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(Sports Illustrated)   Dottie Sandusky took the stand to defend her husband and gave us the understatement of the century. "I'm strict, and I like for things to run a certain way, and we expect a lot of our kids." (w/palpatineesque pic)   (sportsillustrated.cnn.com) divider line 225
    More: Strange, Dottie Sandusky, New York County District Attorney, adolescence, State College, public humiliation  
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4044 clicks; posted to Sports » on 20 Jun 2012 at 12:05 PM (2 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2012-06-20 09:33:01 AM
Her husband wrote in his 2001 autobiography "Touched: The Jerry Sandusky Story"

There are no words.
 
2012-06-20 10:02:27 AM
*shudder*
Shes obviously evil. No kind person would wear that awful lime green sweater where others would have to see it.
 
2012-06-20 10:12:05 AM
Her testimony was straight up creepy. When asked if she and her husband slept in the same bed, all she responded with was that he usually went to sleep before she did. That's it. I hope he takes the stand today. It'll be a freakshow.
 
2012-06-20 10:25:30 AM

quickdraw: *shudder*
Shes obviously evil. No kind person would wear that awful lime green sweater where others would have to see it.


Wearing lime green with black really does cast doubts about one's soul.

Doctor Funkenstein: Her testimony was straight up creepy. When asked if she and her husband slept in the same bed, all she responded with was that he usually went to sleep before she did. That's it. I hope he takes the stand today. It'll be a freakshow.


She's going to say whatever she needs to to cover both their asses. She knew something was up. She is a classic enabler.
 
2012-06-20 10:31:57 AM

Troublesome Strumpet: Her husband wrote in his 2001 autobiography "Touched: The Jerry Sandusky Story"

There are no words.


At 225 pages, it's a hell of a "how-to" book.
 
2012-06-20 10:42:35 AM
I'm just going to hold my comments and let the jury figure it out.

After the fiasco involving the McMartin Preschool in California, it can be challenging to develop an opinion on such a sensitive issue with some much press coverage involved. However, the victims here are not preschool kids, but teens who are testifying about incidents that only occurred some years ago.
 
2012-06-20 12:14:15 PM
She should probably go to prison alongside him. She's clearling covering for him, and herself.

Thank god for double standards, amirite women?!?
 
2012-06-20 12:15:00 PM
She's either as evil and farked up as he is, or in so much Denial she no longer acknowledges reality.
 
2012-06-20 12:17:48 PM

quickdraw: *shudder*
Shes obviously evil. No kind person would wear that awful lime green sweater where others would have to see it.


costumefail.com
 
2012-06-20 12:19:35 PM
So could he be in prison by the end of the month?

Fingers crossed.
 
2012-06-20 12:20:47 PM
Their bank accounts should be frozen.
 
2012-06-20 12:22:43 PM
"None of this stuff that happens to kids ever happens in the public arena..." said Dr. Martin Finkel, a pediatrician with 30 years of experience treating abused children.

Jerry Sandusky, 68, is charged with 51 counts of abuse involving 10 accusers. Prosecutors say he met his victims through the charity he and his wife founded, groomed them, and sexually abused them in motels, in his home and in the Penn State football building.


Nothing more private than then football building of a public university.
 
2012-06-20 12:22:52 PM
There is no reason to have anything to do with the NCAA and especially college football as long as Penn State eludes the death penalty.
 
2012-06-20 12:23:03 PM
Not a lot of talk about the two officers who lied under oath about if they prepped accusers about what other accusers were saying about Sandusky.

I'm these officers and the prosecutor who knowingly put them on the stand will face perjury charges.
 
2012-06-20 12:23:35 PM
Reminds me of that wife who killed a minivan full of family, kids and friends by driving after a bunch of shots and some marijuana at 9 am. Then everyone who new her was like NO WAY, IMPOSSIBLE, NOT HER, WE'VE NEVER SEEN HER TAKE DRUGS OR DRINK!
 
2012-06-20 12:24:16 PM

MugzyBrown: I'm these officers and the prosecutor who knowingly put them on the stand will face perjury charges.


You accidentally them?
 
2012-06-20 12:26:07 PM

skrame: Nothing more private than then football building of a public university.


He apparently only did it there late at night when he expected no one else to be there. IIRC, McQueary went in because he couldn't sleep.
 
2012-06-20 12:26:38 PM

PowerSlacker: MugzyBrown: I'm these officers and the prosecutor who knowingly put them on the stand will face perjury charges.

You accidentally them?


No, he's actually all of the officers.
 
2012-06-20 12:27:59 PM
i2.cdn.turner.com

"I'm a-fillin' my Depends!"
 
2012-06-20 12:29:05 PM

MugzyBrown: Not a lot of talk about the two officers who lied under oath about if they prepped accusers about what other accusers were saying about Sandusky.

I'm these officers and the prosecutor who knowingly put them on the stand will face perjury charges.


There is something that's bugged me for some time that really crystalized during McQueary's testimony. He said that he heard skin on skin slapping from a room away. That means that it must have been awfully quiet in that shower during an anal rape. No grunting and certainly no screaming. Now let's talk about penis size for a moment. Are you going to tell me that he is so under endowed that he could rape a ten year old boy and that boy would be quiet enough to hear the skin slapping from a room away? Just look at Sandusky. He's a big guy. He's got big hands. He's got a huge nose. Not only do I think that he's not under endowed (and I'm not trying to be gay about this), but I think he's hung like a frickin' steed. Not only would there be a lot of noise from any ten year old boy, but I'd bet there would be screams of pain. Yet nothing. I would also venture that there would be tissue damage and permanent scarring.

These accuser have made, short of murder, the most serious of accusations and should be held to the highest standard of proof. Any of the accusers who have maintained anal rape should put themselves up for an examination for scar tissue. Not only is a man's life at stake, but these accusations have unjustly tarnished one of the most noble institutions in all of athletics and arguably the legacy of the greatest man in all of athletics. There should be a very high standard of proof.


ftfy. if you're going to go. go all out.
 
2012-06-20 12:29:56 PM

AirForceVet: After the fiasco involving the McMartin Preschool in California,


Reminds me of the one in Wenatchee Washington. Forty-three adults were arrested on 29,726 charges of child sex abuse, involving 60 children in 1995. Every single charge disproven and overturned. Unfortunately after many had already been incarcerated for years and lost their children. I don't think the sandusky trial will turn out like that. But it is why I try to reserve judgement until after the trial. People get flat out crazy about this shiat. Understandably of course, but still.
 
2012-06-20 12:30:47 PM
I am still looking for a good guy in this story. I am beginning to think there are none.
 
2012-06-20 12:34:24 PM
ftfy. if you're going to go. go all out.

I'm not making anything up.. officers were on tape coaching up one of the witnesses.. They testified they never did such a thing.
 
2012-06-20 12:34:39 PM
I went to school with three of the Sandusky kids and went to the same church as the Sandusky family.

/NOT getting a kick out of, well, any of this
 
2012-06-20 12:35:27 PM

skrame: "None of this stuff that happens to kids ever happens in the public arena..." said Dr. Martin Finkel, a pediatrician with 30 years of experience treating abused children.

Jerry Sandusky, 68, is charged with 51 counts of abuse involving 10 accusers. Prosecutors say he met his victims through the charity he and his wife founded, groomed them, and sexually abused them in motels, in his home and in the Penn State football building.


Nothing more private than then football building of a public university.


Locker rooms. Penn State football locker rooms. Where the expectation of privacy is assumed. He wasn't raping the boys out on the 50 yard line.
 
2012-06-20 12:36:09 PM

Gunny Highway: I am still looking for a good guy in this story. I am beginning to think there are none.


Kinda makes it seem like institutionalized child rape on the part of penn state...but this isn't about paying players so the ncaa doesn't care.
 
2012-06-20 12:38:39 PM

verbaltoxin: skrame: "None of this stuff that happens to kids ever happens in the public arena..." said Dr. Martin Finkel, a pediatrician with 30 years of experience treating abused children.

Jerry Sandusky, 68, is charged with 51 counts of abuse involving 10 accusers. Prosecutors say he met his victims through the charity he and his wife founded, groomed them, and sexually abused them in motels, in his home and in the Penn State football building.


Nothing more private than then football building of a public university.

Locker rooms. Penn State football locker rooms. Where the expectation of privacy is assumed. He wasn't raping the boys out on the 50 yard line.


...that we know of.
 
2012-06-20 12:40:32 PM

BKITU: [i2.cdn.turner.com image 298x404]

"I'm a-fillin' my Depends!"


Why would he go around farking boys when he had that hot babe at home?
 
2012-06-20 12:42:07 PM

MugzyBrown: ftfy. if you're going to go. go all out.

I'm not making anything up.. officers were on tape coaching up one of the witnesses.. They testified they never did such a thing.


Link, please.
 
2012-06-20 12:42:53 PM

MugzyBrown: ftfy. if you're going to go. go all out.

I'm not making anything up.. officers were on tape coaching up one of the witnesses.. They testified they never did such a thing.


Earlier, defense attorneys closely questioned two Pennsylvania State Police investigators about whether they coached some of the alleged victims to provide damaging details about Sandusky's behavior with them.

One of the troopers, Cpl. Joseph Leiter, now retired, acknowledged to Sandusky defense lawyer Joe Amendola that he told some of the alleged victims that they "wouldn't be alone" if they came forward because "there were others." He also said he told one witness in an April 21, 2011, interview that investigators had interviewed as many as nine other alleged victims.

"I don't want you to feel ashamed about what happened," Leiter told the alleged victim according to a recording of the meeting played in court. "I don't want him (Sandusky) to take advantage of you ... We need you to tell us as graphically as you can about what happened to you. Remember, you are not alone."

Asked by prosecutor Joe McGettigan whether the officer ever told witnesses what to say, Leiter turned to the jury and said, "No."

But Amendola later read Leiter portions of the interview transcript in which the investigator told the victim others had reported abuse that progressed to oral sex and rape.

Also on the transcript was a conversation between a lawyer for an alleged victim and Leiter discussing how to get the witness to open up about what had happened to him. At one point, while his client is out of the room, attorney Ben Andreozzi asked Leiter: "Can we say at some point in time we have interviewed other kids?"
 
2012-06-20 12:43:45 PM

Gunny Highway: I am still looking for a good guy in this story. I am beginning to think there are none.


I would say the good guys are the victims who have testified. Who knows how many others this guy hurt, but there are those who have put themselves on the record about horrible incidents in order to get this guy thrown in jail. It's just pathetic that the good guys in the story were abused teenagers and not the adults who could've stood up at any point to protect them from any further harm.
 
2012-06-20 12:44:39 PM
When will they finally leave this poor man alone?

/I know
//0-10
 
2012-06-20 12:45:52 PM
I had a Mexican dinner last night that should have been called the "Jerry Sandusky". It made my ass hurt and I had to throw out my underwear.
 
2012-06-20 12:46:18 PM

justtray: MugzyBrown: ftfy. if you're going to go. go all out.

I'm not making anything up.. officers were on tape coaching up one of the witnesses.. They testified they never did such a thing.

Earlier, defense attorneys closely questioned two Pennsylvania State Police investigators about whether they coached some of the alleged victims to provide damaging details about Sandusky's behavior with them.

One of the troopers, Cpl. Joseph Leiter, now retired, acknowledged to Sandusky defense lawyer Joe Amendola that he told some of the alleged victims that they "wouldn't be alone" if they came forward because "there were others." He also said he told one witness in an April 21, 2011, interview that investigators had interviewed as many as nine other alleged victims.

"I don't want you to feel ashamed about what happened," Leiter told the alleged victim according to a recording of the meeting played in court. "I don't want him (Sandusky) to take advantage of you ... We need you to tell us as graphically as you can about what happened to you. Remember, you are not alone."

Asked by prosecutor Joe McGettigan whether the officer ever told witnesses what to say, Leiter turned to the jury and said, "No."

But Amendola later read Leiter portions of the interview transcript in which the investigator told the victim others had reported abuse that progressed to oral sex and rape.

Also on the transcript was a conversation between a lawyer for an alleged victim and Leiter discussing how to get the witness to open up about what had happened to him. At one point, while his client is out of the room, attorney Ben Andreozzi asked Leiter: "Can we say at some point in time we have interviewed other kids?"


Are you trying to tell me that the cop lied to the kid just to get him to talk? I am flabbergasted.

Also, very underwhelmed
 
2012-06-20 12:46:31 PM
img525.imageshack.us
 
2012-06-20 12:47:27 PM

killershark: Gunny Highway: I am still looking for a good guy in this story. I am beginning to think there are none.

I would say the good guys are the victims who have testified. Who knows how many others this guy hurt, but there are those who have put themselves on the record about horrible incidents in order to get this guy thrown in jail. It's just pathetic that the good guys in the story were abused teenagers and not the adults who could've stood up at any point to protect them from any further harm.


Well said.
 
2012-06-20 12:50:50 PM

JohnBigBootay: Reminds me of the one in Wenatchee Washington. Forty-three adults were arrested on 29,726 charges of child sex abuse, involving 60 children in 1995. Every single charge disproven and overturned. Unfortunately after many had already been incarcerated for years and lost their children. I don't think the sandusky trial will turn out like that. But it is why I try to reserve judgement until after the trial. People get flat out crazy about this shiat. Understandably of course, but still.


But why would McClearly lie? What does he have to gain by destroying Penn State football? In this case it's not just the kids testifying.
 
2012-06-20 12:51:45 PM

you have pee hands: McClearly lie


That's one hell of a typo, there.
 
2012-06-20 12:53:05 PM

KingKauff: Are you trying to tell me that the cop lied to the kid just to get him to talk? I am flabbergasted.


I don't even see that much. He asked the kids to tell him what happened and not to sugar coat it. He didn't tell them what to say.
 
2012-06-20 12:53:20 PM

The Muthaship: MugzyBrown: ftfy. if you're going to go. go all out.

I'm not making anything up.. officers were on tape coaching up one of the witnesses.. They testified they never did such a thing.

Link, please.


Link

Yahoo reported it yesterday. A few redlinks went up here
 
2012-06-20 12:59:12 PM

KingKauff: Are you trying to tell me that the cop lied to the kid just to get him to talk? I am flabbergasted.

Also, very underwhelmed


It kinda damages credibility when you tell a witness what to have witnessed.

