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(Berkeleyside)   If you're riding 50 in a 30 zone on the wrong side of the road whose fault is it when you crash and die? Hint: This happened in America   (berkeleyside.com) divider line 154
    More: Stupid, Market Street, San Francisco County Superior Court, vehicular manslaughter, centennial, inaction, San Francisco District Attorney, U.S. Park Police, torts  
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17478 clicks; posted to Main » on 24 Jun 2012 at 12:49 PM (2 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2012-06-24 12:23:41 PM
Is it Obama's?

I bet its Obama's fault.
 
2012-06-24 12:52:18 PM
I certainly wouldn't argue with the assertion that this idiot is entirely at fault for his own behavior but in a sense his parents may have a bit of a point: Our cycling culture here in the United States is pretty farked up. Our bicycle policy and bicycle education seems to be inadequate and/or inconsistent with safe cycling on public roadways. As a result, cyclists often seem to pick and choose which laws apply to them.

I practice Vehicular Cycling on public roads with the intent of interacting in a predictable and logical fashion with other traffic. If you decide the laws and customs dictating behavior on public roads don't apply to you and scream down a hill at well over the speed limit in the wrong lane... well, you deserve what you get. But we should think as a country about adopting a system for cyclists that would properly ingrain a positive interaction between cyclists and other road users.
 
2012-06-24 12:53:08 PM

SilentStrider: Is it Obama's?

I bet its Obama's fault.


Well, it's his fault or it's the jews' fault; one of the two.

/ I keed, I keed
 
2012-06-24 12:53:14 PM
Hitler's (hister)
 
2012-06-24 12:57:18 PM
If this was a teenager I could maybe see the some logic in the suit, but any 40 year old man is responsible for his own actions. This guy was an idiot and got himself killed. This should get thrown out of court. However, I wouldn't be all that surprised if the parents win.

/somebody think of the precious snowflake manchildren
 
2012-06-24 12:57:22 PM
Sorry for your loss but your son did something stupid and got himself killed. No one made him do it and no one else is responsible. I know it is hard to accept that your perfect snowflake made a bad decision but that's just the way it is.
 
2012-06-24 12:57:25 PM
"49.3 mph, on a bike. How I find religion on Sunday morning," wrote Flint on June 6.

Well, he certainly found the afterlife part.
 
2012-06-24 12:58:38 PM

Jon iz teh kewl: Hitler's (hister)


I don't get it.. but..
"Hitler's Hysterectomy" is a great band name.
 
2012-06-24 12:59:00 PM
Did he have a mo-mo-mo-mo-monkey on his back back back back?
 
2012-06-24 12:59:59 PM
To be fair, the website has a feature to award participants for committing illegal acts. The act, breaking the speed limit, is illegal because it is reckless.

I don't think the parents should get a dime. I think the operators of the website should be facing charges for contributing to delinquency resulting in deaths and injuries.
 
2012-06-24 01:00:38 PM

Hand Banana: Sorry for your loss but your son did something stupid and got himself killed. No one made him do it and no one else is responsible. I know it is hard to accept that your perfect snowflake made a bad decision but that's just the way it is.


And this "snowflake" had grey hair, looks about 60 or so. Shoulda known better.
 
2012-06-24 01:02:20 PM

BarkingUnicorn: "49.3 mph, on a bike. How I find religion on Sunday morning," wrote Flint on June 6.

Well, he certainly found the afterlife part.


Ah, I seem to need a new keyboard now.
 
2012-06-24 01:03:40 PM
The premise is that the cyclist's behavior was encouraged by a social media site.

As an occasional visitor to Fark I have been:
- encouraged to drink beer,
- suggested to do anatomically impossible things of a personal nature,
- have faith in Obama
and do other reckless, wasteful or foolish things.

Does Fark have a form to start the litigation rolling?
 
2012-06-24 01:04:02 PM
No one else is to blame but himself. I used to ride my bike like an idiot when I was a kid, no helmet or safety gear of any kind, out on the two lane highway flying down steep hills as fast as I could go. If the bike had a mechanical failure or I had lost control they would have been scraping me off the road for a mile but it would have been my fault. At least I had youth to blame for my stupidity; this guy was 40 years old.
 
2012-06-24 01:06:42 PM
Websites shouldn't need a disclaimer. This guy knew what he was doing, but because of his stupidity I'm going to have to click through some disclaimer message on every website I visit from now on.
 
