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(Arizona Star)   Border Patrol detains former Arizona governor as radiation risk   (azstarnet.com) divider line 38
    More: Interesting, Arizona Governor, Raul Castro, border patrol, National Center, border security, evils, Nogales, false positives  
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8944 clicks; posted to Main » on 23 Jun 2012 at 5:51 PM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2012-06-23 04:02:15 PM
Napolitano's persecuting her predecessors. Rose and Fife, RUN LIKE HELL. Jane Dee can get what's coming to her.
 
2012-06-23 05:59:05 PM
this is asinine. the whole procedure reeks of security theater. get out of car, be wanded, fill out paperwork, leave. well i feel safer.
 
2012-06-23 05:59:05 PM
They were doing their job...

You know what other group of bullies used that lame excuse?
 
2012-06-23 06:03:54 PM
Presumably he had a nuclear stress test the day before (or something similar).
Didn't he have some chit from the hospital?
 
2012-06-23 06:13:33 PM
Jesus Christ. The man is NINETY SIX years old, and the oldest living Governor for Chrissakes, and they made him sit in the heat.
 
2012-06-23 06:17:41 PM
FTFA "I'm not saying they're bad people," Doan said. "They were doing their job, but they weren't using their heads."

Pretty much sums up Government Employees.
 
2012-06-23 06:18:28 PM
He didn't know his hospital visit involved radiation? Really? Because they've gotten better about informing people "hey, you might trip some detectors".

As for this:

For Doan, it also showed the agents' inability to adequately accommodate frail people in the midsummer heat.

"I'm not saying they're bad people," Doan said. "They were doing their job, but they weren't using their heads."


No kidding. But you're important enough to make a story out of it. That was a mistake on their part.

My ex boyfriend made the stupid mistake of showing a US border guard (from Canada) his green card instead of his drivers license. Green cards are kind of hard to fake... but it didn't matter. We still had to wait an hour and a half while they tore apart the car. He had a cast up his entire leg (the trip was a "hey, you can finally get out of the freakin' bed, happy birthday" celebration). We were not allowed to sit. Good times.
 
2012-06-23 06:19:50 PM

Welfare Xmas: FTFA "I'm not saying they're bad people," Doan said. "They were doing their job, but they weren't using their heads."

Pretty much sums up Government Employees.


And if they paid for an air conditioned waiting room people would be up in arms about wasting money accommodating suspicious people who obviously must be guilty trying to sneak in the country blah blah blah.

There is a obvious reason they didn't let him wait in the car.
 
2012-06-23 06:24:30 PM
Good thing he wasn't black.
 
2012-06-23 06:26:07 PM
Why the hell are there checkpoints anyway?
 
2012-06-23 06:27:20 PM

StreetlightInTheGhetto: He didn't know his hospital visit involved radiation? Really? Because they've gotten better about informing people "hey, you might trip some detectors".


The man is ninety farking six years old. You tell us how much of his faculties are left at this advanced age.

With all the other things that this guy had to deal with, being radioactive is the least of his worries.
 
2012-06-23 06:30:25 PM

coco ebert: Why the hell are there checkpoints anyway?


So they can harass us all on our daily commutes several miles from the border while we drive the major American arteries.
 
2012-06-23 06:32:31 PM

coco ebert: Why the hell are there checkpoints anyway?


Why does the former governor of Arizona live in Nogales, Mexico? I'm guessing tax evader. Or possibly getting quack medical treatment he can't get here. Sorry, old fella, why should you get treated better than any other Mexican?
 
2012-06-23 06:34:36 PM
The guy is pretty interesting. Never heard of him until this story, so I looked him up.

Viva Mexican-Americans and other legal immigrants!

Notice he was a high-achiever because he learned English very quickly? This guy typifies the exact point I always try to make--America should not be supporting Spanish in this country through government forms and benefits programs or allow bilingual schools that de-emphasize learning English as quickly as possible.

The flip side is America should be offering ESL classes at community colleges for free. Some things really do need to be offered to the poor as a long-term investment for everyone.
 
2012-06-23 06:36:35 PM

StreetlightInTheGhetto: There is a obvious reason they didn't let him wait in the car.


Yes, there is an obvious reason that the Border Patrol doesn't let a 96 year old man sit in his air conditioned car when they know that 99.9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999 999999999999999999999999% of all these radiation detections involving the elderly have been medical procedures.