Especially when you lie about it under oath
 
2012-06-20 12:59:56 PM

The Muthaship: KingKauff: Are you trying to tell me that the cop lied to the kid just to get him to talk? I am flabbergasted.

I don't even see that much. He asked the kids to tell him what happened and not to sugar coat it. He didn't tell them what to say.


This is what I was getting at. I don't see anything inproper at all in there. I was just posting the facts, since Mugzy wasn't going to, and instead wanted to frame the argument in a dishonest way.
 
2012-06-20 01:00:34 PM
Saw this early this morning, and immediately thought:

thehiberniatimes.com

/Palpatine works too
 
2012-06-20 01:01:05 PM

MugzyBrown: It kinda damages credibility when you tell a witness what to have witnessed.

Especially when you lie about it under oath


Just for the sake of clarity, do you think Sandusky is being framed here? Do you think he's innocent?
 
2012-06-20 01:02:42 PM
Just for the sake of clarity, do you think Sandusky is being framed here? Do you think he's innocent?

He's probably guilty, but if I was on the jury now I'd be leaning towards acquital because I believe any misconduct by the gov't in prosecution should lead to an acquital.
 
2012-06-20 01:03:45 PM
The defense rests. Closing arguments begin tomorrow.
 
2012-06-20 01:04:36 PM

MugzyBrown: I believe any misconduct by the gov't in prosecution should lead to an acquital.


Really? That's a novel approach to the justice system.

You think what the police did was misconduct in the interviews, or you think their lying about it on the stand was the bigger problem?
 
2012-06-20 01:07:37 PM

MugzyBrown: Just for the sake of clarity, do you think Sandusky is being framed here? Do you think he's innocent?

He's probably guilty, but if I was on the jury now I'd be leaning towards acquital because I believe any misconduct by the gov't in prosecution should lead to an acquital.


Ffs, that is not misconduct. Adjust your tinfoil hat. The cop was trying to be there for a young man who was raped.
 
2012-06-20 01:09:03 PM

Owangotang: MugzyBrown: Just for the sake of clarity, do you think Sandusky is being framed here? Do you think he's innocent?

He's probably guilty, but if I was on the jury now I'd be leaning towards acquital because I believe any misconduct by the gov't in prosecution should lead to an acquital.

Ffs, that is not misconduct. Adjust your tinfoil hat. The cop was trying to be there for a young man who was raped.


This.

I'm not sure anywhere in what I posted that shows ANY type of misconduct. The prosecutor even read the transcript. Please point out 1) Where exactly there was misconduct prior to the case and 2) Who, and what specifically was lied about under oath.
 
2012-06-20 01:09:42 PM

MugzyBrown: ftfy. if you're going to go. go all out.

I'm not making anything up.. officers were on tape coaching up one of the witnesses.. They testified they never did such a thing.


Amendola seems intent on proving that the police are somehow willingly being duped by a cabal of young men looking to get rich. He has no answer for McQueary's testimony, no answer for those creepy letters, no answers for the statements made to the mother of one of the victims back in 1998.

That said, it just takes one Penn St die hard fan to make this a mistrial.
 
2012-06-20 01:10:09 PM
You think what the police did was misconduct in the interviews, or you think their lying about it on the stand was the bigger problem?

Both are bad. Hard to say which is worse, especially because the police thought they had turned off the tape recorder. If it's 'normal' to do as they said, then they'd have done it openly on tape and not testified they hadn't done it.

Perjury is criminal. So is aiding perjury, which is what the prosecution may have done.
 
2012-06-20 01:10:30 PM

MugzyBrown: Just for the sake of clarity, do you think Sandusky is being framed here? Do you think he's innocent?

He's probably guilty, but if I was on the jury now I'd be leaning towards acquital because I believe any misconduct by the gov't in prosecution should lead to an acquital.


I can see that for maybe the particular victims in question. But there was a victim who came forward first, who didn't have the cops "coercing" him [as the defense states] by referring to other victims. So maybe for those charges, the jury finds him not guilty. There are still plenty of other charges and plenty of other victims to get him thrown in jail for a long time.
 
2012-06-20 01:10:31 PM

MugzyBrown: Just for the sake of clarity, do you think Sandusky is being framed here? Do you think he's innocent?

He's probably guilty, but if I was on the jury now I'd be leaning towards acquital because I believe any misconduct by the gov't in prosecution should lead to an acquital.


There are over 50 charges against him. Even if he was acquitted of anything relating to that particular victim there's a good chance many of the other charges will go against him.
 
2012-06-20 01:11:41 PM

Levarien: MugzyBrown: ftfy. if you're going to go. go all out.

I'm not making anything up.. officers were on tape coaching up one of the witnesses.. They testified they never did such a thing.

Amendola seems intent on proving that the police are somehow willingly being duped by a cabal of young men looking to get rich. He has no answer for McQueary's testimony, no answer for those creepy letters, no answers for the statements made to the mother of one of the victims back in 1998.

That said, it just takes one Penn St die hard fan to make this a mistrial.


Or a paranoid anti police anti government weirdo
 
2012-06-20 01:12:09 PM

Levarien: That said, it just takes one Penn St die hard fan to make this a mistrial.


4 employees of PSU and 2 students on the jury.
 
2012-06-20 01:12:45 PM
Grrrr...just 2 seconds...
 
2012-06-20 01:13:58 PM

justtray: I'm not sure anywhere in what I posted that shows ANY type of misconduct.


You don't think the police coaching a witness "off tape" is misconduct?

justtray: 2) Who, and what specifically was lied about under oath.


That's easy. The police testified they had not told Victim #4 what had happened to other victims. They were on tape telling Victim #4 what had happened to other victims.

They also asked both officers if they had talked to eachother before their last time on the stand, one said yes, the other said no. So there are two bald faced lies.
 
2012-06-20 01:14:36 PM

MtLebanonBalogna: There are over 50 charges against him. Even if he was acquitted of anything relating to that particular victim there's a good chance many of the other charges will go against him.


Stop trying to explain the how the exclusionary rule actually works to it. It only wants its dear old PSU back the way it was.
 
2012-06-20 01:14:46 PM

The Muthaship: 4 employees of PSU and 2 students on the jury.


There would be more national "heat" on anything associated with Penn State if Sandusky walks.

You would think anyone on the jury with ties to the university would want to convict him no matter what, as that's step one in the path to something resembling "closure".
 
2012-06-20 01:15:47 PM

Levarien: MugzyBrown: ftfy. if you're going to go. go all out.

I'm not making anything up.. officers were on tape coaching up one of the witnesses.. They testified they never did such a thing.

Amendola seems intent on proving that the police are somehow willingly being duped by a cabal of young men looking to get rich. He has no answer for McQueary's testimony, no answer for those creepy letters, no answers for the statements made to the mother of one of the victims back in 1998.

That said, it just takes one Penn St die hard fan to make this a mistrial.


Yep.

And that's why Sandusky could have raped a conga line of toddlers on video, and probably still get acquitted.
 
2012-06-20 01:15:47 PM

killershark: I can see that for maybe the particular victims in question. But there was a victim who came forward first, who didn't have the cops "coercing" him [as the defense states] by referring to other victims. So maybe for those charges, the jury finds him not guilty. There are still plenty of other charges and plenty of other victims to get him thrown in jail for a long time.


That wouldn't bother me. But I'd question a lot of Victim 4's testimony for sure at this point.
 
2012-06-20 01:16:28 PM

Killer Cars: You would think anyone on the jury with ties to the university would want to convict him no matter what, as that's step one in the path to something resembling "closure".


Trying to guess how jurors will think is the path to insanity.
 
2012-06-20 01:19:01 PM

The Muthaship: Levarien: That said, it just takes one Penn St die hard fan to make this a mistrial.

4 employees of PSU and 2 students on the jury.


It wouldn't have to be a PSU diehard fan...it could be anyone on the jury. I've served as a juror on a criminal trial and a civil trial. Most of the jurors were reasonable -- if not intelligent -- people, but there was no accounting for some of the derp that was tossed around the table by a few people while we were deciding on the verdicts.
 
2012-06-20 01:19:25 PM

MugzyBrown: justtray: I'm not sure anywhere in what I posted that shows ANY type of misconduct.

You don't think the police coaching a witness "off tape" is misconduct?

justtray: 2) Who, and what specifically was lied about under oath.

That's easy. The police testified they had not told Victim #4 what had happened to other victims. They were on tape telling Victim #4 what had happened to other victims.

They also asked both officers if they had talked to eachother before their last time on the stand, one said yes, the other said no. So there are two bald faced lies.


Show me the QUOTES. I don't want to hear your made up interpretation of events. Did you see how I posted the actual facts earlier? They don't mesh up with what you're selling.
 
2012-06-20 01:20:12 PM
Don't worry, kids, Geraldo's on the case!

www.biography.com

semensperms.com
 
2012-06-20 01:21:57 PM
Heavens no! He never EVER wanted me to have buttsecks.
He was just playing with the leather Cheerio.
 
2012-06-20 01:22:52 PM

I_Am_Weasel: Troublesome Strumpet: Her husband wrote in his 2001 autobiography "Touched: The Jerry Sandusky Story"

There are no words.

At 225 pages, it's a hell of a "how-to" book.


It's also a pop-up book.
 
2012-06-20 01:23:49 PM

MugzyBrown: killershark: I can see that for maybe the particular victims in question. But there was a victim who came forward first, who didn't have the cops "coercing" him [as the defense states] by referring to other victims. So maybe for those charges, the jury finds him not guilty. There are still plenty of other charges and plenty of other victims to get him thrown in jail for a long time.

That wouldn't bother me. But I'd question a lot of Victim 4's testimony for sure at this point.


That's fine. But how many victims took the stand for the prosecution? Plus, there was the mother of a victim as well. So you throw out the charges related to Victim 4. You've still got enough to find him guilty of and put him in jail for the rest of his life.
 
2012-06-20 01:25:44 PM
Bbbut the POLICE are out to get Jerry! They already murdered that poor old man, joe paterno! NITTANY UP!
 
2012-06-20 01:27:51 PM

you have pee hands: But why would McClearly lie? What does he have to gain by destroying Penn State football? In this case it's not just the kids testifying.


Which is why I said I don't think this one will turn out like that. I try to be cautious on these kinds of things because it's all too common that the accusers retract their statements - we've seen several of those just this year. But again, I don't think this one will turn out like that. Provided the witness testimony is credible and there's no prosecutorial misconduct I think they'll get a conviction.
 
2012-06-20 01:29:38 PM

Owangotang: Bbbut the POLICE are out to get Jerry! They already murdered that poor old man, joe paterno! NITTANY UP!


I imagine most have you on ignore. But I have to say the only person I have seen say anything like that is you.
 
2012-06-20 01:30:16 PM

FirstNationalBastard: Levarien: MugzyBrown: ftfy. if you're going to go. go all out.

I'm not making anything up.. officers were on tape coaching up one of the witnesses.. They testified they never did such a thing.

Amendola seems intent on proving that the police are somehow willingly being duped by a cabal of young men looking to get rich. He has no answer for McQueary's testimony, no answer for those creepy letters, no answers for the statements made to the mother of one of the victims back in 1998.

That said, it just takes one Penn St die hard fan to make this a mistrial.

Yep.

And that's why Sandusky could have raped a conga line of toddlers on video, and probably still get acquitted.


He's not going to be acquitted. There's a big difference between a hung jury (mistrial) and an acquittal.
 
2012-06-20 01:31:23 PM

UNAUTHORIZED FINGER: Saw this early this morning, and immediately thought:

 
2012-06-20 01:32:41 PM

MugzyBrown: killershark: I can see that for maybe the particular victims in question. But there was a victim who came forward first, who didn't have the cops "coercing" him [as the defense states] by referring to other victims. So maybe for those charges, the jury finds him not guilty. There are still plenty of other charges and plenty of other victims to get him thrown in jail for a long time.

That wouldn't bother me. But I'd question a lot of Victim 4's testimony for sure at this point.


I'm just going to throw this out there and point out that rape victims are generally not known for their mental stability.

Also, why the hell didn't the prosecution object to anyone who had any remote connection to Penn during jury selection? That DA should lose his job, regardless of the verdict.
 
2012-06-20 01:33:49 PM

LoneWolf343: Also, why the hell didn't the prosecution object to anyone who had any remote connection to Penn during jury selection?


The local news guy there said it would be impossible to seat a jury in that area with out PSU people on it, and neither side requested a change of venue.
 
2012-06-20 01:34:53 PM

LoneWolf343: Also, why the hell didn't the prosecution object to anyone who had any remote connection to Penn during jury selection? That DA should lose his job, regardless of the verdict.


To avoid that in that community they would've had to get a ton of Amish people by horse and buggy to come to the courthouse, lol.
 
2012-06-20 01:37:23 PM

LoneWolf343: Also, why the hell didn't the prosecution object to anyone who had any remote connection to Penn during jury selection? That DA should lose his job, regardless of the verdict.


I still find it shocking that there are people who believe jurors would vote to acquit in the face of credible abuse testimony because of their favorite football team. But I suppose the fact you'd insinuate it proves that partisanship of that ilk exists.
 
2012-06-20 01:37:42 PM

MtLebanonBalogna:

There are over 50 charges against him. Even if he was acquitted of anything relating to that particular victim there's a good chance many of the other charges will go against him.


The Feds are waiting in the wings if he gets off.Transporting a minor over state lines for purposes of diddling, yada yada.
This was the 1999 Alamo Bowl incident. And if the Feds won't prosecute, Texas is ready to extradite him, and he'll burn for sure.
 
2012-06-20 01:39:22 PM

AirForceVet: I'm just going to hold my comments and let the jury figure it out.

After the fiasco involving the McMartin Preschool in California, it can be challenging to develop an opinion on such a sensitive issue with some much press coverage involved. However, the victims here are not preschool kids, but teens who are testifying about incidents that only occurred some years ago.


An excellent point bringing up McMartin. The difference here is that McQueary actually witnessed something, as opposed to parents complaining after the fact.

McMartin should be a model of why you shouldn't listen to the media with this hot button cases because you will eventually evolve to an opinion that is not based in reality.

Examples: people think Dharun Ravi pushed Tyler Clementi off the George Washington Bridge and George Zimmerman emptied a clip into Trayvon Martin from behind.

