alywa: Does it increase my enjoyment of driving and taking road trips?

Like the vast majority of people, my car is used almost exclusively for commuting and relatively short trips to areas in the vicinity of my abode. I don't feel particularly compelled to spend several thousand dollars extra to be mollycoddled for my relatively small trips each day. If I were routinely driving hundreds of miles, that might be different, but that's not a common use case. On top of that, I view the primary purpose of my vehicle as "driving", not operating as a functional mobile office. I would rather spend any extra money I spend on upgrade on upgrading things that improve the primary function of the vehicle. For example, in most cases I'd prefer a more powerful motor or better handling or better safety features over, say, navigation.

If you want to spend that much money decking something out that you spend mostly brief stints in, that's fine, but it should hardly be surprising that most of us don't. Frankly, as a tech guy, I'm with the onion-wearers. Most of the electronic whizbang gizmos that go into these modern cars are silly, pointless, and add unneeded cost and complexity for a questionable increase in value. If I can save three grand by dropping some flashy touch screen option, there's no question I'm going to because I just think it's silly to have that in a vehicle I spend mostly driving to and from work in.

odinsposse: The smartest car company is the first one that will realize it will be easier to just have a spot to simply hook your tablet/smartphone to the dash than it is to install expensive propriety systems that do essentially the same thing.

General Motors

Link

I'm pretty happy with the electronics in my 2012 Veloster. However, since it's brand new I'd expect everything to work, hoping that stays the case in the future. The only concern I have is that it has to "boot up" when you start the car.

In my experience things that "boot up" also tend to eventually crash...

Babwa Wawa: odinsposse: The smartest car company is the first one that will realize it will be easier to just have a spot to simply hook your tablet/smartphone to the dash than it is to install expensive propriety systems that do essentially the same thing.

I've seen that in some Nissans - instead of Satnav they had a port for a Garmin. You could buy a Garmin with the car (didn't even mark it up, in fact). Don't know if they do that anymore.

Automakers do stupid stuff with tech. Any other company in the world who wanted to put a GPS in a car would go to a successful GPS manufacturer, like Garmin or TomTom, right? Not the automakers. Kenwood made the GPS in my Subaru, I guess because they're soo darned good at consumer electronics (or possibly the Kenwood rep at Subaru is really good at tickling the balls of the various folks at Subaru)..


Renault has been selling cars integrated with tomtoms for years.

the US spec Fiat 500 is available with integrated TomToms. Mazda is offering them now as well.

I have a 2008 Fusion with Sync, and I really enjoy it. I drive a lot, so the bluetooth definitely comes in handy. I hate talking on my cell while driving, but at least if I have to make or take a call, I can do it hands-free. I wonder more about the cars that will detect if you're drifting into another lane, etc. Does *that* kind of technology make people lazy drivers?

the telematics system in BMW/Mini is only compatible with the current generation of iPhones

have an older iPhone? you are SOL

next generation of iPhones? completely unknown, you might be SOL if you upgrade.

the other fun feature of the BMW/Mini system is that the Facebook/Twitter functionality is active all the time. Other manufacturers have an automatic cut off when the car is in motion, but not BMW.

dumbobruni: the other fun feature of the BMW/Mini system is that the Facebook/Twitter functionality is active all the time. Other manufacturers have an automatic cut off when the car is in motion, but not BMW.

Why on Earth would a car have Facebook and Twitter capabilities ?

padraig: Why on Earth would a car have Facebook and Twitter capabilities ?

Hopefully to compile evidence for when they die in a massive fireball while twittering/facebooking. I hope it also auto-uploads the crash video to youtube.

