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(Yahoo)   Leaked 2009 memo from that gaffe-prone buffoon Biden shows he almost presciently analyzed the situation in Afghanistan and concluded that the "surge" would not work there the way it worked in Iraq   (news.yahoo.com) divider line 124
    More: Interesting, Joe Biden, President Obama, Iraq, Taliban insurgency, Karl Eikenberry, Stanley McChrystal, Sephora, counterinsurgency  
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2130 clicks; posted to Politics » on 25 Jun 2012 at 12:54 PM (2 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2012-06-25 12:54:49 PM
The man is clearly a genius.
 
2012-06-25 12:56:42 PM
I love how being a buffoon in washington DC, means being a guy who is always right and says exactly what he's thinking without regard for politics.
 
2012-06-25 12:57:49 PM

Otherwise Just Fine: The man is clearly a genius.


He managed to become one of the foreign policy experts in the Senate during his time on the FRC. The guy can't be all that stupid, he's just really bad at public speaking or else enjoys trolling the populace a little too much.
 
2012-06-25 12:59:40 PM
After reading today's Politico comments I have decided to begin calling him Osama Bin Biden.

Why? I dunno. Sounds scary, I guess.
 
2012-06-25 01:00:08 PM

ha-ha-guy: Otherwise Just Fine: The man is clearly a genius.

He managed to become one of the foreign policy experts in the Senate during his time on the FRC. The guy can't be all that stupid, he's just really bad at public speaking or else enjoys trolling the populace a little too much.


He's really not that bad at public speaking. For some reason the media exaggerates him into a buffoon when he's actually just sort of a goofy, carefree guy.
 
2012-06-25 01:00:30 PM

depmode98: I love how being a buffoon in washington DC, means being a guy who is always right and says exactly what he's thinking without regard for politics.


When you work in a world of spin, the truth can make you look insane.
 
2012-06-25 01:01:07 PM

ha-ha-guy: The guy can't be all that stupid, he's just really bad at public speaking or else enjoys trolling the populace a little too much.


He says what he thinks, and it's usually correct. He simply picks poor times to express those thoughts, and that timing can hurt political positioning.
 
2012-06-25 01:01:23 PM
Yes, well. If you base your opinion on what the profit-driven media and Fark chooses to say to maximize said profits what do you expect? Superficial understanding is superficial.
 
2012-06-25 01:01:36 PM

HotWingConspiracy: depmode98: I love how being a buffoon in washington DC, means being a guy who is always right and says exactly what he's thinking without regard for politics.

When you work in a world of spin, the truth can make you look insane.


This is true. Also, it sounds like a great tagline for a summer blockbuster.
 
2012-06-25 01:01:39 PM

ha-ha-guy: or else enjoys trolling the populace a little too much.


What else would you expect from a farking Iggles' fan?

But what else does it show? McCain was 100% wrong with what he was campaigning on.
 
2012-06-25 01:06:03 PM
so, Obama is losing a war? A war-loser? A loser?
 
2012-06-25 01:07:19 PM
Rumsfeld didn't know what the fark he was doing in Iraq. They had no plan at all after the capital was taken and Saddam removed.
 
2012-06-25 01:07:31 PM

Khellendros: ha-ha-guy: The guy can't be all that stupid, he's just really bad at public speaking or else enjoys trolling the populace a little too much.

He says what he thinks, and it's usually correct. He simply picks poor times to express those thoughts, and that timing can hurt political positioning.


Call me crazy but back in '07, when Hillary was the front runner and Obama was just warming up, I thought Biden was the only Democrat (or politician in Washington) that actually understood what the heck was going on in the middle east and how to get the US out with least amount of pain.
 
2012-06-25 01:08:23 PM

ha-ha-guy: Otherwise Just Fine: The man is clearly a genius.

He managed to become one of the foreign policy experts in the Senate during his time on the FRC. The guy can't be all that stupid, he's just really bad at public speaking or else enjoys trolling the populace a little too much.


I remember back in early 2001 when they were trying to restart the Star Wars program, and he was made fun of for saying the real threat was from some guy named Osama bin Laden.
 
2012-06-25 01:09:09 PM
The only people surprised by how competent Biden is are conservatives. He wasn't chosen to be VEEP because he is a Grizzly Mama... he knows what he is doing. Just another example conservatives superficial thought processes.
 
2012-06-25 01:10:29 PM
3.bp.blogspot.com
 
2012-06-25 01:11:03 PM
I thought everyone knew that it wouldn't work the same as in Iraq (and it didn't work in Iraq the way most people think), but it was political cover for removing most troops from that Bush/Cheney clusterfrak.

