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(BBC)   Three ultra-Orthodox Jewish men have been arrested in Israel, suspected of defacing the national Holocaust memorial with anti-Zionist graffiti. Wait what   (bbc.co.uk) divider line 228
    More: Ironic, Orthodox Jews, Zionists, Holocaust, Holocaust Memorial Museum, Yad Vashem  
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6775 clicks; posted to Main » on 26 Jun 2012 at 11:37 AM (2 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2012-06-28 12:23:58 PM

liam76: Amos Quito: So why weren't the Jews "allowed in" to ANY other country on the planet?

Did every other country on the planet HATE JEWS SO MUCH that they wouldn't let them in? Could that be the case? if so, why? Why the hatred?

Any country in the planet? Who said that?



You implied it. From above:

liam76: The link I posted in response to him showed how difficult it was for jews to get to other countries. The only way you can pin that n the zionists is if you think they control all the countries jews weren't allowed in.

And as you specifically mentioned Cuba AND the US, I have no doubt that you're thinking of the St. Louis - one ship carrying 900 Jews that were denied entry to Cuba (why?), and subsequently by the US. But these Jews were allowed to enter other European countries.

And what of the US and its immigration quotas? Were they designed to be "ant-Semitic" as so many have charged? No, they were designed to maintain existing ethnic population proportions. Jews were NOT singled out for discrimination.

Have a Kleenex.

liam76: Amos Quito: Or could it be that Hitler and the Nazis somehow magically controlled the immigration policies of every other nation on the planet?

If, as you insist, the Zionists' only interest was saving the Jews - regardless of where they went - those are the only two options, no?

So which is it?

No idea what you are talking about here.



You made the absurd assertion that that Jews had no where to go other than Palestine. Untrue.

I claimed that the Zionists wanted to steer as many emigrating Jews as possible to Palestine, because they needed a population base for their Jewish State. True.

You ridiculously implied that the ONLY way Zionists could influence Jewish emigration was by controlling the immigration policies of all foreign countries - I threw it back in your face.

Turnabout.


liam76: Amos Quito: The only way that you and your IDF pals can answer that is by accusing anyone who asks of being an anti-Semite.

Anyone who asks, no. Somone who has a history of supporting Nazi propaganda, yes.



Please define "Nazi propaganda" and name the specifi piece(s) "propaganda" that you continually allege that I "support".

Thanks.
 
2012-06-28 12:52:38 PM

Amos Quito: You implied it. From above:

liam76: The link I posted in response to him showed how difficult it was for jews to get to other countries. The only way you can pin that n the zionists is if you think they control all the countries jews weren't allowed in.


Is that every country in the planet?

Amos Quito: And as you specifically mentioned Cuba AND the US, I have no doubt that you're thinking of the St. Louis - one ship carrying 900 Jews that were denied entry to Cuba (why?), and subsequently by the US. But these Jews were allowed to enter other European countries.

And what of the US and its immigration quotas? Were they designed to be "ant-Semitic" as so many have charged? No, they were designed to maintain existing ethnic population proportions. Jews were NOT singled out for discrimination.


They were eventually allowed to enter european countries because it became a huge news story.

I didn't say they were "singled out" I said they weren't welcome, as were many other groups. You were the one who took that to mean that every country in the world "HATED JEWS SO MUCH".

Amos Quito: You made the absurd assertion that that Jews had no where to go other than Palestine. Untrue.


No I was pointing out there were no countriess allowing in large number of jews, and they weren't really welcomed anywhere.


Amos Quito: You ridiculously implied that the ONLY way Zionists could influence Jewish emigration was by controlling the immigration policies of all foreign countries - I threw it back in your face.


I didn't say the "only way". You are thw one who repeatedly implies Zionists were behind every action that led to Israel being formed, unless you think they controlled foreign nationsimmigration policy that is BS.



Amos Quito: Please define "Nazi propaganda" and name the specifi piece(s) "propaganda" that you continually allege that I "support".


Well you support the whole claim that jews declared watr on Germany. There are a number of thread where you post the headline declaring something along those lines. And yes posting a misleading headline with no context that backs up Nazi propaganda is supporting Nazi propaganda.

In this thread you have said Israel wouldn't have been possible without the holocaust. You also said that jews in general and Zionists in particular have been behind the events that made Israel possible. IIRC you seem to be of the mind that jews in general and Zionists in particular have been behind the events that made Israel possible.
Of course. Who doubts this?
That means you think the jews in general and zionists in particular were behind the holocaust. I would say blaming jews and zionists for the holocaust falls in with Nazi propaganda, wouldn't you?
 