That obvious reason is criminal stupidity and zero tolerance policies.

But one day, there might be one elderly old guy with an a bomb up his ass, and then won't I be eating my words!
 
2012-06-23 06:38:11 PM

mbillips: coco ebert: Why the hell are there checkpoints anyway?

Why does the former governor of Arizona live in Nogales, Mexico? I'm guessing tax evader. Or possibly getting quack medical treatment he can't get here. Sorry, old fella, why should you get treated better than any other Mexican?


i.imgur.com
 
2012-06-23 06:42:57 PM
They really need an air-conditioned Madam Curie Rest Stop for this. When the UFOs start landing in force, those detectors will go off the scale.

It's so cool to hear of an AZ ex-governor who is not in jail. He must be a democrat.
 
2012-06-23 06:45:16 PM

RoyBatty: mbillips: coco ebert: Why the hell are there checkpoints anyway?

Why does the former governor of Arizona live in Nogales, Mexico? I'm guessing tax evader. Or possibly getting quack medical treatment he can't get here. Sorry, old fella, why should you get treated better than any other Mexican?

[i.imgur.com image 640x457]


This. He lives in Nogales Arizona. There is a checkpoint that stops all north-bound traffic on I-19 between Nogales AZ and Tucson. This wasn't at a border crossing.
 
2012-06-23 06:50:20 PM

Curious: this is asinine. the whole procedure reeks of security theater. get out of car, be wanded, fill out paperwork, leave. well i feel safer.


The "wanding" probably involved a GR135 or a Thermo Identifinder.

More than just a wand, it actually tells the user what the isotope "seen" was. Which was probably Thallium 201 if it was a cardiac stress test...

And good thing for preview, it wouldn't let me link to them...
 
2012-06-23 06:57:32 PM
I hope they checked in the trunk.

www.alexcox.com
 
2012-06-23 07:09:41 PM
blog.tmcnet.com
 
2012-06-23 07:30:47 PM
That doesn't sound particularly terrible. When you're sitting in the shade with a fan 97 F won't put you in any kind of danger to your health, 94 or otherwise. When the man dropped his wallet the BP officer offered to pick it up for him, they were polite, and they in no way exceeded reasonable investigation/containment procedure for the probable dose of radiation detected (barium imaging and a lot of the injectable imaging substances basically light you up like a christmas tree relative to background).

It's certainly worth complaining about check-points and so on when they present some sort of danger or are ineffective or based on an unreasonable fear, but this incident doesn't have any of those characteristics. I mean, you can derive from the story that the Border patrol should be given some portable AC units and an attached shack for when the temperature tops 100 F (i.e. is actually dangerous to the extremely elderly) but it's not legitimate to get a bug up your arse about this.

//The checkpoints across the southwest having radiation detectors has a lot more to do with unintentional contamination risks from the fact that 90% of our research with radioactive shiat is done there than national security, though the NS concerns being addressed is a nice bonus.
 
2012-06-23 07:38:45 PM
☢☢☢☢☢ Would glow again.
 
2012-06-23 07:44:26 PM
Surprised they didn't find Jan Brewer radioactive. That biatch is toxic!
 
2012-06-23 08:30:09 PM
Just another example of the CBP not being able to control our border AT THE BORDER. They never even travelled across the border, all travel within the boundries of our great nation, yet they were treated like illegal interlopers. The harrassment station near Tubac needs to be relocated just on the other side of the border to actually catch illegal activities coming from Mexico, not people travelling within its borders that are citizens. Tubac used to be a fun place to go and buy art and spend the day at the local establishments but now it is like going through checkpoint charlie so most everyone I know avoids going south now for entertainment and art purchases. Buy local and avoid the Gestapo!

This is a reply to the above post on local news site:

So you are favor of the checkpoint as long as it only inconveniences the lesser people who live south of tubac. I have always argued that if the check point was at exit 34,just south of tubac, you would not hear anything about the constitutionality of the questioning or militarization of the border. It comes down to money, merchants are afraid that the checkpoint will discourage the public from buying their "new age" hippie trinkets, so they are against the check point.