It's not what HAPPENED, but that's what people THINK because the stories get misreported, facts get wrong, and it propagates to the point where the mistruths are represented as fact.
 
2012-06-20 01:39:28 PM

LoneWolf343: MugzyBrown: killershark: I can see that for maybe the particular victims in question. But there was a victim who came forward first, who didn't have the cops "coercing" him [as the defense states] by referring to other victims. So maybe for those charges, the jury finds him not guilty. There are still plenty of other charges and plenty of other victims to get him thrown in jail for a long time.

That wouldn't bother me. But I'd question a lot of Victim 4's testimony for sure at this point.

I'm just going to throw this out there and point out that rape victims are generally not known for their mental stability.

Also, why the hell didn't the prosecution object to anyone who had any remote connection to Penn during jury selection? That DA should lose his job, regardless of the verdict.


Being connected in any way with PSU does not mean a juror will be sympathetic to Sandusky. Of all the Penn Staters I know I can't think of one that doesn't think Sandusky isn't guilty of at least most of the charges.
 
2012-06-20 01:41:10 PM

JohnBigBootay: LoneWolf343: Also, why the hell didn't the prosecution object to anyone who had any remote connection to Penn during jury selection? That DA should lose his job, regardless of the verdict.

I still find it shocking that there are people who believe jurors would vote to acquit in the face of credible abuse testimony because of their favorite football team. But I suppose the fact you'd insinuate it proves that partisanship of that ilk exists.


Jury nullification is a real phenomenon. Look at the OJ Simpson murder trial.
 
2012-06-20 01:42:12 PM

JohnBigBootay: Owangotang: Bbbut the POLICE are out to get Jerry! They already murdered that poor old man, joe paterno! NITTANY UP!

I imagine most have you on ignore. But I have to say the only person I have seen say anything like that is you.


Their loss. If you have not seen people ardently defending penn state even still then you are willfully blind.
 
2012-06-20 01:43:16 PM

JohnBigBootay: LoneWolf343: Also, why the hell didn't the prosecution object to anyone who had any remote connection to Penn during jury selection? That DA should lose his job, regardless of the verdict.

I still find it shocking that there are people who believe jurors would vote to acquit in the face of credible abuse testimony because of their favorite football team. But I suppose the fact you'd insinuate it proves that partisanship of that ilk exists.


Isn't the love for that football team the reason it was allowed to go on for 10+ years?
 
2012-06-20 01:43:33 PM

The Muthaship: LoneWolf343: Also, why the hell didn't the prosecution object to anyone who had any remote connection to Penn during jury selection?

The local news guy there said it would be impossible to seat a jury in that area with out PSU people on it, and neither side requested a change of venue.


Perhaps the prosecution should have requested a change of venue. Hopefully if this trial results in a hung jury they'll retry the case in a different location.
 
2012-06-20 01:46:53 PM
So her primary defense is, "I never saw him do anything." Is that just another way of saying, "I never went in the basement when he had young boys over."?
 
2012-06-20 01:47:58 PM
I hope he beats the charges? Why? Because the world is a more interesting place with him walking the streets. If he goes to jail, we'll never hear about him again until somebody eventually shanks him to death.
 
2012-06-20 01:48:43 PM

farkityfarker: Jury nullification is a real phenomenon. Look at the OJ Simpson murder trial.


Sure it is. I've sat through it myself for days on end when I was called to Jury duty. But you're not going to find anyone in Centre County without a tangential relationship to Penn State any more than you could find English speakers in LA who didn't know who OJ Simpson was. And as others have pointed out I think the locals by and large are at least as likely as anyone else to be repulsed by Sandusky. Like any other trial this one will come down to to quality and quantity of credible witness testimony and the conduct and competence of the investigators and expert witnesses. There seems to be this idea among football fans of rival schools that PSU locals would not want to convict a fellow Penn State supporter. I simply find that idea absurd on its face. This isn't a BCS poll.
 
rka
2012-06-20 01:49:13 PM

JohnBigBootay: Owangotang: Bbbut the POLICE are out to get Jerry! They already murdered that poor old man, joe paterno! NITTANY UP!

I imagine most have you on ignore. But I have to say the only person I have seen say anything like that is you.


Yes, but when you do get an actual Penn State Alum/employee posting here or on any forum, aren't they about the most creepy sport fans you've ever come across? The level of hero worship that absolutely drips from their posts is...disturbing. They make our bunkered-down Saints fans in the other threads seem downright well-adjusted.

Even when they think they are being rational and sensitive to the issues there is a level of, I don't want to call it brain washing, but almost cult-like reverence for PSU and JoePa.
 
2012-06-20 01:49:20 PM
I've been weird about Joe Paterno's involvement in this whole mess.

People said "he should have done more"... but what exactly "more" could he have done?

He didn't witness Sandusky doing this... McQueary did. And Paterno told his bosses. Can you file a police report for something you didn't witness and you weren't involved in?

If Paterno did go to the police, they would have wanted to talk to McQueary, which begs the question why he didn't go to the police in the first place.

Paterno evolved from a man who five years ago was so "out of touch" that he wasn't even running the football team and he was just there for fan and booster support to the evil trope of "the man who runs Penn State".

I think, in the long run, Penn State handled this brutally, brutally bad. Their Crisis communication and management was the worst I've ever seen. I think the icing on the cake was having a "moment of silence" at a game after the tragedy broke. HAVING A MOMENT OF SILENCE IS WHAT GOT YOU INTO THIS MESS IN THE FIRST PLACE.
 
2012-06-20 01:49:41 PM

PoochUMD: Isn't the love for that football team the reason it was allowed to go on for 10+ years?


Not exactly. It's not like the average fan knew he was a child molester. That's a bit like blaming the abuses of the Catholic church on your average Christmas & Easter catholic - they may have taken longer to come around to the fact that something was really wrong, but they weren't part of the incident or part of the coverup.
 
2012-06-20 01:51:17 PM

farkityfarker: The Muthaship: LoneWolf343: Also, why the hell didn't the prosecution object to anyone who had any remote connection to Penn during jury selection?

The local news guy there said it would be impossible to seat a jury in that area with out PSU people on it, and neither side requested a change of venue.

Perhaps the prosecution should have requested a change of venue. Hopefully if this trial results in a hung jury they'll retry the case in a different location.


I think the prosecution probably knew of Penn Stater and Centre Countian level of outrage over Sandusky. That level is pretty high.
 
2012-06-20 01:52:04 PM

T.rex: I hope he beats the charges? Why? Because the world is a more interesting place with him walking the streets. If he goes to jail, we'll never hear about him again until somebody eventually shanks him to death.


justice be damned, t.rex wants interesting pedos to be free dammit!!!

and I'm the derpy one????
 
2012-06-20 01:52:55 PM

PoochUMD: Isn't the love for that football team the reason it was allowed to go on for 10+ years?


Not to my mind. I'd imagine it went on for the same reason it always goes on. Incompetence. Guilt. Shame. Disbelief. Fact is most child abuse goes unreported and most child abusers are family members or close family friends. The is the same thing writ large.
 
2012-06-20 01:53:31 PM

JohnBigBootay: LoneWolf343: Also, why the hell didn't the prosecution object to anyone who had any remote connection to Penn during jury selection? That DA should lose his job, regardless of the verdict.

I still find it shocking that there are people who believe jurors would vote to acquit in the face of credible abuse testimony because of their favorite football team. But I suppose the fact you'd insinuate it proves that partisanship of that ilk exists.


You don't know much about the culture of college football, do you? People eat, breathe, and sleep their favorite team. It's not that people will actually say "So what if he rapes little boys? I'm voting him not guilty anyway!" It's because people can get so star-struck about their personal heroes that they are unable to consider the possibility that said heroes may not be heroic at all. They have already made up their minds that he is being railroaded, despite the mountain of evidence. There is not one bit of proof that they could not explain away as fabricated, misinterpreted, or just plain false. Mr. Sandusky could pork a kid right in front of the jury box, and his fans would claim entrapment.

Granted, its not as if somebody who happens to work for or study at Penn St. would be incapable of impartiality. It's a big university, and someone could spend his whole tenure there and never engage with the sports program. He might actually even resent it. Yet, I would not have taken that chance. In fact, I probably would have asked if jurors followed college football at all, and bumped those that answered yes. Sports make people stupid.
 
2012-06-20 01:55:08 PM

MattyFridays: I've been weird about Joe Paterno's involvement in this whole mess.

People said "he should have done more"... but what exactly "more" could he have done?

He didn't witness Sandusky doing this... McQueary did. And Paterno told his bosses. Can you file a police report for something you didn't witness and you weren't involved in?

If Paterno did go to the police, they would have wanted to talk to McQueary, which begs the question why he didn't go to the police in the first place.

Paterno evolved from a man who five years ago was so "out of touch" that he wasn't even running the football team and he was just there for fan and booster support to the evil trope of "the man who runs Penn State".

I think, in the long run, Penn State handled this brutally, brutally bad. Their Crisis communication and management was the worst I've ever seen. I think the icing on the cake was having a "moment of silence" at a game after the tragedy broke. HAVING A MOMENT OF SILENCE IS WHAT GOT YOU INTO THIS MESS IN THE FIRST PLACE.


Poor poor joe paterno. He is the real victim, aye?
 
2012-06-20 01:58:44 PM

durbnpoisn: So her primary defense is, "I never saw him do anything." Is that just another way of saying, "I never went in the basement when he had young boys over."?


Was she asked if she ever heard anything? Because one of the victims claims he screamed his lungs out while Sandusky was raping him in the basement, but no one responded.
 
2012-06-20 02:00:53 PM

Troublesome Strumpet: Her husband wrote in his 2001 autobiography "Touched: The Jerry Sandusky Story"

There are no words.


Well it's better than the original working title: "I Like To Cornhole Little Boys."
 
2012-06-20 02:01:57 PM

rka: Yes, but when you do get an actual Penn State Alum/employee posting here or on any forum, aren't they about the most creepy sport fans you've ever come across?


I have seen somewhat disturbed fans of just about everyone. Having grown up in Alabama I always found the Bear Bryant worship a bit crazy. Though I understand it. But anyway, to answer your question.... no. I don't see PSU fans as any more delusional than anyone else. If your school gets a title or three and the coach stick around for fifty years I imagine he'd be somewhat revered as well. I think Joe Paterno was mostly a force for good who stuck around too long and should have spoken up sooner and louder and it was right to dismiss him. He should have left ten years ago. But I'm not gonna re-write history and discount his positive influence. Bad people do good things. Good people do bad things. The press wants everything to be black and white but it's just not.
 
2012-06-20 02:03:04 PM

JohnBigBootay: PoochUMD: Isn't the love for that football team the reason it was allowed to go on for 10+ years?

Not to my mind. I'd imagine it went on for the same reason it always goes on. Incompetence. Guilt. Shame. Disbelief. Fact is most child abuse goes unreported and most child abusers are family members or close family friends. The is the same thing writ large.


Just like the woman who testified that her son came home with no underwear. But she didn't look into it any further.
 
2012-06-20 02:04:51 PM

MattyFridays: I've been weird about Joe Paterno's involvement in this whole mess.

People said "he should have done more"... but what exactly "more" could he have done?

He didn't witness Sandusky doing this... McQueary did. And Paterno told his bosses. Can you file a police report for something you didn't witness and you weren't involved in?

If Paterno did go to the police, they would have wanted to talk to McQueary, which begs the question why he didn't go to the police in the first place.

Paterno evolved from a man who five years ago was so "out of touch" that he wasn't even running the football team and he was just there for fan and booster support to the evil trope of "the man who runs Penn State".


things joepa the legendary coach of penn state could have done, that i would classify as "more"

1) talk to the police. like the real police with badges and whatnot. pretty sure if joepa walks into the happy valley police station they aren't going to throw him out before asking what's on his mind. maybe bring mcqueary along.

2) hit sandusky with a baseball bat that practice golf cart he sometimes got around in.

3) do more than just say keep your kiddy-raping out of my football facilities.
 
2012-06-20 02:05:25 PM
You might be innocent, Dottie, but you are one stupid and naive coont on top of that.
 
2012-06-20 02:06:52 PM

rka:
Yes, but when you do get an actual Penn State Alum/employee posting here or on any forum, aren't they about the most creepy sport fans you've ever come across?


I was hoping I could keep my creepiness under control...
 
2012-06-20 02:09:17 PM

Owangotang:

Poor poor joe paterno. He is the real victim, aye?


Don't put words in my mouth. You saw what I wrote.
 
2012-06-20 02:10:05 PM

LoneWolf343: You don't know much about the culture of college football, do you? People eat, breathe, and sleep their favorite team............................................................. Sports make people stupid.


Yeah, I used to live in Tusacaloosa Alabama. So I have no idea about the culture of college football. Now that you mention it I DID find it a bit odd when 100,000 people would come to a spring scrimmage.

Here's what I think - I think the prosecutor is as selfish and money-motivated as the rest of us. I think he knows his county better than the rest of us. I think he knows the law better than the rest of us. And I'm virtually certain he doesn't want to look like an idiot and lose a high-profile case. Maybe he's an idiot. But he'd hardly be the first guy who opted not to request a venue change when a prominent local was involved. I imagine he thinks he has such damning evidence it couldn't possibly matter.
 
2012-06-20 02:13:23 PM

JohnBigBootay: rka: Yes, but when you do get an actual Penn State Alum/employee posting here or on any forum, aren't they about the most creepy sport fans you've ever come across?

I have seen somewhat disturbed fans of just about everyone. Having grown up in Alabama I always found the Bear Bryant worship a bit crazy. Though I understand it. But anyway, to answer your question.... no. I don't see PSU fans as any more delusional than anyone else. If your school gets a title or three and the coach stick around for fifty years I imagine he'd be somewhat revered as well. I think Joe Paterno was mostly a force for good who stuck around too long and should have spoken up sooner and louder and it was right to dismiss him. He should have left ten years ago. But I'm not gonna re-write history and discount his positive influence. Bad people do good things. Good people do bad things. The press wants everything to be black and white but it's just not.


If fostering institutionalized kid rape doesn't discount any positive influence then what the hell does?
 
2012-06-20 02:14:49 PM

A Fark Handle:

things joepa the legendary coach of penn state could have done, that i would classify as "more"

1) talk to the police. like the real police with badges and whatnot. pretty sure if joepa walks into the happy valley police station they aren't going to throw him out before asking what's on his mind. maybe bring mcqueary along.