2012-06-28 01:12:05 PM

liam76: Amos Quito: You implied it. From above:

liam76: The link I posted in response to him showed how difficult it was for jews to get to other countries. The only way you can pin that n the zionists is if you think they control all the countries jews weren't allowed in.

Is that every country in the planet?

Amos Quito: And as you specifically mentioned Cuba AND the US, I have no doubt that you're thinking of the St. Louis - one ship carrying 900 Jews that were denied entry to Cuba (why?), and subsequently by the US. But these Jews were allowed to enter other European countries.

And what of the US and its immigration quotas? Were they designed to be "ant-Semitic" as so many have charged? No, they were designed to maintain existing ethnic population proportions. Jews were NOT singled out for discrimination.

They were eventually allowed to enter european countries because it became a huge news story.

I didn't say they were "singled out" I said they weren't welcome, as were many other groups. You were the one who took that to mean that every country in the world "HATED JEWS SO MUCH".

Amos Quito: You made the absurd assertion that that Jews had no where to go other than Palestine. Untrue.

No I was pointing out there were no countriess allowing in large number of jews, and they weren't really welcomed anywhere.


Amos Quito: You ridiculously implied that the ONLY way Zionists could influence Jewish emigration was by controlling the immigration policies of all foreign countries - I threw it back in your face.

I didn't say the "only way". You are thw one who repeatedly implies Zionists were behind every action that led to Israel being formed, unless you think they controlled foreign nationsimmigration policy that is BS.



Amos Quito: Please define "Nazi propaganda" and name the specifi piece(s) "propaganda" that you continually allege that I "support".

Well you support the whole claim that jews declared watr on Germany. There are a number of thread where you post t ...


African Americans engineered lynchings by the KKK in order to found a Welfare State, I think is what Amos is trying to get at here.
 
2012-06-28 01:18:24 PM

Fano: African Americans engineered lynchings by the KKK in order to found a Welfare State, I think is what Amos is trying to get at here


Obviously those black peopel must have done something. There is no way regular US citizens woudl ahve been ok with lynchings, making peopel ride int he back of the bus, slavery, etc.

Don't call me racist just for asking what black people did to cause all those things.
 
2012-06-28 01:23:03 PM

liam76: Fano: African Americans engineered lynchings by the KKK in order to found a Welfare State, I think is what Amos is trying to get at here

Obviously those black peopel must have done something. There is no way regular US citizens woudl ahve been ok with lynchings, making peopel ride int he back of the bus, slavery, etc.

Don't call me racist just for asking what black people did to cause all those things.


I'm just asking questions here. I mean, SOMEONE is poisoning our wells. I mean, would it be anti-semitic to ask if a Jew MIGHT have done it? I mean, can you prove that no jews have ever poisoned a well? You sir must be a liar. I have several cut/paste remarks where a person of Jewish descent discusses putting poison in wells.
 
2012-06-28 03:56:29 PM

liam76: Amos Quito: You ridiculously implied that the ONLY way Zionists could influence Jewish emigration was by controlling the immigration policies of all foreign countries - I threw it back in your face.

I didn't say the "only way". You are thw one who repeatedly implies Zionists were behind every action that led to Israel being formed, unless you think they controlled foreign nationsimmigration policy that is BS.



Zionists are the ONLY reason that Israel was formed. It was they who hatched the plot to gain control of the territory, and worked their asses off using every imaginable form of financial and political skulduggery to pull it off. If you recall (as I have given evidence repeatedly) , BOTH the British and the Germans were courting the support of the Zionists (Rothschilds) during WWI, and the British got the deal. Unfortunately for Germany, that meant that they were screwed, as the Zionists (and Jews in general) had largely SUPPORTED the Germans in their battle against the hated Czar. Once the Czar was on the ropes, the Balfour Declaration deal was made with the Brits, and the worm turned as Zionists turn their efforts AGAINST the Germans who, as history shows, suffered a crushing defeat.

You underestimate the power that International Zionism wielded then and continues to wield today.


liam76: Amos Quito: Please define "Nazi propaganda" and name the specifi piece(s) "propaganda" that you continually allege that I "support".

Well you support the whole claim that jews declared watr on Germany. There are a number of thread where you post the headline declaring something along those lines. And yes posting a misleading headline with no context that backs up Nazi propaganda is supporting Nazi propaganda.



You're confused, lad.

www.redicecreations.com

i.ytimg.com

www.corbisimages.com

3.bp.blogspot.com


"Nazi Propaganda" would imply propaganda generated and published by the Nazis, no?