This happens in every car thread on Fark. Here is the ideal Farker car:

- Hatchback(Sports cars and SUVs = small penis. Nothing else can fit their entire band's instruments in the trunk.)
- FWD(4WD is for people who can't drive in the snow as well as Farkers. RWD is for sports cars, which are bad)
- No options(Luxury features increase weight thereby decreasing precious MPG. Navs are for people too dumb to drive. Farkers have a supernatural sense of direction.)
- 40+ MPG(Anyone who drives a car that gets less is an asshole.)
- Simple bodywork/rims(16" rims or bigger = small penis)
- Under 200HP(That's all a Farker needs to get to work sensibly. Everyone with more is a crazy asshole who passes the Farker on the highway)
- Not a Prius(Seeing as this fits every criteria a Farker wants, the Prius hatred is unexplainable)

Then, some guy comes in and talks about how his car is fun on the track and everyone makes fun of his penis. And so it goes.

ericbo84: Which is why I bought a car that's a car. It's fun to drive, it's mechanical, I don't feel like I'm driving a computer. I don't have hands-free crap. I have a cd player, power windows / doors, and that's about it. I don't want bluetooth integration, a touchscreen, in-dash GPS, hands-free anything... the 6 buttons on my steering wheel are good enough for me.
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Hella fun to drive as well with good gas mileage.

Ha, that is still to techy for me. I bought a new car with a radio, manual doors and windows, and no button on my steering wheel. Screw your electronic gadgets.

Bleyo: This happens in every car thread on Fark. Here is the ideal Farker car:

- Hatchback(Sports cars and SUVs = small penis. Nothing else can fit their entire band's instruments in the trunk.)
- FWD(4WD is for people who can't drive in the snow as well as Farkers. RWD is for sports cars, which are bad)
- No options(Luxury features increase weight thereby decreasing precious MPG. Navs are for people too dumb to drive. Farkers have a supernatural sense of direction.)
- 40+ MPG(Anyone who drives a car that gets less is an asshole.)
- Simple bodywork/rims(16" rims or bigger = small penis)
- Under 200HP(That's all a Farker needs to get to work sensibly. Everyone with more is a crazy asshole who passes the Farker on the highway)
- Not a Prius(Seeing as this fits every criteria a Farker wants, the Prius hatred is unexplainable)

Then, some guy comes in and talks about how his car is fun on the track and everyone makes fun of his penis. And so it goes.

Meh. I got a Wrangler. It's simple as hell, 4WD, shiat gas mileage, but fun as hell to drive.
I wanted simple, capable, and fun. Of course I also don't need to commute to work everyday.

Bleyo: This happens in every car thread on Fark. Here is the ideal Farker car:

- Hatchback(Sports cars and SUVs = small penis. Nothing else can fit their entire band's instruments in the trunk.)
- FWD(4WD is for people who can't drive in the snow as well as Farkers. RWD is for sports cars, which are bad)
- No options(Luxury features increase weight thereby decreasing precious MPG. Navs are for people too dumb to drive. Farkers have a supernatural sense of direction.)
- 40+ MPG(Anyone who drives a car that gets less is an asshole.)
- Simple bodywork/rims(16" rims or bigger = small penis)
- Under 200HP(That's all a Farker needs to get to work sensibly. Everyone with more is a crazy asshole who passes the Farker on the highway)
- Not a Prius(Seeing as this fits every criteria a Farker wants, the Prius hatred is unexplainable)

Then, some guy comes in and talks about how his car is fun on the track and everyone makes fun of his penis. And so it goes.

I don't understand the Prius or most hybrid hate, but I bought my 05 Cobalt in 06 because it got decent gas mileage and was really cheap for a new car. You can't hardly beat $9995 for a new car, pay it off in three years and then have a cheap go box that you don't care if some asshole scratches, dings, or generally farks up.

Bleyo: This happens in every car thread on Fark. Here is the ideal Farker car:

- Hatchback(Sports cars and SUVs = small penis. Nothing else can fit their entire band's instruments in the trunk.)
- FWD(4WD is for people who can't drive in the snow as well as Farkers. RWD is for sports cars, which are bad)
- No options(Luxury features increase weight thereby decreasing precious MPG. Navs are for people too dumb to drive. Farkers have a supernatural sense of direction.)
- 40+ MPG(Anyone who drives a car that gets less is an asshole.)
- Simple bodywork/rims(16" rims or bigger = small penis)
- Under 200HP(That's all a Farker needs to get to work sensibly. Everyone with more is a crazy asshole who passes the Farker on the highway)
- Not a Prius(Seeing as this fits every criteria a Farker wants, the Prius hatred is unexplainable)

Then, some guy comes in and talks about how his car is fun on the track and everyone makes fun of his penis. And so it goes.

my ideal car is a lamborghini aventador

If it wasn't for the POS radio in my van, it would be perfect. Sound 'quality' is worse than the $10 radio I had in a Datsun B110 thirty years ago.