Approximately 50-60 agents are mustered out per shift from the Nogales Station, about 8-10 of those are assigned to the checkpoint. Most will be assigned to work line operations at the border. You cannot successfully have a single line of defense. You can ask any sports coach or military commander to verify this.

Policy states that the Canine handlers are always assigned to the checkpoint unless called to specific operations in the field so they are not available to "SECURE THE BORDER AT THE BORDER" or some other ridiculous philosophy garnered from a bumper sticker.

Can you understand how the Atascosa, Tummacacori and San Cayetano mountains funnel traffic north of Nogales in the Santa Cruz River Valley? Smugglers were using these routes long before the Border Patrol even existed, so no, it is not because of the recent change in strategy. Due to terrain features the Border on the west of Pena Blanca lake, near the city of Nogales, is impossible to patrol.

How about that somebody does not have to cross the line to be part of a smuggling operation? They can drive south from Tucson never cross the line, pick up a load of aliens or drugs, and then attempt to drive north again.

Terrain and road traffic, not politics dictated where the checkpoint would be located. I am sure the patrol would rather have taken over the rest area at exit 56(nort of current location) to monitor the traffic coming out of Mt. Hopkins and Arivaca, but they apparently were not allowed to.

The checkpoint on I-19 has a large shaded for the occupants of vehicles to sit under while they undergo further inspection. They do have large swamp coolers in the seating area. I cannot say if they were operable at that time but they are there.

The detector in primary only detects that radiation is PRESENT in the area. A secondary scan is used to identify the type of radiation present. The agents then have to call specialist with their findings and have it cleared through them. Mr. Castro was not allowed to sit in his own vehicle because the vehicle must be cleared that he is the only source of radiation emitting from it.

I wonder if complainer asked if there was a more climate controlled area for Mr. Castro to sit in? I doubt it, she probably fumed at the fact that the agents did not automatically bring him an air conditioner, comfy chair, and a cool drink. I am sure she dropped Mr. Castro's name to intimidate the agents into fudging the search and sending them on their way. She in fact used a 96 year old man as a ploy to move an inspection along and then later as a political ploy to get attention. I am sure dropping Mr. Castro's name in the city of Nogales gets you all kinds of perks, but alas it did not happen at the federal level.

I am not familiar with the nuclear medicine cards, are they a controlled item? Do they have a serial number that can be traced back to a particular patient and doctor? Are they standardized across the nation? Is the patient required to send them back after a specified period? If they do not return them are there sanctions? If not, the cards have no more weight than me writing "I got bit by a radioactive spider" on a purple post it note and handing it to the agent.

The procedures that the agents followed are not their "whims" or the flexing of "Muscle". They are hard set procedures sent down from Washington for the agent to carry out. They are in fact a pain with more reports to complete than you see on the side of the road.

And why do you think a personality type attracted to Border Patrol work over a city cop would want to stand on the highway and deal with the public for 8-9 hours a day? The answer is, they don't, they hate the checkpoint more than you do, but an assignment must be accomplished and they have been assigned to do it.

When they get off work guess what? They have to pass through the checkpoint too. But your only gripe is Border security prevents you from having a good time.
 
2012-06-23 08:55:01 PM
It's clear that old people should get to carry as much radiation as they want.
 
2012-06-23 09:26:26 PM

mbillips: coco ebert: Why the hell are there checkpoints anyway?

Why does the former governor of Arizona live in Nogales, Mexico? I'm guessing tax evader. Or possibly getting quack medical treatment he can't get here. Sorry, old fella, why should you get treated better than any other Mexican?


Maybe it's because he was born in Mexico in 1916. He moved to the U.S. in 1926 and is a U.S. citizen.
 
2012-06-23 10:05:26 PM
Who cares if it was the governor? The elderly are harassed by the TSA and other government monitors all the time. Nobody seems to care for more than a few hours unless it's a 1%'er and/or a government figure being mishandled.
 
2012-06-23 10:17:04 PM
So wait, is this the same Arizona that is so anti-immigrant they want the right to shoot people heading north from Nogales? The same Arizona that wants to be able to pre-emptively check people's IDs in case they're not Americans? The same Arizona that finds nothing wrong with detaining elderly illegal immigrants in tents at Sheriff Joe's Detention Camp for Brown People?

STFU already. This is what you wanted, and this is how it works. Deal with it.
 