Was the above published by the Nazis? Did they declare a boycott on themselves?

What you see above is ZIONIST propaganda - and remember, this was PRIOR to Kristallnacht, BEFORE the Germans started coming down heavily on Jews.

Of course there is little difference between Nazis and ZioNazis, so I can understand how you might fail to differentiate.


liam76: In this thread you have said Israel wouldn't have been possible without the holocaust



Yes, and it is true. Prior to the war, Zionists tried like hell but FAILED to convince Jews to move to Palestine in numbers sufficient to form a Jewish State. Thanks to the Holocaust and associated persecution, they got their Jews, and the dream came true.


liam76: You also said that jews in general and Zionists in particular have been behind the events that made Israel possible.



Farking DUH! Who did you think was responsible for the creation of Israel? Eskimos?


liam76: That means you think the jews in general and zionists in particular were behind the holocaust



They were certainly involved with stirring up the trouble and inter-ethnic strife that CULMINATED in the Holocaust - the above referenced boycott being an example. The Zionist agenda also benefited magnificently from Germany's persecution of the Jews by the generation of desperate Jewish emigrants and international sympathy/political support, did they not?

liam76: That means you think the jews in general and zionists in particular were behind the holocaust. I would say blaming jews and zionists for the holocaust falls in with Nazi propaganda, wouldn't you?



I would say that you STILL have a problem in being able to differentiate "JEWS" from "ZIONISTS", especially in he context of those times, when very few Jews were Zionist, and the Zionist leadership was a small, politically connected and financially loaded hard-core cabal made up of the likes of David Ben Gurion and Menachem Begin, and headed by the Rothschild klan.

So, having been corrected, will you now accuse me of promoting Zionist propaganda?
 
2012-06-28 05:37:26 PM

Amos Quito: Once the Czar was on the ropes, the Balfour Declaration deal was made with the Brits, and the worm turned as Zionists turn their efforts AGAINST the Germans who, as history shows, suffered a crushing defeat.


So Germany lost because of Zionists? Jesus man you are even more deranged than I thought.


Amos Quito: Well you support the whole claim that jews declared watr on Germany. There are a number of thread where you post the headline declaring something along those lines. And yes posting a misleading headline with no context that backs up Nazi propaganda is supporting Nazi propaganda.


You're confused, lad.


"Nazi Propaganda" would imply propaganda generated and published by the Nazis, no?

Was the above published by the Nazis? Did they declare a boycott on themselves?


No. Re read the bolded. Posting pictures that back up the Nazi propaganda that "jews declared war on Germany" is backing up Nazi propaganda.



Amos Quito:What you see above is ZIONIST propaganda -


First off make up your mind. You repeatedly claimed that Zionists were working with Nazi Germany, if that were the case why would their propaganda talk about jews declaring war on Germany.

And once again re-read the bolded section above.


Amos Quito:and remember, this was PRIOR to Kristallnacht, BEFORE the Germans started coming down heavily on Jews.

Oh, well they weren't coming down heavily on Jews soa boycott over mistreatment of Jewish jews by some American jews is completely out of order.


Amos Quito:Of course there is little difference between Nazis and ZioNazis, so I can understand how you might fail to differentiate.

Unless you can show me where a Zionist group put millions of people to death based on their religion, that alone is enough to mark you as an Anti-semite.


Amos Quito: liam76: That means you think the jews in general and zionists in particular were behind the holocaust


They were certainly involved with stirring up the trouble and inter-ethnic strife that CULMINATED in the Holocaust


I need to bookmark this.

You don't think you support Nazi propaganda, but the holocaust was because jews were stirring up trouble.



Amos Quito: So, having been corrected, will you now accuse me of promoting Zionist propaganda?


You have doubled down on it you goose stepping moron.
 
2012-06-28 05:48:56 PM

Amos Quito: liam76: That means you think the jews in general and zionists in particular were behind the holocaust


They were certainly involved with stirring up the trouble and inter-ethnic strife that CULMINATED in the Holocaust


I got to come back to this.

I can't get how you can say this and see how people see you as a Nazi apologist.

It was the fault of the zionists, the Nazi's weren't that bad, but the Zionists stirred them up so what do you expect?

Seriously, fark you.
 
2012-06-28 06:39:23 PM

liam76: Amos Quito: Once the Czar was on the ropes, the Balfour Declaration deal was made with the Brits, and the worm turned as Zionists turn their efforts AGAINST the Germans who, as history shows, suffered a crushing defeat.