2) hit sandusky with a baseball bat that practice golf cart he sometimes got around in.

3) do more than just say keep your kiddy-raping out of my football facilities.


Fair. Why didn't McQueary do 1 and 2 then?

In this entire mess, Joe Pa is represented as the 2nd worst monster after Sandusky, yet I would rank him #5.

It goes:

1) Sandusky for his crimes
2) McQueary for not doing anything and then not reporting anything
3&4) Curley and Spanier for covering it up
5) Paterno for not doing more.

So why is Paterno seen as the boogeyman when the offenses of McQueary, Curley, and Spanier much, MUCH more egregious? That's the question I'm asking. It goes back to the McMartin thing and how the media forms our opinions.
 
2012-06-20 02:15:32 PM

MattyFridays: Owangotang:

Poor poor joe paterno. He is the real victim, aye?

Don't put words in my mouth. You saw what I wrote.


I translated it from misguided sentiment into English.
 
2012-06-20 02:15:45 PM

farkityfarker: Just like the woman who testified that her son came home with no underwear. But she didn't look into it any further.


Exactly. It's easy to look in the rear view mirror and say something was obvious but denial is powerful. And you see it in child abuse cases again and again and again and again. Do I know why? No, I don't. And I hope I never have to experience it first hand.
 
2012-06-20 02:18:13 PM

Owangotang: Poor poor joe paterno. He is the real victim, aye?


I can't wait for that testimony! Sandusky is a sick fark, but he'll do well in prison if he likes old man ass too.
 
2012-06-20 02:19:00 PM

MattyFridays: A Fark Handle:

things joepa the legendary coach of penn state could have done, that i would classify as "more"

1) talk to the police. like the real police with badges and whatnot. pretty sure if joepa walks into the happy valley police station they aren't going to throw him out before asking what's on his mind. maybe bring mcqueary along.

2) hit sandusky with a baseball bat that practice golf cart he sometimes got around in.

3) do more than just say keep your kiddy-raping out of my football facilities.

Fair. Why didn't McQueary do 1 and 2 then?

In this entire mess, Joe Pa is represented as the 2nd worst monster after Sandusky, yet I would rank him #5.

It goes:

1) Sandusky for his crimes
2) McQueary for not doing anything and then not reporting anything
3&4) Curley and Spanier for covering it up
5) Paterno for not doing more.

So why is Paterno seen as the boogeyman when the offenses of McQueary, Curley, and Spanier much, MUCH more egregious? That's the question I'm asking. It goes back to the McMartin thing and how the media forms our opinions.


Because at a BIG TIME COLLEGE FOOTBALL program head coach is king. He oversaw it all, there is no way he did not. Lionizing coaches is creeeeeepy.
 
2012-06-20 02:19:28 PM

farkityfarker: FirstNationalBastard: Levarien: MugzyBrown: ftfy. if you're going to go. go all out.

I'm not making anything up.. officers were on tape coaching up one of the witnesses.. They testified they never did such a thing.

Amendola seems intent on proving that the police are somehow willingly being duped by a cabal of young men looking to get rich. He has no answer for McQueary's testimony, no answer for those creepy letters, no answers for the statements made to the mother of one of the victims back in 1998.

That said, it just takes one Penn St die hard fan to make this a mistrial.

Yep.

And that's why Sandusky could have raped a conga line of toddlers on video, and probably still get acquitted.

He's not going to be acquitted. There's a big difference between a hung jury (mistrial) and an acquittal.


You're right, I misspoke.

But, how many trials would they hold before finally giving up? Two? Five?

As long as the trial is held in the middle of Penn State territory, there's always a good chance of a mistrial. And at what point does it stop being worth it to try to prosecute him?
 
2012-06-20 02:19:47 PM

Owangotang: MattyFridays: Owangotang:

Poor poor joe paterno. He is the real victim, aye?

Don't put words in my mouth. You saw what I wrote.

I translated it from misguided sentiment into English.


No, you translated it from me asking a question: "What more could have Paterno done?" into trollese. I asked, could Paterno have filed a police report without seeing what happened?

Make no mistake: I think Paterno should have lost his job. I'm questioning why he is portrayed as the second worse person in this situation while people forget about McQueary, Spanier, and Curley. (and Schultz, I think?)

It goes back to how the media shapes our opinions. Paterno is the most well known figure in this mess, so he's the one who's painted as the worst one.
 
2012-06-20 02:20:01 PM

MattyFridays: So why is Paterno seen as the boogeyman when the offenses of McQueary, Curley, and Spanier much, MUCH more egregious? That's the question I'm asking. It goes back to the McMartin thing and how the media forms our opinions.


I hate to quote a comic book, but "with great power comes great responsibility". It's not that clear to me that anyone would have listened to McQueary (there was a coverup anyway, and it's not like he was that big of a deal himself - they could have easily pushed him out of the school and tried to marginalize anything he said), but people would have certainly listened to Joe Pa. If Joe Pa had wanted to fix it, all he had to do was say so. He didn't *do* anything actively evil, but his silence spoke louder than anyone else's because of who he was.
 
2012-06-20 02:20:36 PM
WE ARE....
 
2012-06-20 02:22:10 PM

Owangotang: If fostering institutionalized kid rape doesn't discount any positive influence then what the hell does?


I don't use the ignore button. But how about this - I won't reply to your posts if you won't reply to mine. I just don't think we like to have discussions in the same manner. You want to drum up a lynch mob and it's just not my style. Really - you could start one up for Hitler and I wouldn't join it. I'd say he should get a fair trial with representation and then be punished to the full extent of the law for the crimes that had been proven against him. So really, you fish in your pond and I'll fish in mine.
 
2012-06-20 02:22:59 PM

MattyFridays: Fair. Why didn't McQueary do 1 and 2 then?

In this entire mess, Joe Pa is represented as the 2nd worst monster after Sandusky, yet I would rank him #5.

It goes:

1) Sandusky for his crimes
2) McQueary for not doing anything and then not reporting anything
3&4) Curley and Spanier for covering it up
5) Paterno for not doing more.

So why is Paterno seen as the boogeyman when the offenses of McQueary, Curley, and Spanier much, MUCH more egregious? That's the question I'm asking. It goes back to the McMartin thing and how the media forms our opinions.


he was farking "win the right way" joepa that's why. and he could have reported.

oh, and HE WAS THE MOST POWERFUL MAN IN HAPPY VALLEY AND HE KNEW AND DID ESSENTIALLY NOTHING!! FARKING NOTHING!! FOR AT LEAST A DECADE!! FARK HIM!!

he could have told mcqueary to report it. oh and joepa was involved in the coverup. even if sandusky was completely and totally innocent joepa could have had him questioned by the happy valley police just by shuffling his old ass in the front door of the station and asking them to go pick up rapey jerry.
 
2012-06-20 02:24:58 PM

Owangotang:

Because at a BIG TIME COLLEGE FOOTBALL program head coach is king. He oversaw it all, there is no way he did not. Lionizing coaches is creeeeeepy.


Yet for years before the scandal broke, Joe Paterno was painted as a nice old man who was way out of touch with coaching and college football. He was seen as no more than a mascot. Even when they went to BCS bowl games, people said because it was the support of his coaching staff, not the genius of Joe Paterno.

So you can't have it both ways. Which was he? The old man who was out of touch, or the guy who ran everything?

And again: Don't act like I'm some huge PSU supporter. I went to WVU for God's sake. Hating Penn State is the one thing Pitt and WVU fans could agree on.
 
2012-06-20 02:25:36 PM

meow said the dog: WE ARE....


KID RAPE
 
2012-06-20 02:26:11 PM

meow said the dog: WE ARE....


KIDDY RAPE!!!
 
2012-06-20 02:28:47 PM

MattyFridays: So you can't have it both ways. Which was he? The old man who was out of touch, or the guy who ran everything?


why can't he be some of both? out of touch with plenty of the day to day football operations, but respected more than enough that if had asked the police to investigate they would have put the donuts down and started coaching up witnesses/victims.
 
2012-06-20 02:29:26 PM

MattyFridays: Owangotang:

Because at a BIG TIME COLLEGE FOOTBALL program head coach is king. He oversaw it all, there is no way he did not. Lionizing coaches is creeeeeepy.

Yet for years before the scandal broke, Joe Paterno was painted as a nice old man who was way out of touch with coaching and college football. He was seen as no more than a mascot. Even when they went to BCS bowl games, people said because it was the support of his coaching staff, not the genius of Joe Paterno.

So you can't have it both ways. Which was he? The old man who was out of touch, or the guy who ran everything?

And again: Don't act like I'm some huge PSU supporter. I went to WVU for God's sake. Hating Penn State is the one thing Pitt and WVU fans could agree on.


2002 != 2012. A decade can do a lot to someone's energy levels.
 
2012-06-20 02:30:50 PM
You know this guy is going to walk or at most, get a slap on the wrist.
 
2012-06-20 02:33:14 PM

JohnBigBootay: Owangotang: If fostering institutionalized kid rape doesn't discount any positive influence then what the hell does?

I don't use the ignore button. But how about this - I won't reply to your posts if you won't reply to mine. I just don't think we like to have discussions in the same manner. You want to drum up a lynch mob and it's just not my style. Really - you could start one up for Hitler and I wouldn't join it. I'd say he should get a fair trial with representation and then be punished to the full extent of the law for the crimes that had been proven against him. So really, you fish in your pond and I'll fish in mine.


Not so. I refuse to grant wiggle room to anyone involved with this case. The details are too gruesome to allow it. The fact that you believe that I want some sort of vigilante justice shows deficiency on your part.
 
2012-06-20 02:35:22 PM

MattyFridays: Owangotang:

Because at a BIG TIME COLLEGE FOOTBALL program head coach is king. He oversaw it all, there is no way he did not. Lionizing coaches is creeeeeepy.

Yet for years before the scandal broke, Joe Paterno was painted as a nice old man who was way out of touch with coaching and college football. He was seen as no more than a mascot. Even when they went to BCS bowl games, people said because it was the support of his coaching staff, not the genius of Joe Paterno.

So you can't have it both ways. Which was he? The old man who was out of touch, or the guy who ran everything?

And again: Don't act like I'm some huge PSU supporter. I went to WVU for God's sake. Hating Penn State is the one thing Pitt and WVU fans could agree on.


Assistant coaches testified kids were showing at psu in 1980.
 
2012-06-20 02:35:44 PM

JohnBigBootay: LoneWolf343: Also, why the hell didn't the prosecution object to anyone who had any remote connection to Penn during jury selection? That DA should lose his job, regardless of the verdict.

I still find it shocking that there are people who believe jurors would vote to acquit in the face of credible abuse testimony because of their favorite football team. But I suppose the fact you'd insinuate it proves that partisanship of that ilk exists.


To be fair, we saw how the students at that school reacted when Paterno got canned. Any sane, rational person wouldn't have joined a riot over a football coach getting fired. That sort of partisanship does seem to exist up there.

If anyone on the jury has that viewpoint, do they look at Sandusky as someone who couldn't have done these things and have been shocked by the details presented to them or as someone who's actions have shamed the football program and will be quicker on voting him guilty as a result.

As an aside, I wonder if that part from the Bob Costas interview that wasn't shown that we've been hearing about can still be presented in closing arguments. I truly don't know what the rules are on something like that so I'm curious.
 
2012-06-20 02:37:27 PM

LoneWolf343: You don't know much about the culture of college football, do you? People eat, breathe, and sleep their favorite team. It's not that people will actually say "So what if he rapes little boys? I'm voting him not guilty anyway!"


This isn't the SEC. We don't worship football. We were proud of our university and that our football program was supposedly "done right" with a high graduation rate and limited tolerance for off-the-field problems.

What I see from most people affiliated with PSU (full disclosure: I'm an alumnus and live in the area), is that they are upset that the rest of the world doesn't understand the separation between the University, the athletics department, the city, and the accused. Penn State University didn't rape kids. The Penn State Football program didn't rape kids. Joe Paterno didn't rape kids. The lunch lady in the cafeteria didn't rape kids.

Jerry Sandusky has allegedly raped kids. HE is the one on trial, not Penn State. It's annoying and somewhat hurtful when it's referred to as the "Penn State Molestation Trial." If it gets to the level of the Catholic Church, where there are many accusations across multiple people with PSU affiliation, then PSU is the linking factor,

And, before people chime in with "Oh boo-hoo. Think of how the children felt when they were molested", that is a false argument. Their pain does not justify inflicting more hurt elsewhere; nor is it transferable. It's the same fallacy used when parents say "eat what's on your plate. There are starving kids in Africa." Eating what's on the plate has no bearing to whether the kids in Africa will starve or not, and blaming Penn State as a whole will not undo any molestation those kids may have had.

/Waiting anxiously for a verdict so there can be closure... one way or another.
 
2012-06-20 02:44:56 PM

abmoraz: Jerry Sandusky has allegedly raped kids. HE is the one on trial, not Penn State. It's annoying and somewhat hurtful when it's referred to as the "Penn State Molestation Trial." If it gets to the level of the Catholic Church, where there are many accusations across multiple people with PSU affiliation, then PSU is the linking factor,


yeah, but there's that decade plus coverup that penn state did do, so that's sort of an issue when pretending that this trial is just about sandusky and not the institutional coverup of kiddy-farking. sort of catholic churchish. hence, why i want the death penalty for the football program. knock it down a peg or twenty.
 
rka
2012-06-20 02:45:16 PM

abmoraz: Jerry Sandusky has allegedly raped kids. HE is the one on trial, not Penn State. It's annoying and somewhat hurtful when it's referred to as the "Penn State Molestation Trial." If it gets to the level of the Catholic Church, where there are many accusations across multiple people with PSU affiliation, then PSU is the linking factor,


You act like PSU doesn't have two (former) officials on trial for perjury in the matter.

You act like one of the major questions isn't about how many people at the school knew of Sandusky's previous "indiscretions" and still allowed Ol' Jerry free access to the facilities. Facilities he used to rape kids.

Oh yeah, Penn State wasn't involved in this at all. (eye roll)

See, this is the problem with PSU alumni. They want there to be ONE monster that they can cast out and bury their heads in the sand about everything else.
 