/except the Xe mercenaries, of course
 
2012-06-25 01:11:46 PM

PonceAlyosha: ha-ha-guy: Otherwise Just Fine: The man is clearly a genius.

He managed to become one of the foreign policy experts in the Senate during his time on the FRC. The guy can't be all that stupid, he's just really bad at public speaking or else enjoys trolling the populace a little too much.

He's really not that bad at public speaking. For some reason the media exaggerates him into a buffoon when he's actually just sort of a goofy, carefree guy.


He sounds like exactly what he is, a middle class guy from a blue-collar background. He doesn't have the polish that our supposedly class-blind society and media want from our leaders, so they put him in a fool's costume and make everything he does confrom to that role even if if they have to stretch it 16 ways to Sunday to make it fit. I says a lot about Obama that he recognized a weakness in his own skill set and chose the guy with those skills no matter what other people thought of him.
 
Heb
2012-06-25 01:13:03 PM

ha-ha-guy: Otherwise Just Fine: The man is clearly a genius.

He managed to become one of the foreign policy experts in the Senate during his time on the FRC. The guy can't be all that stupid, he's just really bad at public speaking or else enjoys trolling the populace a little too much.


I'm not American, so not really aware of the US perception of Biden, but "really bad at public speaking"? The speech be have this year to the families of those who died in military service has to be the single finest speech I have ever seen from a politician. It was incredible.
 
2012-06-25 01:13:34 PM
He was spot on. Afghanistan is a terrible place to conduct COIN operations, and particularly with Pakistan waging a proxy war on us. We should negotiate with the Taliban and start withdrawing.
 
2012-06-25 01:13:50 PM
What "works" is to come up with a plan, no matter how divorced from reality, and then continue to claim that it "worked" in spite of all evidence.

"See, things aren't as bad as they were at the low point in 2005. The surge worked. Bush was right all along. Saddam flew the planes into the towers. Liberals hate America. America always wins."

Then we get Obama telling us that we're out of Iraq, and again, just keep repeating it in spite of all evidence. That's true to the same extent that "combat operations" were over when the hillbilly pranced across an aircraft carrier just off San Diego.
 
2012-06-25 01:13:54 PM

karmaceutical: The only people surprised by how competent Biden is are conservatives. He wasn't chosen to be VEEP because he is a Grizzly Mama... he knows what he is doing. Just another example conservatives superficial thought processes.


AND he's got a biatchin' ride.
 
2012-06-25 01:14:31 PM

Jake Havechek: Rumsfeld didn't know what the fark he was doing in Iraq. They had no plan at all after the capital was taken and Saddam removed.


Sure they did. They were supposed to be greeted as liberators and the insurgents mostly give up while the rest of the Iraqi people join up and help our troops weed out the rest. How is it Rumsfeld's fault the Iraqi people didn't follow the plan!
 
Heb
2012-06-25 01:14:37 PM

Heb: ha-ha-guy: Otherwise Just Fine: The man is clearly a genius.

He managed to become one of the foreign policy experts in the Senate during his time on the FRC. The guy can't be all that stupid, he's just really bad at public speaking or else enjoys trolling the populace a little too much.

I'm not American, so not really aware of the US perception of Biden, but "really bad at public speaking"? The speech be have this year to the families of those who died in military service has to be the single finest speech I have ever seen from a politician. It was incredible.


Sorry, should read "he gave" not "be have"

Bloody iPhone
 
2012-06-25 01:14:52 PM

depmode98: I love how being a buffoon in washington DC, means being a guy who is always right and says exactly what he's thinking without regard for politics.

 
2012-06-25 01:14:54 PM

Otherwise Just Fine: The man is clearly a genius.


Genius? Nah. He's prolly got a 120-130 IQ, so he's smart. But he's informed and diligent, so sometimes it looks like he's a genius.
 
2012-06-25 01:15:34 PM

Heb: I'm not American, so not really aware of the US perception of Biden, but "really bad at public speaking"? The speech be have this year to the families of those who died in military service has to be the single finest speech I have ever seen from a politician. It was incredible.


Yup.

Link

And his speech after the BP incident was excellent as well.

Link

The people who love Joe love him because he's genuine. For better or for worse, he says what he's thinking.
 
2012-06-25 01:15:47 PM

Magorn: PonceAlyosha: ha-ha-guy: Otherwise Just Fine: The man is clearly a genius.

He managed to become one of the foreign policy experts in the Senate during his time on the FRC. The guy can't be all that stupid, he's just really bad at public speaking or else enjoys trolling the populace a little too much.

He's really not that bad at public speaking. For some reason the media exaggerates him into a buffoon when he's actually just sort of a goofy, carefree guy.