So Germany lost because of Zionists?



According to the memoirs of David Lloyd George, Prime Minister of Britain during WWI, the Zionist played a remarkable role in the war. Prior to the signing Balfour Declaration (pledging a homeland for Jews in Palestine), Britain had been on the ropes. George credited the Zionists with sabotaging Germany's war efforts on the Eastern Front, with providing Britain access to much needed war money (they were broke, and the Rothschilds stepped in), and with helping to bring the US into the war on the side of the Brits.

George also noted that the Germans were not oblivious to what the Zionists had done, and commented that this perceived betrayal was likely a primary reason for the enmity between Jews and ethnic Germans at the time he penned his memoirs (1939).

So what do YOU think? Are David Lloyd Gorge's comments on the topic credible? Was he in a position to have knowledge of such matters?


liam76: Was the above published by the Nazis? Did they declare a boycott on themselves?

No. Re read the bolded. Posting pictures that back up the Nazi propaganda that "jews declared war on Germany" is backing up Nazi propaganda.



The headline was not written by or published by Nazis. It and the boycott it inspired was the work of Zionists who were working to stir up hatred against the Nazis - much as the Zionists are working to stir up fear and hatred of Iran today. :-)

liam76: First off make up your mind. You repeatedly claimed that Zionists were working with Nazi Germany, if that were the case why would their propaganda talk about jews declaring war on Germany.



They WERE working with Germany, as you well know. Germany wanted Jews OUT, and Zionists wanted Jews in Palestine. Anything that created enmity, trouble and discord between ethnic Germans and Jews worked to the Zionists' advantage, because it put more pressure on Jews to get out of Germany and move to Palestine.

Get it?


liam76: Amos Quito:Of course there is little difference between Nazis and ZioNazis, so I can understand how you might fail to differentiate.

Unless you can show me where a Zionist group put millions of people to death based on their religion, that alone is enough to mark you as an Anti-semite.



So, had the Nazis not actually MURDERED millions of Jews, but only confined them to live in occupied squalor for generations, you'd be totally cool with the Nazis? Is that right?

And it's correctly spelled "anti-Semite" (note capitalization). If you're going to make wild-eyed claims and baseless accusations, at least do so properly.


liam76: Amos Quito: liam76: That means you think the jews in general and zionists in particular were behind the holocaust


They were certainly involved with stirring up the trouble and inter-ethnic strife that CULMINATED in the Holocaust

I need to bookmark this.

You don't think you support Nazi propaganda, but the holocaust was because jews were stirring up trouble.



Damn you're thick. Here, I'll provide helpful definitions:

Jew

1. one of a scattered group of people that traces its descent from the Biblical Hebrews or from postexilic adherents of Judaism; Israelite.
2. a person whose religion is Judaism.
3. a subject of the ancient kingdom of Judah.

Zionist

a worldwide Jewish movement that resulted in the establishment and development of the state of Israel.
1. a political movement for the establishment and support of a national homeland for Jews in Palestine, now concerned chiefly with the development of the modern state of Israel
2. a policy or movement for Jews to return to Palestine from the Diaspora


"Zionist". "Jew". These terms are NOT synonymous. I think you know this, but repeatedly conflate the two in your efforts to spin your spiel, schmuck.


liam76: Amos Quito: So, having been corrected, will you now accuse me of promoting Zionist propaganda?

You have doubled down on it you goose stepping moron.



You live in a fantasy world in which nothing any Jew, whether Zionist, Communist, Nazi or Capitalist, could POSSIBLY have ever done ANYTHING that might have affected his fate or the fates of his fellows. You see them as perpetual victims, innocent bystanders that were always neutral - yet they were always somehow the victims of drive-by scapegoating.

Even now as the Israelis brutally oppress the FARK out of the Palestinians, threaten their neighbors and try like hell to start WWIII, you see them as innocent lambs - a view that is unfortunately shared with many Jews worldwide.

This aversion to introspection is suicidally stupid, and you, Liam76, are handing them the noose.

Why do you hate Jews, Liam76?
 
2012-06-28 06:50:22 PM

liam76: Amos Quito: liam76: That means you think the jews in general and zionists in particular were behind the holocaust


They were certainly involved with stirring up the trouble and inter-ethnic strife that CULMINATED in the Holocaust

I got to come back to this.

I can't get how you can say this and see how people see you as a Nazi apologist.

It was the fault of the zionists, the Nazi's weren't that bad, but the Zionists stirred them up so what do you expect?

Seriously, fark you.