2012-06-20 02:47:33 PM
She testified that Jerry does not even like sex and they have not had sex in decades
 
2012-06-20 02:48:19 PM

LoneWolf343: MugzyBrown: killershark: I can see that for maybe the particular victims in question. But there was a victim who came forward first, who didn't have the cops "coercing" him [as the defense states] by referring to other victims. So maybe for those charges, the jury finds him not guilty. There are still plenty of other charges and plenty of other victims to get him thrown in jail for a long time.

That wouldn't bother me. But I'd question a lot of Victim 4's testimony for sure at this point.

I'm just going to throw this out there and point out that rape victims are generally not known for their mental stability.

Also, why the hell didn't the prosecution object to anyone who had any remote connection to Penn during jury selection? That DA should lose his job, regardless of the verdict.


Good luck finding anyone in State College without ties to Penn State.

And as a resident of State College, I have yet to meet a single person who wants this guy acquitted. Townies and gownies both want to see this guy quivering in a prison yard by next week at the latest.
 
2012-06-20 02:51:24 PM

abmoraz: LoneWolf343: You don't know much about the culture of college football, do you? People eat, breathe, and sleep their favorite team. It's not that people will actually say "So what if he rapes little boys? I'm voting him not guilty anyway!"

This isn't the SEC. We don't worship football. We were proud of our university and that our football program was supposedly "done right" with a high graduation rate and limited tolerance for off-the-field problems.

What I see from most people affiliated with PSU (full disclosure: I'm an alumnus and live in the area), is that they are upset that the rest of the world doesn't understand the separation between the University, the athletics department, the city, and the accused. Penn State University didn't rape kids. The Penn State Football program didn't rape kids. Joe Paterno didn't rape kids. The lunch lady in the cafeteria didn't rape kids.

Jerry Sandusky has allegedly raped kids. HE is the one on trial, not Penn State. It's annoying and somewhat hurtful when it's referred to as the "Penn State Molestation Trial." If it gets to the level of the Catholic Church, where there are many accusations across multiple people with PSU affiliation, then PSU is the linking factor,

And, before people chime in with "Oh boo-hoo. Think of how the children felt when they were molested", that is a false argument. Their pain does not justify inflicting more hurt elsewhere; nor is it transferable. It's the same fallacy used when parents say "eat what's on your plate. There are starving kids in Africa." Eating what's on the plate has no bearing to whether the kids in Africa will starve or not, and blaming Penn State as a whole will not undo any molestation those kids may have had.

/Waiting anxiously for a verdict so there can be closure... one way or another.


Penn state football is what facilitated this, that is what rational people want YOU to understand.
 
2012-06-20 02:53:09 PM

verbaltoxin: skrame: "None of this stuff that happens to kids ever happens in the public arena..." said Dr. Martin Finkel, a pediatrician with 30 years of experience treating abused children.

Jerry Sandusky, 68, is charged with 51 counts of abuse involving 10 accusers. Prosecutors say he met his victims through the charity he and his wife founded, groomed them, and sexually abused them in motels, in his home and in the Penn State football building.


Nothing more private than then football building of a public university.

Locker rooms. Penn State football locker rooms. Where the expectation of privacy is assumed. He wasn't raping the boys out on the 50 yard line.


The expectation of privacy from the general public may be assumed, but not from the dozens (probably well over a hundred) of players, coaches, other football staff, and university workers such as janitors who have access.
 
2012-06-20 03:00:28 PM

UNAUTHORIZED FINGER: Owangotang: Poor poor joe paterno. He is the real victim, aye?

I can't wait for that testimony! Sandusky is a sick fark, but he'll do well in prison if he likes old man ass too.


ಠ_ಠ
 
2012-06-20 03:09:05 PM

Doctor Funkenstein: Her testimony was straight up creepy. When asked if she and her husband slept in the same bed, all she responded with was that he usually went to sleep before she did. That's it. I hope he takes the stand today. It'll be a freakshow.


i heard that he wanted to testify, but his lawyers told him to sit down and shut the fark up. considering the bob costas interview that was probably some good advice. it could have gotten really farking weird.
 
2012-06-20 03:10:19 PM

MtLebanonBalogna: Being connected in any way with PSU does not mean a juror will be sympathetic to Sandusky. Of all the Penn Staters I know I can't think of one that doesn't think Sandusky isn't guilty of at least most of the charges.


There are 94,000 PSU students and 550K alumni out there, so I can't speak for all of them. However, I've spoken with a whole lot of them and there is a uniformity of revulsion at what Sandusky has wrought there. People want him to freaking burn for what he's done to his victims and to the school.

Yeah, people are really sad about Paterno getting bounced immediately and then dying, but nobody I've talked to has expressed an ounce of support for "Jer."

This also isn't the trial against Penn State. Curley and Schultz still have to face the music for perjury, and there will, no doubt be civil suits against all involved. Jerry Sandusky, like many other predators played everyone around him for fools, using homophobia, philanthropy, and the big business of football to hide and facilitate his crimes.

If people failed to act as they were obligated to do so in reporting or protecting kids, then other heads will need to roll, and the system that allowed it will need to pay.
 
2012-06-20 03:13:17 PM

MattyFridays: I've been weird about Joe Paterno's involvement in this whole mess.

People said "he should have done more"... but what exactly "more" could he have done?

He didn't witness Sandusky doing this... McQueary did. And Paterno told his bosses. Can you file a police report for something you didn't witness and you weren't involved in?

If Paterno did go to the police, they would have wanted to talk to McQueary, which begs the question why he didn't go to the police in the first place.

Paterno evolved from a man who five years ago was so "out of touch" that he wasn't even running the football team and he was just there for fan and booster support to the evil trope of "the man who runs Penn State".

I think, in the long run, Penn State handled this brutally, brutally bad. Their Crisis communication and management was the worst I've ever seen. I think the icing on the cake was having a "moment of silence" at a game after the tragedy broke. HAVING A MOMENT OF SILENCE IS WHAT GOT YOU INTO THIS MESS IN THE FIRST PLACE.


This is such a complete load of Shiat regarding Paterno. every story ever told about that guy says how he was the biggest thing on that campus. how what he said would go in most cases. Here, he just passed the buck and got what he deserved in the end, fired.

Sorry, but when you are looked upon as a true leader of a University and you pass a buck the size of this, you failed. He even admitted as much himself.

I do agree about the McQueary thing. Why didn't he go straight to the police. It's like he thought maybe someone would want to cover the event up to avoid bad publicity. If I see a crime at work, I'm not going to my boss to tell him about it first.
 
2012-06-20 03:15:02 PM

The Muthaship: Levarien: That said, it just takes one Penn St die hard fan to make this a mistrial.

4 employees of PSU and 2 students on the jury.


If they do, they will be betraying the University that definitely wants him found guilty at this point...If he is aquitted, the firing of Paterno the way it went down is going to look so much worse.
 
2012-06-20 03:32:02 PM

srhp29: The Muthaship: Levarien: That said, it just takes one Penn St die hard fan to make this a mistrial.

4 employees of PSU and 2 students on the jury.

If they do, they will be betraying the University that definitely wants him found guilty at this point...If he is aquitted, the firing of Paterno the way it went down is going to look so much worse.


Agreed. If any member of the jury lets their connection with Penn St affect their decision, it will certainly be to convict. A conviction provides a clearer path to closure, removes some of the unwanted attention, and allows all of the blame for what is looking more and more like a systematic failure to be placed on one sick sociopath.

A "Not Guilty" verdict (which I am betting on at the moment) causes a new national furor, puts this case even more front-and-center in the public eye, and drags PSU even further into the gutter.
 
2012-06-20 03:46:47 PM

Maud Dib: This was the 1999 Alamo Bowl incident. And if the Feds won't prosecute, Texas is ready to extradite him, and he'll burn for sure.


Heh, yep. The Bexar County (San Antonio) D.A. has basically come out and said "We'll see what happens in Pennsylvania, but if they don't lock him up for the rest of his life, we'll bring him down here. He'll get a fair trial, and then we'll hang him."
 
2012-06-20 03:48:19 PM
'and we expect a lot of our kids."

Like semen when they fart.
 
2012-06-20 03:53:27 PM

scottydoesntknow: The Muthaship: MugzyBrown: ftfy. if you're going to go. go all out.

I'm not making anything up.. officers were on tape coaching up one of the witnesses.. They testified they never did such a thing.

Link, please.

Link

Yahoo reported it yesterday. A few redlinks went up here


wow coaching witnesses. that never happens. next there will be a link about lawyers having their clients dress in certain ways to get sympathy from the jury.

They should definitely let this man go free on a bullshiat technicality.
 
2012-06-20 04:01:50 PM

AbbeySomeone: She's going to say whatever she needs to to cover both their asses. She knew something was up. She is a classic enabler.


I think shes watching her cushy retirement fly out the window and now shes looking at living in a shiatty nursing home in a few years while sandusky lives in prison.
 
2012-06-20 04:05:29 PM

MugzyBrown: Not a lot of talk about the two officers who lied under oath about if they prepped accusers about what other accusers were saying about Sandusky.


The problem was they asked those questions after they already gave testimony, it sounds like a perry mason moment but its not, all those questions happened to the end of their interviews, when they already talked about how sandusky acted inappropriately.
 
2012-06-20 04:21:45 PM

JohnBigBootay: The press wants everything to be black and white but it's just not.


Right, it is 50 shades of gray.
 
2012-06-20 04:25:20 PM

quickdraw: *shudder*
Shes obviously evil. No kind person would wear that awful lime green sweater where others would have to see it.


She'd look better in boy shorts.
 
2012-06-20 04:30:29 PM

rudemix: 'and we expect a lot of our kids."

Like semen when they fart.


Certainly lived up to your handle. Christ ...
 
2012-06-20 04:32:05 PM

Hofheim: [img525.imageshack.us image 112x157]


Can someone generate a larger version of this?
 
2012-06-20 04:33:27 PM

desertgeek: To be fair, we saw how the students at that school reacted when Paterno got canned. Any sane, rational person wouldn't have joined a riot over a football coach getting fired. That sort of partisanship does seem to exist up there.


Shock and denial, anger and bargaining, pain and guilt, etc. - seven stages of grief and all that. It was entirely predictable. We're all the same species after all. I would expect a guy who'd been around for fifty years to engender more loyalty than a guy who had been around for three. I don't excuse wrong action. I just understand it. I mean if you are asking me to believe that the football fans of Penn State are somehow markedly different in their moral makeup in a negative way than, say, people in Oklahoma or Florida or Washington or Michigan - well, I'm sorry. But I don't. Like it or not we're all more alike than different. One thing that is shockingly consistent in child abuse cases is the initial disbelief that your father or brother or friend or uncle or priest or football coach, etc. could have been involved. The crowd/mob mentality certainly didn't help. People get emboldened by lots of things - numbers, anonymity, emotion, etc. and act in a way that they normally wouldn't. My bother in-law the anarchist painted his truck red, white and blue on September 12th - he still can't believe he did it. Crises tend to cause some of us to go a bit nuts sometimes. We're often embarrassed soon afterwards. Again, I don't excuse it - I just understand it and I don't think it makes them child-molester enabling monsters.
 
2012-06-20 04:34:09 PM

Broktun: Right, it is 50 shades of gray.


Heh. Good one.
 
2012-06-20 04:40:59 PM

drivingsouth: I had a Mexican dinner last night that should have been called the "Jerry Sandusky". It made my ass hurt and I had to throw out my underwear.


I hope you get a chance to tell that joke in front of one of his rape victims.

I'm sure it'll be a hit.
 
rka
2012-06-20 04:55:38 PM

JohnBigBootay: I would expect a guy who'd been around for fifty years to engender more loyalty than a guy who had been around for three. I don't excuse wrong action. I just understand it. I mean if you are asking me to believe that the football fans of Penn State are somehow markedly different in their moral makeup in a negative way than, say, people in Oklahoma or Florida or Washington or Michigan - well, I'm sorry. But I don't.


Take a long time coach...Paterno, Bryant, Bobby Knight, whatever. Stick them in an isolated college town where that is about the only thing going (State College PA, College Station TX, Lincoln NB) and sure, you could see this hero worship elsewhere.

But its still damn creepy. Like some sort of horror movie where everything appears idyllic in some charming community but the town council turns out to be a bunch of flesh eating lizard people that the rest of the town sacrifices their teenage daughters and sons to.
 
2012-06-20 04:55:40 PM

airsupport: drivingsouth: I had a Mexican dinner last night that should have been called the "Jerry Sandusky". It made my ass hurt and I had to throw out my underwear.

I hope you get a chance to tell that joke in front of one of his rape victims.

I'm sure it'll be a hit.


Someone sounds a little butt-hurt.
 
2012-06-20 05:06:17 PM

rka: But its still damn creepy. Like some sort of horror movie where everything appears idyllic in some charming community but the town council turns out to be a bunch of flesh eating lizard people that the rest of the town sacrifices their teenage daughters and sons to.


Yeah. That's life with homo sapiens sapiens. We're kind of weird. We build them up and we tear them down and act all kinds of crazy in between. To this day people go to Graceland and cry like babies. Untold thousands worship Michael Jackson as if he were a living god. Many of us rail against being overtaxed yet gladly turn over 10% of our income based on passages in a book written 2,000 years ago. Some of us spend many hours learning how to speak fictional languages. We're all a little crazy, we're just crazy in different ways.
 
2012-06-20 05:13:13 PM
I am praying to my Lord and Savior Jesus Christ that Jerry doesn't get off.
 
2012-06-20 05:21:59 PM

mc_madness: I am praying to my Lord and Savior Jesus Christ that Jerry doesn't get off.


I don't wish to be callous but if He has proven one thing time and again throughout history it's that He doesn't give two shiats about involving himself in what we may or may not want. But I suppose it can't hurt. So give it the old Pascal's Wager college try - so to speak.
 
2012-06-20 05:28:58 PM

A Fark Handle: death


I don't see Penn State or any other program getting the death penalty. It does more harm than good and punishes people, players, and fans for example that have had nothing to do with this.
 
2012-06-20 05:30:19 PM

Owangotang: Penn state football is what facilitated this, that is what rational people want YOU to understand.


Because the towel boy facilitated. The guy who paints the lines facilitated it. The person who handles tickets facilitated it. The woman who handles catering for visiting teams facilitated it. All the players facilitated it. Etc... That's what you are saying when you say "Penn State Football is what facilitated it." You are dehumanizing the monster who did and putting the onus on a large group of innocents just to have your witch hunt instead of the monsters who deserve it.