2012-06-24 01:06:47 PM
The best memorial you can have to honor your dead child is a failed lawsuit due to his own personal negligence.
 
2012-06-24 01:08:33 PM
The guy was riding past the speed limit in the wrong lane. His family should be ridiculed for filing a lawsuit blaming a website for his accident.

/also agree the website should be criminally charged for inciting illegal behaviour.
 
2012-06-24 01:09:17 PM
sounds like florida
 
2012-06-24 01:09:52 PM
Hos is the reason my car club monitors our website amd events for promotion of unsafe behavior. Stupid is as stupid does. Then someone sues
 
2012-06-24 01:11:10 PM

ozebb: I certainly wouldn't argue with the assertion that this idiot is entirely at fault for his own behavior but in a sense his parents may have a bit of a point: Our cycling culture here in the United States is pretty farked up. Our bicycle policy and bicycle education seems to be inadequate and/or inconsistent with safe cycling on public roadways. As a result, cyclists often seem to pick and choose which laws apply to them.

I practice Vehicular Cycling on public roads with the intent of interacting in a predictable and logical fashion with other traffic. If you decide the laws and customs dictating behavior on public roads don't apply to you and scream down a hill at well over the speed limit in the wrong lane... well, you deserve what you get. But we should think as a country about adopting a system for cyclists that would properly ingrain a positive interaction between cyclists and other road users.


A rational post about biking? On my Fark? I see the same thing, of bicyclists choosing what rules are convenient. I didn't know Vehicular Cycling was a thing, but this is essentially what I do. Act predictably, and everyone will get home in one piece. It frustrates me when I act predictably and the cars around me don't. Bad bicyclists have left drivers not knowing what to expect, and that makes biking more dangerous for all of us.
 
2012-06-24 01:11:49 PM
jltthorson: Does Fark have a form to start the litigation trolling?

just get involved in copyright law
 
2012-06-24 01:11:58 PM

SilentStrider: Is it Obama's?

I bet its Obama's fault.


And if you ask him, he'll blame Bush.
 
2012-06-24 01:12:14 PM
Darn bicycles should stay on the sidewalks. or bike paths.Just off the streets.
 
2012-06-24 01:14:01 PM
So dude's parents read about how this website contributed to another person's death and decided to sue.
Of course the other person who died was some old greyhair who got hit by a cyclist doing the EXACT SAME THING their son was. Sounds to me like instead of them having grounds to sue the website, the owner of the car their son hit would have grounds to sue his estate for putting a dent in the bumper.
 
2012-06-24 01:14:41 PM
To be fair, he wasn't really old enough to understand the risks of riding a bike on the street. I mean, come on, 40 is the new 11.
 
2012-06-24 01:14:41 PM
What, the suit doesn't name Garmin nor the US Military for enabing GPS? He'd be alive today if GPS were unavailable to idiots.
 
2012-06-24 01:15:05 PM

Russ1642: Websites shouldn't need a disclaimer. This guy knew what he was doing, but because of his stupidity I'm going to have to click through some disclaimer message on every website I visit from now on.


What if a passenger in the car that hit Flint was seriously injured?

Would you say the passenger should go after:

a) The driver
b) Flint
c) Strava who "rewards" cyclists for committing illegal acts
d) City of Berkeley
e) Trek (or manufacturer of bicycle)

e) Some combination of above
 
2012-06-24 01:16:22 PM

Lord Ranken: sounds like florida


No hills in Florida, best you can get is number of gators avoided
 
2012-06-24 01:18:53 PM
At first I thought "Oh no another one of 'those' lawsuits" but after reading the article the parents have a point. Awarding prizes for the fastest time down a city street is just stupid.
 
2012-06-24 01:21:56 PM
debunktionjunction.net
 
2012-06-24 01:22:02 PM
i.imgur.com
 
2012-06-24 01:25:04 PM

ozebb: Our bicycle policy and bicycle education seems to be inadequate and/or inconsistent with safe cycling on public roadways. As a result, cyclists often seem to pick and choose which laws apply to them.


You could say the exact same thing about our motor vehicle education and motor vehicle operators.
 
2012-06-24 01:28:37 PM
Infospigot

A pretty interesting discussion amongst various authors of articles about Kim, and including comments from Kim's acquaintances.
 
2012-06-24 01:30:35 PM

Great Justice: To be fair, the website has a feature to award participants for committing illegal acts. The act, breaking the speed limit, is illegal because it is reckless.