LOL!

See the last paragraph in my post above.

To you, anyone who implies that there might be even the remotest possibility that Jews played a role in their own farking history is an anti-Semite and a Nazi apologist.

Are you really that naive, Liam76?

Repeat after me: Zionist does NOT equal Jew, and Jew does NOT equal Zionist.

To reinforce this point go back and re-read the news story that started this farking thread.
 
2012-06-28 06:53:41 PM

liam76: Amos Quito: liam76: That means you think the jews in general and zionists in particular were behind the holocaust


They were certainly involved with stirring up the trouble and inter-ethnic strife that CULMINATED in the Holocaust

I got to come back to this.

I can't get how you can say this and see how people see you as a Nazi apologist.

Zionist treachery knows no bounds and lacks all human decency. Their dastardly acts forced Hitler's hand to protect Germv I'm sorry, I can't type -this even in mockery. Every post he made is from an a priori assumption of zionist perfidy, just hiding behind a shell game of of implications. To be intellectually honest and consistent, he should be PROUD to be an antisemite, as it would mean opposing wickedness in his world.

It was the fault of the zionists, the Nazi's weren't that bad, but the Zionists stirred them up so what do you expect?

Seriously, fark you.

 
2012-06-28 07:14:12 PM

Fano: liam76: Amos Quito: liam76: That means you think the jews in general and zionists in particular were behind the holocaust


They were certainly involved with stirring up the trouble and inter-ethnic strife that CULMINATED in the Holocaust

I got to come back to this.

I can't get how you can say this and see how people see you as a Nazi apologist.

Zionist treachery knows no bounds and lacks all human decency. Their dastardly acts forced Hitler's hand to protect Germv I'm sorry, I can't type -this even in mockery. Every post he made is from an a priori assumption of zionist perfidy, just hiding behind a shell game of of implications. To be intellectually honest and consistent, he should be PROUD to be an antisemite, as it would mean opposing wickedness in his world.

It was the fault of the zionists, the Nazi's weren't that bad, but the Zionists stirred them up so what do you expect?

Seriously, fark you.



Wow, that was farking profound, Fano.
 
2012-06-28 07:23:36 PM
 
2012-06-28 08:04:30 PM

Amos Quito: The headline was not written by or published by Nazis. It and the boycott it inspired was the work of Zionists who were working to stir up hatred against the Nazis - much as the Zionists are working to stir up fear and hatred of Iran today. :-)


How many times do I need to re-post this?

Posting pictures that back up the Nazi propaganda that "jews declared war on Germany" is backing up Nazi propaganda.

It doesn't need to be written by Nazi's to support Nazi propaganda.


Amos Quito: liam76: Amos Quito: Once the Czar was on the ropes, the Balfour Declaration deal was made with the Brits, and the worm turned as Zionists turn their efforts AGAINST the Germans who, as history shows, suffered a crushing defeat.

So Germany lost because of Zionists?


According to the memoirs of David Lloyd George, Prime Minister of Britain during WWI, the Zionist played a remarkable role in the war. Prior to the signing Balfour Declaration (pledging a homeland for Jews in Palestine), Britain had been on the ropes. George credited the Zionists with sabotaging Germany's war efforts on the Eastern Front, with providing Britain access to much needed war money (they were broke, and the Rothschilds stepped in), and with helping to bring the US into the war on the side of the Brits.

George also noted that the Germans were not oblivious to what the Zionists had done, and commented that this perceived betrayal was likely a primary reason for the enmity between Jews and ethnic Germans at the time he penned his memoirs (1939).

So what do YOU think? Are David Lloyd Gorge's comments on the topic credible? Was he in a position to have knowledge of such matters?


I would like to see the quote you are referring to in context before I comment on what he said.

As to your specific claims about Zionist support,

1-How many zionists were there on the easten front to fight (or are you conflating jews and zionists again, as you like to do when it is conveniant to you) you have said many times int his thread they are only a small minority of jews, so how could they have been a big help.

2-Prior to the declaration ZIonists (or is it jews), who lived in countries invaded by Germany, didn't lift a finger against Germany?

3-Also I would like a source showing that the Rothschilds only gave Britain money after the Balfour declaration.
Now if you can answer those question it might be worth proceding on this (of course then I would have to ask you about the similiar german-turkish declaration for jews in Palestine, but there is no point going unless you can address those questions)

Amos Quito: So, had the Nazis not actually MURDERED millions of Jews, but only confined them to live in occupied squalor for generations, you'd be totally cool with the Nazis? Is that right?