It's even more absurd when you extend the actions of 1 really bad man and 2-4 others (who have been accused of a possible cover-up) from 3 to the nearly 10,000 that were involved in the football program since Sandusky was hired. It becomes outright ludicrous when you apply that same logic to vilify over 200,000 people affiliated with the university for the actions of 3 to 5 people.

WHen you say "Penn State Molestation case" rather than the "Sandusky Molestation case" you are accusing everyone who is affiliated with Penn State of molestation. You're implying that I whipped out my cock at some point and had my way with an 8yr old. THAT is what pisses me off about it. You are so ignorant that you lump myself and 200,000 other completely innocent people who had no idea about any of this, had no power to stop it, had no way of doing anything about anything. Direct your anger, hate, and vitrol where it belongs, at the actual people involved.

/ let me guess, you get upset when foreigners blame Americans for what Obama or George W. Bush do/did but blaming another class of people for what their leaders did is A-Ok...

farkingnotworking: Good luck finding anyone in State College without ties to Penn State.

And as a resident of State College, I have yet to meet a single person who wants this guy acquitted. Townies and gownies both want to see this guy quivering in a prison yard by next week at the latest.


SO very much THIS. If convicted, I hope he never sees the light of day again.
 
2012-06-20 05:33:59 PM

abmoraz: Owangotang: Penn state football is what facilitated this, that is what rational people want YOU to understand.

Because the towel boy facilitated. The guy who paints the lines facilitated it. The person who handles tickets facilitated it. The woman who handles catering for visiting teams facilitated it. All the players facilitated it. Etc... That's what you are saying when you say "Penn State Football is what facilitated it." You are dehumanizing the monster who did and putting the onus on a large group of innocents just to have your witch hunt instead of the monsters who deserve it.

It's even more absurd when you extend the actions of 1 really bad man and 2-4 others (who have been accused of a possible cover-up) from 3 to the nearly 10,000 that were involved in the football program since Sandusky was hired. It becomes outright ludicrous when you apply that same logic to vilify over 200,000 people affiliated with the university for the actions of 3 to 5 people.

WHen you say "Penn State Molestation case" rather than the "Sandusky Molestation case" you are accusing everyone who is affiliated with Penn State of molestation. You're implying that I whipped out my cock at some point and had my way with an 8yr old. THAT is what pisses me off about it. You are so ignorant that you lump myself and 200,000 other completely innocent people who had no idea about any of this, had no power to stop it, had no way of doing anything about anything. Direct your anger, hate, and vitrol where it belongs, at the actual people involved.

/ let me guess, you get upset when foreigners blame Americans for what Obama or George W. Bush do/did but blaming another class of people for what their leaders did is A-Ok...

farkingnotworking: Good luck finding anyone in State College without ties to Penn State.

And as a resident of State College, I have yet to meet a single person who wants this guy acquitted. Townies and gownies both want to see this guy quivering in a prison yard b ...


As a PSU alum, I hope Sandusky rots in jail and burns in hell, his perversion took down many people there and tore the close-knit PSU family part. My alma mater will bounce back and recover from this better than ever. Believe me, I am sick and tired of people condemning PSU as a whole instead of the few people involved. Sometimes I like to wonder if they even went to college.
 
2012-06-20 05:42:07 PM

kdawg7736: A Fark Handle: death

I don't see Penn State or any other program getting the death penalty. It does more harm than good and punishes people, players, and fans for example that have had nothing to do with this.


the players can transfer without restriction. the power of the football program was the problem, and the death penalty is a great way to reduce the power of the football program. when there's a decade plus institutional coverup of kiddy-rape some eggs have to get broke. it's just one season without the games for the fans. they'll survive.
 
2012-06-20 05:43:37 PM

abmoraz: WHen you say "Penn State Molestation case" rather than the "Sandusky Molestation case" you are accusing everyone who is affiliated with Penn State of molestation.


When I refer to Sandusky, I occasionally call him "that kiddy-diddler from Penn State". I don't think the entire university was raping young boys, but I think he was, and he worked for Penn State and represented the school in an official capacity.

The freaking vice president of my alma mater was caught with a 15-year-old boy in his car, at night, in a park. Whether or not it's fair, the university is going to be associated with some NAMBLA action, at least indirectly.
 
2012-06-20 05:44:04 PM
No "let the butthurt flow through you" pic yet???
 
2012-06-20 05:44:11 PM

rka: See, this is the problem with PSU alumni. They want there to be ONE monster that they can cast out and bury their heads in the sand about everything else.


No, we want those that did wrong to be punished and the innocent to go free. You will never convince me that hundreds of thousands of innocents should be forced to pay for the crimes a few guilty.
 
2012-06-20 05:50:50 PM

Derwood: I went to school with three of the Sandusky kids and went to the same church as the Sandusky family.

/NOT getting a kick out of, well, any of this


*shudder*
 
2012-06-20 05:55:06 PM

A Fark Handle: the death penalty


You keep bringing that up but I just don't see it.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Death_penalty_%28NCAA%29

The NCAA has levied the death penalty five times. In every instance there was in some way, shape, or form players receiving improper benefits. Point shaving, pay for play, illegal scholarships, academic fraud, no-work jobs, ineligible players, etc. There's simply no player involvement whatsoever here and I don't see the NCAA straying that far from their mandate. This is a purely criminal matter. That there will be no death penalty for Penn State football is something I'd be happy to wager on.
 
2012-06-20 05:55:42 PM

kdawg7736: A Fark Handle: death

I don't see Penn State or any other program getting the death penalty. It does more harm than good and punishes people, players, and fans for example that have had nothing to do with this.


Well, they're going to get hammered. That's just reality. An institutionalized cover up of child rape by a fairly high profile member of the university's very high profile football program is going to lead to serious problems.

It could mean a shut down of the athletic department. It could mean the school losing federal funding. I don't think anyone really knows what they're going to get for this mess. But everyone should be prepared for serious consequences for the lack of action from university administrators.
 
2012-06-20 06:01:08 PM

abmoraz: No, we want those that did wrong to be punished and the innocent to go free. You will never convince me that hundreds of thousands of innocents should be forced to pay for the crimes a few guilty.


Define "pay", though. I don't think anyone's calling for thousands of people to go to jail. But, did thousands of people contribute to a culture where Joe Paterno ruled his domain as though he was royalty? Sure. Did Paterno fail to act on information about his trusted lieutenant engaging in despicable acts? Yes.

Basically, was Jerry Sandusky enabled because of his attachment to the football program at Penn State? It's hard to argue that he was not. Now, I don't think Penn State should get the death penalty, because they committed no NCAA violations. I do think the school should voluntarily refuse to field a team for a season, as a reminder. As a way to say "we let this program become too powerful, and children's lives were damaged. Never again."

But the money is too big to have that happen.
 
2012-06-20 06:01:12 PM

desertgeek: Well, they're going to get hammered.


Assuming a conviction and possibly without it I'd say it's even money that what they'll get is civil suits and a lot of them. Some staff members will lose jobs of course but I doubt they lose funding or receive NCAA sanctions. People just see blood in the water because they are fans of another football school. But this kind of shiat happens every day in churches and schools all over the land but they don't close down all the schools and churches. They prosecute the offenders and fire staff members who acted improperly. Frankly I think that's how it should be. Because we wouldn't have many schools or churches left if we closed them all after improper sexual conduct.
 
2012-06-20 06:06:12 PM

JohnBigBootay: A Fark Handle: the death penalty

You keep bringing that up but I just don't see it.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Death_penalty_%28NCAA%29

The NCAA has levied the death penalty five times. In every instance there was in some way, shape, or form players receiving improper benefits. Point shaving, pay for play, illegal scholarships, academic fraud, no-work jobs, ineligible players, etc. There's simply no player involvement whatsoever here and I don't see the NCAA straying that far from their mandate. This is a purely criminal matter. That there will be no death penalty for Penn State football is something I'd be happy to wager on.


oh, i know there won't be. doesn't mean there shouldn't be.
 
2012-06-20 06:10:43 PM

Gonz: abmoraz: No, we want those that did wrong to be punished and the innocent to go free. You will never convince me that hundreds of thousands of innocents should be forced to pay for the crimes a few guilty.

Define "pay", though. I don't think anyone's calling for thousands of people to go to jail. But, did thousands of people contribute to a culture where Joe Paterno ruled his domain as though he was royalty? Sure. Did Paterno fail to act on information about his trusted lieutenant engaging in despicable acts? Yes.

Basically, was Jerry Sandusky enabled because of his attachment to the football program at Penn State? It's hard to argue that he was not. Now, I don't think Penn State should get the death penalty, because they committed no NCAA violations. I do think the school should voluntarily refuse to field a team for a season, as a reminder. As a way to say "we let this program become too powerful, and children's lives were damaged. Never again."

But the money is too big to have that happen.


Your idea of suspending the football team for a year still harms people that had absolutely nothing to do with this.

The AD, the coach, a majority of the coaching staff, and the president of the university are out and gone. Penn State is going to pay for it in civil court (which they should). What else do you WANT in this situation? All of the enablers are GONE. Any thing else harms and punishes people who were not involved.
 
2012-06-20 06:11:20 PM

A Fark Handle: oh, i know there won't be. doesn't mean there shouldn't be.


Personally I'd like to see less NCAA involvement across the board. Some of their rulings are just flat-out nonsensical and I'd like to see it blown up and reformed. Without their bent for historical revisionism via vacated titles and after-the-fact forfeits. I find the whole concept of title-stripping crazy and next to meaningless.
 
2012-06-20 06:14:04 PM

A Fark Handle: oh, i know there won't be. doesn't mean there shouldn't be.


I'd argue that there shouldn't be. Criminal acts are outside the scope of the NCAA's concerns.
 
2012-06-20 06:15:36 PM

A Fark Handle:

oh, i know there won't be. doesn't mean there shouldn't be.


Again. Everyone who is involved in this, either directly or indirectly, has either lost their job, are facing criminal charges, or DEAD.

Why EXACTLY do you want? Why should a kid who has done ABSOLUTELY NOTHING WRONG be punished with the death penalty? I mean, these kids can transfer out, but why should they? Maybe they want to be a part of rebuilding what was damaged.
 
2012-06-20 06:18:17 PM

abmoraz: rka: See, this is the problem with PSU alumni. They want there to be ONE monster that they can cast out and bury their heads in the sand about everything else.

No, we want those that did wrong to be punished and the innocent to go free. You will never convince me that hundreds of thousands of innocents should be forced to pay for the crimes a few guilty.


Don't worry, your precious football program will be ok. Its' power will remain intact, enough so that another coach may someday choose to protect BIG TIME COLLEGE FOOTBALL over protecting kids, like paterno did.

"I'm sorry you had to see that." Joe paterno to mcqueary when mcqueary came to paterno. Not WHAT THE HELL??? Not call the cops. I'm sorry you had to see that. Sounds like he knew about it, huh?

Your football will be ok because it is bigger than even child rape, sadly.
 
2012-06-20 06:19:59 PM

MattyFridays: Maybe they want to be a part of rebuilding what was damaged.


Hey - none of that positive, community-healing kind of namby pamby talk around here buddy. Tragedies are to be wallowed in and left as they were.
 
2012-06-20 06:20:07 PM
So, did any actual victims testify? Or just accusers? There is a difference. Because without a victim, there's no crime. Not a lawyer but I made a great shrimp scampi last night.
 
2012-06-20 06:23:54 PM

Owangotang:

"I'm sorry you had to see that." Joe paterno to mcqueary when mcqueary came to paterno. Not WHAT THE HELL??? Not call the cops. I'm sorry you had to see that. Sounds like he knew about it, huh?

Your football will be ok because it is bigger than even child rape, sadly.


Here's why you're a troll: You're cherry picking quotes and manipulating the context to fit your needs.

Let's take a look at the whole context, shall we?

"(Paterno) was slumped back in his chair, he said well I'm sorry you had to see that. It's terrible. I need to think and tell some people about what you saw and I'll let you know what we'll do next."

Link

There's a reason why she won the farking pulitzer and you're a troll.
 
2012-06-20 06:25:54 PM

Gonz: Basically, was Jerry Sandusky enabled because of his attachment to the football program at Penn State? It's hard to argue that he was not. Now, I don't think Penn State should get the death penalty, because they committed no NCAA violations. I do think the school should voluntarily refuse to field a team for a season, as a reminder. As a way to say "we let this program become too powerful, and children's lives were damaged. Never again."

But the money is too big to have that happen.


That would be catastrophic to the area. It wont happen. As someone that owned a business in town and worked for some other ones, the 7 or 8 home football games is the difference between making and breaking a business here. Not fielding a team for a season would bankrupt 10s of thousands of local residents.

No, I am not exaggerating. The restaurant I worked at in school ran at a loss the entire year except those 8 weeks (+ Blue/White, Artsfest, and 4th fest). I can tell you that I don't work in the service industry any more, nor do work for the university, but if there was no season, I would likely lose my job and therefore my house. Unfortunately, I'm one of the more insulated people around here. I shudder to think what would happen to the rest of the people in the area. Football weekends are the "Christmas rush" for almost all businesses here. Without that influx of people to triple the population those weekends, you'd have another (albeit smaller) Detroit.
 
2012-06-20 06:28:08 PM

MattyFridays: Your idea of suspending the football team for a year still harms people that had absolutely nothing to do with this.


Who? Who would it harm? The players? They get to keep their scholarship and redshirt. Non-revenue sports? Penn State's athletic endowment can handle a year without football (and, this is why I said money would prevent it from happening). Other schools, who would lose a game with Penn State? I'll listen to that argument.

The fans of Penn State? That's where your "all the enablers are gone" argument loses steam, because JoePa's status as King of State College is a factor in all this. If he was just a regular coach, everything about this would have been different. I'm not saying that Penn State fans diddled kids. I'm saying Penn State fans, by making their head football coach into the figure he was, played a role in creating an environment where all the other actions were possible.
 
2012-06-20 06:28:31 PM

MattyFridays: Owangotang:

"I'm sorry you had to see that." Joe paterno to mcqueary when mcqueary came to paterno. Not WHAT THE HELL??? Not call the cops. I'm sorry you had to see that. Sounds like he knew about it, huh?

Your football will be ok because it is bigger than even child rape, sadly.