I don't think the parents should get a dime. I think the operators of the website should be facing charges for contributing to delinquency resulting in deaths and injuries.


Imagine if this were for cars and drag racers were competiting for the top speeds on public roads: it wouldn't last a second.

I also agree the parents shouldn't recieve of a dime. The person whos car he hit should be receiving money for damages and the trauma of having a human hurled at their windshield.
In fact anytime a cyclist is in a accident, having a profile on strava or whatever should be defcto grounds for being at fault, and potentially face felony chargs for drag racing just as if they were in a street race in a car.
 
2012-06-24 01:30:56 PM
The guy with the most money who was only peripherally involved.

//DNRTFA
//what do I win?
 
2012-06-24 01:32:13 PM

ozebb: Our bicycle policy and bicycle education seems to be inadequate and/or inconsistent with safe cycling on public roadways. As a result, cyclists often seem to pick and choose which laws apply to them.


Blah, blah, blah you can't fix stupid blah, blah, blah
 
2012-06-24 01:32:53 PM

ozebb: I certainly wouldn't argue with the assertion that this idiot is entirely at fault for his own behavior but in a sense his parents may have a bit of a point: Our cycling culture here in the United States is pretty farked up. Our bicycle policy and bicycle education seems to be inadequate and/or inconsistent with safe cycling on public roadways. As a result, cyclists often seem to pick and choose which laws apply to them.

I practice Vehicular Cycling on public roads with the intent of interacting in a predictable and logical fashion with other traffic. If you decide the laws and customs dictating behavior on public roads don't apply to you and scream down a hill at well over the speed limit in the wrong lane... well, you deserve what you get. But we should think as a country about adopting a system for cyclists that would properly ingrain a positive interaction between cyclists and other road users.


Good comment but bicyclists are already supposed to obey traffic laws... period. If I exceed the speed limit in my car or on my motorcycle, I may well get a ticket and if I do it enough, lose my driving privileges. IMHO if bicyclists are going to share the road, like any other driver and vehicle, they should have to be licensed, trained, insured, and expected to follow all the laws or pay the penalty. That is an easily adopted "system" though I can already hear the howls of outrage my opinion will bring from the cycling community.
 
2012-06-24 01:33:08 PM

SilentStrider: Is it Obama's?

I bet its Obama's fault.


Probably his white privileged half
 
2012-06-24 01:34:13 PM
I love these stupid douche bag bikers die stories....More Please
 
2012-06-24 01:34:50 PM

Hand Banana: Sorry for your loss but your son did something stupid and got himself killed. No one made him do it and no one else is responsible. I know it is hard to accept that your perfect snowflake made a bad decision but that's just the way it is.


Website counter sues parents for raising such a dumbass. Website awarded 9 million dollars.
Parents complain that it wasnt their fault that they did such a bad job raising their snowflake.
 
2012-06-24 01:36:58 PM

tgo123: I love these stupid douche bag bikers die stories....More Please


I seriously think about hitting cyclists flying down one way streets the wrong way in downtown chicago. but then I remember that it would cost a lot to repaint my car.

plus the lawsuits from the family ... shudder

/seriously, it should be legal and required that you hit these people
/why yes, I am a responsible cyclist when I am not driving or walking, why would you assume that all cyclists are complete assholes?
 
2012-06-24 01:40:53 PM

9Speed: ozebb: Our bicycle policy and bicycle education seems to be inadequate and/or inconsistent with safe cycling on public roadways. As a result, cyclists often seem to pick and choose which laws apply to them.

You could say the exact same thing about our motor vehicle education and motor vehicle operators.


True that, people are going to do stupid shiat no matter what.

One point I'd offer is that motor vehicle operators aren't offered two systems (roadway vs. segregated facilities like bike paths and sidewalks) and conflicting information about what the rules are within those two different systems. Here in Colorado I see this all the time: cyclists get to act like pedestrians on bike paths and they then feel entitled to do so on roadways as well, riding wherever in the road they please with no consideration to logic, not signaling, not yielding right-of-way appropriately and so on and so forth. Things that would get a motor vehicle operator ticketed in a heartbeat.

As an avid cyclist, I'd love to see enforcement of traffic laws stepped up on cyclists as it's irritating and embarrassing and dangerous when cyclists do this sort of thing. Of course, this'd have to go hand in hand with some kind of education about road rules and the like. I'd even happily pay a few dollars and take a test for a bicycle license if it meant everybody else had to do so and be accountable for their errors as well.
 