This is why you are an anti-Semite (happy, I will try and work on my capitalization dyslexia, seeing as how you are a grammar Nazi as well as a regular nazi).

Palestinians weren't "confined" by Israel until 67. As far as their "squalor" you might want to check the UN HDI from 67-05. They were doing better under Israel than many of their arab neighbors. So if Nazi's put german jews in specific areas where their literacy, infant mortality, life expectancy, and population growth improved for generations, and was exceeding their jewish neighbors, that would be a fair comparison.

Not saying Israel should be praised for their treatment of Palestinians just trying to put in perspective the contrast of what Nazis and Israelis have done.

Amos Quito: liam76: Amos Quito: liam76: That means you think the jews in general and zionists in particular were behind the holocaust


They were certainly involved with stirring up the trouble and inter-ethnic strife that CULMINATED in the Holocaust

I need to bookmark this.

You don't think you support Nazi propaganda, but the holocaust was because jews were stirring up trouble.


Damn you're thick. Here, I'll provide helpful definitions:


The "they" here weren't jews, cause was part of the "they" in the post you were replying to.


Amos Quito: To you, anyone who implies that there might be even the remotest possibility that Jews played a role in their own farking history is an anti-Semite and a Nazi apologist.

Are you really that naive, Liam76?

Repeat after me: Zionist does NOT equal Jew, and Jew does NOT equal Zionist.


Did you just mix up zionist and jew here, or are you back to blaming the jews for "stirring things up" as the reason for the holocaust?

Why don't you goose step along until you can get your derp straight and stop pretending that something has to be written by Nazi's to support Nazi propaganda.
 
2012-06-28 08:45:07 PM

liam76: Amos Quito: The headline was not written by or published by Nazis. It and the boycott it inspired was the work of Zionists who were working to stir up hatred against the Nazis - much as the Zionists are working to stir up fear and hatred of Iran today. :-)

How many times do I need to re-post this?

Posting pictures that back up the Nazi propaganda that "jews declared war on Germany" is backing up Nazi propaganda.

It doesn't need to be written by Nazi's to support Nazi propaganda.



So the Zionists who fomented the boycott were "supporting" NAZI propaganda???


liam76: Amos Quito: liam76: Amos Quito: Once the Czar was on the ropes, the Balfour Declaration deal was made with the Brits, and the worm turned as Zionists turn their efforts AGAINST the Germans who, as history shows, suffered a crushing defeat.

So Germany lost because of Zionists?


According to the memoirs of David Lloyd George, Prime Minister of Britain during WWI, the Zionist played a remarkable role in the war. Prior to the signing Balfour Declaration (pledging a homeland for Jews in Palestine), Britain had been on the ropes. George credited the Zionists with sabotaging Germany's war efforts on the Eastern Front, with providing Britain access to much needed war money (they were broke, and the Rothschilds stepped in), and with helping to bring the US into the war on the side of the Brits.

George also noted that the Germans were not oblivious to what the Zionists had done, and commented that this perceived betrayal was likely a primary reason for the enmity between Jews and ethnic Germans at the time he penned his memoirs (1939).

So what do YOU think? Are David Lloyd Gorge's comments on the topic credible? Was he in a position to have knowledge of such matters?

I would like to see the quote you are referring to in context before I comment on what he said.



Fine. From my files:

QUOTE: (emphasis mine)

The support of the Zionists for the cause of the Entente would mean a
great deal as a war measure. Quite naturally Jewish sympathies were to
a great extent anti-Russian, and therefore in favour of the Central
Powers. No ally of Russia, in fact, could escape sharing that immediate
and inevitable penalty for the long and savage Russian persecution of
the Jewish race. In addition to this, the German General Staff, with
their wide outlook on possibilities, urged, early in 1916, the
advantages of promising Jewish restoration to Palestine
under an
arrangement

{p. 726} to be made between Zionists and Turkey, backed by a German
guarantee. The practical difficulties were considerable; the subject
was perhaps dangerous to German relations with Turkey; and the German
Government acted cautiously. But the scheme was by no means rejected or
even shelved, and at any moment the Allies might have been forestalled
in offering this supreme bid. In fact in September, 1917, the German
Government were making very serious efforts to capture the Zionist
Movement.


Another most cogent reason for the adoption by the Allies of the policy
of the declaration lay in the state of Russia herself. Russian Jews had
been secretly active on behalf of the Central Powers from the first;
they had become the chief agents of German pacifist propaganda in
Russia; by 1917 they had done much in preparing for that general
disintegration of Russian society, later recognised as the Revolution.
It was believed that if Great Britain declared for the fulfilment of
Zionist aspirations in Palestine under her own pledge, one effect would
be to bring Russian Jewry to the cause of the Entente.