Here's why you're a troll: You're cherry picking quotes and manipulating the context to fit your needs.

Let's take a look at the whole context, shall we?

"(Paterno) was slumped back in his chair, he said well I'm sorry you had to see that. It's terrible. I need to think and tell some people about what you saw and I'll let you know what we'll do next."

Link

There's a reason why she won the farking pulitzer and you're a troll.


How does that context make it look ANY better? It is easy for you to just label me a troll, much easier it seems than to admit penn state as an institution facilitated kid rape. Your anger is misdirected.
 
2012-06-20 06:31:30 PM

JohnBigBootay: MattyFridays: Maybe they want to be a part of rebuilding what was damaged.

Hey - none of that positive, community-healing kind of namby pamby talk around here buddy. Tragedies are to be wallowed in and left as they were.


As someone

abmoraz:

That would be catastrophic to the area. It wont happen. As someone that owned a business in town and worked for some other ones, the 7 or 8 home football games is the difference between making and breaking a business here. Not fielding a team for a season would bankrupt 10s of thousands of local residents.

No, I am not exaggerating. The restaurant I worked at in school ran at a loss the entire year except those 8 weeks (+ Blue/White, Artsfest, and 4th fest). I can tell you that I don't work in the service industry any more, nor do work for the university, but if there was no season, I would likely lose my job and therefore my house. Unfortunately, I'm one of the more insulated people around here. I shudder to think what would happen to the rest of the people in the area. Football weekends are the "Christmas rush" for almost all businesses here. Without that influx of people to triple the population those weekends, you'd have another (albeit smaller) Detroit.


Sorry, according to Owangotang, every single person in Happy Valley are complicit enablers of what happened and need to be punished.
 
2012-06-20 06:35:07 PM

Owangotang: abmoraz: rka: See, this is the problem with PSU alumni. They want there to be ONE monster that they can cast out and bury their heads in the sand about everything else.

No, we want those that did wrong to be punished and the innocent to go free. You will never convince me that hundreds of thousands of innocents should be forced to pay for the crimes a few guilty.

Don't worry, your precious football program will be ok. Its' power will remain intact, enough so that another coach may someday choose to protect BIG TIME COLLEGE FOOTBALL over protecting kids, like paterno did.

"I'm sorry you had to see that." Joe paterno to mcqueary when mcqueary came to paterno. Not WHAT THE HELL??? Not call the cops. I'm sorry you had to see that. Sounds like he knew about it, huh?

Your football will be ok because it is bigger than even child rape, sadly.


Again, you'll never convince me that punishing a large entity (of which the vast majority had no connection to the crime) for the actions of a (few) individual(s) is a just and good idea. It may not be on the level of child rape, but you are still punishing powerless individuals for something they have no control over.

You can bring up the individuals that committed crimes and I will tell you every time "Those individuals should be charged and tried, not everyone else." Go hunt for your witches elsewhere.
 
2012-06-20 06:35:43 PM

JohnBigBootay: A Fark Handle: oh, i know there won't be. doesn't mean there shouldn't be.

Personally I'd like to see less NCAA involvement across the board. Some of their rulings are just flat-out nonsensical and I'd like to see it blown up and reformed. Without their bent for historical revisionism via vacated titles and after-the-fact forfeits. I find the whole concept of title-stripping crazy and next to meaningless.


i complete agree that most of what the ncaa does stupid, pointless, or worse. i just know that they actually have the power to knock down the penn state football program. and since the power of that program was the problem, i'm just looking for a solution.

MattyFridays: A Fark Handle:

oh, i know there won't be. doesn't mean there shouldn't be.

Again. Everyone who is involved in this, either directly or indirectly, has either lost their job, are facing criminal charges, or DEAD.

Why EXACTLY do you want? Why should a kid who has done ABSOLUTELY NOTHING WRONG be punished with the death penalty? I mean, these kids can transfer out, but why should they? Maybe they want to be a part of rebuilding what was damaged.


1) stop hiding behind adults and calling them kids. if they want to rebuild they can stay behind, the death penalty doesn't mean no more football ever, just a one or so. turns out, if you work for an employer who had an ongoing decade plus institutional coverup of kiddy-rape you might lose your job when the company folds. 2) exactly what i want is the power of the penn state football program reduced and the death penalty does that (see smu).

/they couldn't even cancel the next home game...gotta make the money, money, money.
 
2012-06-20 06:36:12 PM

MattyFridays: Sorry, according to Owangotang, every single person in Happy Valley are complicit enablers of what happened and need to be punished.


No, he's arguing that JoePa should have done more than apologize to McQueary. I'm the one calling for Happy Detroit.
 
2012-06-20 06:36:37 PM

Gonz: Who? Who would it harm?


You're asking the wrong question. The question is who would it help? And the answer is - no one. It's just pointless bloodlust and serves no constructive purpose. The idea that this all too common crime was committed because Joe Paterno was so popular is absurd. It happens every farking day despite the absence of Joe Paterno. And the parents and administrators and police and social workers and friends quite frequently miss the signs and/or fail to prosecute in those cases as well. But no one much gives a shiat about shutting them down because they are not associated with a football rival.
 
2012-06-20 06:37:00 PM

MattyFridays: Sorry, according to Owangotang, every single person in Happy Valley are complicit enablers of what happened and need to be punished.


I'm starting to see that. I'm wondering if he'll be at my door tonight to arrest me and haul me to jail for actually caring about justice rather than outrage and mob rule.
 
2012-06-20 06:38:28 PM

MattyFridays: JohnBigBootay: MattyFridays: Maybe they want to be a part of rebuilding what was damaged.

Hey - none of that positive, community-healing kind of namby pamby talk around here buddy. Tragedies are to be wallowed in and left as they were.

As someoneabmoraz:

That would be catastrophic to the area. It wont happen. As someone that owned a business in town and worked for some other ones, the 7 or 8 home football games is the difference between making and breaking a business here. Not fielding a team for a season would bankrupt 10s of thousands of local residents.

No, I am not exaggerating. The restaurant I worked at in school ran at a loss the entire year except those 8 weeks (+ Blue/White, Artsfest, and 4th fest). I can tell you that I don't work in the service industry any more, nor do work for the university, but if there was no season, I would likely lose my job and therefore my house. Unfortunately, I'm one of the more insulated people around here. I shudder to think what would happen to the rest of the people in the area. Football weekends are the "Christmas rush" for almost all businesses here. Without that influx of people to triple the population those weekends, you'd have another (albeit smaller) Detroit.

Sorry, according to Owangotang, every single person in Happy Valley are complicit enablers of what happened and need to be punished.


You'll forgive me if I find the argument "yes what happened is terrible but it was the foundation for our town and if you destroy it you destroy us too" to be limp. The very money coming into that place is what paterno had to decide to protect instead of protecting kids. Do you really want to preserve the success of the area despite many young boys bring sacrificed to protect it?
 
2012-06-20 06:42:57 PM

JohnBigBootay: Gonz: Who? Who would it harm?

You're asking the wrong question. The question is who would it help? And the answer is - no one. It's just pointless bloodlust and serves no constructive purpose. The idea that this all too common crime was committed because Joe Paterno was so popular is absurd. It happens every farking day despite the absence of Joe Paterno. And the parents and administrators and police and social workers and friends quite frequently miss the signs and/or fail to prosecute in those cases as well. But no one much gives a shiat about shutting them down because they are not associated with a football rival.


Where is the lesson learned in all this if nothing happens to psu football? We know now that the power BIG TIME COLLEGE FOOTBALL afforded to penn state is partially to blame for sandusky not being stopped sooner.
 
2012-06-20 06:45:18 PM
All of this makes what SMU did seem so trivial. IF EVER there was a case for the death penalty of a football program, this is it. But since it's the Catholics money we're talking about, it will never happen. So disgusting, so vile, so evil....good thing they weren't paying players because that would have been really bad.
 
2012-06-20 06:47:37 PM

JohnBigBootay: You're asking the wrong question. The question is who would it help? And the answer is - no one.


The football program at Penn State was such a juggernaut that a child predator felt very comfortable hiding behind its image, seemingly with the attitude that nothing negative would happen to him because of his association with that institution. He felt so certain of this that he even used it to transport children across the nation for his actions.

The only reason that I don't feel more strongly about this is because Joe Paterno is dead, and with him died a lot of that "untouchable" influence.
 
2012-06-20 06:54:50 PM

A Fark Handle: and since the power of that program was the problem, i'm just looking for a solution.


I disagree. I think the problem was Jerry Sandusky. With the subset of problems of the university president not calling for a full investigation after being informed and the police not doing a more thorough investigation after the initial allegations and paterno not following up with the pres about what was happening after he told him. Lots of people should have pushed harder. Now we find this particular crime so reprehensible that we want to spread the blame but the fact is this case played out like hundreds if not thousands of cases before it. How many times have we heard the case of the parent or the teacher or the social worker or the police missing the chance to end a horrible situation early? It's probably a weekly event on fark. It's a downright dirty shame is what it is but I'm not going to sit here and pretend this one is more important because it happened in the setting of college football. It's always a tragedy. And there are usually people who didn't do enough to stop it - either in the family or the institution or both. You find the offender and you punish him to the full extent of the law. You fire or prosecute staff members or authorities who acted improperly. And then you move on and make sure you try to create an environment where it doesn't happen again. You don't punish the whole town. I mean you could but it would serve no constructive purpose.
 
2012-06-20 06:56:01 PM

Owangotang: You'll forgive me if I find the argument "yes what happened is terrible but it was the foundation for our town and if you destroy it you destroy us too" to be limp. The very money coming into that place is what paterno had to decide to protect instead of protecting kids. Do you really want to preserve the success of the area despite many young boys bring sacrificed to protect it?


So tell me, how many families will need to be sacrificed to unmolest those boys?

Your line "yes what happened is terrible but it was the foundation for our town and if you destroy it you destroy us too" is at best, dishonest, at worst, a bald faced lie. What Sandusky did is not the foundation of our town, nor does playing 8 football games a year here suddenly bring on scores of molestations.

Owangotang: Where is the lesson learned in all this if nothing happens to psu football? We know now that the power BIG TIME COLLEGE FOOTBALL afforded to penn state is partially to blame for sandusky not being stopped sooner.


The lesson is learned in the courts of law, not the courts of public opinion. The lesson will be learned when Sandusky's case wraps up this week. It will be learned when Curley and Shultz have their day in court for perjury. It will be learned in the civil suits that may or may not be filed. Conduct your witch hunt elsewhere. This isn't Salem in the 1600s. Those that are guilty will be found and punished.
 
2012-06-20 07:02:20 PM

Gonz: seemingly with the attitude that nothing negative would happen to him


That simply makes him like every other child predator in the history of child predators. If he were a fireman or a banker or a homeless person or a pop star he'd have felt no different. Have we not yet learned that this odd deviant compulsion has no preference when it comes to race, gender, socieconomic background or religious affiliation?
 
2012-06-20 07:04:14 PM

Gonz: The only reason that I don't feel more strongly about this is because Joe Paterno is dead, and with him died a lot of that "untouchable" influence.


As someone that lived in State College for 18 years, I can tell you with 100% certainty, the only people that thought that Joe had "untouchable influence" were not from this area. Joe lost that in the late 90s. "Joe Must Go" was a common chant up until this past year. He may have been untouchable in the 80s and even into the early 90s, but that was far from the case. It's not like tenure in teaching. He had been on thin ice with the AD and the Trustees for a long time.
 
2012-06-20 07:07:20 PM

AbbeySomeone: She's going to say whatever she needs to to cover both their asses. She knew something was up. She is a classic enabler.


Watch, just watch... if she's eventually charged with a crime (let's say perjury), she'll reverse course quickly and say things like "he threatened me to keep quiet!" And the charges will be dropped.
 
2012-06-20 07:09:48 PM

drivingsouth: I had a Mexican dinner last night that should have been called the "Jerry Sandusky". It made my ass hurt and I had to throw out my underwear.


I'm going to borrow that one. It's almost as good as some others I've heard.

My favorite so far is what's grosser than a dirty Sanchez?

/a Penn State Sanchez
//8 year olds, dude
 
2012-06-20 07:10:31 PM

Levarien: MugzyBrown: ftfy. if you're going to go. go all out.

I'm not making anything up.. officers were on tape coaching up one of the witnesses.. They testified they never did such a thing.

Amendola seems intent on proving that the police are somehow willingly being duped by a cabal of young men looking to get rich. He has no answer for McQueary's testimony, no answer for those creepy letters, no answers for the statements made to the mother of one of the victims back in 1998.

That said, it just takes one Penn St die hard fan to make this a mistrial.


There are NO Penn State fans giving Sandusky any special treatment. Quite the opposite, actually.
 
2012-06-20 07:11:02 PM

UNAUTHORIZED FINGER: Saw this early this morning, and immediately thought:

[thehiberniatimes.com image 300x450]

/Palpatine works too


I'm confused, isn't that Palpatine? Not sure why he's wearing white though, that's not very appropriate for a Sith Lord.
 
2012-06-20 07:28:03 PM

JohnBigBootay: PoochUMD: Isn't the love for that football team the reason it was allowed to go on for 10+ years?

Not to my mind. I'd imagine it went on for the same reason it always goes on. Incompetence. Guilt. Shame. Disbelief. Fact is most child abuse goes unreported and most child abusers are family members or close family friends. The is the same thing writ large.


Wrong. University officials knew about Sandusky's perversions in some detail at least as early as 2001, and there is no hint of disbelief, guilt or shame in their emailsLink; they knew what had happened and chose to do nothing because they felt inaction was "humane." I'm sure the majority of Penn State alumni and employees aren't this twisted, but it is well documented that some of them are, and all it takes is one.
 
2012-06-20 07:45:56 PM

malaktaus: Wrong. University officials knew


And I certainly want those university officials punished. I was responding to a particular post and speaking of a community of people, not one person or the other. Besides - the people you are talking about have been fired and face possible prosecution themselves do they not?
 
2012-06-20 07:56:13 PM

MattyFridays: A Fark Handle:

oh, i know there won't be. doesn't mean there shouldn't be.

Again. Everyone who is involved in this, either directly or indirectly, has either lost their job, are facing criminal charges, or DEAD.