Tellingthem: ericbo84: Which is why I bought a car that's a car. It's fun to drive, it's mechanical, I don't feel like I'm driving a computer. I don't have hands-free crap. I have a cd player, power windows / doors, and that's about it. I don't want bluetooth integration, a touchscreen, in-dash GPS, hands-free anything... the 6 buttons on my steering wheel are good enough for me.
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Hella fun to drive as well with good gas mileage.

I have three entire requirements on a car. Manual shifter, good stereo (cd or mp3), AC (rarely use it but it comes in handy) I don't need anything else.

Ppfftt...if you can hear the sound system over the sound of the engine, you're not driving a car worth driving.

My problem is the ridiculous price automakers charge for the electronics, and then often bundle them in to even more expensive packages. You want Sync in that Ford? Sorry, that's only available in the Premium package, that'll be $4K.

Aftermarket, these things are a fraction of the cost. Current car, I removed the awful stock stereo, bought a nice touchscreen off of Amazon. Bluetooth, sat radio, nav, takes USBs, etc. About a third of the cost automakers charge.

padraig: dumbobruni: the other fun feature of the BMW/Mini system is that the Facebook/Twitter functionality is active all the time. Other manufacturers have an automatic cut off when the car is in motion, but not BMW.

Why on Earth would a car have Facebook and Twitter capabilities ?

OMG, almst hit dat pRsN xing d st LOL!

Consumer Reports actually lowers their test scores on cars that don't have actual buttons to operate things like the radio and climate control (as opposed to just a touch screen or joystick thingy). They consider it a safety issue, and I agree. Having to take your eyes off the road to go through a series of menus on a touch screen with no tactical feedback just to change the radio station or temperature on the A/C is a really piss poor design.

You all sound poor.

I have a 2009 Ford Fusion with the Microsoft Sync technology. Because I'm in sales, I spend a LOT of time behind the windshield, and i can say that it is one of the most useful tools that I have. The system automatically downloads my entire addressbook from my Blackberry, which is sync'ed with Outlook. In short, I can voicedial anyone that I've ever contacted while never taking my eyes off the road.

In addition, I can connect my iPod and call up any song, artist or genre from my 9000 item library without having to fool with a dial or the iPod itself.

I've had virtually no issues with any of the vehicle automation, so I really don't see what all of the fuss is about.

alywa: Yeah, I know it is cool to be all minimalist and such on Fark, but y'all sound like you need your onions changed out on your belts.

I absolutely will not buy a car without Nav, bluetooth phone integration, excellent iPod / iPhone integration for music, satellite radio, etc. If it is an SUV, it has to have rear-seat entertainment for the kids. Does it add extra cost and complexity to the vehicle? Yep. Does it increase my enjoyment of driving and taking road trips? Immensely.

Yes, my smartphone does many of these things too, but the screen is small, it kills battery life to use the nav feature for very long, and I can't freaking stand having wires and windshield mounts in my otherwise beautiful and pristine cockpit. Plus, the bluetooth phone control is pretty much necessary for safety (and legality in many states)... yeah, one could simply not use their phone in the car, but in my profession that simply isn't a choice unless I want to pull over all the time if I'm on call.

What I really want to see is for automakers to work with Apple, Google, and MS to come up with a common protocol where the phone can act as the primary computer for the car, and the displays pretty much be dummy displays for the maps, entertainment, communications, etc. Phones are easy and cheap to change out, the complex systems in cars aren't.

Or it could be that most of us already have alternative and better products that aren't proprietary technology which is expensive to replace and impossible to upgrade? Most of the stuff you mention can be replicated for 300$ and the replication will also be mobile tech you can take in your pocket or out of the car.

Mister Peejay: scanman61: Ah yes...the "because we can" crap.. The useless stuff they cram into a car "because we can" or because some focus group said "Yes, I'd buy a car with a bidet in the driver's seat."

"Psst. Hey Audi. Guess what I got. Want this in your next model?"
"Psst. Hey BMW. Guess what I just sold to Audi. I got something better in the pipeline, you want in?"
"Psst. Hey Mercedes. BMW is getting *this* next year, but I have something more sophisticated coming up."
"Psst. Hey Audi..."