It was believed, also, that such a declaration would have a potent
influence upon world Jewry outside Russia, and secure for the Entente
the aid of Jewish financial interests. In America, their aid in this
respect would have a special value when the Allies had almost exhausted
the gold and marketable securities available for American purchases.
Such were the chief considerations which, in 1917, impelled the British
Government towards making a contract with Jewry.


[...]

The Zionist leaders gave us a definite promise that, if the Allies
committed themselves to giving facilities for the establishment of a
National Home for the Jews in Palestine, they would do their best to
rally to the Allied cause Jewish sentiment and support throughout the
world. They kept their word in the letter and the spirit, and the only
question that remains now is whether we mean to honour ours.
Immediately the declaration was agreed to, millions of leaflets were
circulated in every town and area through - out the world where there
were known to be Jewish communities. They were dropped from the air in
German and Austrian towns, and they were scattered throughout Russia
and Poland. I could point out substantial and in one case decisive
advantages derived from this propaganda amongst the Jews. In Russia the
Bolsheviks baffled all the efforts of the Germans to benefit by the
harvests of the Ukraine and the Don, and hundreds of thousands of
German and Austrian troops had to be maintained to the end of the War
on Russian soil, whilst the Germans were short of men to replace
casualties on the Western front. I do not suggest that this was due
entirely, or even mainly, to Jewish activities. But we have good reason
to believe that Jewish propaganda in Russia had a great deal to do with
the difficulties created for the Germans in Southern Russia after the
peace of Brest-Litovsk. The Germans themselves know that to be the
case, and the Jews in Germany are suffering to-day for the fidelity
with which their brethren in Russia and in America discharged their
obligations under the Zionist pledge to the Allies.


Through Sir Mark Sykes and Colonel Lawrence we informed the Arab
leaders, King Hussein and his son, Feisal, of our proposals. We could
not get in touch with the Palestinian Arabs as they were fighting
against us.

{p. 738} There is no better proof of the value of the Balfour
Declaration as a military move than the fact that Germany entered into
negotiations with Turkey in an endeavour to provide an alternative
scheme which would appeal to Zionists. A German-Jewish Society, the
V.J.O.D.,* was formed, and in January, 1918, Talaat, the Grand Vizier,
at the instigation of the Germans, gave vague promises of legislation
by means of which "all justifiable wishes of the Jews in Palestine
would be able to find their fulfilment."


END QUOTE

David Lloyd George, Memoirs of the Peace Conference, Volume II, New Haven, Yale University Press 1939; (ch. XXIII).

Pay particular attention to the underlined portion above.

Any questions?
 
2012-06-28 08:55:06 PM
 
2012-06-28 11:44:49 PM

Amos Quito: Oh, here's a link to Google Books' copy of Memoirs of the Peace Conference.

Have a nice evening.


smart and polite.

you sir...are ten tons of awesome.
 
2012-06-29 05:51:24 AM
Amos Quito, from our previous conversation: Oh, you cited the post where you PLAGIARIZED material from the Zionist Apologist website CAMERA.

Funny, but Liam76 cited that EXACT SAME ARTICLE only yesterday in another thread.

Should we start referring to you as "TappingTheLiam76", Mr. Plagiarist?

LULZ!


because i exposed your out of context misleading bullshiat on this thread as well.

let's ignore i pointed out exactly how and where the text you use was edited and twisted. Like Liam76 said, refute one fact on the Camera article, just one. Go right ahead.
Or admit your misleading out of context bullshiat.

The I know the subject and the history quite well, thank you. And as long as you and yours continue to post your outrageous lies in your pathetic defense of Xionism and Xrael, I'll continue to counter with facts, citing unassailable sources.

How odd that you seemed to elegantly skip the part where i brought explicit proof for your anti-semitic rants, conspiracy theories and lying bullshiat ?

Go work on your misleading edited ben Gurion zionist conspiracy quotes or your "zionists orhestrated the Holocaust" bit. How about your "zionists declared war on germany" bullcrap ? It never fails. hell, maybe your "zionists caused the Germans defeat in WWI" bit ?

Wait a second, you didn't ignore it, you just had nothing to say besides getting pissed and bringing some more of your bullshiat conspiracy nuttery which i refuted as well.

Like i said, you're an anti-semite sack of shiat. A waste of oxygen.