Why EXACTLY do you want? Why should a kid who has done ABSOLUTELY NOTHING WRONG be punished with the death penalty? I mean, these kids can transfer out, but why should they? Maybe they want to be a part of rebuilding what was damaged.


It should be obvious by now that this whole abortion was allowed to continue for such a long time because the football program at Penn State is so very cherished. When Paterno was fired for his abject moral failure, the response of the student body was to riot in protest of his dismissal, not the rape he helped cover up. It's abundantly clear that the Penn State football program was and continues to be a deeply unhealthy influence. Should Penn State be shut down? Of course not, that's absurd. Should the football program be banned? Absolutely, and not just for a year, for a long period of time, I would say at least a decade. Penn State isn't a football team, it's a university, and too many of the students and faculty seem to have forgotten that simple fact.
 
2012-06-20 08:00:33 PM

MattyFridays: Paterno evolved from a man who five years ago was so "out of touch" that he wasn't even running the football team and he was just there for fan and booster support to the evil trope of "the man who runs Penn State".


I have no problem with the idea JoePa was only there for PR reasons, as long as they vacate his wins after 1998.
 
2012-06-20 08:00:50 PM
"Save us!" screamed the children from the basement... and Dottie looked up from her crossword puzzle and whispered "No."
 
2012-06-20 08:07:35 PM

JohnBigBootay:

And I certainly want those university officials punished. I was responding to a particular post and speaking of a community of people, not one person or the other. Besides - the people you are talking about have been fired and face possible prosecution themselves do they not?


From your farking post: "Fact is most child abuse goes unreported and most child abusers are family members or close family friends. The is the same thing writ large."

This is completely inconsistent with your response to my post. Or are you saying that abuse is generally "reported" to a community of people? Are you dishonest or merely obtuse? See, this is why Penn State is so hated these days; it isn't the abuse that's causing it, it's the fact that students and alumni are trying so very hard to convince the world that everything is a-ok when it's clear to everyone that it isn't. It isn't just Curley and Schultz, it's the administration in general that needs to be investigated.
 
2012-06-20 08:29:07 PM

LoneWolf343: JohnBigBootay: LoneWolf343: Also, why the hell didn't the prosecution object to anyone who had any remote connection to Penn during jury selection? That DA should lose his job, regardless of the verdict.

I still find it shocking that there are people who believe jurors would vote to acquit in the face of credible abuse testimony because of their favorite football team. But I suppose the fact you'd insinuate it proves that partisanship of that ilk exists.

You don't know much about the culture of college football, do you? People eat, breathe, and sleep their favorite team. It's not that people will actually say "So what if he rapes little boys? I'm voting him not guilty anyway!" It's because people can get so star-struck about their personal heroes that they are unable to consider the possibility that said heroes may not be heroic at all. They have already made up their minds that he is being railroaded, despite the mountain of evidence. There is not one bit of proof that they could not explain away as fabricated, misinterpreted, or just plain false. Mr. Sandusky could pork a kid right in front of the jury box, and his fans would claim entrapment.

Granted, its not as if somebody who happens to work for or study at Penn St. would be incapable of impartiality. It's a big university, and someone could spend his whole tenure there and never engage with the sports program. He might actually even resent it. Yet, I would not have taken that chance. In fact, I probably would have asked if jurors followed college football at all, and bumped those that answered yes. Sports make people stupid.


I went to Penn State, I went to the games. I had no freaking clue who Sandusky was until this hit the news.
 
2012-06-20 08:35:40 PM

suburbanguy: Levarien: MugzyBrown: ftfy. if you're going to go. go all out.

I'm not making anything up.. officers were on tape coaching up one of the witnesses.. They testified they never did such a thing.

Amendola seems intent on proving that the police are somehow willingly being duped by a cabal of young men looking to get rich. He has no answer for McQueary's testimony, no answer for those creepy letters, no answers for the statements made to the mother of one of the victims back in 1998.

That said, it just takes one Penn St die hard fan to make this a mistrial.

There are NO Penn State fans giving Sandusky any special treatment. Quite the opposite, actually.


He has pissed me off tremendously. From all I've heard, the man abused the people who needed help the most and that is abominable and disturbing on many levels. He also managed to drag a whole lot of innocent people and reputations through the mud just through his association.

Assuming the allegations are true, the man hurt a lot of children who looked to him for help and caused a lot of secondary damage to others who just happened to go to school/work/teach there. Again, assuming that what happened was true, then no one who is a fan of Penn State would even piss on Sandusky to put out a fire.
 
2012-06-20 08:40:19 PM
Malaktaus

Maybe you missed the independent investigator brought in to investigate the administration. As for child abuse often going unreported, I have no burning need to convince you of a well established phenomenon. I see no widespread credible evidence that the PSU community is trying to convince anyone that anything is 'a--ok'. I see an angry, sad population of people eager to see those responsible be punished. I understand that you want to see lots and lots of people punished. Me, I simply want the people who knew about it and didn't do enough punished. Paterno was punished. And he's dead - not much more to do there. Curley and Schultz have been punished and have more to come. Sandusky awaits his reward as we speak. I HOPE the police who didn't follow through are punished. Beyond that I know of no one else who knew about it. Except probably some parents. And no, I don't want anything done to them. They have acted like many parents act in the same situation and already live in their own private hell and its not for me to judge them.
 
2012-06-20 08:44:45 PM
I could understand the prosecution not asking for details from the kids forced to perform oral sex on Sandusky. But if the kids were able to elaborate on such, it would prove beyond a shadow of a doubt proof. It would also rub into Sandusky's face and to the jurors just what he did.
 
2012-06-20 08:46:22 PM

abmoraz: That would be catastrophic to the area. It wont happen. As someone that owned a business in town and worked for some other ones, the 7 or 8 home football games is the difference between making and breaking a business here. Not fielding a team for a season would bankrupt 10s of thousands of local residents.


Here's why that argument doesn't sway me one bit: I'm sure State College is a nice little college town. I've never been there, but I've been to other college towns, so I've got a pretty good idea what it's like. Having said that, you're not a little precious snowflake of a town. You can't take that into consideration when it comes to deciding the right thing to do.

There are plenty of college towns across this nation that benefit economically from college football. Are you going to not consider punishing their football program because of local business? "Hey, it's not like every person in Gainesville, Floirda/ Ann Arbor, Michigan/ Lincoln, Nebraska/ Norman, Oklahoma/ Tuscaloosa, Alabama was cheating. Why should the whole city have to suffer, just because the football program was in the wrong?"

Taking that rationaile even farther- let's say there were 3 programs that were paying huge sums of money to their top recruits. Going full SMU. Hypothetically, let's say these three programs were Southern California, Texas, and Auburn. All 3 were paying the exact same dollar amount. Violations were the same, down to the penny. If we use your logic, it's easy to give USC the death penalty. Los Angeles will be fine. We can shut down Texas as well- Austin's economy won't take that big a hit. And, we have to give Auburn probation, because the loss of a football season would absolutely devastate Auburn, Alabama. Businesses would shutter, and people would lose their jobs.

See the issue here?
 
2012-06-20 08:51:35 PM
'see the issue here?'

No. As I pointed out earlier. They've given the death penalty 5 times. Every case involved athletes receiving improper benefits. See the issue here?
 
2012-06-20 08:52:19 PM

Kevin72: I could understand the prosecution not asking for details from the kids forced to perform oral sex on Sandusky. But if the kids were able to elaborate on such, it would prove beyond a shadow of a doubt proof. It would also rub into Sandusky's face and to the jurors just what he did.


I'm going to steal the point from Rick Reilly's ESPN.com column this week where he called Sandusky a "coward" for not just pleading guilty in the face of overwhelming evidence of his guilt. Link

Of course, the easy reply is to say that this bastard probably still thinks he didn't do anything wrong. He's so farked up in the head (based on his past statements) that he's probably still thinking during this whole trial "was that wrong? Should I have not done that?'

/Seriously, anyone who sexually assualts a child should be put to death
 
2012-06-20 08:55:07 PM

malaktaus: UNAUTHORIZED FINGER: Saw this early this morning, and immediately thought:

[thehiberniatimes.com image 300x450]

/Palpatine works too

I'm confused, isn't that Palpatine? Not sure why he's wearing white though, that's not very appropriate for a Sith Lord.


I've never seen the two of them in the same room together, so it could be. However, that pic could have been taken before Labor Day. :)
 
2012-06-20 09:15:05 PM

Doctor Funkenstein: When asked if she and her husband slept in the same bed, all she responded with was that he usually went to sleep before she did.


So you are deliberately being evasive?
Hostile witness.- and probably guilty for knowing and not saying anything. Like so many more,
 
2012-06-20 09:24:13 PM
There's just nothing clean at all about this whole story. Not a thing. The best part about the story is that its' fallout killed Joe Paterno. Penn State football will continue to be a source of wealth and civic pride for the little piece of Nowheresville, PA that accepts such benefits at the cost of many little boys' anal virginity.

But hey the NCAA shouldn't punish the whole area by shuttering PSU football for even one season! That's UNFAIR to all of those who had nothing to do with it!

Hell, the entire country has seen median home prices plummet in recent years because of despicable deeds by a few on Wall St and in the too-big-to-fail banks. Surely Main Street was UNFAIRLY impacted by those deeds...but impacted they were. Consequences tend to involve more than just the actors in play, that's why we protect and prosecute such ill happenings the way we do.

Unless it's BIG TIME COLLEGE FOOTBALL. The only saving grace for most rational folks? The VERY first thing we will all think of when hearing the words "Penn State" is child rape. Not the most just outcome, but certainly a deserved one.
 
2012-06-20 09:44:30 PM

Owangotang: There's just nothing clean at all about this whole story. Not a thing. The best part about the story is that its' fallout killed Joe Paterno. Penn State football will continue to be a source of wealth and civic pride for the little piece of Nowheresville, PA that accepts such benefits at the cost of many little boys' anal virginity.

But hey the NCAA shouldn't punish the whole area by shuttering PSU football for even one season! That's UNFAIR to all of those who had nothing to do with it!

Hell, the entire country has seen median home prices plummet in recent years because of despicable deeds by a few on Wall St and in the too-big-to-fail banks. Surely Main Street was UNFAIRLY impacted by those deeds...but impacted they were. Consequences tend to involve more than just the actors in play, that's why we protect and prosecute such ill happenings the way we do.

Unless it's BIG TIME COLLEGE FOOTBALL. The only saving grace for most rational folks? The VERY first thing we will all think of when hearing the words "Penn State" is child rape. Not the most just outcome, but certainly a deserved one.


Actually, people who bought into the Real Estate mythology had a hell of a lot more to do with the collapse of the market than students or players at Penn State did with the Sandusky thing. Now, maybe Joe Pa is a different story...
 
2012-06-20 09:45:15 PM
Same goes for administrators for the school, McQueary, and many others.
 
2012-06-20 11:16:49 PM

star_topology: Derwood: I went to school with three of the Sandusky kids and went to the same church as the Sandusky family.

/NOT getting a kick out of, well, any of this

*shudder*


He never came off as creepy back then, but he was clearly good at hiding this stuff. The kids were pretty normal, though most were adopted
 
2012-06-21 12:36:21 AM

JohnBigBootay: 'see the issue here?'

No. As I pointed out earlier. They've given the death penalty 5 times. Every case involved athletes receiving improper benefits. See the issue here?


You are killing me with all of your posts. We get it. Let Sandusky off b/c of police coercion and the Penn State football program should not have to deal with this shame of what one person did.

Whatever helps you sleep at night.

This is a sad case. JoePa should've done more. McQuery should've done more. Everyone who knew of these allegations should've done more, but they didn't. Obviously, Sandusky is the only scumbag here.
 
2012-06-21 12:38:57 AM

JohnBigBootay: 'see the issue here?'

No. As I pointed out earlier. They've given the death penalty 5 times. Every case involved athletes receiving improper benefits. See the issue here?


Okay then.

Let's call Sandusky's rapes "improper benefits" and hand out a death penalty!
 
2012-06-21 01:20:21 AM

Pr1nc3ss: JohnBigBootay: 'see the issue here?'

No. As I pointed out earlier. They've given the death penalty 5 times. Every case involved athletes receiving improper benefits. See the issue here?

You are killing me with all of your posts. We get it. Let Sandusky off b/c of police coercion and the Penn State football program should not have to deal with this shame of what one person did.

Whatever helps you sleep at night.

This is a sad case. JoePa should've done more. McQuery should've done more. Everyone who knew of these allegations should've done more, but they didn't. Obviously, Sandusky is the only scumbag here.


Obviously you do not get it. Because as I have said many times, my feeling is that Sandusky is guilty and I will be OJ-level shocked if he is acquitted. I sleep fine. Suit yourself... but me personally? I try not to let reading and commenting on the news have much effect on my sleep patterns one way or the other.
 
2012-06-21 01:39:18 AM

JohnBigBootay: A Fark Handle: and since the power of that program was the problem, i'm just looking for a solution.

I disagree.


i know you do. and we'll just have to agree to disagree. i feel the power of the program was a significant factor in overlooking/missing/failing to report/investigate earlier signs. i also feel that due to the money/prestige the program brought to penn state they powers that be decided to coverup multiple initial chances to start a serious investigation into sandusky's systemative kiddy-rape program. you're right given the usual ncaa mission to fark over "student-athletes" rather than be a force for betterment there's no prescient to give the death penalty. all that said, the penn state kiddy-rape situation is so much worse than paying players (nothing wrong with that) or playing academically ineligible players (a little more wrong), that i feel if there was ever a time to drop the hammer, this is it. it won't happen, but i feel it should.
 
2012-06-21 01:46:20 AM
A fark handle

Thanks for a civil discussion in spite of the disagreement. You certainly make some good points and have the same concerns a lot of people do. I'm ready for it to be over as I imagine most are. Sadly, it never will be for some. Regardless of what happens from here on out.
 
2012-06-21 08:21:11 AM
 
2012-06-21 10:41:40 AM

Troublesome Strumpet: Her husband wrote in his 2001 autobiography "Touched: The Jerry Sandusky Story"

There are no words.


Just pictures then?
 
2012-06-21 02:28:50 PM
starsmedia.ign.com

GUILLLLLTY!
 
2012-06-22 07:14:45 PM
So now that his own son has made allegations of abuse, can we assume the cops were coaching him too and this kid is in it for the money too? C'mon apologists, we want to hear your slapping sounds ...
 
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