2012-06-23 11:56:51 PM

mbillips: coco ebert: Why the hell are there checkpoints anyway?

Why does the former governor of Arizona live in Nogales, Mexico? I'm guessing tax evader. Or possibly getting quack medical treatment he can't get here. Sorry, old fella, why should you get treated better than any other Mexican?


To your knowledge there is not a Nogales Arizona. shiatHead!
 
2012-06-24 12:03:55 AM

Gyrfalcon: So wait, is this the same Arizona that is so anti-immigrant they want the right to shoot people heading north from Nogales? The same Arizona that wants to be able to pre-emptively check people's IDs in case they're not Americans? The same Arizona that finds nothing wrong with detaining elderly illegal immigrants in tents at Sheriff Joe's Detention Camp for Brown People?

STFU already. This is what you wanted, and this is how it works. Deal with it.


I suggest you read 1070 again!
 
2012-06-24 12:24:00 AM

Curious: this is asinine. the whole procedure reeks of security theater. get out of car, be wanded, fill out paperwork, leave. well i feel safer.


Yeah, when my wife tripped a radiation detector in the airport in Shanghai I felt it was total theater. It was purely talk and paperwork. No wand, no attempt to figure out what was hot--5 minutes and we were on our way. I was actually surprised as their approach to security is usually a lot more sensible than ours.

Note that two US airports didn't detect her despite her being a lot hotter.

Tillmaster: Presumably he had a nuclear stress test the day before (or something similar).
Didn't he have some chit from the hospital?


Strangely enough they only give them if you ask--and it took something like 20 minutes in our case. (And then my wife changed jackets and left the card at home!)

RoyBatty: StreetlightInTheGhetto: There is a obvious reason they didn't let him wait in the car.

Yes, there is an obvious reason that the Border Patrol doesn't let a 96 year old man sit in his air conditioned car when they know that 99.9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999 999999999999999999999999% of all these radiation detections involving the elderly have been medical procedures.

That obvious reason is criminal stupidity and zero tolerance policies.

But one day, there might be one elderly old guy with an a bomb up his ass, and then won't I be eating my words!


Only the elderly? AFIAK they have never caught a person smuggling hot stuff, period. (There have been detections but in cargo, not on people.)

Jim_Callahan: That doesn't sound particularly terrible. When you're sitting in the shade with a fan 97 F won't put you in any kind of danger to your health, 94 or otherwise. When the man dropped his wallet the BP officer offered to pick it up for him, they were polite, and they in no way exceeded reasonable investigation/containment procedure for the probable dose of radiation detected (barium imaging and a lot of the injectable imaging substances basically light you up like a christmas tree relative to background).


Unless you don't perspire enough.

The_Dread_Pirate_Westley: I am not familiar with the nuclear medicine cards, are they a controlled item? Do they have a serial number that can be traced back to a particular patient and doctor? Are they standardized across the nation? Is the patient required to send them back after a specified period? If they do not return them are there sanctions? If not, the cards have no more weight than me writing "I got bit by a radioactive spider" on a purple post it note and handing it to the agent.


No tracking but they do contain information about the lab. There's no reason to return them--they say what you got *WHEN*--an old card proves nothing. The card from my wife's heart test is probably still around here but it's 3 years old and the primary isotope they used has a half-life of 8 hours. Admittedly they don't have security features but they don't really need them. Any question, you dial the lab and ask.
 
2012-06-24 12:39:29 AM

Linkster: Gyrfalcon: So wait, is this the same Arizona that is so anti-immigrant they want the right to shoot people heading north from Nogales? The same Arizona that wants to be able to pre-emptively check people's IDs in case they're not Americans? The same Arizona that finds nothing wrong with detaining elderly illegal immigrants in tents at Sheriff Joe's Detention Camp for Brown People?

STFU already. This is what you wanted, and this is how it works. Deal with it.

I suggest you read 1070 again!


They wanted to be protected from illegal immigrants. Part of that means zealous Border Patrol agents scrutinizing everyone who comes over the border. If that means aged ex-Governors have to sit in a hot tent while they make sure he's not some evil Messican ter'rist smuggling a dirty bomb over the border, then that's what is going to happen.
 