And then the magazines expect this crap, and downplay a car that isn't loaded with it. "This radio is archaic, it uses knobs and stuff!" (C&D is refreshing in this regard - they whip pointless crap mercilessly)

The problem with this kind of feature creep is that the carmakers are using more and more distributed processing in their systems. There isn't a "audio module" or "HVAC module" anymore, these system functions may be controlled by 4 or 5 different nodes. The carmakers are also starting to obsolete replacement parts much quicker...some cases as little as six years.

Don't be surprised when that "fully featured" car you bought this year cannot be repaired in 2020 because the module you need cannot be found.

Oh, you. You think they're waiting seven years to obsolete parts. There are plenty cases where you can't get parts for brand-new cars. (Not counting orphan cars like SAAB!)

And, in the name of theft deterrence, most of these modules have the VIN hard-coded the first time they are connected, and won't work in another vehicle. A good idea, but it means you can't hit up a junkyard for recycled parts.

You sound like someone familiar with the Right to Repair movement.

;-)

So far today I've used our shop's IDS, Tech2 and Techstream...because I HAD to...and people wonder why we charge so much for diagnostics.

ChrisDe: As someone that is currently car shopping, the technology is getting to be too much. And too expensive.

Same here.
All I want is a built in USB port for whatever phone I have. The rest is overkill IMO.

I rented a Camry with a horrible in-dash system. Labels often didn't show up and the first time I tried to make a call it showed "Please enter a number:" with no way to actually enter a number. It worked the second time. The tire pressure screen didn't ever label the tires.

You sound like someone familiar with the Right to Repair movement.

;-)

So far today I've used our shop's IDS, Tech2 and Techstream...because I HAD to...and people wonder why we charge so much for diagnostics.

This. I'm terrified of repairing someday the fancy dual auto hvac system in my '08 GMC Sierra, but it is nothing short of amazing
/and the L76 engine is great

angry_scientist: You sound like someone familiar with the Right to Repair movement.

;-)

So far today I've used our shop's IDS, Tech2 and Techstream...because I HAD to...and people wonder why we charge so much for diagnostics.

This. I'm terrified of repairing someday the fancy dual auto hvac system in my '08 GMC Sierra, but it is nothing short of amazing
/and the L76 engine is great

Oh, lots of shops have a Tech2...you'll always be able to get a GM fixed.

Now if you're talking Nissan or Mitsubishi or Subaru or any of the other less "repair friendly" makes then all those "because we can" systems are going to be sending you back to the dealership.

Bleyo: This happens in every car thread on Fark. Here is the ideal Farker car:

- Hatchback(Sports cars and SUVs = small penis. Nothing else can fit their entire band's instruments in the trunk.)
- FWD(4WD is for people who can't drive in the snow as well as Farkers. RWD is for sports cars, which are bad)
- No options(Luxury features increase weight thereby decreasing precious MPG. Navs are for people too dumb to drive. Farkers have a supernatural sense of direction.)
- 40+ MPG(Anyone who drives a car that gets less is an asshole.)
- Simple bodywork/rims(16" rims or bigger = small penis)
- Under 200HP(That's all a Farker needs to get to work sensibly. Everyone with more is a crazy asshole who passes the Farker on the highway)
- Not a Prius(Seeing as this fits every criteria a Farker wants, the Prius hatred is unexplainable)

Then, some guy comes in and talks about how his car is fun on the track and everyone makes fun of his penis. And so it goes.

Eh, Sonic is close enough for me.
Love that lil thing, surprisingly fun to drive.

Mister Peejay: hoihoi8: The more features you have, the more features that will break.

Bear this in mind when buying used cars.

It's sad and funny to see people buy, say, a used minivan. "but the SuperDeluxeXL was only $1000 more!" And within a year, half of that fancy crap isn't working because you squeaked into something that is expensive to maintain.

It's usually babymommas who do this, too. Not that there's a correlation relating to impulsive behavior and not thinking decisions through, or anything.

I'm still amazed at how quickly the different levels of the current Honda Odyssey jumps up in price. I walked into one dealership looking for their base "LX" model: they were plactically insulted when i wasn't interested in the $45,000 loaded-to-the-gills "Touring" model.