He sounds like exactly what he is, a middle class guy from a blue-collar background. He doesn't have the polish that our supposedly class-blind society and media want from our leaders, so they put him in a fool's costume and make everything he does confrom to that role even if if they have to stretch it 16 ways to Sunday to make it fit. I says a lot about Obama that he recognized a weakness in his own skill set and chose the guy with those skills no matter what other people thought of him.


I believe Biden is a lot smarter than people give him credit for. He does lack polish, but I think that's what makes him so damn likable. That and he's willing to laugh at himself.
 
2012-06-25 01:16:55 PM
Biden is a lot better than bloodthirsty and evil Cheney.
 
2012-06-25 01:17:09 PM

Famous Thamas: Magorn: PonceAlyosha: ha-ha-guy: Otherwise Just Fine: The man is clearly a genius.

He managed to become one of the foreign policy experts in the Senate during his time on the FRC. The guy can't be all that stupid, he's just really bad at public speaking or else enjoys trolling the populace a little too much.

He's really not that bad at public speaking. For some reason the media exaggerates him into a buffoon when he's actually just sort of a goofy, carefree guy.

He sounds like exactly what he is, a middle class guy from a blue-collar background. He doesn't have the polish that our supposedly class-blind society and media want from our leaders, so they put him in a fool's costume and make everything he does confrom to that role even if if they have to stretch it 16 ways to Sunday to make it fit. I says a lot about Obama that he recognized a weakness in his own skill set and chose the guy with those skills no matter what other people thought of him.

I believe Biden is a lot smarter than people give him credit for. He does lack polish, but I think that's what makes him so damn likable. That and he's willing to laugh at himself.


He comes off as a lot more human and relatable than any other national politician.
 
2012-06-25 01:17:12 PM

Kibbler: What "works" is to come up with a plan, no matter how divorced from reality, and then continue to claim that it "worked" in spite of all evidence.

"See, things aren't as bad as they were at the low point in 2005. The surge worked. Bush was right all along. Saddam flew the planes into the towers. Liberals hate America. America always wins."

Then we get Obama telling us that we're out of Iraq, and again, just keep repeating it in spite of all evidence. That's true to the same extent that "combat operations" were over when the hillbilly pranced across an aircraft carrier just off San Diego.


Exactly how many US troops are currently stationed in Iraq, not counting Embassy guards?
 
2012-06-25 01:17:32 PM
Surge never worked for me either.
www.x-entertainment.com
 
2012-06-25 01:17:33 PM

Heb: I'm not American, so not really aware of the US perception of Biden, but "really bad at public speaking"? The speech be have this year to the families of those who died in military service has to be the single finest speech I have ever seen from a politician. It was incredible.


It really was. Make sure you watch that in a dust-free room, when I saw it there was dust all over the damn place.
 
2012-06-25 01:17:44 PM

palelizard: karmaceutical: The only people surprised by how competent Biden is are conservatives. He wasn't chosen to be VEEP because he is a Grizzly Mama... he knows what he is doing. Just another example conservatives superficial thought processes.

AND he's got a biatchin' ride.


Plus, I bet you could plunk him down in an Alaskan wilderness, hand him a rifle and tell him to come back with a moose, and he'd do it. Even with a camera crew and a helper monkey, I bet he'd make a more entertaining TV show than the Quitta from Wasilla.

// but could he hit a wolf while driving the Trans-Am?
 
2012-06-25 01:19:46 PM

Dr Dreidel: palelizard: karmaceutical: The only people surprised by how competent Biden is are conservatives. He wasn't chosen to be VEEP because he is a Grizzly Mama... he knows what he is doing. Just another example conservatives superficial thought processes.

AND he's got a biatchin' ride.

Plus, I bet you could plunk him down in an Alaskan wilderness, hand him a rifle and tell him to come back with a moose, and he'd do it. Even with a camera crew and a helper monkey, I bet he'd make a more entertaining TV show than the Quitta from Wasilla.

// but could he hit a wolf while driving the Trans-Am?


Biden wouldn't need a rifle. He'd just hunt the biatch down and strangle it with his bare hands.
 
2012-06-25 01:20:07 PM

AverageJoe77: I thought Biden was the only Democrat (or politician in Washington) that actually understood what the heck was going on in the middle east and how to get the US out with least amount of pain.


Yeah, it really seems to me that the whole "Biden is an idiot" belief can only be held by those who are really as dumb as they think he is and/or those who can't comprehend the difference between an intelligent person mis-speaking from time to time (or being honest and letting their political shield down, e.g. "big farkin' deal") and someone who is clearly unintelligent and/or intellectually incurious, but may be polished in presentation or appearance (e.g. putting an e on the end of potato; "um, all of them"). Add in his rare (for politicians) ability to make fun of himself, and, well, here we are.