2012-06-24 02:29:14 AM

Gyrfalcon: Linkster: Gyrfalcon: So wait, is this the same Arizona that is so anti-immigrant they want the right to shoot people heading north from Nogales? The same Arizona that wants to be able to pre-emptively check people's IDs in case they're not Americans? The same Arizona that finds nothing wrong with detaining elderly illegal immigrants in tents at Sheriff Joe's Detention Camp for Brown People?

STFU already. This is what you wanted, and this is how it works. Deal with it.

I suggest you read 1070 again!

They wanted to be protected from illegal immigrants. Part of that means zealous Border Patrol agents scrutinizing everyone who comes over the border. If that means aged ex-Governors have to sit in a hot tent while they make sure he's not some evil Messican ter'rist smuggling a dirty bomb over the border, then that's what is going to happen.


I'm not defending 1070 (actually I like 1070, because it might piss off enough people like you to get some real immigration reform, but that's for another thread) , but a checkpoint on a major interstate well away from the border (and they are all over, not just 1-19) is not the border protection most of the isolationists around here want. They want a sealed border and to go about their business freely. Also, not all of us in this state hate Mexicans, I hope you were sitting down for that, take a breather on that bombshell. Maricopa County holds most the votes and they are the most vocal. They dictate sh*t to the rest of the state and cry to the feds about border issues they never experience. Dislike the appropriate people, please.
 
2012-06-24 06:48:10 AM
FTFA: For Doan, it also showed the agents' inability to adequately accommodate frail people in the midsummer heat.

For me, it also, once again, showed "authority's" inability to figure out what is really going on and make an appropriate, or any, decision.
 
2012-06-24 10:20:53 AM

StreetlightInTheGhetto: He didn't know his hospital visit involved radiation? Really? Because they've gotten better about informing people "hey, you might trip some detectors".

As for this:

For Doan, it also showed the agents' inability to adequately accommodate frail people in the midsummer heat.

"I'm not saying they're bad people," Doan said. "They were doing their job, but they weren't using their heads."

No kidding. But you're important enough to make a story out of it. That was a mistake on their part.

My ex boyfriend made the stupid mistake of showing a US border guard (from Canada) his green card instead of his drivers license. Green cards are kind of hard to fake... but it didn't matter. We still had to wait an hour and a half while they tore apart the car. He had a cast up his entire leg (the trip was a "hey, you can finally get out of the freakin' bed, happy birthday" celebration). We were not allowed to sit. Good times.


A US Border guard (from Canada?) Were you coming into the US or going into Canada?
 
2012-06-24 08:49:46 PM

fickenchucker: The guy is pretty interesting. Never heard of him until this story, so I looked him up.

Viva Mexican-Americans and other legal immigrants!

Notice he was a high-achiever because he learned English very quickly? This guy typifies the exact point I always try to make--America should not be supporting Spanish in this country through government forms and benefits programs or allow bilingual schools that de-emphasize learning English as quickly as possible.

The flip side is America should be offering ESL classes at community colleges for free. Some things really do need to be offered to the poor as a long-term investment for everyone.


Our local bilingual school is half native English speakers and half native Spanish. Same with the classes: half are run in English and half in Spanish. Seems to work really well.

Shockingly, the real problem is putting all the non-native speakers in with only other non-native speakers and expecting them to do anything other than speak their mother tongue all day long (with the exception of the three times the teacher calls on them).
 
2012-06-25 01:54:34 PM

Skirl Hutsenreiter: fickenchucker: The guy is pretty interesting. Never heard of him until this story, so I looked him up.

Viva Mexican-Americans and other legal immigrants!

Notice he was a high-achiever because he learned English very quickly? This guy typifies the exact point I always try to make--America should not be supporting Spanish in this country through government forms and benefits programs or allow bilingual schools that de-emphasize learning English as quickly as possible.

The flip side is America should be offering ESL classes at community colleges for free. Some things really do need to be offered to the poor as a long-term investment for everyone.

-----------

Our local bilingual school is half native English speakers and half native Spanish. Same with the classes: half are run in English and half in Spanish. Seems to work really well.

Shockingly, the real problem is putting all the non-native speakers in with only other non-native speakers and expecting them to do anything other than speak their mother tongue all day long (with the exception of the three times the teacher calls on them).



Sounds good to me. Both sets of kids will have so many job opportunities open to them.
 
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