand that. But lying to make people more healthY? DISGUSTING.Lying stinking fartbama.Now go vote for Rmoney who will not lie to you.
Craptastic: praymantis: It's a tax, it's a tax, it's a tax tax tax.It's a tax, it's a tax, it's a tax tax tax.It's a tax, it's a tax, it's a tax tax tax.It's a taaaaaaaaax! It's a tax tax tax!What? I thought we were doing the William Tell Overture.../suck it cons
fruitloop: [i171.photobucket.com image 320x170]And in enough time for these two to close out the week.
Thunderpipes: No. By accepting the cash now, states make themselves responsible for more of the costs later on. Smart states will absolutely refuse this. It does not benefit them at all to participate. It will further hurt state budgets to expand. Christ, how dumb are liberals, really?
TIKIMAN87: Obama has just destroyed this country.
JerseyTim: Oh my god, you guys. Two federal agents just knocked on my door and handed me a letter telling me I have to appear before a death panel next Tuesday. PRAY FOR ME!!!
ialdabaoth: Ok, look. This is simple.If someone can't afford to stay competitive, why do they deserve to compete?If someone can't afford to keep working, why do they deserve to work?If someone can't afford to stay healthy, why do they deserve health?If someone can't afford to stay alive, why do they deserve to live?You get what you pay for. If you can't afford to pay, well... I suppose it's polite to pretend that it was nice knowing you, but you aren't much use anymore, are you?And if you disagree with all of the above statements, great! Politics takes money. If someone can't afford a lobbyist or a campaign, why do they deserve to have an opinion?
optimistic_cynic: WombatControl:Here's a clue: health insurance is not health care. All "universal" or "single-payer" systems work by rationing care. You want treatment for your rare cancer? Some government bureaucrat will determine that the treatment isn't cost effective, and you will either die waiting for it, or you'll never be given the chance. Not only do you end up dead in that scenario, but new and innovative treatments never get developed because said bureaucrat won't pay for them. Oh, but you have "free" health insurance - just not free health care.How is this different from the insurance provider making those same decisions?
make me some tea: RichieLaw: What is this I don't even/But seriously. I am so effing shocked right now. That this conservative court would uphold this, and that ROBERTS would be the swing vote.....just no words....Yeah, I'm rather floored too. I really expected them to shiatcan the thing.As I said in the other thread, though...This is not a victory for liberals. This is a victory for Obama, the health insurance industry and their lobbyists.
schattenteufel: Teabaggers in a nushell:-Republican raise taxes to pay for foreign wars? No Problem! Lets give our boys the best toys to pertect our freedums!-Democrats raise taxes to pay for healthcare of American citizens? THIS IS AN OUTRAGE!(me? I'm against both parties. I just hate Teabaggers.)
vegasj: Theres a shocker.Healthcare stocks are up... market is crashing.WTG Obammy... nice one to fark up this country
LeroyBourne: Holy shiat, on mpr they're talking about civil war over this.
Jensaarai: Well, there ya go. We now have Democrats firmly cheering for a Republican healthcare bill, and Republicans can continue feeling persecuted.
Thunderpipes: When your employer's group coverage goes up in price, and it will, you will be taxed, directly or indirectly, Moran.
NateGrey: Republicans keep saying this is a huge tax increase.I have Employer paid health insurance.How much is the tax I will have to pay Contards?/Listening to Glenn Beck currently
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