2012-06-24 01:40:58 PM

Cyber_Junk: The guy was riding past the speed limit in the wrong lane. His family should be ridiculed for filing a lawsuit blaming a website for his accident.

/also agree the website should be criminally charged for inciting illegal behaviour.


Or the driver of the car should sue the guy's estate for mental anguish caused due to the accident, which he caused. Maybe the parents too, for raising such a moron.

/hate living in a litigious society
 
2012-06-24 01:50:51 PM

Cyber_Junk: /also agree the website should be criminally charged for inciting illegal behaviour.


Just like many, many car enthusiast sites?
 
2012-06-24 01:58:18 PM

ozebb: 9Speed: ozebb: Our bicycle policy and bicycle education seems to be inadequate and/or inconsistent with safe cycling on public roadways. As a result, cyclists often seem to pick and choose which laws apply to them.

You could say the exact same thing about our motor vehicle education and motor vehicle operators.

True that, people are going to do stupid shiat no matter what.

One point I'd offer is that motor vehicle operators aren't offered two systems (roadway vs. segregated facilities like bike paths and sidewalks) and conflicting information about what the rules are within those two different systems. Here in Colorado I see this all the time: cyclists get to act like pedestrians on bike paths and they then feel entitled to do so on roadways as well, riding wherever in the road they please with no consideration to logic, not signaling, not yielding right-of-way appropriately and so on and so forth. Things that would get a motor vehicle operator ticketed in a heartbeat.

As an avid cyclist, I'd love to see enforcement of traffic laws stepped up on cyclists as it's irritating and embarrassing and dangerous when cyclists do this sort of thing. Of course, this'd have to go hand in hand with some kind of education about road rules and the like. I'd even happily pay a few dollars and take a test for a bicycle license if it meant everybody else had to do so and be accountable for their errors as well.


As long as that few dollars is proportional to the cost of a motorcycle or regular drivers license I would be fine with that also. A bicycle does so much less damage to roadways and things they tend to crash into that it should be just a buck or two every like five years. I say it that way because I don't think the bicycle should be registered and insured like a car or motorcycle. They just don't tear up the infrastructure the way other vehicles do.
 
2012-06-24 02:03:37 PM
Obama. Definitely Obama.
 
2012-06-24 02:03:53 PM
it makes sense the grief-stricken parents want to pursue a lawsuit. hopefully when it's said and done the website won't be stuck with a million dollar lawyer tab. the parents will probably be very happy if the website ceases future time challenges on public venues. that's the bottom line - that this guy is the last to pay the price this way.

bike boy went out during a moment of sheer happiness. we should all be so lucky. i just hope to hell he wasn't wearing that ghey spandex. dammit i hate that so much.
 
2012-06-24 02:07:28 PM

StingerJ: A rational post about biking? On my Fark? I see the same thing, of bicyclists choosing what rules are convenient. I didn't know Vehicular Cycling was a thing, but this is essentially what I do. Act predictably, and everyone will get home in one piece. It frustrates me when I act predictably and the cars around me don't. Bad bicyclists have left drivers not knowing what to expect, and that makes biking more dangerous for all of us.


I think everyone pedaling is practicing "vehicular cycling." After all, 90% of the people in a car are absolutely terrible at it, so it only makes sense that 90% of cyclists are as well.

/Been hit a few times, would prefer not to be in the future, I do my best.
 
2012-06-24 02:08:04 PM
I'm just amused by people going for a King of the Mountain title for a downhill segments, the title is usually used for the fastest rider on uphill segments, ie fastest to the top of the mountain...
 
2012-06-24 02:12:34 PM
Meh, I'm conflicted.

Obviously the guy that died was responsible for his own decision, but the parents don't seem to be suing to gain fnancially from it, they just want to shut down a site that promotes dangerous behaviour. So, on the whole i1.ytimg.com

The questions isn't really about "who's fault it was" -cuz yeah, the guy made his choices- the question is more about "Should we intervene when we see a website that glorifies reckless behaviour" -unfortunataly in the legal system, the only way to get somebody to stop doing something is to sue. So yeah, if they were trying to get money, I'd say "fark them" , but if they just want to stop the site from essentially daring people to do stupid stuff, then let them go for it.
 
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