Bauer: you sir...are ten tons of awesome.


hey Amos Quito, you got a compliment from fellow anti-semite and aliens conspiracy nut herr Bauer! The Haiku post style Master! you must be very proud of yourself.
 
2012-06-29 06:42:26 AM

Amos Quito: liam76: Amos Quito: The headline was not written by or published by Nazis. It and the boycott it inspired was the work of Zionists who were working to stir up hatred against the Nazis - much as the Zionists are working to stir up fear and hatred of Iran today. :-)

How many times do I need to re-post this?

Posting pictures that back up the Nazi propaganda that "jews declared war on Germany" is backing up Nazi propaganda.

It doesn't need to be written by Nazi's to support Nazi propaganda.


So the Zionists who fomented the boycott were "supporting" NAZI propaganda???


So we are mixing up zionists and jews again? Or does supporting a boycott against a country that is discriminating against your people make you a zionist (cause that doesn't jive with your previous definition)?

The "boycott" wasn't nazi propaganda, posting pitcures of headlines or pictures of the boycott with no context other than the claim that jews declared war on Germany is supporting Nazi propaganda.

Amos Quito: Brest-Litovsk


Are you familiar with what happened in Brest-Litovsk in 1916? Jews (who had been kicked out under by order fo the russing high command in 1915) returend after the Austro-German army occupied the city. They were then kicked out again, by the Austro-German army. This was before the Balfour Declaration, this was before your lie of "Jews declaring war on Germany". Of course you won't find info about that on places like Stormfront, so I can understand how you would miss it. This and things like it are why jews on the eastern front weren't too fond of Germany. You would recognize this if you were consistant in your derp. Many times in this thread you have said prior to the holocaust there was little interest in Jews going to Palestine, so why would they be swayed by a promise fo land they never want to go to?


Amos Quito: Any questions



Yeah, the same 3 question you didn't answer fromt he last post.


1-How many zionists were there on the easten front to fight (or are you conflating jews and zionists again, as you like to do when it is conveniant to you) you have said many times int his thread they are only a small minority of jews, so how could they have been a big help.

2-Prior to the declaration ZIonists (or is it jews), who lived in countries invaded by Germany, didn't lift a finger against Germany?

3-Also I would like a source showing that the Rothschilds only gave Britain money after the Balfour declaration.
Now if you can answer those question it might be worth proceding on this (of course then I would have to ask you about the similiar german-turkish declaration for jews in Palestine, but there is no point going unless you can address those questions)
 
2012-06-29 10:00:38 AM
your blind hatred does not effect me.

i hope you get over it.

for your own sake.
 
2012-06-29 10:04:14 AM
yes...i have seen an "orb".

up close.

so what.

if caring about the overall welfare of humanity makes me an "alien conspiracy nut" in your eyes...well...that's just a burden i'll have to bare.
 
2012-06-29 10:17:40 AM

Bauer: yes...i have seen an "orb".

up close.

so what.

if caring about the overall welfare of humanity makes me an "alien conspiracy nut" in your eyes...well...that's just a burden i'll have to bare.


Bare it proudly, anti-semite alien conspiracy nutjob!
Is the Haiku thing a result of brain damage to the Occipital Lobe ?
 
2012-06-29 10:33:26 AM
you need help.
 
2012-06-29 10:44:23 AM

Bauer: you need help.


Yes, i'm the one needing help.

What kind of alien was it ? the classic Greys ?
 
2012-06-29 11:51:01 AM

Bauer: yes...i have seen an "orb".

up close.

so what.

if caring about the overall welfare of humanity makes me an "alien conspiracy nut" in your eyes...well...that's just a burden i'll have to bare.


No what makes you an "alien conspiracy nut" is your belief that you saw a spaceship, and that there have been recent discoveries of alien tech found in russia .

SIne you are a big fan of Fark's favorite anti-semite and Nazi supporter, I am curious if you are just crazy when it comes to aliens? Do the jews have anything to do with this alien conspiracy?
 
2012-06-29 04:53:28 PM
my ancestry is german-jewish.

why would i hate my own people?

you don't know me...and you are only looking to make fun of me.
 
2012-06-29 05:27:56 PM

Bauer: my ancestry is german-jewish.

why would i hate my own people?


Do you think the jews are responsible for World War I and II ?

Bauer: you don't know me...and you are only looking to make fun of me


You're right, we shouldn't make fun of the clinically insane.
 
2012-06-29 05:32:46 PM
Oh and one more thing, Her Bauer, do you think Hitler was a scapegoat for the jews ?
 
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