I recently upgraded from a 2001 Hyundai Accent. It was automatic with AC, but that was it. Basic transport. I thought I didn't care about anything else.

Then I got our 2009 Nissan Rouge with Bluetooth, power everything, good stereo, moon roof, etc. I will never go back. Basic transportation sucks balls.

I have three entire requirements on a car. Manual shifter, good stereo (cd or mp3), AC (rarely use it but it comes in handy) I don't need anything else.

no seats and steering wheel?

I drive in a big city and park out in the street, so I prefer the base-model stereos to keep things incognito. But what I will do is put in good speakers and an amplifier, but keep the stock speaker grilles so you can't tell unless you're listening to it.

A nav system is absolutely essential here, though I find that the more I drive the more I have the local streets memorized and thus the less I need it. But absolutely nothing built-in - not even a bracket, since I don't want someone to see it and smash my window thinking I may have hid it in the console or glove box. A smartphone with a navigation app and a suction cup mount are a good choice for this sort of thing.

I drive about 55 miles per day. By far, the most enjoyable and useful electronic gizmo in my car (a 2010 Altima 6-banger) is the USB smartphone/iPod interface. It displays the track info on the dashboard LCD, lets me control all the functions using the stereo controls on the dash or on the wheel, plus hands-free speaker phone functionality and voice-command dialing. All while hiding the phone in the center console.

I pity the fools who have to deal with commercial radio, CDs and bluetooth earpieces.

/loves me some highway music

I just hook my smartphone up ($30 a month/unlimited data T-Mobile prepaid) with an aux cable to my $60 Kenwood stereo in my beater '98 Sentra (or 200sx if ya want to get technical) and can stream Pandora forever, and can get navigation with Google maps. What else could you possibly need to do in a car when it comes to "electronics". Until the cars drive themselves, being on the highway isn't a good time to be posting Facebook updates or catching up on that TV show.

\Father pays for XM radio every month..don't understand why. Can't skip songs, can't choose specific artists, sounds about the same quality as the piped-in Muzak at the supermarket.

Magorn: ericbo84: Which is why I bought a car that's a car. It's fun to drive, it's mechanical, I don't feel like I'm driving a computer. I don't have hands-free crap. I have a cd player, power windows / doors, and that's about it. I don't want bluetooth integration, a touchscreen, in-dash GPS, hands-free anything... the 6 buttons on my steering wheel are good enough for me.
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Hella fun to drive as well with good gas mileage.

My first car was a used 1983 Nissan Sentra, it had a manual transmission, no power steering, and no AC, which, as my dad pointed out at the time, meant I would never have to peplace the AC compressor, the Power steering pump or hoses, or anything but the clutch on the transmission

Yeah if anything goes wrong with my A/C I don't use it enough to get it fixed, I'd probably wait until I sell it. I made sure the clutch was still pretty good when I bought it with ~67k on it last year, which is great for an 04 model. I'll probably just keep it till it falls apart, I only put about 7 or 8k miles on it in a year, so should last me a while. Been eyeing the new FR-S / BRZ though.... but think I'll wait till they have a turbo model out and all the bugs worked out in a few years.

SsHuck And Molly Ziegler: From what I've been able to discern, there are at least two places where microchippy circuit board thingies do not currently belong: On things that vibrate and get hot (that would be cars) and things that use water (dishwashers and washing machines). The technology needs to be made more durable.

/not a gadget freak

So make everything mil-spec?

The thing I don't like more than all of the technology is the car reviewers who knock down a good car because it doesn't have all the stupid gizmos that don't belong on a car in the first place or because it doesn't have something that didn't even exist until a week ago.

Slu: I recently upgraded from a 2001 Hyundai Accent. It was automatic with AC, but that was it. Basic transport. I thought I didn't care about anything else.

Then I got our 2009 Nissan Rouge with Bluetooth, power everything, good stereo, moon roof, etc. I will never go back. Basic transportation sucks balls.

I agree wholeheartedly. I've got a 2011 Nissan, loaded with every upgrade, gadget and gizmo and can't see ever doing without again. I can afford the bells and whistles, and enjoy them. Nissan did a good job of design - I've toyed with Ford and Chevy systems, and they feel downright clunky in comparison.