Particularly his experience on the Foreign Relations Committee made him a great teammate for Obama, but (shock!) that was overlooked in an orgy of, "he chose the gaffe master! They're both idiots!" "analysis."

The more accurate narrative of him being a bit too blunt, a bit too honest, and a well-informed member of the FRC doesn't sell papers / ad time / commemerative crying-eagle plates, I guess.

Of course, that doesn't mean that the popular *perception* of him is a significant handicap to his political success and historical record, unfortunately.
 
2012-06-25 01:20:40 PM
If only there was a politician who said what he really thought, warts and all.

Wait, there is? What a clown, what a buffoon, oh chortle.

Bonus: apart frim his '88 campaign stuff, what real gaffes has he made?
 
2012-06-25 01:22:31 PM
For the record, I like the guy. Not sure how I feel about him being the 2016 nominee, but we'll have to wait and see how that cookie crumbles.
 
2012-06-25 01:23:06 PM
Jake Havechek

Biden is a lot better than bloodthirsty and evil Cheney.



There is always one in the crowd.
 
2012-06-25 01:23:09 PM
I've said repeatedly- Biden is a very smart guy who occasionally says stupid things. Occasionally saying stupid things is an affliction a lot of very smart guys suffer from. I'm not sure why anybody thinks it is a big f*cking deal.
 
2012-06-25 01:23:52 PM

Otherwise Just Fine: For the record, I like the guy. Not sure how I feel about him being the 2016 nominee, but we'll have to wait and see how that cookie crumbles.


I'd be alright with Elizabeth Warren nominating him for VP again.
 
2012-06-25 01:24:57 PM
Nothing has ever worked in Afghanistan as far back as we can study. From Alexander through present day, nothing has worked. Here's an interesting book about it.

Into the Land of Bones(pops)
 
2012-06-25 01:26:06 PM

Otherwise Just Fine: For the record, I like the guy. Not sure how I feel about him being the 2016 nominee, but we'll have to wait and see how that cookie crumbles.


I think there's a good chance he won't run; he'll be 74 in 2016.
 
2012-06-25 01:26:54 PM

PonceAlyosha: He's really not that bad at public speaking. For some reason the media exaggerates him into a buffoon when he's actually just sort of a goofy, carefree guy.


He seems to care about his puppet masters, though. Check out his senate voting record if you don't believe me.

Jake Havechek: Biden is a lot better than bloodthirsty and evil Cheney.


He is corrupt as shiat, but not as blood thirsty, so I will give him that. Watching Fark liberals love for the guy is pretty adorable considering how much of a prick the guy is. If you are a Biden lover, I hope you aren't anti-SOPA/PIPA.
 
2012-06-25 01:27:15 PM
Afghanistan is a country with no sense of itself. It's about 30 different tribes speaking 20 different languages all fighting over the small area where the poppies grow.
 
2012-06-25 01:27:23 PM

karnal: Jake Havechek

Biden is a lot better than bloodthirsty and evil Cheney.


There is always one in the crowd.



Then make it two, champ. Cheney is a blight on humanity.
 
2012-06-25 01:27:43 PM

karnal: Jake Havechek

Biden is a lot better than bloodthirsty and evil Cheney.


There is always one in the crowd.


One blood thirsty and evil supporter of torture in every crowd?
 
2012-06-25 01:29:06 PM

ha-ha-guy: Otherwise Just Fine: The man is clearly a genius.

He managed to become one of the foreign policy experts in the Senate during his time on the FRC. The guy can't be all that stupid, he's just really bad at public speaking or else enjoys trolling the populace a little too much.


Agreed. Being smart and being a great public speaker are totally unrelated. I have no doubt that Joe is competent to BE the Pres or VP. The problem is that he wouldn't be too successful if he RAN for Pres (and wasn't when he did).
 
2012-06-25 01:30:52 PM

Jake Havechek: Rumsfeld didn't know what the fark he was doing in Iraq. They had no plan at all after the capital was taken and Saddam removed.


No, they had a plan. The plan was that after Baghdad was taken, all the Sunnis and shiates would rise up and form a pro-western representative democracy in a matter of weeks. So it was an idiotic plan, but that is technically a kind of plan.
 
2012-06-25 01:35:23 PM
I like Joe. Always have. His 'I'm smarter than you' smile is a bit annoying but all 'n all..

I predict that Obama will probably win the 2012 election and we'll get to choose between Hillary and Joe to go against whatever droid the Republicans scrape up for 2016.

/Romney's such a looser that most of the ranking Republicans are saying "Thanks but no thanks" for the veep spot
//That's gotta hurt
 
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